From MAILER-DAEMON Sat Oct 26 11:46:02 2002 Return-Path: Received: from acsu.buffalo.edu (deliverance.acsu.buffalo.edu [128.205.7.57]) by linux00.LinuxForce.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian -4) with SMTP id g9QFjxWa005485 for ; Sat, 26 Oct 2002 11:45:59 -0400 Message-Id: <200210261545.g9QFjxWa005485@linux00.LinuxForce.net> Received: (qmail 15986 invoked from network); 26 Oct 2002 15:45:59 -0000 Received: from listserv.buffalo.edu (listserv@128.205.7.35) by deliverance.acsu.buffalo.edu with SMTP; 26 Oct 2002 15:45:59 -0000 Date: Sat, 26 Oct 2002 11:45:44 -0400 From: "L-Soft list server at University at Buffalo (1.8e)" Subject: File: "GEODESIC LOG0102" To: Chris Fearnley Status: O Content-Length: 548462 Lines: 14155 ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 00:00:02 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Patrick Salsbury Subject: *SEMI-MONTHLY POSTING* - GEODESIC 'how-to' info ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- This is the semi-monthly "How To" file about the GEODESIC list. 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(Can be in the same message.) ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- (You may want to save this file to forward on to people who are interested, as it tells what the list is about, and how to subscribe and unsubscribe.) Pat _____________________________Think For Yourself______________________________ Patrick G. Salsbury http://www.sculptors.com/~salsbury/ ----------------------- Don't break the Law...fix it. ;^) ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 05:08:08 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Mark Siegmund Subject: Tetworld Center for Peace and Global Gaming Comments: To: Tetglobal , Tetworld , Tetworld Advisory Committee Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Greetings! You are cordially invited to visit a new and dramatic webpage at Tetworld, at: http://members.tripod.com/~Tetworld/center.html Thank you... Mark Siegmund Tetworld Center for Peace and Global Gaming http://members.tripod.com/~Tetworld/index.htm ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 08:31:38 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Steve Waterman Subject: wp's and gc's MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit alan and brian, alan's comments ( re waterman's) .... 30-JAN-2001 10:51 Alan Michelson Verticies + Faces = Edges + 2 ( Verticies + Faces + Edges ) / 2 = great circles ? therefore, ( Edges + 2 + Edges ) / 2 = great circles ? Edges + 1 = great circles ? -------------------------------------------------------------------------- brian's comments... no cigar, Alan. the "plus 2" is in the formula for convex polyhedra, attributed to Euler (which is the same as V+F=E+Cells, where the 2 "cells" are the inside and outside; the cells must all be convex (well; there are other vagaries that must be dealt with, two .-) the thing that we're dyscussing is just the *spinning* of the shape, using any of its n-fold axes (n, greater than 1, of course; actually, *any* pair of opposite vertices on the platonic, archimedean, waterman etc. 'hedra will have a bilateral symmetry, if not a mirror one, or some thing) ... so, these are just the axes through the PAIRED elements, facets, vertices and edges. ............................................................................ ... yes, i believe that is a good manner to define an associated great circle count for these polyhedra. i am also in agreement with alan....for waterman ploys... edges + 1 = great circles. steve ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 04:47:06 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Re: Ashcroft Fillibuster? <> Brian ¿Quincy! Hutchings 01-FEB-2001 4:47 r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us Dear Senatorial Aides; According to the L.A.Times, its just a matter of minutes, now, and a rabid pile of at least ten Blue Dogs, til Senator Ashcroft is a done-deal. Now, it may have come up in the hearings, but the most central issues arent in the paper (perhaps due to the need for composure at the Chicago office). First of all, as was stated in the one-page editorial in The Industry Standard, IT is clear why IT is that this guy is so lusted-after by the IT industry, and in spite of the recent losses in the market, or maybe because of IT, everyone seems to want to shore-up our leadership in e-stuff [*], as a kind of sub rosa tribute to the ideals of utopian post-industrialism, in Congress (and green concensus-science on global warming and so on, which the Florida Gov is taking the lead on with the help of the Texan shocktroops of the energy cartel). This is to say, the laws that he will choose to prosecute (in concert with Justice Rhenquists doctrine of [his] textual intent, as in his days with Nixon, and Bushs new Solicitor General or shall it be Ken Starr, again?) will be those of the unfettered speculative market, in all ITs antideclarational glory the British Liberal Free Trade of imperialism that wed fought at least two wars against! The more important issue, not uncovered by the LATrib, is the tendency of Ashcroft to be a Southern Partisan, or Southron (in the vernacular). I have no idea, if ITs true, but IT sould seem to be something for some dyscussion, the mere fact of being interviewed by Southern Partisan. Please, if there is anything behind that, dont let the IT Boy so-much as hang-aound the Constitution; they call IT, Bivouacing! --Sincerely, Brian Quincy Hutchings 3032 Exposition Blvd. #C, Santa Monica, CA 90404 (r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us) --Oil Platform 2000!... The Three Phases of Exploitation of the PROTOCOLS Of The ELDERS Of KYOTO: (FOSSILISATION (tm/sic))/ BORE/GUSH/NADIR "@" http://www.tarpley.net/29crash.htm. Http://www.tarpley.net/bushb.htm (partial contents, below): 17 -- THE ATTEMPTED COUP D'ETAT OF MARCH 30, 1981 (87K) 18 -- IRAN-CONTRA (140K) 19 -- THE LEVERAGED BUYOUT MOB (67K) 20 -- THE PHONY WAR ON DRUGS (26K) 21 -- OMAHA (25K) 22 -- BUSH TAKES THE PRESIDENCY (112K) 23 -- THE END OF HISTORY (168K) 24 -- THE NEW WORLD ORDER (255K) 25 -- THYROID STORM (139K) ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 05:04:42 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Re: [Q-P] J.K. Galbraith's view of body politic <> Brian ¿Quincy! Hutchings 01-FEB-2001 5:04 r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us thus quoth: the Supreme Court especially, vacancies need not be filled. well, that will be my rallying cry against the WAND Corp., here in their town!... I must say, though, although I agree with James Galbraith's fifth point about the VRA o'65, he completely avoids the fact that a) Gore didn't bother to use it in Fla., and b) Gore lost Arkansas due to hi March 27 arrangement with the Jim Crow majority on the High Court -- bogart that poultice, my friend! now, there was a small item in the paper, about the President inviting the surviving Kennedys to the joint for dinner and a viewing of "13 Days." herewith, from a quite good review in the *NF*, a few caveats: For example, the portrayal of Robert, the AG, and chief collaboratot of the President, is too weak. RFK played a pivotal role in working with his brother to prevent nuclear war. It was Bobby who steered through the option of blockading or quaranteening Cuba, in preference to the McCloy/Acheson "surgical strike"/invasion plan. And it was Bobby who called Krushchev's bluff in accepting the long, rambling note from the Soviet dictator that offered a "way out" of the deepening nightmare. It was no accident that RFK was himself murdered only five years after his borther. He was a direct threat to the McCloy-led Wall Street cabal. Other ommissions: The role of McCloy is all but eliminated; the role of Acheson in encouraging a lunatic miltary attack is downplayed; and the connivings of Bundy are not highlighted. One is left with only the military to blame for a brush with Armageddon, and this os simply wrong. IT WAS THE VAUNTED "FOREIGN POLICY ESTABLISHMENT" THAT NEARLY BLEW THE WORLD AWAY. (I added the caps. that's Jan.29th issue .-) bore/gush/nadir @ http://www.tarpley.net/29crash.htm ; http://www.tarpley.net/bushb.htm (Copyr.92 by EIR, partial contents): INTRODUCTION: An American Caligula? (47K) 8 -- THE PERMIAN BASIN GANG (64K) ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 13:40:17 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Kirby Urner Subject: Re: actaul volumes In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 02:31 PM 01/31/2001 -0500, you wrote: >kirby, > >i have noticed an problem in some of >the volume calculations. > >root 1 has 20 TV. which is consistent. >your actual volume shown however, is >6.6666666666 We did this before: 3 x 6.666.. = 3 * 20/3 = 20. My tetrahedron is 1/3rd the cube the Qhull is talking about. If you have some "actual" volume you prefer, the same scale factor should work for all of them. As far as I'm concerned, TV is as actual as it needs to be. Kirby ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 12:43:23 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: "Brent A. Verrill" Subject: Eden Project Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Hi all, I found two magazine articles on the Eden Project, near Cornwall, England. They are: World Architecture #92, Jan., 2001, pp. 100-107. Cover story. Excellent article and photos. The author gives due credit to Bucky without snide derision. Architectural Review, Aug., 2000. This magazine teases you with a nice cover photo, and then delivers a completely lame fluff piece, ABOUT THE VISITOR'S CENTER! It is an interesting building, rammed earth, tensile fabric roof, etc., but cumon! The story is clearly about the domes! Two or three pages. Worth a look, but not a purchase. Haven't looked for online versions of these articles yet. I'll get back to you on that. Brent ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 13:27:59 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: 'Bill' 'Eagleton' Subject: Re: Eden Project Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > Architectural Review, Aug., 2000. > This magazine teases you with a nice cover photo, and then delivers a > completely lame fluff piece, ABOUT THE VISITOR'S CENTER > Brent www.37.com & the name... Here are the best of the 20... Pretty neat. Some, sorta slow... Some fast. BillSF9c --- http://www.edenproject.com/ http://search.megaspider.com/XP.html?Eden+Project http://www.edenproject.com/views/index.htm --- http://members.tripod.co.uk/edenproject/ --- http://www.tiggerthecat.bizland.com/ --- http://www.cornwall-calling.co.uk/eden-project.htm --- __________________________________________________________________ Get your own FREE, personal Netscape Webmail account today at http://webmail.netscape.com/ ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 18:23:30 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Subject: The Eden Project - The Living Theatre of Plants and People Comments: To: _DomeHomeList MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Internal & external color pics of the Eden Project greenhouse domes in SW England: http://www.edenproject.com/views/index.htm Joe S Moore: joemoore@cruzio.com Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute: http://www.cruzio.com/~joemoore/ ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 22:53:41 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Subject: Out of Print Bucky Books Comments: To: _DomeHomeList MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Domebook 1 & Domebook 2 by Pacific Domes available for sale on Ebay! http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=552609524 http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1407438934 Joe S Moore: joemoore@cruzio.com Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute: http://www.cruzio.com/~joemoore/ ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 3 Feb 2001 09:36:42 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Steve Waterman Subject: physical / mathematical depictions MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit i have included Karl Erickson's first 100 "accumulating spheres" depictions along with some initial raw data for them on my site at... http://www.dsuper.net/%7Etinom/ph2000/wp1to13.html i find these help in visualizing the changes that occur when incrementing by the radial sweep distances. with a little careful scrutiny, you can actually see how every surface shape is being made/determined/calculated /transformed/interpreted/approximated/volumized/ mathematized/transmuted/mirror-reflected/equalized/ structured/rendered/etc.. each polyhedra being a mathematical representation of the physically packed spheres....at some specific root distance. ......................................................................... i have tried to keep all the physical sphere data ( in yellow ) isolated from the mathematical polyhedral data ( in cyan...the light blue ) ............................................................................ ........ i have also tried to make a depiction using povray of the ccp packing as i see it .... http://www.dsuper.net/%7Etinom/ph2000/14VECTOR.html steve ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 3 Feb 2001 05:02:59 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Re: [Q-P] faith-based programs and taxes <> Brian ¿Quincy! Hutchings 03-FEB-2001 5:02 r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us [also: [Q-P] help with the Temple Mt issue] isn't this the major "point" of these initiatives, to make a gigantic taxcut by the Subjectivist Greenspan and his ilk, to be an opportunity for philanthropy? (which is run for the most part by the oligarch, anywho!) as for the Temple Mount and Sharon, my feelings can be subscribed by two comments: a) Oy Heil! and b) God Save the Queen and her Temple Mount Fundies! --The End Was Nigh! http://www.tarpley.net/bush23.htm ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 3 Feb 2001 06:36:32 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Re: great circles ? <> Brian ¿Quincy! Hutchings 03-FEB-2001 6:36 r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us V+F-1=E+1, and E+1=E+1, and 2(E+1)/2 = E+1, but does it follow that the number of paired elements (V+F+E) is equivalent to the number of edges plus one? thus quoth: i am also in agreement with alan....for waterman ploys... edges + 1 = great circles. > --(zero bp (tm) [*]) Oil Platform 2000!... > The Three Phases of Exploitation > of the Protocols of the Elders of Kyoto (sik): fossilisation (sic)/ > bore/gush/nadir @ http://www.tarpley.net/29crash.htm ; > http://www.tarpley.net/bushb.htm (Copyr.92 by EIR, partial >contents): > INTRODUCTION: An American Caligula? (47K) > 8 -- THE PERMIAN BASIN GANG (64K) > 17 -- THE ATTEMPTED COUP D'ETAT OF MARCH 30, 1981 (87K) ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 3 Feb 2001 10:10:17 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Re: Ashcroft Fillibuster? <> Brian ¿Quincy! Hutchings 03-FEB-2001 10:10 r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us MK-infra: How the 'WAND' Corp. Gerry-rigged an Election [*]; "Dynastic" Demolition Derby Experiment? c'1, Brian Quincy.Hutchings The "players" may all have freely associated into the Bush campaign, as they were bound to clump, some where [2]; may've been just-as-promiscuous gatherings for Gore. The unreported fact is, this "nonpartisan quasi- nongovernmental organization" (quango) was the board-home of four members of the "cmte. to re-elect a George" (the G2Kcmte.), along with the new-appointed Secretary of Treasury, and grabbing another notable Republican, who worked "under" Carter [3] as "Fed" Chairman, Volcker. It is this (very recent) boardmember, who is so indicative of the hard bent o'WAND, toward what used to be known as British Liberal Free Trade, or imperialism; that is, "globalisation" is a sort of euphamism, this nation was founded to fight; dig? (Thus, Sec'ty Sir Colin's anglo-american "Exceptionalism" may be a nasty hoot.) Even groovier, they've got three on the Cabinet, with the heighthened role of the Natl.Security Adviser, Rice [4], Rumsfeld (prior WAND Chair) at Defense and, surely wanting to uphold the office of Hamilton's dirigisme, Chair O'Neil. "PM Cheney's" Hi Tea with Austin Powers - Remind Them to Behave! What the portrayal of a VP by The Economist, means?... Perhaps a) that the Queen ha'th no power (as an axiom) and b) neither do'th George. It is true, what they say, insofar as we seem to have had fully 4 or 5 terms of "co-presidency" de facto, though Reagan refused a primary offer from the RNC, to have such with Ford! Like Kennedy's nasty Cabinet, Reagan was surrounded by Bushwhackers; the DLC'd crafted an official role for Gore, only slightly less robust than that sub rosa deal. Now, if Ashcroft be made AG, there's room virtually for anything to be allowed, as with "Lord High Executioner" Rhenquist's doctrine, [his] Textual Intent. At this hoary juncture, let me decipher the hyper-promoted "hit" of the second Austin Powers movie [5], quickly. The premise is identical to that of a Bond novel, with a new feature: British Intelligence is Pythonesque (not oxymoronic). Why's the Wimp-factor Transferred to the Democratic Half o'Senate? Hey, W may be smarter than his father [6] - no matter, the PR campaign of the RNC coronation (just as the DNC made pretense of primaries, with both, worst candidates in their fields). So, how can honest Democrats let a qua-Confederate, like Aschroft, near the Constitution, to "throw" what's left at folks - did we have an honest fillibuster of this guy? The key to the reputed (as I write, not having seen the results) rolling-over of the Dems - if they didn't even ask about his reasons for merely being interviewed by Southern Partisan - may be, Ashcroft has a "100% rating" in the infotech industry (according to The Industry Standard); that's why WAND loves him, so. So, it seems that WAND had decided, a neoconfederate States' Rights'd be the most effective way, "game-theoretically," to allegedly replace their old doctrines of geopolitik [7] with an explicit psychodemographics, portrayed by de Chardin as "noopolitik" - no less than an anglo-american "hegemon" of the same. The term derives, as is unsaid, from Vernadsky's notion of the noosphere - almost a republican one. "Just Say, DUH!" or, How I Learned to Stop Worrying (Period) Well, if you really want to know the origins of WAND, pre-WW2, contact the LaRouchiacs; we dealt with them in the days of their controversial predecessor to LA's Charter Reform, "Big MAC" in NYC in the '70s (New York WAND became a hard core of the City government; a contemporary book, Busting the Big Apple, does not even mention them [8] - howso easy to see, in hindsight). "Tranquilizing Effect" is an article in the WAND Weview of Fall, which metaphorizes the use of psychoactives for the treatment of violet teenagers, as well as dyscussing the implimentation of gun-control in a pediatrical setting. There's also a mild, technocratic fix for a raging "California" e-crisis - which has a Hell of a lot more to do with the nominally Texan companies that now control 2/5 of our generating capacity. The coup de grace, though, is the feature, "Transcendental Destination," in which we find an explicit denunciation of the complete "unaccountability" of non-governmental orgs; after, are laud the jacobin acts of three of them! Of course, WAND is itself a quango (quasi-NGO) with its vast contracts (as shall be clear, henceforth .-) (This is wherein the noospherical stuff is propounded, as a segue into their pet Charter Reform of Neighborhood Councils [9], sans mention, they were the primary consultants to both of the elected & appointed Commissions - or that it was implimented in L.A.) At a recent meeting of a formative Council, only two of us knew of WAND's role in it. At another, I mistakenly suggested that the Councils may be akin to a specialty that they had in Vietnam, when it is enough to caution on a dange of "balkanization;" Greater L.A. is comparable in size & climate to "Greater Serbia," as well! ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 4 Feb 2001 08:52:13 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Subject: Re: quick erectionable shelter Comments: To: DomeHome-H@h19.hoflin.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Ahmad, See: Emergency Shelter Parachute Dome: http://www.cruzio.com/~joemoore/Ideas/IcosDomeParachute.htm and "Emergency" http://www.cruzio.com/~joemoore/Index/Domes-E.htm Joe S Moore: joemoore@cruzio.com Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute: http://www.cruzio.com/~joemoore/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "The DomeHome List" To: Sent: Monday, January 29, 2001 9:06 AM Subject: quick erectionable shelter > From: AHMAD FARHADPOUR > Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2001 23:08:50 -0800 (PST) > > hi friends > > as i wrote in last email i am researching on emergency > shelter systems for rescue operation after natural > disasters, so i need to prefabricated shelter systems > that can be erected less than one hour or even lesser. > if everyone know anything please inform me. > sinserely > > ===== > Yours sincerely > Ahmad FARHADPOUR ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 5 Feb 2001 09:38:23 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: global MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii I resently found out two trends that are a surprise to me, in a way. First, many, many young people use the word globalization as equated with oppression and multinational greed. Second, the same kids(not all are kids, of course) have adopted the words dirty and clean to refer to imports, such as clothes, to indicate the work-place coditions and pay of those involved in the manufacture of things. Comments? Dick ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 5 Feb 2001 12:56:55 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: 'Bill' 'Eagleton' Subject: Re: global Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > Second, the same kids(not all are > kids, of course) have adopted the words dirty and > clean to refer to imports, such as clothes, to > indicate the work-place coditions and pay of those > involved in the manufacture of things. > Comments? > Dick *I am reminded of the tensial stretchers we used to put in pants when hanging them to dry, rather than dry them in a dryer and then use more energy to iron them. :>) BillSF9c __________________________________________________________________ Get your own FREE, personal Netscape Webmail account today at http://webmail.netscape.com/ ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 5 Feb 2001 10:54:30 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Re: great circles ? In-Reply-To: <200102031436.f13EaW306184@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii --- Brian Hutchings wrote: > <> Brian ¿Quincy! Hutchings > 03-FEB-2001 6:36 > r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us > > V+F-1=E+1, and > E+1=E+1, and > 2(E+1)/2 = E+1, but > does it follow that > the number of paired elements (V+F+E) is equivalent > to the number of edges plus one? > > thus quoth: > i am also in agreement with alan....for waterman > ploys... > > edges + 1 = great circles. Since I can spin any system around any imaginable axis, thus creating a great circle in any orientation to any feature of the system, why are we interested in great circles only created by spinning a system around an axis through the vertexes, or centers of edges and faces. Dick ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 5 Feb 2001 11:43:38 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: hing cheung li MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII computer info ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 5 Feb 2001 09:43:45 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Re: [Q-P] 13 Days a review <> Brian ¿Quincy! Hutchings 05-FEB-2001 9:43 r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us ah, guess there was nothing in young Kruschov's book about Lord Bertie; eh? thus quoth: succeed in seeing through to the end. I am convinced that if history had allowed them another six years, they would have brought the cold war to a close before the end of the 1960's. I say this with good reason, because in 1963 my father made an official announcement to a session of the U.S.S.R. Defense Council that he intended to sharply reduce --The End Was Nigh! http://www.tarpley.net/bush23/htm ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 5 Feb 2001 09:52:36 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Re: great circles ? <> Brian ¿Quincy! Hutchings 05-FEB-2001 9:52 r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us there are *no* other elements of a polyhedron. I had confused the notion of "assigning" (n:=n+1 e.g) with an algebraic simplification; that is, I was worried that Michelson had done so. indeed, one can make this simplification from 3 variables to 1, the number of edges, which highlights the essence of superfucial duality: the number of edges remains after dualization (as with inversion in a sphere). that also highlights the idea of Gene (X?) to refer to the shapes by their edges, "n-sys" as he did it, and shows that the dodecahedral projection is "the same" as the icosahedral, and so on. is this only possible with "centrally symmetrical" shapes (not AFAICT from Euler's formula, but just try to do it with a tetragon-based pyramid) ?? thus quoth: > V+F-1=E+1, and > E+1=E+1, and > 2(E+1)/2 = E+1, but > does it follow that > the number of paired elements (V+F+E) is equivalent > to the number of edges plus one? > > thus quoth: > i am also in agreement with alan....for waterman > ploys... > > edges + 1 = great circles. Since I can spin any system around any imaginable axis, thus creating a great circle in any orientation to any feature of the system, why are we interested in great circles only created by spinning a system around an axis through the vertexes, or centers of edges and faces. >--The End Was Nigh! >http://www.tarpley.net/bush23/htm ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 5 Feb 2001 09:58:23 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: =quaker-p@earlham.edu <> Brian ¿Quincy! Hutchings 05-FEB-2001 9:58 r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us note that the Sun_Times is one of the larger of the 379 papers of the Hollinger Corp., whose board includes Dame Maggie, Sir Henry and Zbiggy Brzezinski; why is that? I think, it's the largest in the USA, of the 100s. thus quoth: No, the "blow-up" was not triggered by the press conference. The "blow-up," if that's what it was, followed a step taken by the Labor government. Sharon's visit took place on Thursday. The next day, Friday, Muslim Palestinians went as usual to pray at the El-Aqsa Mosque (where Sharon had been the previous day). For reasons best known to him, and with consequences that were entirely predictable, Barak sent a large military and police contingent into Arab East Jerusalem on that Friday, and when the worshippers came out of the mosque after their prayers to see this vast military and police presence, that's when the "blow-up" occurred. Here is part of an article by Graham Usher that gives what I think is an accurate rendition: >>--The End Was Nigh! >>http://www.tarpley.net/bush23/htm ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 6 Feb 2001 09:29:03 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Re: great circles ? In-Reply-To: <200102051752.f15Hqa714115@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii In other word, I can use the axis that goes through the center of a face, but I can also use an axis not through the center of a face. Aren't there infinite axes of spin? > there are *no* other elements of a polyhedron. > Since I can spin any system around any imaginable > axis, thus creating a great circle in any > orientation > to any feature of the system, why are we > interested in > great circles only created by spinning a system > around > an axis through the vertexes, or centers of edges > and > faces. > > >--The End Was Nigh! > >http://www.tarpley.net/bush23/htm ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 6 Feb 2001 09:30:36 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii What kind? --- hing cheung li wrote: > computer info ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 6 Feb 2001 09:35:12 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Re: global In-Reply-To: <4B35A6DB.52E2AA60.0000F1CA@netscape.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii I suppose this is fear and opposition of the same type as the unknowing anti-technologist. Or the anti-desoverizationists. --- 'Bill' 'Eagleton' wrote: > > Second, the same kids(not all are > > kids, of course) have adopted the words dirty and > > clean to refer to imports, such as clothes, to > > indicate the work-place coditions and pay of those > > involved in the manufacture of things. > > > Comments? > > Dick > > *I am reminded of the tensial stretchers we used to > put in pants when hanging them to dry, rather than > dry them in a dryer and then use more energy to iron > them. :>) > BillSF9c > __________________________________________________________________ > Get your own FREE, personal Netscape Webmail account > today at http://webmail.netscape.com/ ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 6 Feb 2001 10:32:46 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Kirby Urner Subject: Re: great circles ? In-Reply-To: <20010206172903.5114.qmail@web4401.mail.yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 09:29 AM 02/06/2001 -0800, Dick Fischbeck wrote: >In other word, I can use the axis that goes through >the center of a face, but I can also use an axis not >through the center of a face. Aren't there infinite >axes of spin? I suppose you will want to limit yourself to rods through the center of volume? Maybe not. In any case, yes. On the other hand, limiting yourself to a specific set of spin axes related to the poly's features gets you a "signature set" of great circles. These have intrinsic interest and relate to the symmetry properties of the driving poly. Kirby ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 6 Feb 2001 10:35:37 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Kirby Urner Subject: Recent essay re Bucky and math education Comments: cc: synergeo@egroups.com In-Reply-To: <20010206173036.23984.qmail@web4405.mail.yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" FYI: http://www.mathforum.com/epigone/math-learn/pehrornal -- I plan to make it a web page someday, with pictures. In the meantime, this is a good overview of where I'm at with my curriculum writing these days. Kirby 4D Solutions ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 6 Feb 2001 11:40:15 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Re: great circles ? In-Reply-To: <3.0.3.32.20010206103246.00adc260@pop3.norton.antivirus> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Very clear. Thanks. --- Kirby Urner wrote: > At 09:29 AM 02/06/2001 -0800, Dick Fischbeck wrote: > >In other word, I can use the axis that goes through > >the center of a face, but I can also use an axis > not > >through the center of a face. Aren't there infinite > >axes of spin? > > I suppose you will want to limit yourself to rods > through the center of volume? Maybe not. > > In any case, yes. On the other hand, limiting > yourself to a specific set of spin axes related > to the poly's features gets you a "signature set" > of great circles. These have intrinsic interest > and relate to the symmetry properties of the > driving poly. > > Kirby ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 6 Feb 2001 12:17:14 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Kirby Urner Subject: Education Automation (revamped) Comments: cc: synergeo@egroups.com In-Reply-To: <3.0.3.32.20010206103537.007a2740@pop3.norton.antivirus> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Drawing from existing threads in the culture, we create a model academy into which the public at large gains access via made-for-TV shows and webcams. Here, looking over the shoulder of our peers, we see finally start getting those long-awaited synergetics cartoons: http://www.mathforum.com/epigone/math-teach/yumquoxka http://www.mathforum.com/epigone/math-teach/pendskouspun Survivor II & Big Brother meets Star Trek and the Federation Academy. Bucky instead of Barney (a background giant). As per my usual theme: doing anything design science has to happen in front of the cameras, where an audience meets sponsors. It's the Project Renaissance model, where Hollywood meets up with real world logistics (in which the military has experience) to undertake positive, high drama scenarios, like ending hunger (got superplot, inside of which any number of subplots have meaning -- kinda like ER). Project Renaissance: http://www.teleport.com/~pdx4d/pr.html Kirby 4D Solutions ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 6 Feb 2001 16:23:24 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: "Brent A. Verrill" Subject: Re: Education Automation (revamped) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Kirby, I scanned your webpage. Intriguing idea. It brings to my mind the Learning Channel show 'Junkyard Wars', except taking place in an Industrial Design office, or other product development scenario. Obtaining corporate sponsorship seems unlikely, due to intellectual property issues. Government or UN sponsorship is more likely, though difficult. US government sponsorship is exceedingly unlikely considering the new administration. Has the UN provided any sponsorship for broadcast media in the past? I'm sure they have produced videos for specific purposes, propaganda, etc. But for general broadcast? Just a few thoughts... Brent At 12:17 PM 2/6/2001 -0800, you wrote: >Drawing from existing threads in the culture, we create a >model academy into which the public at large gains access >via made-for-TV shows and webcams. Here, looking over the >shoulder of our peers, we see finally start getting those >long-awaited synergetics cartoons: > >http://www.mathforum.com/epigone/math-teach/yumquoxka >http://www.mathforum.com/epigone/math-teach/pendskouspun > >Survivor II & Big Brother meets Star Trek and the Federation >Academy. Bucky instead of Barney (a background giant). > >As per my usual theme: doing anything design science has >to happen in front of the cameras, where an audience meets >sponsors. It's the Project Renaissance model, where >Hollywood meets up with real world logistics (in which >the military has experience) to undertake positive, high >drama scenarios, like ending hunger (got superplot, inside >of which any number of subplots have meaning -- kinda like >ER). > >Project Renaissance: >http://www.teleport.com/~pdx4d/pr.html > >Kirby >4D Solutions > ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 6 Feb 2001 13:31:10 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Mark Siegmund Subject: Re: Education Automation (revamped) In-Reply-To: <3.0.32.20010206162323.00f49140@pop.prism.gatech.edu> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Brent, the United Nations through its United Nations University for Peace (Universidad para La Paz), headquartered in Costa Rica--operates a (global) shortwave radio station RFPI (Radio for Peace International)--which broadcasts from the campus in Costa Rica. They regularly feature programs related to the subject of education and have even offered (and I believe they still do) distance learning courses. Mark > From: "Brent A. Verrill" > Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works > > Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic > Date: Tue, 6 Feb 2001 16:23:24 -0500 > To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.ACSU.BUFFALO.EDU > Subject: Re: Education Automation (revamped) > > Kirby, > > I scanned your webpage. Intriguing idea. It brings to my > mind the Learning Channel show 'Junkyard Wars', except > taking place in an Industrial Design office, or other product > development scenario. > > Obtaining corporate sponsorship seems unlikely, due to > intellectual property issues. Government or UN sponsorship > is more likely, though difficult. US government sponsorship > is exceedingly unlikely considering the new administration. > Has the UN provided any sponsorship for broadcast media in the > past? I'm sure they have produced videos for specific purposes, > propaganda, etc. But for general broadcast? > > Just a few thoughts... > > Brent > > At 12:17 PM 2/6/2001 -0800, you wrote: >> Drawing from existing threads in the culture, we create a >> model academy into which the public at large gains access >> via made-for-TV shows and webcams. Here, looking over the >> shoulder of our peers, we see finally start getting those >> long-awaited synergetics cartoons: >> >> http://www.mathforum.com/epigone/math-teach/yumquoxka >> http://www.mathforum.com/epigone/math-teach/pendskouspun >> >> Survivor II & Big Brother meets Star Trek and the Federation >> Academy. Bucky instead of Barney (a background giant). >> >> As per my usual theme: doing anything design science has >> to happen in front of the cameras, where an audience meets >> sponsors. It's the Project Renaissance model, where >> Hollywood meets up with real world logistics (in which >> the military has experience) to undertake positive, high >> drama scenarios, like ending hunger (got superplot, inside >> of which any number of subplots have meaning -- kinda like >> ER). >> >> Project Renaissance: >> http://www.teleport.com/~pdx4d/pr.html >> >> Kirby >> 4D Solutions >> > ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 6 Feb 2001 07:06:23 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Re: Education Automation (revamped) <> Brian ¿Quincy! Hutchings 06-FEB-2001 7:06 r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us this syetem is already in place in most states, California e.g., known as Chartered Schools. they often call themselves, Academies, many are run by private concerns (there's an Edison Academy for Language Something, that seems to have been set-up in part to escape from the mandate to dump bilingual ed, here, in California (school's in SM)); they have a wide-open deal to impliment their charters, but, of course, they have to accept the local kids (and your kid can come from anywhere in LAUSD -- yeeha, and pass the money to Laidlaw/Greyhound (thanks, Mayor Trickier Dick !-)) as for homeschooling, I consider that to be "private" in the most tell-tale sense! whatever thous doest, you may be almost to get away with anything, now, so long as you put a Cross o'er yo'True School o'Satan! as for Star Trek's Confederate Acadamies, the movie with that iconized Newton, Einstein and Hawking should be more than enough to warn anyone of the curriculum -- though it seems not to be. it's surely mainline Hollywood, though, per "The Birth of a Nation!" thus quoth: (a) the public system should do more to compete with itself, i.e. we could set up taxpayer-funded academies that are highly selective, but not necessarily military-minded, i.e. not modeled after West Point specifically. This would give a federally-minded bunch an opportunity to showcase some new standards without the mandate "all comers will be accepted". I guess I'm thinking of NASA space camps and the like, but these facilities would be in operation during school hours and attendence at one of them would be in lieu of attendence at a regular public school. Admission would be selective. The values taught would be commensurate with the needs of federal agencies, i.e. training in how to govern/manage in a pluralistic, multi-ethnic society, independently of religious orders or hierarchies (or organized crime) would be encouraged. --The End Was Nigh! http;//www.tarpley.net/bush23.htm ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 6 Feb 2001 07:11:09 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Re: [Q-P] help with the Temple Mt issue <> Brian ¿Quincy! Hutchings 06-FEB-2001 7:11 r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us apart from the fact of the jungle fowl (evolution?), isn't this a chicken-egg problem? the Zionists (British and other wise) have not allowed the constitution of a republic (like the Brits, theselves); so, what is the question? thus quoth: goes, and what Will says is true also. But we have to ask: who helped make Arafat the _de_facto_ king of the Palestinians by anointing him and refusing to talk to other (more democratically inclined) --The End Was Nigh! >http;//www.tarpley.net/bush23.htm ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 6 Feb 2001 14:05:39 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Kirby Urner Subject: Re: Education Automation (revamped) In-Reply-To: <3.0.32.20010206162323.00f49140@pop.prism.gatech.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >Obtaining corporate sponsorship seems unlikely, due to >intellectual property issues. Not sure I see this. For example, we want to showcase a math center that looks a lot like mission control. Kids each have a workstation, plus there's a big screen up front. They're learning some hybrid discipline -- a cross between math, computer programming, and multimedia design. Looks interesting -- wish we had this closer to home. Why wouldn't Hewlett-Packard want us to see its logo on some of this equipment? We see high tech gear in the movies all the time, and corporations reportedly pony up big time to get some recognition for their brands in these scenarios (it's called product placement). Kirby ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 6 Feb 2001 22:17:12 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: 'Bill' 'Eagleton' Subject: Re: [Q-P] help with the Temple Mt issue Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" > isn't this a chicken-egg problem? Well, :>) It took me, on and off, a number of decades... But that question ended up having a very simple answer! It met all scienticfic criteria... and there IS an answer. But the excercise was the gain, so I'll not spoil it for you. BillSF9c __________________________________________________________________ Get your own FREE, personal Netscape Webmail account today at http://webmail.netscape.com/ ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 6 Feb 2001 23:39:00 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: "Brent A. Verrill" Subject: Re: Education Automation (revamped) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 02:05 PM 2/6/2001 -0800, you wrote: >>Obtaining corporate sponsorship seems unlikely, due to >>intellectual property issues. > >Not sure I see this. For example, we want to showcase a >math center that looks a lot like mission control. Kids >each have a workstation, plus there's a big screen up front. >They're learning some hybrid discipline -- a cross between >math, computer programming, and multimedia design. Looks >interesting -- wish we had this closer to home. > >Why wouldn't Hewlett-Packard want us to see its logo on >some of this equipment? We see high tech gear in the movies >all the time, and corporations reportedly pony up big time >to get some recognition for their brands in these scenarios >(it's called product placement). > >Kirby Of course, this type of product placement is a no-brainer. Perhaps I misunderstood the thrust of the project. If the program were showing a development team designing the next generation of super efficient refrigerator, It would seem unlikely that GE or Frigidaire (same company?, I can't keep up...) would want to sponsor the project and show how inefficient their products are or how overpriced. If the goal were to then market the design to millions of adoring fans at the conclusion of the show, (presumably to the bettement of humankind) well then, oops, Amana just released the product before GE could put it in production. Besides, how many people are duplicating the design in their basements as the episodes unfold. Not a whole lot of incentive to support the project. Some of these issues could be worked around, I suppose, but I suspect not enough to make most coporations confortable with sponsorship if all their secrets are being broadcast world-round. If you are strictly speaking of the beta testing phase, rather than the product development phase, then this has more promise. When I skimmed your webpage, my mind immediatley went to 'Junkyard Wars.' Where two teams are given a problem to solve and a junkyard full of hardware with which to solve it. Strictly a product development phase scenario. (pause to read Kirby's webpage thoroughly http://www.teleport.com/~pdx4d/pr.html ) It seems that you are proposing to use corporate sponsorship in the beta testing realm, at least mostly. My head is very much into the product development scenario right now. I'm studying industrial design. While I find the process fascinating and think it would make wonderful television, I can see how the testing and implementation phase would make good television for those who find the design phase boring (probably most folks). Brent PS - Although, 'Junkyard Wars' manages to make it interesting, if not entertaining. I also recall a Nighline segment with Robert Krulwich(sp?) challenging IDEO, and industrial design consulting firm, to design a better shopping cart in 48 hours. ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 6 Feb 2001 22:58:42 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: hing cheung li MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII about internet.thank you so much! ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 7 Feb 2001 00:51:43 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Kirby Urner Subject: Re: Education Automation (revamped) In-Reply-To: <3.0.32.20010206233859.00ff9d80@pop.prism.gatech.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >(pause to read Kirby's webpage thoroughly >http://www.teleport.com/~pdx4d/pr.html ) > >It seems that you are proposing to use corporate sponsorship in the beta >testing realm, at least mostly. Yeah, that's a fairly accurate description. Right now, the military guinea pigs a lot of what comes from corporate R&D. I'm looking to expand the model to include more civilians. Product development is more like storyboarding and you're right, it's more likely to be cloaked in secrecy, is a more private affair. These stages of development are mappable to the BE DO HAVE projects completion cycle: http://www.teleport.com/~pdx4d/gst1.html Kirby ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 7 Feb 2001 08:34:07 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: "Brent A. Verrill" Subject: Re: Education Automation (revamped) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 12:51 AM 2/7/2001 -0800, you wrote: >These stages of development are >mappable to the BE DO HAVE projects completion cycle: >http://www.teleport.com/~pdx4d/gst1.html > >Kirby In ID (industrial design), most would refer to your BE DO HAVE cycle as: research phase, design phase (which usually includes prototyping and testing), and implementation or marketing phase. The key is iteration. Large and complex projects may cycle through all three phases more than once. Smaller projects might work through research phase and design phase once or twice before implementation. By the way, does BE DO HAVE come from Bucky, or is that your own metaphor? Brent ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 7 Feb 2001 07:50:26 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Re: net In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Hey Hing- Feel free to ask away. There are lots of bright folks here more than happy to discuss Fuller related problems and ideas. Go for it. Your question may have results unimagined, you never know. Put in subject line, too. It helps somewhat. Dick --- hing cheung li wrote: > about internet.thank you so much ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 7 Feb 2001 08:22:48 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Kirby Urner Subject: Re: Education Automation (revamped) In-Reply-To: <3.0.32.20010207083406.00da8db8@pop.prism.gatech.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >By the way, does BE DO HAVE come from Bucky, or is that your own metaphor? > >Brent Grabbed it from est as I recall, though seem to recall something similar at Epcot (Disney). Kirby ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 7 Feb 2001 11:17:21 -0600 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Tony Kalenak Subject: Bucky Sighting MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" A day or so ago, I was watching a PBS show called "Streamliners". It is about the streamline era of trains in the US during the 1930'S & 40'S. They went off on a short tangent about the other cultural manifestations of streamlining during this time. That's when the showed clips of the Dymaxion car. No mention of Bucky though. It is an interesting show for those interested in such things. -Tony. ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 7 Feb 2001 10:22:16 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Re: Education Automation (revamped) In-Reply-To: <200102061506.f16F6NA19248@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii This quote comes from last night's 60 Minutes II, about the inventor Dean Kanen. He recently finished a wheel chair that can climbs stairs, raise outward on two small rear wheel so the operator is balancing (with 6 gyroscopes) at eye level to a standing adult, and more. He also has this school-age kid program called FIRST which is descibed a little below. It is a nice synergy between school and the corperate world. "And what's really important to Kamen? He thinks history will remember him, less for IT, or Ginger, or the Ibot than for First, which stands for For Inspiration and Recognition of Science and Technology. First is Kamen's mission to change how American kids think about engineers and inventors. "They need to be educated so that they won't be brainwashed. They need to have an opportunity to be able to see and learn things so that they can separate that which is important from that which isn't. That which will help them in later life, and that which won't," he says. To further its goal, First sponsors an international robot competition. More than 500 teams of high school kids from 44 states and several foreign countries build robots and then compete. Of course these days kids pay a little bit of attention to science, but a lot more attention to the Super Bowl. "Kids have this perception of the world, the great American lie, about what's really important to us," he says." Also, I worked teaching last year at Edison Schools,Inc. in Minneapolis. Edison is the larges for-profit school administation company in the country. They add two hours to the school day and sent home a computer with every kid 3rd grade and above. They charge the school district they have a contract with the same price per student the district is paying at all of its other schools. The CEO started Channel One ten or fifteen years ago, an educational channel with commercials. The COO is the former president from Yale. They target inner city, low performance schools. The jury is still way out. Dick > this syetem is already in place in most states, > California e.g., > known as Chartered Schools. they often call > themselves, Academies, > many are run by private concerns (there's an Edison > Academy > for Language Something, that seems to have been > set-up > in part to escape from the mandate to dump > bilingual ed, here, > in California (school's in SM)); > they have a wide-open deal to impliment their > charters, but, > of course, they have to accept the local kids (and > your kid can come from anywhere in LAUSD -- yeeha, > and > pass the money to Laidlaw/Greyhound (thanks, Mayor > Trickier Dick !-)) > > as for homeschooling, I consider that to be > "private" > in the most tell-tale sense! > whatever thous doest, > you may be almost to get away with anything, now, > so long > as you put a Cross o'er yo'True School o'Satan! > > as for Star Trek's Confederate Acadamies, > the movie with that iconized Newton, Einstein and > Hawking should > be more than enough to warn anyone of the > curriculum -- > though it seems not to be. it's surely mainline > Hollywood, > though, per "The Birth of a Nation!" > ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 7 Feb 2001 18:40:00 -0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Paul Taylor Subject: Design Architecture News MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello, I wonder if listers are aware of Design Architecture News? They have a daily email news service that often comes up with items of interest to Fullerians. Three recent examples are the following: -> Solar Energy to Be Widely Used in Buildings- People's Daily (China) http://english.peopledaily.com.cn/200102/02/eng20010202_61464.html -> Green Homes: The eco-friendly homebuilding movement enters adolescence. (American Demographics)- AECdirect http://www.americandemographics.com/publications/ad/01_ad/0101_ad/ad010101.h tm -> U.S. Ranked 11th In Environmental Sustainability: Finland, Norway, and Canada are the top countries in achieving environmental sustainability.- PLANetizen http://www.planetizen.com/news/item.php?id=2193 Best wishes, Paul Taylor. ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 7 Feb 2001 12:13:54 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Mark Siegmund Subject: Re: Design Architecture News In-Reply-To: <018c01c09137$1dfe2e80$5dabfea9@bpo> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Paul, thanks, I just signed up. Mark > From: Paul Taylor > Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works > > Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic > Date: Wed, 7 Feb 2001 18:40:00 -0000 > To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.ACSU.BUFFALO.EDU > Subject: Design Architecture News > > Hello, > > I wonder if listers are aware of Design Architecture News? > > > They have a daily email news service that often comes up with items of > interest to Fullerians. Three recent examples are the following: > > -> Solar Energy to Be Widely Used in Buildings- People's Daily (China) > http://english.peopledaily.com.cn/200102/02/eng20010202_61464.html > > -> Green Homes: The eco-friendly homebuilding movement enters adolescence. > (American Demographics)- AECdirect > http://www.americandemographics.com/publications/ad/01_ad/0101_ad/ad010101.h > tm > > -> U.S. Ranked 11th In Environmental Sustainability: Finland, Norway, and > Canada are the top countries in achieving environmental sustainability.- > PLANetizen > http://www.planetizen.com/news/item.php?id=2193 > > > Best wishes, > > Paul Taylor. > ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 7 Feb 2001 06:49:36 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Re: Education Automation (revamped) <> Brian ¿Quincy! Hutchings 07-FEB-2001 6:49 r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us a gas-log cross might offer a new angle for a church *or* a school; might be considered declasse' in the poorer 'hoods, at this time of "energy crisis" !! --The Duke of Oil! http://www.tarpley.net/bushb.htm ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 7 Feb 2001 13:56:33 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Re: Design Architecture News <> Brian ¿Quincy! Hutchings 07-FEB-2001 13:56 r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us well, that's not very surprizing, if climes nearer the pole are pressed-upon to insulate (or use passive annual heat storage in some form .-) thus quoth: -> U.S. Ranked 11th In Environmental Sustainability: Finland, Norway, and Canada are the top countries in achieving environmental sustainability.- PLANetizen http://www.planetizen.com/news/item.php?id=2193 > --The Duke of Oil! > http://www.tarpley.net/bushb.htm ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 8 Feb 2001 11:27:01 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dexter Graphic Subject: Company Questionnaire (for Perspective Employers or Clients) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit I am developing this set of questions to be asked of any perspective employer or consulting client. Do you think I have left anything out? Do you have any suggestions, corrections, or other feedback you would like to offer? Company Questionnaire 1. How does your company as a whole and your department in specific serve the needs of humanity? 2. Are you open and honest in all your business dealings, decision-making, accounting practices, record keeping, and advertising? 3. Do you respect and honor the intellectual, spiritual, and personal integrity of every individual whether they are your customer, supplier, or employee? 4. Does everyone contributing to your company’s success share equally in the company’s profits? 5. How does your company care for and protect the planet’s natural environment? 6. How much energy does your company consume (measured in solar eMergy units [1]) and how much of it comes from renewable resources like solar, wind, or water power? ([1] See eMergy Evaluation at http://www.dieoff.com/page170.htm for details.) 7. To what extent are you guided by that Grand Universal Integrity often referred to as God? Dexter Graphic ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 8 Feb 2001 14:09:06 -0600 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Tony Kalenak Subject: Re: Company Questionnaire (for Perspective Employers or Clients) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Dexter, Those are stringent standards. No one I have ever worked for could answer all of these positively. In fact, I doubt few people would be employed if they didn't let at least some of these slide. I think they are good guiding principles for the conduct of our personal lives, as well as the search for employment. They would also be great guiding principals for those of us working in "less-than-perfect" jobs, when we make decisions and help to chart the future directions of our companies. I don't have any additions for you questionnaire, but you have started me thinking. -Tony. -----Original Message----- From: Dexter Graphic [SMTP:dextergraphic@PRODIGY.NET] Sent: Thursday, February 08, 2001 1:27 PM To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.ACSU.BUFFALO.EDU Subject: Company Questionnaire (for Perspective Employers or Clients) I am developing this set of questions to be asked of any perspective employer or consulting client. Do you think I have left anything out? Do you have any suggestions, corrections, or other feedback you would like to offer? Company Questionnaire 1. How does your company as a whole and your department in specific serve the needs of humanity? 2. Are you open and honest in all your business dealings, decision-making, accounting practices, record keeping, and advertising? 3. Do you respect and honor the intellectual, spiritual, and personal integrity of every individual whether they are your customer, supplier, or employee? 4. Does everyone contributing to your company's success share equally in the company's profits? 5. How does your company care for and protect the planet's natural environment? 6. How much energy does your company consume (measured in solar eMergy units [1]) and how much of it comes from renewable resources like solar, wind, or water power? ([1] See eMergy Evaluation at http://www.dieoff.com/page170.htm for details.) 7. To what extent are you guided by that Grand Universal Integrity often referred to as God? Dexter Graphic ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 8 Feb 2001 06:33:44 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Re: [Q-P] faith-based programs <> Brian ¿Quincy! Hutchings 08-FEB-2001 6:33 r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us would like to make a gentleman's bet, that Scientololgy got their status, firstly in England?... if only because the St. Hill Organization/Manor is on Hill Street (thus, being Holy British Soil, and suitable for any relic o'the Pantheon o'th'Empire .-) it's all so Pythonesque! thus quoth: That's not an answer to your question, of course; just a note to say that the state has, in the past, found some sort of basis for distinguishing between claims made by self-proclaimed "religious" and/or non-profit groups. --The Thronburgh Doctrine! http://www.tarpley.net/bush24.htm ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 8 Feb 2001 06:49:02 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Re: great circles ? <> Brian ¿Quincy! Hutchings 08-FEB-2001 6:49 r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us Essay, "Education Intimation;" first, a word on Michelsonics. Alan Michelson found a novel, algebraic restatement of the symmetrical form of the basic shapes (itself known a long time). Although it does not inventory the elements of these shapes, it provides for them as paired poles of spinning, producing the Great Circles, thus illustrating the group of rotational symmetries - just in terms of the edges! As many of us learned from Buckminster Fuller, Euler's formula is (as restated by Bucky), Vertices + Facets = Edges + (inside & outside [2]). Michelson found that the number of elements is, V+F+E = (V+F-1) + (E+1) = 2(E+1) [or 2(V+F-1)]; since the poles are paired, the number of GCs produced, will be E+1. [My derivation's not checked .-] By definition, these shapes are "centrally symmetrical," meaning that any line through the center will be "cut" to the shape's surface, in half (by the center). So, that includes all of the archimedeans and their duals (the catalan solids). The tetrahedron is not so, but it may be the "exception that creates a rule." Is't? Thus, the number of edges is invariant to the dualization, along with the number of GCs (or the sum of vertices and facets). Some while ago, I had delighted in calling a book, "The Tetrahedron and How to Ab/use It," which had been published in '37 ((?) Okla.U.Press). Only a couple of years later, I searched for it, again, in Books in Print, only to find that a clothbound re-issue (by Chelsea Publ., which'd done the '64 re-issue) had sold-out interim! Hm. (I never did learn the number of copies, printed, or if there were later pressings. I had also suggested, doing an update that might encompass some o'great Bucky-stuff .-) In between Bucky's elucidation of Euler, and Michelson's reduction of it to terms of rotations: Gene Fowler (had just recalled his surname) had a fuzzy idea for naming the shapes after their edge-numbers - fuzzy, as far as I recall from his website; later, I found that, because Bucky had all-but ignored the non-trigon-faceted shapes - very correctly, since the duals are "grouptheoretically the same" in all essentials - he didn't deal with the dualities between the archimedean and catalan (including the platonic (regular)) shapes. This also topologivally relates to the Snyder-Fuller Law (although it's been a while since I saw it on Cosmography); do the duals have this relation, reciprocally? The S-F Law appears to be related to the study of curvature (k=1/radius). All of this is "very well known" in most respects, just as Michelson's formulation is "trivial," as they say. Well, shut They "up!" I'm just kidding about calling the whole set of shapes, The Michelsonics, though - for now! Now, for the essay. But first, let me ask that you ask Yusef, to fill-out the survey at the end, thus: If you grok anything at all, please put "ha, ha, ha" in the field at the end of the humorous essay (not that it will acutally be funny, but I'm not paid for the laughs , you - hocky-puck). If not, you may elect to respondeth not, Dude/tte. Warning: this is not an "IQ Test." However, if you wish to receive a score, you can hit the button at the end of the release, "I am Man (Woman) enough to look at my Vocational Quotient, to within Orders of Magnitude (or Significant Digits, as the case could be; one has to start, some where)." It's logarithmic (base ten); all treaties as to online privacy will be kept, but be prepared to be "escorted" to Booty Camp in the Submersible Dymaxion Bathroom, when you sign - start packing that toothbrush - your 10y Apprenticeship will be over in No Time! --Sincerely, The Ekisticsfuhrer, London (You May Call Us, Betty Two) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- COSMOSOPHY: Bucky Fuller's Filed Ride! (Copyr.'1 by Brian Quincy Hutchings) Or, How We Learned to Stop Worrying about ANYTHING: The Reformation of Education by President Son o'Sir, with the Help of Son o'Sir FCC Chairman - the Abolition of Classical Education, Having Used "Up" Euclid" and Made LaRouche Teach K-1 til He Keeled; and Kicked the Ancient Bad-boy Greeks into Hyperbolic Orbit (They Wouldn't All Drink from the Cup, Alas); Free at Last from the Dead End of History - the Big Anticipatory Design Science Cruncharooni! ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 9 Feb 2001 01:26:21 -0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Paul Taylor Subject: Re: [Q-P] faith-based programs MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ----- Original Message ----- From: Brian Hutchings > would like to make a gentleman's bet, > that Scientololgy got their status, firstly > in England?... if only because > the St. Hill Organization/Manor is on Hill Street > (thus, being Holy British Soil, and > suitable for any relic o'the Pantheon > o'th'Empire .-) > > it's all so Pythonesque! Although there's no shortage of gullible people here in England, there's no evidence that we gave Dimanetics any special status. I think the credit is largely yours. Pythonesque it ain't. Paul Taylor. ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 9 Feb 2001 01:28:50 -0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Paul Taylor Subject: Re: Company Questionnaire (for Perspective Employers or Clients) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ----- Original Message ----- From: Dexter Graphic > I am developing this set of questions to be asked of any > perspective employer or consulting client. Do you think > I have left anything out? Do you have any suggestions, > corrections, or other feedback you would like to offer? 8. Do you believe in the tooth fairy? In other words, a bit more realism would be in order. Paul Taylor. ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 8 Feb 2001 14:09:55 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Re: [Q-P] faith-based programs <> Brian ¿Quincy! Hutchings 08-FEB-2001 14:09 r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us there is only one church that has special status in England; Betty Dos is the head of it! the rest are just ethnological specimens; eh? thus quoth: evidence that we gave Dimanetics any special status. I think the credit is largely yours. Pythonesque it ain't. I use the term, clinically, as well as "nakedly!" --The End Was Nigh! http://www.tarpley.net/bushb.htm ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 9 Feb 2001 08:28:20 -0800 Reply-To: urner@alumni.princeton.edu Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Kirby Urner Subject: More curriculum writing (web page) Comments: To: math-teach@forum.swarthmore.edu Comments: cc: synergeo@egroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Greetings all -- The web version of an essay I originally posted to math-learn is now available at: http://www.inetarena.com/~pdx4d/ocn/overview.html Lots of graphics, which helps, given the geometric focus (not a grammatically complete sentence, apologies). =20 This essay gets into the sphere packing and nested=20 polys approach to spatial geometry I've consistently=20 championed on this list, with a bridge to sequences, series, and algebraic concepts through figurate=20 numbers and Pascal's Triangle. You'll probably be relieved to know that Python is=20 not even mentioned (although computer programming=20 is, in the concluding paragraph). Kirby Urner Curriculum writer Oregon Curriculum Network ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 9 Feb 2001 08:47:00 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Re: [Q-P] Tax Talking points <> Brian ¿Quincy! Hutchings 09-FEB-2001 8:47 r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us I agree, given the current structure, Jim, but, historically, the Income Tax was enacted along with El Phed. thus ending the dirigist/protectionist measures (i.e. tariffs) -- doing plenty to help a plunge into WW1. in that regard, there were two pieces in today's LATimes, on the editorial page promoting a use-tax on e for the s0called California crisis (hah! [*]), along the lines of the fuel taxes imposed by Euro conuntries with the "OPEC" crisis (half of the increases were in taxes, with the increased revenues being offset by lowering or waiving other taxes, it said). the other was on pabe C8 (Business), about a new I-tax moratorium, a just-reintroduced "bipartisan" bill, because the current one runs-out in October. apparently, a bunch o'states are going to simplify their taxes. it says, it wants to "prevent imposition of multiple taxes on the same transaction and apply a permanent ban to internet access taxes" -- are they going re-unprivatize it, or are they still going to promote toll-roads on the tarmac, two? this ignores the whole idea of a tax on transactions, to limit arbitrage & such speculation; a very small tax would help greatly, especially in the light of states that are dependent upon rentier-financier transactions (Groovy Brittania e.g. .-) thus quoth: The Republicans are trying to frame this as "the government had too much money and it cannot be allowed to pile up in the Treasury". Secondly, that the economy is in dire straights and only money back to taxpayers can help. Third, only income tax payers can be helped since the surplus is from the income tax system. All false. --The End Was Nigh! http://www.tarpley.net/bush23.htm ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 9 Feb 2001 09:01:36 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Re: [Q-P] Climate change <> Brian ¿Quincy! Hutchings 09-FEB-2001 9:01 r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us this is the pruned IPCC "mainstream *overall* warming" group, who have their heads oup their dysplay units. it is wrong, to ignore the copious data from weather stations that are outside of "urban heat islands," as I can attest that they do, so!... in the early years, there were a lot of folks from Quaternary Period research, or it was still quite well-known amongst climatolgists, including modellers. bergs off of Antarctica and oscillations of Arctic seacover are quite meaningless, as to overall trends; they indicate vast alterations of weather, though, selective pictograms in USA Today of "retreating glaciers" camn also be misleading; do you not agree? thus quoth: http://www.ipcc.ch/ On January 22, the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC) issued perhaps the most comprehensive and dire report to date on global warming and climate change. Over three years in the making, the full report includes contributions from 123 lead authors and runs over 1,000 pages. The report finds that global temperatures could rise as much as 10.5 degrees over the next century and that this is primarily the result of pollution. These findings were unanimously approved by about 150 scientists and 80 members of environmental and industry groups present at the IPCC Working Group I meeting in thus quoth: SUBJECT: Re: [Q-P] Tax Talking points did you see Kuttner's proposal, which was also in today's LATimes?... he also had the $500 rebate, along with $50B for schools, $350B for Medicare, and a card for every child ($100B), and $6B for affordable housing. proposed for the Dems to propose, or "be George's lunch." --The Duke of Oil! http;//www.tarpley.net/bush8.htm MESSAGE from =schlitt@WORLD.STD.COM 09-FEB-20 8:22 My list is considerably shorter. 2. The fair way to distribute the excess is to pay every taxpayer a "dividend". This averages out to about $500 per each. File a tax return get the refund for each individual covered by the return. ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 9 Feb 2001 20:06:15 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Subject: Re: book Comments: To: bamoore@emory.edu Comments: cc: _DomeHomeList MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Dear Barb, The _Geodesic Dome Project Book_ is published by C&R Enterprises (Carol & Roger Partipilo), dome consultants in Coos Bay, OR, USA. See http://www.uci.net/~parti/domepage.htm After you have had a chance to look their material over, could you write some kind of a review that I could post on the Geodesic & DomeHome newsletters? Thanks, Joe S Moore: joemoore@cruzio.com Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute: http://www.cruzio.com/~joemoore/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Barb Moore" To: Sent: Friday, February 09, 2001 2:26 PM Subject: book > Is the Geodesic Dome Project Book still available for purchase? > Thanks, > Barb ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 9 Feb 2001 20:39:58 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Subject: BFVI Stats MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit The Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute Stats for Year 2000 Home Page Hits Only January.........1,394 February.......1,506 March............1,844 April...............1,837 May................1,932 June..............1,430 July................1,600 August..........1,600 September..1,459 October........2,257 November...2,223 December...2,191 Total...........21,273 Average/mo.......1,772.75 Average/day............58.28 For much more detailed info see: http://vwr1.hitbox.com/HitboxUI?acct=WQ590817CKNF&p=1 Joe S Moore: joemoore@cruzio.com Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute: http://www.cruzio.com/~joemoore/ ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 10 Feb 2001 07:42:13 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: zero phase MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii I know Bucky says that the tet is the simplest structure because we need 4 V's(capital V is always for vertex, never frequency) to have insideness and outsideness. However, that assumption is based on a flat face of nothingness between each 3 corners. I see it differently. I see a membrane or field of something WITH curvature as the 'skin' of the tet, even if ever so slight. No face or window or opening is ever 100 percent flat. Therefore, the volume of any tet is ever so slightly(at least) greater(or less) than one. Imagine the transformation of the tet into the spherical tet. But stop at 1 percent expansion. It is a tet with a little bulging. Or it could be the opposite, a slight inward curve with slightly less than a volume of one. Either way, no tet is ever a volume of exactly one, operationally speaking(which is all that counts). With this assumption in mind, think about a tet turning inside out, like Bucky discussed many times. Here is what I think might be happening in this transformation between a positive tet and a negative tet. One vertex disappears, than the next, then the next, then the next. We now have the zero phase tet. Then the process repeats in negative space. Check this out. Euler's Law works on this, believe it or not, I think. 4V+4F=6E+2, the tet. E stands for edge OR relationship. Subtract 1V. 3V+2F=3E+2, a 3 cornered pillow. Subtract 1V. 2V+1F=1E+2, a cigar or football. Subtract 1V. 1V+1F=0E+2, a hydrogen atom, the nucleus corresponds to the vertex, the electron cloud corresponds to the face; or a balloon with the knot in it being the single vertex. Then she disappears only to pop in to negative space(the inside out tet). Reverse process. That's it basically. I could call it the synergetic lower-archy. Dick ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 10 Feb 2001 09:10:29 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dexter Graphic Subject: What I expect from people In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit There are only three things that I look for and expect to find in people: honesty, integrity, and creativity. To me, honesty means intellectually identifying the "facts" of reality, integrity means living one's life consistent with this honest understanding of reality, and creativity means working to improve the chances of everyone living a life of honesty and integrity. Dexter Graphic ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 10 Feb 2001 09:16:24 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Mark Siegmund Subject: Re: BFVI Stats In-Reply-To: <002401c0931b$9a2fd540$a708fbcf@oemcomputer> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Joe, incredible stats! I am awed by your accomplishment. I'd love to know your promotional "secrets". Congratulations! mark > From: Joe S Moore > Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works > > Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic > Date: Fri, 9 Feb 2001 20:39:58 -0800 > To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.ACSU.BUFFALO.EDU > Subject: BFVI Stats > > The Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute Stats for Year 2000 > Home Page Hits Only > > January.........1,394 > February.......1,506 > March............1,844 > April...............1,837 > May................1,932 > June..............1,430 > July................1,600 > August..........1,600 > September..1,459 > October........2,257 > November...2,223 > December...2,191 > > Total...........21,273 > > Average/mo.......1,772.75 > Average/day............58.28 > > For much more detailed info see: > http://vwr1.hitbox.com/HitboxUI?acct=WQ590817CKNF&p=1 > > Joe S Moore: joemoore@cruzio.com > Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute: http://www.cruzio.com/~joemoore/ > ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 10 Feb 2001 09:17:27 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Mark Siegmund Subject: www.tetworld.org Comments: To: "Geodesic Listserve GEODESIC"@LISTSERV.ACSU.BUFFALO.EDU In-Reply-To: Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit > > Hi, our domain name is working now at: http://www.tetworld.org or simply: > http://tetworld.org > > BTW--I've been reworking the main pages and would appreciate your review and > comment > > Thanks... > mark > > > ______________________________________________________________________ > To unsubscribe, write to Tetworld-unsubscribe@listbot.com > ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 10 Feb 2001 09:31:13 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Re: BFVI Stats In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii My guess is that, like Bucky, Joe does not promote. Beautiful, Joe. --- Mark Siegmund wrote: > Joe, incredible stats! I am awed by your > accomplishment. > > I'd love to know your promotional "secrets". > > Congratulations! > mark > > > From: Joe S Moore > > Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster > Fuller's works > > > > Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic > > Date: Fri, 9 Feb 2001 20:39:58 -0800 > > To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.ACSU.BUFFALO.EDU > > Subject: BFVI Stats > > > > The Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute Stats for > Year 2000 > > Home Page Hits Only > > > > January.........1,394 > > February.......1,506 > > March............1,844 > > April...............1,837 > > May................1,932 > > June..............1,430 > > July................1,600 > > August..........1,600 > > September..1,459 > > October........2,257 > > November...2,223 > > December...2,191 > > > > Total...........21,273 > > > > Average/mo.......1,772.75 > > Average/day............58.28 > > > > For much more detailed info see: > > > http://vwr1.hitbox.com/HitboxUI?acct=WQ590817CKNF&p=1 > > > > Joe S Moore: joemoore@cruzio.com > > Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute: > http://www.cruzio.com/~joemoore/ > ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 10 Feb 2001 09:36:15 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Re: What I expect from people In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Expectations are killers! (loosely translated from the original Buddist) ;>) --- Dexter Graphic wrote: > There are only three things that I look for and > expect > to find in people: honesty, integrity, and > creativity. > > To me, honesty means intellectually identifying the > "facts" of reality, integrity means living one's > life > consistent with this honest understanding of > reality, > and creativity means working to improve the chances > of everyone living a life of honesty and integrity. > > Dexter Graphi ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 10 Feb 2001 10:26:36 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Subject: New Dome Manuf Comments: To: _DomeHomeList MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit A new dome manufacturer: Oregon Yurt & Dome Southern Oregon (no address) Owners? http://www.yurtsanddomes.com/ Made of metal (aluminum?) Joe S Moore: joemoore@cruzio.com Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute: http://www.cruzio.com/~joemoore/ ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 10 Feb 2001 10:57:01 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Subject: Re: BFVI Stats MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Mark, No secret. I just make available tons of info that people can't get anywhere else. If there is a secret it's that I've been collecting Bucky info since 1970 and it's taken me since late '94 to get it all up on my website. I guess one "secret" is to just keep plodding away. What's that called? Persistence? My stats aren't that great. Kirby's are a lot better. According to AltaVista, 79 sites are linked to my site. See: http://doc.altavista.com/adv_search/ast_ma_wholinks.html Joe S Moore: joemoore@cruzio.com Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute: http://www.cruzio.com/~joemoore/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mark Siegmund" Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic To: Sent: Saturday, February 10, 2001 9:16 AM Subject: Re: BFVI Stats > Joe, incredible stats! I am awed by your accomplishment. > > I'd love to know your promotional "secrets". > > Congratulations! > mark > > > From: Joe S Moore > > Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works > > > > Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic > > Date: Fri, 9 Feb 2001 20:39:58 -0800 > > To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.ACSU.BUFFALO.EDU > > Subject: BFVI Stats > > > > The Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute Stats for Year 2000 > > Home Page Hits Only > > > > January.........1,394 > > February.......1,506 > > March............1,844 > > April...............1,837 > > May................1,932 > > June..............1,430 > > July................1,600 > > August..........1,600 > > September..1,459 > > October........2,257 > > November...2,223 > > December...2,191 > > > > Total...........21,273 > > > > Average/mo.......1,772.75 > > Average/day............58.28 > > > > For much more detailed info see: > > http://vwr1.hitbox.com/HitboxUI?acct=WQ590817CKNF&p=1 > > ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 10 Feb 2001 05:41:59 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Re: zero phase <> Brian ¿Quincy! Hutchings 10-FEB-2001 5:41 r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us your ennumeration of the dysappearing vertices (as subvisible, primitive systems (a-hem)) is fine & dandy! however (for example), the bihedrality of the trigon, and the bigonality of the ... bigon, is just conceptual, since there's no preconceived curvature of the space (with or without stuff in it). (these are your 3V and 2V thingies, repsectively .-) viz, the trigon of no-thickness-what-so-ever (sic), still has two completely dystinguishable sides, being mirror-images (that is, dystinguishable if not equigonal, or, say, if one side is polarized differently, or what-hath-you). the inside-outing via the zero-tet (as opposed to just "popping" thru a facet) is an intersting soliloqy, but one should not be blinded by Bucky's insistence that there are no "really" primitive elements; by saying that the vertex is actually minimally tetrahedral event, he's just driving the analysis "in," ad absurdum. you've got to have "undefineds" that just be, more or less, to make-do with your axioms; such as the parallel postulate! thus quoth: 4V+4F=6E+2, the tet. E stands for edge OR relationship. Subtract 1V. 3V+2F=3E+2, a 3 cornered pillow. Subtract 1V. 2V+1F=1E+2, a cigar or football. Subtract 1V. 1V+1F=0E+2, a hydrogen atom, the nucleus corresponds to the vertex, the electron cloud corresponds to the face; or a balloon with the knot in it being the single vertex. Then she disappears only to pop in to negative space(the inside out tet). Reverse process. --The Thronburgh Doctrine! http://www.tarpley.net/bush24.htm ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 10 Feb 2001 05:47:21 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Re: [Q-P] Climate change <> Brian ¿Quincy! Hutchings 10-FEB-2001 5:47 r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us the Feb.2 issue of Science has a couple of intersting articles on chemistry, that may be of interest to the geodesic-l students o'Bucky. it also has an article on the Pine Island Glacier's retreat in Antarctica, and you merely have to supply the proviso that it could mean the opposite of the author's seeming assumption (I've just read the abstract .-) we really need that Antarctic oil, folks! thus saith: bergs off of Antarctica and oscillations of Arctic seacover are quite meaningless, as to overall trends; they indicate vast alterations of weather, though, selective pictograms in USA Today of "retreating glaciers" camn also be misleading; do you not agree? >--The Thronburgh Doctrine! >http://www.tarpley.net/bush24.htm ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 10 Feb 2001 06:00:37 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Re: zero phase <> Brian ¿Quincy! Hutchings 10-FEB-2001 6:00 r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us I should say, the curvature of the space (say hperbolic) won't matter as to the "2Dness" of the trigon; internal gas-pressure might, though! --The Thronburgh Doctrine! > >http://www.tarpley.net/bush24.htm ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 10 Feb 2001 16:00:41 -0600 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Tony Kalenak Subject: Re: BFVI Stats MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Yeah RIGHT ! Bucky was a promoter almost without equal. If only I had his drive and ego ! -Tony. -----Original Message----- From: Dick Fischbeck [SMTP:dick_fischbeck@YAHOO.COM] Sent: Saturday, February 10, 2001 11:31 AM To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.ACSU.BUFFALO.EDU Subject: Re: BFVI Stats My guess is that, like Bucky, Joe does not promote. Beautiful, Joe. --- Mark Siegmund wrote: > Joe, incredible stats! I am awed by your > accomplishment. > > I'd love to know your promotional "secrets". > > Congratulations! > mark > > > From: Joe S Moore > > Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster > Fuller's works > > > > Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic > > Date: Fri, 9 Feb 2001 20:39:58 -0800 > > To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.ACSU.BUFFALO.EDU > > Subject: BFVI Stats > > > > The Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute Stats for > Year 2000 > > Home Page Hits Only > > > > January.........1,394 > > February.......1,506 > > March............1,844 > > April...............1,837 > > May................1,932 > > June..............1,430 > > July................1,600 > > August..........1,600 > > September..1,459 > > October........2,257 > > November...2,223 > > December...2,191 > > > > Total...........21,273 > > > > Average/mo.......1,772.75 > > Average/day............58.28 > > > > For much more detailed info see: > > > http://vwr1.hitbox.com/HitboxUI?acct=WQ590817CKNF&p=1 > > > > Joe S Moore: joemoore@cruzio.com > > Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute: > http://www.cruzio.com/~joemoore/ > ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 11 Feb 2001 12:12:59 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Subject: Re: Slaughterhouse 5 Comments: To: DomeHome-H@h19.hoflin.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Barb, Does anyone have a pic of the Tralfamadore dome that they could upload to the DomeHome list? Joe S Moore: joemoore@cruzio.com Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute: http://www.cruzio.com/~joemoore/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "The DomeHome List" To: Sent: Sunday, February 11, 2001 11:51 AM Subject: re: Slaughterhouse 5 > Date: 2/11/01 12:58 PM > From: Barb Moore, bamoore@emory.edu > > Mike, > I was wondering when I saw your id (trout) if it was for Kilgore Trout! > I decided on the dome because my ex-boyfriend's favorite book/movie was > Slaughterhouse 5! He and I are considering reconciliation and he loved > the dome idea. We are avid chatters on internet relay chat and "our" > channel is #Tralfamadore and we chat as Billy and Montana! LOL :) > Thanks for your post. > Did you know it took nearly a month to create the starscape for the dome > scenes? > Barb > > > > o > ===== The DomeHome Email List > ========== Web: http://www.domegroup.org > ============= Send posts to: DomeHome-H@h19.hoflin.com > =============== To unsubscribe, write: unsubscribe DomeHome-H > ================ and send to this address: requests@h19.hoflin.com > > > ** subscribe/unsubscribe to this list (under DOG LISTS) and subscribe to > DOME at http://www.hoflin.com > > ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 11 Feb 2001 10:10:34 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: PEN Weekly NewsBlast for February 9, 2001 (Special Valentine's D <> Brian ¿Quincy! Hutchings 11-FEB-2001 10:10 r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us These are related to our theme on education. In particular, I selected the parts about tersting/standards, the Bush Plan, and A program from Oxford, Project 2061 (whose "maps" on, say, "gravity" seem to dysinclude the Keplerian Key to grokking that, in favor of the typical Newtonian stuff). FINDING ALTERNATIVES TO FAILURE Do strict standards for grade promotion may affect retention rates? There is considerable evidence that retention rates already are high in most states and that using scores on state tests as the primary criterion for promotion likely will increase those rates dramatically. The report concludes that neither social promotion nor retention is the answer and that both "solutions" do more harm than good. http://www.sreb.org/programs/HHS/pubs/Alternatives/AlternativesToFailure. asp Project 2061 has done a mighty favor to K-12 science. The project has organized what appeared to be a bazillion seemingly disparate learning goals or benchmarks-describing what a child should know and be able to do-into related ideas that develop sophistication over the course of grade levels. The result is an actual map-called Atlas for Science Literacy-that shows graphically what concepts need to be in place -- and at what point during elementary, middle or high school-in order for students to build the capacity to grasp 2061's highly ambitious 12th grade science benchmarks. http://www.project2061.org Designs for Science Literacy, a new guide to improving the K-12 curriculum, is now available from Oxford University Press! Order your copy today at http://www.oup-usa.org/. HOW READY ARE STATES TO IMPLEMENT BUSH'S EDUCATION PLAN? Progress toward education accountability has been uneven, and most states are struggling to put all of the pieces together in a coherent and demonstrably effective fashion. The Bush plan features a variety of incentives, requirements and new resources aimed at intensifying and quickening the pace of reform, particularly in the area of standards-based assessment and accountability. http://www.ecs.org/ecsmain.asp?page=/clearinghouse/22/88/2288.htm DEALING WITH SCHOOL DROPOUTS The nation's dropout problem is most severe in a few hundred big-city schools that graduate less than half of their freshman classes, according to a Harvard University study. The study suggests that one way to see real improvement is by creating smaller schools or "schools within schools" that give student-especially freshmen-more individualized instruction and counseling. http://www.cleveland.com/education/index.ssf?/news/pd/cc21drop.html http://www.edweek.org/ew/ewstory.cfm?slug=21dropout.h20 SCIENCE TEXTBOOKS RIDDLED WITH ERRORS Twelve of the most popular science textbooks used at middle schools across the nation are riddled with errors, according to a two-year study led by a North Carolina State University researcher. http://more.abcnews.go.com/sections/scitech/DailyNews/scienceerrors010115 .html WHY BAD REFORMS DON'T YIELD GOOD SCHOOLS In search of the "one best system," corporate leaders, public officials, and parents of students have narrowed Americans' general view of what a "good school" is to a one-size-fits-all version. Research and documentation to justify the one-size-fits-all good school are lacking. Although few pundits or critics have raised the issue, there is simply no evidence that rigid standards, uniform tests, and strict accountability have any long-term effects on students once they leave high school. http://www.prospect.org/print/V12/1/cuban-l.html --The duke of Oil! http://www.tarpley.net/bushb.htm MESSAGE from =PEN@PublicEducation.org ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 11 Feb 2001 10:12:22 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Happy Lincoln's V-days! <> Brian ¿Quincy! Hutchings 11-FEB-2001 10:12 r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us everyone wanting to get over the hump of V-day, put your mind on Lincoln's Days (of course, his birth was only historical to his parental units; I'm thinking of Cinco de Mayo and Juneteenth !-) >--The duke of Oil! >http://www.tarpley.net/bushb.htm ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 12 Feb 2001 05:22:10 GMT Reply-To: bbsandra@xoasis.com Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: dxpix@HOTBOT.COM Subject: $20 off Peace Promoting Gift Baskets! twswi Comments: To: mrqrf@aol.com Are you looking for products for vegetarians? How about kosher products? All n atural? Maybe something dairy free? We can help you. We offer all natural, gourmet, kosher, vegetarian gift baskets! Our products are made by unique cooperative ventures by peoples in conflict regions through out the world. Not only do you get a great product, but you are also helping a good cause. We have many different sizes and styles available. Act now and receive a special discount! ***As a special incentive we are providing you with an email coupon ***To receive your 10% discount on orders over $50*** Use this gift voucher on the check out page when it prompts you to redeem PeaceW orks coupons. Just type in FGFT0302 and your discount will be automatically ded ucted from your total. (Offer Expires 3/5/01) Also, Free Shipping for your order over $150 Send an email to leader1@arabia.com with the subject line "health" for your free coupon or click below mailto:leader1@arabia.com?subject=health. This is a one time mailing. If you would like to be removed from this list plea se send a blank email with the subject remove to leader1@arabia.com ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 12 Feb 2001 08:26:52 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Subject: Book Covers Comments: To: wright.wright@mindspring.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Mr Wright, If you would like a pic of the cover of Critical Path see: http://www.cruzio.com/~joemoore/Biblio/ByBFbookTOC-CriticalPath.htm and for Operating Manual for Spaceship Earth see: http://www.cruzio.com/~joemoore/Biblio/ByBFbookTOC-OperatingManualForSpacesh ipEarth.htm Joe S Moore: joemoore@cruzio.com Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute: http://www.cruzio.com/~joemoore/ ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 12 Feb 2001 18:19:38 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dexter Graphic Subject: Re: What I expect from people In-Reply-To: <20010210173615.2467.qmail@web4405.mail.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I'd say the real killers of this age are intellectual dishonesty, lack of personal integrity, and the toleration of environmental and social destruction for purely selfish purposes. All who participate in these "sins" will suffer the "punishment" of God's coming judgment! (loosely translated from original Judeo-Christian prophecies.) (c:W Dexter > From: Dick Fischbeck > Sent: Saturday, February 10, 2001 09:36 > > Expectations are killers! (loosely translated from > the original Buddhist) ;>) > > > Dexter Graphic wrote: > > There are only three things that I look for and > > expect to find in people: honesty, integrity, and > > creativity. > > > > To me, honesty means intellectually identifying the > > "facts" of reality, integrity means living one's > > life consistent with this honest understanding of > > reality, and creativity means working to improve the > > chances of everyone living a life of honesty and > > integrity. ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 13 Feb 2001 03:57:42 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Re: [Q-P] Climate change <> Brian ¿Quincy! Hutchings 13-FEB-2001 3:57 r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us "thermohaline" was not in the Big Dictionary, here, but I thouth that it had to do with salt-gradients in the flow of warm and cold water. these models are quite absurd, however, and contain a very large measure of denial toward changes that quite apparent, with "overall" warming simply being one, that ain't. the modellers are just beginning to grok the use of mesoscale eddies in the hydrosphere and atmosphere, if not their interaction. to postulate a shutdown of any sort, based upon the circa 1896 Glass House of Svente Arrhenius, reified as the Prime Directive in these models, so to say, does not even do justice to a typical glasshouse (which has a groundside, a poleward side etc. the biggest "news" that is supposedly indicative, is the large bergs off of Antarctica; like earthquakes, they are as ordinary as the seasons, and if measured on a log-scale (base-ten), the "11s" will be ten times as frequent as the "10s," period. the telemetry does not support the interpretation that these bergs are caused by the melthing of the Antarctic icesheet, as it may be growing in thickness etc., overall. the most important result of increased *other* G-gasses, will be changes in the flux of the #1 G-gas, water vapor. the dyspoistion of the added (primarily) equitorial energy, depends upon how the heat of fusion is released in the polar regions; this is not just a funcion of "random ideal gas theory," and may even be quite directional (say, outward). thus quoth: An ice age in north Europe in the 21st Century is not likely (from the report): "Most models show weakening of the ocean thermohaline circulation which leads to a reduction of the heat transport into high latitudes of the Northern Hemisphere. However, even in models where the thermohaline circulation weakens, there is still a warming over Europe due to increased greenhouse gases. The current projections using climate models do not exhibit a complete shut down of the thermohaline circulation by 2100. Beyond 2100, the thermohaline circulation could completely, and possibly irreversibly, shut down in either hemisphere if the change in radiative forcing is large enough and applied long enough." --The Duke of Oil! http://www.tarpley.net/bushb.htm ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 13 Feb 2001 12:39:48 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Re: [Q-P] Climate change In-Reply-To: <200102131157.f1DBvgm21529@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii > > "thermohaline" was not in the Big Dictionary, here, > but > I thouth that it had to do with salt-gradients > in the flow of warm and cold water. > these models are quite absurd, however, and > contain a very large measure of denial > toward changes that quite apparent, > with "overall" warming simply being one, that > ain't. Brian- I have no idea whether or not a drastic, people-induces climatic shift is in our future. I think you are saying that in your best guess the theory of global-warming is not scientifically supported. What is your explanation for the theory? Dick ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 13 Feb 2001 14:01:30 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Kirby Urner Subject: Spouting off re Napster etc. In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" I think the big picture view re Napster is that LAWCAP is piggy-backing on engineering, enforcing rules that cripple its capabilities, so that scarcity remains the driving pressure behind high barriers to access -- even though scarcity in principle is a thing of the past, at least insofar as metaphysical assets are concerned. There's a lot of lip-service about helping the developing world, but if this were sincere, then the ability to clone digital assets for universal access would be hailed as a humanitarian breakthrough. But when push comes to shove, most organized religion is mute on the issue, getting behind lawyer-capitalism's drive to make it a criminal act to propagate these assets. Church music is intellectual property, after all. Much better to keep doling out charity in guilt-assuaging dollops, keeping the poor impoverished, than allowing these people the freedom and independence which real wealth affords. You hear that it's the right of the creator of intellectual assets to control how they're used, but why is this so? If you create a liability, like a virus, then it's the rest of the world that has to organize to stop you. You're injecting memes into the larger ecosystem, pumping lyrics and words into the world as a whole. Is that world your exclusive playground or dumping ground? Why should only those who give you money have the right to monitor, audit, supervise, comment, and, if necessary, counter your contributions to our shared legacy? If what you produce is inimical to the interests of another set, they have the right to take a look, without financially supporting your endeavour to pollute the meme pool. But the deeper issue is simply the status of ideas. It's institutional in some regimes that ideas may be tagged as "owned by", so that the same idea may be sold, again and again, to humanity at large. If you think of the rudder as a great idea for steering ships, then not only should you get royalties for the idea, but for each rudder installed. Is this how ideas were propagated in the past? Not really. Cultures took from one another willy nilly, taking whatever they could use. If the utopia of the asset controllers had been in force from the beginning, we'd still be in the stone age, with cave persons still trying to amass enough furs for the privilege of being allowed to light the next camp fire (a patented procedure, owned by CampFires LLC). There's a lot of talk about Napster piggy-backing on the copyrights of others. But how about others piggy-backing on the inventions of others, the engineering and high tech savvy of others. The move now is to push people to DVD players in part because they don't affordably copy (unlike VCRs), plus the individual disks cost less to produce (and of course DVDs are a better technology in some ways -- once you restore copiability to the picture). Every device that is able to faithfully reproduce a digital asset is supposed to be artificially inhibited, crippled, dumbed down, because it's somehow unethical for humanity to reap what generations of technologists have been able to achieve, by building upon one anothers' best ideas. No, it's unethical to take advantage of technology, because that makes it too easy to amass assets, and the whole business model depends on keeping assets scarce, in short supply, no matter how contrived and artificial the means (dumping perfectly good food into a landfill is still a popular option in some circles). The digital "loaves and fishes" phenomenon is a nightmare for LAWCAP. Selfishness is at the root of most business models, and the rapid proliferation of useful memes without revenue from sales is simply beyond the pale, is out of bounds (is "piracy" in other words, even if copying an asset leaves it in the hands of the original asset holder). Of course compensating original creators of new assets on some other basis than "revenue from sales" might have to be adopted. Is that an impossible dream? It might be, if your goal is to hog enormous quantities of assets for personal use while millions starve in hovels. But in some cultures, that "freedom" isn't held in such high esteem. Respect from one's peers is more sought. No one need envy of a greed freak with a trully serious case of affluenza. Why choose such sick and twisted individuals as role models? They need our compassion certainly, but adulation should be reserved for the eternal aspects of people, which aspects are not exclusively manifested by those doing the least with the most. Never was it more clear that "success for humanity" is not how the Grunch is programmed. It's all about "success for the few at the expense of the many" and any technology which promises a way out of that thralldom must be strangled in its infancy. The problem for Grunch is that even if "artists" can be trained to buy in to the selfish model (all their lip synching "band aid" concerts for the hungry notwithstanding), some in the engineering community have more integrity, and will persist in challenging scarcity wherever it is artificially created. There's enough scarcity of real assets (e.g. intelligence), to make it really stupid to create scarcity even where there needn't be any. That's like shooting yourself in the foot, cutting off your nose to spite your face and so forth. Humanity as a whole can't afford to be as stupid, gullible and docile as LAWCAP would have it be, in perpetuity. So even if the artists are slaves to the system, not everyone will be, and that's enough to keep us moving forward, towards a time when we might escape the inferior programming set running in ages gone by, when Malthusianism was the only credible ideology. Kirby ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 14 Feb 2001 00:08:52 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dexter Graphic Subject: Re: Spouting off re Napster etc. In-Reply-To: <3.0.3.32.20010213140130.009d0910@pop3.norton.antivirus> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Great post Kirby; I've forwarded it far and wide. I made a minor adjustment though: I added a footnote to GRUNCH of Giants at BFI for those who might be unfamiliar with this concept. Regarding compensating original creators, I think it would be much more efficient to just provide everyone with basic life-support rather than tying the whole system down with this money-making preoccupation. I'd like to see all creative minds set free by loving service of our one universal family. -Dexter From: Kirby Urner Sent: Tuesday, February 13, 2001 To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works I think the big picture view re Napster is that LAWCAP is piggy-backing on engineering, enforcing rules that cripple its capabilities, so that scarcity remains the driving pressure behind high barriers to access -- even though scarcity in principle is a thing of the past, at least insofar as metaphysical assets are concerned. There's a lot of lip-service about helping the developing world, but if this were sincere, then the ability to clone digital assets for universal access would be hailed as a humanitarian breakthrough. But when push comes to shove, most organized religion is mute on the issue, getting behind lawyer-capitalism's drive to make it a criminal act to propagate these assets. Church music is intellectual property, after all. Much better to keep doling out charity in guilt-assuaging dollops, keeping the poor impoverished, than allowing these people the freedom and independence which real wealth affords. You hear that it's the right of the creator of intellectual assets to control how they're used, but why is this so? If you create a liability, like a virus, then it's the rest of the world that has to organize to stop you. You're injecting memes into the larger ecosystem, pumping lyrics and words into the world as a whole. Is that world your exclusive playground or dumping ground? Why should only those who give you money have the right to monitor, audit, supervise, comment, and, if necessary, counter your contributions to our shared legacy? If what you produce is inimical to the interests of another set, they have the right to take a look, without financially supporting your endeavour to pollute the meme pool. But the deeper issue is simply the status of ideas. It's institutional in some regimes that ideas may be tagged as "owned by", so that the same idea may be sold, again and again, to humanity at large. If you think of the rudder as a great idea for steering ships, then not only should you get royalties for the idea, but for each rudder installed. Is this how ideas were propagated in the past? Not really. Cultures took from one another willy nilly, taking whatever they could use. If the utopia of the asset controllers had been in force from the beginning, we'd still be in the stone age, with cave persons still trying to amass enough furs for the privilege of being allowed to light the next camp fire (a patented procedure, owned by CampFires LLC). There's a lot of talk about Napster piggy-backing on the copyrights of others. But how about others piggy-backing on the inventions of others, the engineering and high tech savvy of others. The move now is to push people to DVD players in part because they don't affordably copy (unlike VCRs), plus the individual disks cost less to produce (and of course DVDs are a better technology in some ways -- once you restore copiability to the picture). Every device that is able to faithfully reproduce a digital asset is supposed to be artificially inhibited, crippled, dumbed down, because it's somehow unethical for humanity to reap what generations of technologists have been able to achieve, by building upon one anothers' best ideas. No, it's unethical to take advantage of technology, because that makes it too easy to amass assets, and the whole business model depends on keeping assets scarce, in short supply, no matter how contrived and artificial the means (dumping perfectly good food into a landfill is still a popular option in some circles). The digital "loaves and fishes" phenomenon is a nightmare for LAWCAP. Selfishness is at the root of most business models, and the rapid proliferation of useful memes without revenue from sales is simply beyond the pale, is out of bounds (is "piracy" in other words, even if copying an asset leaves it in the hands of the original asset holder). Of course compensating original creators of new assets on some other basis than "revenue from sales" might have to be adopted. Is that an impossible dream? It might be, if your goal is to hog enormous quantities of assets for personal use while millions starve in hovels. But in some cultures, that "freedom" isn't held in such high esteem. Respect from one's peers is more sought. No one need envy of a greed freak with a trully serious case of affluenza. Why choose such sick and twisted individuals as role models? They need our compassion certainly, but adulation should be reserved for the eternal aspects of people, which aspects are not exclusively manifested by those doing the least with the most. Never was it more clear that "success for humanity" is not how the Grunch is programmed. It's all about "success for the few at the expense of the many" and any technology which promises a way out of that thralldom must be strangled in its infancy. The problem for Grunch [1] is that even if "artists" can be trained to buy in to the selfish model (all their lip synching "band aid" concerts for the hungry notwithstanding), some in the engineering community have more integrity, and will persist in challenging scarcity wherever it is artificially created. There's enough scarcity of real assets (e.g. intelligence), to make it really stupid to create scarcity even where there needn't be any. That's like shooting yourself in the foot, cutting off your nose to spite your face and so forth. Humanity as a whole can't afford to be as stupid, gullible and docile as LAWCAP would have it be, in perpetuity. So even if the artists are slaves to the system, not everyone will be, and that's enough to keep us moving forward, towards a time when we might escape the inferior programming set running in ages gone by, when Malthusianism was the only credible ideology. Kirby [1] GRUNCH defined http://www.bfi.org/grunch_of_giants1.htm ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 14 Feb 2001 18:12:07 +0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: M Subject: modeling toys MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I got this nifty little toy, Polydron, for my kids... Alright!! Alright!! I got it for me. But, they seem to enjoy it too. It consists of small mold injected plastic plates, triangles, squares, penta- and hexagons that fit together to form polyhedra. Have any more similar geodesic modeling toys out there? Thanks Malcolm ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 14 Feb 2001 08:20:11 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: "Brent A. Verrill" Subject: Re: modeling toys In-Reply-To: <3A8A59F7.B13DB329@ms15.hinet.