From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Jun 15 11:58:44 2004 Return-Path: Received: from acsu.buffalo.edu (deliverance.acsu.buffalo.edu [128.205.7.57]) by linux00.LinuxForce.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.6) with SMTP id i5FFwaa6012451 for ; Tue, 15 Jun 2004 11:58:36 -0400 Message-Id: <200406151558.i5FFwaa6012451@linux00.LinuxForce.net> Received: (qmail 751 invoked from network); 15 Jun 2004 15:58:35 -0000 Received: from listserv.buffalo.edu (128.205.7.35) by deliverance.acsu.buffalo.edu with SMTP; 15 Jun 2004 15:58:35 -0000 Date: Tue, 15 Jun 2004 11:58:35 -0400 From: "L-Soft list server at University at Buffalo (1.8e)" Subject: File: "GEODESIC LOG0311" To: Chris Fearnley X-Virus-Scanned: clamd / ClamAV version 0.71, clamav-milter version 0.71 X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.63 (2004-01-11) on linux00.LinuxForce.net X-Spam-Status: No, hits=3.1 required=5.7 tests=BAYES_50,LUXURY_CAR, MSGID_FROM_MTA_HEADER,NO_EXPERIENCE autolearn=no version=2.63 X-Spam-Level: xxx Status: RO Content-Length: 232430 Lines: 6537 ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 1 Nov 2003 00:00:02 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Patrick Salsbury Subject: *MONTHLY POSTING* - GEODESIC 'how-to' info If you are receiving this message, you are currently subscribed to the list. There is no need to send another 'subscribe' message. If you haven't seen any posts in a while, perhaps it's time for you to post and liven things up... :-) ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- This is the monthly "How To" file about the GEODESIC list. It has info on content and purpose of the list, as well as subscription info, posting instructions, etc. It should prove useful to new subscribers, as well as those who are unfamiliar with LISTSERV operations. This message is being posted on Sat Nov 1 00:00:01 PST 2003. If you are tired of receiving this message once per month, and are reading bit.listserv.geodesic through USENET news, then you can enter this subject into your KILL/SCORE file. If you're reading through email, you can set up a filter to delete the message. Both of these tricks are WELL worth learning how to do, if you don't know already. And isn't it about time to learn something new? Isn't it always? :-) ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- GEODESIC is a forum for the discussion of the ideas and creations relating to the work of R. Buckminster (Bucky) Fuller. Topics range from geodesic math to world hunger; floating cities to autonoumous housing, and little bit of everything in between. Other lists that focuses more specifically on some of these topics can be found on the Reality Sculptors Website: http://reality.sculptors.com/lists.html On topic discussion and questions are welcome. SPAM and unsolicited promotions are not. (Simple, eh?) ----------------------- To subscribe, send mail to LISTSERV@LISTSERV.ACSU.BUFFALO.EDU and in the body of your letter put the line: SUB GEODESIC A web page to signon is available here: http://listserv.acsu.buffalo.edu/user/sub.html When you want to post, send mail to GEODESIC@LISTSERV.ACSU.BUFFALO.EDU ******NOT***** to LISTSERV@LISTSERV.ACSU.BUFFALO.EDU! 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A web page to signoff is available here: http://listserv.acsu.buffalo.edu/user/signoff.html ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- LIST ARCHIVES: Listserv itself is keeping archives of the list, dating back to June, 1992. Send a note to listserv@listserv.acsu.buffalo.edu with this message in the BODY of the note: INDEX GEODESIC You can get help on other Listserv commands by putting the line HELP into the body of the note. (Can be in the same message.) Web-searchable archives for the lists are available at: http://listserv.acsu.buffalo.edu/archives/geodesic.html ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- (You may want to save this file to forward on to people who are interested, as it tells what the list is about, and how to subscribe and unsubscribe.) Pat _____________________________Think For Yourself______________________________ Patrick G. Salsbury http://www.sculptors.com/~salsbury/ ----------------------- Don't break the Law...fix it. ;^) ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 1 Nov 2003 14:34:17 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Subject: Re: Zig-Zag Tensegrity Arch Construction Data MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Bob, Very nice! I think you may know more about Tensegrity Technology than Snelson. -------------------------------------------- Joe S Moore joe_s_moore@hotmail.com http://buckminster.info ------------------------------------------- ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bob Burkhardt" Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic To: Sent: Friday, October 31, 2003 7:04 PM Subject: Zig-Zag Tensegrity Arch Construction Data > Ref: http://www.channel1.com/users/bobwb/synergetics/photos/x3l8arch2b.html > > I haven't assembled this yet. The asymmetry will make it challenging. > Scroll to the > bottom for the pictures. > > Bob ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 1 Nov 2003 14:47:07 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Subject: Global Inc Comments: To: info@osearth.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Mr Medard Gabel, I have two comments re your new book, Global Inc: 1. Why didn't you use the Fuller Projection to display the data? 2. Some of the text is a little difficult to read because the = background is too dark. Otherwise, it's an excellent work. Thank you, -------------------------------------------- Joe S Moore joe_s_moore@hotmail.com http://buckminster.info ------------------------------------------- ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 1 Nov 2003 15:55:07 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: dennis dalesandro Subject: Domes in Iraq, Afghanistan, Palestine, etc... MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii What is the status of geodesic architecture in trouble spots around the world? Is anyone building and delivering cheap, practical domes to refuges and other victims of wars? Perhaps widespread popularization of Buckys ideas will first gain traction outside of America, perhaps the Middle East or Africa. Is he still in the lingo of such places? I'm sure he was at one time. --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Exclusive Video Premiere - Britney Spears ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 2 Nov 2003 11:24:35 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Subject: Emergency Domes Comments: To: "List, DomeHome" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable A Pravda article of Oct 2, 2001 mentioned that Russia donated 46 = geodesic domes (tents?) to Afghanistan: http://english.pravda.ru/cis/2001/10/02/16768.html -------------------------------------------- Joe S Moore joe_s_moore@hotmail.com http://buckminster.info ------------------------------------------- ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 2 Nov 2003 11:41:35 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Subject: Re: Domes in Iraq, Afghanistan, Palestine, etc... Comments: cc: "List, DomeHome" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Dennis, A company called Shelter Now International has built about 3,000 domes for Afghan refugees in Pakistan; see: http://www.pcpafg.org/Organizations/sni/shelter_now_international.htm Also, Domes International has exported domes to India; see: http://www.buyusa.gov/southeast/memphisnewsreleases.html (http://www.domesintl.com/) -------------------------------------------- Joe S Moore joe_s_moore@hotmail.com http://buckminster.info ------------------------------------------- ----- Original Message ----- From: "dennis dalesandro" Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic To: Sent: Saturday, November 01, 2003 4:55 PM Subject: Domes in Iraq, Afghanistan, Palestine, etc... > What is the status of geodesic architecture in trouble spots around the world? Is anyone building and delivering cheap, practical domes to refuges and other victims of wars? Perhaps widespread popularization of Buckys ideas will first gain traction outside of America, perhaps the Middle East or Africa. Is he still in the lingo of such places? I'm sure he was at one time. > ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 4 Nov 2003 13:48:11 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Bob Burkhardt Subject: Re: Zig-Zag Tensegrity Arch Construction Data MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi Joe, Thanks for the compliment. Actually I'm doing the arch in emulation of another admirer of Snelson's, Maxim Schrogin. He sent me pictures of an arch he assembled in the Berkeley, California, area a few years back. I'll have to look into getting his pictures posted on the net. I'd also seen arches designed by Tom Longtin who's in Vermont. That link was http://www.sover.net/~tlongtin/tensegrity/tensegarc500.html. That link's a few years old. Hopefully it's still around. Anyway, Tom's stuff was on the net last time I checked Google. I haven't seen any pictures of arches he's built though, and if I don't see built models I wonder whether what I'm looking at is actually a buildable tensegrity or not. So I'm very curious about how my design will turn out when I assemble it. When I designed it, I was always looking at its broadside. I was surprised when I looked from the top and saw how thin it was. The strut clearances are OK though and I think the slimness of the arch in comparison with the bases will help the stability. I'm hoping it won't be necessary to stake it. I took a tower design and bent it over until it just touched the ground by tightening tendons on one side and loosening them on the other. All the struts are equal length which has been true of the other arches I've seen. So this is an interesting genre of tensegrity structure I think. I felt building one would be a good test of my software and hellp further my tensegrity education. And hopefully I'll wind up with something reasonably decorative. Bob Joe S Moore wrote: >Bob, > >Very nice! I think you may know more about Tensegrity Technology than >Snelson. > >-------------------------------------------- >Joe S Moore >joe_s_moore@hotmail.com >http://buckminster.info >------------------------------------------- >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Bob Burkhardt" >Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic >To: >Sent: Friday, October 31, 2003 7:04 PM >Subject: Zig-Zag Tensegrity Arch Construction Data > > > > >>Ref: >> >> >http://www.channel1.com/users/bobwb/synergetics/photos/x3l8arch2b.html > > >>I haven't assembled this yet. The asymmetry will make it challenging. >> Scroll to the >>bottom for the pictures. >> >>Bob >> >> > >. > > > ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 4 Nov 2003 17:39:32 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Subject: Re: Monterey Dome Homes Comments: To: DomeHome-H@h19.hoflin.com Comments: cc: dentonconrad@netzero.net MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Denton, Monterey Domes was bought by Geodomes Woodworks which went out of business in about 1998; see: http://buckminster.info/Index/Domes-Manuf-G.htm -------------------------------------------- Joe S Moore joe_s_moore@hotmail.com http://buckminster.info ------------------------------------------- ----- Original Message ----- From: "The DomeHome List" To: Sent: Monday, November 03, 2003 9:36 PM Subject: Re: Monterey Dome Homes > From: jmr > Date: 2003.11.03.22.32 > > Denton Conrad wrote: > > > I recently renewed an interest in geodesic dome housing. > > I dug out an old catalog I received from Monterey Domes > > of Riverside, CA. Apparently they are no longer in business. > > Would you happen to know what happened to them? They seemed > > to be ahead of their time. > > > > Denton Conrad > > > > PS - I live in NC. Who are the closest manufacturers? I know > > you have a partial listing, a map showing where they are would > > be nice. > > > Hi, Denton. I'm forwarding your questions to the DomeHome email > list, hoping some of the subscribers will be able to send you > some useful information. > > DomeHomers, if you have informatin for Mr. Conrad, don't forget > to cc his email address in your reply, as he is not a DomeHome > subscriber. > > j m rowland -- DomeHome Moderator > ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 5 Nov 2003 09:00:36 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Subject: Re: Pictures Comments: To: DomeHome-H@h19.hoflin.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit The correct URL for the Missouri dome pic is: http://www.advanced-geodesic-domes.com/AGD/USMissouri.html -------------------------------------------- Joe S Moore joe_s_moore@hotmail.com http://buckminster.info ------------------------------------------- ----- Original Message ----- From: "The DomeHome List" To: Sent: Tuesday, November 04, 2003 10:29 PM Subject: re: Pictures > From: "RAS" > Organization: Advanced Geodesic Domes > Date: Tue, 4 Nov 2003 16:18:37 -0700 > > If you could send me a story about it I'd love too Carolyn. > Sal gave me one and from this link > http://www.advanced-geodesic-domes.com/AGDOMES/USMissouri.html > > I was able to capture your picture from the web but I still > need to know at least the stae you live in and your story > about you dome for the site (500 words or less) > > If you have a bigger picture I'd like the bcause your file is > only 33K and I'm giving up to 50K each. But I'm able to work > with what I did get. yours would make it 2 down 1,668 to go I > guess, even more if they are as small as yours. > > If that link above drops out it can be found from the main > page at http://www.advanced-geodesic-domes.com/ > Bob > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "carolyn@witchweb.net" > > Date: Mon, 03 Nov 2003 18:46:29 -0500 > > > > > > Our dome is already on this list's website. If you would > > like to include it then you are more than welcome to. > > > > Carolyn > > http://witchweb.net/moving > > > > > > At 11:47 PM 10/29/03 -0600, you wrote: > > >From: "RAS" > > >Organization: Advanced Geodesic Domes > > >Date: Wed, 29 Oct 2003 13:07:47 -0700 > > > > > >I'm still looking for people that might wish to have pictures of > > >there dome posted on a web site. I was going to do it if there > > >where at least 10.....but since I only had 2 of you respond.... > > >I'll start with that. > > >I'd like to know if you wish > > >1)the location as close as you wish > > >2)the people that sold the kit or made it (you can show your own > > >work there is no shame in that) > > >3) and if you like an e-mail address you may or may not wish to be > > >posted or I could forward the mail to you. > > >4) some other things might be what it did cost you and hate its > > >worth...R U happy with it....Problems....best liked and so on > > >5) maybe a little right up of your own if you like. > > > > > >My goal is to start with a world map and then have it move to > > >different pages and so on to your dome. > > > > > >But that may never get done so it might be color dots with numbers > > >in them. sorry. > > >I would ask you to keep the file size of the picture some what > > >small say 50 I if that works and I'm able to convert most anything > > >to JPEG > > > > > >bob > > >http://www.advanced-geodesic-domes.com/ > > > .:'':. > .::::::::. The DomeHome Email List . http://www.domegroup.org > > > ** subscribe/unsubscribe to this list (under DOG LISTS) at > http://www.hoflin.com > ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 5 Nov 2003 12:06:34 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Subject: 42 Hours of Bucky Talking Comments: To: "List, DomeHome" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable "Everything I Know" 42 hours of R Buckminster Fuller talking: http://www.omnifelicity.com/bucky/Default.htm Jan 20, 1975 to Feb 1, 1975 -------------------------------------------- Joe S Moore joe_s_moore@hotmail.com http://buckminster.info ------------------------------------------- ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 8 Nov 2003 19:14:23 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Bob Burkhardt Subject: Computer-Enabled Democracy? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Here's a link to the full article (requires registration) http://www.technologyreview.com/articles/wo_wolman103103.asp Here's the link to the ACM newsletter where I originally found it: http://www.acm.org/technews/articles/2003-5/1105w.html#item9 Bob ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 12 Nov 2003 10:25:57 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Tom Gibson / Progressive Engineer Subject: Profile Online Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Dear Colleague: Progressive Engineer, the online magazine and information source, has posted a profile of Buckminster Fuller that tells how he had extraordinary vision for not only structural design but also housing for the masses, sustainability, and renewable energy. The story details why the geodesic dome was so innovative, effective, and efficient. You can see this at http://www.ProgressiveEngineer.com. Thank you. Tom Gibson, P.E. Publisher ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 12 Nov 2003 18:46:52 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Subject: Re: Pictures Comments: To: DomeHome-H@h19.hoflin.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Bob, For a list of domes by US state or country see: http://buckminster.info/Index/Dome-Dt.htm For example, under Dome/A would be found Arizona & Australia. Hope this helps, -------------------------------------------- Joe S Moore joe_s_moore@hotmail.com http://buckminster.info ------------------------------------------- ----- Original Message ----- From: "The DomeHome List" To: Sent: Tuesday, November 11, 2003 10:33 PM Subject: Pictures > From: "RAS" > Organization: Advanced Geodesic Domes > Date: Sun, 9 Nov 2003 17:49:24 -0700 > > Hello everyone > I'm still looking for your pictures and story's to post on my site. > Owners, manufactures, module-makers are all welcome. > Just read the rules. (1 rule 4 parts) > My goal is to have a library of sorts. > As far as I know there are but only two domes in all of the world.... > unless I get more. > Two is all I have so far...SOB > It looks like I have room for 2,815 more.....What say you??? > It R FREE.....:-) > Bob > http://www.advanced-geodesic-domes.com/ > ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 12 Nov 2003 19:41:02 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Subject: Re: Profile Online MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Tom, Thanks for pointing out the excellent article about Bucky. I'll be adding it to my collection; see: http://buckminster.info/Biblio/About-Articles-2003.htm (Won't become visible until I upload all the changes to my website--probably in the next month or so.) -------------------------------------------- Joe S Moore joe_s_moore@hotmail.com http://buckminster.info ------------------------------------------- ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tom Gibson / Progressive Engineer" Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic To: Sent: Wednesday, November 12, 2003 8:25 AM Subject: Profile Online > Dear Colleague: > > Progressive Engineer, the online magazine and information source, has posted > a profile of Buckminster Fuller that tells how he had extraordinary vision > for not only structural design but also housing for the masses, > sustainability, and renewable energy. The story details why the geodesic > dome was so innovative, effective, and efficient. You can see this at > http://www.ProgressiveEngineer.com. Thank you. > > Tom Gibson, P.E. > Publisher > ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 14 Nov 2003 10:27:22 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Mario Merz Comments: To: organic_architecture@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Snips from NYTimes obituary.See also: http://www.studio-international.co.uk/studio-images/biennale01/merz_igloo.jpg Mario Merz, 78, an Italian Installation Artist, Dies By ROBERTA SMITH Published: November 13, 2003 Mario Merz, an Italian artist whose installations exemplified the Arte Povera movement and its use of humble, often organic materials, died on Sunday at his home in Milan. He was 78. The artists' common ground included minimal forms combined with conceptual irreverence and a sense of rustic chic regarding materials and objects that was complemented by the centuries-old Italian buildings in which their work was often exhibited and photographed. Mr. Merz's installations — permeated with ideas of growth and fecundity and spreading across floors, walls and ceilings — had an exuberance that could be alternately carnivalesque or spare, pastoral and populist. He became identified with great spiraling cornucopia-like glass tables stacked with fruits and vegetables, and makeshift clamped-together igloos made of mud, bundled twigs, loaves of bread or irregular pieces of glass, wax or slate. In a 1967 interview Mr. Merz spoke of the importance of organic meaning and said, "These are forms that stretch into space and therefore they are to be understood as a process of development." Many of his installations were accented with words or numbers in neon. The numbers counted off the Fibonacci progression, the mathematical formula for growth patterns found in many forms of life, including leaves, snail shells, pine cones and reptile skins. (Both before and after he discovered the Fibonacci series, a frequent motif included lizards large and small, stuffed and painted.) It was not by chance that the Fibonacci progression was also the basis for the spiral, or that the igloo is a spiral in three dimensions. The igloo, as a form of habitation, was consistent with another preferred form, the table, with its connotations of eating and conviviality. In 1972 he illustrated the Fibonacci progression with a series of photographs of a factory workers' lunchroom and a restaurant progressively crowded with diners. His 1973 show at the John Weber Gallery in New York expressed the Fibonacci in a series of low modular tables. He spent the next dozen years making art indebted to the French Informel painters, working with increasingly thick layers of paint in which he incised a spiral motif. From there he gradually moved to shaped canvases and then to wall pieces, the most original of which, from the mid-1960's, involved neon and jutting forms woven to his specifications by basketmakers. He made his first igloo in 1968, decorating it with a saying by Gen. Vo Nguyen Giap of North Vietnam: "If the enemy masses his forces, he loses ground. If he scatters, he loses force." Mr. Merz's art was ubiquitous in international exhibitions and figured prominently in historic surveys of Arte Povera, most recently one organized by the Tate Modern in London and the Walker Art Center in Minneapolis in 2001. He was the subject of numerous retrospectives, including one at the Guggenheim in 1989, and his work is included in museum collections around the world. __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Protect your identity with Yahoo! Mail AddressGuard http://antispam.yahoo.com/whatsnewfree ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 14 Nov 2003 16:33:18 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Bob Burkhardt Subject: Eight-stage Tensegrity Arch MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Ref: http://www.channel1.com/users/bobwb/synergetics/photos/x3l8arch2.html I finished assembling the arch. It turned out OK. An interesting structure. Bob ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 14 Nov 2003 23:17:24 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Foerd Subject: Re: Eight-stage Tensegrity Arch In-Reply-To: <3FB54A1E.5020502@channel1.