From <@UBVM.CC.BUFFALO.EDU:owner-LISTSERV@UBVM.CC.BUFFALO.EDU> Mon Feb 6 16:04:43 1995 Received: from netaxs.com (root@netaxs.com [198.69.186.1]) by access.netaxs.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id QAA27261 for ; Mon, 6 Feb 1995 16:04:43 -0500 Received: from UBVM.cc.buffalo.edu (ubvm.cc.buffalo.edu [128.205.2.1]) by netaxs.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with SMTP id QAA01806 for ; Mon, 6 Feb 1995 16:04:17 -0500 Message-Id: <199502062104.QAA01806@netaxs.com> Received: from UBVM.CC.BUFFALO.EDU by UBVM.cc.buffalo.edu (IBM VM SMTP V2R2) with BSMTP id 4117; Mon, 06 Feb 95 16:03:23 EST Received: from UBVM.CC.BUFFALO.EDU (NJE origin LISTSERV@UBVM) by UBVM.CC.BUFFALO.EDU (LMail V1.2a/1.8a) with BSMTP id 9062; Mon, 6 Feb 1995 12:39:39 -0500 Date: Mon, 6 Feb 1995 12:39:30 -0500 From: "L-Soft list server at UBVM (1.8a)" Subject: File: "GEODESIC LOG9405" To: "Christopher J. Fearnley" Status: RO ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 1 May 1994 16:16:35 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Comments: Warning -- original Sender: tag was NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU From: Elizabeth Kommit Organization: CRL Dialup Internet Access (415) 705-6060 [login: guest] Subject: Re: Computer Graphics / Mathematics I think I should mention my work here. I have a 3d modeller project which I've been working on for a few years; initially it was to explore polyhedral geometry (since I was studying _Synergetics_ and getting frustrated with paper models) but I'm afraid it's evolved into a easy-to-use "normal" 3D modelling program over the years. It does do Bucky-style "frequency" tesselation and can find the dual of any shape you give it. I wrote it to be portable, versions exist for Amiga, MSWindows and Mac, but the non-Amiga versions need a little work. It's written for portability, so any new platform you might suggest (say, Linux w/X) should be a quick port, given I have access to a machine capable. The modeller is called "PolyWog", and it's currently freeware (I'm a "revolutionary" too :-) I'm considering copylefting it. I'm afraid I only have a dial-up Unix account, so I couldn't take part in any WWW/Mosaic activity. I'm very interested, though, in radical features you'd like to see in a modeller; some I'm considering now are 1. "Unfold" Design a polyhedra, the program will lay it out flat so that you could take the printout and fold it up to form the polyhedra. 2. Measure solid angles. The feature mentioned here about slicing an icosa into quanta sounds good. Ben Discoe chao@crl.com "I do VR for a living" ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 2 May 1994 16:10:31 EDT Reply-To: dkapstd@ftp.com Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Comments: Warning -- original Sender: tag was dkap@MAILSERV-C.FTP.COM From: "A Page in the Life of ..." Subject: Computer Graphics / Mathematics In-Reply-To: ""'s message of Sat, 30 Apr 1994 18:54:58 -0400 <199404302257.SAA12875@cs.brandeis.edu> From: "" Think of it this way: many PC users run DOS/MS-Windows; most don't have the capability/knowledge to run X-Window (sic). Some MS-Windows development environments are relatively cheap, are widely available, and there are a number of 3rd party 3-D libraries available. And with Apple moving to the Power-PC platform, both MS-Windows and Mac affectionados would be able to run the software. This _is_ a plug. My company (contact info@ftp.com for more information) has an X windows product (a product that allows you to run X over windows) called EntranX (don't ask me how to pronounce it ... I don't know) ... I know that sounds like a plug... it isn't. Personally, I'd prefer an X-Window (sic) solution myself, and I know of a nice free and stable POSIX compatible OS which runs X and SysV/386 Intel ABI software, too: Linux (read "this is a plug"; I'm going to install it soon an a spare 386 box). But I don't know where the PEX libraries are obtained. I agree, LINUX is a good way to go ... Mitch C. Amiano amiano@delphi.com -- There are never enough hours in a day, but always too many days before Saturday. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 2 May 1994 12:55:17 EDT Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Chris Fearnley Subject: Re: Computer Graphics / Mathematics In-Reply-To: Message of Sat, 30 Apr 1994 21:28:45 GMT from On Sat, 30 Apr 1994 21:28:45 GMT Craig Anderson said: [Intro deleted] >b) Linux > This I can get my hands on. Internet software, X, > and lot's of other software. I love Linux. Since last Aug when bought my first home PC, till the present I moved from computer ignorant to UNIX SIG leader at the Philadelphia Area Computer Society and started writing (simple) programs in C. I could not have afforded to do this under any other OS except Linux (or maybe free BSD). I say go for Linux - it's great. [Warning: Linux is not for those who do not want to administer it. It does require some basic system administration skills to manage. But that's pretty easy, really :) ] >c) Hurd > Not usable yet. I may switch to the Hurd when it becomes available. >Let's keep this thread going and see what develops. Will Do! > >Craig Anderson >craig@c4.com >303.989.0308 Chris Fearnley fearnlcj@duvm.ocs.drexel.edu ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 2 May 1994 12:34:29 EDT Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Chris Fearnley Subject: Re: Computer Graphics / Mathematics In-Reply-To: Message of Sun, 1 May 1994 16:16:35 -0700 from On Sun, 1 May 1994 16:16:35 -0700 Elizabeth Kommit said: >I think I should mention my work here. I have a 3d modeller project which >I've been working on for a few years; initially it was to explore >polyhedral geometry (since I was studying _Synergetics_ and getting >frustrated with paper models) but I'm afraid it's evolved into a >easy-to-use "normal" 3D modelling program over the years. It does do >Bucky-style "frequency" tesselation and can find the dual of any shape you >give it. I wrote it to be portable, versions exist for Amiga, MSWindows >and Mac, but the non-Amiga versions need a little work. It's written for >portability, so any new platform you might suggest (say, Linux w/X) should >be a quick port, given I have access to a machine capable. The modeller is >called "PolyWog", and it's currently freeware (I'm a "revolutionary" too :-) >I'm considering copylefting it. Thanks for sharing - this could save me a lot of work. :) I like the copyleft (either GNU or Artistic). Is it in C? I'm running Linux with X Windows right now and would love to work on the port. Is it available for anonymous ftp? If not could you uuencode and gzip a copy for me? For all of us? The really neat thing about Linux and some other copyleft software I've been following is that once a developer shares his mostly working code the new features start coming in fast from cooperative developers around the world. I'd like to make your project grow in this way - if at all possible. >I'm afraid I only have a dial-up Unix account, so I couldn't take part in >any WWW/Mosaic activity. I'm very interested, though, in radical features >you'd like to see in a modeller; some I'm considering now are > 1. "Unfold" Design a polyhedra, the program will lay it out flat so that > you could take the printout and fold it up to form the polyhedra. > 2. Measure solid angles. I was just thinking: If it can draw the spherical figures (and print them out too, of course), then it could also calculate all the angles (solid, surface and central). And print out "reports" like in the back pages of Synergetics II. >The feature mentioned here about slicing an icosa into quanta sounds good. > >Ben Discoe >chao@crl.com Nexthursday I begin another period of intentional unemployment and would have time to work on porting this. Chris Fearnley fearnlcj@duvm.ocs.drexel.edu cfearnl@pacs.pha.pa.us > "I do VR for a living" ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 2 May 1994 12:47:42 EDT Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Chris Fearnley Subject: Re: Computer Graphics / Mathematics In-Reply-To: Message of Sat, 30 Apr 1994 18:54:58 -0400 from On Sat, 30 Apr 1994 18:54:58 -0400 said: >Chris writes: >>This is interesting - I must read that book in its entirety! > >I find it reads best as a reference - a kind of lexicon for form >manipulation. Williams also includes a number of references to Fuller's >works, and credits him in part as a source of inspiration early on. That is the way I have been using it, but I never got the form language stuff. Perhaps it's at the artistic and not the scientific level. > >>But a form language is the KEY. >>Perhaps we should discuss the form language... > >Ok, I'm quoting from the book, as a teaser: > >"Polygons and polyhedra can be generated or have identity changes through >ten principal methods: > 1. Vertex Motion 2. Fold 3. Reciprocation > 4. Truncation 5. Rotation-Truncation 6. Augmentation-Deletion > 7. Fistulation 8. Distortion 9. Dissection > 10. Symmetry Integration" > Yes, this is the idea! Now to code it! :) >>I know that Macs CAN do anything. >>...[but]...there is no MacOS for UNIX or DOS. >>...available to even the poorest people. > >Correction: there is no MacOS for Intel architecture machines. But unless >you go with plain vanilla DOS or a free Unix clone (BSD or Linux), the costs >will be prohibitive for many. > >>Besides, I'm a revolutionary > >We all knew this, Chris ;-) How'd ya' guess. You certainly don't know anything about my hair length from the E-mail I send :) > >>and I want this type of work to be available to even the poorest people. > >I assume that something like a copyleft would be in order then. > >>...it seems even more likely that X/PEX is the way to go. > >Considering the large picture, it may be a tad more expensive in terms >of cash, time, or effort required to obtain and use an X based program, but >this certainly doesn't eliminate the fact that X is almost everywhere. > >Think of it this way: many PC users run DOS/MS-Windows; most don't have the >capability/knowledge to run X-Window (sic). Some MS-Windows development >environments are relatively cheap, are widely available, and there are a >number of 3rd party 3-D libraries available. And with Apple moving to the >Power-PC platform, both MS-Windows and Mac affectionados would be able to >run the software. > >I know that sounds like a plug... it isn't. Personally, I'd prefer an > X-Window (sic) solution myself, and I know of a nice free and stable POSIX >compatible OS which runs X and SysV/386 Intel ABI software, too: Linux (read >"this is a plug"; I'm going to install it soon an a spare 386 box). But I >don't know where the PEX libraries are obtained. I run Linux. PEX is available as an optional item with the Slackware distribution, though for lack of hard drive space I haven't installed it yet. Linux is clearly the best OS available, if you don't mind administering a REAL system. (plug off) > >Mitch C. Amiano >amiano@delphi.com Chris Fearnley fearnlcj@duvm.ocs.drexel.edu ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 2 May 1994 19:48:59 EDT Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: "Bruce T. Lael" Subject: Re: Computer Graphics / Mathematics After the discussion around development platforms, I've got a question. Agreed many users don't have access to Unix/Linux systems, however, thanks to my employer I have access to PC X-ware, and to Sun/Unix machines. So the question is, whatta ya got to do 3D (4D?) modelling of geodesics? We do lots of 2D graphics, mostly mapping, but no real 3D. Thanx, Bruce ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 3 May 1994 10:21:22 -0400 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: "Matthew V. J. Whalen" Subject: Re: Computer Graphics / Mathematics In-Reply-To: Your message of "Mon, 02 May 1994 19:48:59 EDT." <199405030305.XAA18910@tis.telos.com> >After the discussion around development platforms, I've got a question. >Agreed many users don't have access to Unix/Linux systems, however, >thanks to my employer I have access to PC X-ware, and to Sun/Unix >machines. So the question is, whatta ya got to do 3D (4D?) >modelling of geodesics? Well, for Sun's, if you are running an X11R5 or R6 based X, then you have PEX available to you. OpenWindows 3.3 (from Solaris 2.3) is X11R5 based. We don't run any openwindows - just plain vanilla X11R5 and R6. -matthew ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 3 May 1994 13:16:04 EDT Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Chris Fearnley Subject: Re: Computer Graphics / Mathematics In-Reply-To: Message of Mon, 2 May 1994 19:48:59 EDT from On Mon, 2 May 1994 19:48:59 EDT Bruce T. Lael said: >After the discussion around development platforms, I've got a question. >Agreed many users don't have access to Unix/Linux systems, however, >thanks to my employer I have access to PC X-ware, and to Sun/Unix >machines. So the question is, whatta ya got to do 3D (4D?) >modelling of geodesics? If you have X, then PEX can go on top of it. PEX is a library of C routines that enable the programer to work with 3D (actually 4D) images. If you don't have access to such a library, then I believe you have to do the bitmapping calculations yourself (can anyone confirm this naive interpretation?). how to get it to look right TO what do I want it to look like. Of course, I haven't bought the O'Reilly book on PEX yet. There are commercial packages like Mathematica and Maple but they probably don't help builld the synergetics images too much. But I have heard of several people using Mathematica on Macs on the West coast. But I have never seen their work. Most mathematicians are interested in continuous curves that can be differentiated or integrated or in number theory. So they haven't the need to calculate complex rotations and the like. I'm using PARI/gp (with ports to amiga, Mac and DOS) which is a free high precision calculator (probably useful for some of our spherical trig needs). Did that answer your question? > >We do lots of 2D graphics, mostly mapping, but no real 3D. > >Thanx, >Bruce Chris Fearnley fearnlcj@duvm.ocs.drexel.edu ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 3 May 1994 18:10:24 -0400 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Jan Shepherd ok 0F7EEF ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 3 May 1994 23:52:02 -0400 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: "" Subject: Re: Computer Graphics / Mathematics I had a well intended response to Elizabeth _____'s recent post, but my mailer got hosed. In any case, the 3D project she presented sounds very interesting, and I for one would like to know more about it. Copyleft is a personal judgement call, but if you do decide to release it, I'd be interested in seeing the code. (Like I'd really have time to do anything meaningful to it.... right.) Even if not, thanks for letting us know about it. ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 4 May 1994 02:21:12 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: 4D Solutions Subject: Coding Synergetics >> >>>But a form language is the KEY. >>>Perhaps we should discuss the form language... >> MORE THOUGHTS SYNERGETICS GRAPHICS (inspired to recent postings brainstorming software/hardware issues)... How would 4D synergetics differ at all from standard 3D graphics? Hardware is uniformly XY-coordinated when it comes to placing pixels on the screen. The existing library of 3D drawing tools is also XYZ of course. No need to reinvent the wheel first off. Starting from the whole and some of the parts would be the most faithful beginning. We should assume that the entire isotropic vector matrix (IVM) is invisibly present and brainstorm primitive function calls that would take advantage of this infrastructure. E.g. one should be able to place an A or B module (translucent or opaque in higher-end apps) with a minimum of fuss. Grabbing A and B mods with the mouse and dragging, with subsequent controls to adjust size and orientation might be an option. In general, the IVM is most conveniently traversed by jumping in a direction indicated by one of the tetrahedron's 6 edges. Putting these 6 vectors tail-to-tail and producing their 6 negative counterparts pointing at 180 degrees produces the 12-spoked hub of the vector equilibrium. Perhaps 2 sets of complementary zig-zags, i,j,k and l,m,n -- which together outline a tetrahedron -- would be useful primitives in an interpreted synergetics programming language. The polyhedra of the synergetics hierarchy would all be primitives and the synergetics hierarchy would somehow comprise the infrastructure for most function calls. E.g. the default icosa would have a pre-defined relationship to the default tetra. Each polyhedron would have internally defined methods for breaking up into submodules, changing its chordal frequency, outputting its volume (a number) in tetravolumes etc. A library of primitive objects each with a set of internally defined powers would seem the way to go. One might invent a layer of synergetics notation, a programming language, that underlying XYZ routines would interpret. For example, one can label the centers of spheres in a closest packing with integers, given a set of basis vectors that point along three edges of a rhombohedron -- a slanted cube. A matrix converts [23,-5,-10] (some sphere) to its corresponding Cartesian floating point coordinates. I once derived these matrices and programmed a very primitive Logo-like turtle to jump from sphere to sphere in synerspace (used SmallTalk on a 286). Just off the top of my head, an interpreted synergetics scenario (storyboarding) language might look something like: place Amod size .5 at origin as "A1" place Bmod bondedto F1 of A1 as "B1" copy A1 to (origin+2*j+3*i) as "A2" rotate A2 axis E1F1 by 90 show A1 color red mode opaque show B1 color blue mode translucent show A2 color red mode opaque OR (another variation of the same thing) A1=PLACE(Amod,0.5,origin) B1=FBOND(Bmod,A1,F1) A2=COPY(A1,origin+2j+3i) A2=ROTATE(A2,E1F1,90) =DRAW(A1,red,1) =DRAW(B1,blue,0) =DRAW(A2,red,1) Ultimately, what we're aiming for is a higher level scenarios language that might allow us to write something like: begin scenario("syn1") explode coupler into mods slowly zoomin any Amod and unfold to planenet slowly display planenet with dimensions for 10 seconds foldup planenet and illuminate Amod within tetrahedron quickly print Amod volume as fraction of tetrahedron end save "syn1" to archives upload "syn1" to internet(addr:GEODESIC) -- Kirby Portland OR >> >>>But a form language is the KEY. >>>Perhaps we should discuss the form language... >> >>Ok, I'm quoting from the book, as a teaser: >> >>"Polygons and polyhedra can be generated or have identity changes through >>ten principal methods: >> 1. Vertex Motion 2. Fold 3. Reciprocation >> 4. Truncation 5. Rotation-Truncation 6. Augmentation-Deletion >> 7. Fistulation 8. Distortion 9. Dissection >> 10. Symmetry Integration" >> > >Yes, this is the idea! Now to code it! :) ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 4 May 1994 19:08:37 -0400 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: "" Subject: Re: Computer Graphics / Mathematics I write: >>I find it reads best as a reference - a kind of lexicon for form Chris responds: >That is the way I have been using it, but I never got the form language >stuff. Perhaps it's at the artistic and not the scientific level. The samples from the book included in the last post (Fold, reciprocation...) could be viewed as operators in a language in which the objects were geometric shapes (eg polyvertexia). Of course, the list is incomplete, and a method of specifying only an addressing mode (prepositional phrase?... ie "stellate only this half of this polyvertexia") is missing. But at the notational level there is also his {edges-at-a-face , faces-at-a-vertex} syntax for specifying polyhedra ( ie {3,5} == icosahedra, {3,3} == tetrahedra, {4,4} == octahedra ) I think it is a 'disciplined' approach, as opposed to a 'rigorous' approach. Williams admitted to its incompleteness, but that is unavoidable. ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 4 May 1994 19:08:50 -0400 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: "" Subject: Re: Computer Graphics / Mathematics ... >haven't bought the O'Reilly book on PEX yet. There are commercial packages Well, that settles it. If O'Reilly has a book out on PEX, it really ought to be a foregone conclusion that PEX is the way to go. (BTW: That's not sarcasm... I actually do think their books are very good.) ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 3 May 1994 16:47:45 EST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: DAMICO@GELMAN.CIRC.GWU.EDU Subject: Re: Synergetics Models Ed Applewhite has succeeded in interesting the Voyager company in publishing an "Expanded Book" (multimedia) on Fuller and Synergetics. The challenge now is producing the product. This would obviously be different from the clips that you are suggesting. However such a CD-ROM would certainly ease the development of this expanded book and other projects. I'm slowly collecting the equipment to capture some of my video and sound footage into digital format. Wasn't the institute working on a project to scan some of the Fuller archives into Mac's? Did anything come out of it? ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 5 May 1994 01:06:45 GMT Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Comments: Warning -- original Sender: tag was NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU From: scimatec5@UOFT02.UTOLEDO.EDU Organization: University of Toledo Subject: Re: Computer Graphics / Mathematics Alright, I'm a little bit lost on all the programming ideas you guys have thrown out (aside from most of what Kirby wrote.) I don't understand enough to ask intelligent questions, so I'll ask all of you (Chris especially,) "What the h*ll are you talking about?" Perhaps that's ignorance, in its purest form, but how is it supposed to change if I don't ask questions? 8) Regards, Steve Mather ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 5 May 1994 23:01:45 -0400 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: "" Subject: Re: Computer Graphics / Mathematics >Alright, I'm a little bit lost on all the programming ... >especially,) "What the h*ll are you talking about?" ... > Steve Mather Hmmm? Did we go obtuse again? Sorry. I suppose that it happens every now and then... we think ahead at breakneck speed not thinking about who's listening in. But what specific topics confused you? If it is X/Linux/C/Libraries/PEX/Windows & etc, that's a matter of current computer software jargon, and we really need to limit the traffic of that stuff. If it's about the geometry/stellation/quanta-modules/X-Y-Z coodinate system & etc, we probably wouldn't be discussing it if we knew what the h*ll we were talking about, so jump in anytime! :-) This is illustrated by the following biographical excerpt about physicist Richard Feynman: -------------------------------------------------------------------------- "God! You're Feynman!" he said in awe. "The great safecracker! I've heard about you; I've always wanted to meet you for so long! I want to learn how to crack a safe from you." "What do you mean? You know how to open safes cold." "I don't." "Listen, [...] I wanted to meet YOU. And you tell me you don't know how to open a safe cold." "That's right." [...] But you opened i! You must know how to crack safes." "Oh yeah. I knew the locks come from the factory set at 25-0-25 or 50-25-50 [...] and the second one worked." So I DID learn something from him - that he cracked safes by the same miraculous methods that I did. ... - Richard P. Feynman in "Surely You're Joking Mr. Feynman!: Adventures of a Curious Character" ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 6 May 1994 01:56:33 LCL Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Betts/IBM Almaden Research Center Subject: Archives or FAQ Does anyone know if there is a Geodesic FAQ or some archives somewhere? Forgive me if this was recently answered, I have been away and my news server (I get this as a usenet group) has a short memory. -Joe Betts ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 7 May 1994 00:17:09 EDT Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Kurt Przybilla <73602.3025@COMPUSERVE.COM> Subject: graphic thoughts knowing next to nothing about the detailed workings of any computer language outside of -basic-, makes me hesitate a moment before I add anything to this discussion. I am often accused of getting of the subject, but just listening to you all talk about something I wish I knew ( and in time will, thanks to your postings ":>) makes me want to ask about an idea a friend and I once discussed about modeling programs on a computer. It sounds like many of you might know a lot about it. It seems to me that in what ever language, on almost any computer out there, someone should be able to write a program that would operate upon this basic premise: spheres with volume. What I means is: 1) of course they would actually be spheres in Bucky's sense of the word: 224.07 Sphere: The Greeks defined the sphere as a surface outwardly equidistant in all directions from a point. As defined, the Greeks' sphere's surface was an absolute continuum, subdividing all the Universe outside it from all the Universe inside it; wherefore, the Universe outside could be dispensed with and the interior eternally conerved. We find local spherical systems of Universe are definite rather than in- finite as presupposed by the calculus's erroneous assumption of 360- degreeness of surface plane azimuth around every point on a sphere. All spheres consist of a high-frequency constellation of event points, all of which are approximately equidistant from one central event point. All the points in the surface of a sphere may be interconnected. Most economically interconnected, they will subdivide the surface of the \sphere into an omnitriangulated spherical web matrix. As the frequency of triangular subdivisions of spherical constellation of omnitrangulated points approaches subvisibility, the difference between the sums of the angles around all the vertex points and the numbers of vertexes, multiplied by 360 degrees, remains constantly 720 degrees, which is the sum of the angles of two times unity (of 360 degrees), which equals one tetrahedron. - Bucky, Syngergetics All vertexes at every frequency could be easily plotted at lightning speeds by the ever improving capacity of this tool's ability to crunch grunchy numbers (i.e. most math currently done on them), and the whole number spherically based math will provide ever more accurate inform- ation about the true nature of structure, synergetically enlightening our view of everything!!! This is not attempting to control every atom in the Universe nor any other act of hubris. This is a way of looking for ever increasingly doing more with less weight and more understand- ing. This is the hope I see in Fullerenes!!! When you think about it, the synergetic force of the naming of the third form of solid carbon after Bucky can never be truly measured. But who else could they name some- thing with that shape after? I don't think most people have the slightest idea what the future holds, but if you are reading this, I assume you do!! I believe we live in the grandest of ages, the turn of the millennium! How much better a time could there be for this information to spread organically---> synergetically---> from 19 to 2,000 in a single year... 2) Most graphics programs, at least the ones I have ever used, which is next to nothing compared to the combined experience of the group of minds that is reading this has, do not give graphics volume, making more an image than a shape. Any image created easily passes through any other, like the invisible man going through a wall, making modeling difficult. Like I said, I don't know much about current programming and sense that when I hear about "object oriented" something or another???? maybe this is what they mean. Treating graphics like objects. Because that is what I mean: making graphics into things with volume, that relate to other objects in the omnidimensional space represented on the screen, as we know objects to behave in space. 