From MAILER-DAEMON@netaxs.com Sat Apr 26 23:50:21 1997 Return-Path: <> Received: from deliverance.acsu.buffalo.edu (deliverance.acsu.buffalo.edu [128.205.7.57]) by access.netaxs.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id XAA21458 for ; Sat, 26 Apr 1997 23:50:08 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199704270350.XAA21458@access.netaxs.com> Received: (qmail 1848 invoked from network); 27 Apr 1997 03:50:07 -0000 Received: from listserv.acsu.buffalo.edu (128.205.7.35) by deliverance.acsu.buffalo.edu with SMTP; 27 Apr 1997 03:50:07 -0000 Date: Sat, 26 Apr 1997 23:50:07 -0400 From: "L-Soft list server at University at Buffalo (1.8c)" Subject: File: "GEODESIC LOG9602" To: cjf@NETAXS.COM Status: RO ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 31 Jan 1996 22:00:40 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: Re: Habitat Dome Comments: To: Merc Martinelli In-Reply-To: ; from "Merc Martinelli" at Jan 31, 96 3:34 pm Geodesic is a LIST, not a NEWSGROUP. You need to subscribe to it like a newsletter. In the "To" line put listserv@ubvm.bitnet (listserv is the name of the list server computer at Univ Buffalo, NY) Leave the "Subject" line blank. At the left margin of your post put the command subscribe geodesic yourfirstname yourlastname In a few minutes you will receive an email asking for confirmation; reply following the instructions carefully. Let me know if you have any problems. -- JOE S MOORE joemoore@cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 31 Jan 1996 22:14:56 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: FERROCEMENT DOMES Comments: To: Vince Fontana In-Reply-To: <199601312232.RAA05203@gramercy.ios.com>; from "Vince Fontana" at Jan 31, 96 5:32 pm Vince Fontana writes: > > To: joemoore@CRUZIO.COM (Joe Moore) > Subject: Re: FERROCEMENT DOMES > Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic > Organization: Internet Online Services > X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2] > > : There's a great article in the campus newspaper of the State Univ of New York > : at Buffalo about Habitat for Humanity building ferrocement domes in India. > > I am interested in Concrete domes. Wondering how the ones in India are made > the ones i have seen go up very easily by spraying foam inside an inflated > dome bag so to speak, attaching rebar and spraying cement on it all done > from the inside. \/. > All I know is what I read in the article. There are probably several people in the Geodesic group that know a lot about ferrocement and possibly Habitat's project in India. I'm forwarding a copy of this reply to the Geodesic group. You should subscribe. -- JOE S MOORE joemoore@cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 1 Feb 1996 11:25:04 GMT Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Chris Fearnley Organization: Philadelphia's Complete Internet Provider Subject: Re: Habitat Dome Joe Moore (joemoore@BBS.CRUZIO.COM) wrote: : Geodesic is a LIST, not a NEWSGROUP. You need to subscribe to it like a : newsletter. In the "To" line put I read Geodesic as the newsgroup bit.listserv.geodesic. But it's through a mail to news gateway. So everyone who thought I unsubscribed :) Simply wasn't able to see my newsgroup subscription. -- Christopher J. Fearnley | UNIX SIG Leader at PACS cjf@netaxs.com | (Philadelphia Area Computer Society) http://www.netaxs.com/~cjf | Design Science Revolutionary ftp://ftp.netaxs.com/people/cjf | Explorer in Universe "Dare to be Naive" -- Bucky Fuller | Linux Advocate ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 1 Feb 1996 07:59:33 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: syn-l: DOME version 4.2 Now Available (fwd) Rick Bono writes: > From desiree.teleport.com!teleport.com!owner-synergetics-l Thu Feb 1 05:57:50 1996 > Date: Thu, 1 Feb 1996 09:00:26 -0500 (EST) > Message-Id: <199602011400.JAA29836@franklin-fddi.cris.com> > X-Sender: rjbono@pop3.cris.com > X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 > Mime-Version: 1.0 > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > To: synergetics-l@teleport.com > From: Rick Bono > Subject: syn-l: DOME version 4.2 Now Available > Sender: owner-synergetics-l@teleport.com > Reply-To: synergetics-l@teleport.com > Precedence: bulk > > > I am pleased to announce that version 4.2 of DOME is now available. It has been > a long time between releases and I hope that it was worth the wait. DOME 4.2 > now adds the following features: > > -VRML output files > -Elliptical geodesics > -Buckyball Constructs > -Improved data structures for more complex designs > -Unix/Linux make files (thanks to Chris Fearnley) > > DOME is avilable through the applied Synergetics Web site at: > http://www.cris.com/~rjbono/html/domes.html > > It is availabe through Kirby Urner's web site as well. Those preferring FTP > transfers can find it at ftp.teleport.com/pub/users/pdx4d/bin/dome42.zip > > Rick > > .- > -- JOE S MOORE joemoore@cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 1 Feb 1996 11:18:03 -0500 Reply-To: ap017@detroit.freenet.org Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Anthony Ander Subject: Re: Geodesic Math and How to Use It May want to try: John KING book store (Detroit, MI) University Microfilm (Ann Arbor MI) 800-521-0600 Princeton Antique 609-344-1943 or the NY Times Sunday, Book review section (the section is also sold separately in better bookstores) Good luck. Tony Ander. -- ## ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 1 Feb 1996 08:18:57 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: SIGNOFF In order to get off the Geodesic list, the command SIGNOFF GEODESIC must be sent to the list server computer at LISTSERV@UBVM.BITNET by the subscriber. Only the subscriber can do this, so save the instructions the computer sent you when you first subscribed and please read them! A list of commands that the computer recognizes can be obtained by sending the command HELP to the list server computer. -- JOE S MOORE joemoore@cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 1 Feb 1996 14:02:51 GMT Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Rick Bono Subject: Dome 4.2 Now Available I am pleased to announce that version 4.2 of DOME is now available. It has been a long time between releases and I hope that it was worth the wait. DOME 4.2 now adds the following features: -VRML output files -Elliptical geodesics -Buckyball Constructs -Improved data structures for more complex designs -Unix/Linux make files (thanks to Chris Fearnley) DOME is avilable through the applied Synergetics Web site at: http://www.cris.com/~rjbono/html/domes.html It is availabe through Kirby Urner's web site as well. Those preferring FTP transfers can find it at ftp.teleport.com/pub/users/pdx4d/bin/dome42.zip Rick ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 1 Feb 1996 15:21:30 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: Re: Dymaxion Map Comments: To: curtis palmer In-Reply-To: ; from "curtis palmer" at Jan 31, 96 1:20 pm curtis palmer writes: > > Do you have an address (Email or otherwise) of Jim Knighton? > > Thanks > Curtis Palmer M.Des email: > curtis_palmer@mindlink.bc.ca > Synergetic Design Phone: 604/228-8533 > 3726 West 28 Ave. > Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada V6S 1S6 No, but try the 411 internet whitepages at http://www.Four11.com I'm forwarding your inquiry to the Geodesic group in the hope that someone out there in Buckyland may be able to help you. -- JOE S MOORE joemoore@cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 2 Feb 1996 10:02:26 CST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: tagdi@RUULCH.LET.RUU.NL Subject: page 6 Zoology general features a fundemantal charcteristic of living organisms is their ability to take in material quite unlike themselves and to synthesize their own unique protoplasm from them. the vertebrate digestive tract is a tube passing through the body with opening at either end. and the process of elimination known as defication should not be confused with excretion which is the discharge of the by-product of metabolism.excretion primarly functions through excretory and respiratory system and the skin- most of the material in the feces does not enter the tissues and does not take part in metabolism. mouth the basic pattern of the vertebrate digestive system is similar to that of the frog. in very primitive vertebrate the mouth is unsupported by jaws, but most v have jaws and a good complement teeth that aids in food getting. representive mammals tooth conist of a crown covered by enamel, hardest substance in the body made of crystels of dentin, a substance very similiar to bone. in addition to a liberal sprinkling of simple glands in the lining of the mouth cavity, mam has evolved several pairs of conspicous salivary glands that are connected to the mouth ducts. the salvia of most mammals and a few other tetrapods contain ptyalin a carbohydrate splitting enzyme and the chemical breakdown of food begins in the mouth. the poison gllands of reptiles and the glands of vampire bats that secret an anticogulants are other specialized oral glands. the pharynx of tetrapods is rather short region in which the food and air passages cros, but in fishes is more extensive area associated with the gill slits. the esophagus is generally a simple conducting tube, but in some animals its structure has been modified for storage. the stomach is usually a j shaped pouch whos chief function is the storage and mechanical churning of food and the initiation of chemical breakdown of protein. absent in primative fishes, perhaps due to feeding less fequently muscular contraction of the stomach churn the food mixing with gastric juice, hydrocloric acid and pepsine enzyme.( synergetic actions, to primary catagories of acides and alkalines make a major theme in chemistry) the amount of pepsine and acid is very small. when the food has been reduced to creamy material and organism been killed by gastric jucises it pases to the intestine- where brought to neutrality by alkaline secretions from liver and pancreas. cow stomach consists of 4 chambers-the rumen one of the chambers can contain 50 gallons, where food temporory stored. contain a large colony of bacteric ehich produce enzyme cellolase which acts on cellulose as the micro-organisms multiply, they senthesize amino acids and protein from simple inexpensive materials. tagdi ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 2 Feb 1996 10:12:10 GMT Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Roger Rabbit Organization: Shut Up Blair Subject: How to get The MORTIMER Story This posting was made automatically by machine. It will appear once every minute or so. Direct any questions to rabbit@Buster.Michigan.COM ------- The MORTIMER story can be retreived from a special archive server (the Mort-Server) To request a part of the MORTIMER story, send mail to one of the addresses below. Put your request on the Subject: line of your message. Requests are can be the in the following form: ALL - (in upper case) will cause the entire story to be sent to you. n - (where n is an integer) will cause part one to be sent n,m... - (where n and m, etc are integers) will cause parts n, m and so forth, to be sent. You may send your request to any of the following addresses: MORTIMER@Buster.Michigan.COM MORTIMER@Babs.Michigan.COM MORTIMER@Plucky.Michigan.COM MORTIMER@Hamton.Michigan.COM MORTIMER@McLoon.Michigan.COM MORTIMER@Elmyra.Michigan.COM If you send off a request and don't get a response within 5 days, send e-mail to the sysop here (NOT ME!!). His address is: ARCHIVER@Michigan.COM -- >>> BAN: Nuclear Power, US Intervention in The Gulf, Toxic Waste, >>> rdc, carasso, Trash Incinerators, Nuclear Weapons, Poverty, KiBoIsM >>> Racism, Kent Paul Dolan, Specieism, etc... Write: Rabbits for a Better >>> Hutch, Roscommon, MI 48653 E-MAIL: rabbit@Buster.Michigan.COM ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 3 Feb 1996 12:41:23 CET Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: tagdi@RUULCH.LET.RUU.NL Subject: Re: How to get The MORTIMER Story In Message Fri, 02 Feb 1996 10:12:10 +0000 (GMT), Roger Rabbit writes: >This posting was made automatically by machine. It will appear once >every minute or so. Direct any questions to rabbit@Buster.Michigan.COM > >------- > >The MORTIMER story can be retreived from a special archive server >(the Mort-Server) To request a part of the MORTIMER story, send >mail to one of the addresses below. Put your request on >the Subject: line of your message. Requests are can be the in the >following form: > >-- >>>> BAN: Nuclear Power, US Intervention in The Gulf, Toxic Waste, >>>> rdc, carasso, Trash Incinerators, Nuclear Weapons, Poverty, KiBoIsM >>>> Racism, Kent Paul Dolan, Specieism, etc... Write: Rabbits for a Better >>>> Hutch, Roscommon, MI 48653 E-MAIL: rabbit@Buster.Michigan.COM anyone get this, is it good material. p.s is there anyone who is in love with the english language, i would like to send them words new to me to expaline,from time to time. you cant realy get the jest of the language from the dictionary only. Tagdi. ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 3 Feb 1996 10:04:18 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Gil Friend Subject: Re: How to get The MORTIMER Story > anyone get this, is it good material. But what _is_ it? > you cant realy get the jest of the language from the dictionary only. How true how true :-) ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 3 Feb 1996 15:11:59 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: FREE PD BUCKY PICS FREE PD BUCKY PICS I would just like to remind everyone that there are a whole bunch (several hundred--I forget) of free, public domain pictures (color and B&W) related to the work of R. Buckminster Fuller at the New Civilization Network File Transfer Protocol (FTP) site: ftp.newciv.org/pub/Bucky However, I believe they are in compressed Amiga format and will have to be uncompressed and converted to whatever alternate format (GIF, JPEG, etc) you may prefer. Also, please note that there are 3 files of about 1 meg each. They uncompresses to a total of about 5 megs if I remember right. Everyone is free to use them in any way they wish--for web pages, reports, multimedia projects, etc. All I ask is that you indicate in some way that I created them, and that you got them from the New Civilization Network site. Thanks. Have fun! Joe. -- JOE S MOORE joemoore@cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 4 Feb 1996 17:01:16 CET Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: tagdi@RUULCH.LET.RUU.NL Subject: Re: How to get The MORTIMER Story In Message Sat, 03 Feb 1996 10:04:18 -0800, Gil Friend writes: >> anyone get this, is it good material. forget it, it was about some articles you can get. someone have send to geodesic, but you have to send a command; it was few days ago. >But what _is_ it? > >> you cant realy get the jest of the language from the dictionary only. > >How true how true :-) then can you translate this words sinus ventricle spindle turgidity harangus nefarious hold doleful haggard sprees,binges debuchaery ouphemistic convivality hawsers incucment shellbacks doping M.Tagdi ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 4 Feb 1996 10:08:41 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brandtenc@AOL.COM Subject: Your list Again - people. PLease remove my address from any list you have. I DO NOT WISH TO RECEIVE YOUR MAIL! Thank you ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 4 Feb 1996 17:42:01 CET Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: tagdi@RUULCH.LET.RUU.NL Subject: zoology page 6 respiration system of terestrial vertebrates the somwhat awkward mouth pump moving air in and out of the lungs, and the need for auxiliary respiratory membranes are among the factors that prevent amphibians from fully exploiting the terrestrial enviroment. the internal surface of the lungs of heigher tetrapods have become greatly subdivided and have increased in area enough to dispense with respiration in the skin. these organism have also developed more efficient means of ventilating the lungs. in mammals, air is drawn into the paired nasal cavities through the external nares. in nasil cavities the air is warmed, particles entraped. cold blooded tetrapods in general do not need so much conditioning of the air as birds and mammals. the larynx is composed of cartilages derived from certain of the viceral arches and serves both to guard the entrance to the windpipe, and to house the vocal cords. the vocal cords are a pair of folds in the lateral walls of the larynx. they can be brought together, or moved apart by the piviting of laryngeal cartiges connected to their dorsal ends. when we speak they are moved toward each other and the current of air expelled from the lungs sets them vibrating. they in turn vibrate the column of air in the larnyx, pharynx and the mouth, just as the reed in an orgon pipe vibrates the column of air in the pipe. muscle fibers extending between the various cartilages of the larynx contol the tension of the cords and the pitch of the sound. the shape of the phyrnx, mouth, tongue, and lips effects the final quality of the sound. trachea extends and divid into the lungs is held open by c shaped cartilagionous rings. the lung of an adult man can hold about 6 liters of air but in quite breading can hold about 1/2 that amount. .5 liter is exhanged in any one cycle of inspiration and experation . this can mix with 2.5 liter of air already in the lungs. respiratiory movement are cyclic- controled by inspiratory and expiratory centers. one more page and it is finished. i think zoology is very fascinating, and one should go back to it from time to time. one need the picture of the whole to go to the branches which is not doen in normal courses. i think i have brought, though in fragments some general pictures which needs adding to them in particular. one of Fuller questions, out of his famous 20 quesions, which he said that if he had not answered he would not had had been able to talk to everyone about the general trends that are engulfing humans who like the wasp bewildred by what they do not see, is what is metabolism. Tagdi ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 4 Feb 1996 09:40:25 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Gil Friend Subject: Re: How to get The MORTIMER Story At 9:01 AM 2/4/96, tagdi@RUULCH.LET.RUU.NL wrote: >In Message Sat, 03 Feb 1996 10:04:18 -0800, > Gil Friend writes: >>> anyone get this, is it good material. > > forget it, it was about some articles you can get. someone have send > to geodesic, but you have to send a command; it was few days ago. > >>But what _is_ it? >> >>> you cant realy get the jest of the language from the dictionary only. >> >>How true how true :-) > > then can you translate this words >sinus >ventricle >spindle >turgidity >harangus >nefarious >hold >doleful >haggard >sprees,binges >debuchaery >ouphemistic >convivality >hawsers >incucment >shellbacks >doping > >M.Tagdi M. Tagdi, I don't fathom you, I have to confess. (Tho that's a list of great _sounding_ words...) But no matter. I'm headed off the list for the next month. Training intensive, minimal email contact. Catch you all later! Best, Gil ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 4 Feb 1996 09:32:44 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Re: FREE PD BUCKY PICS you uh created them?... did you launch the initial photons, or What ?!? ----- "Time is the only dimension." -RBFuller Congecture on "FG#s": Non Compos Mentis!... We return thee to thou couches, Potatoes. ----- On Palmtree BBS: brihut@pro-palmtree.cts.com ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 11:53:33 CET Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: tagdi@RUULCH.LET.RUU.NL Subject: Fragments on the sea one million men left holland for the east indies between 1602 and 1795 only 340000 returned. some portion of them survived for years in the east in local factories and in so called country trade. the portugese record was much the same 2400 vigouse young men left annually for Goa. about half of sailers died, during 17,18.19 century. Brandel's mediteranean map has a 1000 ship wrck going from venice between 1592-1669. there were 1000-2000 ship reck of british vessels a year in the 19 c any one in 12 involved loss of life. loss of life was greate on the west because of the prevalence of on shore galles. hernia from heavy hauling of water caskes , raising sail, and perhaps moving cannon has been one of many physical disorders that plagued men in the sea. other candidats for ocupational disability condition are gastric disorders, noted on coast schooners becuse of irregular meals eaten hurriedly, with a surfeit of fried foods, and the unceasing motion of the vessel. 100 sterling a year was the officer payment on British war ships. 5 or 6 dozzen lashes given for spitting on the deck. 100 strokes was common some sailers died from floging. flogging is prohipited 1830 or so in the U.S. Melvile 1849: 3/4 of the seamen in our american merchant vessels are foreigners.... from all parts of the world. including( worst of all)British men of war, and otheres who were not permited to live on the land. some suggest that sailers come from female dominated families, or from single parent. by 1792 the size of merchant and slave ships reached 340 tons in bordeaux, 374 in Nantes. sailing on merchant earned 12 guilders a month for east india trade, advance of 150 for 15 months as alurment to go to sea.( 12 about 6dollars) number of sailers in duch east india co. 10,000 in 1630 40,000 in 1770 this number not sure since they say that is raised, i do not know if that means only for one year. but still that was not very long time of establishing the company. around the time Francis Bacon wrote his new theory of linking the application of science to betterment of human conditions. don't ask me why i send this, if you think it is worthless don't read it. Bertrand Russle "isn't nice to know things". Tagdi ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 5 Feb 1996 18:11:46 GMT Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Kirby Urner Organization: 4D Solutions Subject: Re: The Shape of the Universe hopclover@aol.com (HopClover) wrote: > > He never says the universe is spherical. He is talking about >2-dimensional flatlanders. That is the >analogy< he is making. > Now you may be saying to yourself that the 2-dimensional >flatlander-mathmetician could on paper add a third dimension and find a >shape to his "spherical" universe. This is true, but this "shape" could >not be a shape in the universe he knows anymore than the 10-dimensional >"shapes" (that the mathmeticians in this year's January Scientific >American are finding to represent our universe) could exist in ours. > >-Mike I have trouble with the 'flatlander' analogy. Because we pretend we can imagine what it'd be like to be in only two dimensions. But how? If you visualize a planar surface, you've placed a point of view outside of it: you've got space. If you visualize a line, again, you're some distance from it, and see 'above' and 'below' it -- same perceptual space you're in right now. If you talk about being an ant going around on a sphere, you're clearly talking the same number of dimensions as we live in normally. The flatland analogy is supposed to show us how shapes we cannot see could be embedded in a space of higher dimension. But I don't think we can imagine a space of lower dimension either, from which place our normal shapes would be non-tunable. Kirby -------------------------------------------------------- Kirby Urner "All realities are virtual" -- KU Email: pdx4d@teleport.com Web: http://www.teleport.com/~pdx4d/ ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 08:42:25 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: BUCKY LURKERS To all Bucky Lurkers: Please don't be shy about posting. It can be anything related to RBF's work-- a book, an article, an example of doing more with less, your hopes & dreams, etc. This is YOUR discussion group. PS: We know you're out there. Send the command REVIEW GEODESIC NAME to the computer at LISTSERV@UBVM.CC.BUFFALO.EDU to get a list of the current subscribers to the GEODESIC list. -- JOE S MOORE joemoore@cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 14:58:19 GMT Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: bill paton Organization: bp ent. Subject: Invention Confidentiality Agreement This is a Confidentiality Agreement you may want to use if you have an invention idea and you want an expert in that field to explore it. Bill Confidentiality Agreement THIS AGREEMENT made as of the _____ day of __________ , 19 __ . BETWEEN: _________________________________ _________________________________ _________________________________ _________________________________ _________________________________ OF THE FIRST PART (hereinafter called the "Discloser") AND: _________________________________ , of _________________________________ _________________________________ _________________________________ _________________________________ OF THE SECOND PART (hereinafter called the "Disclosee") WHEREAS: A. _____ has all right, title and interest to certain Confidential Information (as hereinafter defined); B. _____ has requested that the Disclosee do certain work for _____ concerning the Confidential Information (as hereinafter defined) on the basis that the Disclosee be subject to non-disclosure restrictions on the terms and conditions as hereinafter set forth. NOW THEREFORE THIS AGREEMENT WITNESSETH that in consideration of the sum of ONE ($1.00) DOLLAR and other good and valuable consideration now paid to the Disclosee by _____ (the receipt and sufficiency of which is hereby acknowledged) and of the mutual covenants and agreements herein contained, the parties do hereto covenant and agree as follows: 1. In this Agreement, "Confidential Information" means all information provided by _____ or anyone else on behalf of _____ to the Disclosee with respect to the ideas and inventions of _____ described in Schedule "A" hereto. 