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Nice, Bob Foerd Ref: http://www.channel1.com/users/bobwb/synergetics/photos/x3l8arch2.html I finished assembling the arch. It turned out OK. An interesting structure. Bob ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 14 Nov 2003 22:16:21 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Subject: Re: Mario Merz MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Dick, The part about the Fibonacci numbers caught my eye. The numbers come from the Golden Rectangle which comes from the regular icosahedron; see: http://buckminster.info/Ideas/01-Intro-Icosa.htm The icosa is one of only three basic shapes that Nature uses to build everything; see: http://buckminster.info/Ideas/01-Intro-Geom.htm -------------------------------------------- Joe S Moore joe_s_moore@hotmail.com http://buckminster.info ------------------------------------------- ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dick Fischbeck" Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic To: Sent: Friday, November 14, 2003 11:27 AM Subject: Mario Merz > Snips from NYTimes obituary.See also: > > http://www.studio-international.co.uk/studio-images/biennale01/merz_igloo.jpg > > Mario Merz, 78, an Italian Installation Artist, Dies > By ROBERTA SMITH > > Published: November 13, 2003 > > (snip) > Many of his installations were accented with words or numbers in neon. > The numbers counted off the Fibonacci progression, the mathematical > formula for growth patterns found in many forms of life, including > leaves, snail shells, pine cones and reptile skins. (Both before and > after he discovered the Fibonacci series, a frequent motif included > lizards large and small, stuffed and painted.) > (snip) ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 15 Nov 2003 00:08:20 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: "" Subject: Re: Mario Merz In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Joe; Isn't the dodecahedron the fourth basic shape Nature uses, according to Fuller? Blair Quoting Joe S Moore : > Dick, > > The part about the Fibonacci numbers caught my eye. The numbers come from > the Golden Rectangle which comes from the regular icosahedron; see: > http://buckminster.info/Ideas/01-Intro-Icosa.htm > > The icosa is one of only three basic shapes that Nature uses to build > everything; see: > http://buckminster.info/Ideas/01-Intro-Geom.htm > -------------------------------------------- > Joe S Moore > joe_s_moore@hotmail.com > http://buckminster.info > ------------------------------------------- > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Dick Fischbeck" > Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic > To: > Sent: Friday, November 14, 2003 11:27 AM > Subject: Mario Merz > > > > Snips from NYTimes obituary.See also: > > > > > http://www.studio-international.co.uk/studio-images/biennale01/merz_igloo.jpg > > > > Mario Merz, 78, an Italian Installation Artist, Dies > > By ROBERTA SMITH > > > > Published: November 13, 2003 > > > > (snip) > > Many of his installations were accented with words or numbers in neon. > > The numbers counted off the Fibonacci progression, the mathematical > > formula for growth patterns found in many forms of life, including > > leaves, snail shells, pine cones and reptile skins. (Both before and > > after he discovered the Fibonacci series, a frequent motif included > > lizards large and small, stuffed and painted.) > > (snip) > ------------------------------------------------- This mail sent through IMP: http://horde.org/imp/ ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 15 Nov 2003 00:12:13 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: "" Subject: Re: Mario Merz In-Reply-To: <1068880100.3fb5d0e4bd0ed@webmail.domeincorporated.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Maybe a dodecahedron isn't considered a 'basic' shape, as it isn't comprised only of equilateral triangles. Blair Quoting "" : > Joe; > > Isn't the dodecahedron the fourth basic shape Nature uses, according to > Fuller? > > Blair > > Quoting Joe S Moore : > > > Dick, > > > > The part about the Fibonacci numbers caught my eye. The numbers come > from > > the Golden Rectangle which comes from the regular icosahedron; see: > > http://buckminster.info/Ideas/01-Intro-Icosa.htm > > > > The icosa is one of only three basic shapes that Nature uses to build > > everything; see: > > http://buckminster.info/Ideas/01-Intro-Geom.htm > > -------------------------------------------- > > Joe S Moore > > joe_s_moore@hotmail.com > > http://buckminster.info > > ------------------------------------------- > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Dick Fischbeck" > > Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic > > To: > > Sent: Friday, November 14, 2003 11:27 AM > > Subject: Mario Merz > > > > > > > Snips from NYTimes obituary.See also: > > > > > > > > > http://www.studio-international.co.uk/studio-images/biennale01/merz_igloo.jpg > > > > > > Mario Merz, 78, an Italian Installation Artist, Dies > > > By ROBERTA SMITH > > > > > > Published: November 13, 2003 > > > > > > (snip) > > > Many of his installations were accented with words or numbers in neon. > > > The numbers counted off the Fibonacci progression, the mathematical > > > formula for growth patterns found in many forms of life, including > > > leaves, snail shells, pine cones and reptile skins. (Both before and > > > after he discovered the Fibonacci series, a frequent motif included > > > lizards large and small, stuffed and painted.) > > > (snip) > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------- > This mail sent through IMP: http://horde.org/imp/ > ------------------------------------------------- This mail sent through IMP: http://horde.org/imp/ ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 15 Nov 2003 00:18:59 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: "" Subject: Re: Eight-stage Tensegrity Arch In-Reply-To: <3FB54A1E.5020502@channel1.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Bob; You've built a beautiful structure. I've heard many people say they think the geodesic dome is the structure of the future. I've believed for a long time the geodesic dome is the structure of today, and the tensegrity is the structure of the future. Where do you see the tensegrity first being widely used in practical or functional applications? Blair Quoting Bob Burkhardt : > Ref: http://www.channel1.com/users/bobwb/synergetics/photos/x3l8arch2.html > > I finished assembling the arch. It turned out OK. An interesting > structure. > > Bob > ------------------------------------------------- This mail sent through IMP: http://horde.org/imp/ ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 15 Nov 2003 06:02:05 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Re: Mario Merz In-Reply-To: <1068880333.3fb5d1cd281f4@webmail.domeincorporated.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Hi Blair Is the frost in your ground yet? It's starting here. Because a pentadodeca(20vertexia) is dual to the icosa(12vertexia), they imply each other. Bucky saw structures to be based on one of the only 3 omnitriangulated systems-4vertex, 6vertex and 12vertex. Every other structure system is an extention or combination of those 3. Or something close to this! Dick --- "" wrote: > Maybe a dodecahedron isn't considered a 'basic' shape, as it isn't > comprised > only of equilateral triangles. > > Blair > > Quoting "" : > > > Joe; > > > > Isn't the dodecahedron the fourth basic shape Nature uses, > according to > > Fuller? > > > > Blair > > > > Quoting Joe S Moore : > > > > > Dick, > > > > > > The part about the Fibonacci numbers caught my eye. The numbers > come > > from > > > the Golden Rectangle which comes from the regular icosahedron; > see: > > > http://buckminster.info/Ideas/01-Intro-Icosa.htm > > > > > > The icosa is one of only three basic shapes that Nature uses to > build > > > everything; see: > > > http://buckminster.info/Ideas/01-Intro-Geom.htm > > > -------------------------------------------- > > > Joe S Moore > > > joe_s_moore@hotmail.com > > > http://buckminster.info > > > ------------------------------------------- > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "Dick Fischbeck" > > > Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic > > > To: > > > Sent: Friday, November 14, 2003 11:27 AM > > > Subject: Mario Merz > > > > > > > > > > Snips from NYTimes obituary.See also: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > http://www.studio-international.co.uk/studio-images/biennale01/merz_igloo.jpg > > > > > > > > Mario Merz, 78, an Italian Installation Artist, Dies > > > > By ROBERTA SMITH > > > > > > > > Published: November 13, 2003 > > > > > > > > (snip) > > > > Many of his installations were accented with words or numbers > in neon. > > > > The numbers counted off the Fibonacci progression, the > mathematical > > > > formula for growth patterns found in many forms of life, > including > > > > leaves, snail shells, pine cones and reptile skins. (Both > before and > > > > after he discovered the Fibonacci series, a frequent motif > included > > > > lizards large and small, stuffed and painted.) > > > > (snip) > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------- > > This mail sent through IMP: http://horde.org/imp/ > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------- > This mail sent through IMP: http://horde.org/imp/ __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Protect your identity with Yahoo! Mail AddressGuard http://antispam.yahoo.com/whatsnewfree ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 15 Nov 2003 06:06:55 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Re: Eight-stage Tensegrity Arch In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Yes, very nice. Did you say if the struts touch where they cross? Dick --- Foerd wrote: > Nice, Bob > > Foerd > > > Ref: > http://www.channel1.com/users/bobwb/synergetics/photos/x3l8arch2.html > > I finished assembling the arch. It turned out OK. An interesting > structure. > > Bob __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Protect your identity with Yahoo! Mail AddressGuard http://antispam.yahoo.com/whatsnewfree ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 15 Nov 2003 12:18:31 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: "" Subject: Re: Mario Merz In-Reply-To: <20031115140205.27772.qmail@web40702.mail.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Hi Dick; No frost here. It doesn't usually set until late December, although there is some thin ice on the lakes. Is a pentadodeca the same as a dodecahedron? A dodecahedron has 20 verticies. Would you expand on your statement that the 20 vertexia is dual to the 12 vertexia? I don't follow. Blair Quoting Dick Fischbeck : > Hi Blair > > Is the frost in your ground yet? It's starting here. > > Because a pentadodeca(20vertexia) is dual to the icosa(12vertexia), > they imply each other. Bucky saw structures to be based on one of the > only 3 omnitriangulated systems-4vertex, 6vertex and 12vertex. Every > other structure system is an extention or combination of those 3. > > Or something close to this! > > Dick > > --- "" wrote: > > Maybe a dodecahedron isn't considered a 'basic' shape, as it isn't > > comprised > > only of equilateral triangles. > > > > Blair > > > > Quoting "" : > > > > > Joe; > > > > > > Isn't the dodecahedron the fourth basic shape Nature uses, > > according to > > > Fuller? > > > > > > Blair > > > > > > Quoting Joe S Moore : > > > > > > > Dick, > > > > > > > > The part about the Fibonacci numbers caught my eye. The numbers > > come > > > from > > > > the Golden Rectangle which comes from the regular icosahedron; > > see: > > > > http://buckminster.info/Ideas/01-Intro-Icosa.htm > > > > > > > > The icosa is one of only three basic shapes that Nature uses to > > build > > > > everything; see: > > > > http://buckminster.info/Ideas/01-Intro-Geom.htm > > > > -------------------------------------------- > > > > Joe S Moore > > > > joe_s_moore@hotmail.com > > > > http://buckminster.info > > > > ------------------------------------------- > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > From: "Dick Fischbeck" > > > > Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic > > > > To: > > > > Sent: Friday, November 14, 2003 11:27 AM > > > > Subject: Mario Merz > > > > > > > > > > > > > Snips from NYTimes obituary.See also: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > http://www.studio-international.co.uk/studio-images/biennale01/merz_igloo.jpg > > > > > > > > > > Mario Merz, 78, an Italian Installation Artist, Dies > > > > > By ROBERTA SMITH > > > > > > > > > > Published: November 13, 2003 > > > > > > > > > > (snip) > > > > > Many of his installations were accented with words or numbers > > in neon. > > > > > The numbers counted off the Fibonacci progression, the > > mathematical > > > > > formula for growth patterns found in many forms of life, > > including > > > > > leaves, snail shells, pine cones and reptile skins. (Both > > before and > > > > > after he discovered the Fibonacci series, a frequent motif > > included > > > > > lizards large and small, stuffed and painted.) > > > > > (snip) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------- > > > This mail sent through IMP: http://horde.org/imp/ > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------- > > This mail sent through IMP: http://horde.org/imp/ > > > __________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > Protect your identity with Yahoo! Mail AddressGuard > http://antispam.yahoo.com/whatsnewfree > ------------------------------------------------- This mail sent through IMP: http://horde.org/imp/ ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 15 Nov 2003 12:20:27 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Re: Mario Merz In-Reply-To: <1068923911.3fb67c0758f35@webmail.domeincorporated.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii --- "" wrote: > Is a pentadodeca the same as a dodecahedron? A dodecahedron has 20 > verticies. > Would you expand on your statement that the 20 vertexia is dual to > the 12 > vertexia? I don't follow. Blair Rhombic dodecahedra and pentagonal(or regular) dodecahedra both have 12 sides and 20 vertexes. See: http://mathworld.wolfram.com/Dodecahedron.html and: http://mathworld.wolfram.com/RhombicDodecahedron.html The rh.dodeca is the dual of the cubeocta. The p.dodeca is the dual of the icosa. I am trying to get away from the traditional term polyhedra in favor of Bucky's newer term polyvertexia. The first term refers to the number of openings(sides/faces). The second term refers to the number of vertexes(things/corners). The most informative aspect of a system is the number of vertexes; that's why Bucky wants the change, I think. Area is always measured in triangles. For example, a pentagon always has 3 triangles. I'll go on or does this cover it? Dick __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Protect your identity with Yahoo! Mail AddressGuard http://antispam.yahoo.com/whatsnewfree ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 15 Nov 2003 13:30:04 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: art-speak MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Excerpts from “After the Utopian Reflex” by Kirsten Everberg from the 2003 Wight Biennial Catalog-UCLA In this dynamic rivalry between house and universe, we are far removed from any reference to simple geometric forms. A house that has been experienced is not an inert box. Inhabited space transcends geometrical space. -Gaston Bachelard, “The Poetics of Space” In the place that exists between efficiency and idealism, versions of imagined spaces are made viable with some idea of perfection failed. For Marc Handelman and Oscar Tuazon, the intersection where serviceable becomes transcendent and the transcendent becomes serviceable is where their interests lie. Concerned with the object and its utility, in the sense that it is a measure of the amount of satisfaction or pleasure that somebody gains from consuming a commodity, the product or service, the artists begin to judge the utilitarian in relationship to the utopic - where utopia is the best of all possible worlds, an ideal and perfect place or state where life is harmonious. The distance between what is real and what is imagined is measured in Handelman and Tuazon’s investigation into place, steeped with historicity and creative social force and non-place, where individuals are connected in a uniform manner and where no organic social life is possible. (paragraph about Handelman deleted) In another investigation of utopian principles, Dick Fischbeck and Oscar Tuazon’s autonomous social unit, Randome (2003), operates simultaneously within and independent from the context of the Wight Biennial. Situated in a landscaped area just outside the gallery, and constructed of conical panels of recycled aluminum lithography plates, Randome gives structural expression to ideals of nonhierarchical living. A temporary structure, the dome can be erected quickly anywhere, and can accommodate up to three people. Inside, the address of a temporary listserv is provided, producing and distributing a specific knowledge among the participants while generating an online community. A democratic space of collaboration is engendered, beginning in the space of Randome itself, and continuing into the virtual realm by means of the visitors’ personal computers in the home or office. Fischbeck, the original developer of the randome structure, and Tuazon, an artist living and working in New York City, collaborated to create this temporary structure to serve as a full scale model for simple shelters. In its exploration of the political and social aspects of small-scale adaptive housing strategies, Randome both criticizes current social norms and attempts to generate new ones. Yet, as historical criticism has shown, spaces born from this kind of utopian ideal are largely perceived as fantastical and unrealistic. By all accounts, the original geodesic dome failed to germinate utopian communes in the rural West for those seeking physical and spiritual freedom outside the system. The dome was to be an escape from the oppressive environment of a rigid society caught up in modernist preoccupations with legislating order and breaking from history but for all its popularity, it neither inspired new cities, nor made its way back to the cities it escaped from. Historic attempts at idealized urban habitats relied on spatial concepts of isolation, enclosed cities and self-sufficient housing. Le Corbusier’s La Ville Radieuse in Marseilles, for example, was built on urban visions that were authoritarian and inflexible, and mandated discrete zones for working, living and leisure, rather than embracing a more radical integrative philosophy. Randome operates as a more permeable construction, encouraging drift and embracing rupture and renewal. Organic and porous in its desire and ability to create new networks of interconnectivity between people and space, Randome exists between a real and imagined expanse of community. The builders themeless move between the functional and the ideal - Fischbeck operates on the margins of experimental architecture in the the real world development of small scale, hand-made housing structures of simple materials, while Tuazon’s larger dome project, City Without a Ghetto, explores them as an artist, examining our collective desire for a new utopian city by attempting to actualize the political, economic and structural relations of disparate sites throughout the city. The temporary nature of Randome’s listserv and structure underscore the transitory aspect of prioritizing social issues as a site for artistic engagement. In her survey of practices that variously constitute site-specificity, Miwon Kwon similarly asks if public service, as Postion provided by artists, might be part of a nostalgic move that seeks to restore authenticity to the site in face of the commodification and serialization of places. So while Randome at first appears to operating from a sense of nostalgia, Tuazon asserts that “by reconstructing the ruined objects of an outmoded utopia, the repressed relations between institutions, communities, and spaces become intelligible. . .the ruined utopia, more than revealing the promises of the past that were never delivered, demonstrates the dynamics of fear and desire that structure the utopian proposals of the present.” By demonstrating a presence or awareness of these fears and desires, Randome begins to articulate that the distance between society and community is cultural. As construction between the real and imagined, the objects and spaces created in. Tuazon and Fischbeck’s dome installation function as compromised idealist space. Neither offers a clear image of a new utilization of space. After the disappointment of the modernist utopia, revisiting the myth of the dome - has allowed the examination of the framework supporting our current sense of trepidation and aspiration to the utopic. __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Protect your identity with Yahoo! Mail AddressGuard http://antispam.yahoo.com/whatsnewfree ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 15 Nov 2003 21:16:57 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Subject: Interesting Stats MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable About 2/3 of the people in the world have electricity. About 15% of the people in the world have access to the internet. What would be a critical mass for the internet, and when might that = occur? Just "Thinking Outloud", -------------------------------------------- Joe S Moore joe_s_moore@hotmail.com http://buckminster.info ------------------------------------------- ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 16 Nov 2003 05:40:53 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Re: Interesting Stats In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii --- Joe S Moore wrote: > About 2/3 of the people in the world have electricity. > > About 15% of the people in the world have access to the internet. > > What would be a critical mass for the internet, and when might that > occur? Joe How will we know when it is reached? Will something change? Speculate, please. Dick __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Protect your identity with Yahoo! Mail AddressGuard http://antispam.yahoo.com/whatsnewfree ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 16 Nov 2003 13:32:02 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Bob Subject: Re: Interesting Stats In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" Joe- What do you mean by "critical mass for the internet"? Bob Sanderson >About 2/3 of the people in the world have electricity. > >About 15% of the people in the world have access to the internet. > >What would be a critical mass for the internet, and when might that occur? > >Just "Thinking Outloud", > >-------------------------------------------- >Joe S Moore >joe_s_moore@hotmail.com >http://buckminster.info >------------------------------------------- ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 16 Nov 2003 19:32:10 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Subject: Re: Interesting Stats MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Bob & Dick, Sorry for not replying sooner. I usually spend all day working on my website & check my email in the evening. OK. I'm making several assumptions: When the internet reaches a critical mass, something dramatic will happen. The critical mass probably is more than 50%. If the % with access to the internet is growing at 5%/year, then critical mass will occur in about 10 years. Now, I don't know what exactly will happen, but when a majority occurs, the psychology changes. I don't know if critical mass is more or less than half, but I suspect it's more--how much--I don't know. I don't know how fast the % with access to the internet is growing, but I suspect it is at least 5%--maybe faster! And I suspect that when a majority of humanity is on the internet, a lot of good ideas will start to be implemented--in a hurry. These are just hunches. -------------------------------------------- Joe S Moore joe_s_moore@hotmail.com http://buckminster.info ------------------------------------------- ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bob" Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic To: Sent: Sunday, November 16, 2003 11:32 AM Subject: Re: Interesting Stats Joe- What do you mean by "critical mass for the internet"? Bob Sanderson and How will we know when it is reached? Will something change? Speculate, please. Dick > >About 2/3 of the people in the world have electricity. > > > >About 15% of the people in the world have access to the internet. > > > >What would be a critical mass for the internet, and when might that occur? > > > >Just "Thinking Outloud", > > ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 17 Nov 2003 10:13:31 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Bob Burkhardt Subject: Re: Eight-stage Tensegrity Arch MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Blair, I know tensegrity (cable domes) is used currently to roof stadiums and I see a lot of academic work published on deployable antennas based on tower structures with adjustable tendons. I don't have a lot of insight where it might be applied next. I've done some brainstorming which you can read in http://www.channel1.com/users/bobwb/prospect/prospect.htm. I've been trying to get together an effective technology for engineering the structures on a computer which I think will make applications more feasible. Bob wrote: >Bob; > >You've built a beautiful structure. I've heard many people say they think the >geodesic dome is the structure of the future. I've believed for a long time >the geodesic dome is the structure of today, and the tensegrity is the >structure of the future. Where do you see the tensegrity first being widely >used in practical or functional applications? > >Blair > > >Quoting Bob Burkhardt : > > > >>Ref: http://www.channel1.com/users/bobwb/synergetics/photos/x3l8arch2.html >> >>I finished assembling the arch. It turned out OK. An interesting >>structure. >> >>Bob >> >> >> > > > > >------------------------------------------------- >This mail sent through IMP: http://horde.org/imp/ > >. > > > ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 17 Nov 2003 10:35:38 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Foerd Subject: Re: Eight-stage Tensegrity Arch In-Reply-To: <3FB8E59B.4000405@channel1.