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Malcolm, Try Zometool. Probably the quintessential prefabricated geodesic modeling system. I say 'prefabricated' because lots of folks on this list prefer to do their modeling with paper, sticks, plastic tubing, cardboard, etc. Brent At 05:12 AM 2/14/01 , you wrote: >I got this nifty little toy, Polydron, for my kids... Alright!! Alright!! > >I got it for me. > >But, they seem to enjoy it too. >It consists of small mold injected plastic plates, triangles, squares, penta- and hexagons that >fit together to form polyhedra. > >Have any more similar geodesic modeling toys out there? > >Thanks > > >Malcolm > ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 14 Feb 2001 08:55:08 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Subject: Re: modeling toys MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Malcolm, You might want to take a look at my Domes/Models collection. Scroll down to "Models": http://www.cruzio.com/~joemoore/Index/Domes-M.htm Also, check out the Geometry/Models page: http://www.cruzio.com/~joemoore/Index/GeomModels.htm Joe S Moore: joemoore@cruzio.com Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute: http://www.cruzio.com/~joemoore/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "M" Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic To: Sent: Wednesday, February 14, 2001 2:12 AM Subject: modeling toys > I got this nifty little toy, Polydron, for my kids... Alright!! Alright!! > > I got it for me. > > But, they seem to enjoy it too. > It consists of small mold injected plastic plates, triangles, squares, penta- and hexagons that > fit together to form polyhedra. > > Have any more similar geodesic modeling toys out there? > > Thanks > > > Malcolm ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 14 Feb 2001 11:58:19 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dexter Graphic Subject: Re: modeling toys In-Reply-To: <3A8A59F7.B13DB329@ms15.hinet.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > Have any more similar geodesic modeling toys out there? This one's my favorite: http://www.rogersconnection.com/index.html It uses magnets in the ends of the struts and ball bearings at the vertices to hold the pieces together. It's nice to see the angles adjust dynamically as your add or reposition struts. There is a problem with weight that keeps you from building too big however. Be sure to check out the gallery of models: http://www.rogersconnection.com/Gallery.html Dexter ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 14 Feb 2001 14:11:25 -0600 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Tony Kalenak Subject: Re: Spouting off re Napster etc. MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" "It's institutional in some regimes that ideas may be tagged as "owned by", so that the same idea may be sold, again and again, to humanity at large." I think Academia has a big hand and stake in this "owned by" model. Along with the "Professions" (e.g. medical, engineering, and architecture, to name a few). They have "licensed" their knowledge making it illegal to publicly practice with this knowledge without first paying for it and attending their 4 - 8 year bootcamps. I understand the need for accountability in the name of public safety, but one by one the old apprenticeship paradigm has been decommissioned, making Academia the only route. -----Original Message----- From: Kirby Urner [SMTP:pdx4d@TELEPORT.COM] Sent: Tuesday, February 13, 2001 4:02 PM To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.ACSU.BUFFALO.EDU Subject: Spouting off re Napster etc. I think the big picture view re Napster is that LAWCAP is piggy-backing on engineering, enforcing rules that cripple its capabilities, so that scarcity remains the driving pressure behind high barriers to access -- even though scarcity in principle is a thing of the past, at least insofar as metaphysical assets are concerned. There's a lot of lip-service about helping the developing world, but if this were sincere, then the ability to clone digital assets for universal access would be hailed as a humanitarian breakthrough. But when push comes to shove, most organized religion is mute on the issue, getting behind lawyer-capitalism's drive to make it a criminal act to propagate these assets. Church music is intellectual property, after all. Much better to keep doling out charity in guilt-assuaging dollops, keeping the poor impoverished, than allowing these people the freedom and independence which real wealth affords. You hear that it's the right of the creator of intellectual assets to control how they're used, but why is this so? If you create a liability, like a virus, then it's the rest of the world that has to organize to stop you. You're injecting memes into the larger ecosystem, pumping lyrics and words into the world as a whole. Is that world your exclusive playground or dumping ground? Why should only those who give you money have the right to monitor, audit, supervise, comment, and, if necessary, counter your contributions to our shared legacy? If what you produce is inimical to the interests of another set, they have the right to take a look, without financially supporting your endeavour to pollute the meme pool. But the deeper issue is simply the status of ideas. It's institutional in some regimes that ideas may be tagged as "owned by", so that the same idea may be sold, again and again, to humanity at large. If you think of the rudder as a great idea for steering ships, then not only should you get royalties for the idea, but for each rudder installed. Is this how ideas were propagated in the past? Not really. Cultures took from one another willy nilly, taking whatever they could use. If the utopia of the asset controllers had been in force from the beginning, we'd still be in the stone age, with cave persons still trying to amass enough furs for the privilege of being allowed to light the next camp fire (a patented procedure, owned by CampFires LLC). There's a lot of talk about Napster piggy-backing on the copyrights of others. But how about others piggy-backing on the inventions of others, the engineering and high tech savvy of others. The move now is to push people to DVD players in part because they don't affordably copy (unlike VCRs), plus the individual disks cost less to produce (and of course DVDs are a better technology in some ways -- once you restore copiability to the picture). Every device that is able to faithfully reproduce a digital asset is supposed to be artificially inhibited, crippled, dumbed down, because it's somehow unethical for humanity to reap what generations of technologists have been able to achieve, by building upon one anothers' best ideas. No, it's unethical to take advantage of technology, because that makes it too easy to amass assets, and the whole business model depends on keeping assets scarce, in short supply, no matter how contrived and artificial the means (dumping perfectly good food into a landfill is still a popular option in some circles). The digital "loaves and fishes" phenomenon is a nightmare for LAWCAP. Selfishness is at the root of most business models, and the rapid proliferation of useful memes without revenue from sales is simply beyond the pale, is out of bounds (is "piracy" in other words, even if copying an asset leaves it in the hands of the original asset holder). Of course compensating original creators of new assets on some other basis than "revenue from sales" might have to be adopted. Is that an impossible dream? It might be, if your goal is to hog enormous quantities of assets for personal use while millions starve in hovels. But in some cultures, that "freedom" isn't held in such high esteem. Respect from one's peers is more sought. No one need envy of a greed freak with a trully serious case of affluenza. Why choose such sick and twisted individuals as role models? They need our compassion certainly, but adulation should be reserved for the eternal aspects of people, which aspects are not exclusively manifested by those doing the least with the most. Never was it more clear that "success for humanity" is not how the Grunch is programmed. It's all about "success for the few at the expense of the many" and any technology which promises a way out of that thralldom must be strangled in its infancy. The problem for Grunch is that even if "artists" can be trained to buy in to the selfish model (all their lip synching "band aid" concerts for the hungry notwithstanding), some in the engineering community have more integrity, and will persist in challenging scarcity wherever it is artificially created. There's enough scarcity of real assets (e.g. intelligence), to make it really stupid to create scarcity even where there needn't be any. That's like shooting yourself in the foot, cutting off your nose to spite your face and so forth. Humanity as a whole can't afford to be as stupid, gullible and docile as LAWCAP would have it be, in perpetuity. So even if the artists are slaves to the system, not everyone will be, and that's enough to keep us moving forward, towards a time when we might escape the inferior programming set running in ages gone by, when Malthusianism was the only credible ideology. Kirby ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 14 Feb 2001 09:17:34 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Re: [Q-P] Climate change <> Brian ¿Quincy! Hutchings 14-FEB-2001 9:17 r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us What is your explanation for the theory? Dick why is the 1896 "model" so paradigmatic, as if the programmers had assumed that insolation is evenly-dystributed about the globe, and slowly hacked the resulting annoyance into compliance with a select data? my own knowledge of the rather coarse gridwork of the GCMs is limited mainly to abstracts, and pouplar books on the matter (such as Stephen Schneider's. whom I spoke with about diffg.eqs. at a TreePeople conference. in a word, "however." however, these models are not made form any *conceptual* model, but seem to be thrown-together from the work-a-day models of the Weather Dept. at the university, with giant leaps into the void of making-do with ad-hoc heuristics that give a darn good fit to a certain selection of the data. however, by the most simple adumbration of the quaint Butterfly Effect, that is of "essential dependence upon intermediate cognition" -- there are only "initial conditions in these models -- one can see that there is no warranty from the forecast of the weather, out to over a year in some repsects, on the range of "climate." or, perhaps, we cannot predict the wather, only forecast economical responses to various possibilities, currently consigned to the Free Market and a diocletian edict from BP, 'WAND' et al (the market tends most closely to these oligarchs, whose Invisible Hand is in the business of making "honest money.") (the only really intial conditions are those that are set in unique experiments of new principles, as a matter of hypothesis; refer here to agriculture for the matter of climate: take the USDA's Hardiness Zone Maps as a series, as was done by Hamaker about 20ya !-) the other matter is political, and the UNIPCC is that, all the way, although its act has been honed to a science!... first of all, most of the largest sources of CO2 (and most G-gasses) are natural, mostly seasonal or diurnal; htat's well-known, but the concentration upon these secondary "anthrogenic" flows almost never acknowledges this, and it's often forgotten. the most auspicious moment I learned from a pulbication called "Solar Age or Ice Age News," reporting on a radical group called Tree War Scoeity, or some thing, who had attended (or gotten a-hold of the transcripts; I don't recall) a meeting of the AAAS, where funding for studies is ultimately controlled in large measure in public academia. there was a famous person there, to sort-of lay-down the law for the new paradigm, which had to fight against the very mainstream, science-based study of the Quaternary Period; this was one Roger Revelle -- you've heard of him? as for the Kyoto Protocols, Qui bono -- besides the Green Party and their "IRV" populism? thus quoth: Brian- I have no idea whether or not a drastic, people-induces climatic shift is in our future. I think you are saying that in your best guess the theory of global-warming is not scientifically supported. --The Duke of Oil! http://www/tarpley.net/bushb.htm ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 15 Feb 2001 12:06:43 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Subject: Re: [adcomm] Observatory Site? Comments: To: Tetworld Global Advisory Committee MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Mark, Alcatraz Island (the former prison) in the middle of San Francisco Bay. It is Federally owned land not presently being used for anything. Joe S Moore: joemoore@cruzio.com Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute: http://www.cruzio.com/~joemoore/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mark Siegmund" To: "Tetglobal" ; "Tetworld" ; "Tetworld Advisory Committee" Sent: Thursday, February 15, 2001 12:07 PM Subject: [adcomm] Observatory Site? > Tetworld Global Advisory Committee - http://www.tetworld.org > > Hi, I'm looking for ideas regarding the location for the Observatory/Gaming > Complex. > > Where in the world should it be located? Sri Lanka, Rome, Paris, Nairobi, > New York, Sydney, Costa Rica....? > > Mark ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 15 Feb 2001 14:33:05 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Re: BFVI Stats In-Reply-To: <2F175DC588EFD211B37C0060088FAC39186A94@pscserver3> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Okay Tony- I screwed up again. Is it the wrong word? Either that or Bucky lied. What do you call his claimings to only answer questions asked of him rather than trying to get disinterested people to listen to him? Non-solicitation? What I called non-promotional comes from his stated theory and practice of changing the environment through artifacts instead of trying to change peoples behavior through persuasion. Agreed, He was not a laid-back kind of man. Always on the move. Sleeping as little as possible. Doing everything He could to get the info out that there is plenty to go around, and all His other findings. What am I getting at? Help. Verbalality isn't my strength. Dick --- Tony Kalenak wrote: > Yeah RIGHT ! > Bucky was a promoter almost without equal. > If only I had his drive and ego ! > > -Tony. > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Dick Fischbeck > [SMTP:dick_fischbeck@YAHOO.COM] > Sent: Saturday, February 10, 2001 11:31 AM > To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.ACSU.BUFFALO.EDU > Subject: Re: BFVI Stats > > My guess is that, like Bucky, Joe does not > promote. > ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 15 Feb 2001 14:50:15 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Re: zero phase In-Reply-To: <200102101341.f1ADfx808852@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii --- Brian Hutchings wrote: > <> Brian ¿Quincy! Hutchings > 10-FEB-2001 5:41 > r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us > > your ennumeration of the dysappearing vertices (as > subvisible, > primitive systems (a-hem)) is fine & dandy! > however (for example), > the bihedrality of the trigon, and > the bigonality of the ... bigon, is just > conceptual, > since there's no preconceived curvature of the > space I don't grok this. I though, just as there are no straight lines, there are no flat surfaces. And isn't Bucky's view of the minimum structure as 4-vertexion only conceptual in the same way? > (with or without stuff in it). > (these are your 3V and 2V thingies, repsectively > .-) > viz, the trigon Tri-vertexion, ok. Three sides, I don't get. The 3-vertexion hypothesized has two sides, three edges. of no-thickness-what-so-ever > (sic), > still has two completely dystinguishable sides, > being mirror-images (that is, > dystinguishable if not equigonal, or, say, if > one side is polarized differently, or > what-hath-you). > > the inside-outing via the zero-tet (as opposed > to just "popping" thru a facet) is an intersting > soliloqy, but > one should not be blinded by Bucky's insistence > that > there are no "really" primitive elements; > by saying that the vertex is actually minimally > tetrahedral event, > he's just driving the analysis "in," ad absurdum. > you've got to have "undefineds" that just be, > more or less, to make-do with your axioms; > such as the parallel postulate! I am thinking that there is this undivisible two-ness to nature or in unity, like concave/convex. IN/out. Tension/compression. Etc. Non-mirrored complimentarity to things. So, maybe vertex/corner/angle/whatever and window/face/hedron/whatever are such a pair. I am strickly playing with ideas. I must admit I like the way Euler's Law seems to hold true as we pass through zero phase. Dick > > thus quoth: > 4V+4F=6E+2, the tet. E stands for edge OR > relationship. > Subtract 1V. > 3V+2F=3E+2, a 3 cornered pillow. > Subtract 1V. > 2V+1F=1E+2, a cigar or football. > Subtract 1V. > 1V+1F=0E+2, a hydrogen atom, the nucleus > corresponds > to the vertex, the electron cloud corresponds to > the > face; or a balloon with the knot in it being the > single vertex. > Then she disappears only to pop in to negative > space(the inside out tet). > Reverse process. > > --The Thronburgh Doctrine! > http://www.tarpley.net/bush24.ht ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 15 Feb 2001 15:00:50 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: volume of tet/spherical tet MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii A while back, I was pondering what appears to be Bucky's understanding(pg 191?;Cosmog.) that the spherical version of a vertexion is always one tetra volume greater than the vertexion itself. I played with the numbers but get hung when I get to the synergetic constant deal. Am I correct in figuring that using the tet as unit volume is different than thinking in terms of 1/3 a cube as unit volume? I am stuck. Kirby, I remember you said the points of a tet would stick through a sphere of 2 unit volumes, yes? Can anyone make this simple? Dick ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 15 Feb 2001 11:55:06 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Re: volume of tet/spherical tet <> Brian ¿Quincy! Hutchings 15-FEB-2001 11:55 r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us uh-oh; I think, that was of the ilk of his thinking that the sphere (of unit diameter?) contained exactly 5 tets (of water); close, but damped cigar! the volume of a sphere is simply transcendental, if you use a unit tet (or cube of 3 tets) or unit-edged diameter or radius or what-hath-thou. thus, a unit-diameter sphere's volume pi/6 times ddd, in unit-cubical volume (meaning, the sphere that is instructed (inscribed) into the hexahedron, touching its facets. thus quoth: A while back, I was pondering what appears to be Bucky's understanding(pg 191?;Cosmog.) that the spherical version of a vertexion is always one tetra volume greater than the vertexion itself. I played it's very instructive to nest hedra into spheres; check the relation between the in-, mid- and outspheres of (say) the tetrahedron. (that is, in the usual terms, inscribed, circumscriptable, and circumscribed spheres .-) --The Duke of Enron! http://www.tarpley.net/bush8.htm ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 15 Feb 2001 12:09:54 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Re: zero phase <> Brian ¿Quincy! Hutchings 15-FEB-2001 12:09 r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us no way in Hell (or any other chi-chi resort) am I going to use the awful "-vertexion" last-gasp (but we can always blame it on Kuromoya .-) yes, the triangle is special, but I don't see any reason in giving it its own geekology; thus, Trigon. (the matter of naming polyhedra, alternately, after their vertices (with the numbering of their duals), however, is a great breakthrough; we can argue about the proper terms, though !-) Bucky's dicta about "no flat surfaces" etc., are rather silly (Bert Russellian?) attempts to get rid of undefinables, and not successful. as a practical matter, you could take a trigonal frame an wrap clear stuff around it, and you'd certainly have a "pillow," which could be inflated, as much as tolerances allowed (pffft); any internal pressure will give you a curved surface!... that still leaves the "plus inside and outside cells." on the wayside, I see the bigon as enumerated with 2 edges and 2 facets in cigar conformation, neccesarily curved (for at least the purposed of a diagram) or just coincident: 2+2=2+2 -- who needed four? --The Thronburgh Doctrine! > http://www.tarpley.net/bush24.htm ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 15 Feb 2001 22:01:01 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Subject: Bucky Book for Sale Comments: cc: _DomeHomeList MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit The book _Inventions: The Patented Works of R Buckminster Fuller_ is currently available at Ebay: http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?MfcISAPICommand=ViewItem&item=14091 23133 Joe S Moore: joemoore@cruzio.com Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute: http://www.cruzio.com/~joemoore/ ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2001 00:37:30 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Kirby Urner Subject: Also: new 'Private Sky' volume (soon) In-Reply-To: <000a01c097dd$eb98cc40$310efbcf@oemcomputer> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Amazon.com is already selling the next volume of 'Private Sky', which is more discourse/papers, fewer pictures (and hence lower priced than vol 1). My copy is on order. E.J. Applewhite, Fuller's life-long collaborator, is very pleased with it, as the intro gets into the nuts and bolts of synergetics and even says some new things about it (i.e. it's not just a rehash). Also, this from Trevor (another Fuller scholar -- though he's studied many other topics in depth as well): ============================ Date: Wed, 14 Feb 2001 09:41:36 -0800 (PST) From: Trevor Blake Subject: World Game in Slashdot Buckminster Fuller, his World Game, the World Game Institute, the Dymaxion Air-Ocean Map, and Portland's own 4-D Solutions are mentioned in the remarkable online resource slashdot... http://slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=01/02/13/2153202&mode=thread ... slashdot is a reader-writen resource, and at times relies on enthusiasm over accuracy. By this I mean sometimes you read a very interesting story in a poorly-writen or shallowly-researched article. Slashdot is also at times overly convinced of the messianic powers of linux and open source, but - having said all that, I do read slashdot not once but several times a day and consider it much closer to 'news' than anything I could buy on the street corner. Plenty about computers, good bits on culture and science in general. - Trevor Blake ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 15 Feb 2001 22:47:15 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Kirby Urner Subject: Re: volume of tet/spherical tet In-Reply-To: <20010215230050.17920.qmail@web4402.mail.yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" You can define a spherical tetrahedron to have a volume 1 greater than a corresponding regular tetrahedron simply by fixing the radius to the necessary length (found by calculation). The synergetics constant to the 3rd power was developed as a way of considering XYZ and IVM volumes and how to go back and forth between them. One way is to call the distance between cube corners, along a face diagonal, 2. In the XYZ world, such a cube would have edges of root(2) and therefore a volume of root(2)^3. But in synergetics world, this is the volume 3 cube, ergo the constant of relationship is IVM:XYZ::3:root(2)^3 = ~1.06066 I'd have to reread the sections in Cosmography you're concerned about, but in general there's no discrepancy between the concentric hierarchy and regular XYZ cubism, other than what's taken as the base model of 3rd powering: the cube in the XYZ lattice ( = SCP), the tetrahedron in the IVM ( = CCP). Kirby At 03:00 PM 02/15/2001 -0800, you wrote: >A while back, I was pondering what appears to be >Bucky's understanding(pg 191?;Cosmog.) that the >spherical version of a vertexion is always one tetra >volume greater than the vertexion itself. I played >with the numbers but get hung when I get to the >synergetic constant deal. Am I correct in figuring >that using the tet as unit volume is different than >thinking in terms of 1/3 a cube as unit volume? I am >stuck. Kirby, I remember you said the points of a tet >would stick through a sphere of 2 unit volumes, yes? >Can anyone make this simple? > >Dick > ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 15 Feb 2001 23:06:05 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Kirby Urner Subject: Fwd: another fun post from the Math Forum In-Reply-To: <20010215230050.17920.qmail@web4402.mail.yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Subject: Pseudo-Education (progaganda against...) Author: Kirby Urner Date: 15 Feb 01 17:51:25 -0500 (EST) Thought I'd do some propaganda with a different spin, since the prejudice seems to so often be that USAers would be better off if their educations were better-bolstered by more traditional content from "the old country". Well, how about we question that prejudice and look at things a little differently for a change... ====================== The USA math curriculum is still awash in poor, structurally deficient memes imported from Europe. Most USA classrooms _still_ share nothing with students about Alexander Graham Bell's octet truss, nor Medal of Freedom winner Bucky Fuller's nesting of concentric polyhedra, which embeds therein. This is because so much of the USA teaching establishment overlaps the thralldom of European mediocrity, which is not only Malthusian in outlook, but woefully out of date in its approach to pedagogy. And so pseudo-education remains, for many unlucky students, the order of the day. Fortunately, the most forward-thinking intelligensia in Europe is ahead of the curve, as per usual. Thanks to superstar intellectuals like Anthony Judge, Joachim Krausse, and Claude Lictenstein, we won't be long for this world of inferior math teachers who learned everything they know from a tired (never wired) slate of European gurus. Before long, we'll have more freedom and democracy again. Nor will the USA chain of command be so enslaved to the NATO idiots who brought us that pseudo-war in the Balkans, which very nearly plunged us into a conflagration of record-breaking proportions. I'm encouraged that the USA network is once again asserting its independence and free will vis-a-vis Europe, and especially its religious hierarchies, which are unfit to govern in our pluralistic and free-of-organized-religion-dominated management (organized crime also has a hard time gaining a permanent foothold, although it's always making new inroads, oft times under the guise of perfectly legal-seeming businesses). The American Revolution was about creating a space wherein we could think freely and anew and not simply recreate the same European cultures all over again, with all their blindnesses and small-mindedness. Our success with this agenda is in part made possible by the peoples who were already here, with great traditions and ideas of their own. Many of these ideas lived on, even as whole generations and ways of life were wiped out by imported diseases and armaments. Kirby ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2001 11:02:03 -0600 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Tony Kalenak Subject: Re: BFVI Stats MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Dick, I so glad you responded to my post. I was thinking that I had become a ghost. I always remember the film clip of the young Fuller explaining his model of the Dymaxion Deployment Unit (maybe that is not the right term). I think Bucky liked to "promote" and generally discuss his ideas and artifacts. He was far from a retiring hermit and seemed to love the spotlight. Like most everyone, I think he changed over the course of his life. Later in his life, he seemed to focus more on the guiding principles and less on the artifacts. Anyway, that is what I gather from books and video and the one time I saw him. -Tony. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------ Okay Tony- I screwed up again. Is it the wrong word? Either that or Bucky lied. What do you call his claimings to only answer questions asked of him rather than trying to get disinterested people to listen to him? Non-solicitation? What I called non-promotional comes from his stated theory and practice of changing the environment through artifacts instead of trying to change peoples behavior through persuasion. Agreed, He was not a laid-back kind of man. Always on the move. Sleeping as little as possible. Doing everything He could to get the info out that there is plenty to go around, and all His other findings. What am I getting at? Help. Verbalality isn't my strength. Dick --- Tony Kalenak > wrote: > Yeah RIGHT ! > Bucky was a promoter almost without equal. > If only I had his drive and ego ! > > -Tony. ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2001 09:01:19 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Subject: Re: [adcomm] Observatory Site? Comments: To: Tetworld Global Advisory Committee MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Mark, Just about every spot in the US is covered by Microsoft's Terraserver. Let me know what you want to look at and I'll try to get a topo map and an aerial photo. Ref: http://terraserver.microsoft.com/ Also, the mapping services such as Mapblast & Mapquest sometimes come in handy. Joe S Moore: joemoore@cruzio.com Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute: http://www.cruzio.com/~joemoore/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mark Siegmund" To: "Tetworld Global Advisory Committee" Sent: Friday, February 16, 2001 6:15 AM Subject: Re: [adcomm] Observatory Site? > Tetworld Global Advisory Committee - http://www.tetworld.org > > Joe--you're some kind of Virtual Archivist! There are a number of closed > military bases that could be looked into--you know Rep. Kucinich is very > involved and committed to peace--I'm going to contact him. > > Thanks, > Mark ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2001 12:51:57 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: "Brent A. Verrill" Subject: Re: [adcomm] Observatory Site? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" I don't know if that's entirely true, Joe. Last I heard, it was a popular tourist destination run by National Parks Dept. (National Forestry Service?) It would be a cool location though. Brent At 12:06 PM 2/15/2001 -0800, you wrote: >Mark, > >Alcatraz Island (the former prison) in the middle of San Francisco Bay. It >is Federally owned land not presently being used for anything. > >Joe S Moore: joemoore@cruzio.com >Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute: http://www.cruzio.com/~joemoore/ > >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Mark Siegmund" >To: "Tetglobal" ; "Tetworld" ; >"Tetworld Advisory Committee" >Sent: Thursday, February 15, 2001 12:07 PM >Subject: [adcomm] Observatory Site? > > >> Tetworld Global Advisory Committee - http://www.tetworld.org >> >> Hi, I'm looking for ideas regarding the location for the >Observatory/Gaming >> Complex. >> >> Where in the world should it be located? Sri Lanka, Rome, Paris, Nairobi, >> New York, Sydney, Costa Rica....? >> >> Mark > ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2001 12:12:35 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Steve Sanow Subject: Re: [adcomm] Observatory Site? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit This is true... Been there, done that. You can view it live from a cam on the Exploratorium. http://events.exploratorium.edu/CAM2/index.html I use it as my startup page. Wish I was there (er, in SF, not in prison!). ----- Original Message ----- From: "Brent A. Verrill" Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic To: Sent: Friday, February 16, 2001 9:51 AM Subject: Re: [adcomm] Observatory Site? > I don't know if that's entirely true, Joe. Last I heard, it was a popular > tourist destination run by National Parks Dept. (National Forestry > Service?) It would be a cool location though. > > Brent > > At 12:06 PM 2/15/2001 -0800, you wrote: > >Mark, > > > >Alcatraz Island (the former prison) in the middle of San Francisco Bay. It > >is Federally owned land not presently being used for anything. > > > >Joe S Moore: joemoore@cruzio.com > >Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute: http://www.cruzio.com/~joemoore/ > > > >----- Original Message ----- > >From: "Mark Siegmund" > >To: "Tetglobal" ; "Tetworld" ; > >"Tetworld Advisory Committee" > >Sent: Thursday, February 15, 2001 12:07 PM > >Subject: [adcomm] Observatory Site? > > > > > >> Tetworld Global Advisory Committee - http://www.tetworld.org > >> > >> Hi, I'm looking for ideas regarding the location for the > >Observatory/Gaming > >> Complex. > >> > >> Where in the world should it be located? Sri Lanka, Rome, Paris, Nairobi, > >> New York, Sydney, Costa Rica....? > >> > >> Mark > > > > ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2001 10:23:25 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Kirby Urner Subject: Re: [Edu-sig] Active Essays Comments: To: Dethe Elza In-Reply-To: <011201c096fd$0cbd51c0$60294c18@poco1.bc.wave.home.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >When I struggled to read Bucky Fuller's Synergetics some years ago, >I found myself wishing for something very much like this. It's nice >to see some progress being made to incorporate executable code in >narrative streams to explain/explore complex subjects. > >--Dethe I agree, and forwarded the URL to a bevy of geometers I know, with credit to yourself: "Dethe on edu-sig (Python) clued me re this "active essay", which uses Java applets to make its points: http://el.www.media.mit.edu/groups/el/projects/emergence/index.html ..." As per synergetics and applets, you'll find an example on: http://www.teleport.com/~pdx4d/domegeo.html (source linked from http://www.teleport.com/~pdx4d/javafreq.html) Here's the first Java applet I ever put on the web (check boxes have a mind of their own unless you choose the 'manual' radio button first): http://www.teleport.com/~pdx4d/javavols.html There's also Javascript: http://www.teleport.com/~pdx4d/exhibit1.html http://www.teleport.com/~pdx4d/exhibit2.html And let's not forget my "spooky castle" jitterbug transformation at http://members.xoom.com/Urner/movies/ghostjit.mpg So far, I've only used Python + Povray or Python + VRML at my website. The idea of using Jython with Java3D is just an idea (for me). Nor have I done anything with Python + OpenGL (but plan to). The talented Mark Somers has done some of the most impressive Povray animations. I've you've got the time or fast connection, watch the animated GIF at: http://www.inetarena.com/~pdx4d/synergetica/gctrain.html Kirby ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2001 13:54:12 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Mark Siegmund Subject: FW: There are people at the Observatory! Comments: To: "Geodesic Listserve GEODESIC"@LISTSERV.ACSU.BUFFALO.EDU In-Reply-To: Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit ---------- > From: Mark Siegmund > Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2001 13:51:56 -0800 > To: Tetglobal , Tetworld , > Tetworld Advisory Committee > Subject: There are people at the Observatory! > > Hi, Please check out http://members.tripod.com/~Tetworld/center.html to view > the people working, visiting and "playing" at the Tetworld Earth Observatory. > > mark ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2001 18:21:44 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Steve Waterman Subject: live 3D graphics for watermans MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Kirby, i have recently been in contact with Martin Kraus, and he has written a conversion program. he takes the Python/Idle pov output for the waterman polys and then after conversion, uses Live 3D graphics. now all the polys up to root 100 can be rotated among other things. http://www.dsuper.net/%7Etinom/ph2000/wp1to13.html several other operations can be done to the figures... by using combos of the Ctrl , Shift, Caps lock and the mouse, the figures can even be altered from their original polyhedra shapes. ( smaller/bigger/get inside object/etc... ) ....unlimited variety ! and you can return to the original figure by hitting Home if you want, or it automatically happens whenever the page reloads. steve ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2001 15:46:52 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Mark Siegmund Subject: The International Journal of Humanities and Peace Comments: To: Ecol-Econ , Envtecsoc , Tetworld , Tetglobal , Tetworld Advisory Committee , "Geodesic Listserve GEODESIC"@LISTSERV.ACSU.BUFFALO.EDU, Peace , Peace Studies Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Hello, for those of you, who have written an article appearing in IJHP, Vol.16, No.1 2000 and have not as yet received your complimentary copy--you may now go to http://members.tripod.com/~Tetworld/ijhp2.html to view the cover for that volume and the Table of Contents. Thanks... Regards, Mark Siegmund Associate Editor IJHP http://www.ijhp.net ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2001 10:33:57 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Re: [adcomm] Observatory Site? <> Brian ¿Quincy! Hutchings 16-FEB-2001 10:33 r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us BEEN THERE, DONE THAT, MR. PRESIDENT As Chicago has learned through its repeated stabs at accountability, the main reason for school failure is that principals and teachers have not been trained and supported to meet the needs of low-income children. Bush's proposal for a short-term infusion of extra money at a failing school, bundled with the threat of losing funds, will do nothing to rectify this fundamental problem. Unlike other critiques of the President's plan this one is based upon observed experience, not ideology. http://www.catalyst-chicago.org/02-01/0201editors.htm LOCAL EDUCATION FUND RELEASES STATE OF EDUCATION REPORT This assessment of local schools by the Charlotte-Mecklenburg Education Foundation is a tale of two school systems, or three, or four. Some students do wonderfully well, others fail, and some are stuck in the middle. Averages can hide the success of top-ranked students and mask the plight of students at the bottom, both for the system and individual schools. The question in each instance is how does the school system do with students at each level, at each school. http://www.cmef.org/soper.htm USDA WANTS SCHOOLS TO DROP SODA, JUNK FOOD To cut down on the soda, snacks and sweets children are eating, the government wants to require that all food sold in schools meets nutrition standards. That could mean an end to soda machines in the hall and candy and cookie sales to buy band uniforms. The junk food that kids consume at school is contributing to obesity and other health problems, the Agriculture Department said in a report requested by Congress. http://www.fns.usda.gov/tn/Healthy/calltoaction.html LET THEM EAT TESTS In the name of "accountability," President Bush proposes to require every state to test all public school students in grades 3 - 8 every year in language arts and math in exchange for federal funds. Students in low-scoring schools which fail to post test-score gains over three years would be able to use their share of federal funds to attend other public or private schools. Other sanctions and rewards could be imposed on those schools. The threat of federal funding sanctions raises the stakes of these state tests. http://www.fairtest.org/nattest/Bush%20ExamWinter01.html SENATE PANEL LEAVES OUT VOUCHERS Bush has made education reform his first legislative priority, proposing initiatives that include giving $1,500 vouchers to parents of students in troubled public schools to help them send their children to private institutions and religious schools. Senate education committee leaders won't include President Bush's private school voucher plan in their education reform package, setting the stage for a battle on the Senate floor. http://washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A1630-2001Feb13.html SUBJECT: PEN Weekly NewsBlast for February 16, 2001 (Special President's MESSAGE from =PEN@PublicEducation.org 16-FEB-20 10:17 ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2001 10:36:07 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Re: [adcomm] Observatory Site? <> Brian ¿Quincy! Hutchings 16-FEB-2001 10:36 r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us TEACHERS ARE KEY, BUT HOW TO GET THEM IN THE WORST SCHOOLS? A study by the California Teachers Association shows a direct correlation between statewide test scores and factors such as credentialed teachers, student ethnicity, poverty and school overcrowding. So how do you get good teachers for the overcrowded, poor and minority schools that need them the most and are least likely to have them? http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/news/archive/2001/02/14/st ate20 43EST0258.DTL "HOLDING SCHOOLS ACCOUNTABLE" TOOLKIT This new toolkit offers a collection of ideas and tools from pioneering community-based efforts to hold schools accountable for student achievement. Its chapters cover getting organized and setting a vision, identifying standards and setting goals, gathering information, taking action, and evaluating your work. http://www.publicimpact.com/hsat PREDICTABLE LOSERS IN TESTING SCHEMES High-stakes tests are leaving schools and students consumed by a "cult of measurement." http://www.aasa.org/publications/sa/2000_12/sacks.htm $40 MILLION GRANT TO BAY AREA SCHOOL REFORM COLLABORATIVE One of the nation's Annenberg Challenge sites has received a $40 million vote of confidence from two major funders. The bulk of the new $40 million will be awarded to groups of K-12 public schools. Each Local Collaborative will contain an "anchor school" with a proven track record in reform; it will also include multiple schools new to reform, one or more school districts, and in some cases, other school- and youth-supporting organizations. http://basrc.wested.org/basrc/whatsnew/press.html#HA --The Duke of Enron! http://www.tarpley.net/bush8.htm ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2001 10:41:52 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Re: zero phase <> Brian ¿Quincy! Hutchings 16-FEB-2001 10:41 r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us sorry, where you put "p 191", I was thinking 191x, the year -- and thinking of Bucky's mystaque about the sphere being 5-tets big. thus saith: > Bucky's dicta about "no flat surfaces" etc., > are rather silly (Bert Russellian?) attempts > to get rid of undefinables, and not successful. > as a practical matter, > you could take a trigonal frame an wrap clear stuff around it, > and you'd certainly have a "pillow," > which could be inflated, as much as tolerances allowed (pffft); > any internal pressure will give you a curved surface!... > that still leaves the "plus inside and outside cells. > --The Thronburgh Doctrine! > > http://www.tarpley.net/bush24.htm ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2001 13:55:27 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Mark Siegmund Subject: Re: [adcomm] Observatory Site? In-Reply-To: <001a01c0983a$2847e7a0$b308fbcf@oemcomputer> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Joe, great! Mark > From: Joe S Moore > Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works > > Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic > Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2001 09:01:19 -0800 > To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.ACSU.BUFFALO.EDU > Subject: Re: [adcomm] Observatory Site? > > Mark, > > Just about every spot in the US is covered by Microsoft's Terraserver. Let > me know what you want to look at and I'll try to get a topo map and an > aerial photo. > > Ref: http://terraserver.microsoft.com/ > > Also, the mapping services such as Mapblast & Mapquest sometimes come in > handy. > > Joe S Moore: joemoore@cruzio.com > Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute: http://www.cruzio.com/~joemoore/ > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Mark Siegmund" > To: "Tetworld Global Advisory Committee" > Sent: Friday, February 16, 2001 6:15 AM > Subject: Re: [adcomm] Observatory Site? > > >> Tetworld Global Advisory Committee - http://www.tetworld.org >> >> Joe--you're some kind of Virtual Archivist! There are a number of closed >> military bases that could be looked into--you know Rep. Kucinich is very >> involved and committed to peace--I'm going to contact him. >> >> Thanks, >> Mark > ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2001 20:47:31 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Subject: Bucky Trading Card Comments: To: _DomeHomeList MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Color Bucky Fuller trading card currently available at Ebay! http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?MfcISAPICommand=ViewItem&item=11130 95676 Joe S Moore: joemoore@cruzio.com Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute: http://www.cruzio.com/~joemoore/ ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 17 Feb 2001 07:50:54 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Kirby Urner Subject: Re: live 3D graphics for watermans In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 06:21 PM 02/16/2001 -0500, you wrote: >Kirby, > >i have recently been in contact with Martin Kraus, >and he has written a conversion program. >he takes the Python/Idle pov output for the waterman >polys and then after conversion, uses Live 3D graphics. > Cool. Assuming Live3D = VRML. Live3D was a very good VRML browser that went away for Windows users (unless it's back -- SGI took it over after it changed its name to Cosmo as I recall). Kirby ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 17 Feb 2001 10:12:03 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Subject: Re: Help! Comments: To: Natymail@aol.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_001C_01C098CA.13147F20" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_001C_01C098CA.13147F20 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Nat, See http://www.cruzio.com/~joemoore/Index/Cheg-Cloc.htm (scroll down to "Cities") and http://www.cruzio.com/~joemoore/Index/Domes-C.htm Also, if you go to the bottom of my home page & do a search for = "cities", you should get 57 hits. Joe S Moore: joemoore@cruzio.com Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute: http://www.cruzio.com/~joemoore/ =20 ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Natymail@aol.com=20 To: joemoore@cruzio.com=20 Sent: Saturday, February 17, 2001 5:36 AM Subject: Help! I am writing an article on "Floating cities", possible migration to = the sea=20 in the thousands.=20 Have you got any information of ongoing projects or technical info. on = how=20 these cities may be constructed?=20 thanx,=20 Nat.=20 ------=_NextPart_000_001C_01C098CA.13147F20 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Nat,
 