3) Spheres would obviously be the building balls. 4) The arrangement of spheres is governed by principles beyond the wills of men and naturally forms the isotropic vector matrix. 5) You could rough model with larger spheres and as you refined the shape you could locally or entirely decrease the size of the spheres. You would be able to create ever more apparently smooth surfaces by using smaller spheres. I imagine it to be like starting with pretty fair sized rocks, coming up with a rough approximate shape, than covering it with sand and smoothing it into the exact shape desired. Of you could utilized the matrix formed from connecting their center points and build with octet trusswork, using tetra and octa hedrons to build a beautiful net, skin, internal organ... whatever you wish to build. 6) You would be in reality modeling naturally synergetic structures utilizing all the advantages of this ever increasingly powerful new tool on all levels, eventually of course being able to design every- thing on what ever level you determine works best, necessary; atomic would generally be the rule, I think, learning as you go, what mater- ials best be used; the model itself probably answering that question for y or making it pretty easy to quess. 7) these shperes would not pass through other spheres unless their size fit through the web of another's. They are not solids. I know it sounds a little unclear, but it says what I mean. When you think of it on an atomic and molecular level, it becomes clear. (525.00 makes it even clearer) I truly sense that there must be some of this kind of modeling being done somewhere by chemists and physists on big computers, but from my own experience and what I've seen in the media, I tend to think that most programs, even on the best Silicon Graphics machine works almost exclusively on an X-Y-Z 3d grid, where plotting points is always a problem and at best clumsy and difficult. Kirby, no offense, but even your coding was a bit to similar to what is happening right now for me, but your ideas about Hollywood!!! I could not agree with you more!!! Like I said, I know little about what I ask and would love to hear what an one who has read this far thinks. If I seem longwinded, forgive me. I tend to think Bucky stated many things about as well as anyone has ever stated them. I particularly like how he begins Synergetics: Introduction: The Wellspring of Reality We are in an age that assumes the narrowing trends of specialization to be logical, natural, and desirable.Consequently, society expects all earnestly responsible communication to be crisply brief. Advancing science has now discovered that all the known cases of biological extinction have been caused by overspecialization, whose concentration of only slected genes sacrifices general adaptability. Thus the specialist's brief for pinpointing brevity is dubious. In the meantime, humanity has been dprived of comprehensive understanding. -Bucky Synergetically, kurt przybilla omnidirectional thinking ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 6 May 1994 16:24:22 GMT Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Comments: Warning -- original Sender: tag was NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU From: Chris Fearnley Organization: Critical Path Project Subject: Re: Computer Graphics / Mathematics In article <1994May4.200645.1@uoft02.utoledo.edu> scimatec5@uoft02.utoledo.edu writes: > >Alright, I'm a little bit lost on all the programming >ideas you guys have thrown out (aside from most of >what Kirby wrote.) I don't understand enough to ask >intelligent questions, so I'll ask all of you (Chris >especially,) "What the h*ll are you talking about?" >Perhaps that's ignorance, in its purest form, but how >is it supposed to change if I don't ask questions? 8) Yes, we have been too vague, sorry. I thin what Kirby wrote is a wonderful summary/expansion on what we have been discussing. Mostly we have been brainstorming about the qualities of what we want in a synergetics geometry computer model and what language/platform should this model or program be written for. I think PEX is the most trans-platform language to use for our modelling. Though someone pointed out that it is a resource intensive medium (8 megs of RAM to be comfortable). I think we should continue brainstorming about these ideas. Then I can summarize things later. As always if we drop jargon that you are unfamiliar with please ask - it's important to have everyone contribute :) > Regards, > Steve Mather Chris Fearnley -- Christopher J. Fearnley UNIX SIG Leader at PACS cfearnl@cpp.pha.pa.us (Philadelphia Area Computer Society) cfearnl@pacs.pha.pa.us Design Science Revolutionary fearnlcj@duvm.ocs.drexel.edu Explorer in Universe ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 6 May 1994 21:10:16 GMT Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Comments: Warning -- original Sender: tag was NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU From: Chris Fearnley Organization: Critical Path Project Subject: Re: Archives or FAQ In article <9405060856.AA1415@thiel0.almaden.ibm.com> Joe Betts/IBM Almaden Research Center writes: >Does anyone know if there is a Geodesic FAQ or some archives somewhere? Critical Path Project has Archives of the GEODESIC list. (215)463-7160. Login as "fix" and set up an account [This is a free system devoted to Bucky Fuller and AIDS research.] The archives are in the files area. I am preparing a FAQ on Fuller. It is version 0.4 right now and 4000+ lines. I will post it in one or two weeks (when it's a little more complete). It is very incomplete now and in need of good answers to geometry/dome questions (these take awhile for me to compose - so don't hold your breath). I am incorporating the collective wisdom of ~4 years of GEODESIC posts. > >Forgive me if this was recently answered, I have been away and my news server >(I get this as a usenet group) has a short memory. > >-Joe Betts Christopher J. Fearnley UNIX SIG Leader at PACS cfearnl@cpp.pha.pa.us (Philadelphia Area Computer Society) cfearnl@pacs.pha.pa.us Design Science Revolutionary fearnlcj@duvm.ocs.drexel.edu Explorer in Universe -- Christopher J. Fearnley UNIX SIG Leader at PACS cfearnl@cpp.pha.pa.us (Philadelphia Area Computer Society) cfearnl@pacs.pha.pa.us Design Science Revolutionary fearnlcj@duvm.ocs.drexel.edu Explorer in Universe ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 8 May 1994 00:29:23 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: 4D Solutions Subject: Scanning at BFI >Wasn't the institute working on a project to scan some of the Fuller >archives into Mac's? Did anything come out of it? -- Blaine A thumbnail history of the scanning project: Russell Chu, Robert Orenstein, and Hal Hildebrand donated a lot of resources and time, to get a prototype IBM clone set up at the institute. Bonnie Goldstein (BFI staff) had earlier sketched out the scanning project in a document, with input from these folks. Hal's first donated motherboard wasn't powerful enough, so Russ helped out and got a 386DX with 8MB RAM. Hal is/was a super high powered SmallTalk programmer then with a document scanning defense contractor and the idea was to scan "Everything I Know" as the basic text -- that's a transcribed version of spoken cassette tapes. This would form a core to which other materials could later be linked, hypertext fashion. Hal's SmallTalk program was to be the recepticle and retrieval system. Robert Orenstein was sort of lining up to apprentice under Hal to learn enough SmallTalk to help out (Hal lived in the Bay Area, far enough from BFI to make tech support tough). But all these folks are/were busy busy earning livings. And SmallTalk is a pretty steep learning curve (I tried, got as far as the 4D turtle I described earlier -- my hardware was inadequate too back then, although later Russ gave me his 386DX motherboard, and now I have a 486...never understood Hal's document handling system). Hal drifted off to form his own small business to market a multi-user SmallTalk operating system called Tensegrity. Russ (in construction) moved to Seattle and got married. Robert is still in LA and continues doing trainings for Ingres. The Institute itself got caught up in needing to move away from LA. So... no progress on the scanning front. The idea of using "Everything I Know" as one backbone scenario through a hypertext archives seems valid, although the transcript itself has the drawback of being transcribed speech -- not as polished syntax (but a good read nevertheless). Sneaking synergetics into videogames, using synergetics aesthetics in ways that don't necessarily connote "Bucky" right off, is a way to go. Its a look and feel. Saw Whorf's kid on Star Trek the other night had a Fullerene he'd made in chemistry class (was using it as a water balloon). So there was a blue hexpent on screen, and a little Klingon saying "Fullerene" -- now that's progress! Sort of. -- Kirby ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 8 May 1994 03:59:12 GMT Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Comments: Warning -- original Sender: tag was NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU From: scimatec5@UOFT02.UTOLEDO.EDU Organization: University of Toledo Subject: Re: Computer Graphics / Mathematics "What the h*ll are you talking about?" > Hmmm? Did we go obtuse again? Again? Perhaps. There are some here still in high school...(not out of choice, but state law. Besides, colleges frown on excepting freshman who haven't completed their high school education. =) > Sorry. I suppose that it happens every > now and then... we think ahead at breakneck speed not thinking about who's > listening in. > But what specific topics confused you? If it is > X/Linux/C/Libraries/PEX/Windows & etc, that's a matter of current computer > software jargon, and we really need to limit the traffic of that stuff. Uh, that would be it. > If it's about the geometry/stellation/quanta-modules/X-Y-Z coodinate system > & etc, we probably wouldn't be discussing it if we knew what the h*ll we > were talking about, so jump in anytime! :-) I'd love to, but I'm still working my way into it all. =) Everything's so simple, but the connections and relationships between everything seem so endless (as perhaps they are, being dynamic...(speaking of synergetics, not XYZ.)) The application of X-Y-Z coordinate programs may not be wholy appropriate though (as another pointed out) considering its limiting factors, though alternatives don't come to mind. > This is illustrated by the > following biographical excerpt about physicist Richard Feynman: > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------- > "God! You're Feynman!" he said in awe. "The great safecracker! I've heard > about you; I've always wanted to meet you for so long! I want to learn how > to crack a safe from you." > "What do you mean? You know how to open safes cold." > "I don't." > "Listen, [...] I wanted to meet YOU. And you tell me you don't know how to > open a safe cold." > "That's right." > [...] But you opened i! You must know how to crack safes." > "Oh yeah. I knew the locks come from the factory set at 25-0-25 or > 50-25-50 [...] and the second one worked." > So I DID learn something from him - that he cracked safes by the same > miraculous methods that I did. ... THE MEANING OF LIFE! Well, not really. ^^^^^^^^^^^^^=: Steve Mather ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 9 May 1994 08:56:00 -0400 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: "H. Jeffrey Rosen" Subject: Re: Scanning at BFI Hello, Group! The recent thread RE the scanning project recalls a proposal I made to the BFI over a decade ago, while I was working as a videodisc specialist in the aerospace industry. My idea was/is to marry a videodisc based image archive to Bucky's scanned written/spoken works. The last time I saw Bucky was in Pasadena, about eight months before he passed away. I mentioned my concept to him, proudly admitting that it was his vision in "Education Automation" which had inspired me. He nodded gently, staring at me with those incredibly deep eyes, and said with a hint of regret, "Y'know, I've been meaning to do that." I spent many afternoons at the house in Pacific Palisades with the Synergetics Discussion Group reviewing flowcharts, hypertext schemes and the index of videotapes compiled by Applewhite. We were all very excited about what the new interactive technology was offering us, and how the BFI could use it to make Synergetics more widely understood. Even in my local discussion group in Long Beach, I explored ways to popularize the ideas of RBF in the media, designing what I called "Commercials for Sanity" which would have run on public access cable TV. Sadly, Allegra had to postpone consideration of the proposal indefinitely, citing high equipment costs and shortages of human resources. After all, the BFI had only just moved to LA, and most of the volunteer help was busy figuring out where to store stuff. So now that the text-scanning discussion is taking form, I'd once again like to offer this idea to the Bucky Fans on the Internet: a holistic (spherical) curriculum model, based on fundamental (synergetic) design concepts, as the human interface/front end of an all-inclusive, ever expanding hypermedia database. Users will subscribe to the service through the BFI on a fee-for-use basis, allowing BFI to waive fees in particular cases at first, and perhaps altogether, after the value of the tool has grown, in favor of a royalty-based agreement with the users of the info. The design curriculum allows tailoring of the interface to all ages and cultures. The hypermedia links the written, spoken, transcribed words of Bucky, his confederates, associates, critics, biographers etc. with the vast archive of images, models, pencil sketches, movies, videotapes etc. which are detailed in the Applewhite index, and which have been growing, I'm sure, over the past decade. This tool is an achievable goal. It requires the support of the BFI, and the determined labor of people who believe both in the value of information and the future of humanity. I welcome discussion of this idea, and will follow the scanning thread to see where it leads. H. J. Rosen, Senior Editor 703-43A / Hypermedia Group Westinghouse S.R.C. Aiken SC 29803 Voice 803.725.2765 Fax 803.725.1292 Email hjrosen@srs.gov ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 9 May 1994 10:43:37 -0600 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Randy Cox Subject: Bucky posters On pages vi and xi of "Inventions: The Patented Works of R. Buckminster Fuller" there are photos of Bucky. The first is of a relatively young man contemplating a model of the 4D house (probably about 1928 or so...). The second is of an older Bucky seated, studying a model, with synergetic models scattered about (with a blackboard in the background) - probably taken in the fifties (maybe forties). I'd like to know if anyone out there has scanned images of these photos... TIFF, GIF, or any other format. Failing that, does anyone know if copies are available (preferably poster- sized). The BI? ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 9 May 1994 10:36:19 EST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: DAMICO@GELMAN.CIRC.GWU.EDU Subject: Re: Scanning at BFI I will carry copies of this and the other conversations relating to the fruition of the vision that Fuller expressed in Education Automation to Ed Applewhite on Wednesday. I am going over to his apartment to get him hooked up on the Net. He will likely be subscribing to this list at that time as well. We are reaching the 25 year time lag point for this particular idea and it appears that the technology is maturing to the point that it could become a reality. Ever onward. -Trimtab- ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 9 May 1994 19:17:18 GMT Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Comments: Warning -- original Sender: tag was NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU From: Chris Fearnley Organization: Critical Path Project Subject: Re: Archives or FAQ In article cfearnl@cpp.pha.pa.us (Chris Fearnley) writes: >In article <9405060856.AA1415@thiel0.almaden.ibm.com> Joe Betts/IBM Almaden Research Center writes: >>Does anyone know if there is a Geodesic FAQ or some archives somewhere? > [Stuff Deleted] >I am preparing a FAQ on Fuller. It is version 0.4 right now and 4000+ >lines. I will post it in one or two weeks (when it's a little more >complete). It is very incomplete now and in need of good answers to >geometry/dome questions (these take awhile for me to compose - so don't >hold your breath). I am incorporating the collective wisdom of ~4 >years of GEODESIC posts. > Actually I will be posting it as soon as I figure out how: today or tomorrow (I hope). It only has 1400 lines - but it probably will grow to 4000 lines by end of the year :) Let's see if I can get my signature problem under control. Now that I don't need to use a VAX to access news, I'm trying new features :) -- Christopher J. Fearnley UNIX SIG Leader at PACS cfearnl@cpp.pha.pa.us (Philadelphia Area Computer Society) cfearnl@pacs.pha.pa.us Design Science Revolutionary fearnlcj@duvm.ocs.drexel.edu Explorer in Universe ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 9 May 1994 19:42:54 GMT Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Comments: Warning -- original Sender: tag was NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU From: Chris Fearnley Organization: Critical Path Project Subject: Re: graphic thoughts The problem with computer graphics is that we have a two-dimensional screen and we want to represent four-dimensional objects on it (or 3D objects for you mathemathematician types :). The human heritage has provided numerous techniques for creating the illusion of 4D space on a 2D piece of paper or computer monitor. So the techniques we would use would probably rely on the this XYZ APPROXIMATION to the real world. But really I have no desire to learn all the mathematics. So I want to use one of the graphics libraries. These libraries will (if I understand it correctly) provide functions that allow the programer to describe shapes and how they are to interrelate to each other. So the spheres you were talking about would need to be explained the computer. We would need to tell it about the "real world". But the libraries take care of the 2D representation automatically. Perhaps there is a "synergetics way" to represent 4D objects on a screen, but I think it would be easier and faster to use one of the libraries. I hope this helps! -- Christopher J. Fearnley UNIX SIG Leader at PACS cfearnl@cpp.pha.pa.us (Philadelphia Area Computer Society) cfearnl@pacs.pha.pa.us Design Science Revolutionary fearnlcj@duvm.ocs.drexel.edu Explorer in Universe ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 9 May 1994 20:03:09 GMT Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Comments: Warning -- original Sender: tag was NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU From: Chris Fearnley Organization: Critical Path Project Subject: Re: Computer Graphics / Mathematics In article <1994May7.225912.1@uoft02.utoledo.edu> scimatec5@uoft02.utoledo.edu writes: > [Lost's of stuff deleted] > >> If it's about the geometry/stellation/quanta-modules/X-Y-Z coodinate system >> & etc, we probably wouldn't be discussing it if we knew what the h*ll we >> were talking about, so jump in anytime! :-) > >I'd love to, but I'm still working my way into it all. =) >Everything's so simple, but the connections and relationships >between everything seem so endless (as perhaps they are, being >dynamic...(speaking of synergetics, not XYZ.)) The >application of X-Y-Z coordinate programs may not be wholy >appropriate though (as another pointed out) considering its >limiting factors, though alternatives don't come to mind. > > Synergetics is really very easy. But because we grow up in a world which does not have the shapes that synergetics uses on every street corner, it is hard to get started. The first suggestion is to build models. Before I began building models it was very difficult to visualize ANY of the models Fuller talked about. But the act of puzzling out how to build the models and then actually building them was wonderfully fun and educational. One thing I recommend you don't do is put off learning synergetics 'till after college. I bought vol. 1 of synergetics in my junior or senior year of high school. I couldn't visualize the models so I said let me be a math major and then I'll figure it out. Well, four years at a prestiguous public ivy and I still couldn't visualize a damn thing in synergetics. So I took a year off after graduating to build models. Now I understand synergetics MUCH better (there is always more to learn!!!). On another note you brought up I don't believe that XYZ is limiting. It simply is not the way the Universe works. You could probably come up with an XYZ interpretation of anything and it would approximate reality (this is what physics has succesfully done). But it's so irrational and awkward and worse than that it's clear that the Universe can't be doing it that way ("How many decimal places does nature carry out her calculation of pi before she gets frustrated and chooses instead to make an imperfect buble?"). [More stuff deleted] > Steve Mather > > > -- Christopher J. Fearnley UNIX SIG Leader at PACS cfearnl@cpp.pha.pa.us (Philadelphia Area Computer Society) cfearnl@pacs.pha.pa.us Design Science Revolutionary fearnlcj@duvm.ocs.drexel.edu Explorer in Universe ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 9 May 1994 22:54:07 EDT Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Kurt Przybilla <73602.3025@COMPUSERVE.COM> Subject: Re: scanning Not only is such a tool achievable, it is necessary. The sooner,the better! Please include my name in the list of people willing to dedicate my time and labor to this project in any way possible. I am a good researcher and fast learner. Please tell me how I can help. Of course, I will be more than glad to pay for the use of such a service!!!! I am very glad to know there are people like you out there. Our future is in good hands. Synergetically, Kurt Przybilla omnidirectional thinking 73602.3025@compu$erve.com ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 9 May 1994 23:24:48 EDT Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Kurt Przybilla <73602.3025@COMPUSERVE.COM> Subject: buckyboron I found this recently and feel that it may answer some of the questions previously posted last month (by, I think it was Steve) concerning Bucky balls (C60) and boron. From: Encyclopedia of Applied Physics, Vol. 6 1993 VCH Publishers p.520 " A second method is the substitutional doping of an impurity atom with a different valence state for a carbon atom on the surface of a fullerene ball. Since a carbon atom is o small, and since the average nearest-neighbor C-C distance ac-c on the C60 surface is only 1.44 A /angstrom/ (Johnson et al., 1992), the only species that can be substituted for a carbon atom on the C60 ball surface is boron, making the charged ball p type. Smalley and co-workers have demonstrated that it is possible to replace more than on carbon atom by boron on a given ball ( Smalley, 1991). Also for graphite, the only substitutional dopant is boron, and for the same reasons as for C60. However, for diamond, which has larger C-C nearest neighbor distance of ac-c+1.544 A, both boron and nitrogen can enter the lattice sbustitutionally(Feild, 1979). It has also been reported that it is possible to place a potassium atom endoheronally inside the C60 ball while at the same time substituting aa boron for a carbon atom on the surface of the ball(Smalley, 1991)." The first method of doping deals with "endohedral" doping of rare earth, or alkali-metal ions. The third deals with similar dopants introduced between adjacent balls (intercalation) There are over 20 pages of very good information in this source. I recom- end it to all, but can help to note how funny it is to hear science texts teaching Bucky's ideas with out mentioning him outside of a small blurb at the beginning that in this case reads, "They gave the name buckminsterfullerene to C60 (Kroto et al., 1985) because of its resemblance to the geodesic domes desgned and built by R. Buckminister Fuller (Fuller,1984)" There is no mention of Bucky's continually stressing that carbon is a tetra- hedron. Of course, they have to walk everyone through Euler, without men- tioning Synergetics, or the fact that Bucky long ago created it by including energy and Euler's topology in an omnitopology. Even Smalley and Kroto puzzled over the shape of C60 for weeks. Synergetically, Kurt Przybilla omnidirectional thinking ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 11 May 1994 06:36:14 GMT Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Comments: Warning -- original Sender: tag was NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU From: Jonathan Betts Organization: IBM Research Subject: Re: Scanning at BFI In article <43711B6241@GELMAN.CIRC.GWU.EDU> , DAMICO@GELMAN.CIRC.GWU.EDU writes: > I am going over > to his apartment to get him hooked up on the Net. The Net. One of the most wonderful things emerging. Why? One reason is the ever-increasing amount of quality data accessible instantly. Powerful, anti- ignorance tool, and ignorance is a major world problem. A new and especially wonderful part of the Net: WWW/Mosaic. Check it out -- it's free. Download the client (Mac or PC or UNIX) from NCSA. SUGGESTION: put all the Bucky info available in electronic form into a database accessible from a BFI home page. True, people could access this into for free, but this is great info to have freely accessible. Right? For people only partly connected to the net, set up an FTP site, too. The BFI will make money other ways, like selling services, and selling paper to those who still must waste trees to access info. Only fitting that those people should subsidize the paper-free dissemination of the same info, no? IDEA! Shareware is a tremendously successful way of distributing software and also getting money to the authors. What about DATA SHAREWARE? Decide how much you at the BFI would like someone to pay you for getting a copy of the each data item you distribute, and a decent fraction of people will send in their money -- if the prices are reasonable. You may even make more money than if you wait for people to buy paper products that they hear about only through obscure means, and have to wait for mail cycles or use gasoline to get. The power of instant gratification is immense, and the goodwill of humans is surprising. Allow the free distribution of the data with the following cateats: (1) the (this) distribution clause must accompany each copy (2) the recipient of each copy agrees to send $x dollars to the BFI before accessing the data beyond the distribution clause. This is aleady being done successfully with music. Check out IUMA (WWW: http://sunsite.unc.edu/innc/idec/html or FTP: sunsite.unc.edu, in pub/electronic-publications/IUMA) Joe Betts (IBM does not necessarily support any idea put forth by me here) ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 12 May 1994 08:33:40 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Kirby Urner Subject: Re: Scanning at BFI >stuff deleted >A new and especially wonderful part of the Net: WWW/Mosaic. Check it out >it's free. Download the client (Mac or PC or UNIX) from NCSA. >stuff deleted >SUGGESTION: put all the Bucky info available in electronic form into a >database accessible from a BFI home page. True, people could access this >into for free, but this is great info to have freely accessible. Right? >For people only partly connected to the net, set