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > Blair to Bob,.... Where do you see the tensegrity first being widely used in practical or functional applications? I'm not Blair or Bob but how about looking at long span bridge design? Foerd ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 17 Nov 2003 11:10:51 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Bob Burkhardt Subject: Re: Eight-stage Tensegrity Arch MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I posted a picture of Maxim's arch at: http://www.channel1.com/users/bobwb/synergetics/photos/maxim.html He also informs me that Sculpture magazine a couple months back had an ad by Marlborough Gallery advertising an arch by Kenneth Snelson. I'll see if I can look that up. Bob Bob Burkhardt wrote: > Ref: > http://www.channel1.com/users/bobwb/synergetics/photos/x3l8arch2.html > > I finished assembling the arch. It turned out OK. An interesting > structure. > > Bob > > ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 17 Nov 2003 11:11:02 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Bob Burkhardt Subject: Re: Eight-stage Tensegrity Arch MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Dick, There's a minimum of 2"-3" clearance between all struts. Bob Dick Fischbeck wrote: >Yes, very nice. Did you say if the struts touch where they cross? > >Dick >--- Foerd wrote: > > >>Nice, Bob >> >>Foerd >> >> >>Ref: >>http://www.channel1.com/users/bobwb/synergetics/photos/x3l8arch2.html >> >>I finished assembling the arch. It turned out OK. An interesting >>structure. >> >>Bob >> >> > > >__________________________________ >Do you Yahoo!? >Protect your identity with Yahoo! Mail AddressGuard >http://antispam.yahoo.com/whatsnewfree > >. > > > ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 17 Nov 2003 11:20:10 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Bob Burkhardt Subject: Re: Eight-stage Tensegrity Arch MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Yes, bridges should certainly be on the list of applications to try out. Ottewill and Duncan had an interesting design in the Sept/Oct '96 issue of Art and Design (pp. 54-7), and I saw something by Russell Chu at the SNEC meeting last December. Both of these looked like they were more for smaller-scale application. Bob Foerd wrote: >>Blair to Bob,.... Where do you see the tensegrity first being widely >> >> >used in practical or functional applications? > >I'm not Blair or Bob but how about looking at long span bridge design? > >Foerd > >. > > > ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 17 Nov 2003 08:21:19 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Re: Eight-stage Tensegrity Arch In-Reply-To: <3FB8E59B.4000405@channel1.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Blair wrote: > >You've built a beautiful structure. I've heard many people say they > think the > >geodesic dome is the structure of the future. I've believed for a > long time > >the geodesic dome is the structure of today, and the tensegrity is > the > >structure of the future. Hi Blair Geodesic structures ARE tensegrity structure. The tension and compression members are not so obvious, though. They operate structurally the same. "703.03 All geodesic domes are tensegrity structures whether or not the tension- compression differentiations are visible to the observer. Tensegrity geodesic spheres do what they do because they have the properties of hydraulically or pneumatically inflated structures." Dick __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Protect your identity with Yahoo! Mail AddressGuard http://antispam.yahoo.com/whatsnewfree ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 17 Nov 2003 10:05:47 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: "" Subject: Re: Eight-stage Tensegrity Arch In-Reply-To: <20031117162119.50062.qmail@web40706.mail.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Yes, I agree with you Dick. My question, and to respond to Foerd, is more to do with tensegrity structures where the members, cables and frames combined, do not continue all the way across the structure. Unlike a cable supported suspension bridge where long cables stretch from shore to shore, a cable tensegrity as Burkhart has built has numerous shorter cables and frames intertwined making the span. Unlike long cables supporting a radio tower from falling, where will a tensegrity like Burkhart's with hundreds of members, start possibly showing up in construction? Blair Quoting Dick Fischbeck : > Blair wrote: > > >You've built a beautiful structure. I've heard many people say they > > think the > > >geodesic dome is the structure of the future. I've believed for a > > long time > > >the geodesic dome is the structure of today, and the tensegrity is > > the > > >structure of the future. > > Hi Blair > > Geodesic structures ARE tensegrity structure. The tension and > compression members are not so obvious, though. They operate > structurally the same. > > > "703.03 All geodesic domes are tensegrity structures whether or > not > the tension- compression differentiations are visible to the observer. > Tensegrity geodesic spheres do what they do because they have the > properties of hydraulically or pneumatically inflated structures." > > Dick > > __________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > Protect your identity with Yahoo! Mail AddressGuard > http://antispam.yahoo.com/whatsnewfree > ------------------------------------------------- This mail sent through IMP: http://horde.org/imp/ ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 17 Nov 2003 08:38:41 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: polies MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii http://www.record-eagle.com/2003/nov/16polie.htm __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Protect your identity with Yahoo! Mail AddressGuard http://antispam.yahoo.com/whatsnewfree ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 17 Nov 2003 08:46:59 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Re: Eight-stage Tensegrity Arch In-Reply-To: <1069088747.3fb8ffebdf395@webmail.domeincorporated.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii --- "" wrote: Unlike long cables supporting a radio > tower from > falling, where will a tensegrity like Burkhart's with hundreds of > members, > start possibly showing up in construction? I'm starting to see some similar structures at the local summer fairs. One in particular was a bungie harness support tower where 4 people(mostly kids that I saw) could becomes almost weightless, jumping and flipping. They loved it. Or how about a new giant arch like the St.Louis gateway. Think of the attension EPCOT gets for their big ball. Some town somewhere would want one. __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Protect your identity with Yahoo! Mail AddressGuard http://antispam.yahoo.com/whatsnewfree ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 17 Nov 2003 09:13:44 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: endless bridge MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii I'll try to locate Dave. He wrote back in the spring to synergeo and elsewhere. I think he had a small car suspended from his 50 foot long tensegrity bridge. He'd be interested in this thread, I'm sure. Anyone remember this? His old site is down unfortunately. Dick David Ratcliff Email : davidratcliff6255@hotmail.com Website : http://groups.msn.com/DavesBridgesandTow City : West Wyalong NSW Country : Australia Comment : Please visit my site on newest designs. It's somewhere in between tensegrity and open web trusses. Or a combination of both! Steel tower to 6 km high? Bridge to 7 km? - Or endless? Quote "Design has reached its peak.... The only way we will be able to go further is for a lighter, stronger more composite material be developed" This new webbing has never been explored before. Very very very simple. Thanks, Dave __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Protect your identity with Yahoo! Mail AddressGuard http://antispam.yahoo.com/whatsnewfree ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 17 Nov 2003 13:12:22 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Foerd Subject: Re: Eight-stage Tensegrity Arch In-Reply-To: <1069088747.3fb8ffebdf395@webmail.domeincorporated.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit >Yes, I agree with you Dick. My question, and to respond to Foerd, is more to do with tensegrity structures where the members, cables and frames combined, do not continue all the way across the structure. Unlike a cable supported suspension bridge where long cables stretch from shore to shore, a cable tensegrity as Burkhart has built has numerous shorter cables and frames intertwined making the span. Without rereading stuff from years ago, it seems possible to categorize at least two types of tensegrity structures assuming compressive elements are discontinuous- that is, tensile elements are continuous or non-continuous. Continuous tensors intertwined throughout compressor plurality would exhibit behavior such that the last tensor connection resolves forces and, if any tensile segment is cut or removed, all compressors succumb to gravity. Non-continuous is more along notions of the module wherein, if one unit fails, the others to themselves remain force balanced. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 17 Nov 2003 11:16:31 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Re: Eight-stage Tensegrity Arch In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii --- Foerd wrote: > Without rereading stuff from years ago, it seems possible to > categorize at > least two types of tensegrity structures assuming compressive > elements are > discontinuous- that is, tensile elements are continuous or > non-continuous. > Continuous tensors intertwined throughout compressor plurality would > exhibit > behavior such that the last tensor connection resolves forces and, if > any > tensile segment is cut or removed, all compressors succumb to > gravity. Is there a good picture or example of this. I guess a balloon would fit that catagory, right? Dick __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Protect your identity with Yahoo! Mail AddressGuard http://antispam.yahoo.com/whatsnewfree ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 17 Nov 2003 15:28:03 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Bob Burkhardt Subject: Re: Eight-stage Tensegrity Arch MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Yes, I know Bucky says this, but I think he's over-generalizing here. Tensegrities have components that only undergo tension and these are continuous. In a dome, all the members can undergo tension and compression in different situations. The compression members in a tensegrity physically can usually undergo tension, but by design they are not meant to. Here's some definitions from academic papers I've been reading lately: Adhikari, Rajesh, Skelton, Robert E., Helton, J. William, "Mechanics of Tensegrity Beams", Univ of Calif at La Jolla, Structural Systems and Control Laboratory Report No. 1998-1: "A tensegrity system is a stable connection of axially-loaded members. A Class k tensegrity structure is one in which at most k compressive members are connected to any node." (Structures like my arch with non-contiguous struts are thus Class 1 structures. Structures which have struts pin-joined together would be classified higher.) Bin-Bing Wang (Tover Centre of Space Structures Technology Development, Xu Zhou Tover Group Corporation, China) Cable-strut systems: Part I - Tensegrity, JOURNAL OF CONSTRUCTIONAL STEEL RESEARCH MAR, 1998, v. 45, no. 3, pp. 281-289 lists four qualities: (1) composed of compression and tension elements (2) struts discontinuous while cables continuous (3) rigidified (kinematically indeterminate system) or strengthened (kinematically determinate system) by self-stressing (4) self-supporting In (1) I think we're talking about members that are either in compression or tension and don't flip-flop between the two states as in a geodesic. Wang later goes on to discuss excluding (2) for the case of tensegrities with pin-jointed struts. (3) is certainly a defining quality which I don't think geodesics exhibit -- none of them are prestressed that I know of. (4) is an important quality of a lot of tensegrities, but I've built domes that I consider tensegrities (see http://www.channel1.com/users/bobwb/tenseg/v8dome/release/release.htm) but where staking is integral to the structure. This is an exception among tensegrities I've built, and, like the arch, most are self-supporting: it's not staked to the ground and it looks the same lying on its side or floating in outer space as it does sitting on the ground. I spent a significant amount of design effort getting the six ground-contact points of the arch so they are co-planar without necessity of staking. I think the arch looks kind of like a rainbow which adds to its aesthetic appeal. Bob Dick Fischbeck wrote: >Blair wrote: > > >>>You've built a beautiful structure. I've heard many people say they >>> >>> >>think the >> >> >>>geodesic dome is the structure of the future. I've believed for a >>> >>> >>long time >> >> >>>the geodesic dome is the structure of today, and the tensegrity is >>> >>> >>the >> >> >>>structure of the future. >>> >>> > >Hi Blair > >Geodesic structures ARE tensegrity structure. The tension and >compression members are not so obvious, though. They operate >structurally the same. > > > "703.03 All geodesic domes are tensegrity structures whether or not >the tension- compression differentiations are visible to the observer. >Tensegrity geodesic spheres do what they do because they have the >properties of hydraulically or pneumatically inflated structures." > >Dick > > > ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 17 Nov 2003 16:43:45 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: "" Subject: Re: polies In-Reply-To: <20031117163841.83465.qmail@web40705.mail.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Is it 'government illogic' that dictates the dome at the south pole be torn down? The article says," ...the old geodesic dome..." Ha-ha. Blair Quoting Dick Fischbeck : > http://www.record-eagle.com/2003/nov/16polie.htm ------------------------------------------------- This mail sent through IMP: http://horde.org/imp/ ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 17 Nov 2003 17:09:34 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: "" Subject: Re: Eight-stage Tensegrity Arch In-Reply-To: <3FB8E59B.4000405@channel1.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Bob, was it you who recently discussed a book you are getting published? Your work facinates me, although much of it is literally over my head. For 15 years I've had a tensegrity model from BFI hanging in my great room. Wasn't the topic of the recent October meeting of SNEC, tensegrity? I'll try to make the July SNEC meeting again, but this time I had previously commited to a four day road trip to hear Tull in St. Paul and Chicago. This forthcoming meeting may coincide with the release of the 50th anniversary U.S. postage stamp commemorating Fuller and the first geodesic patent. Blair Quoting Bob Burkhardt : > Blair, > > I know tensegrity (cable domes) is used currently to roof stadiums and I > see a lot of academic work published on deployable antennas based on > tower structures with adjustable tendons. I don't have a lot of insight > where it might be applied next. I've done some brainstorming which you > can read in http://www.channel1.com/users/bobwb/prospect/prospect.htm. > I've been trying to get together an effective technology for > engineering the structures on a computer which I think will make > applications more feasible. > > Bob > > wrote: > ------------------------------------------------- This mail sent through IMP: http://horde.org/imp/ ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 17 Nov 2003 15:49:18 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Re: Eight-stage Tensegrity Arch In-Reply-To: <1069114174.3fb9633e233ef@webmail.domeincorporated.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii --- "" wrote: > Wasn't the topic of the recent October meeting of SNEC, tensegrity? > I'll try > to make the July SNEC meeting again, I heard it might be in June again. Chris Fearnley or John Belt., do you know yet? Dick __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Protect your identity with Yahoo! Mail AddressGuard http://antispam.yahoo.com/whatsnewfree ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 17 Nov 2003 15:52:38 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Re: polies In-Reply-To: <1069112625.3fb95d3182754@webmail.domeincorporated.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii --- "" wrote: > Is it 'government illogic' that dictates the dome at the south pole > be torn > down? > The article says," ...the old geodesic dome..." Ha-ha. Is it scheduled for destruction? Is it gone yet? Dick __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Protect your identity with Yahoo! Mail AddressGuard http://antispam.yahoo.com/whatsnewfree ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 17 Nov 2003 23:35:21 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Subject: Re: polies Comments: cc: "List, DomeHome" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Dick et al, According to the manufacturer, Temcor, the South Pole Dome will be removed in 2 or 3 years. (The email was dated Mar 31, 2003.) The Seabees are trying to recover it & add it to their US Naval SEABEE Musuem at Port Hueneme, CA, USA. If that doesn't happen, then it will be scrapped. -------------------------------------------- Joe S Moore joe_s_moore@hotmail.com http://buckminster.info ------------------------------------------- ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dick Fischbeck" Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic To: Sent: Monday, November 17, 2003 4:52 PM Subject: Re: polies > --- "" wrote: > > Is it 'government illogic' that dictates the dome at the south pole > > be torn > > down? > > The article says," ...the old geodesic dome..." Ha-ha. > > Is it scheduled for destruction? Is it gone yet? > > Dick ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 17 Nov 2003 23:59:26 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Subject: Re: Domes from scratch Comments: To: DomeHome-H@h19.hoflin.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Don & Linda, Here's a list of books about building domes: http://buckminster.info/Biblio/About-Books-Domes.htm -------------------------------------------- Joe S Moore joe_s_moore@hotmail.com http://buckminster.info ------------------------------------------- ----- Original Message ----- From: "The DomeHome List" To: Sent: Saturday, November 15, 2003 4:16 PM Subject: Domes from scratch > From: "Don and Linda Snow" > Date: Fri, 14 Nov 2003 20:56:01 -0500 > > Hi are there any good books out there on building domes > from scratch. you know stick built. buying a kit and > bolting a bunch of triangles together, just seams like > a waste of lumber and hardware > thanks > Don Snow ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 18 Nov 2003 00:07:11 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Subject: Tensegrity Project Suggestions Comments: To: "List, DomeHome" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable How about building flat roofs (or walls) out of tensegrity octahedra; = see http://buckminster.info/Ideas/04-OctaRegTruss.htm http://buckminster.info/Ideas/04-OctaRegTensegTruss.htm -------------------------------------------- Joe S Moore joe_s_moore@hotmail.com http://buckminster.info ------------------------------------------- ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 18 Nov 2003 09:14:00 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Robert Burkhardt Subject: Re: Eight-stage Tensegrity Arch In-Reply-To: <1069114174.3fb9633e233ef@webmail.domeincorporated.