2. The Disclosee agrees to receive the Confidential Information on the following terms and conditions and agrees: (a) that the Disclosee will receive and maintain the Confidential information in confidence; (b) that the Disclosee will examine the Confidential Information at the expense of the Disclosee; (c) that the Disclosee will not reproduce the Confidential Information or any part thereof without the express written consent of _____; (d) that the Disclosee will not in ay manner, directly or indirectly, make known, divulge, publish or communicate the Confidential Information or any part thereof to any person, firm or corporation without the express written consent of _____ nor will the Disclosee allow or permit any person or persons to have access to or to inspect the Confidential Information; (e) that the Disclosee will not use or utilize the Confidential Information without the express written consent of _____ and only for those purposes authorized in writing by _____; (f) that the Disclosee will not use the Confidential Information or any part thereof as a basis for the design or creation of any method, system, apparatus or device similar to any method, system, apparatus or device embodied in the Confidential Information except as authorized in writing by _____; (g) that the Disclosee will not, nor will the Disclosee allow any third party, nor will the Disclosee enter into any agreement with any third party, to use, utilize, sell or trade the Confidential Information, or any part thereof or any similar Confidential Information; (h) that the Disclosee will use the best efforts of the Disclosee to protect and safeguard the Confidential Information from loss, theft, destruction or the like and assure that any persons authorized in writing by _____ to receive the Confidential Information from the Disclosee will be bound, in writing, by the stipulations herein. 3. Paragraph 2 will not apply to the following Confidential Information: (a) technical information which at the time of disclosure is in the public domain; (b) technical information which, after disclosure, is published or otherwise becomes part of the public domain through no fault of the Disclosee (but only after, and only to the extent that, it is published or otherwise becomes part of the public domain); (c) technical information which was in the possession of the Disclosee at the time of disclosure and was not acquired, directly or indirectly, from _____ or any one on behalf of _____ and (d) technical information which the Disclosee received after the time of disclosure from a third party who did not require the Disclosee to hold the same in confidence and who did not acquire such technical information, directly or indirectly, from _____ or any one on behalf of _____. 4. The Disclosee agrees, forthwith upon oral or written demand by _____ to return to _____ any Confidential Information in the possession of the Disclosee. 5. The Disclosee acknowledges and agrees that the Confidential Information constitutes a valuable proprietary property of _____ and that _____ will suffer irreparable harm if unauthorized parties gain access to the Confidential Information. The Disclosee agrees that if any Confidential Information is disclosed or used in violation of this Agreement, then _____ will have, in addition to any other remedies available to _____ the right to injunctive relief (including interlocutory injunctive relief) enjoining such action and the Disclosee agrees that other remedies are inadequate to fully protect _____ rights. 6. No failure or delay on the part of _____ in exercising any right, power or remedy hereunder will operate as a waiver thereof, nor will any single or partial exercise of any such right, power or remedy include any other further exercise thereof or the exercise of any other right, power or remedy. 7. This Agreement and the application or interpretation hereof will be governed exclusively by its terms and by the laws of the Province of Ontario and the Disclosee irrevocably attorns to the jurisdiction of the Courts of the Province of Ontario 8. _____ will be at liberty to make known, divulge or communicate or sell the Confidential Information to any other person, firm or corporation. 9. This Agreement is not assignable by the Disclosee. 10. This Agreement expires in 5 years from the date of signature. IN WITNESS WHEREOF the parties hereto have executed this Agreement as of the day and year first above written. SIGNED, SEALED AND DELIVERED BY ) ) _______________________________ ) in the presence of: ) ) _______________________________ ) ______________________________ Name ) ) _______________________________ ) Address ) ) _______________________________ ) Occupation ) ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 15:00:08 GMT Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: bill paton Organization: bp ent. Subject: US Invention Disclosure Registration Program Info about the first step you may want to take before the expenses of patenting. Bill U.S. Department of Commerce Patent and Trademark Office Washington, D.C. 20231 A service for inventors, the U.S. Patent and Trademark Office's "DISCLOSURE DOCUMENT PROGRAM" What It Is & How To Use It One of the services provided for inventors by the U.S. Patent and Trademark Office is the acceptance and preservation for a limited time of "Disclosure Documents" as evidence of the dates of conception of inventions. WHAT THE PROGRAM IS A paper disclosing an invention and signed by the inventor or inventors may be forwarded to the Patent and Trademark Office by the inventor (or by any one of the inventors when there are joint inventors), by the owner of the invention, or by the attorney or agent of the inventor(s) or owner. It will be retained for two years, and then be destroyed unless it is referred to in a separate letter in a related patent application filed within two years. The Disclosure Document is not a patent application, and the date of this receipt in the Patent and Trademark Office will not become the effective filing date of any patent application subsequently filed. However, like patent applications, these documents will be kept in confidence by the Patent and Trademark Office. This program does not diminish the value of the conventional witnessed and notarized records as evidence of conception of an invention, but it should provide a more credible form of evidence than that provided by the popular practice of mailing a disclosure to oneself or another person by registered mail. CONTENT OF DISCLOSURE DOCUMENT Although there are no restrictions as to content and claims are not necessary, the benefits afforded by the Disclosure Document will depend directly upon the adequacy of the disclosure. Therefore, it is strongly urged that the document contain a clear and complete explanation of the manner and process of making and using the invention in sufficient detail to enable a person having ordinary knowledge in the field of the invention to make and use the invention. When the nature of the invention permits, a drawing or sketch should be included. The use or utility of the invention should be described, especially in chemical inventions. PREPARATION OF THE DOCUMENT The Disclosure Document must be limited to written matter or drawings on paper or other thin, flexible material, such as linen or plastic drafting material, having dimensions or being folded to dimensions not to exceed 8 1/2 by 13 inches (21.6 by 33.0 cm). Photographs also are acceptable. Each page should be numbered. Text and drawings should be sufficiently dark to permit reproduction with commonly used office copying machines. OTHER ENCLOSURES In addition to the fee described below, the Disclosure Document must be accompanied by a stamped, self-addressed envelope and a separate paper in duplicate, signed by the inventor, stating that he is the inventor and requesting that the material be received for processing under the Disclosure Document Program. The papers will be stamped by the Patent and Trademark Office with an identifying number and date of receipt, and the duplicate request will be returned in the self-addressed envelope together with a warning notice indicating that the Disclosure Document may be relied upon only as evidence and that a patent application should be diligently filed if patent protection is desired. The inventor's request may take the following form: "The undersigned, being the inventor of the disclosed invention, requests that the enclosed papers be accepted under the Disclosure Document program, and that they be preserved for a period of two years." DISPOSITION The Disclosure Document will be preserved in the Patent and Trademark Office for two years after its receipt and then will be destroyed unless it is referred to in a separate letter in a related patent application filed within the two year period. The letter filed in the related patent application must identify not only the patent application, but also the Disclosure Document by its title, number and date of receipt. Acknowledgment of receipt of such letters will be made in the next official communication or in a separate letter from the Patent and Trademark Office. FEE A fee of $10 is charged for this service. Payment must accompany the Disclosure Document when it is submitted to the Patent and Trademark Office. A check or money order must be made payable to "Commissioner of Patent and Trademarks." Mail with the Disclosure Document to: "Commissioner of Patent and Trademarks, Box D.C. Washington, D.C. 20231." Fees are subject to change annually. Fees may be confirmed by calling the Public Service Branch at (703) 308-4357. WARNING TO INVENTORS The two-year retention period should not be consid- ered a "grace period" during which the inventor can wait to file a patent application without possible loss of benefits. It must be recognized that in establishing priority of invention an affidavit or testimony referring to a Disclosure Document must usually also establish diligence in completing the invention or in filing the patent application after the filing of the Disclosure Documents. Inventors are also reminded that any public use or sale in the United States or publication of the invention anywhere in the world more than one year prior to the filing of a patent application on that invention will prohibit the granting of a patent on it. If the inventors are not familiar with what is considered to be "diligence in completing the invention" or "reduction of practice" under the patent law, or if they have other questions about patent matters, the Patent and Trademark Office advises them to consult an attorney or agent registered to practice before the Patent and Trademark Office. A publication, "Attorneys and Agents Registered to Practice Before the U.S. Patent and Trademark Office", is available from the Superintendent of Documents, U.S. Government Printing Office, P.O. Box 371954, Pittsburgh, PA 15250-7954. Patent attorneys and agents may be found in the telephone directories of most major cities. Also, many large cities have associations of patent attorneys which may be consulted. January 1994 ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 14:56:10 GMT Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: bill paton Organization: bp ent. Subject: Starting home-based R & D Companies Here is something that I found on the net which may be interested in you CADS out there (Comprehensive Anticipatory Design Scientists. It's a little advertising heavy near the end, but you can ignore that if you want. Bill STARTING HOME-BASED RESEARCH AND DEVELOPMENT COMPANIES In the final analysis, only the inventor truly understands his/her invention. At Thorne and Company, we believe that you as an inventor should take charge of your own intellectual property. Patent your own invention. At the very least, write the draft and have the attorney write the patent claims. Avoid marketing firms that promise you the world, and form your own R and D company to prototype, patent, market and license/manufacture your own products. Research companies can be started in your home and are a legitimate way to control your present and future intellectual property. These companies belong to the inventor, speak only for the inventor, and serve as a great tax write-off for the inventor, especially if they are incorporated (how about leasing your house and your car to your corporation then deducting them as a business expense). Thorne and Company is a consulting company for inventors only. It is unique in that regard. Our job is to help you set up your company, and to show you how to get information that will enable you to patent, market and sell your product or process. We're an information company. If there is a state program in Alabama to help local inventors market their inventions, we probably already know about it. Our job is to coach you in the realities of the business world, and to teach you to become self-reliant. In one or two years, you won't need us anymore. In the interim, we're the ones standing in the shadows, the ones no one but you sees. When I was in graduate school at Berkeley, I was never required to take a business course on entrepreneurship. I was trained to conduct basic research, ostensively for the public good. Well, not all basic research is equal, especially in the eyes of the commercial world. Inventors working out of their garages seem to understand this. They live to commercialize their products. Scientists, on the other hand, and even some engineers, rarely give more than lip service to the commercial potential to their research (inventions). This ignorance costs them dearly. I've never forgotten the story of the Israeli scientist who invented the avidin-biotin technology, which is now used