See http://www.c= ruzio.com/~joemoore/Index/Cheg-Cloc.htm
(scroll down to = "Cities")=20 and
http://www.cru= zio.com/~joemoore/Index/Domes-C.htm
 
Also, if you go to = the bottom=20 of my home page & do a search for "cities", you should get 57=20 hits.

Joe S Moore: joemoore@cruzio.com
Buckminste= r Fuller=20 Virtual Institute: http://www.cruzio.com/~joemoore= /
 
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Natymail@aol.com=20
Sent: Saturday, February 17, = 2001 5:36=20 AM
Subject: Help!

I am = writing an article=20 on "Floating cities", possible migration to the sea
in the = thousands.=20

Have you got any information of ongoing projects or technical = info. on=20 how
these cities may be constructed?

thanx,
Nat.=20
------=_NextPart_000_001C_01C098CA.13147F20-- ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 17 Feb 2001 12:48:15 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dexter Graphic Subject: Satellite Map Shows Mankind Is Destroying The Earth MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Satellite Map Shows Mankind Is Destroying The Earth Steve Connor in San Francisco, 2-17-2001 http://www.independent.co.uk/news/UK/Environment/2001-02/satmap170201.shtml A new scientific picture of the world, showing how man has left an indelible mark on the planet that is visible from space, was published yesterday by scientists who warned that the Earth was undergoing an unprecedented transformation. The map, compiled from satellite images, shows almost a quarter of the Earth's surface has been entirely transformed, either by being covered overby roads and buildings or ploughed up for crops. Another quarter has been exploited to a lesser degree, but in a way that has completely altered its natural state. http://earthobservatory.nasa.gov/Observatory/Datasets/landcover.umd.html A rapidly growing human population, rising economic expectations, continual decline in natural resources and increasing pollution by industrialised countries are leading to a crisis of epic proportions. This stark warning is contained in a new atlas of the world showing how humans have had a devastating impact on the natural environment. The report, compiled by the American Association for the Advancement of Science (AAAS), was published on the opening day of its annual meeting in San Francisco. "We have become a force of nature comparable to volcanoes or to cyclical variations in the Earth's orbit," the report warns. "As we enter the third millennium, the destiny of the planet is in our hands as never before, yet they are inexperienced hands. We are modifying ecosystems and global systems faster than we can understand the changes and prepare responses to them." The main satellite map in the AAAS Atlas of Population and Environment shows the full extent of human influence. The swath of pink, denoting complete transformation, covers not only the developed world of North America and Europe, but vast areas of Asia and Africa. No continent except Antarctica is unscathed. "Humans are perhaps the most successful species in the history of life on Earth. From a few thousand individuals some 200,000 years ago, we passed 1 billion around 1800 and 6 billion in 1999. Our levels of consumption and the scope of our technologies have grown in parallel with, and in some ways outpaced, our numbers," the report says. "But our success is showing signs of overreaching itself, of threatening the key resources on which we depend. Today our impact on the planet has reached a truly massive scale. In many fields our ecological footprint outweighs the impact of all other living species combined. "We have transformed approximately half the land on Earth for our own uses -- around 11 per cent each for farming and forestry, and 26 per cent for pasture, with at least another 2 to 3 per cent for housing, industry, services and transport. The area used for growing crops has increased by almost six times since 1700, mainly at the expense of forest and woodland," the report says. Images from the Advanced Very High Resolution Radiometer satellite, operated by Nasa and the US Geological Survey, yielded the principal map on human transformation of the land, said Lars Bromley of the AAAS's Directorate for International Programs. "You can determine whether something is paved over, whether something is bare soil, a ploughed field, or whether it's normal land cover," Mr Bromley said. "You can detect a lot of the sources of pollutants, basically from the northern hemisphere. When people see the extent of the transformation they are surprised." Past attempts to estimate global land usehave been hindered by the lack of full geographical coverage, which is not a problem with a polar-orbiting satellite, Mr Bromley said. "By getting this eye-in-the-sky view you can prove that ... this cropland is far more extensive than anybody recognised." The atlas shows the extent to which soil erosion has affected a substantial part of the Earth's surface that has gone under cultivation and then been abandoned. "Worldwide, an estimated 12 million hectares of croplands fall out of use for this reason each year. Economists have estimated the value of this lost soil, in terms of nutrients and water-holding capacity, at about $400bn," the report says. Fresh water has also been degraded. "Chronic or acute water shortage is increasingly common in many countries with fast-growing populations, becoming a potential source of conflict," the report says. "The distribution of water resources around the globe is highly unequal ... Canada has more than 30 times as much water available to each citizen as China. "Today it is estimated that 31 countries with 8 per cent of the world's population mostly in Africa and the Middle East have water shortages. By 2025 the figure is likely to have risen to 48 countries and 35 per cent of population ... The crisis is likely to be worsened by the deteriorating quality of water, polluted by industrial wastes and sewage discharges, and spreading diseases such as cholera and schistosomiasis." The AAAS report concludes that humans have: * Regulated the flow of about two-thirds of all rivers on Earth, creating artificial lakes and altering the ecology of existing lakes and estuaries; * Fished two-thirds of marine fisheries to the limit or beyond and altered ecologies of many marine species. In 100 years we have destroyed half of coastal forests and irrevocably degraded a tenth of coral reefs; * Contributed 50 per cent more to the nitrogen cycle than all natural sources combined, leading to the impoverishment of forest soils and forest death, and at sea to the development of toxic algal blooms and expanding "dead zones" devoid of oxygen; * Released toxic metals into the biosphere through mining and processing that would otherwise have remained safely locked in stone; * Had an incalculable effect on biodiversity. The 484 animal and 654 plant species recorded as extinct since 1600 are only "the tip of a massive iceberg"; * Become a major force of evolution, not just for the "new" species we breed and genetically engineer, but for the thousands of species whose habitats we modify, consigning many to extinction. "In this unprecedented situation, the need to be fully aware of what we are doing has never been greater," the report says. "We need to understand the way in which population, consumption and technology create their impact, to review that impact across the most critical fields, and to find ways of using our understanding of the links to inform policy." ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 17 Feb 2001 08:03:43 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Re: [Q-P] FWD: California Electricity Crisis <> Brian ¿Quincy! Hutchings 17-FEB-2001 8:03 r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us on these "California" matters, the current *L.A. Weekly* has several drop-dead articles, which tend to promote DWP GM David Freeman toward heading of a state e-authority. the page of graphs, "Where'd the Windfalls, Go?" is priceless, and included the sum for the inaugural (just Reliant's $300K, along with its other expenditures, broken-out in a caption). the bio of Freeman is quite reassuring, in that, though the bigtime promoter of conservation and "renewables" (that is, anything but "fossils" from Obnoxico; they can sell everything else to us), he did not not mothball *every* nuke taht he came across (in NYC e.g.) the other news, in yesterday's Times, was most DYS heartening, and paints the picture --if read contextually-- of Canada and Mexico gouging and being gouged, respectively, more or less. Canada (like the LA DWP, a-hem) is making big bucks in natural gas, now, althogh the dereg has hit home in Alberta, supposedly with a backlash. Mexico actually gets some e from us, although we get oil from them, and some gas, but with Fox having given Pemex to the head of Mexico Dupont, that nation is about to lose its shirt to the Fwee Mawket. (Fox even "privatized" the selection of his Cabinet, to some crazed consulting firm.) thus quoth: "Bush is helping out his buddies at the expense of every consumer in California, and his refusal to cap wholesale prices is threatening to wreak havoc on the entire western region of the United States." the real joke is that Gore'd have been any different, along with Nader and his slightly nore-explicit greenyness; recall, a British conglomerate has been your #1 dystrivutor of "petrol" since April! --The Duke of Enron! http://www.tarpley.net/bush8.htm ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 17 Feb 2001 08:12:19 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Re: [Q-P] Climate change <> Brian ¿Quincy! Hutchings 17-FEB-2001 8:12 r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us some corrections: the xeroxed publication from Hamaker's co-author, with his great Comments as well as a compendium of recent climate/enviro stuff --this was years ago-- was call the Solar Age or Ice Age Bulletin. the org that was quoted from was, the Tree War Assembly, and it was from a meeting of the NSF, no the AAAS -- and it was not Roger Revell, who has done a lot of stuff on currents and ice, I recall, but it was Oliver "Buck" Revelle. *now*, do you recognize this infamous name? the fabulous Butterfly Effect is a horrible joke. it refers, though, to butterflies flying *in concert*, and not just to San Juan Capistrano. unfortunately, as often as not, they tend to fly against the coriolis -- not well-trained lepidopterae! kidding. it really refers to the inherent choas of the floating-point hardware & siftware -- duh! --The Duke of Oil! http://www/tarpley.net/bushb.htm ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 17 Feb 2001 15:40:31 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Kirby Urner Subject: Re: live 3D graphics for watermans In-Reply-To: <3.0.3.32.20010217075054.00b58de0@pop3.norton.antivirus> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >Cool. Assuming Live3D = VRML. Live3D was a very >good VRML browser that went away for Windows users >(unless it's back -- SGI took it over after it >changed its name to Cosmo as I recall). > >Kirby > No wait, I was wrong. LiveGraphics3D is not Live3D. But I'm glad you reminded me of Live3D the VRML browser, as I found CosmoPlayer (a later name for it) is back online (available for download) courtesy of Computer Associates. I like what Martin Kraus has done and think that'd be a useful output format to have in general for polyhedra (Watermans included). I'll plan to add that as an option, along with VRML (keeping the existing Povray of course). I'd like to redo some of my existing concentric hierarchy graphics using the same LiveGraphics3D approach. I'm also redoing Watermans as objects which can be combined and output together, so we can look at more than one at a time, in the same view. This involves making the W class a subclass of my Polyhedron class, and writing more generic utilities. Kirby ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 17 Feb 2001 19:12:41 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Steve Waterman Subject: W subclass MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Kirby, you wrote... >I'm also redoing Watermans as objects which can be >combined and output together, so we can look at more >than one at a time, in the same view. this sounds very interesting. >This involves >making the W class a subclass of my Polyhedron class, >and writing more generic utilities. and this even sounds more encouraging. steve ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 17 Feb 2001 10:37:42 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Re: Spouting off re Napster etc. <> Brian ¿Quincy! Hutchings 17-FEB-2001 10:37 r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us oops. <> Brian ?Quincy! Hutchings 17-FEB-2001 10:30 r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us the parable of the Loafing Fishes (the fishing loaves?) not- withstanding, if kids were able to sing *a la bel canto*, alone or in groups, would they really need these DVDs, so badly? thus quoth: The problem for Grunch is that even if "artists" can be trained to buy in to the selfish model (all their lip synching "band aid" concerts for the hungry notwithstanding), some in the engineering community have more integrity, and will persist in challenging scarcity wherever it is artificially created. There's enough scarcity of real Obnoxico has almost tsken over the USA's e-gen, with the predictable happenstance that Canada's making big bucks off of it; *o* save Betty Dos! > --The Duke of Enron! http://www/tarpley.net/bushb.htm ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 17 Feb 2001 22:15:33 -0400 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Mike & Coreen Subject: Souce for Hubs/Connectors? Hi All, I am wanting to build a small shed initially from 2 x 4 lumber, and then maybe move on to a full scale house (2x6 or 2x8's) at some point in the future. I have searched the Web extensively w/o success for a metal hub that will accept wooden struts! Anyone help? Thanks Mike Smith NB, Canada ---------------------- Michael, Coreen & Corey Smith 271 Smith Rd Waterville-Sunbury, NB Canada E2V 3V6 Coreen is an Orchid and Plant fanatic http://www.geocities.com/RainForest/Vines/2174/ Mike is a Radio Fanatic http://members.tripod.com/~ve9aa/index.html Corey loves music boxes & TV. ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 17 Feb 2001 23:17:40 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Kirby Urner Subject: Re: W subclass In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 07:12 PM 02/17/2001 -0500, you wrote: >Kirby, > >you wrote... > >>I'm also redoing Watermans as objects which can be >>combined and output together, so we can look at more >>than one at a time, in the same view. > > this sounds very interesting. Here's a preview: shows W11 inside W24 http://www.inetarena.com/~pdx4d/ocn/graphics/cp11_24.gif Kirby ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 18 Feb 2001 08:37:27 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Steve Waterman Subject: some other examples of W duals MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Kirby, >>>I'm also redoing Watermans as objects which can be >>>combined and output together, so we can look at more >>>than one at a time, in the same view. >> > > this sounds very interesting. >Here's a preview: shows W11 inside W24 >http://www.inetarena.com/~pdx4d/ocn/graphics/cp11_24.gif last week, i tried to do a couple of these ( duals ) manually... http://www.dsuper.net/%7Etinom/ph2000/duals.html my initial choices were to see what duals appeared like when their root values are close together...in these 2 examples, i have re-colored the 2d surfaces to white for the first example, and then i left them clear for the second example. steve . ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 18 Feb 2001 08:19:26 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Kirby Urner Subject: Re: some other examples of W duals In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > last week, i tried to do a couple of these ( duals ) manually... > > http://www.dsuper.net/%7Etinom/ph2000/duals.html Those are good. I need to work on my technique. Kirby ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 18 Feb 2001 10:28:40 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Subject: Re: Souce for Hubs/Connectors? Comments: cc: _DomeHomeList MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Mike, See http://www.cruzio.com/~joemoore/Index/DomeManuf-S.htm The Starplate system is probably what you're looking for. Stromberg's is probably the only place that you can get them. Joe S Moore: joemoore@cruzio.com Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute: http://www.cruzio.com/~joemoore/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mike & Coreen" Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic To: Sent: Saturday, February 17, 2001 6:15 PM Subject: Souce for Hubs/Connectors? > Hi All, > > I am wanting to build a small shed initially from 2 x 4 lumber, and then maybe move on to a full > scale house (2x6 or 2x8's) at some point in the future. I have searched the Web extensively w/o > success for a metal hub that will accept wooden struts! > Anyone help? > > Thanks > > Mike Smith > NB, Canada > ---------------------- > Michael, Coreen & Corey Smith > 271 Smith Rd > Waterville-Sunbury, NB > Canada E2V 3V6 > Coreen is an Orchid and Plant fanatic > http://www.geocities.com/RainForest/Vines/2174/ > Mike is a Radio Fanatic > http://members.tripod.com/~ve9aa/index.html > Corey loves music boxes & TV. ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 18 Feb 2001 18:50:58 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Subject: Fw: something for everyone MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Joe S Moore: joemoore@cruzio.com Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute: http://www.cruzio.com/~joemoore/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "The DomeHome List" To: Sent: Sunday, February 18, 2001 1:00 PM Subject: something for everyone > Date: 2/17/01 11:07 PM > From: Trout, mpowell@mho.net > > This is directed to those "lurkers" who may not be too interested in > all the theory or philosopies (?) that get passed on here, but rather > simple Dome talk. There's a Dome site on yahoo that there's about 50 > people who write about biulding, living and want to live in Domes. > the addy is http://clubs.yahoo.com/clubs/geodesicdomehomes > > you post a msg and someone replys maybe this is closer to what you > are interested in.. > > just a thought... > > Mike > > > > o > ===== The DomeHome Email List > ========== Web: http://www.domegroup.org > ============= Send posts to: DomeHome-H@h19.hoflin.com > =============== To unsubscribe, write: unsubscribe DomeHome-H > ================ and send to this address: requests@h19.hoflin.com > > > ** subscribe/unsubscribe to this list (under DOG LISTS) and subscribe to > DOME at http://www.hoflin.com > > ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2001 06:56:28 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Mark Siegmund Subject: Re: something for everyone In-Reply-To: <002201c09a1e$e3f5b140$8608fbcf@oemcomputer> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Speaking of domes--Fuller style--anybody know of a company able to build one 400' in diameter? mark > From: Joe S Moore > Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works > > Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic > Date: Sun, 18 Feb 2001 18:50:58 -0800 > To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.ACSU.BUFFALO.EDU > Subject: Fw: something for everyone > > Joe S Moore: joemoore@cruzio.com > Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute: http://www.cruzio.com/~joemoore/ > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "The DomeHome List" > To: > Sent: Sunday, February 18, 2001 1:00 PM > Subject: something for everyone > > >> Date: 2/17/01 11:07 PM >> From: Trout, mpowell@mho.net >> >> This is directed to those "lurkers" who may not be too interested in >> all the theory or philosopies (?) that get passed on here, but rather >> simple Dome talk. There's a Dome site on yahoo that there's about 50 >> people who write about biulding, living and want to live in Domes. >> the addy is http://clubs.yahoo.com/clubs/geodesicdomehomes >> >> you post a msg and someone replys maybe this is closer to what you >> are interested in.. >> >> just a thought... >> >> Mike >> >> >> >> o >> ===== The DomeHome Email List >> ========== Web: http://www.domegroup.org >> ============= Send posts to: DomeHome-H@h19.hoflin.com >> =============== To unsubscribe, write: unsubscribe DomeHome-H >> ================ and send to this address: requests@h19.hoflin.com >> >> >> ** subscribe/unsubscribe to this list (under DOG LISTS) and subscribe to >> DOME at http://www.hoflin.com >> >> > ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2001 09:04:59 -0600 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Tony Kalenak Subject: Re: something for everyone MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain How about TEMCOR ? -----Original Message----- From: Mark Siegmund [SMTP:siegmund@THEGRID.NET] Sent: Monday, February 19, 2001 8:56 AM To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.ACSU.BUFFALO.EDU Subject: Re: something for everyone Speaking of domes--Fuller style--anybody know of a company able to build one 400' in diameter? mark > From: Joe S Moore > Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works > > Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic > Date: Sun, 18 Feb 2001 18:50:58 -0800 > To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.ACSU.BUFFALO.EDU > Subject: Fw: something for everyone > > Joe S Moore: joemoore@cruzio.com > Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute: http://www.cruzio.com/~joemoore/ > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "The DomeHome List" > To: > Sent: Sunday, February 18, 2001 1:00 PM > Subject: something for everyone > > >> Date: 2/17/01 11:07 PM >> From: Trout, mpowell@mho.net >> >> This is directed to those "lurkers" who may not be too interested in >> all the theory or philosopies (?) that get passed on here, but rather >> simple Dome talk. There's a Dome site on yahoo that there's about 50 >> people who write about biulding, living and want to live in Domes. >> the addy is http://clubs.yahoo.com/clubs/geodesicdomehomes >> >> you post a msg and someone replys maybe this is closer to what you >> are interested in.. >> >> just a thought... >> >> Mike >> >> >> >> o >> ===== The DomeHome Email List >> ========== Web: http://www.domegroup.org >> ============= Send posts to: DomeHome-H@h19.hoflin.com >> =============== To unsubscribe, write: unsubscribe DomeHome-H >> ================ and send to this address: requests@h19.hoflin.com >> >> >> ** subscribe/unsubscribe to this list (under DOG LISTS) and subscribe to >> DOME at http://www.hoflin.com >> >> > ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2001 07:09:52 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Subject: Re: something for everyone Comments: cc: _DomeHomeList MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Mark, Temcor claims that they can build domes of 1,000' (300 meters) in diameter. http://www.temcor.com/profile.html Here is a chart of the history of domes (courtesy of Takenaka Corp): http://www.takenaka.co.jp/takenaka_e/dome_e/history/tech/table.html Joe S Moore: joemoore@cruzio.com Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute: http://www.cruzio.com/~joemoore/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mark Siegmund" Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic To: Sent: Monday, February 19, 2001 6:56 AM Subject: Re: something for everyone > Speaking of domes--Fuller style--anybody know of a company able to build one > 400' in diameter? > > mark ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2001 10:15:29 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Subject: Starplate Dealer Comments: cc: _DomeHomeList MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Starplate connectors for sale at Stromberg's: http://www.strombergschickens.com/catalog/aviarys/aviary_supply.htm#framewor k Joe S Moore: joemoore@cruzio.com Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute: http://www.cruzio.com/~joemoore/ ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2001 10:20:26 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Subject: Atlas shows man's 'footprint' on the planet Comments: cc: Tetworld Global Advisory Committee MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit New atlas of human impact on Earth: http://news.bbc.co.uk/low/english/in_depth/sci_tech/2001/san_francisco/newsi d_1172000/1172896.stm Joe S Moore: joemoore@cruzio.com Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute: http://www.cruzio.com/~joemoore/ ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2001 10:41:54 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Re: volume of tet/spherical tet In-Reply-To: <3.0.3.32.20010215224715.00b5a9a0@pop3.norton.antivirus> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii --- Kirby Urner wrote: > You can define a spherical tetrahedron to have > a volume 1 greater than a corresponding regular > tetrahedron simply by fixing the radius to the > necessary length (found by calculation). > Kirby-Will you please give me an example for this? I am still bewildered. Thank. Dick ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2001 11:15:15 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Re: Satellite Map Shows Mankind Is The Earth In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii > A rapidly growing human population, rising economic > expectations, > continual decline in natural resources and > increasing pollution > by industrialised countries are leading to a crisis > of epic > proportions. > > Hey- Dex- Yes, no one can see the future. However, since this is a discussion group for and about the ideas of Bucky, I would like to emphasize that our problems are solvable through CADS artifacts. Or at least, that is why I am here. This assumes that we don't blow ourselves to smithereens. Change the environment by building livingry, and people will behave in more and more health ways. It is a waste of time to try to convince people to act differently. Evolution/Nature is operating here, not one-system-is-better-than-another. Also, you quote very much material that you have already linked. And a reminder, that Grunch(uncle sam,pope, and lawcap) will always fight CADS because it spells their death. Dick ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2001 11:18:38 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Re: something for everyone In-Reply-To: <001601c09a86$186f0cc0$1708fbcf@oemcomputer> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii > > > Speaking of domes--Fuller style--anybody know of a > company able to build > one > > 400' in diameter? > > > > mark Also, monolithic domes are enclosing more and more space. They do weight a heck of a lot, though. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2001 11:43:15 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Re: Spouting off re Napster etc. In-Reply-To: <3.0.3.32.20010213140130.009d0910@pop3.norton.antivirus> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Kirby writes; > > There's a lot of lip-service about helping the > developing > world, but if this were sincere, then the ability to > clone digital assets for universal access would be > hailed > as a humanitarian breakthrough. But when push comes > to > shove, most organized religion is mute on the issue, > getting behind lawyer-capitalism's drive to make it > a > criminal act to propagate these assets. Church > music is > intellectual property, after all. Much better to > keep > doling out charity in guilt-assuaging dollops, > keeping > the poor impoverished, than allowing these people > the > freedom and independence which real wealth affords. > > You hear that it's the right of the creator of > intellectual > assets to control how they're used, but why is this > so? You've mentioned the 'me first award' before. And I agree that it is silly, if my ego is engaged. I lean toward the idea that Bucky had regarding patents, at least, he did at one time. (I am working on making my language more presice) He said, in effect, that had he not receice the patents, few would have heard of him. So, there is this value in claiming authorship. I think that the patent process is a bit of a intellectual review, which gives some amount of credibility to an idea. I will repeat myself here. The intitutions of power in our time, the government, the church, and the bank, will fight CADS because it denies them the scarcity required for their suvival. Nothing new. Dick ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2001 12:55:53 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dexter Graphic Subject: Bucky's patents (was RE: Spouting off re Napster etc.) In-Reply-To: <20010219194315.11816.qmail@web4404.mail.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > ...the idea that Bucky had regarding patents, ... > He said, in effect, that had he not receive the > patents, few would have heard of him. Do companies that build domes have to pay Bucky's estate a fee every time they build one? How do his design patents effect our socio-economic word? Dexter ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2001 13:17:10 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dexter Graphic Subject: Software patents MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0007_01C09A76.441D6750" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0007_01C09A76.441D6750 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Here is an example of how patents are used in the software industry. Essentially big corporations want to collect a fee every time some uses one of their ideas. Did you know that GIF image technology is licensed by CompuServe and MP3 music compression by some consortium in Germany? Every user of these technologies must pay fees to the patent holders. this is just the tip of the iceberg; there are literally thousands of these kinds software patents in existence. Small software developers without big money and lots of legal clout behind them are left walking through a minefield of possible lawsuits. Amazon's "one click ordering" and Symantec's "incremental file update" are just two blatant examples of this insanity. Did you know that a few years ago Comptons tried to sue competitors because it had "invented" the idea of on electronic encyclopedia?! Only consumer outrage got them to back down. Time to boycott Symantec and Amazon? Patenting software is about as stupid as licensing words and phrases -- imagine the nightmare of writing a letter or news article if you had to apply for permission to use certain word combinations and then had to pay a fee for every copy of your letter or article read! That's how mind damaging and creativity destroying software patents are. Dexter Symantec reveals software-updating patents http://news.excite.com/news/zd/010208/09/symantec-reveals-software-updating Updated 9:14 AM ET February 8, 2001 by Robert Lemos, ZDNet News The company is attempting to apply the patents covering its method for updating virus software to the antivirus industry and also to the software industry as a whole. Security-software maker Symantec on Wednesday notified rivals that it owns a pair of patents covering its method for updating virus software and definitions incrementally. It was unclear why Symantec waited until now to reveal the patents, which were granted last year. A representative at rival McAfee said McAfee had not known of the patents and is looking into the matter. The patents guard a key component of Symantec's Norton AntiVirus 5.0, 2000, and 2001 products, which the company calls its "microdefinition system" and which allows data that is updated frequently to be efficiently patched. "When there is a lot of content that has to be updated regularly, this can be handy," said Carey Nachenberg, chief researcher for the Symantec AntiVirus Research Center and one of the patent holders. "When you have so many updates, it is unaffordable and inefficient to post thousands or millions of patches." The debate over software and business patents has heated up over the last 18 months. In October 1999, online bookseller Amazon.com sued rival Barnes & Noble for infringing on its patent on buying books with a single click of the mouse. Later, Amazon grabbed patents for a recommendation service and an affiliate program. Then, Amazon CEO Jeff Bezos and Tim O'Reilly, Amazon's most influential critic and the founder of technical publisher O'Reilly & Associates, helped form a service that offers rewards for evidence that a patented technology had been used prior to the date the company filed its patent. The Symantec patents are for Multi-tiered Incremental Software Updating and Backtracked Incremental Updating. According to the company, the ability to update virus definitions and software a piece at a time can result in smaller downloads--sometimes up to 90 percent smaller. That means the company's LiveUpdate software can run up to four times faster than if it had to download the full virus definition. Software industry standard? Symantec is not only attempting to apply the patents to the antivirus industry but also to the software industry as a whole. In its statement Wednesday, the company noted that "the technology may be used to update general computer readable files, which may include data files, program files, database files, graphics files, or audio files." Yet incremental updates have been around for a long time, most likely for longer than the Internet has been around. Software companies that need to fix buggy applications would rather not force people to download an entire new program. They'd rather enable customers to download a small update. Nachenberg said such software updating is old hat, but the way Symantec does its updates is different. ------=_NextPart_000_0007_01C09A76.441D6750 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Here = is an example=20 of how patents are used in the software industry. Essentially big = corporations=20 want to collect a fee every time some uses one of their ideas. Did you = know that=20 GIF image technology is licensed by CompuServe and MP3 music compression = by some=20 consortium in Germany? Every user of these technologies must pay fees to = the=20 patent holders. this is just the tip of the iceberg; there are literally = thousands of these kinds software patents in existence. Small = software=20 developers without big money and lots of legal clout behind them are = left=20 walking through a minefield of possible lawsuits. Amazon's "one click = ordering"=20 and Symantec's "incremental file update" are just two blatant examples = of this=20 insanity. Did you know that a few years ago Comptons tried to sue = competitors=20 because it had "invented" the idea of on electronic encyclopedia?! Only = consumer=20 outrage got them to back down.
 
Time to boycott Symantec and Amazon? =
 
Patenting software is about as stupid as licensing words and = phrases=20 -- imagine the nightmare of writing a letter or news article if you had = to apply=20 for permission to use certain word combinations and then had to pay a = fee for=20 every copy of your letter or article read! That's how mind damaging and=20 creativity destroying software patents are.
 
Dexter
 

Symantec reveals software-updating=20 patents 
http://news.excite.com/news/zd/010208/09/symantec-reveals-softwa= re-updating

Updated 9:14 AM ET February 8, 2001
by = Robert Lemos,=20 ZDNet News

The company is attempting to = apply the=20 patents covering its method for updating virus software to the antivirus = industry and also to the software industry as a=20 whole.

Security-software maker Symantec on Wednesday = notified=20 rivals that it owns a pair of patents covering its method for updating = virus=20 software and definitions incrementally.

It was unclear why = Symantec=20 waited until now to reveal the patents, which were granted last year. A=20 representative at rival McAfee said McAfee had not known of the patents = and is=20 looking into the matter.

The patents guard a key component of = Symantec's=20 Norton AntiVirus 5.0, 2000, and 2001 products, which the company calls = its=20 "microdefinition system" and which allows data that is updated = frequently to be=20 efficiently patched.

"When there is a lot of content that has to = be=20 updated regularly, this can be handy," said Carey Nachenberg, chief = researcher=20 for the Symantec AntiVirus Research Center and one of the patent = holders. "When=20 you have so many updates, it is unaffordable and inefficient to post = thousands=20 or millions of patches."

The debate over software and business = patents=20 has heated up over the last 18 months.

In = October=20 1999, online bookseller Amazon.com sued rival Barnes & Noble for = infringing=20 on its patent on buying books with a single click of the mouse. Later, = Amazon=20 grabbed patents for a recommendation service and an affiliate program.=20 Then, Amazon CEO Jeff Bezos and Tim O'Reilly, Amazon's most = influential=20 critic and the founder of technical publisher O'Reilly & Associates, = helped=20 form a service that offers rewards for evidence that a patented = technology had=20 been used prior to the date the company filed its patent.

The = Symantec=20 patents are for Multi-tiered Incremental Software Updating and = Backtracked=20 Incremental Updating.

According to the company, the ability to = update=20 virus definitions and software a piece at a time can result in smaller=20 downloads--sometimes up to 90 percent smaller. That means the company's=20 LiveUpdate software can run up to four times faster than if it had to = download=20 the full virus definition.

Software = industry=20 standard? Symantec is not only attempting to apply the patents to the = antivirus=20 industry but also to the software industry as a whole. In its statement=20 Wednesday, the company noted that "the technology may be used to update = general=20 computer readable files, which may include data files, program files, = database=20 files, graphics files, or audio files."

Yet incremental = updates=20 have been around for a long time, most likely for longer than the = Internet has=20 been around.

Software companies that need to fix buggy = applications would=20 rather not force people to download an entire new program. They'd rather = enable=20 customers to download a small update.

Nachenberg said such = software=20 updating is old hat, but the way Symantec does its updates is=20 different.