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Hi Blair, I'm publishing my book on the internet at http://www.channel1.com/users/bobwb/tenseg/book/cover.html After I've completed changes for the second edition sometime next year, I may consider other forms of publication. The recent SNEC meeting was focussed on adapting material on geodesics for courses. No tensegrity. I presented some material from my book at the January meeting. Hadn't heard about the geodesic stamp. I'll be on the lookout for it. Bob Zitat von "" : > Bob, was it you who recently discussed a book you are getting published? > Your > work facinates me, although much of it is literally over my head. For 15 > years > I've had a tensegrity model from BFI hanging in my great room. > > Wasn't the topic of the recent October meeting of SNEC, tensegrity? I'll try > to make the July SNEC meeting again, but this time I had previously commited > to a four day road trip to hear Tull in St. Paul and Chicago. This > forthcoming > meeting may coincide with the release of the 50th anniversary U.S. postage > stamp commemorating Fuller and the first geodesic patent. > > Blair > > > Quoting Bob Burkhardt : > > > Blair, > > > > I know tensegrity (cable domes) is used currently to roof stadiums and I > > see a lot of academic work published on deployable antennas based on > > tower structures with adjustable tendons. I don't have a lot of insight > > where it might be applied next. I've done some brainstorming which you > > can read in http://www.channel1.com/users/bobwb/prospect/prospect.htm. > > I've been trying to get together an effective technology for > > engineering the structures on a computer which I think will make > > applications more feasible. > > > > Bob > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------- > This mail sent through IMP: http://horde.org/imp/ > ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 18 Nov 2003 09:15:45 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Robert Burkhardt Subject: Re: Eight-stage Tensegrity Arch In-Reply-To: <20031117234918.79341.qmail@web40703.mail.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Hi Dick, Yes, tensegrity is supposed to be the topic of next summer's SNEC meeting. Bob Zitat von Dick Fischbeck : > --- "" wrote: > > > Wasn't the topic of the recent October meeting of SNEC, tensegrity? > > I'll try > > to make the July SNEC meeting again, > > I heard it might be in June again. Chris Fearnley or John Belt., do you > know yet? > > Dick > > __________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > Protect your identity with Yahoo! Mail AddressGuard > http://antispam.yahoo.com/whatsnewfree > ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 18 Nov 2003 08:57:57 -0600 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Tony Kalenak Subject: Re: polies MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain It should be a National Monument ! -----Original Message----- From: [mailto:thedomeguy@DOMEINCORPORATED.COM] Sent: Monday, November 17, 2003 5:44 PM To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU Subject: Re: polies Is it 'government illogic' that dictates the dome at the south pole be torn down? The article says," ...the old geodesic dome..." Ha-ha. Blair Quoting Dick Fischbeck : > http://www.record-eagle.com/2003/nov/16polie.htm ------------------------------------------------- This mail sent through IMP: http://horde.org/imp/ ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 18 Nov 2003 09:00:04 -0600 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Tony Kalenak Subject: Re: polies MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain I hope they save all the parts. It would be a good Fuller Museum piece &/or Place. -----Original Message----- From: Dick Fischbeck [mailto:dick_fischbeck@YAHOO.COM] Sent: Monday, November 17, 2003 5:53 PM To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU Subject: Re: polies --- "" wrote: > Is it 'government illogic' that dictates the dome at the south pole > be torn > down? > The article says," ...the old geodesic dome..." Ha-ha. Is it scheduled for destruction? Is it gone yet? Dick __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Protect your identity with Yahoo! Mail AddressGuard http://antispam.yahoo.com/whatsnewfree ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2003 01:50:58 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: randomes Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed well, it's gone, now -- what ever in Hell it was! were there any takers to the listserv?... good thing, noone tried to live in it, before it rained. thus quoth: Oscar Tuazon?s autonomous social unit, Randome (2003), operates simultaneously within and independent from the context of the Wight Biennial. Situated in a landscaped area just outside the gallery, and constructed of conical panels of recycled aluminum lithography plates, Randome gives structural expression to ideals of nonhierarchical living. A temporary structure, the dome can be erected quickly compromised idealist space. Neither offers a clear image of a new utilization of space. After the disappointment of the modernist utopia, revisiting the myth of the dome - has allowed the examination of the --Dec.2000 'WAND' Chairman Paul O'Neill, reelected to Board. Newsish? http://www.rand.org/publications/randreview/issues/rr.12.00/ http://members.tripod.com/~american_almanac --A church-school McCrusade (Blair's ideals?): Harry-the-Mad-Potter want's US to kill Iraqis?... http://www.tarpley.net/bush25.htm ("Thyroid Storm" ch.) http://www.rwgrayprojects.com/synergetics/plates/plates.html http://quincy4board.homestead.com/files/curriculum/Cosmo.PCX _________________________________________________________________ Need a shot of Hank Williams or Patsy Cline? The classic country stars are always singing on MSN Radio Plus. Try one month free! http://join.msn.com/?page=offers/premiumradio ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2003 01:57:54 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: Mario Merz Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed the rh.dodecah. is dual to the cuboctahedron, or the tetra-kai-deca-XI-asteron (fourteen 4-way vertices), mister Know-it-all. yes, the (regular) 20-asteron is dual to the (regular) 12-asteron. (the dodecahedron is dual to the icosahedron, regularity being assumed without qualifiers, depending upon context.) but "Dick" actually said that, as well, so maybe it's time to learn how to count! thus quoth: Rhombic dodecahedra and pentagonal(or regular) dodecahedra both have 12 sides and 20 vertexes. See: --UN HYDROGEN (sic; Methanex (TM) reformanteurs) ECONOMIE?... La Troi Phases d'Exploitation de la Protocols des Grises de Kyoto: (FOSSILISATION [McCainanites?] (TM/sic))/ BORE/GUSH/NADIR "@" http://www.tarpley.net/aobook.htm. Http://www.tarpley.net/bushb.htm (content partiale, below): 17 -- L'ATTEMPTER de COUP D'ETAT, 3/30/81 23 -- Le FIN d'HISTOIRE 24 -- L'ORDEUR du MONDE NOUVEAU 25 -- THYROID STORK !?! --les ducs de Buffet; vote NONE OF THE BELOW on Trickier Dick Cheney's California Recall & e-Dereg! http://larouchepub.com _________________________________________________________________ Set yourself up for fun at home! Get tips on home entertainment equipment, video game reviews, and more here. http://special.msn.com/home/homeent.armx ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 18 Nov 2003 18:23:01 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: UCLA randome photos Comments: To: synergeo MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Well, it might have been more organized had I been there, but I think it looks great! http://groups.msn.com/BuckminsterFuller/shoebox.msnw?action=ShowPhoto&PhotoID=172 Dick __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Protect your identity with Yahoo! Mail AddressGuard http://antispam.yahoo.com/whatsnewfree ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 18 Nov 2003 21:27:16 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Re: art-speak Pictures of UCLA randome at: http://groups.msn.com/BuckminsterFuller/shoebox.msnw?action=Sho wPhoto&PhotoID=172 Dick ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 18 Nov 2003 21:21:11 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Subject: Electricity Development Near Koreas Comments: cc: "Meisen, Peter" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable >From GlobalSecurity.org: The current status of electricity development in North & South Korea & = surrounding areas: http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/world/dprk/dprk-dark.htm -------------------------------------------- Joe S Moore joe_s_moore@hotmail.com http://buckminster.info ------------------------------------------- ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 18 Nov 2003 21:56:12 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Subject: Global Power Consumption Comments: cc: "Meisen, Peter" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable >From NOAA Satellite & Info Service: Global Power Consumption/Infrastructure Prorated by Population Density: http://dmsp.ngdc.noaa.gov/pres/low_light_120701/html/page10.html -------------------------------------------- Joe S Moore joe_s_moore@hotmail.com http://buckminster.info ------------------------------------------- ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2003 07:16:30 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: "" Subject: Re: UCLA randome photos In-Reply-To: <20031119022301.64934.qmail@web40710.mail.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Would that be organized randomness? It looks like the pitch of the cones is too sharp for the diameter of the dome. Blair Quoting Dick Fischbeck : > Well, it might have been more organized had I been there, but I think > it looks great! > > http://groups.msn.com/BuckminsterFuller/shoebox.msnw? action=ShowPhoto&PhotoID=172 > > Dick > > __________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > Protect your identity with Yahoo! Mail AddressGuard > http://antispam.yahoo.com/whatsnewfree > ------------------------------------------------- This mail sent through IMP: http://horde.org/imp/ ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2003 08:35:47 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Robert Burkhardt Subject: Re: UCLA randome photos In-Reply-To: <20031119022301.64934.qmail@web40710.mail.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Looks good. The swept back profile of the entrance is interesting. The randome allows a lot of scope for individual style. Congrats to both of you! Bob Zitat von Dick Fischbeck : > Well, it might have been more organized had I been there, but I think > it looks great! > > http://groups.msn.com/BuckminsterFuller/shoebox.msnw?action=ShowPhoto&PhotoID=172 > > Dick > > __________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > Protect your identity with Yahoo! Mail AddressGuard > http://antispam.yahoo.com/whatsnewfree > ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2003 10:34:29 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Re: UCLA randome photos In-Reply-To: <1069251390.3fbb7b3e8ea8b@webmail.domeincorporated.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii --- "" wrote: > Would that be organized randomness? It was supposed to be an arrangement of 6 spiral, all starting from the apex. A pineapple, for example, has 8 spirals clockwise and 13 spirals anti-clockwise. > It looks like the pitch of the cones is too sharp for the diameter of > the dome. In effect, that's right. The problem was he put it together without help and he had never done one this size before. There really has to be two people, one inside and one outside. There should be no gaps in the laps, no daylight between the vertex elements. Had that been the case, it would have been a hemisphere of a smaller diameter instead of the flatten version it ended up being. It's all learning! Dick > Quoting Dick Fischbeck : > > > Well, it might have been more organized had I been there, but I > think > > it looks great! > > > > http://groups.msn.com/BuckminsterFuller/shoebox.msnw? > action=ShowPhoto&PhotoID=172 __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Protect your identity with Yahoo! Mail AddressGuard http://antispam.yahoo.com/whatsnewfree ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2003 10:37:13 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Re: UCLA randome photos In-Reply-To: <1069248947.3fbb71b37475a@webmail.channel1.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii --- Robert Burkhardt wrote: > Looks good. The swept back profile of the entrance is interesting. > The > randome allows a lot of scope for individual style. Congrats to both > of you! > > Bob Thanks, Bob. We have another one in the works for a show in New York in January. Dick > > Well, it might have been more organized had I been there, but I > think > > it looks great! > > > > > http://groups.msn.com/BuckminsterFuller/shoebox.msnw?action=ShowPhoto&PhotoID=172 __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Protect your identity with Yahoo! Mail AddressGuard http://antispam.yahoo.com/whatsnewfree ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2003 13:24:15 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Subject: Re: Domes from scratch Comments: To: marcelo@lol.com.br Comments: cc: "List, DomeHome" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Marcello, What is the name of the book/booklet that you are referring to? Is it listed in Construction Lab's catalog? (See http://www.mmedia.is/kingdome/domemat.html#b) If so which letter? (A-O) -------------------------------------------- Joe S Moore joe_s_moore@hotmail.com http://buckminster.info ------------------------------------------- ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Tuesday, November 18, 2003 3:21 AM Subject: Re: Domes from scratch > Good day Joe, > > I have similar objectives as Don and Linda and a few years ago I have bought a book/manual from Einar Thorsteinn which shows you how to build a dome without custom hardware, etc. > > The material appears to me as very interesting and very realistic for the "common" people like me (technologically speaking!). > > Yet there has never been any comment on such work in this group (I have been part of the group for a few years)and there is no reference either in the listing of books in your site as recomended to Don and Linda. > > I take the opportunity to ask: Is there any reason? I have also not been able to locate any domes built using such plans and thus have referencies as far as construction is concerned. This is probably the only reason that restrains me from building one as in this side of the world nobody has ever heard of domes and I should do it all on my own. > > This is the site that maybe of interest to Don and Linda: http://www.mmedia.is/kingdome/ > > All the best for their building. > > Marcello iacoponi > > > -- Mensagem Original -- > De: Joe S Moore > Para: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > Enviar: 04:59 AM > Assunto: Re: Domes from scratch > > Don & Linda, > > Here's a list of books about building domes: > http://buckminster.info/Biblio/About-Books-Domes.htm > -------------------------------------------- > Joe S Moore > joe_s_moore@hotmail.com > http://buckminster.info > ------------------------------------------- > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "The DomeHome List" > To: > Sent: Saturday, November 15, 2003 4:16 PM > Subject: Domes from scratch > > > > From: "Don and Linda Snow" > > Date: Fri, 14 Nov 2003 20:56:01 -0500 > > > > Hi are there any good books out there on building domes > > from scratch. you know stick built. buying a kit and > > bolting a bunch of triangles together, just seams like > > a waste of lumber and hardware > > thanks > > Don Snow > ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2003 22:16:50 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Subject: Re: BUCKY chair Comments: To: einar thorsteinn Comments: cc: "List, DomeHome" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Einar, Nice chair! I've seen the horizontal planes of half of a VE also used as shelves mounted on a wall. Think someone could post the Table of Contents of _The KGB Manual_ on your website? $175 is a LOT of money for a book! It would be nice if people could get a better idea of what they are getting for their money. Maybe some sample pages? A cover pic, etc? Also, would you mind posting to the appropriate electronic newsletters a more detailed notice of your Summer Dome-Building Classes. There might be a few people here in the USA that would be interested in attending. >From Einar's website (http://www.mmedia.is/kingdome/domemat.html#b) "M3: Courses If you are in Europe we would like to point out to you our summer-courses in dome-building : The first weekend in May and the last weekend in August at The Ecological Village In Torup Denmark. Only a one and a half hours drive train ride north from the center of Copenhagen, Denmark. The village received the European Solar Prize in 1994. Contact Hanne Lykkeberg for further information and registration : Tel . Int + 45 47 98 75 71 " -------------------------------------------- Joe S Moore joe_s_moore@hotmail.com http://buckminster.info ------------------------------------------- ----- Original Message ----- From: "einar thorsteinn" To: (snip) Cc: (snip) Sent: Wednesday, November 19, 2003 5:49 AM Subject: BUCKY chair Hallo aus Berlin This is one piece from the Scandinavian Design exhibit http://www.scandesign.org:80/scandesign/art_object.do?instance=/db/scandesig n:xpath(/artobject[@id='c0222i04'])&category=symbols&term=null Einar Thorsteinn 170642 3689 Asgeirsson ______________________ Studio Olafur Eliasson Invaldidenstraße 50-51 D 10557 Berlin Germany tel: Int + 4930 3988 4816 fax: int + 4930 4285 1479 ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2003 05:28:10 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: UCLA randome photos Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed that's got to be the first intelligent comment taht I've heard, regarding the putative Randome (tm) tweaked-cone concept, but you'd still have to deal with shingling ... and other aspects of implimentation, of which we have no evidence, that I've seen (as in, it was posted to a website, with or -- definitely -- without documentation). obviously, the thing was removed under cover of darkness, possibly by doctor Dick, himself. just too convenient, that you "weren't there to supervise" the application of Shinola (tm); eh? there just isn't any where, there, in your criteria of "no light," because you'd have to stress the elements to achieve such; you've never even bothered to *mention* it, or to get a retraction from monsieur Petit, herr doktor-professor! thus quoth: It was supposed to be an arrangement of 6 spiral, all starting from the apex. A pineapple, for example, has 8 spirals clockwise and 13 spirals anti-clockwise. two people, one inside and one outside. There should be no gaps in the laps, no daylight between the vertex elements. Had that been the case, it would have been a hemisphere of a smaller diameter instead of the flatten version it ended up being. --les ducs de Buffet; vote NONE OF THE BELOW on Trickier Dick Cheney's California Recall & e-Dereg! http://larouchepub.com _________________________________________________________________ >From the hottest toys to tips on keeping fit this winter, you’ll find a range of helpful holiday info here. http://special.msn.com/network/happyholidays.armx ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2003 21:01:54 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Subject: Re: Domes from scratch Comments: To: marcelo@lol.com.br Comments: cc: "List, DomeHome" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Marcello, You're right! That book isn't in my dome-books list (or the more broader bibliography of Bucky-related books; see http://buckminster.info/Biblio/About-Books-G-L.htm. I will definitely add it--especially with your positive book review. I suspect not many people have read the _Kingdome Geodesic Building Manual_ because of its price ($158)! Mr Thorsteinn may be willing to give you a list of people who have built a dome based on his book; you would have to ask him. For a collection of dome-related references please see http://buckminster.info/Index/Dome-Dt.htm. You should subscribe to the DomeHome electronic newsletter ("list"); see http://www.domegroup.org/. There's a lot of people there that are planning to or actually building domes. -------------------------------------------- Joe S Moore joe_s_moore@hotmail.com http://buckminster.info ------------------------------------------- ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Wednesday, November 19, 2003 8:15 PM Subject: Re: Domes from scratch > Good day Joe, > > Thanks for your attention to this topic. > > The booklet I refer to is the "Kingdome Geodesic Building Manual" (letter K) it provvides very clear, ready to use information with dimensional data for building domes of a variety of sizes without the need for custom/proprietary metal connectors AND with a ventilation "chamber" between the inner and outer skin of the dome. > > These factors make the above building system very attractive to me and I feel also maybe to Don and Linda. > > Having no referencies (hasn't anyone that follows this group ever built or heard of someone who has built such a dome) and having myself absolutely no experience makes me usure of whether to start building or not. > > Tks. > > Marcello > > -- Mensagem Original -- > De: Joe S Moore > Para: marcelo@lol.com.br > Enviar: 19/11/2003 > Assunto: Re: Domes from scratch > > Marcello, > > What is the name of the book/booklet that you are referring to? Is it > listed in Construction Lab's catalog? (See > http://www.mmedia.is/kingdome/domemat.html#b) If so which > letter? (A-O) > -------------------------------------------- > Joe S Moore > joe_s_moore@hotmail.com > http://buckminster.info > ------------------------------------------- > ----- Original Message ----- > From: > To: > Sent: Tuesday, November 18, 2003 3:21 AM > Subject: Re: Domes from scratch > > > Good day Joe, > > > > I have similar objectives as Don and Linda and a few years ago I have > bought a book/manual from Einar Thorsteinn which shows you how to build a > dome without custom hardware, etc. > > > > The material appears to me as very interesting and very realistic for > the > "common" people like me (technologically speaking!). > > > > Yet there has never been any comment on such work in this group (I have > been part of the group for a few years)and there is no reference either in > the listing of books in your site as recomended to Don and Linda. > > > > I take the opportunity to ask: Is there any reason? I have also not > been > able to locate any domes built using such plans and thus have referencies as > far as construction is concerned. This is probably the only reason that > restrains me from building one as in this side of the world nobody has ever > heard of domes and I should do it all on my own. > > > > This is the site that maybe of interest to Don and Linda: > http://www.mmedia.is/kingdome/ > > > > All the best for their building. > > > > Marcello iacoponi > > > > -- Mensagem Original -- > > De: Joe S Moore > > Para: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > > Enviar: 04:59 AM > > Assunto: Re: Domes from scratch > > > > Don & Linda, > > > > Here's a list of books about building domes: > > http://buckminster.info/Biblio/About-Books-Domes.htm > > -------------------------------------------- > > Joe S Moore > > joe_s_moore@hotmail.com > > http://buckminster.info > > ------------------------------------------- > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "The DomeHome List" > > To: > > Sent: Saturday, November 15, 2003 4:16 PM > > Subject: Domes from scratch > > > > > From: "Don and Linda Snow" > > > Date: Fri, 14 Nov 2003 20:56:01 -0500 > > > > > > Hi are there any good books out there on building domes > > > from scratch. you know stick built. buying a kit and > > > bolting a bunch of triangles together, just seams like > > > a waste of lumber and hardware > > > thanks > > > Don Snow ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2003 06:12:01 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: mass produced MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii http://target.com/target_group/graves/detect.jhtml The addition that really adds up ------------------------------------------------------------------------ By LINDA HALES The Washington Post ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Friday, November 07, 2003 -- A teakettle, rather than a building, turned Michael Graves into America's