up an FTP site, too. > >Joe Betts >(IBM does not necessarily support any idea put forth by me here) > Good suggestions. I just started using WWW/Mosaic last week -- FTP too. A lot of home users who say they're "connected to the Net" don't have FTP either though -- just email, sufficient for subscribing to GEODESIC. For those not familiar: WWW (World Wide Web) is an amorphous hypertext document linking computers and their contents. On my screen (Windows), the text appears as black on a grey background -- except some words and phrases appear in blue. Clicking on the blue text with my mouse takes me not another page. Graphics (GIFs) are also interspersed in these pages. BFI is a long way from having the savvy to provide extensions to the WWW on its own. BFI might negotiate with corporate and/or well equipped individual net users to share content e.g. scannable material. I am not a BFI person, but I too have a lot to learn (although I'm somewhat further along). Like what utilities do universities use to actually create these WWW home pages and such. I presume one needs to be running in UNIX. ------------------------------------------------ Kirby T. Urner pdx4d@teleport.com 4D Solutions pdx4d@igc.apc.org Portland, Oregon ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 12 May 1994 14:04:11 LCL Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: GERRY SEGAL Subject: Re: Scanning at BFI On 5/12 Kirby Urner wrote: > >stuff deleted > Good suggestions. I just started using WWW/Mosaic last week -- FTP too. > A lot of home users who say they're "connected to the Net" don't have > FTP either though -- just email, sufficient for subscribing to GEODESIC. Kirby: First let me thank you for the very interesting suggestions you wrote last week regarding coding synergetics using the IVM. What a powerful way of sharing and continuing Bucky's ideas. I would love to see a language created that way. Ideally, it would be great to see it created by a shared group over the Internet and in the public domain ala LINUX. In regard to the above a lot more services are beginning to offer or plan to offer Mosaic. I've read about America On Line and Prodigy. There are new interesting companies that are giving away SLIP interfaces and charging low monthly fees ~$9.00/month. > BFI is a long way from having the savvy to provide extensions to the > WWW on its own. BFI might negotiate with corporate and/or well equipped > individual net users to share content e.g. scannable material. I am > not a BFI person, but I too have a lot to learn (although I'm somewhat > further along). Like what utilities do universities use to actually > create these WWW home pages and such. I presume one needs to be running > in UNIX. > Kirby, BFI is a lot closer than you think. Mosaic and all WWW interfaces is based on a hypertext style language HTML. Editors are available on various platforms including DOS and Macintosh. Creating a WWW home page is a bit more difficult, but quite close to, creating a Hypertext document on the Mac. Check out the WWW FAQ file available at URL "http://www.umcc.umich.edu/~ec/www/html_faq.html". If a Home Page does get in place I'd like to be the first to offer the Project Synergy curriculum. It was developed by myself and a team of NYC school teachers circa 1975-79. We need generalists in the future. ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 12 May 1994 14:11:10 -0600 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Randy Cox Subject: Fuller Structures I'm interested in exchanging experiences and sea stories on building Fuller- type structures. I've read GEODESIC archives for the last few months, and know that there are people on the list that have dome experience, but I've not seen any discussions of other structures using tensegritic or aspensional structures. I'm assuming, of course, that most of the people with dome experience I've read about in the archives have been building struted framework domes, or cast fly"s eyes. Is anyone else out there actively building any other usable-sized (big enough for adults) structures? I've built examples of both, and am activly engaged in developing others -- including octets and geodesic vaults. I consider myself extremely fortunate that I am occasionally called upon at work to build (or at least investigate) such things. My predominate occupation is camoufleur, so I have to make things to support nets and soft structures. Most of my work has been decidedly military, but is increasingly becoming oriented towards disaster relief. Also, I'm interested in modeling the fabrication, structural, and environmental effects of really large structures (RLS's). An example of an RLS would be a domes of 1 km diameter or more. Is anyone out there aware of previous (other than those done by Bucky) or current efforts in this regard ( Biospherians need not reply...)? ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 13 May 1994 00:14:52 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Kirby Urner Subject: Re: Scanning at BFI >Kirby: First let me thank you for the very interesting suggestions you >wrote last week regarding coding synergetics using the IVM. What a >powerful way of sharing and continuing Bucky's ideas. Thanks! I'm sure much better language models could be proposed so lets keep that thread alive. >stuff deleted >Kirby, BFI is a lot closer than you think. Mosaic and all WWW >interfaces is based on a hypertext style language HTML. Editors are >available on various platforms including DOS and Macintosh. Creating >a WWW home page is a bit more difficult, but quite close to, creating a >Hypertext document on the Mac. Check out the WWW FAQ file available >at URL "http://www.umcc.umich.edu/~ec/www/html_faq.html". So I'm beginning to learn. I was in fact exploring about HTML just today, reading about how to create these hypertext documents. You're right, it doesn't look all that difficult. Still, one has to be a host or server of some kind, not just a logger inner. If Synergetics was taken more seriously, we'd have more seriously interested grad students at universities where home pages are already in place that could hyperlink into RBF scenarios. BFI could definitely help coauthor such, and provide some cool inline GIFs. >If a Home Page does get in place I'd like to be the first to offer the >Project Synergy curriculum. It was developed by myself and a team of >NYC school teachers circa 1975-79. We need generalists in the future. > Interesting. Would like to hear more. -- Kirby ------------------------------------------------ Kirby T. Urner pdx4d@teleport.com 4D Solutions pdx4d@igc.apc.org Portland, Oregon ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 13 May 1994 00:18:15 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Kirby Urner Subject: Re: Fuller Structures >Also, I'm interested in modeling the fabrication, structural, and >environmental effects of really large structures (RLS's). An example of an >RLS would be a domes of 1 km diameter or more. Is anyone out there aware of >previous (other than those done by Bucky) or current efforts in this regard ( >Biospherians need not reply...)? > Have you checked out Internation Journal of Space Structures (I believe is the title). Pretty up to date on engineering domes, but other structures as well. There's also Dome Magazine, but this is probably more focused on what you already know about. -- Kirby ------------------------------------------------ Kirby T. Urner pdx4d@teleport.com 4D Solutions pdx4d@igc.apc.org Portland, Oregon ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 13 May 1994 09:17:01 LCL Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: GERRY SEGAL Subject: Re: Scanning at BFI On 5/12/94 Kirby wrote: >You're right, it doesn't look all that difficult. Still, one has to be > a host or server of some kind, not just a logger inner. All you need is a MAC or PC. Probably should be dedicated, it doesn't have to be. Nothing else is needed. ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 13 May 1994 16:28:58 GMT Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Comments: Warning -- original Sender: tag was NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU From: Jonathan Betts Organization: Cellular Organization Subject: Re: Scanning at BFI In article Kirby Urner, pdx4d@TELEPORT.COM writes: >BFI is a long way from having the savvy to provide extensions to the >WWW on its own. BFI might negotiate with corporate and/or well equipped >individual net users to share content e.g. scannable material. I am >not a BFI person, but I too have a lot to learn (although I'm somewhat >further along). Like what utilities do universities use to actually >create these WWW home pages and such. I presume one needs to be running >in UNIX. (1) there are semi-cheap ways of getting on the net as a WWW server, something like $20-$400 /month depending upon what is availble in the area. Then a Mac or PC or a UNIX machine will do. (2) there are freeware editors for putting together WWW home pages quickly and easily. (3) BFI could probably find someone who would put the BFI data on their WWW server, since the BFI is so cool. There are a lot of interesting, progressive, radical, etc. people out there with WWW servers. Joe Betts -- betts@netcom.com -- ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 13 May 1994 16:40:14 GMT Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Comments: Warning -- original Sender: tag was NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU From: Jonathan Betts Organization: Cellular Organization Subject: Re: Fuller Structures In article <199405121411109010@pobox.tbe.com> Randy Cox, Randy_Cox@POBOX.TBE.COM writes: >other structures using tensegritic or aspensional structures. >cast fly"s eyes. what is a cast fly eye? >I've built examples of both, and am activly engaged in developing others -- >including octets and geodesic vaults. what are geodesic vaults? >My predominate occupation is camoufleur are you at liberty to disclose any of your designs? >increasingly becoming oriented towards disaster relief. I am glad to hear it. >very large structures the only tidbit I have to offer here is that Fuller suggested that these structure can be weaker than you might predict since they can hold themselves up using the warm air inside -- very predictable solar gain. Joe Betts -- betts@netcom.com -- ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 14 May 1994 01:14:53 GMT Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Comments: Warning -- original Sender: tag was NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU From: scimatec5@UOFT02.UTOLEDO.EDU Organization: University of Toledo Subject: Re: Fuller Structures In article <199405121411109010@pobox.tbe.com>, Randy Cox writes: > I'm interested in exchanging experiences and sea stories on building Fuller- > type structures. (a whole lot just indiscriminately deleted, for lack of a more exciting pastime...=) Well, I thought I'd ask all of you of an idea I'm working on, and be sure it'll work before I get started (well, really I've already started, I just haven't finished.) I'm afraid I haven't built any full sized structures yet. First you start with an IVM (isotropic vector matrix (I think that's what it's called =)) and make all the octahedrons of the tetra-octa alternation center bodied, with tensile edges. The tetrahedrons then are made up of the tensile edges of the octahedrons and and one additional tensile edge of their own, the opposing tetrahedons balancing each other out. Then this whole thing is projected onto a sphere from which ever platonic "solid" you like. Will it work? I don't have a working model yet, as school keeps getting in the way. Steve Mather ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 14 May 1994 10:00:01 EDT Reply-To: dkapstd@ftp.com Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Comments: Warning -- original Sender: tag was dkap@MAILSERV-C.FTP.COM From: "A Page in the Life of ..." Subject: Scanning at BFI In-Reply-To: Kirby Urner's message of Fri, 13 May 1994 00:14:52 -0700 <199405130717.DAA11092@cs.brandeis.edu> I have a (somewhat slow) WWW server running on my linux box, if people want to put mosaic and such up on it. The box currently doesn't have mail capabilities or an anonymous ftp set up (yet) but it does serve web pages. If people want to send me (at this address) their html text pages I would be more than happy to put them up (yes I have CGI working). It is http://switchboard.ftp.com:80/ No, there isn't anything all that interesting up on it yet ... Let me know. Dave K. -- For NASA, space is still a high priority. -- Vice President Dan Quayle, September 1990 ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 14 May 1994 15:38:31 EDT Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: SteveW7562@AOL.COM Subject: world game I've just added my name to this list after ( happily ) discovering its existence. Can anyone tell me what the status of World Game is? I last attended a summer workshop at NYU around 1980. I lost touch with World Game after Dr. Fuller passed on. Are workshops still held? Have they evolved ( as I would have expected them to ) into an on-line process? I recall Ed Schlossberg remarking in 1975 that the original vision of playing World Game with computers ran out of steam because the technology wasn't mature enough, and the degree of complexity of the database construction wasn't grasped by early student enthusiasts. In 1994, though, I would think that any number of participants could spontaneously conference into workgroups via internet and draw on the net-wide information resources. Surely someone is doing this. Steve Wenzel ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 15 May 1994 00:41:41 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Kirby Urner Subject: Re: world game >Can anyone tell me what the status of World Game is? I last >attended a summer workshop at NYU around 1980. I lost touch >with World Game after Dr. Fuller passed on. Are workshops >still held? Have they evolved ( as I