------=_NextPart_000_0007_01C09A76.441D6750-- ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2001 14:17:27 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dexter Graphic Subject: Human Nature / Laws of Nature (was RE: Satellite Map Shows Mankind Is The Earth) In-Reply-To: <20010219191515.8317.qmail@web4404.mail.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > Hey- Dex- Yes, no one can see the future. However, > since this is a discussion group for and about the > ideas of Bucky, I would like to emphasize that our > problems are solvable through CADS artifacts. Or at > least, that is why I am here. This assumes that we > don't blow ourselves to smithereens. Check your assumptions. See the last paragraph below. > Change the environment by building livingry, and > people will behave in more and more health ways. It > is a waste of time to try to convince people to act > differently. Fuller's livingry is based on industrial production which requires a world-around socio-economic effort. This was temporarily produced by war-mentality but the only lasting way to unify all of humankind is by universal-family-mentality. > Evolution/Nature is operating here, not > one-system-is-better-than-another. What happens to bacteria in a petri dish when they have consumed all the easy sugary fuel provide them? It's called die-off and that's exactly what will happen to humanity sometime in the next 50 years. Scroll down to the section on OVERSHOOT at http://208.240.253.224/page135.htm Also read the Olduvai Gorge Theory at http://www.dieoff.com/page224.htm > And a reminder, that Grunch (uncle sam, pope, and > lawcap) will always fight CADS because it spells > their death. Their death is inevitable (as is any system based on the denial of reality) and that's why they will use their weapons of mass destruction to blow us all to smithereens as you say. Remember, they live for death -- exploitation and killingry is their livelihood. They hate truth, beauty, and goodness. Dexter Graphic ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2001 16:06:12 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Kirby Urner Subject: Re: Bucky's patents (was RE: Spouting off re Napster etc.) In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >Do companies that build domes have to pay Bucky's >estate a fee every time they build one? How do his >design patents effect our socio-economic word? > >Dexter The dome patents have expired. Kirby ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2001 16:20:58 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Kirby Urner Subject: Another preview: VRML views of Watermans In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Steve et al -- I've made some progress outputting to VRML, which is what I originally thought you meant when you mentioned Live3D. Live3D was a VRML plug-in for Netscape which then turned into CosmoPlayer -- I think is how it went. CosmoPlayer was great, but then SGI bought it and the Windows version disappeared. After you posted about Live3D, my memory was triggered and I went searching, and found: http://www.cai.com/cosmo/ At first, the download feature didn't work, but when I put in my email address, but not my name, it did. So I've got CosmoPlayer back on my computer, which I think I prefer it to Cortona (which is what I'd been using -- Cortona is actually quite good). Anyway, if you've got the capability to view VRML files (called "worlds" -- the come with the .wrl file extension), you might want to check out W11 and W24 at: http://www.inetarena.com/~pdx4d/ocn/worlds/wm11.wrl http://www.inetarena.com/~pdx4d/ocn/worlds/wm24.wrl I've taken a screen shot of what this looks like on my computer (making the window less than full-screen, to cut down on the size of the graphic): http://www.inetarena.com/~pdx4d/ocn/graphics/vrmlview.gif This is similar to what you get with LiveGraphics3D, except a VRML plug-in has more power (works better on more powerful computers too). That doesn't mean the LiveGraphics3D format is redundant -- looks like a very useful utility. My next project will be to try outputting in that format (.m) as well. The source code for doing the above isn't available to the public yet, as I'm still working on making it easier to use and relatively bug free. I'll upload it to the net later, when it's finished. Kirby ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2001 16:38:05 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Kirby Urner Subject: Re: volume of tet/spherical tet In-Reply-To: <20010219184154.15706.qmail@web4403.mail.yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >Kirby-Will you please give me an example for this? I >am still bewildered. Thank. > >Dick > We want a sphere of volume 2 vis-a-vis a tetrahedron of volume 1. (4/3)pi r^3 * syn3 = 2 where syn3 = sqrt(9/8) Solving for r: I get r = ~0.7663991982 Kirby ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2001 19:59:58 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dexter Graphic Subject: Re: Bucky's patents In-Reply-To: <3.0.3.32.20010219160612.009dbca0@pop3.norton.antivirus> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > >Do companies that build domes have to pay Bucky's > >estate a fee every time they build one? How do his > >design patents effect our socio-economic word? > > > >Dexter > > The dome patents have expired. > > Kirby If Bucky had started a corporation would it have been able to renew them? Or do engineering patents simply expire after a certain period of time? -Dexter ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2001 23:55:16 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Mark Siegmund Subject: Re: something for everyone In-Reply-To: <2F175DC588EFD211B37C0060088FAC39186B02@pscserver3> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Thanks Tony > From: Tony Kalenak > Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works > > Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic > Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2001 09:04:59 -0600 > To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.ACSU.BUFFALO.EDU > Subject: Re: something for everyone > > How about TEMCOR ? > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Mark Siegmund [SMTP:siegmund@THEGRID.NET] > Sent: Monday, February 19, 2001 8:56 AM > To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.ACSU.BUFFALO.EDU > Subject: Re: something for everyone > > Speaking of domes--Fuller style--anybody know of a company able to > build one > 400' in diameter? > > mark > >> From: Joe S Moore >> Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works >> >> Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic >> Date: Sun, 18 Feb 2001 18:50:58 -0800 >> To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.ACSU.BUFFALO.EDU >> Subject: Fw: something for everyone >> >> Joe S Moore: joemoore@cruzio.com >> Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute: > http://www.cruzio.com/~joemoore/ >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "The DomeHome List" >> To: >> Sent: Sunday, February 18, 2001 1:00 PM >> Subject: something for everyone >> >> >>> Date: 2/17/01 11:07 PM >>> From: Trout, mpowell@mho.net >>> >>> This is directed to those "lurkers" who may not be too interested > in >>> all the theory or philosopies (?) that get passed on here, but > rather >>> simple Dome talk. There's a Dome site on yahoo that there's about > 50 >>> people who write about biulding, living and want to live in > Domes. >>> the addy is http://clubs.yahoo.com/clubs/geodesicdomehomes >>> >>> you post a msg and someone replys maybe this is closer to what > you >>> are interested in.. >>> >>> just a thought... >>> >>> Mike >>> >>> >>> >>> o >>> ===== The DomeHome Email List >>> ========== Web: http://www.domegroup.org >>> ============= Send posts to: DomeHome-H@h19.hoflin.com >>> =============== To unsubscribe, write: unsubscribe DomeHome-H >>> ================ and send to this address: > requests@h19.hoflin.com >>> >>> >>> ** subscribe/unsubscribe to this list (under DOG LISTS) and > subscribe to >>> DOME at http://www.hoflin.com >>> >>> >> > ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2001 23:45:17 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Kirby Urner Subject: Re: Bucky's patents In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >If Bucky had started a corporation would it have been >able to renew them? Or do engineering patents simply >expire after a certain period of time? -Dexter > I'm no patent lawyer, but my understanding is ALL patents expire after a set time. Kirby ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2001 23:54:35 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Mark Siegmund Subject: Re: something for everyone In-Reply-To: <001601c09a86$186f0cc0$1708fbcf@oemcomputer> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Thanks much Joe > From: Joe S Moore > Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works > > Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic > Date: Mon, 19 Feb 2001 07:09:52 -0800 > To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.ACSU.BUFFALO.EDU > Subject: Re: something for everyone > > Mark, > > Temcor claims that they can build domes of 1,000' (300 meters) in diameter. > http://www.temcor.com/profile.html > > Here is a chart of the history of domes (courtesy of Takenaka Corp): > http://www.takenaka.co.jp/takenaka_e/dome_e/history/tech/table.html > > Joe S Moore: joemoore@cruzio.com > Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute: http://www.cruzio.com/~joemoore/ > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Mark Siegmund" > Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic > To: > Sent: Monday, February 19, 2001 6:56 AM > Subject: Re: something for everyone > > >> Speaking of domes--Fuller style--anybody know of a company able to build > one >> 400' in diameter? >> >> mark > ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 09:40:45 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Re: volume of tet/spherical tet In-Reply-To: <3.0.3.32.20010219163805.00ab3dd0@pop3.norton.antivirus> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii --- Kirby Urner wrote: > >Kirby-Will you please give me an example for this? > I > >am still bewildered. Thank. > > > >Dick > > > > We want a sphere of volume 2 vis-a-vis a tetrahedron > of > volume 1. > > (4/3)pi r^3 * syn3 = 2 where syn3 = sqrt(9/8) > > Solving for r: > > I get r = ~0.7663991982 > > Kirby Are the vertexes of the tet all touching the sphere? ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 10:00:09 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Re: Human Nature / Laws of Nature (was RE: Satellite Map Shows Mankind Is The Earth) In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii cut- > > > Change the environment by building livingry, and > > people will behave in more and more health ways. > It > > is a waste of time to try to convince people to > act > > differently. > > Fuller's livingry is based on industrial production > which requires a world-around socio-economic effort. > This was temporarily produced by war-mentality but > the only lasting way to unify all of humankind is by > universal-family-mentality. Industrial production capability is _not_ Grunch. Two different ideas. I disagree with your statement about how to proceed. I think it says exactly what Bucky said not to waste your time with. > > Evolution/Nature is operating here, not > > one-system-is-better-than-another. > > What happens to bacteria in a petri dish when they > have consumed all the easy sugary fuel provide them? > > It's called die-off and that's exactly what will > happen to humanity sometime in the next 50 years. You are using a Malthusian metaphor here it seems to me. There is no shortages. We are not running out of energy income. The universe is not running down. I do not see any connection between what you are talking about and Bucky's solution of eternally doing more with less, and thus getting with Nature's program. General Plenty. ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 12:28:16 -0600 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Tony Kalenak Subject: Re: Human Nature / Laws of Nature (was RE: Satellite Map Shows Ma nkind Is The Earth) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Dick, I think you are right in pointing us back to one of Bucky's main thrusts. We have the ability to make humanity a success by doing progressively more with less; using our energy income (not our savings) and stop holding on to the piano tops (stop-gap solutions) hastily adopted by our technological forbearers and politicians. Humanity will be forced onto the right track, if it doesn't initially make the "right" technological choices (or destroy itself first). Having artifacts available which promote humanities growth in a positive direction was Fullers thrust (especially in his later years). It is the most humane form of technology. By making these alternative/positive technologies available, as our stored energy and raw material resources dwindle and become more costly, we can direct humanities growth/behaviors in a genuinely healthy and sustainable direction. This, I believe, should be the goal of those aspiring to take Fuller's design and technology initiatives forward,. -Tony. http:\\environmentalvalving.cjb.net -----Original Message----- From: Dick Fischbeck [SMTP:dick_fischbeck@YAHOO.COM] Sent: Tuesday, February 20, 2001 12:00 PM To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.ACSU.BUFFALO.EDU Subject: Re: Human Nature / Laws of Nature (was RE: Satellite Map Shows Mankind Is The Earth) cut- > > > Change the environment by building livingry, and > > people will behave in more and more health ways. > It > > is a waste of time to try to convince people to > act > > differently. > > Fuller's livingry is based on industrial production > which requires a world-around socio-economic effort. > This was temporarily produced by war-mentality but > the only lasting way to unify all of humankind is by > universal-family-mentality. Industrial production capability is _not_ Grunch. Two different ideas. I disagree with your statement about how to proceed. I think it says exactly what Bucky said not to waste your time with. > > Evolution/Nature is operating here, not > > one-system-is-better-than-another. > > What happens to bacteria in a petri dish when they > have consumed all the easy sugary fuel provide them? > > It's called die-off and that's exactly what will > happen to humanity sometime in the next 50 years. You are using a Malthusian metaphor here it seems to me. There is no shortages. We are not running out of energy income. The universe is not running down. I do not see any connection between what you are talking about and Bucky's solution of eternally doing more with less, and thus getting with Nature's program. General Plenty. ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 10:31:17 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Re: zero phase In-Reply-To: <200102152009.f1FK9s804566@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii --- Brian Hutchings wrote: > <> Brian ¿Quincy! Hutchings > 15-FEB-2001 12:09 > r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us > > no way in Hell (or any other chi-chi resort) > am I going to use the awful "-vertexion" last-gasp > (but > we can always blame it on Kuromoya .-) What was that other name you had, astor or something. I want to find the best word that we can to name "vertexion." Using the number of vertexes of a system is the most economical way to distinguish one system from another. Areas/openings and relationships/edges are always equal to or greater in quantity than vertexes, right? > yes, the triangle is special, but > I don't see any reason in giving it its own > geekology; > thus, Trigon. (the matter of naming polyhedra, > alternately, > after their vertices (with the numbering of their > duals), > however, is a great breakthrough; > we can argue about the proper terms, though !-) Triaster, 3-aster oK? Biaster, 2-aster, uniaster, 1-aster. Dis-aster(smash-up) :) Yes, yes, let's agree on terms for this. Dictionary splice: ster-3 Important derivatives are: star, stellar, constellation, aster, asterisk, asteroid, disaster. Star. Suffixed form *ster-s-. star, from Old English steorra, star, from Germanic *sterzn-. Suffixed form *str-l-. stellar, stellate; constellation, from Latin stlla, star. Oldest root form *ster-. aster, asteriated, asterisk, asterism, asteroid, astral, astro-; astraphobia, disaster, from Greek astr, star, with its derivative astron, star, and possible compound astrap, asterop, lightning, twinkling (< “looking like a star”; ps, stem op-, eye, appearance; see okw-). Esther, from Persian sitareh, star, from Iranian stem *str-. > on the wayside, > I see the bigon as enumerated > with 2 edges and 2 facets in cigar conformation, > neccesarily curved (for at least the purposed of a > diagram) > or just coincident: 2+2=2+2 -- > who needed four? The biaster has only one relationship/edge, not two. The bow, as in bow and arrow, might work along side cigar and football as a model. 2+1=1+2 The 1-aster, (uniaster) model is the hydrogen atom with proton as aster, or the balloon with knot as aster, or the black hole with singularity as aster. The uniaster has no relationships, but still has a face, or field. 1+1=0+2 The zero-aster is the equilibrium state through which we turn inside-out. Somebody has to explain asterion turning in-side out! ;>) > --The Thronburgh Doctrine! > > http://www.tarpley.net/bush24.htm ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 10:54:13 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Kirby Urner Subject: Re: volume of tet/spherical tet In-Reply-To: <20010220174045.6938.qmail@web4402.mail.yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >Are the vertexes of the tet all touching the sphere? > No. The "nice" relationship you're looking for doesn't exist, nor do I think a close reading of 'Cosmography' gives any hope either. Kirby ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 11:52:22 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Mark Siegmund Subject: Re: Human Nature / Laws of Nature (was RE: Satellite Map Shows Ma nkind Is The Earth) In-Reply-To: <2F175DC588EFD211B37C0060088FAC39186B0E@pscserver3> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Glad to see this thread... Mark Siegmund http://www.tetworld.org > From: Tony Kalenak > Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works > > Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic > Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 12:28:16 -0600 > To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.ACSU.BUFFALO.EDU > Subject: Re: Human Nature / Laws of Nature (was RE: Satellite Map Shows Ma > nkind Is The Earth) > > Dick, > I think you are right in pointing us back to one of Bucky's main thrusts. We > have the ability to make humanity a success by doing progressively more with > less; using our energy income (not our savings) and stop holding on to the > piano tops (stop-gap solutions) hastily adopted by our technological > forbearers and politicians. > > Humanity will be forced onto the right track, if it doesn't initially make > the "right" technological choices (or destroy itself first). Having > artifacts available which promote humanities growth in a positive direction > was Fullers thrust (especially in his later years). It is the most humane > form of technology. By making these alternative/positive technologies > available, as our stored energy and raw material resources dwindle and > become more costly, we can direct humanities growth/behaviors in a genuinely > healthy and sustainable direction. > > This, I believe, should be the goal of those aspiring to take Fuller's > design and technology initiatives forward,. > > -Tony. > > > > http:\\environmentalvalving.cjb.net > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Dick Fischbeck [SMTP:dick_fischbeck@YAHOO.COM] > Sent: Tuesday, February 20, 2001 12:00 PM > To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.ACSU.BUFFALO.EDU > Subject: Re: Human Nature / Laws of Nature (was RE: Satellite > Map Shows Mankind Is The Earth) > > cut- >> >>> Change the environment by building livingry, and >>> people will behave in more and more health ways. >> It >>> is a waste of time to try to convince people to >> act >>> differently. >> >> Fuller's livingry is based on industrial production >> which requires a world-around socio-economic effort. >> This was temporarily produced by war-mentality but >> the only lasting way to unify all of humankind is by >> universal-family-mentality. > > Industrial production capability is _not_ Grunch. Two > different ideas. I disagree with your statement about > how to proceed. I think it says exactly what Bucky > said not to waste your time with. > > > >>> Evolution/Nature is operating here, not >>> one-system-is-better-than-another. >> >> What happens to bacteria in a petri dish when they >> have consumed all the easy sugary fuel provide them? >> >> It's called die-off and that's exactly what will >> happen to humanity sometime in the next 50 years. > > You are using a Malthusian metaphor here it seems to > me. There is no shortages. We are not running out of > energy income. The universe is not running down. I do > not see any connection between what you are talking > about and Bucky's solution of eternally doing more > with less, and thus getting with Nature's program. > General Plenty. > ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 14:46:29 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Steve Waterman Subject: another way to sub-divide ? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Kirby, i propose that it may be useful to employ an additional method to sub-divide tets ( and square based pyramids )... as i understand it, roughly speaking, the present method basically uses the central point of a tet to sub-divide into different shaped modules/shapes. ............................................................................ ............. i quite recently noticed that an interesting coincidence that occurs. that physically, both the tet and the square based pyramid, of edge 1, can both be sub-divided into smaller (edges 1/2) tets and square based pyramids. perhaps this is well known, i really have no idea....whether or not it is already known, that does not really matter... a square based pyramid can be sub-divided into... 4 tets ...1/16 original volume each 6 square based pyramids....1/8 original volume each a tet can be sub-divided into... 4 tets....1/8 original volume each 2 square based pyramids....1/4 original volume each as i see it then, this would allow for a "hierarchy" either up or down. or perhaps even a "fractal" approach could be applied graphically ? steve ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 05:37:55 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Re: volume of tet/spherical tet <> Brian ¿Quincy! Hutchings 20-FEB-2001 5:37 r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us this is a rather arbitrary factor, that you asked-for; you tell us, what relation it has with the sphere! otherwise, it makes a lot more sense to nest shapes in certain ways, and find their resulting rations; dig? they are quite intersting! thus qutoh: > We want a sphere of volume 2 vis-a-vis a tetrahedron > of > volume 1. > > (4/3)pi r^3 * syn3 = 2 where syn3 = sqrt(9/8) > > Solving for r: > > I get r = ~0.7663991982 > > Kirby Are the vertexes of the tet all touching the sphere? --The Duke of Enron! http://www.tarpley.net/bushb.htm ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 12:45:06 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Re: volume of tet/spherical tet In-Reply-To: <3.0.3.32.20010220105413.009d76c0@pop3.norton.antivirus> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Do you have the formula for the radius of the tet? The oct? and icos? --- Kirby Urner wrote: > >Are the vertexes of the tet all touching the > sphere? > > > > No. The "nice" relationship you're looking for > doesn't > exist, nor do I think a close reading of > 'Cosmography' > gives any hope either. > > Kirby ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 09:39:46 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Re: volume of tet/spherical tet <> Brian ¿Quincy! Hutchings 20-FEB-2001 9:39 r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us this is the gigantic problem of Fuller's work. he assumes this stuff as sort-of "given," and never looked at how it was that he was shown some of it in Milton Academy, possibly because he never really realized it -- but he worked it all out, later, on his own, and by ingoring the duals, and so on (which is exemplary, but only *an* example .-) this is also the problem, I'm sure, that I have with this list; most of the listers seem not to have even a crude "beginning course," which was really true of my public education, as well. that is to say, this stuff is very "elementary" to configure, and we should not have to tell you "the formula" (and you sure as Hell are not getting much out of Kepler's "watershed" of scientific dyscovery, if you leave it at Newton's (stolen) *reductio ad algebra* of the "inverse square LAW," so-called.=; theese things are definitively inter-related, and thus a paart of a "liberal arts" or "Classical" education. I always recommend the book, _Modern Pure Solid Geometry_ by Altshiller-Court, but it has to be supplemented with compass-constructions (which are found in his book of planar geometry, _College Geometry_ .-) about the only place that consturctions are implcit --well, obviously in building domes and models, which I am not knocking-- is in that thing with the diameters in _S_. thus quoth: Do you have the formula for the radius of the tet? The oct? and icos? --The Duke of Enron! http://www.tarpley.net/bushb.htm ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 09:58:26 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Re: another way to sub-divide ? <> Brian ¿Quincy! Hutchings 20-FEB-2001 9:58 r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us despite appearances, it _is_ narrowly constructed, then someone well, Steve, there's a limit to the number of times you can divide the shapes into *conguent* (or mirrored) parts; I can't tell, but it looks like your cuttings are not "there," yet -- at leat not fractally. (I can see, how a pyramid divides into 4 tilted ones, though, and also how a tet can divide into 4 "LCDs" o'Bucky.) have you spoken with anyone about your various theories? --The Duke of Enron! http://www.tarpley.net/bushb.htm ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 10:11:26 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Re: [Q-P] Two sides to every story? <> Brian ¿Quincy! Hutchings 20-FEB-2001 10:11 r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us thus quoth: > despite appearances, it _is_ narrowly constructed, then someone yes, the UNIPCC has benn winnowed-out of dysconsensuals, over the years (it started out of the DuPont sudden conversion, following its hostile take-over by the Bronfmans, into "hole theory," which is a misnomer on its face; it's the souther polar night-time vortex, which breaks-up in spring, when the sun "rises" o'er the pole) since the Montral Protocols (now, those of "the elders of Kyoto"). the shocking thing is the belief that the oil cartels have no stake in these things, which one might believe, if a British conglomerate were not the USA's #1 seller of "fossils" since April! here's the guy that's made the most sense (along with the reference to doctr S.Fred Singer): Good science reporting shows that there is some evidence for recent increases in global temperatures at the surface and low altitude, but that for reasons which are completely unknown, the data shows no corresponding increase at higher elevations. Good science reporting also states that there have been past episodes of global warming which appear to be more dramatic than the current episode. Further, solid science writing would go into the issue of climatic variability over less than geologic time frames. Finally, the continued debate over anthropogenic causes for temperature changes would be treated in a balanced fashion. Above and beyond all the ongoing and very serious disagreements on what the data is and what the data means, a good article on the subject would show how people may be both harmed and helped should the current trend continue. >--The Duke of Enron! >http://www.tarpley.net/bushb.htm ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 20:38:03 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Steve Waterman Subject: visual depictions needed MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Brian,. >(I can see, how a [square based] pyramid divides into 4 tilted ones, though, and >also how a tet can divide into 4 "LCDs" o'Bucky.) i do not believe that this is what i am referring to. i will need to make some visual depictions to better show this... SBP (edge 1)...subs into 6 sbp + 4 tet ( all edge 1/2 ) TET (edge 1)...subs into 2 sbp + 4 tet ( all edge 1/2 ) but for now at least, i will try a verbal description.... imagine if you take four square based pyramids and place onto a table, forming a square. you can then place an octet so that it rests in the middle of the bottom four. giving 6 total square base pyramid. the 4 tets are the spaces between the octet and any one of the four pyramids on the table surface. for the tet, imagine 3 tets forming a triangular base.... ( leaving an empty center triangle in the base ) and a fourth tet gets supported by the 3 apex of the base tets. what remains then is an octet....or 2 square based pyramids. i shall try to make a visual depiction of this soon....or find some existing material that might be employed to highlight this conjecture. >have you spoken with anyone about your various theories? yes, numerous meetings and in various fields over the last dozen years or so. i have a multi-hour scheduled meeting on Friday with a professor emeritus of Chemistry at McGill and 5 grad students. i am to give presentation and to discuss my conjectures regarding the linking of sphere packing to the Lyman wavelengths and other physical constants, among quite a few other Physics theories. steve ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 18:30:51 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Subject: Re: The URL you gave me is not working for me. Comments: To: Lamont Mohammed MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lamont, BFI's web address is now http://www.bfi.org/ Joe S Moore: joemoore@cruzio.com Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute: http://www.cruzio.com/~joemoore/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lamont Mohammed" To: "Joe S. Moore" Sent: Tuesday, February 20, 2001 1:26 PM Subject: The URL you gave me is not working for me. > > --- "Joe S. Moore" wrote: > > Lamont, > > > > The Buckminster Fuller Institute sells all of > > Bucky's books. Check out > > their web site at http://www.critpath.org/bfi/ . > > Ask them for a copy of > > their latest catalog and newsletter. > > ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 22:08:10 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Kirby Urner Subject: Re: volume of tet/spherical tet In-Reply-To: <20010220204506.29041.qmail@web4406.mail.yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 12:45 PM 02/20/2001 -0800, you wrote: >Do you have the formula for the radius of the tet? The >oct? and icos? Radius means from center to vertex, or center to face-center or...? Kirby ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 22:15:36 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Kirby Urner Subject: Re: another way to sub-divide ? In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >tets and square based pyramids. perhaps this is well known, I think so, yes. > 4 tets....1/8 original volume each > 2 square based pyramids....1/4 original volume each > Here's a picture: mostly people just say "octahedron" and don't bother with "2 square based pyramids" (takes longer to type). Anyway... http://www.rwgrayprojects.com/synergetics/s01/figs/f00416.html Kirby ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2001 10:06:33 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Steve Waterman Subject: SBP subs MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Kirby, regarding tetrahedrons and SBP sub-divisions.... >> 4 tets....1/8 original volume each >> 2 square based pyramids....1/4 original volume each >> >Here's a picture: mostly people just say "octahedron" >and don't bother with "2 square based pyramids" (takes >longer to type). Anyway... >http://www.rwgrayprojects.com/synergetics/s01/figs/f00416.html yes, these images for the tet are what i was visualizing. perhaps not the best visual for the SBP....but, if you took just the top two rows of this construction... http://www.rogersconnection.com/Gallery-GT1.html yields... 6 SBP + 4 TETS. steve ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2001 10:06:57 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Re: volume of tet/spherical tet In-Reply-To: <200102201739.f1KHdkJ27482@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii --- Brian Hutchings wrote: > <> Brian ¿Quincy! Hutchings > 20-FEB-2001 9:39 > r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us > > this is the gigantic problem of Fuller's work. > he assumes this stuff as sort-of "given," and > never looked at how it was that he was shown some > of it in Milton Academy, possibly because he never > really realized it > -- but he worked it all out, later, on his own, and > by ingoring the duals, and so on (which is > exemplary, but > only *an* example .-) > this is also the problem, I'm sure, that I have > with this list; most of the listers seem not > to have even a crude "beginning course," > which was really true of my public education, as > well. > > that is to say, > this stuff is very "elementary" to configure, and > we should not have to tell you "the formula" (and > you sure as Hell are not getting much out > of Kepler's "watershed" of scientific dyscovery, if > you leave it at Newton's (stolen) *reductio ad > algebra* > of the "inverse square LAW," so-called.=; > theese things are definitively inter-related, and > thus a paart of a "liberal arts" or "Classical" > education. > I always recommend the book, > _Modern Pure Solid Geometry_ by Altshiller-Court, > but > it has to be supplemented with > compass-constructions > (which are found in his book of planar geometry, > _College Geometry_ .-) > > about the only place that consturctions are implcit > --well, obviously in building domes and models, > which I am not knocking-- > is in that thing with the diameters in _S_. > > thus quoth: > Do you have the formula for the radius of the tet? > The > oct? and icos? > > --The Duke of Enron! > http://www.tarpley.net/bushb.htm ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2001 10:11:43 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Re: volume of tet/spherical tet In-Reply-To: <200102201739.f1KHdkJ27482@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii > that is to say, > this stuff is very "elementary" to configure, and > we should not have to tell you "the formula" (and > you sure as Hell are not getting much out > of Kepler's "watershed" of scientific dyscovery, if > you leave it at Newton's (stolen) *reductio ad > algebra* > of the "inverse square LAW," so-called.=; > theese things are definitively inter-related, and > thus a paart of a "liberal arts" or "Classical" > education. > I always recommend the book, > _Modern Pure Solid Geometry_ by Altshiller-Court, > but > it has to be supplemented with > compass-constructions > (which are found in his book of planar geometry, > _College Geometry_ .-) > > about the only place that consturctions are implcit > --well, obviously in building domes and models, > which I am not knocking-- > is in that thing with the diameters in _S_. > > thus quoth: > Do you have the formula for the radius of the tet? > The > oct? and icos? > --The Duke of Enron! > http://www.tarpley.net/bushb.ht Should I apologize for asking? You sound annoyed. Dare to be naive. I can go look it up. What do you think Bucky is saying on p.191(cosmog.) Dick ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2001 10:14:23 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Re: volume of tet/spherical tet In-Reply-To: <3.0.3.32.20010220220810.00900d90@pop3.norton.antivirus> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii --- Kirby Urner wrote: > At 12:45 PM 02/20/2001 -0800, you wrote: > >Do you have the formula for the radius of the tet? > The > >oct? and icos? > > Radius means from center to vertex, or center to > face-center or...? > > Kirby Center to vertex , edge and face. ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2001 10:28:30 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Re: volume of tet/spherical tet In-Reply-To: <200102201739.f1KHdkJ27482@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii > > that is to say, > this stuff is very "elementary" to configure, and > we should not have to tell you "the formula" Brian Who is we? What if I had said, "Does anyone have the formula handy, please?" This group is for all, where ever someone is mathematically, digitally, verbally, etc. What is your problem? Someone's intuitive abilities has nothing to do with their achievement in formal education. On the other hand, maybe you were thinking I am lazy? Or have I misread you completely. Dick ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2001 11:20:34 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Tension Comments: To: Melinda South Comments: cc: aftbq@uaa.alaska.edu, mike@uskh.com, jfarley@daibba.com, rclancaster@email.msn.com, hatch@r2h.com, peterhabib@baynet.net, mrkattan@awalnet.net, sabijit@vsnl.com, z@zdomes.com In-Reply-To: <3A80801B.60488BA9@monolithic.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Someplace along the line there must have been an event or series of events that led to the commonly held belief that monolithic domes are not geodesic domes. They are. The sooner those interested in generally-spherical-structures get back together on this understanding, the sooner we can synergetically proceed. Bucky included the thin-shell, three-way grid-of-steel tensile-strength rebar embodiment in patent #3,197,927 because it is a geodesic structure. As in all structures, compression and tension balance each other. As lighter and lighter materials replace the concrete and steel(such as graphite foam and rods), these presently-heavy shells will become know as geodesic-tensegrity structures, which is somewhat difficult to see at the present. Dick Fischbeck dick_fischbeck@yahoo.com --- Melinda South wrote: > Dear Dick: > > Here is a list of engineers who are familiar with > concrete thin shells. > Feel free to contact them for more information for > your questions. > > http://www.domebuilders.com/engineers/index.html > > Sincerely, > > David B. South, President > DBS/ms Hubdome for dick_fischbeck@yahoo.com Yahoo! - My Yahoo! Options - Sign Out - Help Mail Addresses Calendar Notepad as attachmentinline text Download Attachments Prev | Next | Hubdome - Choose Folder -[New Folder]InboxCool StuffFriendscosmicaccountingkirby and brianrenee and simonsaved stuff Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 14:10:50 -0600 From: Melinda South | Block address | Add to Address Book Organization: Monolithic Dome Institute To: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Re: Geodesic]] Dear Dick: Unfortunately I don't have the engineering background needed to argue about the forces in a structure. I can refer you to some engineers that can, but surface it to say that the concrete is the main structure of a thin shell. The rebar is there for the temperature control and for tension in the very lowest parts of the shell. In reality when they design a dome, most of the dome could be built without any rebar. The rebar serves other function and tension. The structure is in compression throughout most of the surface. I like your lapping of plywood over each other to make the ply dome. I think it great. I am delighted for you and what you are doing. Again, unfortunately I don't have time to deal with the little domes. I am working on large structures. The little domes are so tremendously strong when built out of concrete that there is no need of fussing which way the rebar is going. In the extremely large domes we no longer have the direction of the rebar, we have to worry about ribs. So, consequently the rebar falls out of that equation also, except as it applies to the ribs. Again, I congratulate you on your grasp of the situation. There is very little doubt in my mind that if we were trying to ultimately load a Monolithic dome that we may have to get real serious about rebar placement, but where we are only using 10 percent of it strength anyway, why bother. Sincerely, David B. South, President DBS/kh Dick Fischbeck wrote: > > David - I will stop asking questions if they are not > relevant. Let me know. > > First, can I share your ideas with others? > > Last, my geodesic dome has no "struts". Like the > plydome, it is self-strutting. As the number of > vertexes in a sphere or dome increases, so do the > number of edges/relationships/vectors/struts(all > equivalent). There is no difference between a shell > and an icosahedron except for the number of vertexes, > edges and faces. Omni-triangulation is the secret of > your domes. Energy moves through all structures most > efficiently, or geodesically. I challenge you( in a > friendly way) to prove to yourself that a two-way grid > of tension elements is as effective as a three-way > grid. I guarantee you the three-way is superior and > will be showing up in shell structures around the > world soon if not already. I predict that you will use > a three-way grid eventually because it will be > stronger and cheaper. > > Is there some reason for you to oppose a geodesic > explanation of the success of Monolithic? > > I can also visualize using interlapping circles of > rebar. Have you thought of that? > > Dick Fischbeck > > --- Melinda South wrote: > > Dear Dick: > > > > Typo. All forces was what was meant. When we put > > pressure on a > > Monolithic Dome it travels outward from the point > > in a circular patter > > as ripples in a pond. > > > > The Geodesic forces travel down the struts to the > > nodes. > > > > Sincerely, > > > > David B. South, President > > DBS/ms > > > > Monolithic Dome Institute > > president@monolithic.com > > > > > > > > Melinda South wrote: > > > > > > -------- Original Message -------- > > > Subject: Re: Geodesic > > > Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 09:48:07 -0800 (PST) > > > From: Dick Fischbeck > > > To: Melinda South > > > > > > --- Melinda South wrote: > > > > Dear David, > > > > > > > > Under no conditions can you consider a > > Monolithic > > > > dome as a geodesic > > > > dome. A geodesic dome is a polyhedra of many > > sizes > > > > and the Monolithic > > > > is a shell. All sources are handled totally > > > > different in these two > > > > structures. > > > > > > > What did you mean by sources here? Do you mean > > > manufacturers > > > > > > Dick Fischbeck ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2001 04:31:44 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Re: volume of tet/spherical tet <> Brian ¿Quincy! Hutchings 21-FEB-2001 4:31 r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us well, there is not a formula per se, although there are tons o'formulae!... I was looking at a great, new book at the store, _What is Mathematics, Really_ by R.Hirsch; it's great even if it completley miscomprehends the contrast between Plato and his naughty student, Aristotle, and erects the main part of the usual canon of Newton-Descartes-etc. ad vomitorium. if, as I did not in my ninth-grade geometry class, you didn't do the constructions with the "theorem-proof lattice," then you wouldn't see how simple it is to derive these measures, which amount to little-more than "dropping perpendiculars" from the centers (of vertices, edges, facets and gravity); that is, using a compass, mentally, of *circular action*, which defines second-roots and first-root ("rational") constructions (they can be done without straightedge, if you don't mind imagining the "straight circles" between the crossing-points of the compass' arcs .-) perhaps your grade-school geometry is a matter of some trauma (heh-heh). thus quoth: problem? Someone's intuitive abilities has nothing to anyway, I was stating *my* problem with this group, not theirs!... all that *they* ahve to do, is get a sub to *21st C.Science & Technology*, along with a few books from our bookstore -- say, the last volume of Euclid (by Heath from Dover), which contains the best part, the "14th Book," which is actually by Hypsicles. I don't know where Euclid lies in the "schools," if not just Scholastic, because he did bring it all together, I guess. anyway, start with that next-to-last Book, and you can dig into the details of the planar stuff, at your leisure (if any .-) --The Duke of Enron! http://www.tarpley.net/bush8.htm ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2001 11:32:57 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Re: volume of tet/spherical tet In-Reply-To: <200102211231.f1LCViY31874@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii > I guess. anyway, > start with that next-to-last Book, and > you can dig into the details of the planar stuff, > at your leisure (if any .-) > > --The Duke of Enron! > http://www.tarpley.net/bush8.htm You know, I am a bit lazy, I guess. Sometimes I want to take the short cut. But, I still would like you incite of p.191. And what about the unigon? bigon, digon, triaster, 100-aster, all that. Dick ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2001 11:39:56 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Kirby Urner Subject: Fwd: Bucky's Everything I Know (EIK) in RealAudio on web In-Reply-To: <20010221182830.21779.qmail@web4402.mail.yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" From: Jimoriset@aol.com Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 17:17:47 EST Subject: fluidiom: EIK Bucky Fans, Y'all might enjoy looking at some sample web pages of Bucky's Everything I Know 42 Hour session in 1975. For a brief time it's available at www.jimoriset.com/eikx Cheers! ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2001 11:57:41 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: spectrum MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Kirby or anyone, I was thinking that the waterman sphere might be the zero-phase of the nucleus. Say I have u-238. The nucleus is that many sphere's packed in dynamic closest packing(like a swarm of bee's). Waterman's would be the closest together those protons and nutrons could be, but would never stay put, always moving. But might be related to electron orbits. So, the outer most electron's orbit could be determined by this waterman diameter. And this outer, lowest energy electron is responsible for the bright spectral line which is the signature of every element. I wonder if there is a connection here. Dick ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2001 05:13:22 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Re: [Q-P] Panels of experts and the like <> Brian ¿Quincy! Hutchings 21-FEB-2001 5:13 r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us well, talk about partially overlapping, nonsimultaneous scenarios! the talk of the supposed monolithicity of "the scientific community," whose funding biases have been just-noted by others, is alike with the supposition that funding from oilcos automatically makes one into the target of an ad-hominem argumentarium ... well, you know what I mean. I did not know taht doctor S.Fred Singer was an astrophysicist, because I only knew of him from climate stuff, and his intersting, other credentials. those credentials went completely unmentioned in a ridiculous cover-article on "Das Hole unt der Ozonosphere" in *Popular Science* (then, a Times-Mirror co.; now, perhaps owned by Tribune Co.), in which the three *modellers* of the future (of the climate) were given a collage of their pictures, as if they were gods, and Singer's was like a (bad) mug-shot. I hate the Moony Times, as a political operation (it's basically handed-out, free, to folks on the Hill, to keep the scandals in high gear), but you can't just dyscount an author or reporter, because he's paid by it. (keep-up the attacks on Sir George, though, who got plenty o'dough into the G2KCmte. by this means !-) now, the fact that the IPCC reports have no indices, I did not know, either, because I've only looked at (not read, much) some of the executive summaries, since those are what most executives are reading. however, it is entirely dysingenuous of the UNIPCC to do this, even if it took a 110% of the volume to do it: what could be more important, than being able to track your own past work (and the work of the others, who have since moved-on, for whatever good or rotten reason) ??... what, exactly, is the provenance of this assertion about "the index," and is there actually one, in there, some where? and, "Sinerites," or at least Singer, looks at other things than record as compiled by the IPCC; such as the US Climate Reference Network, a dataset of 28 rural weather-stations (those that are, yet, rural, in the Continental USA .-) as always, one must look at the *anomolies* to dyscern what is going on, some of which have just been reiterated. a good example was the fatuous coverage of receding glaciers in the NYT, a day or two ago (pA1). I mean, the guy had set his instrument up in the ice, the year before, and was PO'd because it fell-over the next year -- a whole year of data, up the wazoo!... there are vague assertions about how Kilinajaro had been surveyed in 1912, so competely; well, how completely? --The Duke of Enron! http://www.tarpley.net ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2001 12:51:56 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: radius via tau MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Icosahedron Edge length 2 tau (tau=sqrt5+1/2) V-radius=2tau E-radius=1 F-radius=sqrt(6+5tau)/3 Well, this is something, though not what I thought it would be. ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2001 13:04:16 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: radius MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Tetrahedron: e3 * sqrt(2)/12 Cube: e3 Octahedron: e3 * sqrt(2)/3 Dodecahedron: e3 * (15+7*sqrt(5))/4 Icosahedron: e3 * (15+5*sqrt(5))/12 These are cubical v-radius formulas, I guess. Pretty messy. ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 07:54:44 +1100 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Alex Peart Subject: unsubscribe Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed _________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2001 13:13:11 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: radius MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Poly, Edge Length,F-radius, V-radius, C-Angle, Volume Edge =1 Tetrahedron 2.8284 0.5774 1.7321 109.47 0.11785 Cube 1.4142 0.7071 1.2247 70.53 1.00000 Octahedron 2 0.8165 1.4142 90 0.47140 Dodecahedron 0.7639 0.8507 1.0705 41.82 7.66312 Icosahedron 1.2361 0.9342 1.1756 63.43 2.18170 Now, this is not tetrahedral unit-volume figuring. That is what I want to understand. Dick ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2001 14:53:11 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: place MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Is this the place to find Fuller scholars? In all the world, there must be at least fifty people that understand synergetics and tensegrity, and I am looking for them. Am I there? ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2001 16:55:23 -0600 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Tony Kalenak Subject: Re: place MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain You have been here long enough to know that. -----Original Message----- From: Dick Fischbeck [SMTP:dick_fischbeck@YAHOO.COM] Sent: Wednesday, February 21, 2001 4:53 PM To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.ACSU.BUFFALO.EDU Subject: place Is this the place to find Fuller scholars? In all the world, there must be at least fifty people that understand synergetics and tensegrity, and I am looking for them. Am I there? ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2001 15:01:36 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: donjuan MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Check this out. From castaneda.com What Is Tensegrity? Tensegrity is the modernized version of some movements called magical passes developed by Indian shamans who lived in Mexico in times prior to the Spanish Conquest. Times prior to the Spanish Conquest is a term used by don Juan Matus, a Mexican Indian shaman who introduced Carlos Castaneda, Carol Tiggs, Florinda Donner-Grau and Taisha Abelar to the cognitive world of shamans who lived in Mexico in ancient times -- which, according to don Juan, was between 7,000 and 10,000 years ago. ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2001 15:03:22 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Re: place In-Reply-To: <2F175DC588EFD211B37C0060088FAC39186B27@pscserver3> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Yeah Your right. I just feel like the group I am talking about is not yet all-the-way connected. --- Tony Kalenak wrote: > You have been here long enough to know that. > > -----Original Message----- > From: Dick Fischbeck > [SMTP:dick_fischbeck@YAHOO.COM] > Sent: Wednesday, February 21, 2001 4:53 PM > To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.ACSU.BUFFALO.EDU > Subject: place > > Is this the place to find Fuller scholars? > In all the > world, there must be at least fifty people > that > understand synergetics and tensegrity, and I > am > looking for them. Am I there? ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2001 15:11:06 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: bubble chamber MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii http://bc.tensegrity.net/ Spherical motors and such. ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2001 18:44:54 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Steve Waterman Subject: sphere packing and Physics MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Dick, you wrote... >I was thinking that the waterman sphere might be the >zero-phase of the nucleus. Say I have u-238. The >nucleus is that many sphere's packed in dynamic >closest packing (like a swarm of bee's). this is Physics current perception. i propose that even protons, neutrons and electrons are also closed packed...not "fundamental'. (snip) >But might be related to electron orbits. quite directly, i believe. (snip) dick, all this borders on topics not really to be covered at this GEODESIC site. and i feel it would not be appropriate to discuss such issues here. why don't you contact me through my site, swaterman117@hotmail.com and i would feel better about trying to respond to your questions as to these possible links between close packing and Physics....in my opinion. steve ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 00:39:28 -0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Paul Taylor Subject: Re: donjuan MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > Times prior to the Spanish Conquest is a term > used by don Juan Matus, a Mexican Indian shaman who > introduced Carlos Castaneda, Carol Tiggs, Florinda > Donner-Grau and Taisha Abelar to the cognitive world > of shamans who lived in Mexico in ancient times -- > which, according to don Juan, was between 7,000 and > 10,000 years ago. Check this out: >From Martin Gardner's new book, "Did Adam and Eve Have Navels?": "Careful investigations found his books riddled with contradictions, outright errors, and rafts of material pilfered from other authors. Don Juan existed only in Carlos's imagination. As sociologist Marcello Truzzi was the first to say, Castenada's books were the greatest science hoax since the Piltdown Man." (p.164) Best stick to Fuller and Snelson? Regards, Paul Taylor. ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2001 10:11:09 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Re: [Q-P] Panels of experts and the like <> Brian ¿Quincy! Hutchings 21-FEB-2001 10:11 r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us Firstly, it is just wrong that there are two sides to this story. At the same time as the streaming media account for the tendentiousness of the "California" e-crisis (although barely mentioning it vis-a-vu Mexico and Canada, of course, strategically), they present the case for quite draconian reductions of emmissions of CO2, but always phrased in terms of a politically-corrected, psychedelic "What'll consumers demand?" - although Enron et al are clearly preceding apace, in spite of what a body o'Boomers whine. And, they refuse to mention "nuke-yellar" in context, only in singular opinions & letters of support, along with the usual, ignorant retorts to these, that amount to ad-hominem attacks (ad-thingum? I still intend to get back with Lovins' _Soft Energy Paths_, although I know in my lower chakras, I'm correct .-) These reductions are rapidly being introduced in developing countries, India e.g., simply through "market power." How much of the "Asia Crisis" was due to the expediency of M&A over "Y2K," as in Indonesia? Which is routinely blamed on Suharto, although it was clearly more to the blame of the IMF and Australian PM Howard (and the stay-behind networks of Dutch, Portugeuse and British (Jardine Mathesson Ltd. e.g.) imerpialism and the UN's). (The UN embodies imperialism, because of two empricial powers that got onto the Security Council, and, also against FDR's wishes, the continuity of the empires, themselves (name one 57-strong voting-block in the General Assembly, that which maketh the day- to-day stuff of the UN's legislation; thank you !-) If folks would stop white-washing both Truman and Churchill, much progress'd be made against the latter-day followers of British Liberal Free Trade, if that is still possible.) If there's any hope at all, in spite of his being completely surrounded by grade-A holes from Sir George's "adminstrative Leviathan" (chunks of it, just to ensure that that messy Order remains covered-up, for ever, in the *vox populi*), of Son George to learn the meaning of the word, republic, that will require that someone ask him - without trying to make him look like a dolt, I hope! Otherwise, it's just back to "the Queen's favorite President, since George Bush" (or perhaps TR, who won a second term - and lost his third for the sake of his fellow anglomaniac, an ol'time Democrat; a rose is a rose, I suppose). Now, getting back to forecasting (*versus* the rectal dysplay unit (a-hem .