best-known architect. In the last five years, the Graves studio has produced an avalanche of toasters, telephones, lamps, clocks, patio chairs and garden umbrellas for the shelves of Target stores. Now, Graves and the discount chain are offering the ultimate home accessory: a designer room. It's a Michael Graves Pavilion. And the concept is revolutionary: Little additions by a very big architect are being offered like spatulas on Target's Web site, www.target.com. For as little as $10,000, online shoppers can buy a kit. The pavilions, which come in three stylish, airy models, will be prefabricated by Lindal Cedar Homes, an established kit-house and sunroom company in Washington state. Installation may double the cost, but construction by a Lindal dealer and a delivery date of six weeks are part of a seamless package deal. The underlying philosophy is explained on the Web site against a soothing background of Graves' favorite cerulean blue. Grand estates have always had special spaces, the architect writes - little outbuildings to provide a ''whimsical complement to the residence proper.'' Graves, ever the democratic designer, believes regular folk in bungalows deserve exceptional spaces, too. Presto. The pavilions cost less than a luxury car, from $16,000 to $40,000 completed. They are designed to stand alone in a back yard or to be attached to a house. Ceilings soar more than 13 feet over rooms of 167 to 215 square feet. The Brighton resembles an octagonal English conservatory. The square Sherwood can serve as a covered deck or screened porch. Buyers can choose from a short menu of colors and exteriors - options that enable the same structure to morph in style, at the click of a computer mouse. That's what appealed to Jean and Ed Kee of Alexandria, Va., who this summer placed the first order for a Michael Graves Pavilion. Veterans of three major remodeling ventures with local architects, they had been contemplating a fourth go-round for their 1937 house. They wanted a home office but recoiled at the prospect of an addition involving major excavation, endless decisions, zoning variances and change orders, and a cul-de-sac occupied by dump trucks and dumpsters. And the cost would be enormous. Ed Kee spotted a sketch of the prefab pavilion in late June while reading an article in The New York Times. Jean Kee, who describes the couple as ''design snobs,'' took one look and agreed it was just what they needed. She did a Web search and came up with the Heathcote model, with round windows. She customized the color and siding in four clicks. ''It was just easy,'' she says. ''I could not stomach the process of another custom project. The main attraction is that, gosh, it's just done.'' The Kees were so early in their purchase that dealer-contractors were still being trained. Delivery was promised in September - six weeks after the order was placed. By Thanksgiving, the Kees expect to be done. And instead of spending $100,000 or more, the pavilion will have cost them $32,000, she says. Kee says she asked her longtime architect to take a look at the Web site herself ''and tell me what you would do.'' She hasn't heard back. The pluses of prefab Prefabricated housing has fascinated architects and designers for decades. Mass production would lead to more affordable, efficient dwellings. But the marketplace has never proved sympathetic. Most famously, in the 1940s, Buckminster Fuller failed to sell Americans on a circular steel Dymaxion Dwelling Machine, which would have been dropped in place by a crane. Several cutting-edge designers are now trying to turn shipping containers into dwellings. Graves has had his eye on the housing market for a long time. He produced a house plan for Life magazine's master architect series in the 1990s. But his animated postmodern design did not sell as well as a traditional shingle-style plan by Robert A.M. Stern, a fact that disappointed Graves. The pavilions may fare better. Americans spent $163 billion on home remodeling last year, according to the National Association of the Remodeling Industry. That figure is expected to rise to $214 billion this year, as homeowners commission two-story additions, master suites and bigger bathrooms. Graves and team imagine the attached pavilion as a breakfast room, formal dining room, game room or office. Free-standing, it could become a pool cabana, potting shed, artist's studio or yoga room. The project is so new that the company has made fewer than a dozen sales, according to Lindal Vice President Jeffrey Caden. A few prospective customers have flown to headquarters in Washington state to see a built pavilion. Caden says they experience a ''feeling of awe'' when they enter, thanks to high ceilings and clerestory windows that let in light at the top. Lindal is offering to subtract airfare from the price of a pavilion for shoppers who need to see and feel before they commit. In advance of a major marketing effort, readers of design magazines have encountered a two-page advertisement, including a pop-up pavilion. As a result, Lindal has been fielding questions from New Yorkers asking whether they could put a pavilion on a Manhattan roof. (Caden says it depends on the roof.) People are already asking whether Lindal can make them bigger, to which Caden replies, ''There are other projects that Graves and Lindal are working on.'' One of them is the still-mysterious House Wedd, which Graves promised to design for a couple who won a wedding registry contest at Target. Caden says the house is ''almost designed.'' Target does not envision a future as a purveyor of kit houses, as Sears was in the last century, according to a spokeswoman. There is no intention of selling pavilions at the stores. They are the most costly item on the Web site. But the risk to Target is limited to the cost of designing the Web site and marketing. According to Caden, ''the entry point of $10,000 was really critical'' to the discounter and a challenge to the fabricator. But price was also a positive motivator for the design team. ''We wanted to make the idea of renovation affordable,'' says architect Gary Lapera, a Graves partner who worked on the project for 16 months. ''The only way to do that is to mass-produce.'' But instead of offering every customer the same room, Graves created variety through what Lapera calls an ''open-ended design system.'' Making the pavilions out of timber and glass preserves ''a sense of craft'' in what is essentially assembly-line housing. __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Free Pop-Up Blocker - Get it now http://companion.yahoo.com/ ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2003 11:54:24 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Bob Burkhardt Subject: Kenneth Snelson tensegrities at Marlborough Gallery MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Ref: http://www.marlboroughgallery.com/artists/snelson/artwork.html Thanks to Maxim Schrogin for this. I guess the dragon is the arch he's talking about. Bob ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2003 12:13:47 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Bob Burkhardt Subject: Re: Kenneth Snelson tensegrities at Marlborough Gallery MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Maxim informs me that the arch is not pictured on this page. So I'll need to dig through the library it looks like. Bob Bob Burkhardt wrote: > Ref: http://www.marlboroughgallery.com/artists/snelson/artwork.html > > Thanks to Maxim Schrogin for this. I guess the dragon is the arch > he's talking about. > > Bob > > ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2003 18:21:26 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Subject: Emailing: summary Comments: cc: "List, DomeHome" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable >From now on, the price of non-renewable energy is highly likely to start = rising rather quickly; please see: http://www.hubbertpeak.com/summary.htm This should spur the adoption of energy-efficient artifacts & the = development of renewable energy sources. Note: Oil is already at $30/barrel. -------------------------------------------- Joe S Moore joe_s_moore@hotmail.com http://buckminster.info ------------------------------------------- ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2003 21:26:00 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dave Chapman Subject: Re: mass produced In-Reply-To: <20031120141201.72702.qmail@web40704.mail.yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 06:12 AM 11/20/03 -0800, you wrote: > >The pluses of prefab > >Prefabricated housing has fascinated architects and designers for >decades. Mass production would lead to more affordable, efficient >dwellings. But the marketplace has never proved sympathetic. Most >famously, in the 1940s, Buckminster Fuller failed to sell Americans on >a circular steel Dymaxion Dwelling Machine, which would have been >dropped in place by a crane. Several cutting-edge designers are now >trying to turn shipping containers into dwellings. > The US Navy (and various allied countries) had a project in the 1970s to convert container ships into warships. As part of the project, they had containers which had various functions in them: They had containers which were cabins, offices, hallways, kitchens, bathrooms, and (of course) radar control rooms, torpedo launchers, etc. The idea was that you could take a container ship, stack on a bunch of these "containers", add a crew, and sail off into battle. The "Atlantic Conveyor" and the "Atlantic Connection" actually saw combat in the Falklands War. The program went by the rather amusing name of "Rent-A-Navy". I actually saw (and used) one of the bathroom modules at a museum in Sydney, NSW. It's on a dock, near the submarine. They also have an office container. It's a reasonable idea, but the resulting buildings are shockingly ugly. -dave chapman ========================================================= ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 21 Nov 2003 09:58:25 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Bob Burkhardt Subject: Re: BUCKY chair MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Yes, very innovative. Speaking of half VE's, I sent in a comment a week or so ago how a 4-fold prism forms a half VE if the tendon sizes are chosen right. Now I see one could make an interesting stool frame out of it as well though not collapsible. The wall shelf app might work as well as long as we're talking about a half-VE with a square on the top rather than a triangle. Bob Joe S Moore wrote: >Einar, > >Nice chair! I've seen the horizontal planes of half of a VE also used as >shelves mounted on a wall. > >Think someone could post the Table of Contents of _The KGB Manual_ on your >website? $175 is a LOT of money for a book! It would be nice if people >could get a better idea of what they are getting for their money. Maybe >some sample pages? A cover pic, etc? > >Also, would you mind posting to the appropriate electronic newsletters a >more detailed notice of your Summer Dome-Building Classes. There might be a >few people here in the USA that would be interested in attending. > >>From Einar's website (http://www.mmedia.is/kingdome/domemat.html#b) > >"M3: Courses > >If you are in Europe we would like to point out to you our summer-courses in >dome-building : The first weekend in May and the last weekend in August at >The Ecological Village In Torup Denmark. Only a one and a half hours drive >train ride north from the center of Copenhagen, Denmark. The village >received the European Solar Prize in 1994. Contact Hanne Lykkeberg for >further information and registration : >Tel . Int + 45 47 98 75 71 " > >-------------------------------------------- >Joe S Moore >joe_s_moore@hotmail.com >http://buckminster.info >------------------------------------------- >----- Original Message ----- >From: "einar thorsteinn" >To: (snip) >Cc: (snip) >Sent: Wednesday, November 19, 2003 5:49 AM >Subject: BUCKY chair > > >Hallo aus Berlin > >This is one piece from the Scandinavian Design exhibit > >http://www.scandesign.org:80/scandesign/art_object.do?instance=/db/scandesig >n:xpath(/artobject[@id='c0222i04'])&category=symbols&term=null > >Einar Thorsteinn >170642 3689 >Asgeirsson >______________________ >Studio Olafur Eliasson >Invaldidenstraße 50-51 >D 10557 Berlin Germany > >tel: Int + 4930 3988 4816 >fax: int + 4930 4285 1479 > >. > > > ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 21 Nov 2003 10:52:14 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Bob Subject: Re: mass produced In-Reply-To: <3.0.2.32.20031120212600.00e5bac4@mail.monitor.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" Dave, Thanks for your mass production observations. I think an investigation of the meaning of the word "ugly" might provide the basis of a new science of earth-shaking importance! Thorstein Veblen, in his 1899 economic treatise "Theory of the Leisure Class" proposed that human beings recognize "beauty" and other positive value concepts in terms of conspicuous waste, or other demonstrations of lack of concern for utility. This is possibly why domes tend to be anathema to architects. Its certainly why prefab rectangular dwellings, misnamed "mobile homes" are often forbidden by zoning ordinances. Where I live its not allowed to include a "mobile home" in the category of "affordable housing"- ostensibly because if such homes could be included, communities would include the existing prefab homes in their inventory of "affordable housing" and thereby unfairly meet their quotas. Bob Sanderson >At 06:12 AM 11/20/03 -0800, you wrote: > > > >The pluses of prefab > > > >Prefabricated housing has fascinated architects and designers for > >decades. Mass production would lead to more affordable, efficient > >dwellings. But the marketplace has never proved sympathetic. Most > >famously, in the 1940s, Buckminster Fuller failed to sell Americans on > >a circular steel Dymaxion Dwelling Machine, which would have been > >dropped in place by a crane. Several cutting-edge designers are now > >trying to turn shipping containers into dwellings. > > > >The US Navy (and various allied countries) had a >project in the 1970s to convert container ships >into warships. As part of the project, they had >containers which had various functions in them: > >They had containers which were cabins, offices, >hallways, kitchens, bathrooms, and (of course) >radar control rooms, torpedo launchers, etc. > >The idea was that you could take a container ship, >stack on a bunch of these "containers", add a >crew, and sail off into battle. The "Atlantic Conveyor" >and the "Atlantic Connection" actually saw combat >in the Falklands War. The program went by the >rather amusing name of "Rent-A-Navy". > >I actually saw (and used) one of the bathroom modules >at a museum in Sydney, NSW. It's on a dock, near >the submarine. They also have an office container. > > > >It's a reasonable idea, but the resulting buildings >are shockingly ugly. > >-dave chapman > > >========================================================= ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 21 Nov 2003 17:23:36 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: "" Subject: Re: mass produced In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Two quotes from Bucky about beauty: "When I am working on a problem I never think about beauty. I only think about how to solve the problem. But when I have finished, if the solution is not beautiful, I know it is wrong." and... "Beauty; if you really understand the problem, if you solve it correctly so life really goes on, this is regeneration of life. Do it economically and you can't miss beauty." R. Buckminster Fuller Blair Quoting Bob : > Dave, > > Thanks for your mass production observations. > > I think an investigation of the meaning of the word "ugly" might > provide the basis of a new science of earth-shaking importance! > > Thorstein Veblen, in his 1899 economic treatise "Theory of the > Leisure Class" proposed that human beings recognize "beauty" and > other positive value concepts in terms of conspicuous waste, or other > demonstrations of lack of concern for utility. This is possibly why > domes tend to be anathema to architects. Its certainly why prefab > rectangular dwellings, misnamed "mobile homes" are often forbidden by > zoning ordinances. Where I live its not allowed to include a > "mobile home" in the category of "affordable housing"- ostensibly > because if such homes could be included, communities would include > the existing prefab homes in their inventory of "affordable housing" > and thereby unfairly meet their quotas. > > Bob Sanderson > > > >At 06:12 AM 11/20/03 -0800, you wrote: > > > > > >The pluses of prefab > > > > > >Prefabricated housing has fascinated architects and designers for > > >decades. Mass production would lead to more affordable, efficient > > >dwellings. But the marketplace has never proved sympathetic. Most > > >famously, in the 1940s, Buckminster Fuller failed to sell Americans on > > >a circular steel Dymaxion Dwelling Machine, which would have been > > >dropped in place by a crane. Several cutting-edge designers are now > > >trying to turn shipping containers into dwellings. > > > > > > >The US Navy (and various allied countries) had a > >project in the 1970s to convert container ships > >into warships. As part of the project, they had > >containers which had various functions in them: > > > >They had containers which were cabins, offices, > >hallways, kitchens, bathrooms, and (of course) > >radar control rooms, torpedo launchers, etc. > > > >The idea was that you could take a container ship, > >stack on a bunch of these "containers", add a > >crew, and sail off into battle. The "Atlantic Conveyor" > >and the "Atlantic Connection" actually saw combat > >in the Falklands War. The program went by the > >rather amusing name of "Rent-A-Navy". > > > >I actually saw (and used) one of the bathroom modules > >at a museum in Sydney, NSW. It's on a dock, near > >the submarine. They also have an office container. > > > > > > > >It's a reasonable idea, but the resulting buildings > >are shockingly ugly. > > > >-dave chapman > > > > > >========================================================= > ------------------------------------------------- This mail sent through IMP: http://horde.org/imp/ ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 21 Nov 2003 19:47:13 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Subject: Re: Domes from scratch Comments: To: marcelo@lol.com.br Comments: cc: "List, DomeHome" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Marcello, I don't know if any of the following domes were built using Einar Thorsteinn's book, but here's a list of domes in Iceland (where he originally was located): http://buckminster.info/Index/Domes-I.htm Since you are in Brazil (lol.com.br), if you go to the bottom of my home page & search for Brazil, you should get about 31 hits regarding something having to do with Brazil & R B Fuller. Maybe I'll break down & buy the book. I'm still hoping to see the table of contents first. -------------------------------------------- Joe S Moore joe_s_moore@hotmail.com http://buckminster.info ------------------------------------------- ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Thursday, November 20, 2003 7:27 AM Subject: Re: Domes from scratch > Hello Joe, > > Thanks for your reply. > > Not many people might have bought the book, not because of its price but most probably because of the lack of marketing (present in the mayority of kits/turn key dome builders). I may comment that the book presents good value for money once it is not simply a book (information) but it is a project that gives you actual plans for building a dome "from scratch" yet my opinion is theoretical because I have not actually build the dome. > > As you mention I requested to Mr. Einar owners/builders references but did not manage a listing, suppose that is difficult to know who build a dome and who only bought the book (I am in the 2nd category!), also understand that privacy is important. > > From your site I could not determine if any of the domes were Einar's project. > > Sometime ago at Domegroup nobody appeared to have built or known who had built a dome based on Einar's plans, still keep an eye in the group's info. > > Any reference is wellcome. > > Thanks again. > > Marcello iacoponi > > -- Mensagem Original -- > De: Joe S Moore > Para: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > Enviar: 02:01 AM > Assunto: Re: Domes from scratch > > Marcello, > > You're right! That book isn't in my dome-books list (or the more broader > bibliography of Bucky-related books; see > http://buckminster.info/Biblio/About-Books-G-L.htm. I will > definitely add > it--especially with your positive book review. I suspect not many people > have read the _Kingdome Geodesic Building Manual_ because of its price > ($158)! Mr Thorsteinn may be willing to give you a list of people who have > built a dome based on his book; you would have to ask him. > > For a collection of dome-related references please see > http://buckminster.info/Index/Dome-Dt.htm. > > You should subscribe to the DomeHome electronic newsletter ("list"); > see > http://www.domegroup.org/. There's a lot of people there > that are planning > to or actually building domes. > (snip) ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 21 Nov 2003 22:02:02 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dave Chapman Subject: Re: mass produced In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 10:52 AM 11/21/03 -0500, you wrote: >Dave, > >Thanks for your mass production observations. > >I think an investigation of the meaning of the word "ugly" might >provide the basis of a new science of earth-shaking importance! > >Thorstein Veblen, in his 1899 economic treatise "Theory of the >Leisure Class" proposed that human beings recognize "beauty" and >other positive value concepts in terms of conspicuous waste, or other >demonstrations of lack of concern for utility. This is possibly why >domes tend to be anathema to architects. Its certainly why prefab >rectangular dwellings, misnamed "mobile homes" are often forbidden by >zoning ordinances. Some years ago, I saw a discussion of why buildings look better with trim than without. The basic idea was that trim provides a "scale bridge", such that the building's main features (several meters in size), the building's human-scale features (1-2 meters), the trim (50-200 mm), and the texture of the grain of the materials used in the building (1-2 mm) form a continuum of scale, which is interpreted as pleasing to the eye. Another set of theories describe how things whose proportions are according to the Golden Ratio (approximately 5:8) look better than things which are square. So, yes, there actually is a (poorly developed) science of aesthetics. Oddly enough, I was just having a conversation today about Class Warfare and building codes. The specific examples were the City of Los Gatos' attempt to make it illegal to own a pickup truck, and the City of Santa Rosa's current laws which prohibit you from keeping an RV anywhere that it can be seen by the public. . . As for shipping containers, they are ugly on various levels. It almost appears that the creators went out of their way to make them ugly, as a design statement. This is sort of like the recent mini-SUVs, which are ugly because the Hummer has made if very fashionable to drive an ugly SUV. I suppose you could make a good-looking container, but . . . -dave ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 21 Nov 2003 22:03:33 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dave Chapman Subject: Re: mass produced In-Reply-To: <1069460616.3fbeac8884d47@webmail.domeincorporated.