would have expected >them to ) into an on-line process? WG Institute in Philly puts out a Mac HyperCard WG software package that's somewhat cool (not being a MacHead, I haven't used it much). Workshops still held. Distilled into a canned set of exercises, mostly for school kids. Gymnasium sized Dymaxion map people get to walk on. >I recall Ed Schlossberg remarking in 1975 that the original >vision of playing World Game with computers ran out of steam >because the technology wasn't mature enough, and the >degree of complexity of the database construction wasn't >grasped by early student enthusiasts. In 1994, though, I >would think that any number of participants could >spontaneously conference into workgroups via internet and >draw on the net-wide information resources. Surely someone >is doing this. > >Steve Wenzel > I'd say this is what we're all doing -- world game being what we're all playing (except World Game [TM] holds the copyright to calling it World Game [TM] and will sic lawyers on you if you say THIS is world game -- although part of the canned workshop is (or was) to say: "the real World Game begins when you walk out the door")). ------------------------------------------------ Kirby T. Urner pdx4d@teleport.com 4D Solutions pdx4d@igc.apc.org Portland, Oregon ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 15 May 1994 08:45:12 18000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Cal Eastman Subject: Re: Scanning at BFI In-Reply-To: <199405121624.MAA19233@hela.INS.CWRU.Edu>; from "Kirby Urner" at May 12, 94 8:33 am quick note- peaople who have email can ftp indirect;ly using an "ftp by email" server -- Boom shiva mahalinga nataraj :) (puffiness 4evah) ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 15 May 1994 09:21:14 -0400 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: "" Subject: Re: Fuller Structures >I've read GEODESIC archives for the last few months, and know that there are >people on the list that have dome experience, but I've not seen any >discussions of other structures using tensegritic or aspensional structures. Tensegrity models are a sort of on-again off-again hobby of mine. One problem I've noticed is the relative scarcity of engineered connectors intended for tensegrity construction. Not that I am _surprised_ by this; raw materials abound, but not much effort is put into a building method that not many people use. ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 15 May 1994 19:18:02 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: troy vanlynden Subject: Re: world game In-Reply-To: <9405141939.AA07222@henson.cc.wwu.edu> The worldgame was held at Western washington U in Feb 1994, I believe that is roughly the time frame? it was a good demonstration. Currently there is a worldgame group here in SEATTLE - i don't know the name of it ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 14 May 1994 12:34:12 GMT Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Comments: Warning -- original Sender: tag was NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU From: Craig Anderson Organization: Colorado SuperNet, Inc. Subject: Re: Scanning at BFI N E R D A L E R T - geodesic cyberspace meme approaching Check out tkWWW. This is a tcl/tk based WWW browser. Positive Potentials: 1) Includes HTML editor. 2) Motif not required to make mods. 3) Runs in an interpreter environment, tcl/tk. The geodesic community could customize this easily. 4) Check out tcl-dp. This is a distributed processing add-on for tcl. Combining tkWWW and tcl-dp could provide an interactive WWWW Cyberspace. 5) I think there is already a tcl/tk 3d back-end - interactive 3D geodesic Cyberspace anyone. 6) Freeware! All of it! Drawbacks: 1) Some assembly required. 2) Unix/X based. (Given the existence of Linux, I consider this a plus; but then I'm issuing ths nerd alert ;-) P.S. Check out WavesWorld for NeXTStep. Later, Craig Anderson craig@c4.com (Home page under construction) ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 15 May 1994 03:49:52 GMT Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Comments: Warning -- original Sender: tag was NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU From: Kevin Sahr Organization: Forest Sciences Laboratory Subject: Synergetics software ideas I seem to have missed a good chunk of the discussion about creating software to "play" (and work, of course!) with synergetic structures. I too would very much like to see software like this developed, and by the end of this summer I think I could also volunteer some time towards making this a reality. I've been a professional programmer for the last 5 years, with a significant chunk of that time spent doing high-end 3D graphics work. For what it's worth, here's my slant on what I've seen of the discussion so far. First, though the choice of an initial platform and graphics library is obviously important, I think the real key to doing this right is to use something like the SmallTalk model-view- controller paradigm. Specifically, I think we should develop a display-independent back-end, that consists of a set of data structures and a command language that drives their manipulation that contains no platform/library-specific graphics commands in and of itself. While it's got it's problems, I think the obvious best choice of a language to do this in is C++. Next we define an abstract display class, where any specific instance of this class would have to define some canonical set of drawing methods. One of the first display classes to create would be a text one: i.e., to draw a polygon to it would simply print-out the vertices of the polygon or whatever. We also define an abstract controller class, which would issue some set of commands to manipulate the data structures. Again, the first obvious controller to define would be a text-based one, where you type in what you want to happen. If this was well-designed, then different people could code specific display classes for their favorite platform/graphics library. And if the models were always internally manipulated by some platform-independent command/function set, then GUI's for different platforms could be layered on top of that command set. Unfortunately we're stuck with XYZ graphics libraries, at least at some level (since the pixels on our monitors are in rectilinear coordinates; always struck me as an obvious idea to make monitors with a hexagonal grid of pixels rather than rectilinear. Seems like it should give a better display [with less aliasing, etc.] for the same number of pixels). But there's no reason why our internal manipulations can't be IVM based; indeed, I think that the development of such a graphics language would be highly educational. As to which graphics library to implement in first, I personally think that the best 3D graphics library by far is OpenGL. As far as I can tell the only reason people use anything other than GL for 3D graphics is because, until very recently, GL was a proprietary standard that was only available on SGI machines (which were, again until very recently, very expensive). Now that OpenGL is being ported to many other platforms I personally think it's going to kill all of it's competition (which consists, as far as I can tell, of PEX, PHIGS, and StarBase (:-()). Also, I believe there are PD GL work-alikes available for both the PC and the Mac (called VOGL, I believe). But again, it really doesn't matter to me which display someone works on first; because if this is done in the manner I suggest the display, while obviously important, is not where the meat of this project is. Give me a set of vertices for a polyhedron and in GL I can draw it on the screen shaded, lighted, and with your mother-in-law's face texture-mapped onto it with no trouble. With a (very) little more trouble I could draw it on a Mac (at least as a wireframe, sans your mother-in-law's face :-)). Believe me, I'm not trying to trivialize the graphics portion of this project (and I'm _especially_ not trying to trivialize the mouse-based user interface portion of such a project!). But given that we've got a variety of platforms here I think we could get the biggest bang for our time by not cutting any of them out of the action from the get-go. Well, I didn't come into work on a Saturday night to ramble-on on my soapbox. Can't avoid that core anymore.... Kevin ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 17 May 1994 05:44:13 GMT Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Comments: Warning -- original Sender: tag was NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU From: Chris Fearnley Organization: Critical Path Project Subject: Re: Synergetics software ideas In article <2r4650$agj@gaia.ucs.orst.edu> sahr@thuja.FSL.ORST.EDU (Kevin Sahr) writes: >I seem to have missed a good chunk of the discussion about >creating software to "play" (and work, of course!) with >synergetic structures. I too would very much like to see >software like this developed, and by the end of this summer >I think I could also volunteer some time towards making this >a reality. I've been a professional programmer for the last >5 years, with a significant chunk of that time spent doing >high-end 3D graphics work. For what it's worth, here's my >slant on what I've seen of the discussion so far. You can get the recent logs of the discussion by sending e-mail to listserv@ubvm with the body consisting of the line "get geodesic log9404" or whatever month you want. Actually you didn't miss much just ignorants speculating on graphics libraries that we know nothing about yet. It is refreshing to hear from someone who knows a little about this area. > >First, though the choice of an initial platform and graphics >library is obviously important, I think the real key to doing >this right is to use something like the SmallTalk model-view- >controller paradigm. Specifically, I think we should develop a >display-independent back-end, that consists of a set of data >structures and a command language that drives their manipulation >that contains no platform/library-specific graphics commands in >and of itself. While it's got it's problems, I think the obvious >best choice of a language to do this in is C++. Next we define >an abstract display class, where any specific instance of this >class would have to define some canonical set of drawing methods. >One of the first display classes to create would be a text one: >i.e., to draw a polygon to it would simply print-out the vertices >of the polygon or whatever. We also define an abstract controller >class, which would issue some set of commands to manipulate the >data structures. Again, the first obvious controller to define >would be a text-based one, where you type in what you want to >happen. Agreed. Except I'm not ready for C++ yet - maybe next year. I only began C programming a few months ago. C means there will be more collaborants than C++ could sustain (in 5 years this may be opposite from now, of course). I'm a little fuzzy on the distinction between the "back-end" and the graphics library. I thought the graphics library would take care of such tings as displaying the models (if it's set up right of course), so that the programmer can concentrate on what to do and how to get A to transform into B. Unless you mean to say that the user interface should be designed first - which seems like a good idea. Writing may be clarifying things for me: perhaps you are just suggesting an extra layer of modularization so we write functions like do_VE_jitterbug_transformation and then describe it in terms of functions like draw_VE then draw_icosa then draw_octa then draw_tetra then unfold_poly then refold_inreverse then repeat until user enters next command. The graphics library part would describe how to display the drawings but the "back_end" would describe the high-end steps needed? Well, holler if I got it wrong. > [stuff deleted] > >As to which graphics library to implement in first, I personally >think that the best 3D graphics library by far is OpenGL. As far as >I can tell the only reason people use anything other than GL for 3D >graphics is because, until very recently, GL was a proprietary standard >that was only available on SGI machines (which were, again until very >recently, very expensive). Now that OpenGL is being ported to many >other platforms I personally think it's going to kill all of it's >competition (which consists, as far as I can tell, of PEX, PHIGS, and >StarBase (:-()). Also, I believe there are PD GL work-alikes available >for both the PC and the Mac (called VOGL, I believe). I'll take your word for it, but the OpenGL FAQ seems to suggest to my ignorance that it is more marginal (due to cost?) than PEX which is free (and comes with source code so it is amenable to tinkering). PHIGS is the ISO standard so what you say does sound a bit surprising given the solid base that ISO trys to provide with its standards - but who am I to know :) So how expensive is OpenGL now? The FAQ implies there are not many implementations available yet. Could be that the lower quality PEX is still better? [stuff deleted] > >Kevin > -- Christopher J. Fearnley UNIX SIG Leader at PACS cfearnl@cpp.pha.pa.us (Philadelphia Area Computer Society) cfearnl@pacs.pha.pa.us Design Science Revolutionary fearnlcj@duvm.ocs.drexel.edu Explorer in Universe ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 17 May 1994 16:28:05 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Kirby Urner Subject: Re: Scanning at BFI >On 5/12/94 Kirby wrote: > >>You're right, it doesn't look all that difficult. Still, one has to be >> a host or server of some kind, not just a logger inner. > >All you need is a MAC or PC. Probably should be dedicated, it doesn't >have to be. Nothing else is needed. > >Gerry Segal Well, if you're going to answer incoming calls from internet users following HTML links through the World Wide Web, then your computer has to be more than just an ANSI BBS with a 2400 bps modem! We'd want a Bucky home page to be strategically positioned, or at least wired