-)) Per Singer's alleged mistake, and that "severe winter weather is perfectly consistent with global warming;" well, how be that? This limpid assertion goes to the heart of the problem of the anomalies, without bothering to offer a hypothesis as to their cause - although the effects are apparent, and Enron et al are raking in the effectiveness of market-power, o'er the increased demand of both summer & winter; hallelujah. As for the supposed lack of indices to the heap o'reports from the IPCC, anyone can do that (and I'll dunk dollars to dreadnoughts that at least one Singerite has done, so); maybe the concensus is, they'd rather not know! Thus quoth: list, only Mark attacked anything specific. For example, he said "there is some evidence for recent increases in global temperatures at the surface and low altitude, but that for reasons which are completely unknown, the data shows no corresponding increase at higher elevations." I vaguely remember that the "higher elevations" in the stratosphere are cooler because the lower layers are warmer. That may or may not be true, but I did find that they are cooler because of the reduced ozone layer. (Climate The two things are unrelated (as data gotten in two, different "spheres," as he was probably refering to elevations on the land). As for Mark's assertion about past climate, it's broad enough to be true, pre-Quatenary Period e.g. Also, if one looks at the Shackleton et al survey of sediment cores (as I recall), there seems to be an interesting correlation of CO2 and the initiation of the glacial phase, and within current findings - not of the IPCC models', though, future-in-a-box. But, one has to get over the silly ideal of "global" warming, which is just a synonym for "evenly over the surface of a sphere." Oy heil! --The Duke of Enron! http://www.tarpley.net/bush8.htm Re: [Q-P] Panels of experts and the like ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2001 19:06:11 -0600 Reply-To: waux@genevaonline.com Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Glenn Norgren Subject: Re: donjuan In-Reply-To: <003e01c09c68$1d533ca0$5dabfea9@bpo> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Marcello Truzzi is full of shit, and so are the rest of the Castaneda thrashers. There is a lot of valuable material in those books - and not all scientists knock it, just those who feel threatened by relativity, quantum mechanics, and string theory. lenn "There are more things in heaven and earth Horatio, then are dreamt of in your philosophy" Shakespeare -----Original Message----- From: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works [mailto:GEODESIC@LISTSERV.ACSU.BUFFALO.EDU]On Behalf Of Paul Taylor Sent: Wednesday, February 21, 2001 6:39 PM To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.ACSU.BUFFALO.EDU Subject: Re: donjuan > Times prior to the Spanish Conquest is a term > used by don Juan Matus, a Mexican Indian shaman who > introduced Carlos Castaneda, Carol Tiggs, Florinda > Donner-Grau and Taisha Abelar to the cognitive world > of shamans who lived in Mexico in ancient times -- > which, according to don Juan, was between 7,000 and > 10,000 years ago. Check this out: >From Martin Gardner's new book, "Did Adam and Eve Have Navels?": "Careful investigations found his books riddled with contradictions, outright errors, and rafts of material pilfered from other authors. Don Juan existed only in Carlos's imagination. As sociologist Marcello Truzzi was the first to say, Castenada's books were the greatest science hoax since the Piltdown Man." (p.164) Best stick to Fuller and Snelson? Regards, Paul Taylor. ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2001 10:22:51 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: New Thread! (was: visual depictions needed .-) <> Brian ¿Quincy! Hutchings 21-FEB-2001 10:22 r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us oh, I get that; you are just dividing along the ol'IVM -- which is not of interest, although it can be continued "ad finitum!" the reason I'd asked about your theories is, some of them are barely made-out as to hypothesis (all of the ones that I looked at); so, either you've come a long way, Baby, or I just don't get IT. certainly, the Lyman lines'd be quite testable! thus quoth: imagine if you take four square based pyramids and place onto a table, forming a square. you can then place an octet so that it rests in the middle of the bottom four. giving 6 total square base pyramid. the 4 tets are the spaces between the octet and any one of the four pyramids on the table surface. --The Duke of Enron! >http://www.tarpley.net/bushb.htm ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2001 10:53:47 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Re: New Thread! (was: radius .-) <> Brian ¿Quincy! Hutchings 21-FEB-2001 10:53 r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us where is this useless gahbahj piling-up from? Poly, Edge Length,F-radius, V-radius, C-Angle, Volume Edge =1 Tetrahedron 2.8284 0.5774 1.7321 109.47 0.11785 Cube 1.4142 0.7071 1.2247 70.53 1.00000 Octahedron 2 0.8165 1.4142 90 0.47140 Dodecahedron 0.7639 0.8507 1.0705 41.82 7.66312 Icosahedron 1.2361 0.9342 1.1756 63.43 2.18170 there are no terms of definition, so what in Hell are we supposed to do to it? --The Duke of Enron! http://www.tarpley.net ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2001 10:58:45 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Re: place <> Brian ¿Quincy! Hutchings 21-FEB-2001 10:58 r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us couldn't you ask a question that couldn't only be answered by a reference to http://Hail.brittanica.com! ?? Tensegrity (n.); the intimation of always-and-only-for-ever-with-out-possible-let-up ("up") of tension & compression ("&" is a unique bi-operator !-) thus quoth: Is this the place to find Fuller scholars? In all the world, there must be at least fifty people that understand synergetics and tensegrity, and I am >--The Duke of Enron! > http://www.tarpley.net ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2001 11:16:40 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Re: [Q-P] Two sides to every story? <> Brian ¿Quincy! Hutchings 21-FEB-2001 11:16 r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us these anomolies are the most important data to assess; "let's suppose you're right," and that the simulacra are way, way the Hell off! these anonomalies do explain, in part, why it is that the purveyors of the "info," like the NYT, insist on leaving things so sketchy; truthfully, it is in the minds of the scientists, and this is reflected in the "let's not index this **** -- I don't really want t'know!" thing. (that is to say, beyond whatever biases are lurking in the shadows, such as at that goo, ol'Tort paper .-) again, let me state to be quite clear, although the annual (or diurnal) production of CO2 is primarily due to the biosphere, itself (as is readily seen in the annual graph of it), the science seldom mentions this fact. just as they are looking for the largest antrhopogenic sources, they also seldom mention that CO2 is only the second-most- prevalent G-gas, after water-vapor (although every thing hinges upon that, and is the reason for such intl.programs as GEWEX). the same is easily shown of chlorine, and specifically of halogenated compounds, and many others. thus quoth: Let's suppose you're right about all of this. The obvious question is: so what? Suppose it's true that "higher elevations" have remained mysteriously cool over the last N years. How does this help us deal with the effects of warming at sea-level? People don't live in the stratosphere (well, in academia they tend to, but that's a different story). Most people don't live in the stratosphere -- they live on the planet's surface -- where the warming trend is relatively clear and likely to be expensive for many people. Antarctica is not melting (glaciers, there, continue to calve -- news item !-)... sealevel is not rising (although there are local subsidences of various sorts -- news items !-) "the computerized simulacra is not the telemetry;" eh? --The Duke of Enron! >> http://www.tarpley.net ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2001 20:23:18 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dexter Graphic Subject: Re: Human Nature / Laws of Nature In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Tony, Dick, others, Here is my reaction/response to the various points you have raised. During the last 200 years we have built a civilization that's completely dependent on cheap and plentiful energy from oil and natural gas. When the supply runs out sometime in the next 50 years our civilization is going to crash and the world's human population with it. In 1800 it is estimated that there were about 1 billion people living on planet Earth; today there are more than 6 billion -- that's a six fold increase in just 200 years! Overpopulation, disease, energy crisis, starvation, war, environmental destruction, and biological die-off are simply the results not the cause. They are symptoms of a humanity's fatal spiritual disease -- self-serving denial of reality in favor of ego-glorifying illusions of power and glory. Humanity's problem is not a lack of technology but the misuse of technology; not a lack of intelligence but a misuse of intelligence. Our problem is one of attitude and purpose: are we here for self-aggrandizement or to work for world betterment? Do we love our selves more than we love our fellows? Do we desire temporal/sensual involvement with our environment more than we desire the eternal principles of truth, beauty, and goodness? Do we fear a cruel and uncaring universe or do we give thanks to a loving Universal Father? Our wrong answers to these spiritual questions generate all the secondary problems we face in the social, intellectual, and material world. The most important value which Bucky's artifacts reveal to the young minds of this planet is his personal *attitude* of loving devotion, intelligent concern, and lifelong service of the universal family. His greatest gift to the "eternally regenerative scenario universe" is the *spirit* of his life's purpose. He was a faithful scientist/engineer/philosopher/artist seeking/demonstrating/understanding/depicting the heart and mind of God. Fuller's life of honesty, integrity, and creativity is what inspires me. Dexter Graphic ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2001 21:47:30 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Subject: Re: Human Nature / Laws of Nature MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Dexter, I think you should read the following: http://www.cruzio.com/~joemoore/Strategy/GrandStrategy.htm and see this page re energy: http://www.cruzio.com/~joemoore/Ideas/EndEnergyRenewable.htm Joe S Moore: joemoore@cruzio.com Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute: http://www.cruzio.com/~joemoore/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dexter Graphic" Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic To: Sent: Wednesday, February 21, 2001 8:23 PM Subject: Re: Human Nature / Laws of Nature > Tony, Dick, others, > > Here is my reaction/response to the various points you have raised. > (snip) ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2001 22:15:00 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Kirby Urner Subject: Re: radius (correction) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 01:13 PM 02/21/2001 -0800, you wrote: >Poly, Edge Length,F-radius, V-radius, C-Angle, Volume > >Edge =1 > >Tetrahedron 2.8284 0.5774 1.7321 109.47 0.11785 >Cube 1.4142 0.7071 1.2247 70.53 1.00000 >Octahedron 2 0.8165 1.4142 90 0.47140 >Dodecahedron 0.7639 0.8507 1.0705 41.82 7.66312 >Icosahedron 1.2361 0.9342 1.1756 63.43 2.18170 Actually, I'm a bit confused as to what you mean by the first number after the name of the poly, as you've specified Edge =1 above. The volumes you give don't seem to match these "Edge Lengths" (even in XYZ). Also, we were doing C-Angles not so long ago on this list, with several people contributing formulaic expressions, e.g. C-Angle of regular tet is acos(-1/3) -- gives you the possibility of yet more digits of precision, if you need them. >Now, this is not tetrahedral unit-volume figuring. >That is what I want to understand. > >Dick > http://www.teleport.com/~pdx4d/ocn/volumes.html > http://www.teleport.com/~pdx4d/ocn/volumes2.html I goofed up my URLs: http://www.teleport.com/~pdx4d/volumes.html http://www.teleport.com/~pdx4d/volumes2.html That's better. Kirby ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2001 21:41:29 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Kirby Urner Subject: Re: volume of tet/spherical tet In-Reply-To: <20010221181423.24829.qmail@web4405.mail.yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >Center to vertex , edge and face. > The synergetics A module will give you all this information, if you spend some time with it: http://www.rwgrayprojects.com/synergetics/s09/figs/f1301.html Every edge length has factor 'a', which is whatever edge length you want to assign the regular tetrahedron. Then all these other lengths you asked for fall out as edges of the A module. Kirby ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2001 22:07:27 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Kirby Urner Subject: Re: radius In-Reply-To: <20010221211311.27628.qmail@web4406.mail.yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 01:13 PM 02/21/2001 -0800, you wrote: >Poly, Edge Length,F-radius, V-radius, C-Angle, Volume > >Edge =1 > >Tetrahedron 2.8284 0.5774 1.7321 109.47 0.11785 >Cube 1.4142 0.7071 1.2247 70.53 1.00000 >Octahedron 2 0.8165 1.4142 90 0.47140 >Dodecahedron 0.7639 0.8507 1.0705 41.82 7.66312 >Icosahedron 1.2361 0.9342 1.1756 63.43 2.18170 > >Now, this is not tetrahedral unit-volume figuring. >That is what I want to understand. > >Dick The standard way of organizing the Platonics, which famous five you have just listed, is to always make the edge = 1, and then use the cube as your model of 1x1x1 (hence Cube = 1.00000). Bucky is nesting the polys and follows the practice of developing the cube from the 8 points of two intersecting tetrahedra (stella octangula), meaning the cube edge is not the same as the tetrahedron's edge, but rather the cube's face _diagonal_ is the the same as the tetra's edge. Furthermore, Bucky doesn't use the cube, but the tetrahedron as his model of 3rd powering, so 1x1x1 is a 3-edge zig-zag (a cobra, a snake), making a tetrahedron: http://members.nbci.com/Urner/images/genesis3d.html If you take the volume of the tetrahedron given above, and multiply it by an XYZ-to-IVM conversion constant, you can get its corresponding synergetics volume, but this is not the volume 1 tet -- too small vis-a-vis the corresponding cube. It needs to be blown up some. I think it's easier to understand the synergetics concentric hierarchy by reading something like my volumes pages, which, unlike this listserv, have lots of pictures (some of them animated): http://www.teleport.com/~pdx4d/ocn/volumes.html http://www.teleport.com/~pdx4d/ocn/volumes2.html Kirby ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 09:48:05 -0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Paul Taylor Subject: Re: donjuan MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ----- Original Message ----- From: Glenn Norgren Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic To: Sent: Thursday, February 22, 2001 1:06 AM Subject: Re: donjuan > Marcello Truzzi is full of shit, and so are the rest of the Castaneda > thrashers. There is a lot of valuable material in those books - and not all > scientists knock it, just those who feel threatened by relativity, quantum > mechanics, and string theory. Thanks for your measured, reasoned response. I doubt that Gardner feels threatened by relativity, as he wrote a guide to it, published by Dover Books. His recent book of collected essays, "The Night is Large", contains open-minded and fascinating discussions about quantum mechanics and string theory. How you can justify your wild claim about anyone who casts doubt on Castenada's writings remains to be seen. > "There are more things in heaven and earth Horatio, then are dreamt of in > your philosophy" > Shakespeare Just so: there is make-believe, blind faith, prejudice, fraud and gullibility, for example. Horizons can be wonderfully expanded by bearing such things in mind. Cheers, Paul Taylor. ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 00:22:55 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Kirby Urner Subject: Some progress with LiveGraphics3D In-Reply-To: <3.0.3.32.20010221220727.00b94620@pop3.norton.antivirus> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Steve -- I'm making headway with LiveGraphics3D, though the code is still immature/hard to use. Example: http://www.inetarena.com/~pdx4d/ocn/overview.html has a Live3D duo-tet cube (wireframe view) about half way down on the right -- that was generated directly out of my Python code (not by converting a Pov-ray file). More later... Kirby ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 09:37:13 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Steve Waterman Subject: Live3D and VRML MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Kirby, >I'm making headway with LiveGraphics3D, though the code >is still immature/hard to use. > not to suggest that you require any aid with this, but perhaps Martin Kraus would be interested in your various techniques and you in some of his ? have you two been in touch yet ? >Example: http://www.inetarena.com/~pdx4d/ocn/overview.html >has a Live3D duo-tet cube (wireframe view) about half way >down on the right -- that was generated directly out of my >Python code (not by converting a Pov-ray file). > this sounds as if you are getting a pretty good handle on Live3d... >More later... also, the VRML depictions via "Cortona" ?, which i downloaded did not work for me ( but did for my buddy, bob )....nice graphics indeed..... (seems to have better speed and continuity between frames than Live3D.) steve ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 08:55:50 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Subject: Re: [adcomm] FW: Tetworld Center Comments: To: Tetworld Global Advisory Committee MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Mark, For some info re Don Richter see: http://www.cruzio.com/~joemoore/Index/Rhf-Rn.htm (scroll down to "Richter") Joe S Moore: joemoore@cruzio.com Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute: http://www.cruzio.com/~joemoore/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mark Siegmund" To: "Tetglobal" ; "Tetworld" ; "Tetworld Advisory Committee" Sent: Wednesday, February 21, 2001 9:52 PM Subject: [adcomm] FW: Tetworld Center > Tetworld Global Advisory Committee - http://www.tetworld.org > > Hi, I've been looking at possibilities for the dome at Earth Observatory > Gaming Complex and this is from Temcor Corp. Anybody know who Don Richter > is/was? > > mark > ---------- > > From: "John Drinan" > > Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2001 13:51:16 -0800 > > To: "Mark Siegmund" > > Subject: Tetworld Center > > > > A most appropriate use for a Temcor dome. You may be aware that Bucky was > > an original member of Temcor's Board and Don Richter a guiding force in > > management for many years. As your building plans progress please keep us > > in mind. If you would like to examine some of our most recent work, just > > let me know. > > > > John E. Drinan > > Architectural Sales Manager, USA ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 10:03:24 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Re: New Thread! (was: radius .-) In-Reply-To: <200102211853.f1LIrlu01933@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sorry, I lost my mind for a second. --- Brian Hutchings wrote: > <> Brian ¿Quincy! Hutchings > 21-FEB-2001 10:53 > r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us > > where is this useless gahbahj piling-up from? > > Poly, Edge Length,F-radius, V-radius, C-Angle, > Volume > > Edge =1 > > Tetrahedron 2.8284 0.5774 1.7321 109.47 0.11785 > Cube 1.4142 0.7071 1.2247 70.53 1.00000 > Octahedron 2 0.8165 1.4142 90 0.47140 > Dodecahedron 0.7639 0.8507 1.0705 41.82 7.66312 > Icosahedron 1.2361 0.9342 1.1756 63.43 2.18170 > > there are no terms of definition, so > what in Hell are we supposed to do to it? > > --The Duke of Enron! > http://www.tarpley.net ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 10:09:53 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Re: donjuan In-Reply-To: <003e01c09c68$1d533ca0$5dabfea9@bpo> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii That is my point(not obviously so). I think these folks are polluting the meme landscape(am I using the word meme correctly here, anyone?). There are almost as many search references to this nonsense as there are to the real thing. --- Paul Taylor wrote: > > Times prior to the Spanish Conquest is a > term > > used by don Juan Matus, a Mexican Indian shaman > who > > introduced Carlos Castaneda, Carol Tiggs, Florinda > > Donner-Grau and Taisha Abelar to the cognitive > world > > of shamans who lived in Mexico in ancient times -- > > which, according to don Juan, was between 7,000 > and > > 10,000 years ago. > > Check this out: > > From Martin Gardner's new book, "Did Adam and Eve > Have Navels?": > > "Careful investigations found his books riddled with > contradictions, outright errors, and rafts of > material pilfered from other > authors. Don Juan existed only in Carlos's > imagination. As sociologist > Marcello Truzzi was the first to say, Castenada's > books were the greatest > science hoax since the Piltdown Man." (p.164) > > Best stick to Fuller and Snelson? > > Regards, > > Paul Taylor. ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 10:15:39 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Re: Human Nature / Laws of Nature In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii I think you are missing what CADS is. I do thing you have digested enough of Bucky by what I read in your posts. Keep going! Spirituality is fine but a different path to utopia then what CADS describes. Explore procession in particular I suggest. Dick --- Dexter Graphic wrote: > Tony, Dick, others, > > Here is my reaction/response to the various points > you have raised. > > During the last 200 years we have built a > civilization that's completely > dependent on cheap and plentiful energy from oil and > natural gas. When the > supply runs out sometime in the next 50 years our > civilization is going to > crash and the world's human population with it. In > 1800 it is estimated > that there were about 1 billion people living on > planet Earth; today there > are more than 6 billion -- that's a six fold > increase in just 200 years! > > Overpopulation, disease, energy crisis, starvation, > war, environmental > destruction, and biological die-off are simply the > results not the cause. > They are symptoms of a humanity's fatal spiritual > disease -- self-serving > denial of reality in favor of ego-glorifying > illusions of power and glory. > > Humanity's problem is not a lack of technology but > the misuse of technology; > not a lack of intelligence but a misuse of > intelligence. Our problem is one > of attitude and purpose: are we here for > self-aggrandizement or to work for > world betterment? Do we love our selves more than we > love our fellows? Do > we desire temporal/sensual involvement with our > environment more than we > desire the eternal principles of truth, beauty, and > goodness? Do we fear a > cruel and uncaring universe or do we give thanks to > a loving Universal > Father? Our wrong answers to these spiritual > questions generate all the > secondary problems we face in the social, > intellectual, and material world. > > The most important value which Bucky's artifacts > reveal to the young minds > of this planet is his personal *attitude* of loving > devotion, intelligent > concern, and lifelong service of the universal > family. His greatest gift > to the "eternally regenerative scenario universe" is > the *spirit* of his > life's purpose. He was a faithful > scientist/engineer/philosopher/artist > seeking/demonstrating/understanding/depicting the > heart and mind of God. > > Fuller's life of honesty, integrity, and creativity > is what inspires me. > > Dexter Graphic ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 10:44:27 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Re: New Thread! (was: radius .-) In-Reply-To: <200102211853.f1LIrlu01933@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii I am studying this stuff as Kirby and you suggest, but in the mean time Brian, can you say why the cubicly considered tet is volume 0.11785 and the cube is volume one, when we know that the correct ratio is 1:3? --- Brian Hutchings wrote: > <> Brian ¿Quincy! Hutchings > 21-FEB-2001 10:53 > r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us > > where is this useless gahbahj piling-up from? > > Poly, Edge Length,F-radius, V-radius, C-Angle, > Volume > > Edge =1 > > Tetrahedron 2.8284 0.5774 1.7321 109.47 0.11785 > Cube 1.4142 0.7071 1.2247 70.53 1.00000 > Octahedron 2 0.8165 1.4142 90 0.47140 > Dodecahedron 0.7639 0.8507 1.0705 41.82 7.66312 > Icosahedron 1.2361 0.9342 1.1756 63.43 2.18170 > > there are no terms of definition, so > what in Hell are we supposed to do to it? > > --The Duke of Enron! > http://www.tarpley.net ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 11:08:21 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Crackpot MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii It has to be okay to be somewhat of a crackpot, on this list especially. I see the world at stake. Synergetics and the geometry of thinking, probably most would agree, is the ONLY solution to our mutual survival. On the whole planet this group is closest to being in a position to invent our way into utopia. The individual eternity-accessing little-person's mind is how/where these inventions and intuitions become know. Politeness is nice but not central to the circumstances. And competition is entropic and always special case. No one needs to hold there imagination back. Everyone must offer whatever glimpse they may have of Nature's Way of structuring Herself. Ridicule is obsolete. It is special case. Joking and kidding is harmless. I am so glad you all are here. Exploring Universe in pure metaphysical terms would definitly be a drag alone. I am stating this in the chance that someone will join in synergeticly who might otherwise assume that their incite is less than important. ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 11:20:32 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: in-out MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Last night while turning a jitterbug repetitively inside-out, I could see how no momentum is lost and this oscillation is probably a perfect model for omni-energetic dynamic balance. I think of it as the 4-d gyroscope. Does anyone know how to do a moving image of this? I think it would be one step beyond the beautiful jitterbug VE/octa transformationing Kirby (and others?) already have in place. ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 11:42:42 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: radio MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Did anyone listen to Phil Hendry last night. Yeah, he's raunchy, by very bright I think. Anyway, one of his characters was going off on why this fbi spy story is unimportant since countries don't matter anymore. She cited the internet and globalization being in part responsible. And the callers, of course, were irate, offended, etc., as one would expect. What does this have to do with Bucky? Only that more and more people are getting clues about their true future. Of course nations are obsolete, but I don't hear to many public discussion on the subject. I am forever encouraged! Dick ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 19:45:30 -0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Paul Taylor Subject: Fw: ASTEROID OR COMET TRIGGERED LARGEST MASS EXTINCTIONIN EARTH'S HISTORY, FORESHADOWING FATE OF DINOSAURS MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Fullerenes: ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Thursday, February 22, 2001 7:00 PM Subject: ASTEROID OR COMET TRIGGERED LARGEST MASS EXTINCTIONIN EARTH'S HISTORY, FORESHADOWING FATE OF DINOSAURS > Donald Savage > Headquarters, Washington, DC February 22, 2001 > (Phone: 202/358-1547) > > Vince Stricherz > University of Washington, Seattle > (Phone: 206/ 543-2580) > > RELEASE: 01-23 > > ASTEROID OR COMET TRIGGERED LARGEST MASS EXTINCTION > IN EARTH'S HISTORY, FORESHADOWING FATE OF DINOSAURS > > New findings provide evidence that Earth's most severe > mass extinction -- an event 250 million years ago that wiped > out 90 percent of the life on Earth -- was triggered by a > collision with a comet or asteroid. > > Over 90 percent of all marine species and 70 percent of land > vertebrates perished as a result, according to the NASA-funded > research team, led by Dr. Luann Becker of the University of > Washington (UW), Seattle. The team's findings will be > published tomorrow in the journal Science. > > The collision wasn't directly responsible for the extinction > but rather triggered a series of events, such as massive > volcanism, and changes in ocean oxygen, sea level and climate. > That in turn led to species extinction on a wholesale level, > according to the team. > > "If the species cannot adjust, they perish. It's a survival- > of-the-fittest sort of thing," said Becker, UW acting > assistant professor of Earth and Space Sciences. "To knock out > 90 percent of organisms, you've got to attack them on more > than one front." > > The scientists do not know the site of the impact 250 million > years ago, when all Earth's land formed a supercontinent > called Pangea. However, the space body left a calling card -- > complex carbon molecules called buckminsterfullerenes, or > Buckyballs, with the noble gases helium and argon trapped > inside the caged structure. Fullerenes, which contain at least > 60 carbon atoms and have a structure resembling a soccer ball > or a geodesic dome, are named for Buckminster Fuller, inventor > of the geodesic dome. > > The researchers know these particular Buckyballs are > extraterrestrial because the noble gases trapped inside have > an unusual ratio of isotopes, atoms whose nuclei have the same > number of protons but different numbers of neutrons. > Terrestrial helium is mostly helium-4, while extraterrestrial > helium is mostly helium-3. > > "These things form in carbon stars. That's what's exciting > about finding fullerenes as a tracer," Becker said. The > extreme temperatures and gas pressures in carbon stars are > perhaps the only way extraterrestrial noble gases could be > forced inside a fullerene, she said. > > These gas-laden fullerenes were formed outside the Solar > System, and their concentration in the sedimentary layer at > the boundary of the Permian and Triassic periods means they > were delivered by comets or asteroids. The researchers > estimate the comet or asteroid was roughly 3 3/4 to 7 1/2 > miles (6 to 12 kilometers) across, or about the same size as > the asteroid believed responsible for the extinction of the > dinosaurs 65 million years ago. > > The telltale fullerenes containing helium and argon were > extracted from sites where the Permian-Triassic boundary layer > had been exposed in Japan, China and Hungary. The evidence was > not as strong from the Hungary site, but the China and Japan > samples bear strong evidence, Becker said. > > The team's work was made more difficult because there are few > 250 million-year-old rocks left on Earth since most rocks of > that age have been recycled through the planet's tectonic > processes. "It took us two years to do this research, to try > to narrow it down enough so that we could see this fullerene > signature," Becker said. > > Scientists have long known of the mass extinction 250 million > years ago, since many fossils below the boundary -- such as > trilobites, which once numbered more than 15,000 species -- > diminish sharply close to the boundary and are not found above > it. There also is strong evidence suggesting the extinction > happened very rapidly, on the order of 8,000 to 100,000 years, > which the latest research supports. > > Previously, it was thought that any asteroid or comet > collision would leave strong evidence of the element iridium, > the signal found in the sedimentary layer from the time of the > dinosaur extinction. Iridium was found at the Permian-Triassic > boundary, but not nearly in the concentration as from the > dinosaur extinction. Becker believes that difference is > because the two space bodies that slammed into Earth had > different compositions. > > Members of the research team are Becker; Robert Poreda and > Andrew Hunt from the University of Rochester, NY; Ted Bunch of > the NASA's Ames Research Center, Moffett Field, CA; and > Michael Rampino of New York University and NASA's Goddard > Institute of Space Sciences, New York. Funding for the > research was provided by NASA's Astrobiology and > Cosmochemistry programs and the National Science Foundation. > > Images are available at: > http://www.washington.edu/newsroom/news/images/extinct > > -end- > > * * * > > NASA press releases and other information are available automatically > by sending an Internet electronic mail message to domo@hq.nasa.gov. > In the body of the message (not the subject line) users should type > the words "subscribe press-release" (no quotes). ----------------------------------------------------- Paul Taylor. ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 12:27:30 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Re: sphere packing and Physics In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Steve- I bring this up because I am looking at the hydrogen atom as a model for the monoaster/unigon, whatever the name. But have you looked to see if there is a correlation between waterman radii and spectal line energy? I am picturing this electron in omni-circular balance with a proton or nucleus at a specific distance, and that distance possibly related to your radii. Or is there a correlation between nuclear radii and your waterman radii? I'll take my answer off the air if you prefer. dick_fischbeck@yahoo.com --- Steve Waterman wrote: > Dick, > > you wrote... > > >I was thinking that the waterman sphere might be > the > >zero-phase of the nucleus. Say I have u-238. The > >nucleus is that many sphere's packed in dynamic > >closest packing (like a swarm of bee's). > > this is Physics current perception. i propose > that > even protons, neutrons and electrons are also > closed packed...not "fundamental'. > > (snip) > > >But might be related to electron orbits. > > quite directly, i believe. > > (snip) > > dick, all this borders on topics not really to > be > covered at this GEODESIC site. and i feel > it would not be appropriate to discuss such > issues > here. why don't you contact me through my > site, > > swaterman117@hotmail.com > > and i would feel better about trying to respond to > your > questions as to these possible links between close > packing > and Physics....in my opinion. > > > steve ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 05:49:44 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Re: Fw: ASTEROID OR COMET TRIGGERED LARGEST MASS EXTINCTIONIN EAR <> Brian ¿Quincy! Hutchings 22-FEB-2001 5:49 r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us this is called, seeing exactly what you want to see in the data (for lack of any other "models," or just ignoring them, and it was the same with "shocked quartz"). there's a good book on Dinosaur lore out, edited by Robert Silverberg, that offers a bit-more of a rounded view of this; actually, a lot more, although it doesn't hurt to look at Charles Officer's booklength polemic. in particular, the ration of He3/He4 is found, similar to what is coming off of Sun, coming out of the midocean rifts; what could that be? thus quoth: > The researchers know these particular Buckyballs are > extraterrestrial because the noble gases trapped inside have > an unusual ratio of isotopes, atoms whose nuclei have the same > number of protons but different numbers of neutrons. > Terrestrial helium is mostly helium-4, while extraterrestrial > helium is mostly helium-3. --Les Dukes d'Enron! http://www.tarpley.net/bush8.htm ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 06:19:19 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Re: New Thread! (was: radius .-) <> Brian ¿Quincy! Hutchings 22-FEB-2001 6:19 r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us that is because, as Kirby later wrote, the Greeks decided to use the edge of the hexahedron as the referent, whereas the one that circumscribes the tetrah., is precisely one third of its volume. it is important to derive the "formula" for the volume of *any* pyramid (thus also a tet), via its altitude; you can show this by subdividing a cube into identical thirds, which will have square bases, and the altitude will fall-out, organically. then, derive the volume of a sphere, by subdividing it "to the limit" into tetrahedra (or into any polygon-based pyramids) and applying the form, above. so, in thus deriving pi (in contrast with the areal pi of the bubble-surface), which shpere is impaled on the hexahedron (as it were ?-) note: deriving the formula for a pyramid, is analgous to getting the one for the altitude of a trigon (bh/2). thus quoth: considered tet is volume 0.11785 and the cube is volume one, when we know that the correct ratio is 1:3? --The Duke of Enron! > http://www.tarpley.net ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 13:19:13 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: tracks MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Here is a link I found through Bob Gray's work. It is along the same line of thought as I am presently on. Again, spirituality is fine and healthy, I am looking at her "patterns" as energy railroad tracks, as Bucky put it. Dick http://www.pattern.org/connections.html ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 13:26:46 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Re: New Thread! (was: radius .-) In-Reply-To: <200102221419.f1MEJJp06671@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii So, are you saying that when I use the tetra edge as one and the cube edge as sqrt(1/2), I will then get the correct ratio? --- Brian Hutchings wrote: > <> Brian ¿Quincy! Hutchings > 22-FEB-2001 6:19 > r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us > > that is because, as Kirby later wrote, the Greeks > decided > to use the edge of the hexahedron as the referent, > whereas the one that circumscribes the tetrah., > is precisely one third of its volume. > it is important to derive the "formula" > for the volume of *any* pyramid (thus also a tet), > via its altitude; > you can show this by subdividing a cube > into identical thirds, which will have square > bases, and > the altitude will fall-out, organically. > then, derive the volume of a sphere, > by subdividing it "to the limit" into tetrahedra > (or > into any polygon-based pyramids) and applying the > form, > above. so, in thus deriving pi (in contrast > with the areal pi of the bubble-surface), > which shpere is impaled on the hexahedron (as it > were ?-) > > note: deriving the formula for a pyramid, > is analgous to getting the one for the altitude > of a trigon (bh/2). > > thus quoth: > considered tet is volume 0.11785 and the cube is > volume one, when we know that the correct ratio is > 1:3? > > --The Duke of Enron! > > http://www.tarpley.net ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 06:38:54 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Re: [Q-P] Climate <> Brian ¿Quincy! Hutchings 22-FEB-2001 6:38 r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us the comma was not at all deceptive: "those.., who" -- as denoting a subset; I agree, though, that it'll generally be taken to be The Grand Computerized Concensus. as for ms.Street's "because," per stratospheric and troposhperic warmth and coolth, let's just say, there's an intersting correlation & probably some linkage, which may even have been demonstrated within the bowels of the UNIPCC. the real point is that what we are concerned with occurs within the troposphere, regarding the climate, and particularly with the solid phase of water. it is here, where the anamoly of "weirdly cool altitudes" is of such importance, and may certainly retain an icecap on Kilimanjarno; eh? Fred is just great; do you still want to know, what his impressive credentials are -- or do you all, already know this?... even though he's an old anti-nukie, count me as a Singerite. I get the feeling that no-one, here, has actually read Fred's stuff, directly, or heard him on the radio; eh? thus quoth: >contradicts the thinking of those in the science community, who believe that >scientists should make more of an effort to familiarize the public with >scientific issues. > --The Duke of Enron! http://www.tarpley.net ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 13:39:54 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Mark Siegmund Subject: Re: Human Nature / Laws of Nature In-Reply-To: Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Bucky said while in the recovery room after a hip operation (shortly before his death) to grandson, Jaime---- that it's all about integrity... Mark > From: Dexter Graphic > Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works > > Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic > Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2001 20:23:18 -0800 > To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.ACSU.BUFFALO.EDU > Subject: Re: Human Nature / Laws of Nature > > Tony, Dick, others, > > Here is my reaction/response to the various points you have raised. > > During the last 200 years we have built a civilization that's completely > dependent on cheap and plentiful energy from oil and natural gas. When the > supply runs out sometime in the next 50 years our civilization is going to > crash and the world's human population with it. In 1800 it is estimated > that there were about 1 billion people living on planet Earth; today there > are more than 6 billion -- that's a six fold increase in just 200 years! > > Overpopulation, disease, energy crisis, starvation, war, environmental > destruction, and biological die-off are simply the results not the cause. > They are symptoms of a humanity's fatal spiritual disease -- self-serving > denial of reality in favor of ego-glorifying illusions of power and glory. > > Humanity's problem is not a lack of technology but the misuse of technology; > not a lack of intelligence but a misuse of intelligence. Our problem is one > of attitude and purpose: are we here for self-aggrandizement or to work for > world betterment? Do we love our selves more than we love our fellows? Do > we desire temporal/sensual involvement with our environment more than we > desire the eternal principles of truth, beauty, and goodness? Do we fear a > cruel and uncaring universe or do we give thanks to a loving Universal > Father? Our wrong answers to these spiritual questions generate all the > secondary problems we face in the social, intellectual, and material world. > > The most important value which Bucky's artifacts reveal to the young minds > of this planet is his personal *attitude* of loving devotion, intelligent > concern, and lifelong service of the universal family. His greatest gift > to the "eternally regenerative scenario universe" is the *spirit* of his > life's purpose. He was a faithful scientist/engineer/philosopher/artist > seeking/demonstrating/understanding/depicting the heart and mind of God. > > Fuller's life of honesty, integrity, and creativity is what inspires me. > > Dexter Graphic > ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 13:38:02 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Kirby Urner Subject: Re: donjuan In-Reply-To: <002401c09cb4$a94399c0$5dabfea9@bpo> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Snelson is quite perplexed by Castaneda's use of "tensegrity" and thinks it feeds off a looseness in thinking which allows any word to mean whatever we want it to mean -- as long as it's hip, and sounds cool. But then he didn't necessarily like the word "tensegrity" to begin with, which was Bucky's coin, not Snelson's. He refers to his sculptures as using "floating compression" a lot of the time. Personally speaking, I like the word "tensegrity" and don't mind Casteneda's borrowing, as memes often propagate and 90 degrees to what a linear/literal thinker'd expect, and oft times this redounds to our benefit down the road apiece i.e. I'm glad language remains unpredictable and surprising. That being said, I understand Snelson's chagrin. It's easier for me to be such a liberal-minded guy, given I haven't invested my entire career as an artist in exploring and developing this particular phenomenon. Kirby ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 13:39:13 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Re: [Q-P] Climate change In-Reply-To: <200102141717.f1EHHYk29936@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii In addition to what you say here, it seems to me that this Planet is in equilibrium as are all systems, and is therefore responding continually to ALL relevant energy events, such as CO2 entering the atmosphere. The Earth is not like some teetering rock balanced on a pinnacle, ready to tip, which seems to be a common conception. --- Brian Hutchings wrote: > <> Brian ¿Quincy! Hutchings > 14-FEB-2001 9:17 > r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us > > What is your explanation for the theory? > > Dick > > why is the 1896 "model" so paradigmatic, as if > the programmers had assumed that insolation is > evenly-dystributed > about the globe, and slowly hacked the resulting > annoyance > into compliance with a select data? > my own knowledge of the rather coarse gridwork > of the GCMs is limited mainly to abstracts, and > pouplar books on the matter (such as Stephen > Schneider's. > whom I spoke with about diffg.eqs. at a TreePeople > conference. > in a word, "however." > however, these models are not made form any > *conceptual* model, > but seem to be thrown-together from the work-a-day > models > of the Weather Dept. at the university, > with giant leaps into the void of making-do > with ad-hoc heuristics that give a darn good fit > to a certain selection of the data. however, > by the most simple adumbration of the quaint > Butterfly Effect, > that is of "essential dependence upon intermediate > cognition" -- > there are only "initial conditions in these models > -- > one can see that there is no warranty from the > forecast > of the weather, out to over a year in some > repsects, > on the range of "climate." or, perhaps, > we cannot predict the wather, only forecast > economical responses > to various possibilities, currently consigned > to the Free Market and a diocletian edict from BP, > 'WAND' et al > (the market tends most closely to these oligarchs, > whose Invisible Hand is in the business of making > "honest money.") > (the only really intial conditions are those > that are set in unique experiments of new > principles, > as a matter of hypothesis; refer here to > agriculture > for the matter of climate: > take the USDA's Hardiness Zone Maps as a series, > as was done by Hamaker about 20ya !-) > > the other matter is political, and the UNIPCC is > that, all the way, > although its act has been honed to a science!... > first of all, > most of the largest sources of CO2 (and most > G-gasses) are natural, > mostly seasonal or diurnal; htat's well-known, but > the concentration upon these secondary > "anthrogenic" flows > almost never acknowledges this, and it's often > forgotten. > the most auspicious moment I learned > from a pulbication called "Solar Age or Ice Age > News," > reporting on a radical group called Tree War > Scoeity, or > some thing, who had attended (or gotten a-hold > of the transcripts; I don't recall) a meeting > of the AAAS, where funding for studies is > ultimately controlled > in large measure in public academia. > there was a famous person there, > to sort-of lay-down the law for the new paradigm, > which had to fight against the very mainstream, > science-based study of the Quaternary Period; > this was one Roger Revelle -- you've heard of him? > > as for the Kyoto Protocols, Qui bono -- > besides the Green Party and their "IRV" populism? > > thus quoth: > Brian- I have no idea whether or not a drastic, > people-induces climatic shift is in our future. I > think you are saying that in your best guess the > theory of global-warming is not scientifically > supported. > > --The Duke of Oil! > http://www/tarpley.net/bushb.htm ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 14:10:43 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Kirby Urner Subject: Re: New Thread! (was: radius .-) In-Reply-To: <20010222184427.16961.qmail@web4402.mail.yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 10:44 AM 02/22/2001 -0800, you wrote: >I am studying this stuff as Kirby and you suggest, but >in the mean time Brian, can you say why the cubicly >considered tet is volume 0.11785 and the cube is >volume one, when we know that the correct ratio is >1:3? I'm not Brian but I'll try again to make this clear. First, the cube that's 3x the volume of a regular tet is not just any cube. You have to say what cube you're talking about. Is it the cube with the same edge as the tetrahedron? No. It's not. It's the cube with the tetrahedron inscribed as face diagonals. Think of a square. Draw a diagonal. That's the edge of the tetrahedron. If the cube has edges 1, this diagonal is sqrt(2). If the cube has edges 2, then the diagonal is sqrt(4+4) = sqrt(8) = 2sqrt(2). This tetrahedron will have volume 1/3rd that of the cube in which it inscribes, which is true regardless of whether we're doing synergetics or not. Take this tetrahedron of 0.11785 (approximately). What are its edges? E = 1. So it should NOT have a volume 1/3rd that of the cube's with E = 1 also, as it is _too small_. The diagonals of the cube, with edges 1, is sqrt(2), which is closer to 1.414. The tetrahedron needs to be blown up to have these longer edges, so that it will inscribe properly, and not just rattle around inside the cube. Now, what happens to volume when you increase the edges. This is part of what every 7th grader should know, according to the California state standard. Answer: volume changes as a 3rd power of the change in edge lengths i.e. if you scale all the edges by 2 (double their lengths), volume goes up 8 times, whereas if you halve all the edges, volume goes down to 1/8th of its previous value. This is true for _any shape_. So, we're starting with a volume of 0.11785 (approximately) and want to make this tetrahedron bigger, to have edges of about 1.414, not just 1. So we have to multiply all the edges by sqrt(2), meaning the volume will go up by a factor of sqrt(2) to the third power, or about: 2.8284271247461907. Now, what's 2.8284271247461907 times 0.11785 (approximately)? Answer: 0.33333013665133859. And if we had more digits of accuracy, you'd see this is really 1/3rd. In other words, the cube is 1, and the inscribed tetrahedron is 1/3rd. So far, this is just 7th grade math -- no synergetics, no Bucky, nothing that's not already in the text books. Now, what's different about synergetics is we take that tetrahedron (the one inscribed in the cube) and _define_ it to have a volume of 1. We're allowed to do this. What units you use is cultural, and here, in the synergetics culture, we're making 3rd powering and growing/shrinking tetrahedra go together -- it's a new neural net, a new paradigm, and it changes everything to think this way, but so what? We're gonna do it. So now we've done it. So now, given the tetrahedron has a volume of 1, what's the volume of the cube? Well, it's still 3x the tetrahedron's volume -- that relationship hasn't changed at all. So it has to be 3. So that's it, we're done. What this means is, if I build both these polys out of cardboard and leave a face open, I can fill the tetrahedron with lentils or fava beans or popcorn (unpopped), and _pour_ it into the cube three times. It'll go in exactly (if I don't spill too much). The tetrahedron is our basic measuring cup, being the simplest of shapes. Four tetras fill the octahedron and six fill the rhombic dodecahedron. Twenty fill the cuboctahedron -- provided you scale all these shapes in the logical/rational/obvious way that Bucky recommends. This is what I'd call kindergarten math, and I've taught it at the kindergarten level with great success.[1] Next week I do a first grade mini-course on the same subject. We'll also cover Euler's Law, which every first grader should know, and probably will, within a couple of years (I anticipate). Kirby PS: what we need to combat is the silly prejudice that you have to be an Einstein to understand the simple basics of synergetics, i.e. the concentric hierarchy and its relationship to sphere packing. There seems to be this notion that you're supposed to be an MIT professor or something, to understand this stuff, whereas the truth is it's comprehensible to first graders (average first graders, not whiz kids). I'm not saying all of synergetics is so accessible, but the basics most certainly are, and should have made their way onto the boob tube, in the context of 'Sesame Street'-like programs, decades ago (like in the 1960s). But nooooooo, academia is too busy nursing it's collective ego to "get off it" with Bucky even just a little bit. That leaves the impression that, if it's not crackpot stuff (and some of is "highly speculative" to say the least), it must be super difficult (how else to explain its almost total obscurity?) whereas, in truth, it's super easy (which is partly why academia doesn't want to admit it made a mistake neglecting the Fuller corpus for so long; it doesn't see how it can back track without losing face at this point (but it'll just have to find a way, as the pressure to incorporate this material is only increasing, thanks to the internet)). [1] http://groups.yahoo.com/group/synergeo/message/236 ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 17:33:40 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Subject: Re: New Thread! (was: radius .-) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Dick, Take a look at "Tetrahedron as Unity" & "Unity = 2" http://www.cruzio.com/~joemoore/Ideas/Tet.htm Joe S Moore: joemoore@cruzio.com Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute: http://www.cruzio.com/~joemoore/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dick Fischbeck" Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic To: Sent: Thursday, February 22, 2001 1:26 PM Subject: Re: New Thread! (was: radius .-) > So, are you saying that when I use the tetra edge as > one and the cube edge as sqrt(1/2), I will then get > the correct ratio? (snip) ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 17:40:52 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Subject: Re: [adcomm] FW: Tetworld Center Comments: To: Tetworld Global Advisory Committee MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Mark, All in good time. Now if we could somehow have everything Bucky wrote online, then we could link to the relevant sections. However, the copyright laws seem to be a problem. Joe S Moore: joemoore@cruzio.com Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute: http://www.cruzio.com/~joemoore/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mark Siegmund" To: "Tetworld Global Advisory Committee" Sent: Thursday, February 22, 2001 1:34 PM Subject: Re: [adcomm] FW: Tetworld Center > Tetworld Global Advisory Committee - http://www.tetworld.org > > Good God Man!--what a heap of work you've done. Now if you (in your spare > time) can have an active link to all the references--I'll be mightly pleased > to nominate you for the first Tetworld Fifth Degree "Beyond the Call" > Award. > > As of now, you're up for the Fourth Degree Award. > > Thanks, > Mark > > > From: "Joe S Moore" > > Reply-To: "Tetworld Global Advisory Committee" > > Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 08:55:50 -0800 > > To: "Tetworld Global Advisory Committee" > > Cc: "_Geodesic" > > Subject: Re: [adcomm] FW: Tetworld Center > > > > Tetworld Global Advisory Committee - http://www.tetworld.org > > > > Mark, > > > > For some info re Don Richter see: > > http://www.cruzio.com/~joemoore/Index/Rhf-Rn.htm > > (scroll down to "Richter") > > > > Joe S Moore: joemoore@cruzio.com > > Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute: http://www.cruzio.com/~joemoore/ > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Mark Siegmund" > > To: "Tetglobal" ; "Tetworld" ; > > "Tetworld Advisory Committee" > > Sent: Wednesday, February 21, 2001 9:52 PM > > Subject: [adcomm] FW: Tetworld Center > > > > > >> Tetworld Global Advisory Committee - http://www.tetworld.org > >> > >> Hi, I've been looking at possibilities for the dome at Earth Observatory > >> Gaming Complex and this is from Temcor Corp. Anybody know who Don Richter > >> is/was? > >> > >> mark ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 11:34:25 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Re: New Thread! (was: radius .-) <> Brian ¿Quincy! Hutchings 22-FEB-2001 11:34 r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us What's on p.191 of _Cosmography_, Dick? Allow me to make a brief synopsis (or charicature) of Bucky's Filed Ride (Cosmometry .-) At Milton Academy in Newtonium, MA, USA, the functionally-blind-without-glasses student, Fuller, got quite an education; *some* sort of one, at any rate, which I am not privy to any details of, but it was intended to prepare the fifth generation of his family, gone to Hahvahd (of course, we all on this list praise God, that he had to blow *that* nasty joint .-) One day at school, Mrs. _______ (forgot her name) gave the class a constructive lesson: Take these toothpicks and semi-soft peas, and build! Supposedly, little Bucky was thus blind, that he didn't really recall seeing the typical, New England Clapboard Cottage (forgot the usual name; Salt Box?), nor the structure of his own rather more elaborate residence @ Newton. At any rate, the omnitrigonated (sic) structures that he could feel, but not see, to be made in his hands with the little struts'n'hubs, made such an impression upon him, that he ran with it -- and forgot the rest of his geometry, in so many words, in the pursuit! So, why, as with the Greeks, did Bucky resort to his Hierarchy, that is so centered upon the struts -- the edges of the polyhedra? As with Gene Fowler's vague suggestion, there actually are good reasons for that, although the particular systematization o'Fuller, may not have been constructed with a coherent hypothesis; or, what is that? --Les Dukes d'Enron! http://www.tarpley.net ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 21:29:18 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Kirby Urner Subject: Re: Live3D and VRML Comments: cc: Martin.Kraus@informatik.uni-stuttgart.de In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 09:37 AM 02/22/2001 -0500, you wrote: >Kirby, > >>I'm making headway with LiveGraphics3D, though the code >>is still immature/hard to use. >> > >not to suggest that you require any aid with this, but perhaps >Martin Kraus would be interested in your various techniques >and you in some of his ? have you two been in touch yet ? > I'll send him a copy of this in case he wants to take a look at http://www.inetarena.com/~pdx4d/ocn/polynest.html -- so far my most ambitious effort to generate something his applet will display. > >>Example: http://www.inetarena.com/~pdx4d/ocn/overview.html >>has a Live3D duo-tet cube (wireframe view) about half way >>down on the right -- that was generated directly out of my >>Python code (not by converting a Pov-ray file). >> > >this sounds as if you are getting a pretty good handle on Live3d... > Yes, I think I've learned enough about the Graphics3D format to suit my rather limited needs. >>More later... > > > >also, the VRML depictions via "Cortona" ?, which i downloaded >did not work for me ( but did for my buddy, bob )....nice graphics >indeed..... >(seems to have better speed and continuity between frames than Live3D.) > >steve > Kirby PS: the VRML clone of the above is at: http://www.inetarena.com/~pdx4d/ocn/worlds/polynest.wrl PPS: re VRML plug-ins, it was CosmoPlayer, not Cortona, that I was recommending you download and install. If still interested, maybe re-read what I posted. ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 23 Feb 2001 02:25:09 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: marksomers Subject: Back in the saddle again MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000B_01C09D3F.D7D47760" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000B_01C09D3F.D7D47760 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable OK kids I'm back in the list serv. First off I've just been to a green party meeting .... yawn=20 ............. double yawn ........ these yawohs have little concept ( = and I mean a littlte ( teent tiny ) concept of the real world ) I'll = bust thier asses and enlighten them on this. I've been confronted by people with little to no concepts in science and = technology ..... sooooooooooooo she said "Mark make me squirm" .... = anyways back at the ranch I'm going to help the locals with a web site = ........ They obviously want political stratems ....... I obviously will = deliver natural real world answer ... No applause needed .....=20 Anything other than mind tripping python program of recent? Anybody want to run for political office in Montana here?=20 P.S. Brian you were right about the dereg of utilities having a diverse = affect even in this part of the woods. Mark ------=_NextPart_000_000B_01C09D3F.D7D47760 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
OK kids I'm back in the list = serv.
 