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 05:23 PM 11/21/03 -0700, you wrote: >Two quotes from Bucky about beauty: > >"When I am working on a problem >I never think about beauty. >I only think about how to solve the problem. >But when I have finished, >if the solution is not beautiful, I know it is wrong." > >and... > >"Beauty; if you really understand the problem, >if you solve it correctly so life really goes on, >this is regeneration of life. >Do it economically and you can't miss beauty." > > R. Buckminster Fuller > > >Blair > > I think that geodesic structures are beautiful, and I think that the Expo-67 dome is very beautiful. -dave ========================================================= ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 22 Nov 2003 10:04:36 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Bob Subject: Re: mass produced In-Reply-To: <1069460616.3fbeac8884d47@webmail.domeincorporated.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" Blair- Thanks for these quotes. Veblen's dark vision of human motivation contained a flicker of hope in what he called the "instinct of workmanship" Bob >Two quotes from Bucky about beauty: > >"When I am working on a problem >I never think about beauty. >I only think about how to solve the problem. >But when I have finished, >if the solution is not beautiful, I know it is wrong." > >and... > >"Beauty; if you really understand the problem, >if you solve it correctly so life really goes on, >this is regeneration of life. >Do it economically and you can't miss beauty." > > R. Buckminster Fuller > > >Blair > > > >Quoting Bob : > > > Dave, > > > > Thanks for your mass production observations. > > > > I think an investigation of the meaning of the word "ugly" might > > provide the basis of a new science of earth-shaking importance! > > > > Thorstein Veblen, in his 1899 economic treatise "Theory of the > > Leisure Class" proposed that human beings recognize "beauty" and > > other positive value concepts in terms of conspicuous waste, or other > > demonstrations of lack of concern for utility. This is possibly why > > domes tend to be anathema to architects. Its certainly why prefab > > rectangular dwellings, misnamed "mobile homes" are often forbidden by > > zoning ordinances. Where I live its not allowed to include a > > "mobile home" in the category of "affordable housing"- ostensibly > > because if such homes could be included, communities would include > > the existing prefab homes in their inventory of "affordable housing" > > and thereby unfairly meet their quotas. > > > > Bob Sanderson > > > > > > >At 06:12 AM 11/20/03 -0800, you wrote: > > > > > > > >The pluses of prefab > > > > > > > >Prefabricated housing has fascinated architects and designers for > > > >decades. Mass production would lead to more affordable, efficient > > > >dwellings. But the marketplace has never proved sympathetic. Most > > > >famously, in the 1940s, Buckminster Fuller failed to sell Americans on > > > >a circular steel Dymaxion Dwelling Machine, which would have been > > > >dropped in place by a crane. Several cutting-edge designers are now > > > >trying to turn shipping containers into dwellings. > > > > > > > > > >The US Navy (and various allied countries) had a > > >project in the 1970s to convert container ships > > >into warships. As part of the project, they had > > >containers which had various functions in them: > > > > > >They had containers which were cabins, offices, > > >hallways, kitchens, bathrooms, and (of course) > > >radar control rooms, torpedo launchers, etc. > > > > > >The idea was that you could take a container ship, > > >stack on a bunch of these "containers", add a > > >crew, and sail off into battle. The "Atlantic Conveyor" > > >and the "Atlantic Connection" actually saw combat > > >in the Falklands War. The program went by the > > >rather amusing name of "Rent-A-Navy". > > > > > >I actually saw (and used) one of the bathroom modules > > >at a museum in Sydney, NSW. It's on a dock, near > > >the submarine. They also have an office container. > > > > > > > > > > > >It's a reasonable idea, but the resulting buildings > > >are shockingly ugly. > > > > > >-dave chapman > > > > > > > > >========================================================= > > > > > > >------------------------------------------------- >This mail sent through IMP: http://horde.org/imp/ ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 22 Nov 2003 10:16:09 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: "" Subject: Re: mass produced In-Reply-To: <3.0.2.32.20031121220202.0077fe7c@mail.monitor.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit 'The Golden Ratio', a book written by Mario Livio, is identified by the greek letter Phi, (pronounced 'fee'); more or less a circle with a verticle line through it. The golden ratio number is 1.61803. Blair ,Quoting Dave Chapman : > >Thorstein Veblen, in his 1899 economic treatise "Theory of the > >Leisure Class" proposed that human beings recognize "beauty" and > >other positive value concepts in terms of conspicuous waste, or other > >demonstrations of lack of concern for utility. > Another set of theories describe how things whose proportions are > according to the Golden Ratio (approximately 5:8) look better than > things which are square. > ------------------------------------------------- This mail sent through IMP: http://horde.org/imp/ ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 22 Nov 2003 16:55:27 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Subject: Re: Domes from scratch Comments: To: marcelo@lol.com.br Comments: cc: "List, DomeHome" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Marcello, Thank you so much! I'll add the TOC to my website. I realize now why there was some difficulty in locating references to Einar's book; he calls it by two different names: Kingdome Geodesic Building Manual and The KGB Manual and so it would be entered into the bibliography in two different locations: About/K/...and About/T/.....I'll have to do both & cross reference. Refs about Alan Neil Ditchfield & Honeycomb Engineering Design are at: http://buckminster.info/Index/Disd-Domd.htm and http://buckminster.info/Index/Domes-Manuf-H.htm Also, I have some additional info in my files that was current as of Jan 6, 2001: Patent # PI 9203881-6 published in Revista da Propriedade Industrial, # 1449, Sept 29, 1998, Brazil. CR ALMEIDA S.A.: Avenida Vicente Machado 1771 Curitiba PR Brazil 80440-020 TEL: +55 41 342-4411 FAX: +55 41 244-0592 E-mail: alanneil@cralmeida.com.br and montana@montana.ind.br PS: If you mail me (below) a color copy of the cover, I can scan it & add it to the top of the Table of Contents (TOC) page. PPS: We're not breaking any copyright laws as long as we're not trying to make any money off the material & it's being used for educational purposes--which is the purpose of my website. It's called in the law "Fair Use". -------------------------------------------- Joe S Moore 5424 N Linda Place Tucson, AZ 85704 joe_s_moore@hotmail.com http://buckminster.info ------------------------------------------- ----- Original Message ----- From: "Marcelo" To: "Joe S Moore" Sent: Saturday, November 22, 2003 6:49 AM Subject: Domes from scratch > Hello Joe, > > Thanks for your reply, > > Checked your page suggestions, learned that there is a city in Indiana named Brazil (!) and a reference to someone in Curitiba (this one in Brazil and actually where I live): "Honeycomb Engineering Design, 01-01, Alan N Ditchfield" - but could not go any further either through your site (no links) nor locally. Any further help? > > Table of contents for the K.G.B. (Kingdome Geodesic Building) Manual are not a problem hopefully without breaking any copyright law, I have transcribed it and is attached. I do not have a scanner readily available thus could not do the same with the cover page. > > It might be an intersting idea to send copies of these e-mails to Einar himself for comments. > > Your feedback is welcome. > > Tks > > Marcello iacoponi > > ======= At 2003-11-21, 19:47:00 you wrote: ======= > > >Marcello, > > > >I don't know if any of the following domes were built using Einar > >Thorsteinn's book, but here's a list of domes in Iceland (where he > >originally was located): http://buckminster.info/Index/Domes-I.htm > > > >Since you are in Brazil (lol.com.br), if you go to the bottom of my home > >page & search for Brazil, you should get about 31 hits regarding something > >having to do with Brazil & R B Fuller. > > > >Maybe I'll break down & buy the book. I'm still hoping to see the table of > >contents first. (snip) ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 23 Nov 2003 01:24:01 -0300 Reply-To: marcelo@lol.com.br Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Marcelo Subject: Domes from scratch Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Good morning Joe, Tks again. KGB Cover in the post soonest. Relieved to hear about copyright because I work on my own and often suffer from unrespected copyright - I feel rather ethic about it. Your files seem to be well stocked and organised. After a few years of reading and learning much from the group I am glad to have contributed even though so little. Back to the beginning: Did Don and Linda find anything interesting? Any info regarding domes actually built using Einar's plans? Any comments from Einar himself? My regards, Marcello iacoponi ======= At 2003-11-22, 16:55:00 you wrote: ======= >Marcello, > >Thank you so much! I'll add the TOC to my website. I realize now why there >was some difficulty in locating references to Einar's book; he calls it by >two different names: > >Kingdome Geodesic Building Manual and > >The KGB Manual > >and so it would be entered into the bibliography in two different locations: >About/K/...and About/T/.....I'll have to do both & cross reference. > >Refs about Alan Neil Ditchfield & Honeycomb Engineering Design are at: >http://buckminster.info/Index/Disd-Domd.htm and >http://buckminster.info/Index/Domes-Manuf-H.htm > >Also, I have some additional info in my files that was current as of Jan 6, >2001: > >Patent # PI 9203881-6 published in Revista da Propriedade Industrial, # >1449, Sept 29, 1998, Brazil. > >CR ALMEIDA S.A.: Avenida Vicente Machado 1771 Curitiba PR Brazil 80440-020 >TEL: +55 41 342-4411 >FAX: +55 41 244-0592 >E-mail: alanneil@cralmeida.com.br and montana@montana.ind.br > >PS: If you mail me (below) a color copy of the cover, I can scan it & add it >to the top of the Table of Contents (TOC) page. > >PPS: We're not breaking any copyright laws as long as we're not trying to >make any money off the material & it's being used for educational >purposes--which is the purpose of my website. It's called in the law "Fair >Use". > >-------------------------------------------- >Joe S Moore >5424 N Linda Place >Tucson, AZ 85704 >joe_s_moore@hotmail.com >http://buckminster.info >------------------------------------------- >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Marcelo" >To: "Joe S Moore" >Sent: Saturday, November 22, 2003 6:49 AM >Subject: Domes from scratch > > >> Hello Joe, >> >> Thanks for your reply, >> >> Checked your page suggestions, learned that there is a city in Indiana >named Brazil (!) and a reference to someone in Curitiba (this one in Brazil >and actually where I live): "Honeycomb Engineering Design, 01-01, Alan N >Ditchfield" - but could not go any further either through your site (no >links) nor locally. Any further help? >> >> Table of contents for the K.G.B. (Kingdome Geodesic Building) Manual are >not a problem hopefully without breaking any copyright law, I have >transcribed it and is attached. I do not have a scanner readily available >thus could not do the same with the cover page. >> >> It might be an intersting idea to send copies of these e-mails to Einar >himself for comments. >> >> Your feedback is welcome. >> >> Tks >> >> Marcello iacoponi >> >> ======= At 2003-11-21, 19:47:00 you wrote: ======= >> >> >Marcello, >> > >> >I don't know if any of the following domes were built using Einar >> >Thorsteinn's book, but here's a list of domes in Iceland (where he >> >originally was located): http://buckminster.info/Index/Domes-I.htm >> > >> >Since you are in Brazil (lol.com.br), if you go to the bottom of my home >> >page & search for Brazil, you should get about 31 hits regarding >something >> >having to do with Brazil & R B Fuller. >> > >> >Maybe I'll break down & buy the book. I'm still hoping to see the table >of >> >contents first. >(snip) > >. = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = Best regards. Marcelo marcelo@lol.com.br 2003-11-23 ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 23 Nov 2003 08:01:52 EST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Mark Stehly Subject: Re: Domes from scratch MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Joe, A simple point. Just remember the inter library loaning system. In response to: "Maybe I'll break down & buy the book. I'm still hoping to see the table of contents first." Mark ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 23 Nov 2003 10:49:13 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: "Ken G. Brown" Subject: Re: Domes from scratch In-Reply-To: <200311210504.WAA29647@sunny2.tnc.ab.ca> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" John Rich's site http://www.geocities.com/RainForest/Jungle/3675/ has a wealth of info and beautiful pictures as well as access to his downloadable book, Timber Geodesic Domes http://www.geocities.com/RainForest/Jungle/3675/links.htm#tgd . Ken >Date: Wed, 19 Nov 2003 21:01:54 -0700 >From: Joe S Moore >Subject: Re: Domes from scratch > >Marcello, > >You're right! That book isn't in my dome-books list (or the more broader >bibliography of Bucky-related books; see >http://buckminster.info/Biblio/About-Books-G-L.htm. I will definitely add >it--especially with your positive book review. I suspect not many people > > > > -- Mensagem Original -- >> > De: Joe S Moore >> > Para: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU >> > Enviar: 04:59 AM >> > Assunto: Re: Domes from scratch >> > >> > Don & Linda, >> > >> > Here's a list of books about building domes: > > > http://buckminster.info/Biblio/About-Books-Domes.htm >> > -------------------------------------------- >> > Joe S Moore >> > joe_s_moore@hotmail.com > > > http://buckminster.info > > > ------------------------------------------- > > > ----- Original Message ----- >> > From: "The DomeHome List" >> > To: >> > Sent: Saturday, November 15, 2003 4:16 PM >> > Subject: Domes from scratch >> > >> > > From: "Don and Linda Snow" >> > > Date: Fri, 14 Nov 2003 20:56:01 -0500 >> > > >> > > Hi are there any good books out there on building domes >> > > from scratch. you know stick built. buying a kit and >> > > bolting a bunch of triangles together, just seams like >> > > a waste of lumber and hardware >> > > thanks > > > > Don Snow > >------------------------------ > >Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2003 06:12:01 -0800 >From: Dick Fischbeck >Subject: mass produced > >http://target.com/target_group/graves/detect.jhtml > > > > >The addition that really adds up > >------------------------------------------------------------------------ >By LINDA HALES The Washington Post >------------------------------------------------------------------------ >Friday, November 07, 2003 -- A teakettle, rather than a building, >turned Michael Graves into America's best-known architect. In the last >five years, the Graves studio has produced an avalanche of toasters, >telephones, lamps, clocks, patio chairs and garden umbrellas for the >shelves of Target stores. Now, Graves and the discount chain are >offering the ultimate home accessory: a designer room. > >It's a Michael Graves Pavilion. And the concept is revolutionary: >Little additions by a very big architect are being offered like >spatulas on Target's Web site, www.target.com. > >For as little as $10,000, online shoppers can buy a kit. The pavilions, >which come in three stylish, airy models, will be prefabricated by >Lindal Cedar Homes, an established kit-house and sunroom company in >Washington state. Installation may double the cost, but construction by >a Lindal dealer and a delivery date of six weeks are part of a seamless >package deal. > >The underlying philosophy is explained on the Web site against a >soothing background of Graves' favorite cerulean blue. Grand estates >have always had special spaces, the architect writes - little >outbuildings to provide a ''whimsical complement to the residence >proper.'' Graves, ever the democratic designer, believes regular folk >in bungalows deserve exceptional spaces, too. > >Presto. The pavilions cost less than a luxury car, from $16,000 to >$40,000 completed. They are designed to stand alone in a back yard or >to be attached to a house. Ceilings soar more than 13 feet over rooms >of 167 to 215 square feet. The Brighton resembles an octagonal English >conservatory. The square Sherwood can serve as a covered deck or >screened porch. Buyers can choose from a short menu of colors and >exteriors - options that enable the same structure to morph in style, >at the click of a computer mouse. > >That's what appealed to Jean and Ed Kee of Alexandria, Va., who this >summer placed the first order for a Michael Graves Pavilion. Veterans >of three major remodeling ventures with local architects, they had been >contemplating a fourth go-round for their 1937 house. They wanted a >home office but recoiled at the prospect of an addition involving major >excavation, endless decisions, zoning variances and change orders, and >a cul-de-sac occupied by dump trucks and dumpsters. And the cost would >be enormous. > >Ed Kee spotted a sketch of the prefab pavilion in late June while >reading an article in The New York Times. Jean Kee, who describes the >couple as ''design snobs,'' took one look and agreed it was just what >they needed. She did a Web search and came up with the Heathcote model, >with round windows. She customized the color and siding in four clicks. > >''It was just easy,'' she says. ''I could not stomach the process of >another custom project. The main attraction is that, gosh, it's just >done.'' > >The Kees were so early in their purchase that dealer-contractors were >still being trained. Delivery was promised in September - six weeks >after the order was placed. By Thanksgiving, the Kees expect to be >done. And instead of spending $100,000 or more, the pavilion will have >cost them $32,000, she says. > >Kee says she asked her longtime architect to take a look at the Web >site herself ''and tell me what you would do.'' She hasn't heard back. > >The pluses of prefab > >Prefabricated housing has fascinated architects and designers for >decades. Mass production would lead to more affordable, efficient >dwellings. But the marketplace has never proved sympathetic. Most >famously, in the 1940s, Buckminster Fuller failed to sell Americans on >a circular steel Dymaxion Dwelling Machine, which would have been >dropped in place by a crane. Several cutting-edge designers are now >trying to turn shipping containers into dwellings. > >Graves has had his eye on the housing market for a long time. He >produced a house plan for Life magazine's master architect series in >the 1990s. But his animated postmodern design did not sell as well as a >traditional shingle-style plan by Robert A.M. Stern, a fact that >disappointed Graves. > >The pavilions may fare better. Americans spent $163 billion on home >remodeling last year, according to the National Association of the >Remodeling Industry. That figure is expected to rise to $214 billion >this year, as homeowners commission two-story additions, master suites >and bigger bathrooms. > >Graves and team imagine the attached pavilion as a breakfast room, >formal dining room, game room or office. Free-standing, it could become >a pool cabana, potting shed, artist's studio or yoga room. > >The project is so new that the company has made fewer than a dozen >sales, according to Lindal Vice President Jeffrey Caden. A few >prospective customers have flown to headquarters in Washington state to >see a built pavilion. Caden says they experience a ''feeling of awe'' >when they enter, thanks to high ceilings and clerestory windows that >let in light at the top. Lindal is offering to subtract airfare from >the price of a pavilion for shoppers who need to see and feel before >they commit. > >In advance of a major marketing effort, readers of design magazines >have encountered a two-page advertisement, including a pop-up pavilion. >As a result, Lindal has been fielding questions from New Yorkers asking >whether they could put a pavilion on a Manhattan roof. (Caden says it >depends on the roof.) People are already asking whether Lindal can make >them bigger, to which Caden replies, ''There are other projects that >Graves and Lindal are working on.'' > >One of them is the still-mysterious House Wedd, which Graves promised >to design for a couple who won a wedding registry contest at Target. >Caden says the house is ''almost designed.'' > >Target does not envision a future as a purveyor of kit houses, as Sears >was in the last century, according to a spokeswoman. There is no >intention of selling pavilions at the stores. They are the most costly >item on the Web site. But the risk to Target is limited to the cost of >designing the Web site and marketing. > >According to Caden, ''the entry point of $10,000 was really critical'' >to the discounter and a challenge to the fabricator. But price was also >a positive motivator for the design team. > >''We wanted to make the idea of renovation affordable,'' says architect >Gary Lapera, a Graves partner who worked on the project for 16 months. >''The only way to do that is to mass-produce.'' But instead of offering >every customer the same room, Graves created variety through what >Lapera calls an ''open-ended design system.'' Making the pavilions out >of timber and glass preserves ''a sense of craft'' in what is >essentially assembly-line housing. > > >__________________________________ >Do you Yahoo!? >Free Pop-Up Blocker - Get it now >http://companion.yahoo.com/ > >------------------------------ > >Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2003 11:54:24 -0500 >From: Bob Burkhardt >Subject: Kenneth Snelson tensegrities at Marlborough Gallery > >Ref: http://www.marlboroughgallery.com/artists/snelson/artwork.html > >Thanks to Maxim Schrogin for this. I guess the dragon is the arch he's >talking about. > >Bob > >------------------------------ > >Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2003 12:13:47 -0500 >From: Bob Burkhardt >Subject: Re: Kenneth Snelson tensegrities at Marlborough Gallery > >Maxim informs me that the arch is not pictured on this page. So I'll >need to dig through the >library it looks like. > >Bob > >Bob Burkhardt wrote: > >> Ref: http://www.marlboroughgallery.com/artists/snelson/artwork.html >> >> Thanks to Maxim Schrogin for this. I guess the dragon is the arch >> he's talking about. >> >> Bob >> >> > >------------------------------ > >Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2003 18:21:26 -0700 >From: Joe S Moore >Subject: Emailing: summary > >>From now on, the price of non-renewable energy is highly likely to start = >rising rather quickly; please see: > >http://www.hubbertpeak.com/summary.htm > >This should spur the adoption of energy-efficient artifacts & the = >development of renewable energy sources. > >Note: Oil is already at $30/barrel. > >-------------------------------------------- >Joe S Moore >joe_s_moore@hotmail.com >http://buckminster.info >------------------------------------------- > >------------------------------ > >End of GEODESIC Digest - 19 Nov 2003 to 20 Nov 2003 (#2003-277) >*************************************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 23 Nov 2003 13:47:29 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Subject: Re: e-mail lists Comments: To: thedomeguy@domeincorporated.com Comments: cc: "List, DomeHome" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Blair, If I remember right, it was a Yahoo group called Synergeo, but it had to do with Synergetics; see http://groups.yahoo.com/group/synergeo/ Go to yahoo Groups & search for geodesic, buckminster, etc http://groups.yahoo.com Here's a list (scroll to "Newsletters") that I compiled--but the date on the bottom of the page is 2-16-03: http://buckminster.info/Index/New-Nind.htm MSN Groups also has several Bucky-related groups (search for buckminster, geodesic, etc http://groups.msn.com/ There probably are other orgs sponsoring groups. -------------------------------------------- Joe S Moore joe_s_moore@hotmail.com http://buckminster.info ------------------------------------------- ----- Original Message ----- From: To: "Joe S Moore" Sent: Sunday, November 23, 2003 9:09 AM Subject: e-mail lists > Joe, > > You wrote once you had to drop out of a dome e-mail list because it took too > much of your time. Which list was this? > > Blair ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 23 Nov 2003 14:32:14 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Subject: Re: Domes from scratch Comments: To: marcelo@lol.com.br MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hey Marcello, see my embedded comments below. Switching to webpage = format--hope you can read it. -------------------------------------------- Joe S Moore joe_s_moore@hotmail.com http://buckminster.info ------------------------------------------- ----- Original Message -----=20 From: "Marcelo" Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic To: Sent: Saturday, November 22, 2003 9:24 PM Subject: Domes from scratch > Good morning Joe, >=20 > Tks again. >=20 > KGB Cover in the post soonest.