into the WWW enough so that Mosaic browsers might just "stumble across" Bucky stuff. The goal is to make screens accessible to a general public, not just "hard to reach" stuff for the trully dedicated Fullerist. But basically I agree with the gist of your comment: the technology barriers are *not* overwhelming. ------------------------------------------------ Kirby T. Urner pdx4d@teleport.com 4D Solutions pdx4d@igc.apc.org Portland, Oregon ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 17 May 1994 16:33:01 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Kirby Urner Subject: Re: Scanning at BFI >In article Kirby Urner, >pdx4d@TELEPORT.COM writes: >>BFI is a long way from having the savvy to provide extensions to the >>WWW on its own. >Joe Betts replies: >(1) there are semi-cheap ways of getting on the net as a WWW server, >something like >$20-$400 /month depending upon what is availble in the area. Then a Mac >or PC or >a UNIX machine will do. >(2) there are freeware editors for putting together WWW home pages >quickly and easily. That'll be a next project, to find FTP sites from which to download said freebies. Seems like those of us with Mosaic-type internet access could swap HTML pages around, as a kind of prototyping/storyboarding thing. Getting BFI interested would require a show and tell session where we dialed in to a WWW server with a mockup. BFI has the GIFs and possible FTP down- loadables that would turn the mockup into a goldmine. ------------------------------------------------ Kirby T. Urner pdx4d@teleport.com 4D Solutions pdx4d@igc.apc.org Portland, Oregon ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 17 May 1994 16:42:45 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Kirby Urner Subject: Re: Scanning at BFI >N E R D A L E R T - geodesic cyberspace meme approaching > >Check out tkWWW. This is a tcl/tk based WWW browser. STUFF DELETED >6) Freeware! All of it! > >Drawbacks: >1) Some assembly required. >2) Unix/X based. (Given the existence of Linux, I consider this a plus; > but then I'm issuing ths nerd alert ;-) > >P.S. >Check out WavesWorld for NeXTStep. > >Later, >Craig Anderson >craig@c4.com >(Home page under construction) Thanks for the info. I'm looking for an HTML editor that'll work in MS Windows. An architect friend of mine, who is intrigued by Bucky, got me NextStep for the 486. But I don't yet have the megabytes, gigs or even CDROM to load and play. Some day, I'd like to have a Buckyoidal WWW Server on a NeXT system with access to 4D graphics. (Note: Fuller used 4D to refer to the 4 rays from a central hub that omnisymmetrically define an expanding volume (e.g. the four lines from the center of a tetrahedron to its four vertices). The Cartesian system consists of 6 rays from the origin defining an expanding cube. The expanding tetrahedron uses/defines volume more economically, Bucky claimed). ------------------------------------------------ Kirby T. Urner pdx4d@teleport.com 4D Solutions pdx4d@igc.apc.org Portland, Oregon ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 17 May 1994 16:53:01 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Kirby Urner Subject: Re: Synergetics software ideas Kevin -- I enjoyed your manifesto advocating a C++ engine over which various developers could pitch their interface tents (how's that for mixing metaphors?). Using the OOPs model, I'd suggest that any polyhedron object be prepared to answer "what is your volume?" in tetravolumes. I've wondered about using 4 planes positioned at 60 degrees (ala the walls of a tetrahedron), each slidable to provide a tetrahedron's size and position (inside-outing also doable). The tetrahedron would be a kind of "cursor" in that it would imply a complex internal structure of selectable objects e.g. the "cosmic hierarchy" of concentric polys would be illuminable within tetrahedron X located in my 4D cross-hairs. Another cool interface would be 4D LOGO, a turtle-based language wherein the (multiple) turtles would be piloted to jump vectorially in an iso- tropic vector matrix (high rez). Polyhedra could be generated as successive turtle moves. -- Kirby ------------------------------------------------ Kirby T. Urner pdx4d@teleport.com 4D Solutions pdx4d@igc.apc.org Portland, Oregon ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 18 May 1994 10:42:09 EDT Reply-To: dkapstd@ftp.com Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Comments: Warning -- original Sender: tag was dkap@MAILSERV-C.FTP.COM From: "A Page in the Life of ..." Subject: Scanning at BFI In-Reply-To: Kirby Urner's message of Tue, 17 May 1994 16:28:05 -0700 <199405180100.VAA09029@cs.brandeis.edu> Hmm, maybe my first post didn't get out ... I have a WWW server up and running that I would be more than willing to host _any_ BF information on. It is stable (but a little slow) and on a direct connection to the world. If people want to start sending me things (I don't quite have an anonymous ftp up and running yet ...) or perhaps I could set up a BF login or something let me know. The site is http://switchboard.ftp.com/ and it is running gn so people can gopher to it as well (on port 70 or 80) so if people want to put stuff up (like the archives http'd or such) that can be done as well. It is a pleasue to serve. David C. Kaplowitz -- All men are created unequal. ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 18 May 1994 21:57:01 -0400 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: TAFORD@DELPHI.COM Subject: Income Opportunities from Investment Banker - Interested? Please send inquiries/replies to: taford@delphi.com ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 18 May 1994 22:41:27 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Roger M Kolaks Subject: Re: Income Opportunities from Investment Banker - Interested? In-Reply-To: <01HCI09PBE2A91XJQO@delphi.com> I have never requested any information from you nor are you among my list of associates. If you contact me again I will have my attorney call your attorney concerning legal action against you. Sincerely, Roger M Kolaks On Wed, 18 May 1994 TAFORD@delphi.com wrote: > > > Please send inquiries/replies to: taford@delphi.com > > ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 18 May 1994 23:25:36 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Kirby Urner Subject: Re: Scanning at BFI >N E R D A L E R T - geodesic cyberspace meme approaching >Later, >Craig Anderson >craig@c4.com >(Home page under construction) > -- Kirby here. On the hypertexting scanned Fuller thread, I mentioned I would set out in a quest in cyberspace for a hypertext markup language (HTML) editor for Windows. Found one (through the Web) just half an hour later. I've been looking at sample HTML pages with Mosaic in local mode. Works pretty well, but all this software is alpha or beta versions (I finally got through to FTP the Win32 version of Mosaic). Seems BFI should be the supertanker that we trimtabbers steer by which I mean prototyping in a nebulous, fragile, but entertaining cyberspace could/should take place on "pioneer time" (unpaid) before BFI is asked to commit time and resources to learning the ins and outs. We need forest guides (BFI is like the civilized lady who comes to Boston on the ship from London and gets to go to the Wild West, guided onward and protected by forest-savvy types -- Last of the Mohicans I guess it was). Sorry if I've stopped making sense. Excited to find HTML technology so easily available. -- Kirby ------------------------------------------------ Kirby T. Urner pdx4d@teleport.com 4D Solutions pdx4d@igc.apc.org Portland, Oregon ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 19 May 1994 07:46:37 CST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: "HOLMANJ@UWWVAX.UWW.EDU JOHN HOLMAN" Subject: Re: Income Opportunities from Investment Banker - Interested? OF course I am interested!!! Tell me More. ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 19 May 1994 13:14:43 GMT Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Comments: Warning -- original Sender: tag was NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU From: Christopher Rywalt Organization: Stevens Institute of Technology Subject: WWW Serving Bucky; Scanning _Inventions_; was Re: Scanning at BFI In article Kirby Urner writes: >Date: Tue, 17 May 1994 16:42:45 -0700 >From: Kirby Urner >Subject: Re: Scanning at BFI [some stuff about Un*x-based HTML editors deleted] >Thanks for the info. I'm looking for an HTML editor that'll work >in MS Windows. An architect friend of mine, who is intrigued by >Bucky, got me NextStep for the 486. But I don't yet have the >megabytes, gigs or even CDROM to load and play. Some day, I'd >like to have a Buckyoidal WWW Server on a NeXT system with access >to 4D graphics. An HTML editor for MS Windoze is HTMLEDIT (original name, eh?) which I have a copy of here on my PC. Archie places it at the following sites: calypso-2.oit.unc.edu /pub/packages/infosystems/WWW/tools/editing/ms-windows/htmledit.zip ftp.sunet.se /pub/www/hyperedit/htmledit.zip It's a good piece of software, especially considering it's shareware. It takes a bit of getting used to, but I find it useful for large-scale HTML editing. I have a WWW server running here on a VAX. It has full accessiblity to the Internet community (when it hasn't crashed -- a so-far uncommon occurence). My colleague and I have been working on a Discordian site which is up and running and receives a fair amount of use. My dream project has been to scan in Synergetics and put it up all hypertexted; a test project to work out the scanning and OCRing I've been working on is the introduction to Inventions. I have it scanned and OCRed and am currently working on cleaning up the text. I expect that will be on the web shortly. The URL for our home page is http://www.stevens-tech.edu/ The URL for my home page (to which Inventions will be linked) is http://vaxa.stevens-tech.edu:8000/crywalt.html The introduction to Inventions, however, hardly highlights the advantages of using hypertext, since there's nothing to link to, really. Also, since I'm working with a hand scanner, the images will most likely have to wait a bit (though I have a few things scanned in badly). Anything passed to me will certainly find its way onto the net. Since we already have a good number of users accessing HyperDiscordia, and my colleague will certainly link anything I do into his document, I think we can reach a fair number of people with this. >Kirby T. Urner pdx4d@teleport.com >4D Solutions pdx4d@igc.apc.org >Portland, Oregon Chris %SYSTEM-F-ACCVIO, access violation, reason mask=00, virtual address=00000000, PC =0000BFEF, PSL=03C00009 %TRACE-F-TRACEBACK, symbolic stack dump follows module name routine name line rel PC abs PC SIGNTAURE crywalt@vaxc.stevens-tech.edu 2010 00001010 DEADBEEF SIGNATURE main 2226 00000107 0000BFEF ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 19 May 1994 10:07:35 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: charlie@HPCVUSC.CV.HP.COM Subject: Re: Income Opportunities from Investment Banker - Interested? In-Reply-To: Your message of "Wed, 18 May 94 21:57:01 EDT." <01HCI09PBE2A91XJQO@delphi.com> Not only am I not interested, I am ticked off that this junk e-mail has appeared in my box. Don't do it again! Charlie ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 19 May 1994 22:04:35 GMT Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Comments: Warning -- original Sender: tag was NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU From: Ted Kull Organization: Educational Testing Service Subject: Hello Hello, Saw this list on our news reader. I'm guessing that this a general forum for those interested in geodesic structures ala Bucky Fuller...yes? I'm an old fan of Bucky so, I'm generally interested in other related topics. Is this list specifically focused on geodesics or do you branch out into other areas as well. i.e., general trends in technology, etc.? Ted Kull tkull@rosedale.org /----------------------------------------------------------------------\ | Disclaimer: Opinions expressed are those of the author and do not | | reflect those of the Educational Testing Service. | \----------------------------------------------------------------------/ ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 19 May 1994 19:23:33 -0400 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: "C.P.Townsend" Subject: Re: Income Opportunities from Investment Banker - Interested? In-Reply-To: <199405191735.AA16734@panix.com> from "charlie@HPCVUSC.CV.HP.COM" at May 19, 94 01:07:35 pm Real fine of you to post it to the list, pal. Thanks. ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 19 May 1994 19:24:47 -0400 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: "C.P.Townsend" Subject: Re: Income Opportunities from Investment Banker - Interested? In-Reply-To: <199405190219.AA27213@panix.com> from "TAFORD@delphi.com" at May 18, 94 09:57:01 pm You are a certifiable moron and deserve whatever digital misfortune comes your way. ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 20 May 1994 08:16:58 GMT Reply-To: "Christopher J. Fearnley" Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Comments: Warning -- original Sender: tag was NETNEWS@AUVM.AMERICAN.EDU From: "Christopher J. Fearnley" Organization: Critical Path Project Subject: R. Buckminster Fuller Frequently asked Questions and Answers (Part 1 of 2) Posted-By: auto-faq 2.4 Archive-name: bucky-fuller-faq/part1 Version 0.7 [Sorry I didn't get this out last week - some technical difficulties and prioritizing. I have not processed the '92-present logs from GEODESIC. Probably won't get to them this week. So I'll post this version 0.7 now. Please send errors additions, etc., to me. Perhaps it will be ready for news.answers distribution (i.e., version 1.0) by the end of June. Any suggestions about improving the indexing? I haven't had time to think much about it. But this is almost adequate. Are there any other newsgroups or mailing lists that this FAQ should be posted to? PS. There are a lot of gaps, please help me fill them! I really like constructive criticism - criticize away! I hope this is useful to you all. Do Enjoy!] This is the Frequently Asked Questions and Answers (FAQ) Resource on R. Buckminster Fuller. It is based primarily on the history of the discussions, interests, and needs of the readers of the BITNET list GEODESIC and it's USENET gateway bit.listserv.geodesic. So some of the information could be in error (especially addresses and phone numbers). The FAQ is maintained by Chris Fearnley (cfearnl@cpp.pha.pa.us). Please send all errors and suggestions to me. Bracketed citations refer to the material that follows. Some citations are quoted directly from the logs and follow the material. Beware of outdated information: this information is culled from old log files and is not necessarily up-to-date. Contents: 1.0 Introductory 2.0 Fuller's Ideas about Human Society: Critical Path 2.1 What is the Design Science Revolution? 