throughout the world by companies who produce biological test kits. He didn't patent the technology. Years later, he wrote a letter to Science or Nature magazine informing the international community that he was now living on a pension, and thought it would be only right if companies making money off his invention voluntarily contributed some form of token payment to him. He may have gotten a few bucks, but probably very few. Most businessmen would respond, quite appropriately, "tough shit". Hindsight, the art and science of looking back with regret, is a terribly burdensome perspective to adopt. When Milstein and Kohler invented the monoclonal antibody technology, Cambridge University, their employer, refused to file a patent because some "suit" didn't think the technology was valuable. Big mistake. The technology was worth billions. Milstein and Kohler should have gotten a waver from Cambridge and sought commercial backing elsewhere. They didn't and lost countless millions in royalties. As compensation, they did receive the Nobel Prize. Personally, I would rather be rich. The moral of these stories is don't depend on others to take care of you. Take care of yourself, and do it with a vengence. There is no greater burden than potential, or so says one of my neurotic genius friends. If you are an inventor, you are different from the rest of the population. If you tinker around in your garage just for fun, but not for profit, that is fine. You aren't likely to be interested in what I have to say. But if you are one of those inventors with the suppressed potential to become entrepreneurs, I suggest you read this letter through to the end. Invention is a creative act. It is very difficult to define. Entrepreneurship is not a creative act. It takes balls, but it isn't creative, per se. It is a process by which someone , a risk-taker, forms a business for the express purpose of making money. This process has rules, which are definable and can be followed. In short, forming a business may not be rocket science, but it isn't trivial either. If you are smart enough to be an inventor, you are certainly smart enough to control the exploitation of your invention. I am a biological scientist. I have five college degrees, culminating in a Ph.D in science from Berkeley. After completing my postdoc position, I was shocked to learn that I could not get a job. I wasn't well prepared for the real world. After sending out 100 resumes and getting two interviews, I seriously considered getting out of science. The despair was getting to me. The longer you are out of science, the more difficult it is to convince someone to let you back in. I might have changed careers if it wasn't for my cousin. Over a ten year period, I had experimented with a biological technique that had immense social and financial value if it could be perfected. I hadn't perfected it yet but I had enough information to know that I was on the right track. I freely offered the technology to the one company and state agency that consented to interview me. They were initially interested, but they ultimately passed on both me and my technology. My cousin, tired of listening to me whine about the state of the job market, suggested that I start my own biotechnology company. This seemed like a preposterous idea. I didn't know anything about business. I just wanted someone to give me a job as a scientist, an occupation I knew something about. Well, as my job prospects dwindled, my interest in becoming an entrepreneur increased logrithmically. I hit the library and read every useless book on entrepreneurship and business that looked remotely interesting. Most of these books were out of date, irrelevant, or too theoretical to be of use to me. I wanted someone to tell me how to start a business. Pure and simple. Discussions of cash flow management were of little use to someone who had no cash flow, no business license, and no understanding of how to get either. Well, I won't bore you with the details, but I did form a biotech company, it is a private corporation, and I am a paper multimillionaire. Most importantly, I am happy because I like what I am doing. The knowledge that I struggled to gain I am going to pass on to other inventors who want to control their own destinies. R and D companies can be put together cheaply with used equipment, and it can be done in your own home, in your garage. Furthermore, the government, both state and federal, will help you, both financially and with free technical and business advice. They want you to succeed. Small business is where all the jobs are coming from, and that translates into a broader tax base. Is working out of your own garage or someone else's garage realistic? Can you become a multimillionaire starting out this way? The answer is an unqualified YES!. Silicon Valley got started in the garages of inventors. Venture capitalists and investment bankers did not exist in those days. Inventors made do with what they had or could scrounge. The prototype of the original Apple computer was built out of parts scrounged out of dumpsters in Silicon Valley. Inventors, by definition, are inventive. They adapt their needs to whatever is available. Quality used equipment of every description is for sale all over the country. If you live in a metropolitan area, most of it can be purchased locally. My friends and I have purchased office furniture (Steelcase desks, excellent condition, $1-5 each), machine tools of every description, computers (I bought $80,000 worth of Tektronics UNIX graphics computers from the GSA for $200. The equipment was six years old and had never been used), laboratory equipment of every description for biology and chemistry labs (two door incubators for $75, spectrophotometers for $65 to $150, metal New Brunswick shaker incubators for $55, balances, water baths, ph meters for $10-$20, and the list goes on and on), office machines (IBM Selectric II typewriters $5 each, adding machines $1), etc. There is nothing you can't buy surplus from either the government (federal, state or municipality), universities, or private companies. Some of this equipment is sold at auction. Other equipment is priced to move. The deals are there. You simply have to know who to ask. Anyone with technical skills and ingenuity can come up with a product that some company might want to license. How do you find these companies? The federal and state governments have programs for helping inventors gather market information for little ($50) or no money. There are private, nonprofit organizations that will help inventors evaluate their inventions. Most, if not all , trade publications accept p.r. releases about products looking for a home. In my field, Genetic Engineering News has this as a regular feature. Finding a potential licenser or manufacturer for your product is not an insurmountable problem. Again, you simply have to know who to ask. The biggest problem for inventors is protecting their intellectual property. There is no room for error here. If you give a talk at a Rotary luncheon about your new gas saving device for automobiles, you had better have a patent pending. If not, your talk constitutes public disclosure. You have one year, from the date of your talk, to file a patent application in the US. However, by your public disclosure without a US patent pending, you have unilaterally lost the right to patent your invention in every other country in the world. I hope your talk went well, because it cost you a bundle of money. Know the rules regarding patents, trade secrets, confidentiality agreements, licensing agreements, etc. It's a cold world out there, and inventors, whose orientations are creative rather than business, are particularly vulnerable. What about money? Is money freely available to start-up entrepreneurs? The answer is no. Money isn't freely available to anyone, but it is available to someone who has built a prototype and who has some knowledge of the market potential of his/her product. There are many government programs to help young companies. The federal Handbook of Domestic Assistance is the size of the Seattle telephone book. Venture capitalists might find your product and/or technology interesting enough to build a company around it. If they did, you would probably be offered 5% of the stock. No venture capitalist gives control of a company to the inventor of the product or process upon which the company was founded. It never happens. I suspect they believe that creative people can't be entrepreneurs. If this tiny equity position and lack of control bothers you, you might want to operate and control your own company. This is a more difficult path, but it can be done. If you take a royalty, it will be between 3% and 6%. The amount of money (cash) you actually receive is directly proportional to the aggressiveness of the company to which you licensed your technology or product. Did you do your homework and check out this company first? How is their D and B (credit) rating? Are they being sued? Do they have another product similar to yours? Are they an international company with manufacturing facilities in different countries? Did you get a guaranteed annual payment? Did you give them worldwide rights because they said it was the norm? These companies don't give a fig about your interests. They are only interested in their own bottom lines. There is nothing wrong with this attitude. You should adopt the same attitude. If you aren't sophisticated about business, don't expect the licensee to teach you. The problem is yours. If you want to remain an R and D company and license your technology to outside manufacturers, you may never need more space than your garage. This type of arrangement is very attractive to many inventors who would prefer to remain creative tinkerers. Other inventors want more out of their inventions. This is especially true if their invention is a product or technology that has wide applicability. Taking a royalty is painless, but it could also be a financial disaster in the long run. A street-wise inventor once told me that "there are no beans in collecting royalties. The money is in manufacturing." Manufacturing requires more money, but it also creates jobs. This is where government programs are especially useful. Jobs increase the tax base, and the tax base, human beings, vote. If you have a prototype, favorable market information, which many government agencies will help you accumulate, a patent pending, and a reasonable business plan, the government will not only help you get money, they will help you sell your products both to the government and to overseas markets. Raising large amounts of money should not be your concern at this point. Build a working model of your product first, then decide if you want to manufacture it or license it out to others. If the product or technology is useful, someone will want it. A final thought before I discuss our services. I've gone to college for a long time, and I have many highly educated, intelligent friends. Some of my friends are irritatingly arrogant, which is a fatal character flaw in a business negotiation with someone who negotiates for a living. At the end of the day, my omnipotent friends might find, in horrific retrospect, that the negotiator not only ate their lunch, but his company now owned both their current and future intellectual property. If his company put up seed money, the negotiator might have even talked my friends into guaranteeing the money with their real and personal property. After all, he might say, it would be only right. Far-fetched example? Not at all. Professional negotiators don't have to be intelligent or forthright. They are paid to manipulate you to their way of thinking. It may not be nice, but it is both legal and ethical. No one is putting a gun to your head. Remember, there is no norm and there is no standard. Norm and standard are negotiating ploys. Also, if you have a patent pending, you never give anyone worldwide rights without major concessions from the licensee. And I do mean major. Your patent attorney will negotiate for you. They are good at it. You aren't. The Virtual corporation is the future and the future is now. Due to the increasing costs of doing business, companies, especially high tech companies, will find it increasingly attractive to contract out everything from accounting to manufacturing to distribution. Many companies with multimillion dollar technologies will occupy facilities no larger than 5,000 to 10,000 square feet. This is nothing more than a glorified garage. The only actual employees will be management, a small support clerical staff and R and D personnel. Virtual corporations are already common in the cash-poor biotech industry. As the job market deteriorates for scientists and engineers, they have the choice of either changing careers (how about law school, a decision made by two of my former friends at Berkeley), or starting their own companies. I did it, and it was painful. I had to learn everything from square one. The people who become clients of Thorne and Company will find that their transition from hobbiest or academic scientist/engineer to entrepreneur (CEO of their own corporation) will not be easy, but it will be fun. It's definitely going to be a ride-a ride they will never regret taking. Knowledge