=20 Thank you! I already input the TOC, but it won't become visible until I = upload all the changes to my website "soon" (in next 30 days?) It's now = almost 100 megs--about half pics. > Relieved to hear about copyright because I work on my own and often = suffer from unrespected copyright - I feel rather ethic about it. >=20 > Your files seem to be well stocked and organised. I have been collecting info relevant to R B Fuller since 1970; have over = 100 lineal feet of binders, books, tapes, etc.=20 > After a few years of reading and learning much from the group I am = glad to have contributed even though so little. >=20 > Back to the beginning: >=20 > Did Don and Linda find anything interesting? Don't know > Any info regarding domes actually built using Einar's plans? None yet > Any comments from Einar himself? None yet > My regards, >=20 > Marcello iacoponi My comments re personal housing structures in general: Any residential building including domes should meet the following = performance criteria: 1. Not made of flammable materials. 2. Can't rot. 3. Can't be eaten by bugs. 4. Structure should be mass-produced in order to bring cost down to that = of a luxury car. 5. Ideally, it should be self-contained (collects & recycles renewable = energy) & portable. Nothing like above is presently available on this planet--yet. Bottom line: Can't honestly recommend current crop of personal domes. = (Commercial ones are different.) Current residential domes are just = special-case custom-built houses--slightly less expensive than = conventional custom-built homes. Very disappointing; wait 10 years. >=20 > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D At 2003-11-22, 16:55:00 you wrote: = =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >=20 > >Marcello, > > > >Thank you so much! I'll add the TOC to my website. I realize now = why there > >was some difficulty in locating references to Einar's book; he calls = it by > >two different names: > > > >Kingdome Geodesic Building Manual and > > > >The KGB Manual > > > >and so it would be entered into the bibliography in two different = locations: > >About/K/...and About/T/.....I'll have to do both & cross reference. > > > >Refs about Alan Neil Ditchfield & Honeycomb Engineering Design are = at: > >http://buckminster.info/Index/Disd-Domd.htm and > >http://buckminster.info/Index/Domes-Manuf-H.htm > > > >Also, I have some additional info in my files that was current as of = Jan 6, > >2001: > > > >Patent # PI 9203881-6 published in Revista da Propriedade Industrial, = # > >1449, Sept 29, 1998, Brazil. > > > >CR ALMEIDA S.A.: Avenida Vicente Machado 1771 Curitiba PR Brazil = 80440-020 > >TEL: +55 41 342-4411 > >FAX: +55 41 244-0592 > >E-mail: alanneil@cralmeida.com.br and montana@montana.ind.br > > > >PS: If you mail me (below) a color copy of the cover, I can scan it & = add it > >to the top of the Table of Contents (TOC) page. > > > >PPS: We're not breaking any copyright laws as long as we're not = trying to > >make any money off the material & it's being used for educational > >purposes--which is the purpose of my website. It's called in the law = "Fair > >Use". (snip) ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 23 Nov 2003 14:07:43 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Re: Domes from scratch In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii --- Joe S Moore wrote: > My comments re personal housing structures in general: > > Any residential building including domes should meet the following > performance criteria: > > 1. Not made of flammable materials. > 2. Can't rot. > 3. Can't be eaten by bugs. > 4. Structure should be mass-produced in order to bring cost down to > that of a luxury car. > 5. Ideally, it should be self-contained (collects & recycles > renewable energy) & portable. > > Nothing like above is presently available on this planet--yet. > > Bottom line: Can't honestly recommend current crop of personal domes. > (Commercial ones are different.) Current residential domes are just > special-case custom-built houses--slightly less expensive than > conventional custom-built homes. Very disappointing; wait 10 years. Joe I can't wait for you to see pictures of the newest randome prototype! It is contructed with 0.040 aluminum sheeting, s.s. fasteners and plexiglass. It weighs in at 1400 pounds, has a 24 foot diameter(450 ft^2), cost $1500 in mateial, and should be hurricane and snow-load proof. Of course, extras are extra, like a floor. Dick __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Free Pop-Up Blocker - Get it now http://companion.yahoo.com/ ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 23 Nov 2003 18:10:32 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Subject: Re: Domes from scratch MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Dick, Thanks for the positive feedback! I am expecting to be branded as a heretic. I didn't have the guts to cc the DomeHome group. May I suggest a squished tensegrity truss floor? See http://buckminster.info/Ideas/04-OctaRegTruss.htm Details: http://buckminster.info/Ideas/04-OctaIrregTensegTruss.htm or http://buckminster.info/Ideas/04-OctaRegTensegTruss.htm No one has used this design yet (to the best of my knowledge), except Bucky in the Yomiuri Golf Club Dome in Tokyo. Seems to me that it would make a light-weight, strong floor. Bucky even designed a machine for making the truss; I think he called it an Octa-Spinner. -------------------------------------------- Joe S Moore joe_s_moore@hotmail.com http://buckminster.info ------------------------------------------- ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dick Fischbeck" Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic To: Sent: Sunday, November 23, 2003 3:07 PM Subject: Re: Domes from scratch > --- Joe S Moore wrote: > > > My comments re personal housing structures in general: > > > > Any residential building including domes should meet the following > > performance criteria: > > > > 1. Not made of flammable materials. > > 2. Can't rot. > > 3. Can't be eaten by bugs. > > 4. Structure should be mass-produced in order to bring cost down to > > that of a luxury car. > > 5. Ideally, it should be self-contained (collects & recycles > > renewable energy) & portable. > > > > Nothing like above is presently available on this planet--yet. > > > > Bottom line: Can't honestly recommend current crop of personal domes. > > (Commercial ones are different.) Current residential domes are just > > special-case custom-built houses--slightly less expensive than > > conventional custom-built homes. Very disappointing; wait 10 years. > > Joe > > I can't wait for you to see pictures of the newest randome prototype! > It is contructed with 0.040 aluminum sheeting, s.s. fasteners and > plexiglass. It weighs in at 1400 pounds, has a 24 foot diameter(450 > ft^2), cost $1500 in mateial, and should be hurricane and snow-load > proof. > > Of course, extras are extra, like a floor. > > Dick > > __________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > Free Pop-Up Blocker - Get it now > http://companion.yahoo.com/ > ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 24 Nov 2003 05:40:00 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: bio-x Comments: To: synergeo MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Speaking of ball clusters... Bio-X is news to me, although I am aware that D'arcy Thompson was a pioneer in explorations of biomathematics. Snips from: http://daily.stanford.edu/tempo?page=content&id=12501&repository=0001_article Dick _Irony hides within the Clark Center_ By Geoff Koch Columnist Monday, November 24, 2003 The James H. Clark Center houses engineers, biologists, medical researchers and physical scientists. It houses something else, too: irony. The building and the Bio-X program inside suggest that academe is finally jazzed about generalists or at least about those interested in working across disciplines. Clark is not the first to cut across fields of specialization. A generation earlier another maverick, R. Buckminster Fuller, did the same thing. And a brief look at “Bucky” leads to the second irony, that universities have never much liked people who are really committed to crossing professional boundaries. Bucky, whose papers are housed at Stanford, is best known for inventing geodesic domes like the futuristic spheres at Epcot Center in Orlando and the Missouri Botanical Garden in St. Louis. But, like Clark, he ranged widely in his life and spent the bulk of his career outside of universities. After dropping out of Harvard University twice and running a family business into the ground, he became a freelance inventor. In the 1930s and 1940s, he invented what he hoped would be mass-produced solutions to housing and transportation problems around the world, none of which sold successfully. He wrote the book “Operating Manual for Spaceship Earth,” which helped to illustrate the importance of acting responsibly toward the planet’s finite resources and to influence the early environmental movement. He had fantastical notions, too, including an idea to rebuild the blighted city of East St. Louis. Bucky proposed no less than a mile-wide geodesic umbrella that would cover a futuristic structure that would house thousands. It promised to solve the problem of urban decay by creating a classless, energy-efficient community. Though few physical artifacts of his work remain, his influence is still felt today. In fact, Bucky even may have influenced the design of the Clark Center ever so subtly. Sir Norman Foster, the famed architect who designed the Clark Center, occasionally collaborated with Bucky. “I remember, in 1978, showing him our Sainsbury Centre for the Visual Arts and being startled when he asked: ‘How much does your building weigh?’” Foster wrote, describing one particularly telling exchange early in his relationship with Bucky. “The question was far from rhetorical. He was challenging us to discover how efficient it was; to identify how many tonnes of material enclosed what volume.” Foster remains a fan of Bucky’s, but mind-expanding questions like these did not endear Bucky to everyone. Though he collected many honorary degrees, most scholars considered Bucky to be nothing more than a polemical self-promoter and charlatan. He taught at Southern Illinois University. But even in Carbondale — far from the well-trod path of the Ivies, Stanford and the other major research universities — he eventually ran afoul of more conservative faculty and administrators. And yet Bucky’s ideas echo today in Bio-X, the premiere cross-discipline research program, and in one of the premiere universities in the world. But whether it will be the first real university home for eccentric generalists and geniuses — today’s Jim Clarks and Bucky Fullers — remains to be seen. __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Free Pop-Up Blocker - Get it now http://companion.yahoo.com/ ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 24 Nov 2003 20:01:29 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: mass produced Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed a.k.a. the Battle of los Islas Malvinas, a very shameful chapter in US history -- siding with the Imperium, and completely violating the Monroe Doctrine! thus quoth: The idea was that you could take a container ship, stack on a bunch of these "containers", add a crew, and sail off into battle. The "Atlantic Conveyor" and the "Atlantic Connection" actually saw combat in the Falklands War. The program went by the rather amusing name of "Rent-A-Navy". I actually saw (and used) one of the bathroom modules at a museum in Sydney, NSW. It's on a dock, near --Dec.2000 'WAND' Chairman Paul O'Neill, reelected to Board. Newsish? http://www.rand.org/publications/randreview/issues/rr.12.00/ http://members.tripod.com/~american_almanac _________________________________________________________________ Groove on the latest from the hot new rock groups! Get downloads, videos, and more here. http://special.msn.com/entertainment/wiredformusic.armx ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 24 Nov 2003 20:05:58 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: ils duces d'Enron Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Hubbert's peak was written up years ago in *Scientific American*, but I didn't read that cover-article because it was "just statistics." having seen, though, the 2002 book an acolyte of his at Royal Dutch Shell, I've got a better sense of it. also, the book really lays-out most of the assumptions of the industry. it's already given us the Kyoto Protocol, which is fullt active (113 over 80 countries, ratified it.) http://www.tarpley.net/bush25.htm ("Thyroid Storm" ch.) http://www.rwgrayprojects.com/synergetics/plates/plates.html http://quincy4board.homestead.com/files/curriculum/Cosmo.PCX --UN HYDROGEN (sic; Methanex (TM) reformanteurs) ECONOMIE?... La Troi Phases d'Exploitation de la Protocols des Grises de Kyoto: (FOSSILISATION [McCainanites?] (TM/sic))/ BORE/GUSH/NADIR "@" http://www.tarpley.net/aobook.htm. Http://www.tarpley.net/bushb.htm (content partiale, below): 17 -- L'ATTEMPTER de COUP D'ETAT, 3/30/81 23 -- Le FIN d'HISTOIRE 24 -- L'ORDEUR du MONDE NOUVEAU 25 -- THYROID STORK !?! _________________________________________________________________ Gift-shop online from the comfort of home at MSN Shopping! No crowds, free parking. http://shopping.msn.com ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 24 Nov 2003 18:22:58 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Subject: Re: Starnet International Corporation Comments: To: Deborah Grace MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Dear Deborah, On StarNet's old website (1999) each one of their projects had a separate webpage. According to that old webpage (which, fortunately, I printed out in b&w & have in my files), their Fantasy Dome project (#2556) was for a client named Fukuoka Daiei Real Estate, Inc, & was supposed to be built somewhere (I don't know what city) on the island of Kyosho, Japan. Maybe the project was dropped. I can mail you a copy if you want. On their new website one now has to be granted a name & password in order to view most of their projects (which I haven't bothered to do). It would seem to appear that Ms Diestro doesn't know what she is talking about. If the project wasn't built or it can't determined what happened, let me know & I can drop that dome from the top of the list & add one at the bottom. -------------------------------------------- Joe S Moore joe_s_moore@hotmail.com http://buckminster.info ------------------------------------------- ----- Original Message ----- From: "Deborah Grace" To: "Joe S Moore" Sent: Monday, November 24, 2003 4:41 PM Subject: FW: Starnet International Corporation > Hi Joe, > > Our web master was trying to get images for #1 of the 10 largest dome list > we've been working on (for a little while now...) and this is the response > she got from Starnet Corporation. > > Can you help me get clarification about this? > > Thanks so much! > > Deborah > > > From: Amy Love > > Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2003 14:17:22 -0800 (PST) > > To: lauren@bfi.org > > Subject: Starnet International Corporation (fwd) > > > > This is the response I got regarding getting a dome image for #1 of the > > ten largest. I don't know what to say, or if I should even respond. > > > > Amy Love -- Email: > > > > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > > Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2003 14:45:58 -0500 > > From: Starnet International > > To: 'Amy Love' > > Subject: Starnet International Corporation > > > > Mrs. Love, > > > > I am sorry, but i can not really send you any images of that project. > > Starnet did not do that Project. Could you tell us who told you we did that > > project? > > > > Maria Diestro > > > > Starnet International Corporation > > 200 Hope Street > > Longwood, FL 32750 > > 407-830-1199 ext 112 > >> ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 25 Nov 2003 07:18:36 -0600 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Jim Nugent Subject: Hugh Kenner Dies MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit -- >From the November 25, 2003 New York Times Obiturary Page Hugh Kenner, the critic, author and professor of literature regarded as America's foremost commentator on literary modernism, especially the work of Ezra Pound and James Joyce, died yesterday at his home in Athens, Ga. He was 80. Kenner wrote "Bucky: A Guided Tour of Buckminster Fuller" in 1973. --------------------------------------- Jim Nugent - Park Forest, Illinois --------------------------------------- "A guitar's all right John, but you'll never earn a living by it." - John Lennon's aunt Mimi ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 25 Nov 2003 08:53:43 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Subject: Re: Hugh Kenner Dies Comments: cc: "List, DomeHome" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Please see comments below: -------------------------------------------- Joe S Moore joe_s_moore@hotmail.com http://buckminster.info ------------------------------------------- ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jim Nugent" Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic To: Sent: Tuesday, November 25, 2003 6:18 AM Subject: Hugh Kenner Dies > From the November 25, 2003 New York Times Obiturary Page > > Hugh Kenner, the critic, author and professor of literature regarded as America's foremost commentator on literary modernism, especially the work of Ezra Pound and James Joyce, died yesterday at his home in Athens, Ga. He was 80. > > Kenner wrote "Bucky: A Guided Tour of Buckminster Fuller" in 1973. http://buckminster.info/Biblio/About-BkTOC-BuckyAGuidedTourOfBF.htm (pic & TOC) and _Geodesic Math & How to Use It_ http://buckminster.info/Biblio/About-BkTOC-GeodesicMathAndHowToUseIt.htm (pic & TOC) > --------------------------------------- > Jim Nugent - Park Forest, Illinois > --------------------------------------- ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 25 Nov 2003 11:46:35 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Subject: Electrification Progress Comments: To: "Meisen, Peter" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Peter, I found a paper on the World Bank's website that has a nice color chart = (on page 15) of "The Annual Average Number of People Gaining Access to = Electricity" broken down by 6 developing regions from 1970-2030; see http://www.worldbank.org/energy/pdfs/Decentralized%20Electrification%20Le= ssons%20Cabraal%2023Oct03.pdf=20 -------------------------------------------- Joe S Moore joe_s_moore@hotmail.com http://buckminster.info ------------------------------------------- ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 25 Nov 2003 23:50:53 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Subject: Dymaxion Map Stamp MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable In 1982 Korea issued a stamp with Bucky's Dymaxion Projection (VE): http://sio.midco.net/dansmapstamps/dymaxion.htm#1 -------------------------------------------- Joe S Moore joe_s_moore@hotmail.com http://buckminster.info ------------------------------------------- ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 26 Nov 2003 03:17:40 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: ron Subject: Re: Dymaxion Map Stamp In-Reply-To: Joe S Moore 's message of Tue, 25 Nov 2003 23:50:53 -0700 Content-Disposition: Inline Content-Type: Text/Plain; Charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: Quoted-Printable MIME-Version: 1.0 (WebTV) #=85top # =85synergetics/Buckminster Fuller =85synergetics/Design =85synergetics/Dymaxion Map =95Dymaxion Map - stamp http://sio.midco.net/dansmapstamps/dymaxion.htm =95THE FULLER MAP: INDEX www.nous.org.uk/BFMAPindex.html ? THE FULLER MAP: INDEX It is admitted that this is not an index in the full sense of the word, but the job of creating one would be too onerous. Many of Buckminster Fuller's books are without indexes, and part of the original motive for The Fuller Map was to cope with this lack, and to interconnect ideas and designs which were scattered throughout a series of books. So, although each entry here is linked to only one module, the texts are hyperlinked, allowing a labyrinthine journey through the complex realm of Fuller's work. This hypertext is steadily growing. 