First off I've just been to a green = party=20 meeting  .... yawn
............. double yawn ........ = these =20 yawohs have little concept ( and I mean a littlte ( teent tiny ) concept = of the=20 real world )  I'll bust thier asses and enlighten them on=20 this.
 
I've been confronted by people with = little to no=20 concepts in science and technology ..... sooooooooooooo she said "Mark = make me=20 squirm" ....  anyways back at the ranch I'm going to help the = locals with a=20 web site ........ They obviously want political stratems ....... I = obviously=20 will deliver natural real world answer ... No applause needed .....=20
 
Anything other than mind tripping = python program of=20 recent?
 
Anybody want to run for political = office in Montana=20 here?
 
P.S. Brian you were right about the = dereg of=20 utilities having a diverse affect even in this part of the = woods.
 
Mark
 
 
------=_NextPart_000_000B_01C09D3F.D7D47760-- ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 23 Feb 2001 08:43:33 -0600 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Tony Kalenak Subject: Re: Human Nature / Laws of Nature MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Very true. I agree with your assessment. As an aside, I feel that the new current administration is taking a very negative tact of "You Vs Me" adversarial world view, instead of a positive "how can we make humanity a success" by working together. I troubles me. Like the Toa says "there is no greater misfortune than having an enemy". -----Original Message----- From: Dexter Graphic [SMTP:dextergraphic@PRODIGY.NET] Sent: Wednesday, February 21, 2001 10:23 PM To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.ACSU.BUFFALO.EDU Subject: Re: Human Nature / Laws of Nature Tony, Dick, others, Here is my reaction/response to the various points you have raised. During the last 200 years we have built a civilization that's completely dependent on cheap and plentiful energy from oil and natural gas. When the supply runs out sometime in the next 50 years our civilization is going to crash and the world's human population with it. In 1800 it is estimated that there were about 1 billion people living on planet Earth; today there are more than 6 billion -- that's a six fold increase in just 200 years! Overpopulation, disease, energy crisis, starvation, war, environmental destruction, and biological die-off are simply the results not the cause. They are symptoms of a humanity's fatal spiritual disease -- self-serving denial of reality in favor of ego-glorifying illusions of power and glory. Humanity's problem is not a lack of technology but the misuse of technology; not a lack of intelligence but a misuse of intelligence. Our problem is one of attitude and purpose: are we here for self-aggrandizement or to work for world betterment? Do we love our selves more than we love our fellows? Do we desire temporal/sensual involvement with our environment more than we desire the eternal principles of truth, beauty, and goodness? Do we fear a cruel and uncaring universe or do we give thanks to a loving Universal Father? Our wrong answers to these spiritual questions generate all the secondary problems we face in the social, intellectual, and material world. The most important value which Bucky's artifacts reveal to the young minds of this planet is his personal *attitude* of loving devotion, intelligent concern, and lifelong service of the universal family. His greatest gift to the "eternally regenerative scenario universe" is the *spirit* of his life's purpose. He was a faithful scientist/engineer/philosopher/artist seeking/demonstrating/understanding/depicting the heart and mind of God. Fuller's life of honesty, integrity, and creativity is what inspires me. Dexter Graphic ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 23 Feb 2001 08:39:04 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Subject: Re: [adcomm] FW: Tetworld Center Comments: To: Tetworld Global Advisory Committee MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Mark, Hopefully the Bucky archive at Stanford will be open to the public this year. Also I have heard that they will be setting up a Bucky website, but I don't have any details. Here is the New York Times article in the Geodesic archives: http://listserv.acsu.buffalo.edu/cgi-bin/wa?A2=ind9907&L=geodesic&P=R2772&m= 8520 Also, here is the article in the BFI newsletter: http://www.bfi.org/Trimtab/t699a.htm#fuller_archive.htm Joe S Moore: joemoore@cruzio.com Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute: http://www.cruzio.com/~joemoore/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mark Siegmund" To: "Tetworld Global Advisory Committee" Sent: Friday, February 23, 2001 6:33 AM Subject: Re: [adcomm] FW: Tetworld Center > Tetworld Global Advisory Committee - http://www.tetworld.org > > > Joe, what are plans at the Bucky Archives--perhaps they would welcome having > them on-line. Is there yet an email and/or url for the archives? > > Mark > > > From: "Joe S Moore" > > Reply-To: "Tetworld Global Advisory Committee" > > Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 17:40:52 -0800 > > To: "Tetworld Global Advisory Committee" > > Cc: "_Geodesic" > > Subject: Re: [adcomm] FW: Tetworld Center > > > > Tetworld Global Advisory Committee - http://www.tetworld.org (snip) ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 23 Feb 2001 10:07:19 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Re: donjuan In-Reply-To: <3.0.3.32.20010222133802.00ad5100@pop3.norton.antivirus> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii > Personally speaking, I like the word "tensegrity" > and don't > mind Casteneda's borrowing, as memes often propagate > and 90 > degrees to what a linear/literal thinker'd expect, > and oft > times this redounds to our benefit down the road > apiece i.e. > I'm glad language remains unpredictable and > surprising. I like the word tensegrity as well, Kirby. As to the idea of meme pollution, what you say makes more sense to me. Maybe its along the same line as when Bucky says there is no pollution, only entropic 'use' of resources. And the processional aspect of memes make sense, too. ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 23 Feb 2001 10:51:03 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Re: New Thread! (was: radius .-) In-Reply-To: <3.0.3.32.20010222141043.00906290@pop3.norton.antivirus> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii cut-- > So, we're starting with a volume of 0.11785 > (approximately) > and want to make this tetrahedron bigger, to have > edges > of about 1.414, not just 1. So we have to multiply > all > the edges by sqrt(2), meaning the volume will go up > by a > factor of sqrt(2) to the third power, or about: > 2.8284271247461907. > > Now, what's times 0.11785 > (approximately)? > Answer: 0.33333013665133859. And if we had more > digits of > accuracy, you'd see this is really 1/3rd. In other > words, > the cube is 1, and the inscribed tetrahedron is > 1/3rd. > So far, this is just 7th grade math -- no > synergetics, no > Bucky, nothing that's not already in the text books. cut> Approaching from the other side, I have a tet of edge length 2, and a volume 8. This fits into a cube of edge length sqrt2. The volume of a cube this size is (sqrt2)^3. That come to 2.8284271247461907. What's wrong here? ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 23 Feb 2001 10:58:56 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Re: New Thread! (was: radius .-) In-Reply-To: <200102221934.f1MJYPQ09086@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii --- Brian Hutchings wrote: > <> Brian ¿Quincy! Hutchings > 22-FEB-2001 11:34 > r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us > > What's on p.191 of _Cosmography_, Dick? He says the spherical version of a asterion is always one tetravolume greater than its great-circle-cord version. ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 23 Feb 2001 11:30:26 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Re: New Thread! (was: radius .-) In-Reply-To: <3.0.3.32.20010222141043.00906290@pop3.norton.antivirus> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii > So, we're starting with a volume of 0.11785 > (approximately) > and want to make this tetrahedron bigger, to have > edges > of about 1.414, not just 1. So we have to multiply > all > the edges by sqrt(2), meaning the volume will go up > by a > factor of sqrt(2) to the third power, or about: > 2.8284271247461907. > > Now, what's 2.8284271247461907 times 0.11785 > (approximately)? > Answer: 0.33333013665133859. And if we had more > digits of > accuracy, you'd see this is really 1/3rd. In other > words, > the cube is 1, and the inscribed tetrahedron is > 1/3rd. > So far, this is just 7th grade math -- no > synergetics, no > Bucky, nothing that's not already in the text books. As to that last "calculation" I made, let me start over. A tet with edge 2 has a volume of 1/2 bh. Or 2^3/12*sqrt2=0.940. The cube of edge sqrt2 has a volume of 2.8284. this 3 times 0.94. Right this time? ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 23 Feb 2001 10:56:47 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Kirby Urner Subject: Re: Back in the saddle again In-Reply-To: <000e01c09d7a$84b06ea0$3b93a6d8@intch.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/enriched; charset="us-ascii" Arial. No applause needed ..... ArialAnything other than mind tripping python program of recent? <<<<<<<< We had a good discussion of great circle networks in the course of which I pointed people to your POV-Ray cartoon at my website. Dunno if anybody went there. I like the Python <<--> Naga hyperlink. Seems appropriate to have great circle snakes constricting the curriculum, making it more crypto-compressed the way academics like it. >>>> ArialAnybody want to run for political office in Montana here? <<<<<<<< My friend Bob Palmer used to be in the legislature, but was part of the Montana->Oregon exodus awhile ago (seems most folks skip Idaho for some reason). >>>> ArialP.S. Brian you were right about the dereg of utilities having a diverse affect even in this part of the woods. ArialMark <<<<<<<< ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 23 Feb 2001 12:42:05 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Re: New Thread! (was: radius .-) In-Reply-To: <3.0.3.32.20010222141043.00906290@pop3.norton.antivirus> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii > So, we're starting with a volume of 0.11785 > (approximately) > and want to make this tetrahedron bigger, to have > edges > of about 1.414, not just 1. So we have to multiply > all > the edges by sqrt(2), meaning the volume will go up > by a > factor of sqrt(2) to the third power, or about: > 2.8284271247461907. > > Now, what's 2.8284271247461907 times 0.11785 > (approximately)? > Answer: 0.33333013665133859. And if we had more > digits of > accuracy, you'd see this is really 1/3rd. In other > words, > the cube is 1, and the inscribed tetrahedron is > 1/3rd. > So far, this is just 7th grade math -- no > synergetics, no > Bucky, nothing that's not already in the text books. > > Now, what's different about synergetics is we take > that > tetrahedron (the one inscribed in the cube) and > _define_ > it to have a volume of 1. We're allowed to do this. > What > units you use is cultural, and here, in the > synergetics > culture, we're making 3rd powering and > growing/shrinking > tetrahedra go together -- it's a new neural net, a > new > paradigm, and it changes everything to think this > way, but > so what? We're gonna do it. So now we've done it. > So > now, given the tetrahedron has a volume of 1, what's > the > volume of the cube? Well, it's still 3x the > tetrahedron's > volume -- that relationship hasn't changed at all. > So it > has to be 3. So that's it, we're done. Say I say the V-radius of a tet is 1. The edge length,a, then becomes 1.6333. That is because V-radius=edge length*sqrt6/4(from A-module). The tet volume is a^3sqrt2/12=0.5135. A sphere with radius 1 has a volume of 4.188. About right? Then the corresponding cube's volume is 1.155^3=1.541. Divide that by 3 give the tet volume 0.5135. I think this works. ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 23 Feb 2001 14:12:02 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: marksomers Subject: Bucky in the saddle again MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0007_01C09DA2.98068200" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0007_01C09DA2.98068200 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Comet dating via bucky balls.. ftp://ftp.hq.nasa.gov/pub/pao/pressrel/2001/01-023.txt And some images .... and one "motion picture"=20 http://www.washington.edu/newsroom/news/images/extinct/ ------=_NextPart_000_0007_01C09DA2.98068200 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Comet dating via bucky = balls..
 
ftp://ftp= .hq.nasa.gov/pub/pao/pressrel/2001/01-023.txt
 
And some images .... and one "motion = picture"=20
 
http://w= ww.washington.edu/newsroom/news/images/extinct/
 
 
 
 
 
------=_NextPart_000_0007_01C09DA2.98068200-- ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 23 Feb 2001 07:29:26 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Re: Back in the saddle again <> Brian ¿Quincy! Hutchings 23-FEB-2001 7:29 r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us well, OK. thus quoth: >>>> ArialP.S. Brian you were right about the dereg of utilities having a diverse affect even in this part of the woods. ArialMark <<<<<<<< --Le Duke d'Enron! http://www.tarpley.net/bush8.htm ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 23 Feb 2001 07:38:35 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Re: New Thread! (was: radius .-) <> Brian ¿Quincy! Hutchings 23-FEB-2001 7:38 r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us eh, what? thus quoth: He says the spherical version of a asterion is always one tetravolume greater than its great-circle-cord version. >--Le Duke d'Enron! >http://www.tarpley.net/bush8.htm ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 23 Feb 2001 07:44:07 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Re: New Thread! (was: radius .-) <> Brian ¿Quincy! Hutchings 23-FEB-2001 7:44 r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us nothing's wrong. if you're used to f-stops in cameras, that's a power of secondroot(2) -- which is definitively (usually) not "square," either! I prefer to stick with rationals under radicals: the three-halvth-root(2) is irrational (or you can call it the two-thirds-root(1/2), I think .-) thus quoth: length 2, and a volume 8. This fits into a cube of edge length sqrt2. The volume of a cube this size is (sqrt2)^3. That come to 2.8284271247461907. What's --Le Duke d'Enron! >>http://www.tarpley.net/bush8.htm ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 23 Feb 2001 07:51:23 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Re: Back in the saddle again <> Brian ¿Quincy! Hutchings 23-FEB-2001 7:51 r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us yeah, welcome "back;" I think. Mark? MT? The Mighty Thunderbird ?!? thus quoth: deliver natural real world answer ... No applause needed .....=20 >--Le Duke d'Enron! >>>http://www.tarpley.net/bush8.htm ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 23 Feb 2001 19:37:19 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Kirby Urner Subject: Re: New Thread! (was: radius .-) In-Reply-To: <20010223185103.17250.qmail@web4402.mail.yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >Approaching from the other side, I have a tet of edge >length 2, and a volume 8. This fits into a cube of >edge length sqrt2. The volume of a cube this size is >(sqrt2)^3. That come to 2.8284271247461907. What's >wrong here? > The tetra edge is 2 radii, i.e. we define it in the sphere packing matrix as the edges interconnecting 4 spheres of radius 1. So you could also say the edges are of 1 diameter (1 D vs. 2 R). This is what we'll call the unit volume tetrahedron in synergetics (I'm not going with 8). According to this model, we don't say the cube edge to the 3rd power is the cube's volume. That's how we do it in XYZ, but not in the IVM. What you've come up with is the beginnings of the derivation of a conversion constant that will let us convert between these two systems of mensuration. Whereas the XYZ volume of the cube is (sqrt2)^3, as you say, in the IVM its volume is simply 3x that of the inscribed tetrahedron, or 3. IVM : XYZ :: 3 : sqrt2^3, i.e. IVM/XYZ = 3/sqrt2^3 or IVMvolume = XYZvolume (3/sqrt2^3) = XYZvolume (sqrt(9/8)) [easier to remember, as Brian Hutchings pointed out some years back]. sqrt(9/8) is what Bucky calls the 3rd power of his "synergetics constant". Kirby ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 23 Feb 2001 19:37:48 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Kirby Urner Subject: Re: New Thread! (was: radius .-) In-Reply-To: <20010223204205.1093.qmail@web4406.mail.yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >Say I say the V-radius of a tet is 1. The edge >length,a, then becomes 1.6333. That is because >V-radius=edge length*sqrt6/4(from A-module). The tet >volume is a^3sqrt2/12=0.5135. > >A sphere with radius 1 has a volume of 4.188. > >About right? Then the corresponding cube's volume is >1.155^3=1.541. >Divide that by 3 give the tet volume 0.5135. >I think this works. > Looks right. Kirby ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 23 Feb 2001 20:24:36 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Kirby Urner Subject: Re: New Thread! (was: radius .-) In-Reply-To: <20010223193026.22113.qmail@web4402.mail.yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >As to that last "calculation" I made, let me start >over. >A tet with edge 2 has a volume of 1/2 bh. >Or 2^3/12*sqrt2=0.940. >The cube of edge sqrt2 has a volume of 2.8284. this 3 >times 0.94. Right this time? > This is all correct. Multiplying these XYZ volumes by the syn3 (= sqrt(9/8): Tet: >>> xyzvol = (2**3/12.)*math.sqrt(2) >>> syn3 = math.sqrt(9./8) >>> xyzvol * syn3 0.99999999999999989 (i.e. 1) Cube: >>> (math.sqrt(2)**3)*syn3 3.0000000000000004 (i.e. 3) Kirby ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 24 Feb 2001 09:51:29 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Re: New Thread! (was: radius .-) In-Reply-To: <3.0.3.32.20010223193719.00b6b100@pop3.norton.antivirus> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Wow, the light comes on! --- Kirby Urner wrote: > >Approaching from the other side, I have a tet of > edge > >length 2, and a volume 8. This fits into a cube of > >edge length sqrt2. The volume of a cube this size > is > >(sqrt2)^3. That come to 2.8284271247461907. What's > >wrong here? > > > > The tetra edge is 2 radii, i.e. we define it in the > sphere packing matrix as the edges interconnecting > 4 spheres of radius 1. So you could also say the > edges > are of 1 diameter (1 D vs. 2 R). This is what we'll > call the unit volume tetrahedron in synergetics (I'm > not going with 8). > > According to this model, we don't say the cube edge > to the 3rd power is the cube's volume. That's how > we do it in XYZ, but not in the IVM. > > What you've come up with is the beginnings of the > derivation of a conversion constant that will let > us convert between these two systems of mensuration. > > Whereas the XYZ volume of the cube is (sqrt2)^3, as > you say, in the IVM its volume is simply 3x that of > the > inscribed tetrahedron, or 3. IVM : XYZ :: 3 : > sqrt2^3, > i.e. IVM/XYZ = 3/sqrt2^3 or IVMvolume = XYZvolume > (3/sqrt2^3) > = XYZvolume (sqrt(9/8)) [easier to remember, as > Brian > Hutchings pointed out some years back]. > > sqrt(9/8) is what Bucky calls the 3rd power of his > "synergetics constant". > > Kirby ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 24 Feb 2001 09:54:19 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Re: New Thread! (was: radius .-) In-Reply-To: <200102231538.f1NFcZU13439@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii --- Brian Hutchings wrote: > <> Brian ¿Quincy! Hutchings > 23-FEB-2001 7:38 > r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us > > eh, what? > > thus quoth: > He says the spherical version of a asterion is > always > one tetravolume greater than its great-circle-cord > version. Well, what language/term do you want to use. You nixed vertexion. > >--Le Duke d'Enron! > >http://www.tarpley.net/bush8.htm ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 24 Feb 2001 10:22:27 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Re: New Thread! (was: radius .-) In-Reply-To: <3.0.3.32.20010223193719.00b6b100@pop3.norton.antivirus> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii snip> IVM : XYZ :: 3 : > sqrt2^3, > i.e. IVM/XYZ = 3/sqrt2^3 or IVMvolume = XYZvolume > (3/sqrt2^3) > = XYZvolume (sqrt(9/8)) [easier to remember, as > Brian > Hutchings pointed out some years back]. > > sqrt(9/8) is what Bucky calls the 3rd power of his > "synergetics constant". > > Kirby Is there a 4th power synergetic constant,too? And, is there an equivilent A-module to the icosa somewhere? Both A and B modules have helped me imagine the goings-on here. Dick ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 24 Feb 2001 04:22:29 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Re: New Thread! (was: radius .-) <> Brian ¿Quincy! Hutchings 24-FEB-2001 4:22 r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us I didn't "nix" VERTEXION (tm), but I think that it should be tortured slowly to death! I was referring to the content of the problem, which sounds like something that escaped critical analysis -- bad adjuvant! thus quoth: > He says the spherical version of a asterion is > always > one tetravolume greater than its great-circle-cord > version. --Le Duke d'Enron! > >http://www.tarpley.net/bush8.htm ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 24 Feb 2001 04:50:55 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Re: [Q-P] political assassination and Unimogs <> Brian ¿Quincy! Hutchings 24-FEB-2001 4:50 r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us (Also re: [Q-P] Quakers and abolition) Wow -- and almost as predictable as George bombing Iraq (I'm sure, we weren't the only ones), is the revival of the infamous "Thornburgh Doctrine." Oh; you've never heard of it? See http://www.tarpley.net/bush24.htm -- a very long chapter in a very trying, too-well-documented book of Sir George's whacky career; written by two associates of seven who were jailed by him, based upon a phoney bankruptcy proceedings against 3 publishing companies, which was later declared a "constructive fraud upon the Court," by the Court, and as the most extensive governmental misconduct, ever in the USA, to his knowledge, by one of the attorneys, Ramsey Clark. thus quoth: "A bill that would restore the president's authority to order the assassination of foreign leaders is winding its way through Congress even as it raises eyebrows outside Washington." http://www.foxnews.com/politics/021401/assassin_dupre.sml Re: [Q-P] Quakers and abolition There's plenty of evidence that Garrison & cohorts were working in such a way as to promote Sessesh, along with such rabid dupes as John Brown. (See _Treason in America_ by Anton Chaitkin.) thus quoth: These events occurred long before the 1850s. In fact they were bred by the rise of Garrisonian, radical, abolitionism after 1831. Garrison was always lamenting the weakness of Quakers when it came to sticking to the cause, although of course he found many supporters among Friends too. thus quoth: Yes, a few Quakers who became involved in activities as joining John Brown's group training for the Harper's Ferry raid, or housing and sustaining the group, had lapsed from organized Meeting life or were disowned, but --Les Dukes d'Enron! http://www.tarpley.net ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 24 Feb 2001 04:54:05 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Re: [Q-P] Energy policy on the WWW etc. <> Brian ¿Quincy! Hutchings 24-FEB-2001 4:54 r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us What must be grokked, perhaps, regardless of whether the simulacra bear-out their programming, is that these small countries get dysproportionate power in the General Assembly. You wouldn't call many of them "nations," because they're part of a retrocolonial block, like the Commonwealth (and often have most of their government run by Crown Agents e.g., which was actually "privatized" by the monarchy in the last decade (I think)). Sure, 15' of headway above the water is small, in the face of any kind of erosion or just high seas. The problem with the models is, they don't deal with the tell-tale anomalies of altitude, lattitude and season -- dysregarding the fact that most of the CO2 spike *is* seasonal, and that any "ratcheting" of the level is *assumed* to be anthropogenic. The other thing is, such scenarios as "doubling," presume that there will be no phase-change (nonlinearity) in such a trend (as per the Shackleton et al data, apparently). thus quoth: SOUND PRINT Kiribati in Crisis. As global warming creates rising sea levels, no one is perhaps more vulnerable than people who live on small islands. overcrowded, polluted, running out of water, affected by coastal erosion and disease. And while much of that is the result of outside influences, Kiribati is failing to find solutions. thus quoth: Global average temperature and sea level are projected to rise under all IPCC SRES scenarios. The projected rate of warming is much larger than the observed changes during the 20th century and is very likely to be without precedent during at least the last 10,000 years, based on palaeoclimate data. (when best data is available) Anthropogenic climate change will persist for many centuries. --Les Dukes d'Enron! http://www.tarpley.net ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 24 Feb 2001 12:23:57 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dexter Graphic Subject: Re: Human Nature / Laws of Nature In-Reply-To: <003e01c09c93$06a9f0e0$9b08fbcf@oemcomputer> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > I think you should read the following: > http://www.cruzio.com/~joemoore/Strategy/GrandStrategy.htm > > and see this page re energy: > http://www.cruzio.com/~joemoore/Ideas/EndEnergyRenewable.htm > > Joe S Moore: joemoore@cruzio.com A sensibly society might be able to achieve all these things. The current world-order (driven by avarice) will not even try. See "Easter's End" by Jared Diamond: http://dieoff.com/page145.htm ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 24 Feb 2001 14:46:39 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Kirby Urner Subject: Re: New Thread! (was: radius .-) In-Reply-To: <20010224182227.25470.qmail@web4403.mail.yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >Is there a 4th power synergetic constant,too? And, Yes, Fuller goes on up the scale in one section. >is there an equivilent A-module to the icosa >somewhere? Both A and B modules have helped me imagine >the goings-on here. > >Dick The S,T and E modules are what Fuller developed toward the end of his career -- the T-mods a 9th hour inclusion according to Ed. These are for working with the 5-fold symmetric polys, which we get to by jitterbugging the cuboctahedron (buildable from As and Bs). Note: A = B = T in terms of volume (1/24th the regular tet interconnecting 4 IVM spheres of unit radius). ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 24 Feb 2001 16:57:22 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Subject: Re: Human Nature / Laws of Nature MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Dexter, We now know for a fact that humanity has enough know-how to solve all it's physical problems. But will humanity apply that info? Fuller felt that humanity is presently in the midst of facing a "Final Exam". Whether we will pass or not is still unknown. Will humanity have the wisdom to choose "Utopia"--or spiral into "Oblivion"? He felt that it is touch -and-go: Will enough humans choose honesty & integrity to tip the balance? We shall see. I have to assume that we will make it, otherwise there is no reason to continue existing. Joe S Moore: joemoore@cruzio.com Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute: http://www.cruzio.com/~joemoore/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dexter Graphic" Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic To: Sent: Saturday, February 24, 2001 12:23 PM Subject: Re: Human Nature / Laws of Nature > > I think you should read the following: > > http://www.cruzio.com/~joemoore/Strategy/GrandStrategy.htm > > > > and see this page re energy: > > http://www.cruzio.com/~joemoore/Ideas/EndEnergyRenewable.htm > > > > Joe S Moore: joemoore@cruzio.com > > A sensibly society might be able to achieve all these things. > The current world-order (driven by avarice) will not even try. > > See "Easter's End" by Jared Diamond: > http://dieoff.com/page145.htm > ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 25 Feb 2001 08:41:12 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Steve Waterman Subject: interesting links MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit some interesting links from the site of Martin Kraus.... http://wwwvis.informatik.uni-stuttgart.de/~kraus/LiveGraphics3D/links.html steve ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 25 Feb 2001 20:05:36 +0330 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: tina Subject: Any Pictures MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0024_01C09F66.513E6CA0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0024_01C09F66.513E6CA0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Please Give Me Any Pictures. Tina@Mail.dci.co.ir ------=_NextPart_000_0024_01C09F66.513E6CA0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Please Give Me Any = Pictures.
 
Tina@Mail.dci.co.ir
<= /BODY> ------=_NextPart_000_0024_01C09F66.513E6CA0-- ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 25 Feb 2001 12:15:31 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: marksomers Subject: Re: Any Pictures MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0008_01C09F24.A59DDFC0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0008_01C09F24.A59DDFC0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hey Brian, Do you still have those photos of all of us, on this thread, roller = blading in speedos up in Venice, to send to Tina? =20 ----- Original Message -----=20 From: tina=20 Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.ACSU.BUFFALO.EDU=20 Sent: Sunday, February 25, 2001 9:35 AM Subject: Any Pictures Please Give Me Any Pictures. =20 Tina@Mail.dci.co.ir ------=_NextPart_000_0008_01C09F24.A59DDFC0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hey Brian,
 
Do you still have those photos of all = of us, on=20 this thread, roller blading in speedos up in Venice, to = send to=20 Tina?  
 
 
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 tina
Newsgroups: = bit.listserv.geodesic
To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.ACSU.BUFFALO= .EDU=20
Sent: Sunday, February 25, 2001 = 9:35=20 AM
Subject: Any Pictures

Please Give Me Any = Pictures.
 
Tina@Mail.dci.co.ir
<= /BLOCKQUOTE> ------=_NextPart_000_0008_01C09F24.A59DDFC0-- ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 25 Feb 2001 06:48:36 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Re: [Q-P] Bill Clinton's latest <> Brian ¿Quincy! Hutchings 25-FEB-2001 6:48 r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us wow; and, we cannot assume that everyone "believes" the hype, although they may gossip about it! President C1 C2 C3 -------------------------------------------------------------- Roosevelt (FD) 28 % 3687 307 Truman 42 2044 256 Eisenhower 27 1157 145 Kennedy 41 575 209 Johnson 30 1187 226 Nixon 26 926 168 Ford 31 409 273 Carter 22 566 141 Reagan 13 406 51 Bush (GHW) 5 77 19 Clinton 6 448 56 -------------------------------------------------------------- C1 == Percentage of clemency requests granted C2 == Number of clemency requests granted C3 == Number of clemency requests granted per year -------------------------------------------------------------- Source: Office of the Pardon Attorney, Department of Justice -------------------------------------------------------------- These "clemency" numbers include individual pardons and commutations only. For example, they do not include the thousands of Vietnam-era "draft dodgers" whose pardons were approved by Jimmy Carter. You may see different numbers elsewhere. A common source of confusion is that some mistakenly refer to pardons only; others (such as the table above) include both (outright) pardons and commutations of sentences. For example: the _NYT_, always self-righteous and always looking to make interesting mistakes, has said -- in the same edition of the paper -- that Clinton "pardoned" 140 people on his last day in office and that he "pardoned" 176 people on his last day in office; the latter number includes both pardons and commutations of sentences. Anyway, given the table, what's so exceptional about the Clinton pardons? It can't be the "appearance" of "pardons for sale" -- that applies --Les Dukes d'Enron! http://www.tarpley.net/bush8.htm ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 25 Feb 2001 07:07:30 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Re: live **** or die? <> Brian ¿Quincy! Hutchings 25-FEB-2001 7:07 r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us in no way to excuse the Court from it's high-handed "selection" of "JR" Bush (nor its earlier deal with "JR" Bush, no matter how unreported by the scandal-lovin'media), but there really ought to be a great dystinction between apportionment, perhaps, and actual voting, with the latter being perhaps the most important of "states' rights" in the non-neocon sense (not Confederated, that is). especially, shouldn't we guard against i-voting, since this has such potential to be hacked by out-of-state/supranational/corporatist powers -- one of the reasons for having the *deliberative* body of the Electoral College delegation, meeting inside of it's Capitol! see the book, _Vote-scam_, and compare with Dirty Dick Morris' Vote.com! thus quoth: the Congress, Scalia implies in a paragraph quoted below, we must settle for a sort of "know-nothing" hand-count only -- and surely a hand-count must be accurate enough for the America of the year 2000 if it was accurate enough for the founders. And from this comes part (2b) of my contrast: if the census data are inaccurate (which the Court acknowledges) then the unfairness follows, as inaccurate data will be used to determine representation in Congress. Yet the (predictable) five-person majority decided that using only inaccurate and unfair numbers was still the best thing to do, provided the numbers were purely the result of a manual count (of people, not votes). | Could it be that all these Congresses [in the past] were unaware | that ... estimation techniques "will make the census more accurate | than an admittedly futile attempt to count every individual by | personal inspection, interview, or written interrogatory"? ... | There were difficult-to-reach inhabitants in the early 1800's, just | as there are today -- indeed, perhaps a greater proportion of them, | since the society was overwhelmingly composed of farmers, and largely | of frontiersmen. And though there were no professional statisticians, | it must have been known that various methods of estimating unreachable | people would be more accurate than assuming that all unreachable | people did not exist. (Thomas Jefferson's 1782 estimate of the | population of Virginia based upon limited data and specific | demographic assumptions is thought to have been accurate by a | margin of one-to-two percent. ... .) Yet such methods of | estimation have not been used for over two centuries. | Justice Stevens reasons from the purpose of the census clause: "The | census is intended to serve the constitutional goal of equal | representation. . . . That goal is best served by the use of a | `Manner' that is most likely to be complete and accurate." ... | That is true enough, and would prove the point if either (1) | every estimate is more accurate than a headcount, or (2) Congress | could be relied upon to permit only those estimates that are more | accurate than headcounts. It is metaphysically certain that the | first proposition is false, and morally certain that the second is. | To give Congress the power, under the guise of regulating the "Manner" | by which the census is taken, to select among various estimation | techniques having credible (or even incredible) "expert" support, is | to give the party controlling Congress the power to distort represen- | tation in its own favor. In other words, genuine enumeration may not | be the most accurate way of determining population, but it may be the | most accurate way of determining population with minimal possibility | of partisan manipulation. The prospect of this Court's reviewing | estimation techniques in the future, to determine which of them so | obviously creates a distortion that it cannot be allowed, is not a | happy one. ... Indeed, it is doubtful whether ... the Court would | even have available the raw material to conduct such review | effectively. As pointed out by the appellants in the present cases, | we will _never_ be able to assess the relative accuracy of the | sampling system used for the 2000 census by comparing it to the | results of a headcount, _for_there_will_have_been_no_headcount._ About this second excerpt, three observations: (1) The last line is particularly silly -- no one other than the Republican plaintiffs was suggesting that the Bureau of the Census would abandon hand-counts entirely and serve up some data-free, purely statistical concoction instead -- but Scalia apparently fell for this nonsense -- an error made by no other --Les Dukes d'Enron! http://www.tarpley.net ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 25 Feb 2001 20:40:39 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Kirby Urner Subject: Re: Any Pictures In-Reply-To: <000b01c09f5f$532950e0$3b93a6d8@intch.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/enriched; charset="us-ascii" At 12:15 PM 02/25/2001 -0700, you wrote: >>>> ArialHey Brian, ArialDo you still have those photos of all of us, on this thread, roller blading in speedos up in Venice, to send to Tina? <<<<<<<< Mark, you might have missed these: Important meeting re Elastic Interval Geometry: http://www.inetarena.com/~pdx4d/ocn/graphics/eigmeeting.jpg Kirby and Steve celebrating a minor victory: http://www.inetarena.com/~pdx4d/ocn/graphics/happydays.jpg >>>> ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 25 Feb 2001 21:40:08 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Subject: Re: Any Pictures Comments: cc: Tina@Mail.dci.co.ir MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0024_01C09F73.863D65C0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0024_01C09F73.863D65C0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Tina, Here's about 1000 pics that are relevant to the work of R Buckminster = Fuller: http://www.cruzio.com/~joemoore/Pics/ Joe S Moore: joemoore@cruzio.com Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute: http://www.cruzio.com/~joemoore/ =20 ----- Original Message -----=20 From: tina=20 Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.ACSU.BUFFALO.EDU=20 Sent: Sunday, February 25, 2001 8:35 AM Subject: Any Pictures Please Give Me Any Pictures. Tina@Mail.dci.co.ir ------=_NextPart_000_0024_01C09F73.863D65C0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Tina,
 
Here's about 1000 pics that = are=20 relevant to the work of R Buckminster Fuller:
http://www.cruzio.com/~joe= moore/Pics/

Joe S Moore: joemoore@cruzio.com
Buckminste= r Fuller=20 Virtual Institute: http://www.cruzio.com/~joemoore= /
 
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 tina
Newsgroups: = bit.listserv.geodesic
To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.ACSU= .BUFFALO.EDU=20
Sent: Sunday, February 25, 2001 = 8:35=20 AM
Subject: Any Pictures

Please Give Me Any = Pictures.
 
Tina@Mail.dci.co.ir
<= /BLOCKQUOTE> ------=_NextPart_000_0024_01C09F73.863D65C0-- ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 26 Feb 2001 11:01:31 +0330 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: tina Subject: HELP ME MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_00AA_01C09FE3.79C4B120" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_00AA_01C09FE3.79C4B120 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I Am Tina Thanks For Help Me About Pictures. I Want Send E-Mail To This : But Always Receive This Mail : >You are not authorized to send mail to >the BOLFAM-L list = from your >tina@MAIL.DCI.CO.IR account. You >might be authorized to send to the = list from >another of your accounts, or perhaps >when using another mail = program which >generates slightly different addresses, but >LISTSERV has no way to = associate >this other account or address with yours. If >you need assistance or if = you have >any question regarding the policy of the >BOLFAM-L list, please contact = the list >owners: BOLFAM-L->request@LISTSERV.OKSTATE.EDU. > ... Please Help Me... Thanks. Tina ------=_NextPart_000_00AA_01C09FE3.79C4B120 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I Am Tina
 
Thanks For Help Me About = Pictures.
I Want Send E-Mail To This = :
 
<BOLFAM-L@LISTSERV.OKSTATE.E= DU>
 
But Always Receive This Mail = :
 
>You =20 are  not  authorized  to  send   = mail =20 to  >the  BOLFAM-L  list  from =20 your
>
tina@MAIL.DCI.CO.IR
account. You  >might be = authorized to=20 send to  the list from
>another of  your accounts,  = or=20 perhaps  >when using  another mail  program=20 which
>generates slightly  different addresses, but =20 >LISTSERV has no way  to associate
>this other account or = address=20 with yours. If >you need assistance or if you have
>any = question=20 regarding the policy of the >BOLFAM-L list, please contact the=20 list
>owners: BOLFAM-L->request@LISTSERV.OKSTATE.EDU.
> ...
 