2.2 What is the "cosmic accounting system"? 2.3.0 What is the World Game? 2.3.1 What is the World Game Institute? 2.3.2 What are the World Game Institutes "games" like? 2.3.3 What is Global Data Manager (GDM)? 2.3.4 Does the World Game offer any solutions to the World Hunger Problem? 2.4 What were Fuller's views on religion/God? 2.5 What is the Global Energy Grid idea? 2.6 What is a "trimtab"? 3.0 Synergetics 3.1 What is "synergy"? 3.2 What is Fuller's definition of "Universe"? 3.3 What is the "isotropic vector matrix" [IVM]? 3.4 What is the "vector equilibrium"? 3.5 What is the jitterbug? 3.6 What is Fuller's concept of "space"? 3.7 What is the "omnidirectional halo"? 3.8 What are the basics of Spherical Trigonometry? 3.9 Does synergetics provide an extension or modification of the 'scientific method?' 3.10 Are there connections between synergetics and fullerenes (besides the name, of course? 4.0 Geodesic Domes and Other Inventions 4.1.0 What is a geodesic dome? 4.1.1 Does a dome really weigh less than its component materials? 4.1.2 What are some features of underground, concrete domes? 4.1.3 Dome References 4.3 What is a tensegrity model? 4.4 Who was Kenneth Snelson and what was his role in the invention of tensegrities? 4.5 What are "cloud nines"? 4.6 What is "dymaxion"? 4.7 What is the Dymaxion Car? 4.8 What is a "fog gun"? 4.9 What are geotangent domes? 4.10 What was Fuller's Floating City design? 4.11 What was the Old Man's River Project (circular cities)? 4.12 What was the Dymaxion Deployment Unit? 5.0 Other related topics: Miscellany 5.1 What are the fullerenes or buckyballs? 5.2 What is Biosphere II? 5.3 Was Fuller's formally educated? 6.0 Resources 6.1 Buckminsterfullerenes Update Service and Fullerene Bibliography 6.2 List GEODESIC: GEODESIC@UBVM.BITNET 6.3 FIX (Fuller Information eXchange) BBS 6.4 Blaine D'Amico's annotated bibliography 6.5 Organizations and Corporations mentioned on GEODESIC (incomplete and dated) 1.0 Introductory Buckminster Fuller (1895-1983) is the renowned inventor of the geodesic dome, the world game, and a new system of mathematics called synergetics. He was a polymath whose books touch upon every aspect of the human condition. His greatest writings were _Critical Path_, _Synergetics_ (2 volumes), and posthumously _Cosmography_. Since his death a recently discovered allotrope of carbon, the fullerenes, have been named in his honor. 2.0 Fuller's Ideas about Human Society: Critical Path Fuller was interested in all branches of the so-called "social sciences" and he made contributions to several. He wrote mostly about Economics. He published several studies of industrial trends (including a famous 1940 issue of Fortune magazine which he inspired). He advocated the principle of "ephemeralization" or doing "more with less". He also advocated a design science revolution whereby designers would use the principles of science in a well thought out way to accomplish greater and greater functionality with fewer and fewer energy resource investments for the benefit of 100% of humanity. This, in contradistinction to his "archenemy" Obnoxico Inc., which trys to make money out of thin air (or rocks) with no appreciable benefit to humankind. He founded the world game which explores the administation of making the world work for 100% of all humanity. His major works in this area are _Critical Path_ and _Grunch of Giants_ wherein he also gives a unique perspective of the history of humans on Earth. 2.1 What is the Design Science Revolution? As I understand it this is basically Fuller's program for converting the world's killingry industries over to livingry industries. Because the principle of ephemeralization shows that we can accomplish more and more functionality with less and less energy and material investment, we are now able to do so much with so little that we can provide for the basic needs of 100% of humanity without disadvantaging anyone. Fuller suggests that by taking the design principles of Universe (as described in _Synergetics_ and elsewhere and our consciously developed values, we can emerge from the present-day "dark ages" and prosper like never before in history. 2.2 What is the "cosmic accounting system"? [I think Fuller's example below is the best description. Typed in by Pat Salsbury.] The following is an excerpt from "Critical Path" by R. Buckminster ("Bucky") Fuller. (Copyright 1981, St. Martin's Press, NY - pp. 262-263) "...We have pointed out that the geologist Francois de Chardenedes wrote for me a scenario of the technology of nature's producing petroleum which disclosed that the amount of energy employed by nature as heat and pressure for the amount of time required to produce each gallon of petroleum, if paid for at the rate at which the public utilities now charge retail customers for electricity, must cost over a million dollars a gallon. Combine that information with the discovery that approximately 60 percent of the employed in U.S. America are working at tasks that are not producing any life support. Jobs of inspectors-of-inspectors; jobs with insurance companies that induce people to bet that their house is going to be destroyed by fire while the insurance company bets that it isn't. All these are negative preoccupations...jobs with the underwriting of insurance underwriters by other insurance underwriters -- people checking up on one another in all the different departments of the Treasury, the Internal Revenue, FBI, CIA, and in counterespionage. About 60 percent of all human activity in America is not producing any physical life protection, life support, or development accommodation, which physical life support alone constitutes real wealth. "The majority of Americans reach their jobs by automobile, probably averaging four gallons a day -- thereby, each is spending four million real cosmic-physical-Universe dollars a day without producing any physical Universe life-support wealth accredited in the energy-time -- metabolic -- accounting system eternally governing regenerative Universe. Humans are designed to learn how to survive only through trial-and-error-won knowledge. Long-known errors are, however, no longer cosmically tolerated. The 350 trillion cosmic dollars a day wasted by the 60 percent of no-wealth-producing human job-holders in the U.S.A., together with the $19 quadrillion a day wasted by the no-wealth-producing human job-holders in all other automobiles-to-work countries, also can no longer be cosmically tolerated. "Today we have computers that enable us to answer some very big questions if all the relevant data is fed into the computer and all the questions are properly asked. As for instance, "Which would cost society the least: to carry on as at present, trying politically to create more no-wealth-producing jobs, or paying everybody handsome fellowships to stay at home and save all those million-dollar-each gallons of petroleum?" Stated evermore succinctly, the big question will be: "Which costs more -- paying all present job-holders a billionaire's lifelong $400,000-a-day fellowship to stay at home, or having them each spend $4 million a day to commute to work?" Every computer will declare it to be much less expensive to pay people not to go to work. The same computers will also quickly reveal that there is no way in which each and every human could each day spend $400,000 staying at the most expensive hotels and doing equally expensive things; they could rarely spend 4000 of the 1980-deflated dollars a day, which is only 1 percent of a billionaire's daily income." 2.3.0 What is the World Game? [keyed in by Patrick G. Salsbury.] This is an excerpt from "The Essential Whole Earth Catalog" (Doubleday & Company, Inc., Garden City, NY) p. 89 " THE WORLD GAME "To make the World work / for 100% of Humanity / In the shortest possible time / Through spontaneous cooperation / Without ecological offense / Or the disadvantage of anyone." Buckminster fuller initiated the World Game in 1969 as one means of accomplishing this worthy goal. The idea is that with enough data on world resources and their distribution (including accumulated technology and problem-solving skills), the world's citizens will do what's best for all. Fuller assumed that once it was obvious that there was enough of everything to go around, people would stop fighting wars and get to work making the world work -- if not as a utopia at least not continuing the current suicidal path. World Game is still developing. Recent sessions use an enormous basketball-court-size map in order to more easily visualize various strategies as they are suggested by participants. A formidable software database called Global Data Manager allows individuals to play with the numbers on their PCs. 2.3.1 What is the World Game Institute? [Dane Winberg of the World Game Institute sent me this contribution.] World Game Institute is a non-profit, non-partisan, global education and research organization dedicated to developing and disseminating problem solving and educational tools. World Game was conceived by world renowned architect, philosopher and visionary, R. Buckminster Fuller as a creative problem solving tool whose goal is to "make the world work for 100% of humanity in the shortest possible time, through spontaneous cooperation and without ecological offense or the disadvantage of anyone." Global Recall 2.0 - A computer atlas featuring 300 world, regional and country maps and 600 data indicators for all countries; 18 essays on current global problems; a Solutions Lab section where you can describe your ideas for global solutions and compare them to real-world data. Comprised of several linked HyperCard stacks, available for Macintosh computers. Regular data updates. Global Data Manager - Available for DOS or Macintosh (currently only for system 6), GDM displays data on population, food, energy, education, natural resources, economics, etc. for the world, all continents and all countries. Separately sold disks of data from World Bank, World Resources Institute, UN. World Game Workshops - Interactive global simulations conducted for elementary and high schools, community groups, universities and corporations; adapted with an emphasis on world geography, history, current events, global issues, patterns of development, strategic options and sustainable solutions to local and global problems. World View Map for the Playground - A basketball court-sized world map is painted on elementary school playgrounds; includes an activities manual for several subject areas. World View Map for the Classroom - A smaller roll-out version of the playground map for indoor use. World Game Institute 3215 Race Street Philadelphia, PA 19104-2597 Phone: (215)387-0220 Fax: (215)387-3009 E-mail: XTM00002@DUVM.OCS.DREXEL.EDU [Posted by Ian Wells] INTRODUCTION TO THE WORLD GAME INSTITUTE Welcome to the World Game! The World Game Institute is a non-profit research and education organization dedicated to developing technological and interactive tools for global problem solving. Among our many products and programs are: - Computer software products for researchers, primary and secondary schools, policy makers and others who need global information at their fingertips to help them create problem solving strategies that work; - Participatory workshops conducted for corporations, national governments, universities high schools and world organizations that demonstrate in real terms the distribution of resources around the world, and methods of using those resources to provide a quality standard of life for all humans without destroying the planet; - Museum exhibits which display the status of resource distribution around the world, and which demonstrate the impact of environmental, military and agricultural policy; - Publications which disseminate research methods and solutions for global problems, and demonstrating creative uses for the tools developed by the World Game Institute; - Playground maps of the world, supplied with teacher's training manuals and activities to make global education fun. The World Game was created by R. Buckminster Fuller, the eminent geometer, architect and thinker, as a creative alternative to war games. Participants in World Game workshops learn to see the world in terms of one population sharing the wealth of one planet, and "win" the Game when they meet the basic health, education, welfare and survival needs of the world's population. In its more sophisticated versions, the World Game also acts as a simulation and laboratory, used by policy makers, corporations and diplomats and world leaders to devise efficient problem solving strategies. ******The preceding was uploaded to CompuServe several months ago. The World Game Workshop, while conceived by Fuller, does not resemble the original Workshops closely at all. Neither is the World Game Institute actively involved in disseminating information about Fuller or pursuing his "synergetics" theory, per se. His theories are a jumping off point for the Institute, but we are not solely involved in propagating his teachings alone. Sus