4-D HOUSE ABDUCTION ABUNDANCE, CONSTANT RELATIVE AERODYNAMICS ALLOYS ARCHITECTURE ARCHITECTURE, NAVAL ARCHITECTURE, PRE-DYMAXION BANKING BATHROOM, DYMAXION BAUHAUS BIOLOGY CAR, DYMAXION CARTOGRAPHY CHANGE CHANGE CURVES CLOUD STRUCTURES CLOUD STRUCTURES ANALYSIS COMPLEMENTARITY CONSIDERABLE SET CONTINUOUS MAN CRITICAL PATH ANALYSIS DESIGN COVARIABLES DESIGN DISCIPLINES DESIGN, INDUSTRIAL DESIGN, PRIME DESIGN SCIENCE DESIGN SCIENCE EVENT FLOW DESIGN SCIENCE REVOLUTION DESIGN STRATEGY DESIGN TORPOR DOME, EXPO' 67 DOME, EDEN PROJECT DOME, FORD ROTUNDA DOME, GEODESIC DOME, KABUL DOME, KAISER DOME, MANHATTAN DOME, MILLENNIUM DOMINANT CONCEPTS DUALISM DYMAXION DYMAXION DEPLOYMENT UNIT DYMAXION DWELLING MACHINE EARTH, SPACESHIP ECOLOGICAL CONTROLS ECOLOGICAL GEOMETRY ECOLOGY EFFICIENCY ENERGY ENERGY ACCOUNTING ENERGY OF PRODUCTION ENERGY SLAVE ENTROPY EPHEMERALIZATION FLOATING CITIES FLUID GEOGRAPHY FOG GUN FORD FORDISM FORM AND MATHEMATICS FREEDOM, DEGREES OF FREQUENCY MODULATION GEOSCOPE GEOSCOPY GRAVITY GRIFFITH CRACK LENGTH HABITUAL THINKING HEURISTICS IMPERIALISM INDUSTRIALIZATION OF THE MIND INDUSTRIALIZATION INDUSTRIALIZED HOUSING INFORMATION AND ENERGY INITIATIVE INTUITION INVENTIONS INVENTOR'S PARADOX IRON HOUSE JELLYFISH, MECHANICAL LIVINGRY MACHINES MAP, DYMAXION MAPPING MAPPING, COGNITIVE MAPPING, MATHEMATICAL MECHANICAL ADVANTAGE MECHANICAL EXTENSIONS MEGASTRUCTURES MORATORIUM NAVIGATION OBNOXICO OLD MAN RIVER ORGANS, ARTIFICIAL ORDER, UNDERLYING PATENTS PERFORMANCE PHYSICS, DIGITAL POETRY, FULLER'S POLLUTION POWERING PRECESSION PROBLEM-SOLVING PRODUCTION, INTEGRATED PSYCHOLOGY, ROBOT QUANTUM DEVICES RADIO-TRIANGULATION MAPPING REDUCTION BY BITS REDUCTION TO PRACTICE REFORM THE ENVIRONMENT REIFICATION RESOURCES RHYTHM RISK HOMEOSTASIS ROAD TRANSPORT RUTHERFORD SANITATION SCARCITY SCIENCE, BABYLONIAN SHELTER SIZE AND SHAPE SKIAMORPHS SNELSON SPHERES, CLOSEST PACKING OF SPRUCE GOOSE DOME STEEL STEEL, HIGH TENSILE STOCKADE SYSTEM STRENGTH CALCULATIONS STRENGTH OF MATERIALS SUB-OPTIMIZATION SYNERGETICS SYNERGY SYSTEM TELEOLOGY TELEWORKING, FOLLOW-THE-SUN TENSEGRITY TETRA CITY TETRAHEDRON THINKING, GEOMETRY OF THINKING, TOTAL TIME, MECHANICAL TOOLS, NON-PROSTHETIC TOWN PLANNING TRITON CITY TWONESS UNIVERSAL REQUIREMENTS OF A DWELLING ADVANTAGE UNIVERSE VECTOR EQUILIBRIUM WEALTH WEIGHT WHOLE SYSTEM, PRINCIPLE OF WIND POWER WORLD ELECTRIC POWER GRID WORLD ENERGY MAP WORLD GAME WORLD SERVICE INDUSTRIES YOMIURI TOWER ? THE FULLER MAP BOOK 1 - WORDS AND THINGS BOOK 2 - THE SCIENCE OF LIVING BOOK 3 - THE WORLD OF WORK BOOK 4 - ENERGY MAPPED BOOK 5 - THE WORLD OF FORMS BOOK 6 - THE FORMS OF THOUGHT ? =95THE FULLER MAP - BOOK 1 www.nous.org.uk/BFMAP.1.html ? BOOK 1 - WORDS AND THINGS 1.1 INVENTIONS INVENTIONS MECHANICAL JELLYFISH STOCKADE SYSTEM 4-D HOUSE DYMAXION BATHROOM DYMAXION CAR FOG GUN DYMAXION DEPLOYMENT UNIT DYMAXION DWELLING MACHINE INDUSTRIALIZED HOUSING IRON HOUSE GEODESIC DOME FORD ROTUNDA DOME KABUL DOME KAISER DOME EXPO' 67 DOME SPRUCE GOOSE DOME TENSEGRITY STRUCTURES MEGASTRUCTURES OLD MAN RIVER MANHATTAN DOME TETRA CITY TRITON CITY YOMIURI TOWER FLOATING CITIES PATENTS 1.2 BIOGRAPHY More will be collected here about Buckminster Fuller's life and career. MORATORIUM SNELSON 1.3 POETICS FULLER'S POETRY =95THE FULLER MAP - BOOK 2 www.nous.org.uk/BFMAP.2.html ? BOOK 2: THE SCIENCE OF LIVING 2.1 DESIGN SCIENCE DESIGN SCIENCE DESIGN STRATEGY INITIATIVE WEIGHT STEEL GRIFFITH CRACK LENGTH HIGH TENSILE STEEL RUTHERFORD STRENGTH CALCULATIONS STRENGTH OF MATERIALS TOTAL THINKING TOWN PLANNING REFORM THE ENVIRONMENT RISK HOMEOSTASIS UNIVERSAL REQUIREMENTS OF A DWELLING ADVANTAGE UNIVERSE DESIGN DISCIPLINES DESIGN SCIENCE EVENT FLOW REDUCTION TO PRACTICE PRE-DYMAXION ARCHITECTURE SKIAMORPHS PRIME DESIGN DESIGN SCIENCE REVOLUTION SANITATION DESIGN TORPOR INDUSTRIAL DESIGN CRITICAL PATH BABYLONIAN SCIENCE DIGITAL PHYSICS AERODYNAMICS ALLOYS 2.2 LIVINGRY LIVINGRY SHELTER BIOLOGY RHYTHM ARCHITECTURE NAVAL ARCHITECTURE BAUHAUS CLOUD STRUCTURES CLOUD STRUCTURES ANALYSIS =95THE FULLER MAP - BOOK 3 www.nous.org.uk/BFMAP.3.html ? BOOK 3: THE WORLD OF WORK 3.1 HISTORY CHANGE CHANGE CURVES IMPERIALISM 3.2 INDUSTRIALIZATION INDUSTRIALIZATION INDUSTRIALIZATION OF THE MIND ROBOT PSYCHOLOGY INTEGRATED PRODUCTION CONTINUOUS MAN FOLLOW-THE-SUN TELEWORKING FORD FORDISM ARTIFICIAL ORGANS MACHINES MECHANICAL ADVANTAGE MECHANICAL EXTENSIONS NON-PROSTHETIC TOOLS OBNOXICO MECHANICAL TIME EPHEMERALIZATION QUANTUM DEVICES 3.3 ECONOMICS ENERGY ACCOUNTING ENERGY SLAVE SPACESHIP EARTH BANKING WEALTH 3.4 POLITICS This chapter of Book 3 has yet to be written. =95THE FULLER MAP - BOOK 4 www.nous.org.uk/BFMAP.4.html ? BOOK 4: ENERGY MAPPED 4.1 ENERGY PERFORMANCE EFFICIENCY ENERGY ENERGY OF PRODUCTION ENTROPY COMPLEMENTARITY GRAVITY 4.2 CARTOGRAPHY CARTOGRAPHY NAVIGATION FLUID GEOGRAPHY DYMAXION MAP RADIO-TRIANGULATION MAPPING GEOSCOPE GEOSCOPY 4.3 ECOLOGY AND RESOURCES ECOLOGICAL CONTROLS ECOLOGICAL GEOMETRY ECOLOGY RESOURCES SCARCITY POLLUTION WIND POWER WORLD ELECTRIC POWER GRID WORLD ENERGY MAP WORLD GAME WORLD SERVICE INDUSTRIES =95THE FULLER MAP - BOOK 5 www.nous.org.uk/BFMAP.5.html ? BOOK 5: THE WORLD OF FORMS 5.1 FORM AND MATHEMATICS SIZE AND SHAPE FORM AND MATHEMATICS 5.2 SYNERGETICS SYNERGETICS SYNERGY TETRAHEDRON SYSTEM CLOSEST PACKING OF SPHERES CONSTANT RELATIVE ABUNDANCE DEGREES OF FREEDOM POWERING TWONESS UNDERLYING ORDER PRECESSION PRINCIPLE OF WHOLE SYSTEM VECTOR EQUILIBRIUM DESIGN COVARIABLES FREQUENCY MODULATION TENSEGRITY SUB-OPTIMIZATION =95THE FULLER MAP - BOOK 6 www.nous.org.uk/BFMAP.6.html ? THE FULLER MAP BOOK 6: THE FORMS OF THOUGHT 6.1 HEURISTICS PROBLEM-SOLVING REDUCTION BY BITS INTUITION INVENTOR'S PARADOX TELEOLOGY HABITUAL THINKING 6.2 ABDUCTION ABDUCTION MAPPING MATHEMATICAL MAPPING COGNITIVE MAPPING REIFICATION 6.3 GEOMETRY OF THINKING GEOMETRY OF THINKING CONSIDERABLE SET DUALISM =95MAP - intro www.nous.org.uk/ =95Introducing The MAP www.nous.org.uk/intro.html ? MAP This site is a mapping of a personal selection of ideas, findings and arguments linking the arts and sciences, especially music, psychology, poetry and design. The aim is to progressively enhance the hyperlinks as the site grows. As it is the work of a musician, not a professional academic, it also mentions musical activities. It is meant to be an incitement to read books, to listen to music, to explore the natural and built environment, and to think. ? MUSIC performances and recordings in jazz, classical, and world music music meets cultural theory science and music ? CULTURE cultural theory, history and journalism philosophy postmodernism ? SCIENCE research, controversy, history the meanings of living brains and beliefs, cognition and creativity ? DESIGN the works and ideas of Buckminster Fuller design thinking architecture ? POETRY original poetry and performance projects poetics =95MAP Bibliography www.nous.org.uk/biblio.html =95FULLER - Links www.nous.org.uk/BFlinks.html =95ARCHITECTURE - Links www.nous.org.uk/arch.html =95DESIGN - Links www.nous.org.uk/design.html ? DESIGN BOOKS Gordon - The New Science of Strong Materials - Why You Don't Fall Through the Floor. Gordon - Structures - Why Things Don't Fall Down. Levenson - Measure for Measure - A Musical History of Science. Petroski - Invention by Design - How Engineers Get from Thought to Thing. Vogel - Cats' Paws and Catapults - Mechanical Worlds of Nature and People. DESIGN LINKS Design Museum Design Studies - Goldsmiths' College, University of London Design Council Victoria and Albert Museum demi - Design for the Environment Multimedia Implementation Project Design Meeting Point ideamagazine Institution of Civil Engineers structurae - International Database and Gallery of Structures Hexagonal Engineering # #=85end ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 26 Nov 2003 22:31:49 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: Hugh Kenner Dies Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed LATimes did a bang-up obit, although _Bucky_ and _Geodesic Math_ were only listed amongst the literati. --Dec.2000 'WAND' Chairman Paul O'Neill, reelected to Board. Newsish? http://www.rand.org/publications/randreview/issues/rr.12.00/ http://members.tripod.com/~american_almanac http://www.tarpley.net/bush25.htm ("Thyroid Storm" ch.) http://www.rwgrayprojects.com/synergetics/plates/plates.html http://quincy4board.homestead.com/files/curriculum/Cosmo.PCX _________________________________________________________________ Is there a gadget-lover on your gift list? MSN Shopping has lined up some good bets! http://shopping.msn.com ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 27 Nov 2003 19:23:58 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Subject: Re: wichita house Comments: To: christoph gengnagel MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Christoph, The Dymaxion Wichita Fuller House patent was applied for (don't have the = #) on Mar 16, 1946, but was later dropped or abandoned; a patent was = never issued. See _Inventions_ pages 95-126. Here's a list of references about the house: http://buckminster.info/Index/Wh-Wilk.htm (scroll to "Wichita") and http://buckminster.info/Index/Dymax-Dz.htm (scroll to "Dymaxion/House") -------------------------------------------- Joe S Moore joe_s_moore@hotmail.com http://buckminster.info ------------------------------------------- ----- Original Message -----=20 From: christoph gengnagel=20 To: joe_s_moore@hotmail.com=20 Sent: Thursday, November 27, 2003 7:31 AM Subject: wichita house Dear Joe, i=B4m looking for the patent number of RFB famous "Wichita" House. = Could give me please a clou where i can find this ? Thank you in adavance=20 Christoph --=20 ______________________________________ Dipl. Ing. Christoph Gengnagel Wiss. Assistent Fakult=E4t f=FCr Architektur TUM Lehrstuhl f=FCr Tragwerksplanung Arcisstra=DFe 21 D-80290 M=FCnchen Telefon: 089 / 289-23157 Telefax: 089 / 289-23153 e-mail: c.gengnagel@lrz.tum.de http://www.lt.arch.tu-muenchen.de/ ______________________________________ ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 27 Nov 2003 19:57:55 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Subject: Re: Information Comments: To: SEG Comments: cc: "List, DomeHome" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hosrow, See http://buckminster.info/Index/Cheg-Cloc.htm (scroll to "Citizen") = and http://buckminster.info/Index/Domes-O.htm (scroll to "Oklahoma/Oklahoma = City") Here's 2 pictures: http://www.buckminster.info/Pics/Icos-Dome-Bank-OklahomaCity-Aerial.gif http://www.buckminster.info/Pics/Icos-Dome-BankCitizensState.jpg Here's 3 articles about efforts to save the "Gold Dome Bank": http://www.nationaltrust.org/news/docs/20020606_golddome.html http://www.nationaltrust.org/11Most/2002/golddome.html http://www.okcbusiness.com/news/news_view.asp?newsid=3D1683 -------------------------------------------- Joe S Moore joe_s_moore@hotmail.com http://buckminster.info ------------------------------------------- ----- Original Message -----=20 From: SEG=20 To: joe_s_moore@hotmail.com=20 Sent: Thursday, November 27, 2003 7:14 PM Subject: RE: Information Do you have any information as to the construction of the Citizen = State Bank In Oklahoma city, Oklahoma? Please respond. Thank you, Hosrow Aframian, PE,SE Structural Engineering Group, Inc. Phone: 405-604-6979 ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 28 Nov 2003 15:56:39 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Bob Burkhardt Subject: Zig-Zag Tensegrity Torus Datasheet MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Ref: http://www.channel1.com/users/bobwb/synergetics/photos/x3l10torus1spec.html Just in time for the holiday season! The tensegrity torus! Scroll down to the bottom for pictures. Wouldn't it make a great holiday wreath? I also designed a smaller eight-stage (24 struts) version which the clearances are kind of tighter on. This version has ten stages (30 struts). Bob ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 28 Nov 2003 17:14:31 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Subject: Re: Information Comments: To: SEG Comments: cc: "List, DomeHome" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hosrow, I believe the basis for the Kaiser Aluminum Corp geodesic domes was = Fuller's USA patent # 3,203,144 which can be viewed (both text & pics) = at the US Patent website; see http://patimg1.uspto.gov/.piw?docid=3DUS003203144&PageNum=3D1&&IDKey=3DF1= DE153D25DB&HomeUrl=3Dhttp://patft.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-Parser?Sect1=3DPT= O1%2526Sect2=3DHITOFF%2526d=3DPALL%2526p=3D1%2526u=3D/netahtml/srchnum.ht= m%2526r=3D1%2526f=3DG%2526l=3D50%2526s1=3D3,203,144.WKU.%2526OS=3DPN/3,20= 3,144%2526RS=3DPN/3,203,144 Also, if you go to the bottom of my home page & search for the word = Kaiser, you should get 42 hits, most of which have to do with the Kaiser = domes. You might want to contact Fuller's 2 architectural partners, Mr Sadao & = Mr Zung; see http://buckminster.info/Index/Sa-Scg.htm http://buckminster.info/Index/Zf-Zz.htm Hope this helps, -------------------------------------------- Joe S Moore joe_s_moore@hotmail.com http://buckminster.info ------------------------------------------- ----- Original Message -----=20 From: SEG=20 To: Joe S Moore=20 Sent: Friday, November 28, 2003 10:27 AM Subject: Re: Information ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Joe S Moore=20 To: SEG=20 Cc: List, DomeHome ; List, Geodesic=20 Sent: Thursday, November 27, 2003 8:57 PM Subject: Re: Information Hosrow, See http://buckminster.info/Index/Cheg-Cloc.htm (scroll to = "Citizen") and http://buckminster.info/Index/Domes-O.htm (scroll to = "Oklahoma/Oklahoma City") Here's 2 pictures: = http://www.buckminster.info/Pics/Icos-Dome-Bank-OklahomaCity-Aerial.gif http://www.buckminster.info/Pics/Icos-Dome-BankCitizensState.jpg Here's 3 articles about efforts to save the "Gold Dome Bank": http://www.nationaltrust.org/news/docs/20020606_golddome.html http://www.nationaltrust.org/11Most/2002/golddome.html http://www.okcbusiness.com/news/news_view.asp?newsid=3D1683 -------------------------------------------- Joe S Moore joe_s_moore@hotmail.com http://buckminster.info ------------------------------------------- ----- Original Message -----=20 From: SEG=20 To: joe_s_moore@hotmail.com=20 Sent: Thursday, November 27, 2003 7:14 PM Subject: RE: Information Do you have any information as to the construction of the Citizen = State Bank In Oklahoma city, Oklahoma? Please respond. Thank you, Hosrow Aframian, PE,SE Structural Engineering Group, Inc. Phone: 405-604-6979 Thank you, Joe I am still looking for the original construction materials and method. = I am planning to analysis this dome however I can not locate any = drawings as to the construction of the dome. Should you know of any = source, pleas respond. R=20 ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 28 Nov 2003 17:31:02 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Subject: Re: Zig-Zag Tensegrity Torus Datasheet Comments: cc: "List, DomeHome" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Bob, Have you seen these tensegrity cylinder models that (presumably) Fuller's students made years ago? "Experimental structures at North Carolina State university, 1950, l95l, 1952, 1953": http://www.bfi.org/slideshtml/imag0001a.htm http://www.bfi.org/slideshtml/imag0097.htm -------------------------------------------- Joe S Moore joe_s_moore@hotmail.com http://buckminster.info ------------------------------------------- ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bob Burkhardt" Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic To: Sent: Friday, November 28, 2003 1:56 PM Subject: Zig-Zag Tensegrity Torus Datasheet > Ref: > > http://www.channel1.com/users/bobwb/synergetics/photos/x3l10torus1spec.html > > Just in time for the holiday season! The tensegrity torus! Scroll down > to the bottom for pictures. > Wouldn't it make a great holiday wreath? I also designed a smaller > eight-stage (24 struts) > version which the clearances are kind of tighter on. This version has > ten stages (30 struts). > > Bob ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 29 Nov 2003 09:08:03 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Bob Burkhardt Subject: Re: Zig-Zag Tensegrity Torus Datasheet MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Joe, No, I hadn't seen them. Seems like they might be tensegrities, but I find it hard to tell the compression (struts) from the tension (tendons) elements. I know for some of his structures, like the deresonated tensegrity, the tensile elements don't look like one would expect, and the struts get more than just axial stresses. Thanks for pointing these out. Bob Joe S Moore wrote: >Bob, > >Have you seen these tensegrity cylinder models that (presumably) Fuller's >students made years ago? > >"Experimental structures at North Carolina State university, 1950, l95l, >1952, 1953": > >http://www.bfi.org/slideshtml/imag0001a.htm >http://www.bfi.org/slideshtml/imag0097.htm > >-------------------------------------------- >Joe S Moore >joe_s_moore@hotmail.com >http://buckminster.info >------------------------------------------- >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Bob Burkhardt" >Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic >To: >Sent: Friday, November 28, 2003 1:56 PM >Subject: Zig-Zag Tensegrity Torus Datasheet > > > > >>Ref: >> >> >> >> >http://www.channel1.com/users/bobwb/synergetics/photos/x3l10torus1spec.html > > >>Just in time for the holiday season! The tensegrity torus! Scroll down >>to the bottom for pictures. >>Wouldn't it make a great holiday wreath? I also designed a smaller >>eight-stage (24 struts) >>version which the clearances are kind of tighter on. This version has >>ten stages (30 struts). >> >>Bob >> >> > >. > > > ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 29 Nov 2003 14:23:17 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Bob Burkhardt Subject: Re: Zig-Zag Tensegrity Torus Datasheet MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit They are a bit reminiscent of Vladimir Schuchov's towers, though his were closer to geodesics than tensegrity. See http://www.architectureweek.com/2003/0820/culture_1-1.html for a picture of an example. Bob Joe S Moore wrote: >Bob, > >Have you seen these tensegrity cylinder models that (presumably) Fuller's >students made years ago? > >"Experimental structures at North Carolina State university, 1950, l95l, >1952, 1953": > >http://www.bfi.org/slideshtml/imag0001a.htm >http://www.bfi.org/slideshtml/imag0097.htm > >-------------------------------------------- >Joe S Moore >joe_s_moore@hotmail.com >http://buckminster.info >------------------------------------------- >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Bob Burkhardt" >Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic >To: >Sent: Friday, November 28, 2003 1:56 PM >Subject: Zig-Zag Tensegrity Torus Datasheet > > > > >>Ref: >> >> >> >> >http://www.channel1.com/users/bobwb/synergetics/photos/x3l10torus1spec.html > > >>Just in time for the holiday season! The tensegrity torus! Scroll down >>to the bottom for pictures. >>Wouldn't it make a great holiday wreath? I also designed a smaller >>eight-stage (24 struts) >>version which the clearances are kind of tighter on. This version has >>ten stages (30 struts). >> >>Bob >> >> > >. > > > ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 29 Nov 2003 15:42:20 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: ron Subject: Great Buildings Online Images - US Pavilion at Expo '67 Content-Disposition: Inline Content-Type: Text/Plain; Charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: Quoted-Printable MIME-Version: 1.0 (WebTV) # =85search/synergetics/domes/Architecture Design Images History 3D Models and more - Artifice Great Buildings Online =85search/synergetics/domes/Great Buildings Online Images - US Pavilion at Expo '67 =85search/synergetics/domes/Architecture Design - Great Buildings Online/search engine =95Architecture Design Images History 3D Models and more - Artifice Great Buildings Online http://www.greatbuildings.com/gbc.html =95US Pavilion at Expo '67 - Photo, overview of dome in landscape context http://www.greatbuildings.com/cgi-bin/gbi.cgi/US_Pavilion_at_Expo_67.html/= cid_2892999.gbi =95US Pavilion at Expo '67 - Photo, close view looking up through geodesic filigree http://www.greatbuildings.com/cgi-bin/gbi.cgi/US_Pavilion_at_Expo_67.html/= cid_2892270.gbi =95US Pavilion at Expo '67 - Buckminster Fuller and Shoji Sadao - Great Buildings Online http://www.greatbuildings.com/buildings/US_Pavilion_at_Expo_67.html Great=A0Buildings=A0Online =A0Search - Advanced Search - Buildings - Architects - Types - Places - 3D Models - Pix - Architecture Week=A0=A0 Architect: Buckminster Fuller and Shoji Sadao Location: Montreal, Canada Date:1967 Building Type: exhibition hall=A0 Construction=A0System:geodesic dome Climate: temperate Context: exposition site Style: Modern Notes: Lightweight geodesic dome envelope enclosing more conventional interior construction. "A giant dome, roughly three-quarters of a sphere, designed to look like a lacy filigree weightless against the sky. Height: 200 feet: spherical diameter; 250 feet. Construction: a space frame of steel pipes enclosing 1,900 molded acrylic panels." =97 from Sylvia Hart Wright. Sourcebook of Contemporary North American Architecture: From Postwar to Postmodern. p33. =95Google Search: US Pavilion at Expo '67 http://www.google.com/custom?q=3DUS+Pavilion+at+Expo+'67&cof=3DLW%3A647%3B= L%3Ahttp%3A%2F%2Fwww.ArchitectureWeek.com%2Fimages%2FAWHeader.gif%3BLH%3A8= 2%3BBGC%3Awhite%3BAH%3Aleft%3BAWFID%3A9b03822cbb67c0ab%3B # ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 29 Nov 2003 14:03:18 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: boathouse Comments: To: organic_architecture@yahoogroups.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii What is a house but an airship anchored! http://hem.fyristorg.com/arcticwar/bilder/pages/boathouse_jpg.htm Dick __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Free Pop-Up Blocker - Get it now http://companion.yahoo.com/ ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 29 Nov 2003 14:25:55 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Stockade revisited MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii http://www.australiatrade.com.au/Housing/LowCost/index.htm http://www.solutioneers.net/solutioneering/bucky4kids.html Dick __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Free Pop-Up Blocker - Get it now http://companion.yahoo.com/ ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 29 Nov 2003 21:13:10 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Bob Burkhardt Subject: Eight-Stage Tensegrity Torus MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit A datasheet for the eight-stage version of the tensegrity torus is available at: http://www.channel1.com/users/bobwb/synergetics/photos/x3l08torus1spec.html. Scroll to the bottom for graphics. Bob ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 29 Nov 2003 21:53:40 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Subject: Kaiser Aluminum Corp Domes Comments: To: seg@coxinet.net Comments: cc: "List, DomeHome" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hosrow Aframian, PE,SE Structural Engineering Group, Inc. Hosrow, I found the patent for the Kaiser Domes. US3,194,360 was issued July = 13, 1965, to Donald L Richter, who worked for Kaiser. When Kaiser = decided to get out of the dome business, Mr Richter started Temcor = (http://www.temcor.com/). There's a lot of technical details on their = website. Here's the patent at espacenet: http://v3.espacenet.com/origdoc?sf=3Dn&FIRST=3D1&F=3D0&CY=3Dep&LG=3Den&DB= =3DEPODOC&PN=3Dus3194360&Submit=3DSEARCH&IDX=3DUS3194360&QPN=3DUS3194360 -------------------------------------------- Joe S Moore joe_s_moore@hotmail.com http://buckminster.info ------------------------------------------- ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 30 Nov 2003 18:59:19 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Subject: Re: Zig-Zag Tensegrity Torus Datasheet Comments: To: DomeHome-H@h19.hoflin.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Don't know--these are pics on BFI's website with little explanation. Can't think of (at the moment) any documentation of the experimental structures done by RBF at N Carolina State U in the early 50s. -------------------------------------------- Joe S Moore joe_s_moore@hotmail.com http://buckminster.info ------------------------------------------- ----- Original Message ----- From: "The DomeHome List" To: Sent: Sunday, November 30, 2003 9:58 AM Subject: re: Zig-Zag Tensegrity Torus Datasheet > From: "RAS" > Organization: Advanced Geodesic Domes > Date: Sat, 29 Nov 2003 22:16:57 -0700 > > No ......are they the same thing that can be done with > soda straws rubber bands and paper clips? They look nice. > Bob > http://www.advanced-geodesic-domes.com/ > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "Joe S Moore" > > Date: Fri, 28 Nov 2003 17:31:02 -0700 > > > > Bob, > > > > Have you seen these tensegrity cylinder models that > > (presumably) Fuller's students made years ago? > > > > "Experimental structures at North Carolina State > > university, 1950, l95l, 1952, 1953": > > > > http://www.bfi.org/slideshtml/imag0001a.htm > > http://www.bfi.org/slideshtml/imag0097.htm