is power. No truer statement has ever been made. Thorne and Company was started because I have a wealth of information about starting, financing, and promoting young companies, especially technology companies. This information is valuable, primarily because it changes daily. The cost of our services is $396/year. The key word here is services.You are not purchasing a book, which if it existed at all, would be out of date as soon as it was printed. Our business guide is part print and part electronic. In order to join our entrepreneurial group of inventor-clients, you must have a computer and a modem. We communicate with each other by e-mail through the Internet or commercial online services such as CompuServe or America Online. Fax communication will also be available, but voice communications will be minimal. It cost too much and it is inefficient. Our consulting fee is nominal because we don't have to reinvent the wheel every time we help someone new. The same business principles apply to toys, garage door openers, electrical and electronic devices, software (increasingly going to patent rather than copyright protection), those wonderful nuclear accelerators developed by the Ghost Busters, and, oh yes, genetically engineered organisms. As I said, our service is interactive. What you are purchasing is a personal relationship. We will tell you, our client, in chronological order, how to proceed with the establishment of your business. We will tell you what books to read about business, copyrights, trademarks, patents, etc. We will provide their titles, authors and ISBN numbers. We will tell you what kind of computer and printer to buy, the best and most economical software to purchase, how to connect your computer online to the Internet and commercial services, how and where to incorporate out of state (if necessary, and increasingly it is necessary), how and where to buy surplus equipment at auction, how to bid at auctions, how to protect your intellectual property, how to write drafts of patents, what to include in technology licensing agreements, where to find free government experts and marketing information, and how to get funding for your company. We will also teach you tax strategies, based upon your present income level. If you reach the point where you are seriously interested in venture capital, we are tied into another company that does an excellent job of matching the interests of those seeking venture capital with those seeking investments. We subscribe to Bacon's Publicity Checker which lists over 17,000 newspapers and magazines in North America. When you have a patent pending, we'll help you write and distribute your press release. Or, we'll do it for you for a nominal fee. We will even go so far as to help you design your company stationary, and arrange to have it printed (appearances are important). In June, a computer bulletin board will be established so we, as a group, can share our experiences, sell surplus equipment to one another, recommend patent attorneys and other professionals to one another, and generally provide help to each other in any way possible. The bulletin board will have daily postings from the Commerce Business Daily, the Commerce Dept. equivalent of the Federal Register. This document lists all government contracts as they are issued, and all surplus property immediately as it becomes available. Our clients can communicate with us anytime (24 hours/day) by e-mail, fax or snail mail (US mail). We will answer, to the best of our ability, any question you have about your business. We will do CD-ROM or publication data searches for you at no additional charge. In June, we will open a commercial account with NEXUS, which will allow us access to a wealth of current online business information, including patent databases and intelligence reports on companies you might want to do business with. We can check these companies out for you. If they are public corporations, they can't burp without someone reporting it. These online searches cost $100/hour with a $50 minimum. Most patent searches cost $50. Internet world-wide information searches cost $50/ hour with a $25 minimum. Thorne and Company was created to be a one-stop consulting firm for inventors. If you need information, we'll help you find it. If you need legal advice on a particular licensing agreement, we have consultant contract lawyers who will read the agreement and give you their opinion. This cost extra, but it is rarely over $100. Whatever you need, whenever you need it, we'll try to dig it out. "Do I have to purchase a computer?". This question has come up frequently. The answer is ABSOLUTELY, POSITIVELY, YES! Our job is to help you help yourself. We can't do that if you can't access the mind-boggling amount of free information that is available, worldwide, on the Internet and other online services. As an example, one Sunday night I was bored with TV so I decided to "surf the net". I dialed my Internet provider (a local call), and ended up accessing, in chronological order, the National Supercomputer Center in Saulo Paulo, Brazil, the government statistics bureau in Chile, 15 or 20 computer science and electrical engineering departments in various universities in Australia, and various university departments in Mexico (which unfortunately were in Spanish-how inconsiderate). I was on the computer for two hours and all it cost me was a local (25 miles) telephone call. Of course, if you want a particular piece of information, you have to know who to call. There is no directory for the Internet, because the information available on the Internet changes daily. It is our job (nightmare) to keep on top of it as much as possible. CompuServe, the commercial online service, has a regular inventors forum where inventors from all over the world can talk to one another. If purchased new, the correct computer should cost no more than $700. Once you get used to "surfing the net" or engaging in forum discussions on CompuServe, it becomes extremely addictive. Remember, information is power. Your personal computer is your gateway to that power. If you are interested in getting some painless, easy to understand information on the Internet, I suggest you call Free Range Media at 1-800-327-4225. They sell a videotape called the Information Superhighway. It cost $29.95. If you purchase Internet In A Box, the Internet access software that I use and strongly recommend, you will find a $10.00 discount coupon in the box for this tape. This tape does a great job of describing the wonders, and I do mean wonders, of the Internet, and the information that is freely (usually) available to anyone who can access it. Your satisfaction with our services is 100% guaranteed. If you pay by credit card, you can pay the entire amount or installment of $33/month plus tax (if you are a Washington resident). This will be automatically charged to your credit card each month. If you become dissatisfied with our service, you can terminate our relationship. No questions asked. No explanations expected. There will be no further charges to your credit card. If you wish to pay by check, you also have the option of paying $33/month or the entire $396/yearly fee. When you pay the entire yearly fee, we will refund your money, pro-rated to the number of months you belonged to our service, if you subsequently resign. Either way, you aren't locked into a long-term relationship that you do not want or use. We strongly encourage you to take charge of your intellectual property. Don't take the lazy way and intrust some marketing company that promises you everything but results. Most of these companies are either outright scams or their success rates are very low. Patent and market your invention yourself. If you invented it, you should take charge of it. It not only can be done, it is done every day. The only difference between you and those already marketing their own inventions is information. They know more than you do. Thorne and Company was formed to fill in those blanks. Whatever you decide, don't make any mistakes with your intellectual property. Once it is gone or compromised (i.e. made public), you can't get it back. Nice guys don't finish last if they aren't operating in the dark. GOOD LUCK! If you interested in joining our group of entrepreneur/inventors, please provide the following information. U.S. citizenship is not required. Name Address Telephone number Fax number (if any) E-mail address (if any) Social Security Number (this is your password). If you don't have a SSN, we will assign you a password. Personal information (in order to see if you qualify for special programs) 1. sex 2. racial or ethnic group 3. veteran status (branch and dates served) 4. disabilities? You may pay by personal check, money order, or VISA/MasterCharge. If you are living outside the U.S., we don't accept foreign checks. Our bank charges us too much to process them. You must pay either by credit card or by cash. We accept all foreign currencies as long as the exchange rate is correct. The fee is $396/year or $33/month. For Washington residents, with sales tax added, the fee is $427/year or $35.60/month. If you are using a credit card, tell us VISA or MC, your name as it appears on the card, the number, and the expiration date. The information requested above MUST be mailed to us. We don't want electronic transfers, because they aren't safe. We do not want anyone knowing personal information about you, or your credit card numbers. Also, your letter must be signed by you in ink. This is for our protection. If you have any questions, you can telephone us between 7 and 8am, Pacific Standard Time. After 8 am, the computers usually tie up the telephone lines. We are moving to a new location in April which will enable us to have more telephone lines, including a dedicated fax line. M. THORNE and COMPANY, PO Box 759, CONCRETE, WA. 98237 360-853-8268; e-mail max@sos.net, CompuServe 76521,1156, America Online DMartin329. ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 10:53:50 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Smallshaw Subject: Roofing Domes I'm new to this group, but at Joe's prompting, would like to pose a question that perhaps others have dealt with. We are almost finished building a 'conventional' house, but before starting strongly considered building a dome structure since both my wife and I have been reading and admiring Bucky's work for decades. After looking into the specifics of how we would actually build the thing, however, we eventually decided that there would be too many problems, particularly in roofing and interior finishing. I am wondering if anybody has any thoughts on the former of these two issues, because we are still considering a dome studio/workshop/office. Here in the cold and rainy Gulf Islands of British Columbia, roofing is an important issue. I have seen domes sheathed in asphalt (duroid) shingles, but they are hard to use on a dome structure. As well, I don't like the aesthetics of them much and they are hard to dispose of when they eventually wear out. I have also seen cedar shakes/shingles used, but that material is getting expensive (even here in BC), is of limited durability in a wet winter climate like ours and is of questionable safety in the dry season if you decide to fire up your wood stove (someone described it as piling kindling on top of your house and then showering it with sparks). So what to use? We eventually decided to sheath our 45-degree (12/12) pitch roof with concealed fastener metal - reasonable cost, exceptional durability and watertightness, fire-resistant, good if you want to collect roof runoff for use in the dry season - after deciding that we couldn't afford slate, our first choice. But what about domes? It seems to me, after spending a lot of effort to make this building watertight and resistant to the effects of weather, that the ideal materials for a dome would be steel and glass, manufactured in triangular watertight units that could be bolted and caulked together. You build a large, uninsulated dome of glass and steel that acts as your roof, and then build whatever you like inside. Your inside structure doesn't have to be anywhere near as strong as a conventional building - no roof to support, no wind/snow loads - and it would be protected from the deteriorating effects of the weather. Insulation would be easy because you already have a first line of defense in the dome, and there would presumably be fewer worries about moisture buildup in your insulating layer. Now I don't know if it is possible to cheaply manufacture glass and steel dome components. Windows, and especially skylights, are not cheap, but if sizes were standardized and the glass single-pane, it might be feasible. Glass and steel are not particularly expensive, especially if you consider their lifespan (provided the steel was treated properly), and they are more recyclable than a lot of other materials. I would love to be able to buy glass and steel dome kit. Anybody have any ideas on this subject, or have you all been through all of this before? Brian Smallshaw Saltspring Island BC ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 15:39:47 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: Re: Roofing Domes In-Reply-To: ; from "Brian Smallshaw" at Feb 6, 96 10:53 am Does anyone out there manufacture domes out of metal (steel, aluminum) and/or synthetic materials (fiberglass, composites)? If so, would they or someone else please let us know? I could never get too excited about living in a dome that could burn, rot, or be eaten by bugs. -- JOE S MOORE joemoore@cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 19:44:26 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Vito Dibona Subject: Re: Skin for greenhouse dome This is a first time post for me. I like the feel of this group - seems that there is a lot of experience to be shared. A few weeks ago, I started a methane generator project in the greenhouse of Warren Wilson College. For those of you not familiar, it turns pig poop into methane and traps it for use as fuel. The greenhouse people were not too happy about this arrangement, and I was forced to move the generator out into the cold.....