Please Help Me...
Thanks.
Tina
------=_NextPart_000_00AA_01C09FE3.79C4B120-- ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 26 Feb 2001 02:08:59 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: marksomers Subject: Re: Any Pictures MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0020_01C09F99.14A5D980" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0020_01C09F99.14A5D980 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable ROTFLMAO...=20 ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Kirby Urner=20 Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.ACSU.BUFFALO.EDU=20 Sent: Sunday, February 25, 2001 9:40 PM Subject: Re: Any Pictures At 12:15 PM 02/25/2001 -0700, you wrote: >>>> Hey Brian, Do you still have those photos of all of us, on this thread, roller = blading in speedos up in Venice, to send to Tina? <<<< Mark, you might have missed these: Important meeting re Elastic Interval Geometry: http://www.inetarena.com/~pdx4d/ocn/graphics/eigmeeting.jpg Kirby and Steve celebrating a minor victory: http://www.inetarena.com/~pdx4d/ocn/graphics/happydays.jpg >>>>=20 ------=_NextPart_000_0020_01C09F99.14A5D980 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
ROTFLMAO...
 
 
 
 
 
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Kirby = Urner=20
Newsgroups: = bit.listserv.geodesic
To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.ACSU.BUFFALO= .EDU=20
Sent: Sunday, February 25, 2001 = 9:40=20 PM
Subject: Re: Any Pictures

At 12:15 PM 02/25/2001 -0700, you=20 wrote:
>>>>
Hey = Brian,

Do=20 you still have those photos of all of us, on this thread, roller = blading in=20 speedos up in Venice, to send to=20 = Tina?

<<<<
Mark,=20 you might have missed these:


Important meeting re Elastic = Interval=20 Geometry:
http= ://www.inetarena.com/~pdx4d/ocn/graphics/eigmeeting.jpg

Kirby = and Steve celebrating a minor=20 = victory:
http://www.inetarena.com/~pdx4d/ocn/graphics/happydays.jpg

>>>>=20
------=_NextPart_000_0020_01C09F99.14A5D980-- ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 26 Feb 2001 02:30:34 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: marksomers Subject: Re: HELP ME MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0062_01C09F9C.19013D00" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0062_01C09F9C.19013D00 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!!!!!! Oklahoma ..... that explains a lot. =20 ----- Original Message -----=20 From: tina=20 Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.ACSU.BUFFALO.EDU=20 Sent: Monday, February 26, 2001 12:31 AM Subject: HELP ME I Am Tina =20 Thanks For Help Me About Pictures. I Want Send E-Mail To This : =20 =20 But Always Receive This Mail : =20 >You are not authorized to send mail to >the BOLFAM-L list = from your >tina@MAIL.DCI.CO.IR account. You >might be authorized to send to = the list from >another of your accounts, or perhaps >when using another mail = program which >generates slightly different addresses, but >LISTSERV has no way = to associate >this other account or address with yours. If >you need assistance or = if you have >any question regarding the policy of the >BOLFAM-L list, please = contact the list >owners: BOLFAM-L->request@LISTSERV.OKSTATE.EDU. > ... =20 Please Help Me... Thanks. Tina ------=_NextPart_000_0062_01C09F9C.19013D00 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!!!!!!
 
Oklahoma ..... that explains a = lot.
 
 
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 tina
Newsgroups: = bit.listserv.geodesic
To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.ACSU.BUFFALO= .EDU=20
Sent: Monday, February 26, 2001 = 12:31=20 AM
Subject: HELP ME

I Am Tina
 
Thanks For Help Me About = Pictures.
I Want Send E-Mail To This = :
 
<BOLFAM-L@LISTSERV.OKSTATE.E= DU>
 
But Always Receive This Mail = :
 
>You =20 are  not  authorized  to  send   = mail =20 to  >the  BOLFAM-L  list  from =20 your
>
tina@MAIL.DCI.CO.IR
account. You  >might be = authorized to=20 send to  the list from
>another of  your = accounts,  or=20 perhaps  >when using  another mail  program=20 which
>generates slightly  different addresses, but =20 >LISTSERV has no way  to associate
>this other account = or=20 address with yours. If >you need assistance or if you = have
>any=20 question regarding the policy of the >BOLFAM-L list, please contact = the=20 list
>owners: BOLFAM-L->request@LISTSERV.OKSTATE.EDU.
> ...
 
Please Help Me...
Thanks.
Tina
------=_NextPart_000_0062_01C09F9C.19013D00-- ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 26 Feb 2001 02:36:35 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: marksomers Subject: Re: Back in the saddle again MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit OK .... so diverse was like ... a really bad ... no sucky word to use ... Ahem.. dereg of the utilities as you correctlty pointed out Brian has had a (bad impact) here in Montana because we are also dereg. but we do gots lots of buffalo.. chips. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Brian Hutchings" Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic To: Sent: Friday, February 23, 2001 8:29 AM Subject: Re: Back in the saddle again > <> Brian ¿Quincy! Hutchings 23-FEB-2001 7:29 > r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us > > well, OK. > > thus quoth: > >>>> > > > > ArialP.S. Brian you were right about > the dereg of utilities having a diverse affect even in this part of the > woods. > > > > ArialMark > > > > > > <<<<<<<< > > --Le Duke d'Enron! > http://www.tarpley.net/bush8.htm > ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 26 Feb 2001 02:16:04 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Mark Siegmund Subject: Kirby? Comments: To: Tetworld Comments: cc: "Geodesic Listserve GEODESIC"@LISTSERV.ACSU.BUFFALO.EDU Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Hi Kirby... I'm looking for the text of Bucky's words re the world game complex design, ie, 400' dome, 300' dymax map, 10-20 million display bulbs do you have the text, remember it, or remember the source? mark ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 26 Feb 2001 03:05:31 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Mark Siegmund Subject: Re: [adcomm] FW: Tetworld Center In-Reply-To: <002701c09db7$354eb320$960efbcf@oemcomputer> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Hi Joe, I've sent an email to Michael Keller, Stanford Librarian, regarding the Bucky archive & Stanford's plans... thanks... Mark > From: Joe S Moore > Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works > > Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic > Date: Fri, 23 Feb 2001 08:39:04 -0800 > To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.ACSU.BUFFALO.EDU > Subject: Re: [adcomm] FW: Tetworld Center > > Mark, > > Hopefully the Bucky archive at Stanford will be open to the public this > year. Also I have heard that they will be setting up a Bucky website, but I > don't have any details. > > Here is the New York Times article in the Geodesic archives: > http://listserv.acsu.buffalo.edu/cgi-bin/wa?A2=ind9907&L=geodesic&P=R2772&m= > 8520 > > Also, here is the article in the BFI newsletter: > http://www.bfi.org/Trimtab/t699a.htm#fuller_archive.htm > > Joe S Moore: joemoore@cruzio.com > Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute: http://www.cruzio.com/~joemoore/ > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Mark Siegmund" > To: "Tetworld Global Advisory Committee" > Sent: Friday, February 23, 2001 6:33 AM > Subject: Re: [adcomm] FW: Tetworld Center > > >> Tetworld Global Advisory Committee - http://www.tetworld.org >> >> >> Joe, what are plans at the Bucky Archives--perhaps they would welcome > having >> them on-line. Is there yet an email and/or url for the archives? >> >> Mark >> >>> From: "Joe S Moore" >>> Reply-To: "Tetworld Global Advisory Committee" >>> Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 17:40:52 -0800 >>> To: "Tetworld Global Advisory Committee" >>> Cc: "_Geodesic" >>> Subject: Re: [adcomm] FW: Tetworld Center >>> >>> Tetworld Global Advisory Committee - http://www.tetworld.org > (snip) > ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 26 Feb 2001 03:21:17 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Mark Siegmund Subject: Global Data Manager Comments: To: Tetglobal , Tetworld , Tetworld Advisory Committee , "Geodesic Listserve GEODESIC"@LISTSERV.ACSU.BUFFALO.EDU Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Hi, has anyone used world game's global data manager? thanks, mark ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 26 Feb 2001 20:08:06 +0330 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: tina MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_00CE_01C0A02F.D4FF92C0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_00CE_01C0A02F.D4FF92C0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable ------=_NextPart_000_00CE_01C0A02F.D4FF92C0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
 
------=_NextPart_000_00CE_01C0A02F.D4FF92C0-- ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 26 Feb 2001 13:25:33 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Re: in-out To those who program Java or other moving pictures- This will be very cool. Make am animation as follows: Start with a triangular cone, where the edge length of the triangle is equal to the height of the cone. Have the triangle rotate 1/2 turn(180 degress) as it moves toward the vertex of the cone. The triangle gets smaller and smaller as it approaches the vertex, and vanishes as it does reach the vertex. Make six clockwise and six counter-clockwise(left and right) spiraling versions of the discribed vanishing triangle. Superimpose all 12 spiraling, shrinking triangular cones so that all vertexes coincide, and have oppositely spiraling cones share axes. The 4 required axes are the sixty degree IVM axes. When the 12 triangular cones vanish, they each reappear on the other side of the vertex and continue rotating in the same direction while expanding to their original size. As the VE reappears in the exact location that it began, it continues WITHOUT losing any momentum, until it disappears again. This is a new(?) embodiment of the Jitterbug to better model Nature's pulsating energy transformations. There is a resemblance between this model and the rodeo-rope-expert that repeatedly jumps through his or her rotating, torusing lasso. Dick On Thu, 22 Feb 2001 11:20:32 -0800, Dick Fischbeck wrote: >Last night while turning a jitterbug repetitively >inside-out, I could see how no momentum is lost and >this oscillation is probably a perfect model for >omni-energetic dynamic balance. I think of it as the >4-d gyroscope. Does anyone know how to do a moving >image of this? I think it would be one step beyond the >beautiful jitterbug VE/octa transformationing Kirby >(and others?) already have in place. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 26 Feb 2001 10:36:44 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Subject: Re: Kirby? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Mark, Here's my list of World Game refs: http://www.cruzio.com/~joemoore/Index/World.htm Plus, if you use the search function on the bottom of my home page, you will get 143 hits for world + game . Joe S Moore: joemoore@cruzio.com Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute: http://www.cruzio.com/~joemoore/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mark Siegmund" Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic To: Sent: Monday, February 26, 2001 2:16 AM Subject: Kirby? > Hi Kirby... > > I'm looking for the text of Bucky's words re the world game complex design, > ie, 400' dome, 300' dymax map, 10-20 million display bulbs > > do you have the text, remember it, or remember the source? > > mark > > ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 26 Feb 2001 22:49:03 +0330 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: tina Subject: IRAN MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0038_01C0A046.51266700" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0038_01C0A046.51266700 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Please Help Me ... Please Help Me About Any Information of IRAN Country. I,Am Spanish Man . I Live To Iran . Here is Good Country. And Freedom. Iranian People Is Very Hospitable. This Country is Very Beautiful , Especially : Isfihan & Shiraz Citys. ------=_NextPart_000_0038_01C0A046.51266700 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Please Help Me ...
 
Please Help Me About Any Information of = IRAN=20 Country.
I,Am Spanish Man . I Live To Iran . = Here=20 is Good Country.
And Freedom. Iranian People Is=20 Very Hospitable.
This Country is Very Beautiful , = Especially=20 :
Isfihan = & Shiraz Citys.
------=_NextPart_000_0038_01C0A046.51266700-- ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 26 Feb 2001 16:56:52 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Re: New Thread! (was: radius .-) In-Reply-To: <200102241222.f1OCMTK16842@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii I am stuck with vertexion, then, until someone has a better name. Somehow I can not dismiss the content in question so easily. Yeah, maybe it is a dead end. --- Brian Hutchings wrote: > <> Brian ¿Quincy! Hutchings > 24-FEB-2001 4:22 > r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us > > I didn't "nix" VERTEXION (tm), but > I think that it should be tortured slowly to death! > I was referring to the content of the problem, > which sounds like something that escaped critical > analysis > -- bad adjuvant! > > thus quoth: > > He says the spherical version of a asterion is > > always > > one tetravolume greater than its > great-circle-cord > > version. > > --Le Duke d'Enron! > > >http://www.tarpley.net/bush8.htm ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 26 Feb 2001 13:59:56 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Re: New Thread! (was: great circles .-) <> Brian ¿Quincy! Hutchings 26-FEB-2001 13:59 r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us Weggener (in the _Spherical Models_ book) did use the term, polygon, to refer to "solids" and their vertices. of course, it's confusing, but it might not be so, if we took the beginning of the course with shapes that are not just *on* paper (clearly, they can be *of* paper, as in Weggener .-) in the meantime, I like the use of polyaster, because it's sort-of cognate with spherical geometry o'the stars; naturally, the whole (regular) polyaster'd not be visible in one night on one hemisphere! well, I'd better patent that, quickly! Copyr. '1 CCE by me. but what are we going to call, in some "classical" sense, the shapes by their edges?... I mean, "-sys" is not the worst possible name, by any means! --Les Dukes d'Enron! http://www.tarpley.net/bush8.htm ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 26 Feb 2001 21:18:30 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Subject: Re: Looking for dome dweller to interview Comments: To: _DomeHomeList David, I'm forwarding your query to the Geodesic list & the DomeHome list. Joe S Moore: joemoore@cruzio.com Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute: http://www.cruzio.com/~joemoore/ "David G. Imber" wrote in message news:3a9aad86.6286836@news.i-2000.com... > Hello: > > Please forgive my unfamiliarity with this news group and its > regular manners and procedures (if such exist). > > I write for a Japanese architecture and design magazine > called Casa BRUTUS. > > I'm currently researching a feature on R. Buckminster Fuller. > Specifically, I'm interested in his geodesic domes as dwellings. > > I'm located in New York City, and will shortly fly up to > Montreal to photograph the Biosphere there. But the magazine is > even more interested in making contact with some ordinary (or > extraordinary) individuals who just happen to live in a geodesic > dome. We'd like to photograph their home and interview them about > the experience of living in such a structure. > > If you live in the northeast and fit this profile, or can refer me > to someone who does, I'd be very grateful to speak with you. > > Thank you very much for your time. > > DGI > > ******************************** > David G. Imber > Maniform Creative Services > http://www.maniform.com > > ******************************** ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 26 Feb 2001 22:15:36 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Kirby Urner Subject: Re: New Thread! (was: radius .-) In-Reply-To: <20010227005652.16691.qmail@web4404.mail.yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 04:56 PM 02/26/2001 -0800, you wrote: >I am stuck with vertexion, then, until someone has a >better name. I'm sticking with tetrahedron. Keep the word, change the usage, vs. invent a new word, is my philosophy. Kirby ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 27 Feb 2001 12:07:59 +0330 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: tina Subject: Read Me MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_00A3_01C0A0B5.ED3B8700" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_00A3_01C0A0B5.ED3B8700 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hello I Am Tina. Please Help Me About This List. I Want Information About This List & Buffalo Service. Thanks... tina. ------=_NextPart_000_00A3_01C0A0B5.ED3B8700 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hello
 
I Am Tina.
Please  Help Me About This=20 List.
I Want Information About This List = & Buffalo=20 Service.
 
Thanks...
tina.
------=_NextPart_000_00A3_01C0A0B5.ED3B8700-- ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 27 Feb 2001 13:11:10 +0330 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: tina Subject: Question MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_00AA_01C0A0BE.C0CA7CE0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_00AA_01C0A0BE.C0CA7CE0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable What Proposition this List ? ------=_NextPart_000_00AA_01C0A0BE.C0CA7CE0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

What Proposition this List ?

------=_NextPart_000_00AA_01C0A0BE.C0CA7CE0-- ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 27 Feb 2001 19:16:11 +0330 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: tina Subject: This List MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_014F_01C0A0F1.BE9A0020" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_014F_01C0A0F1.BE9A0020 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Whether This List is Diplomatic ? Please Help Me... ------=_NextPart_000_014F_01C0A0F1.BE9A0020 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Whether This List is Diplomatic = ?
Please Help = Me...
------=_NextPart_000_014F_01C0A0F1.BE9A0020-- ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 27 Feb 2001 11:04:34 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dexter Graphic Subject: Re: Question Comments: cc: tina@MAIL.DCI.CO.IR In-Reply-To: <00bf01c0a0a1$92de60c0$bd2092c3@tina> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > What Proposition this List ? It's a discussion about Buckminster Fuller's ideas for making everyone on this planet a success. Have many people even heard of Buckminster Fuller in Iran? He is famous for inventing the geodesic dome. Have you ever seen one of these geodesic domes? Do they have any over there where you live, Tina, in Isfihan or Shiraz? Dexter ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 27 Feb 2001 11:17:32 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Re: New Thread! (was: radius .-) In-Reply-To: <3.0.3.32.20010226221536.00b5e9d0@pop3.norton.antivirus> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii --- Kirby Urner wrote: > At 04:56 PM 02/26/2001 -0800, you wrote: > >I am stuck with vertexion, then, until someone has > a > >better name. > > I'm sticking with tetrahedron. Keep the word, > change > the usage, vs. invent a new word, is my philosophy. > > Kirby Can't we assume Bucky made the change for a reason? It seems to me that since vertex = event, face = novent, and edge = relationship between events, then vertex is most important. No? By important I mean defining. Face and edge are secondary concepts, in a way. And by naming polyhedron by their number-of-vertexes or crossing, we are not limited to even-numbered event fields(polyhedron). I say event fields because events interact with each other in inverse proportion to their proximity. I don't know if he was original, but a friend said, "Proximity is the _father_ of invention." I've always liked that. I have been thinking of using vexion as short for vertexion. ;) 4, 5, 6, 7-vexion, etc. (I can hear Brian now) Dick ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 27 Feb 2001 11:45:45 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Subject: Re: Read Me MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0058_01C0A0B2.D2523680" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0058_01C0A0B2.D2523680 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Tina, Maybe this will help: http://listserv.acsu.buffalo.edu/archives/geodesic.html Joe S Moore: joemoore@cruzio.com Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute: http://www.cruzio.com/~joemoore/ =20 ----- Original Message -----=20 From: tina=20 Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.ACSU.BUFFALO.EDU=20 Sent: Tuesday, February 27, 2001 12:37 AM Subject: Read Me Hello I Am Tina. Please Help Me About This List. I Want Information About This List & Buffalo Service. Thanks... tina. ------=_NextPart_000_0058_01C0A0B2.D2523680 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Tina,
 
Maybe this will=20 help:
http://l= istserv.acsu.buffalo.edu/archives/geodesic.html
=

Joe S Moore: joemoore@cruzio.com
Buckminste= r Fuller=20 Virtual Institute: http://www.cruzio.com/~joemoore= /
 
----- Original Message -----
From:=20 tina
Newsgroups: = bit.listserv.geodesic
To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.ACSU= .BUFFALO.EDU=20
Sent: Tuesday, February 27, = 2001 12:37=20 AM
Subject: Read Me

Hello
 
I Am Tina.
Please  Help Me About This=20 List.
I Want Information About This List = & Buffalo=20 Service.
 
Thanks...
tina.
------=_NextPart_000_0058_01C0A0B2.D2523680-- ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 27 Feb 2001 23:52:03 +0330 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: tina MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0121_01C0A118.48677280" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0121_01C0A118.48677280 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi, Please Give Me Any Information About Buckminster Fuller's. Thanks. Tina ------=_NextPart_000_0121_01C0A118.48677280 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi,
 
Please Give Me Any Information About = Buckminster=20 Fuller's.
 
Thanks.
Tina
------=_NextPart_000_0121_01C0A118.48677280-- ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 27 Feb 2001 06:59:00 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Re: New Thread! (was: radius .-) <> Brian ¿Quincy! Hutchings 27-FEB-2001 6:59 r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us I think it was great, for Bucky to concentrate upon the trigonated shapes, virtually to the exclusion of the euqlly-important duals of them (with some exception for the hexahedron and the rhombical dodecahedron, as they pertain to space-filling). in a sense, not to do so is obfuscatory, because all of the essential relationships are held in hand, with many newfound ones coming to pass in the process (that is, grouptheoretically, they're the same things). not even Loeb's appendix on the pentagonal dodecah.bothered with the dual relations, as I recalled, but they are important, and having these two, different ways of naming the shapes, merely shows their intertransformability. (Loeb's last book in the "Pattern" series. shich included Edmondspn's introductory one, though, gets deep into this stuff, as a matter of taxonomy, even .-) as for the importance of the "cube" and "square" (octaster and tetragon), it is that they are self-dual in their respective "dimensionality" (which is probably why "2D" space or flatland is of any pseudophysical use, at all; it just works !-) that is to say, in terms of a shape that is centered at an origin, as is usually assumed (or implied), or location (co-ordination), space is definitively 3D (or 2D in flatland); *not* that there are not other ways to ascertain it. that is just the way that Bucky naievely found this stuff, out. I just recalled the rh.triacontah; it has two, different sorts of vertices, so is easier to call by its facets. Bucky's heirarchy isn't sacred, except in certain denominations (tee-hee); there are many other ways to grok this, and better, perhaps. the reference to vertices as "events" is also just fine, but you can make them into facets, as well, by dualization. thus quoth: Can't we assume Bucky made the change for a reason? It seems to me that since vertex = event, face = novent, and edge = relationship between events, then vertex is most important. No? By important I mean defining. just be careful, about using -vertexion; I may get really, reaqlly mad! --Les Dukes d'Enron! http://www.tarpley.net/bush8.htm ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 27 Feb 2001 07:03:49 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: somnabulum tremors <> Brian ¿Quincy! Hutchings 27-FEB-2001 7:03 r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us for the second time in a few months, I was awakened by longtime, rather incessant rumbing of the ground, which I could feel, sleeping on it. as I was getting my shoes on, with the thought of getting way from the buildings, it reached its maximum of a faint sort of jostling, and I just decided to go back to sleep (with my shoes, on .-) I feel that this is pretty normal, and may not be reported, but it surely was interesting, and I have to hypotheses as to thei source (depending upon how far it was, of course). --Les Dukes d'Enron! >http://www.tarpley.net/bush8.htm ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 27 Feb 2001 14:15:30 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dexter Graphic Subject: Re: Question Comments: To: tina In-Reply-To: <012e01c0a0fa$f6705900$bb2092c3@tina> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > > It's a discussion about Buckminster Fuller's ideas for making > > everyone on this planet a success. Have many people even heard > > of Buckminster Fuller in Iran? He is famous for inventing the > > geodesic dome. Have you ever seen one of these geodesic domes? > > Do they have any over there where you live, Tina, in Isfihan > > or Shiraz? > > > > Dexter > > Hi Dexter Thankyou For Answer to My Question. > I Live In Tehran (Metropolis) > Sorry, I Unknowing Many Thing of Buckminster. > I to become Glad if More Know About He. Do you have access to the World Wide Web? Here is a site which tells about his life and work: http://www.bfi.org/ ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 27 Feb 2001 17:59:35 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: 'Bill' 'Eagleton' Subject: Re: This List Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > Whether This List is Diplomatic ? > Please Help Me... Werll, we try to be tactful... The proposal is advancement of Buckminster Fuller's geodestics and related. BillSF9c __________________________________________________________________ Get your own FREE, personal Netscape Webmail account today at http://webmail.netscape.com/ ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 27 Feb 2001 15:26:41 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Kirby Urner Subject: Re: New Thread! (was: radius .-) In-Reply-To: <20010227191732.10171.qmail@web4402.mail.yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 11:17 AM 02/27/2001 -0800, you wrote: >--- Kirby Urner wrote: >> At 04:56 PM 02/26/2001 -0800, you wrote: >> >I am stuck with vertexion, then, until someone has >> a >> >better name. >> >> I'm sticking with tetrahedron. Keep the word, >> change >> the usage, vs. invent a new word, is my philosophy. >> >> Kirby > >Can't we assume Bucky made the change for a reason? Yes. I'm just not following his example in this instance. I'm sticking with tetrahedron, with the understanding that in synergetics we're more interested in events and relation- ships (networks/graphs as wireframes) and less interested in the window-openings framed thereby. Kirby ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 27 Feb 2001 15:28:26 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Kirby Urner In-Reply-To: <012601c0a0fa$f37e9040$bb2092c3@tina> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/enriched; charset="us-ascii" At 11:52 PM 02/27/2001 +0330, you wrote: >>>> ArialHi, ArialPlease Give Me Any Information About Buckminster Fuller's. ArialThanks. Tina <<<<<<<< Didn't Fuller collaborate with Anwar Dil on 'Humans in Universe' and isn't Anwar from Iran? Kirby ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 27 Feb 2001 11:28:49 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Re: New Thread! (was: radius .-) <> Brian ¿Quincy! Hutchings 27-FEB-2001 11:28 r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us topologically, there's no differnce between the tetrahedron and its dual, the tetraster (using inversion or reciprocation in the sphere); what is the differnce in the shape, though? when you finally see the Big Tetraster in the Sky, you may have given Richard Haogland another heart attack! the vertices of the cuboctahedron are all-alike, as with all of the archimedean shapes, as are the facets of their duals; so, how would one call the vertices of the dodecaster? *delta* is the (loser-case) Greek letter that is used to name a trigonal facet (of the deltahedra), so that we can use gamma for a 3-way vertex, chi for 4-way, and so on (if there's no 5-armed, we can use phi, perhaps?) note that the regular/platonic shapes are reguler per both vertices and facets! thus quoth: Yes. I'm just not following his example in this instance. I'm sticking with tetrahedron, with the understanding that in synergetics we're more interested in events and relation- ships (networks/graphs as wireframes) and less interested in the window-openings framed thereby. graph-theory does bring the topological invariance to view, although it could be argues that vertices are more imporant, here (because the facets aren't neccesarily obvious, unless you make a "simplex" of all-possible combinations; isn't that the point of the "window" term, in part?) --Les Dukes d'Enron! >http://www.tarpley.net/bush8.htm ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 28 Feb 2001 12:07:49 +0330 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: tina Subject: Thanks Comments: To: Kirby Urner MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > Didn't Fuller collaborate with Anwar Dil on > 'Humans in Universe' and isn't Anwar from Iran? > > Kirby Hi Kirby Thankyou For Answer to My Question. But I did not understand Your Qestion. Thanks tina@mail.dci.co.ir Hamed. ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 28 Feb 2001 07:25:42 -0600 Reply-To: waux@genevaonline.com Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Glenn Norgren Subject: Re: modeling toys In-Reply-To: <3A8A59F7.B13DB329@ms15.hinet.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Check out IKOSO Kits. They are out west somewhere - Oregon I think. -----Original Message----- From: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works [mailto:GEODESIC@LISTSERV.ACSU.BUFFALO.EDU]On Behalf Of M Sent: Wednesday, February 14, 2001 4:12 AM To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.ACSU.BUFFALO.EDU Subject: modeling toys I got this nifty little toy, Polydron, for my kids... Alright!! Alright!! I got it for me. But, they seem to enjoy it too. It consists of small mold injected plastic plates, triangles, squares, penta- and hexagons that fit together to form polyhedra. Have any more similar geodesic modeling toys out there? Thanks Malcolm ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 28 Feb 2001 17:52:23 +0330 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: tina Subject: Read This MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0024_01C0A1AF.345C8040" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0024_01C0A1AF.345C8040 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hello to All... I Am Hamed Mirzaei. I Have 20 years old. I Find This Address (Buffalo List) To This Book : The Internet Complete Reference By Harley Hahn. ------=_NextPart_000_0024_01C0A1AF.345C8040 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hello to All...
 
I Am Hamed Mirzaei.
I Have 20 years old.
I Find This Address (Buffalo List) To = This Book=20 :
 
The Internet Complete=20 Reference
By
Harley=20 Hahn.
------=_NextPart_000_0024_01C0A1AF.345C8040-- ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 28 Feb 2001 07:37:48 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Kirby Urner Subject: Re: Read This Comments: cc: tina@MAIL.DCI.CO.IR In-Reply-To: <002901c0a192$0e902a00$b72092c3@tina> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/enriched; charset="us-ascii" Hi Hamed -- R. Buckminster Fuller was a philosopher-architect who lived from 1895 to 1983. He invented many things and hoped humans would be a long term success. He had the idea of calling this planet Spaceship Earth. He came up with a map of the world that shows no nations. Although Fuller made contributions to many fields, had many degrees and awards, his writings are not studied very much in schools. Those of us who are interested in developing his ideas about "design science", a way to improve living standards without relying too much on politics, tend to find one another through the internet and we collaborate using this technology. Fuller was perhaps most famous for developing and popularizing a structure known as the geodesic dome. The largest domes in the world are made with this design. A lot of people from the 1960s onward decided they would like to live in dome homes. So many people are attracted to this list because they want to find others who live in, or are thinking about living in, such a structure. The internet contains thousands and thousands of lists where people with common interests share their information and ideas. You have subscribed to this one. I don't know what kind of information you are seeking, or what kind of internet tools you have. I would suggest using a newsreader to look for newsgroups. alt.fan.countries.iran is one such newsgroup. clair.web.world.mideast.iran is another. Here's an excerpt from the latter: TEHRAN, Feb 28 (AFP) - Iran castigated Wednesday plans by the Taliban regime of neighbouring Afghanistan to destroy ancient Buddhist and other statues. "We condemn the destruction of statues of Buddha which are treasures of mankind just like the Taj Mahal, or Imam Square" in Isfahan, Iran's historic monuments organisation said in a statement sent to AFP. The head of the United Nations Cultural, Educational and Scientific Organisation (UNESCO), Koichiro Matuura, should convey the protests of the whole world and act as quickly as possible to save the statues, it added. Taliban foreign minister Wakil Ahmad Mutawakel told AFP Wednesday the decision of the group's supreme leader Mulla Mohammad Omar to destroy pre-Islamic statues in Afghanistan, including the world's tallest Bhuddha dating back 2,000 years, was irreversible. Only some news services will carry these groups. Or if you have a web browser, you should go to a search engine like www.alltheweb.com and type in key words and see what web pages might be of interest. If you don't know how to do any of this, maybe you can find a friend close by who will give your some advice and support. If you continue to have an interest in the work of R. Buckminster Fuller and related ideas, you should stay subscribed to this group, or come back again later when you have done more research -- it is your decision. Personally speaking, I have been to both Isfahan and Shiraz, as well as Tehran (also Afghanistan and many other places). My parents lived in Cairo for many years, as well as Bangladesh -- countries with thriving Islamic cultures. My father was a regional and urban planner, helping to design cities or plan for their expansion. My mother worked to improve living standards for people in other ways. Given their example, it is easy to see why I would be attracted to Bucky Fuller's ideas and his hopes for a more peaceful and well-designed world. Kirby PS: you may get two copies of this because I'm posting to the list, as well as to your email address. At 05:52 PM 02/28/2001 +0330, tina wrote: >>>> ArialHello to All... ArialI Am Hamed Mirzaei. I Have 20 years old. I Find This Address (Buffalo List) To This Book : ArialThe Internet Complete Reference ArialBy Harley Hahn. <<<<<<<< ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 28 Feb 2001 09:33:23 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Subject: Alpine Domes Comments: To: _DomeHomeList MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Mr Bryce Halonen, the owner of Alpine Domes of Monroe, OR, USA, has notified me that his company is no longer in business. Joe S Moore: joemoore@cruzio.com Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute: http://www.cruzio.com/~joemoore/ ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 28 Feb 2001 09:55:40 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Subject: Re: i see you are interested in geodomes: Comments: To: Wally MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Mr McMillan, I'm not quite sure what you are trying to tell me. That you design geodesic domes? If so, then you'll have to add a section on your website about that capability so that I can link to it from my Master Index. Here is Mr Bono's website: http://www.cris.com/~rjbono/ Joe S Moore: joemoore@cruzio.com Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute: http://www.cruzio.com/~joemoore/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Wally" To: Sent: Wednesday, February 28, 2001 2:16 AM Subject: i see you are interested in geodomes: > I sent the following to Rick Bono: > > >Rick Bono wrote: > > > >Anyway, what I am trying to draw a dome in AutoCAD 2000. > > >What angles do i rotate the circles to get the vertices to > > >coinside? > > > > > I'm not sure what you mean here. could you explain? > > > > sure, for free yet: > > In AutoCAD: > 1. draw the polygon > 2. draw a semicircle normal to the polygon thru two opposing > apexes > 3. rotate the semicircle about its diameter in the planeof > the polygon > 4. array the semicircle to the remaining apexes > 5. the intersections of the semicircle are the apexes of the > geodesic dome > (to 13 decimals) > > 'Course, now the following questions: > > a) what happens when there are an odd number of polygon > apexes? > > b) what about doing it for an ellipse, a parabola, a > catenary? > > c) what about doing it for the curve making an ungula of an > ellipsoid or a > hemisphere? > > d) what is the configuration for equal dihedral angles at > the latitudes > and/or the other sides of the facet intersections of the > geodome? > -- > Regards, > Walton McMillan > > 650/ 328-5380 > > Please visit my web site at: www.McMillanEngineers.com for > information ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 28 Feb 2001 10:07:35 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Subject: Re: modeling toys Comments: To: waux@genevaonline.com Comments: cc: _DomeHomeList MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Here is Ikoso-Kits website: http://www.ikoso.com/ Joe S Moore: joemoore@cruzio.com Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute: http://www.cruzio.com/~joemoore/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Glenn Norgren" Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic To: Sent: Wednesday, February 28, 2001 5:25 AM Subject: Re: modeling toys > Check out IKOSO Kits. They are out west somewhere - Oregon I think. > > -----Original Message----- > From: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works > [mailto:GEODESIC@LISTSERV.ACSU.BUFFALO.EDU]On Behalf Of M > Sent: Wednesday, February 14, 2001 4:12 AM > To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.ACSU.BUFFALO.EDU > Subject: modeling toys > > I got this nifty little toy, Polydron, for my kids... Alright!! Alright!! > > I got it for me. But, they seem to enjoy it too. > It consists of small mold injected plastic plates, triangles, squares, > penta- and hexagons that fit together to form polyhedra. > > Have any more similar geodesic modeling toys out there? > > Thanks > > Malcolm ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 28 Feb 2001 22:14:30 +0330 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: tina Comments: To: Kirby Urner MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_00DF_01C0A1D3.D23DA2C0" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_00DF_01C0A1D3.D23DA2C0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Kirby -- Thankyou Verymuch For Help me. Your Mail Was Full Help to me, Thanks. Mr or Mrs Kirby, Do You Live In India? Again Thanks For Help me. I Now Know R.Buckminster Fuller has Eminent Man. Thanks. hamed ------=_NextPart_000_00DF_01C0A1D3.D23DA2C0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi Kirby --
 
Thankyou Verymuch For Help = me.
Your Mail Was Full Help to me, = Thanks.
Mr or Mrs Kirby, Do = You Live In=20 India?
Again Thanks For Help me.
I Now Know=20 R.Buckminster Fuller has Eminent Man.
 
Thanks.
hamed
------=_NextPart_000_00DF_01C0A1D3.D23DA2C0-- ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 28 Feb 2001 13:17:28 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dexter Graphic Subject: The GNU GPL and the American Way MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hey, look what I found in the news this morning! -Dex The GNU GPL and the American Way http://news.excite.com/news/zd/010228/12/the-gnu-gpl Updated 12:53 PM ET February 28, 2001 by Richard Stallman , founder of the GNU Project Defenselessness is not the American Way. In the land of the free and the brave, developers defend their freedom with the GNU General Public License. Microsoft describes the GNU General Public License (GNU GPL) as an "open source" license, and says it is against the American Way. To understand the GNU GPL, and recognize how it embodies the American Way, you must first be aware that the GPL was not designed for open source. The Open Source Movement, which was launched in 1998, aims to develop powerful, reliable software and improved technology, by inviting the public to collaborate in software development. Many developers in that movement use the GNU GPL, and they are welcome to use it. But the ideas and logic of the GPL cannot be found in the Open Source Movement. They stem from the deeper goals and values of the Free Software Movement. The Free Software Movement was founded in 1984, but its inspiration comes from the ideals of 1776: freedom, community, and voluntary cooperation. This is what leads to free enterprise, to free speech, and to free software. As in "free enterprise" and "free speech", the "free" in "free software" refers to freedom, not price; specifically, it means that you have the freedom to study, change, and redistribute the software you use. These freedoms permit citizens to help themselves and help each other, and thus participate in a community. This contrasts with the more common proprietary software, which keeps users helpless and divided: the inner workings are secret, and you are prohibited from sharing the program with your neighbor. Powerful, reliable software and improved technology are useful byproducts of freedom, but the freedom to have a community is important in its own right. We could not establish a community of freedom in the land of proprietary software where each program had its lord. We had to build a new land in cyberspace--the free software GNU operating system, which we started writing in 1984. In 1991, when GNU was almost finished, the kernel Linux written by Linus Torvalds filled the last gap; soon the free GNU/Linux system was available. Today millions of users use GNU/Linux and enjoy the benefits of freedom and community. I designed the GNU GPL to uphold and defend the freedoms that define free software--to use the words of 1776, it establishes them as inalienable rights for programs released under the GPL. It ensures that you have the freedom to study, change, and redistribute the program, by saying that nobody is authorized to take these freedoms away from you by redistributing the program [under a restrictive proprietary license.] For the sake of cooperation, we encourage others to modify and extend the programs that we publish. For the sake of freedom, we set the condition that these modified versions of our programs must respect your freedom just like the original version. We encourage two-way cooperation by rejecting parasites: whoever wishes to copy parts of our software into his program must let us use parts of that program in our programs. Nobody is forced to join our club, but those who wish to participate must offer us the same cooperation they receive from us. That makes the system fair. Millions of users, tens of thousands of developers, and companies as large as IBM, Intel, and Sun, have chosen to participate on this basis. But some companies want the advantages without the responsibilities. >From time to time, companies have said to us, "We would make an improved version of this program if you allow us to release it without freedom." We say, "No thanks--your improvements might be useful if they were free, but if we can't use them in freedom, they are no good at all." Then they appeal to our egos, saying that our code will have "more users" inside their proprietary programs. We respond that we value our community's freedom more than an irrelevant form of popularity. Microsoft surely would like to have the benefit of our code without the responsibilities. But it has another, more specific purpose in attacking the GNU GPL. Microsoft is known generally for imitation rather than innovation. When Microsoft does something new, its purpose is strategic--not to improve computing for its users, but to close off alternatives for them. Microsoft uses an anticompetitive strategy called "embrace and extend". This means they start with the technology others are using, add a minor wrinkle which is secret so that nobody else can imitate it, then use that secret wrinkle so that only Microsoft software can communicate with other Microsoft software. In some cases, this makes it hard for you to use a non-Microsoft program when others you work with use a Microsoft program. In other cases, this makes it hard for you to use a non-Microsoft program for job A if you use a Microsoft program for job B. Either way, "embrace and extend" magnifies the effect of Microsoft's market power. No license can stop Microsoft from practicing "embrace and extend" if they are determined to do so at all costs. If they write their own program from scratch, and use none of our code, the license on our code does not affect them. But a total rewrite is costly and hard, and even Microsoft can't do it all the time. Hence their campaign to persuade us to abandon the license that protects our community, the license that won't let them say, "What's yours is mine, and what's mine is mine." They want us to let them take whatever they want, without ever giving anything back. They want us to abandon our defenses. But defenselessness is not the American Way. In the land of the brave and the free, we defend our freedom with the GNU GPL. Addendum Microsoft says that the GPL is against "intellectual property rights." I have no opinion on "intellectual property rights," because the term is too broad to have a sensible opinion about. It is a catch-all, covering copyrights, patents, trademarks, and other disparate areas of law; areas so different, in the laws and in their effects, that any statement about all of them at once is surely simplistic. To think intelligently about copyrights, patents or trademarks, you must think about them separately. The first step is declining to lump them together as "intellectual property". My views about copyright take an hour to expound, but one general principle applies: it cannot justify denying the public important freedoms. As Abraham Lincoln put it, "Whenever there is a conflict between human rights and property rights, human rights must prevail." Property rights are meant to advance human well-being, not as an excuse to disregard it. Richard Stallman is the founder of the GNU Project, launched in 1984 to develop the free operating system GNU (an acronym for "GNU's Not Unix"), and thereby give computer users the freedom that most of them have lost. Stallman graduated from Harvard in 1974 with a BA in physics. During his college years, he also worked as a staff hacker at the MIT Artificial Intelligence Lab, learning operating system development by doing it. In 1998 Stallman received the Electronic Frontier Foundation's Pioneer award along with Linus Torvalds. For a history and overview of the GNU project read: http://www.gnu.org/gnu/thegnuproject.html ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 28 Feb 2001 16:41:36 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Same story MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii I am reminded in Amy's book, "A Fuller Explanation", of something Kirby said recently in a post to me, about him attempting yet again to explain the same thing that he has explained many times before. She says: "He has told the story countless times, each rendition sounding like the first, with an air of revelation." This must be a requirement to those that dare to dig Bucky out of obscurity. Persistence must be a part of integrity. Dick ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 28 Feb 2001 12:54:02 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Re: New Thread! (was: radius .-) <> Brian ¿Quincy! Hutchings 28-FEB-2001 12:54 r001806@pen2.ci.santa-monica.ca.us hey, Dick; what is the Snyder-Fuller Law, in Cosmography, please? thus quoth: Bucky out of obscurity. Persistence must be a part of --Les Dukes d'Enron! http://www.tarpley.net/bush8.htm