(for good digetion, the pig poop slurry, must be kept pretty warm) That said, I am now looking for a greenhousey environ to keep the digester. A year or so ago, I built a 12' diam. 5/8 3v dome out of 1/2" electrical conduit. I would like to use this same frame as a greenhouse. Any ideas on how to 'skin' this cat?-What can I cover the dome with? I would like it to last at least 3 years of weather and I can't afford to spend more than a hundred or so dollars. Vito Di Bona vito@warren-wilson.edu ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 21:29:34 GMT Reply-To: Alex Gaal Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Alex Gaal Organization: Case Western Reserve University, Cleveland, OH (USA) Subject: Re: The Shape of the Universe Here's one for you. The Universe is shaped as a 3d mobius strip. A flatlander sets off in what he thinks is straight ahead and travels until he reaches the point from which he started. Take the 2d of the strip and extropolate it to 3d. An impossible space ship takes off on its course over this great geodesic curve and ends up where it started. You ask whats outside the 3d mobius manifold as there is something outside the 2d strip? ...jello. ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 21:45:51 GMT Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Chris Fearnley Organization: Philadelphia's Complete Internet Provider Subject: Re: Invention Confidentiality Agreement bill paton (bpaton@inforamp.net.) wrote: : This is a Confidentiality Agreement you may want to use if you have an : invention idea and you want an expert in that field to explore it. : Bill : : Confidentiality Agreement ICK! Why strangehold the free flow of information? I recognize that there are many unscrupulous people out there. So for some a confidentiality agreement may be necessary. But my value is to avoid them if at all possible. -- Christopher J. Fearnley | UNIX SIG Leader at PACS cjf@netaxs.com | (Philadelphia Area Computer Society) http://www.netaxs.com/~cjf | Design Science Revolutionary ftp://ftp.netaxs.com/people/cjf | Explorer in Universe "Dare to be Naive" -- Bucky Fuller | Linux Advocate ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 21:30:40 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: James Fischer Subject: Re: Home-based R & D Bill Patton posted a promotional piece from "Thorne and Company". There are many such companies, who claim to help the inventor make money from their ideas. Most are outright scams. What they really "sell" is a lot of semi-useful information about programs like the Small Business Investment Corporation (SBIC) and Small Business Administration (SBA), with a smattering of tax information. As such, they are parasites. They prey on people who may or may not have a marketable concept, and never address the central issue: "Can THIS SPECIFIC idea/design/concept make me any money?". I hate parasites like these, since the reference librarian at any decent public library can fill your arms with the same information for free. A single letter to the SBA can get you a list of every document they publish, all available for no more than the cost of printing. Since information published by the US Government is "in the public domain", many newsletters and "middlemen" make money by charging you (the unsuspecting customer) for what you could get for free. Why do I dislike people who charge you money to provide information of this sort? After all, they do save you the trouble of doing your own research. Well, if they were willing to put their money where their mouths were, they would do all this for A PERCENTAGE of what you will make from your idea. So, before you send $33 per month to some parasite, send me a note. If I like your idea and think it has commerical potential, I will do more than they claim to do, and take a small percentage of any royalties you earn from your idea as my only "fee". Anyone who works on any other basis has no interest in you or your idea. I pay obscene amounts of money to my beancounters and two firms of intellectual property lawyers every month. The overwhelming majority of my income is from license fees, royalties, and other payments for my designs (mostly software). I have never paid a dime to anyone to provide me with a "simple, step-by-step guide to going through the process", since THE PROCESS IS DIFFERENT FOR EACH SPECIFIC CONCEPT!!! The process is NEVER simple. For example, I recently went to a meeting where we did a yearly "project review" for a product which uses my technology as a central part of the product sold. There were 24 people in the room!! I brought a lawyer on a leash, since one cannot go to such meetings without an attack-trained lawyer or two. This is "business as usual", and people that sell you "services" will never get you to that table. That kind of table is where the money changes hands. Just a quick summary of the major points to contrast: INVENTOR SERVICES COMPANY REFERENCE LIBRARIAN ------------------------- ------------------- Some PO Box somewhere A real (often cute, intelligent, and fun member of the opposite sex) person. $200 - $10,000 An occasional lunch might be a good idea. Re-hash of raw data Pointers to the real sources of the facts. Brief treatments of generic Everything on the planet topics, with come-ons to is available through the get you to buy books, tapes, awsome power of "Inter- and other "in-depth" Library Loan" for free. information. No software will ever be able to compress information to the extent a human female does when she merely raises an eyebrow. james fischer jfischer@supercollider.com ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 20:20:46 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: Re: Skin for greenhouse dome In-Reply-To: ; from "Vito Dibona" at Feb 6, 96 7:44 pm Don't know too much about plastics, but I DO know that you should suspend the skin from the inside of the frame--a dome within a dome--several inches away from the frame. The interior skin is pulled out toward the outside frame--so that it won't flap in the wind. -- JOE S MOORE joemoore@cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 6 Feb 1996 20:31:20 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: NEW FTP ADDRESS Does anyone know the new FTP address for the Bucky files (pics and database) that used to be on the Switchboard server? The switchboard.ftp.com address doesn't seem to work anymore. -- JOE S MOORE joemoore@cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 11:35:29 CST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: tagdi@RUULCH.LET.RUU.NL Subject: Fuller writting Fuller patterns...... let us say, that he changes the theme on the averageafter 15 written lines, knoting the synergetic ideas in similar manner as the basket weaver. his way of writing comes from understanding the language of poetry. he ties the essential, after triming it, brings the matephysical, and juxsposed to the physical. tagdi ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 11:35:33 CST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: tagdi@RUULCH.LET.RUU.NL Subject: cold misconception about cold: go north go cold correct: go east go cold. tagdi ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 08:29:57 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: Re: BUCKY LURKERS (fwd) Venter, Dawie writes: > From aztec.co.za!cthru.iplan.co.za!i1.iplan.co.za!dawie Wed Feb 7 00:55:31 1996 > From: "Venter, Dawie" > Organization: Denel Informatics, Cape Reg Office > To: joemoore@cruzio.com > Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 10:50:17 GMT+0200 > Subject: Re: BUCKY LURKERS > X-Confirm-Reading-To: "Venter, Dawie" > X-Pmrqc: 1 > Priority: normal > X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail/Windows (v1.22) > Message-Id: <4D95D947561@i1.iplan.co.za> > > Hello Joe > > I posted the clip below to newsgroup: bit.listserv.geodesic, not sure > if it is linked to GEODESIC@UBVM.cc.buffalo.edu. I'm also a newby > and battling a little to get to grips with all this technology. If > you've read it please ignore. > > clip start -------------------------------------------------------------- > > I have a collection of dome-books rapidly approaching almost 20 years > since being printed, and showing signs of wear and deterioration. A > lot of the techniques and construction methods covered by these > books are also about 20 years behind current trends and available > materials. Getting information from the WWW is an excellent > alternative, but has the drawback of being vast and very scattered, > slow to download and requires a lot of filtering to get appropriate > information. > > It is with this as background, that I would like enquire if anybody > is aware of a CD-ROM covering the subject of geodesic domes, and > where it may be obtained from? If such a CD-ROM does not exist, > maybe members of this newsgroup may generate enough interest with > the publishers of CD-ROMS to consider an encyclopaedia about > geodesic domes as shelters and homes. Just imagine having > comprehensive information about dome maths, structural behaviour > under load / earthquakes, video clips, a mini CAD to manipulate > existing floor plans, dome history, Bucky history and facts, > scaleable and printable 3-D models for various frequency domes, > material cutting angles, cutting lists, dome wind resistance, latest > materials, etc., all this with sound, animation, hardcopy and > electronic file output, from one single source! > Truly a CD for Dome-mestic use :-) > > Regards > David Venter > Capetown South-Africa > > clip end------------------------------------------------------------- > .- > -- JOE S MOORE joemoore@cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 11:35:13 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: James Fischer Subject: Re: Skin for greenhouse dome Vito Di Bona asked: >A year or so ago, I built a 12' diam. 5/8 3v dome out of 1/2" >electrical conduit. I would like to use this same frame as a greenhouse. >Any ideas on how to 'skin' this cat?-What can I cover the dome with? I would >like it to last at least 3 years of weather and I can't afford to spend >more than a hundred or so dollars. Given your budget, I would suggest that you contact local nurserys and ask them if they have any "end-rolls" of plastic to sell or give away. Buying plastic even from a wholesaler is too expensive for your budget. Greenhouse plastic comes in 100-foot rolls, so there are often "left-overs", which have little value to the nurserys, since they are too short for anything other than patching a tear. These "too short" remnants can be as long as 25 feet, and as width varies depending upon what they ordered - there seems to be no "standard" width. Depending upon the type of plastic, you can get up to 10 years of actual "life" before the plastic "goes white" on you, more if you take down and store the plastic in the summers. Covering your dome with plastic will require you to study parachutes, and how they are made from "banana peel" sections. I would get an end-roll of newsprint from your local newspaper (once again, low-cost or free for the asking) to make a full-size pattern, and tape/tie the pattern to the dome to assure yourself that you have the correct size and shape. The "correct" size and shape is best shown in the photos of the various geodesic trade fair pavilions ("The Dymaxion World of Buckminster Fuller" has some not-so-good photos of them, but you can at least get the idea). One would suspend the plastic from each strut intersection, and get the tension right by adjusting the length of the wires/cords. I have no idea how to design one of these things "correctly" - anyone have a clue? I have designed and built a few dome greenhouses where the plastic was a semi-sphere that was a few inches smaller than the dome framework, and then simply adjusted the wires by hand to get the tension "right". No wind flap, but perhaps I was just lucky, rather than smart. The suspension of the plastic can be done with re-enforced points (multiple layers of circular plastic) that have a hole punched through the middle. A set of wooden strain-reliefs would also be a help. I would make the wooden strain reliefs with a drill and a el-cheapo hole-cutting bit. The hole is cut by the outer gizmo that looks like a hacksaw blade bent in a circle, and the center is drilled out by the drill bit. You end up with a "donut", just right for threading a rope or wire. 1/2" or 1/4" plywood would work here. I was able to "weld" sections of plastic to each other with an old iron set on a low temperature - just fold each plastic segment to be joined to create a 1-inch or 2-inch "flap" and overlap the flaps as follows: Plastic Sheet #1 --------------------------+ | The Fold +---------------- | | -------------+ | +--------------------------- Plastic Sheet #2 Then apply the narrow tip of the iron to the folded area to "weld" them. The fumes can be nasty. Mess about with scraps until you find the right temperature. You want a temperature that creates a "weld" in about 15 seconds, no less. (Stay away from the "cotton" setting, and do NOT use the steam!) ;-) Suspending the plastic from the dome is a pain - start at the summit of the dome, and work down from the top, around and around in circles. Since you built your dome from conduit, you may be able to find a small, lightweight person who could climb on the dome framework itself to do this. If one places one's feet ONLY at the intersections, one can climb about without bending the struts. (I weigh 120 lbs, and this works for me with PVC domes, so I assume it would work with metal too.) This sort of effort would be helped if the archive at BFI could be used to find actual blueprints of actual projects. Does anyone know if BFI keeps any such index that would allow a person to find and order copies of dimensioned drawings or blueprints? No software will ever be able to compress information to the extent a human female does when she merely raises an eyebrow. james fischer jfischer@supercollider.com ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 09:03:12 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: Re: Skin for greenhouse dome In-Reply-To: <199602071650.LAA01033@crucible.inmind.com>; from "James Fischer" at Feb 7, 96 11:35 am See Fuller US Patent # 2,914,074 "Catenary (Geodesic Tent)" granted 11-24-59. Has detailed description of how to suspend geodesic skins from geodesic frames. Maybe someone could scan it and post it since it's in the public domain? Or maybe get a digital copy from the Patent Office? See: _Inventions_, pages 162-6. -- JOE S MOORE joemoore@cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 10:32:56 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: curtis palmer Subject: Re: Roofing Domes >To: Multiple recipients of list GEODESIC > >Does anyone out there manufacture domes out of metal (steel, aluminum) and/or >synthetic materials (fiberglass, composites)? If so, would they or someone >else please let us know? I could never get too excited about living in a >dome that could burn, rot, or be eaten by bugs. > I have produced an experimental dome in steel using laser cutting as the preferred fabricating tech. Unfortunately it is only 2 ft. in diameter, though it could be scaled up easily. My technique uses one fabrication method to manufacture struts, hubs, panels entirely from standard sheet stock. Tolerances of laser cutting can be controlled to 0.001" for each component but I haven't measured the resultant accumulated error. The first laser cut dome I made in 1984 using 1/8" masonite 27.25" diameter (spherical) supported the sitting weight of a 110 lb. woman. I haven't loaded the steel structure. I have used it for vacuum forming and as a jig for welding. All this was work done as a Masters in Industrial Design. I am trying to establish a business so if people have need of precision small scale domes or be willing to work through the development of larger domes based on my techniques I would be happy to oblige. (I am new to posting to the list and I am unsure if I've now included my signature several times. Please advise.) Curtis Palmer M.Des email: curtis_palmer@mindlink.bc.ca Synergetic Design Phone: 604/228-8533 3726 West 28 Ave. Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada V6S 1S6 Curtis Palmer M.Des email: curtis_palmer@mindlink.bc.ca Synergetic Design Phone: 604/228-8533 3726 West 28 Ave. Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada V6S 1S6 ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 13:12:28 GMT Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: "John D. Robinson" Organization: Computer Aided Engineering Subject: Domebooks Howdy, I'm looking for copies of several books on domebuilding. John Robinson, Mechanician Mechanical Engineering University of Wisconsin 1513 University Ave. Madison, Wi. 53706 608-262-3606 FAX 608-265-2316 Current Land Speed Record Holder Bonneville Salt Flats H/GCC 92 cu.in. 1980 Dodge Colt 131.333 MPH ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 13:22:29 GMT Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: "John D. Robinson" Organization: Computer Aided Engineering Subject: domebooks (2) Howdy, Now that I've screwed up and posted before I'm done, I'm looking for several books on domebuilding... "Zome Primer" by S. Baer "The Dome Cookbook" by S. Baer "Geodesics" by E. Popko "Domebook 2" by ? I have a partial copy of Domebook 2 that is missing 10 or 12 pages. I used the information in it on a dome that I built at Marinette Wi. on Earth Day in 1971. It was a 22 ft. 3v 5/8 strut structure that had metal hubs for connections. Thanks ; - ) John Robinson, Mechanician Mechanical Engineering University of Wisconsin 1513 University Ave. Madison, Wi. 53706 608-262-3606 FAX 608-265-2316 Current Land Speed Record Holder Bonneville Salt Flats H/GCC 92 cu.in. 1980 Dodge Colt 131.333 MPH ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 16:00:44 GMT Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: 102005.624@COMPUSERVE.COM Organization: CompuServe Incorporated Subject: Addition to listing Sirs, I have a web page which presents the elements of structure through a series of gifs. I would like to add it to your listing. The URL is: http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/robert_conroy Thankyou. Bob ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 16:21:37 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: Re: Domebooks In-Reply-To: ; from "John D. Robinson" at Feb 7, 96 1:12 pm Which books on domes are you looking for? Do you have a list? -- JOE S MOORE joemoore@cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 16:29:14 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: FWD>Mission to Planet Earth (fwd) Bruce Fairchild writes: > From gw.numenet.com!numenet.com!owner-mission-earth Wed Feb 7 13:10:37 1996 > Message-Id: > Date: 7 Feb 1996 11:49:03 -0600 > From: Bruce Fairchild > Subject: FWD>Mission to Planet Earth > To: "press-release-com@mercury.hq.na" > X-Mailer: Mail*Link SMTP-QM 3.0.2 > Sender: owner-mission-earth@scs.org > Precedence: bulk > X-Comment: Discussion forum on simulation to aid in world planning and survival > Subject: FWD>Mission to Planet Earth Administrator to > > Return to > > Douglas Isbell > Headquarters, Washington, DC January 19, 1996 > (Phone: 202/358-1753) > > Brian Dunbar > Headquarters, Washington, DC > (Phone: 202/358-1600) > > RELEASE: 96-9 > > MISSION TO PLANET EARTH ADMINISTRATOR TO RETURN TO UCLA > > Dr. Charles F. Kennel, NASA Associate Administrator for > the Office of Mission to Planet Earth, will leave the space > agency by late spring to return to the University of > California, Los Angeles, NASA Administrator Daniel Goldin > announced today. > > Kennel has been appointed by the University of > California Board of Regents as the new executive vice > chancellor and chief academic officer of UCLA. He started > work at NASA in January 1994 under a two-year appointment > from his post as a professor in the UCLA Department of Physics. > > "Under the leadership of Charlie Kennel, the Mission to > Planet Earth program has made significant progress in helping > improve our understanding of our changing planet," Goldin > said. "Dr. Kennel has been instrumental in putting the > program on a sound budgetary footing while emphasizing its > solid science focus. He has also led development of a > coordinated educational program that will help increase > students' understanding of Earth's environment." > > Key agency accomplishments during Kennel's tenure as > associate administrator include the restructuring of NASA's > Earth Observing System, increasing usage of advanced > technology in the agency's future Earth science missions, the > definition of the first steps toward an integrated global > observing strategy, and the launch of the first next- > generation GOES weather satellite. > > "I am extraordinarily grateful to NASA, and especially > to Dan Goldin, for giving me the opportunity to work on such > a fascinating program, which deals with issues of importance > to the whole world," Kennel said. "I've met and worked with > some of the most creative and dedicated people I have ever > known. It is especially satisfying that I will now be able > to apply what I learned from them on behalf of my home > institution, UCLA." > > Kennel received an A.B. from Harvard College in 1959 and > a Ph.D. in Astrophysical Sciences from Princeton University > in 1964. He has been a tenured member of the UCLA Department > of Physics since 1967, and was its chairman from 1983 to > 1986. He is the author or co-author of more than 225 > experimental and theoretical publications in plasma physics, > space plasma physics, planetary science, astrophysics, and > nonlinear science. > > Dr. Kennel has been a Fulbright scholar, a Guggenheim > scholar, and a Fairchild Professor at the California > Institute of Technology. He is a fellow of the American > Geophysical Union, the American Physical Society, the > American Association for the Advancement of Science, and a > member of the International Academy of Astronautics and the > U.S. National Academy of Sciences. > > -end- > > NASA press releases and other information are available > automatically by sending an Internet electronic mail message > to domo@hq.nasa.gov. In the body of the message (not the > subject line) users should type the words "subscribe > press-release" (no quotes). The system will reply with a > confirmation via E-mail of each subscription. A second > automatic message will include additional information on the > service. NASA releases also are available via CompuServe > using the command GO NASA. > > > .- > -- JOE S MOORE joemoore@cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 21:26:15 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: James Fischer Subject: Re: Skin for greenhouse dome Joe Moore suggested: >See Fuller US Patent # 2,914,074 "Catenary (Geodesic Tent)" granted 11-24-59. >Has detailed description of how to suspend geodesic skins from geodesic frames. >Maybe someone could scan it and post it since it's in the public domain? Or >maybe get a digital copy from the Patent Office? > >See: _Inventions_, pages 162-6. Been there, done that, got that. The patent application does not give one enough data to build one. No numbers, just pretty pictures and somewhat vauge descriptions. The conical portional of the catenary tent could be made from one standard pattern, as could the "between conical" piece. The problem is that without a general equation, I have no idea how to generate a "tent" design to match a specific dome configuration. Perhaps I am not smart enough for this task. After all, it was years before I relaized that a "conic section" was not the "funny pages" part of the newspaper... No software will ever be able to compress information to the extent a human female does when she merely raises an eyebrow. james fischer jfischer@supercollider.com ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 23:54:59 -0600 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: "J. Michael Rowland" Subject: Re: BUCKY LURKERS Joe Moore sez: >To all Bucky Lurkers: > >Please don't be shy about posting . . . Well, I've been lurking here for almost a year, now; I'm not shy... but it's about all I can do to keep up with what's already being posted (that and trying to decipher Tagdi's unique style of spelling :-) ...and even so, I have a tremendous backlog of postings I haven't even skimmed yet. So, the first thing I would like to say, in my first post here, is Please, Please, Gerald A. de Jong, compile a version of Struck for the Mac... I would be glad to volunteer my services in this regard (I have Think C and VIP C compilers... neither is C++-capable, though). Alternatively, if anyone can recommend a good 3D modelling program for the Mac that isn't tied to Cartesian coordinates, I'm all a-listen. I'm very interested in geodesic and/or tensegrity house plans. I drew up a very simple house plan using Adobe Illustrator for a 3-story cabin built inside a simple tensegrity structure -- six telephone poles as struts; it looks more like a ship than a house -- at least, that's my wife's feedback -- and I have no idea how to attach the cables to the ends of the poles in such a way that would enable the structure to hold its own weight, much less a housefull of furnishings. But I'd really like to build it, anyway. jmr J. Michael Rowland.................................rowley@telalink.net ===========------------------------------------------------=========== |||||||(((( ASCII Text - Your BEST Entertainment Value ))))||||||| ===========------------------------------------------------=========== ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 8 Feb 1996 14:29:50 CET Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: tagdi@RUULCH.LET.RUU.NL Subject: marketing in the information zoo consumerism is a conglomeration of seprate groups each with its own particular concerns, which somtimes form temporary alliance on a particular issue. in 1971, there were over 60 consumer orgonization in Europe, of which 10 were associated with goverment, with total membership of 1.5 million. private consumer groups often seek the support of organizations with allied intrests such as protestant and catholic consumer groups. they also seek the support of professional groups who share similar concerns on specific issues, including scientific community and charitable organization. publicity is major tool, and a number of consumer groups have become quite adept at using news confrences or media events to bring their causes to wider audience. they also may choose to sponsor independent scientific studies to force regulatory agencies to review the saftey of a product previously believed to be safe. lobbying is also a way to get their case heard. by 1975 over 300 cooperation in U.S has established "consumer releations" department. and by 1977 a 750 members society of consumer affairs professional had been formed to exchange information. some MNationals have extended the concept beyond the U.S - Coca Cola is one example. consumer groups are receptive to the idea of assisting groups in other countries. MN's must not only live up to different consumarism standards in each country, but it must also be prepared to come closer to meeting these standards than domestic business. they are more visible, vulnerable, and more subject to criticism. tagdi ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 8 Feb 1996 14:55:33 CET Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: tagdi@RUULCH.LET.RUU.NL Subject: Re: Skin for greenhouse dome james fisher No software will ever be able to compress information to the extent a human female does when she merely raises an eyebrow. tagdi or when she merely put on a high heels, the kind they wear in the Netherland. note that in this country more than 90% of the girls wear a high heels that resembles the hoofs of a gazelle. gee, i wonder why they do that. ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 22:26:37 GMT Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Tognon Marco Organization: PING Belgium Subject: Re: BUCKY LURKERS (fwd) Hello David Venter & JOE S MOORE, It is indeed a great idea to compile all the knowledge on domes and to create a CDROM of it. I do not think that bringing in the information is a serious problem, (we all feel the same about the geodesic structure) but how to raise the money to create the "Thing". Who will act as a treasurer and how do we submit our share? A sort of - Geodesic CDROM Fund - can be set up where every body can contribute.It can not be so expensive to produce, say 5000 CDROMS. Look at it as an investment, they will become rare after about 10 years. I'me in favor of such an idea, who likes to talk about it? Regards, Tognon Marco Genk Belgium ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 8 Feb 1996 08:38:46 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: Re: 2 quick things Comments: To: Bill Walden In-Reply-To: <199602080011.AA256408266@inuvik.cnd.hp.com>; from "Bill Walden" at Feb 7, 96 5:11 pm Bill Walden writes: > 1. Is there an FAQ somewhere for people interested in building Check out Kirby Urner's website http://www.teleport.com/~pdx4d He has TONS of Bucky-related material including links to other relevant sites--the Bucky FAQ among them. > a dome house? Can you suggest a book if there isn't? I've Best book is _Geodesic Math & How to Use It_; seems to be out of print, but use interlibrary loan to get it-- > found lots of info on Earthships, but precious little on > building domes to live in. > 2. is the mailing list the same as bit.listserv.geodesic? All LISTS are like newsletters that a person subscribes to. Some lists are "gatewayed" (forwarded, mirrored) to a NEWSGROUP. The Geodesic list is gatewayed to the newsgroup bit.listserv.geodesic. > 3. You have a page of web links to dome builders, but at least > 2 are off the net (out of business?). Dome manufacturers come & go like the seasons. It's hard to keep track of who is in or out of business. I depend on Bucky fans out there to try to keep the dome manuf list up to date. > > Thanks for running the listserv (and the newsgroup mirror?). > Don't thank me, thank Pat Salsbury & Chris Fearnley for starting & keeping going the Geodesic list since about 1990. Don't know who started the geodesic newsgroup. > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > | Bill Walden | Internet: wbw@fc.hp.com | > | Hewlett-Packard Company | Tel: 970-229-7812 | > | M/S J4 | Fax: 970-229-7018 | > | 3404 E. Harmony Road | "The loss of one's mind, or never to | > | Ft. Collins, CO 80525 | have had one - is a terrible thing." | > --------------------------------------------------------------------- -- JOE S MOORE joemoore@cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 8 Feb 1996 08:50:14 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: Ships in the night (fwd) Flemming Funch writes: > From netcom7.netcom.com!newciv.org!ffunch Wed Feb 7 23:37:02 1996 > Message-Id: > Mime-Version: 1.0 > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > Date: Wed, 7 Feb 1996 22:56:41 -0800 > To: Wholeinfo-l@netcom.com > From: Flemming Funch > Subject: Ships in the night (fwd) > > >>># Actual radio conversation released by the # > >>># Chief of Naval Operations, 10-10-95 # > >>># # > >>># ================================================================= # > >>># # > >>># Voice1: Please divert your course 15 degrees to the North to # > >>># avoid a collision. # > >>># # > >>># Voice2: Recommend you divert YOUR course 15 degrees to South to # > >>># avoid a collision. # > >>># # > >>># Voice1: This is the Captain of a US Navy ship. I say again, # > >>># divert YOUR course. # > >>># # > >>># Voice2: No. I say again, you divert YOUR course. # > >>># # > >>># Voice1: THIS IS THE AIRCRAFT CARRIER ENTERPRISE, WE ARE A LARGE # > >>># WARSHIP OF THE US NAVY. DIVERT YOUR COURSE NOW! # > >>># # > >>># Voice2: This is a lighthouse. Your call. # > >>># # > >>> > > > > o o > / \------------------ Flemming A. Funch ------------------/ \ > / * \ World Transformation/New Civilization/Whole Systems / * \ > / * * \ ffunch@newciv.org / * * \ > o-------o--------- http://newciv.org/worldtrans/ ---------o-------o > > > .- > -- JOE S MOORE joemoore@cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 8 Feb 1996 08:59:32 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: Re: Roofing Domes (fwd) Dawie Venter writes: > From aztec.co.za!cthru.iplan.co.za!iplan.co.za!dawie.venter Thu Feb 8 00:58:48 1996 > Message-Id: <9602080656.AA18883@cthru.iplan.co.za> > From: Dawie Venter > To: joemoore@bbs.cruzio.com > Subject: Re: Roofing Domes > Date: Thu, 08 Feb 96 13:53:52 GMT > > You wrote: > >Does anyone out there manufacture domes out of metal (steel, aluminum) and/or > >synthetic materials (fiberglass, composites)? If so, would they or someone > >else please let us know? > > Not in production yet, but busy setting up to manufacture fibreglass geodesic dome > panels as a do-it yourself project. I am progressing well towards completing the fibreglass > moulds. Very interested to exchange ideas, please E-Mail comments/questions directly to > Dawie.Venter@iplan.co.za. (from: Cape Town South Africa) > > .- > -- JOE S MOORE joemoore@cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 8 Feb 1996 13:47:27 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Smallshaw Subject: Re: BUCKY LURKERS >I'm very interested in geodesic and/or tensegrity house plans. I drew up a >very simple house plan using Adobe Illustrator for a 3-story cabin built >inside a simple tensegrity structure -- six telephone poles as struts; it >looks more like a ship than a house -- at least, that's my wife's feedback >-- and I have no idea how to attach the cables to the ends of the poles in >such a way that would enable the structure to hold its own weight, much >less a housefull of furnishings. But I'd really like to build it, anyway. >jmr > >J. Michael Rowland.................................rowley@telalink.net A 3-story cabin built out of telephone poles! Cool! I have Illustrator, can you send me a copy? Brian Smallshaw ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 8 Feb 1996 13:37:36 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Nick Pine Organization: Villanova University Subject: Re: Skin for greenhouse dome Joe Moore wrote: >Don't know too much about plastics, but I DO know that you should suspend the >skin from the inside of the frame--a dome within a dome--several inches away >from the frame. The interior skin is pulled out toward the outside frame--so >that it won't flap in the wind. Sounds like this would work for a dome... I wonder if one could put the plastic on the outside and put some sort of venturi device at the peak (like a hole :-) to make a slight vacuum inside when the wind blows... Nick ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 8 Feb 1996 13:45:42 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Nick Pine Organization: Villanova University Subject: Re: cold wrote: >misconception about cold: go north go cold > correct: go east go cold. I wonder what you mean by that, Tagdi. It is my impression that the way the earth's atmosphere flows is roughly like this: the sun shines on the equator, which makes the warm air rise, and it is replaced by cooler air that flows towards the equator underneath, from the poles. Meanwhile, the earth is spinning pretty fast at the equator in tangential ground velocity, so the air that slides in from the poles has to speed up as it approaches the equator, while the air that flows upwards from the equaator and makes its way towards the poles has to loses some of its momentum. I wonder if that has to do with what you are saying somehow... Nick ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 8 Feb 1996 14:14:56 GMT Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dawie Venter Organization: Denel Informatics, Cape Regional Office Subject: Eathquakes and geodesic dome structures The earthquake in Los Angeles, during Jan 1994, made almost 25,000 housing units uninhabitable. Does anyone perhaps have information if any geodesic dome structures were within the affected area and how these withstood the tremors. What specific damage did dome structures sustain in comparison to any conventional structures in the immediate vacinity? Any other information about the survivability of dome structures in extreme weather conditions, e.g. snow, high wind, also welcome. Regards David Venter (Cape Town South Africa) ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 8 Feb 1996 18:46:49 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: Re: Skin for greenhouse dome In-Reply-To: <4fdftg$cvr@vu-vlsi.ee.vill.edu>; from "Nick Pine" at Feb 8, 96 1:37 pm Nick Pine writes: > > Joe Moore wrote: > > >Don't know too much about plastics, but I DO know that you should suspend the > >skin from the inside of the frame--a dome within a dome--several inches away > >from the frame. The interior skin is pulled out toward the outside frame--so > >that it won't flap in the wind. > > Sounds like this would work for a dome... I wonder if one could put the > plastic on the outside and put some sort of venturi device at the peak > (like a hole :-) to make a slight vacuum inside when the wind blows... > > Nick > .- > I've also seen designs that pushed the geodesic dome skin out away from the interior geodesic skeleton frame--but that seemed to be a more complicated & expensive design. -- JOE S. MOORE joemoore@cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A ALTERNATE TEL AND/OR FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 USA I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 8 Feb 1996 19:16:08 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: Re: Eathquakes and geodesic dome structures In-Reply-To: <1996Feb8.071714.19071@cthru.iplan.co.za>; from "Dawie Venter" at Feb 8, 96 2:14 pm Dawie Venter writes: > > The earthquake in Los Angeles, during Jan 1994, made almost 25,000 housing > units uninhabitable. > Does anyone perhaps have information if any geodesic dome structures were > within the affected area > and how these withstood the tremors. What specific damage did dome structures > sustain in > comparison to any conventional structures in the immediate vacinity? Any other See Timberline's newsletter "Timberline Express", Spring 1994, page 6, for an article about one of their domes that survived even though it was only 2.5 miles from the epicenter. TLineDomes@aol.com Also, see 2 articles in the Spring 1993 issue of DOME magazine on pages 16-21. They talk about domes that survived earthquakes and hurricanes in other parts of the USA. donh@hoflin.com > information about the > survivability of dome structures in extreme weather conditions, e.g. snow, high > wind, also welcome. Fuller tested fiberglass radomes in winds up to 182 mph; they were designed to withstand 200 mph with static loads up to 220mph. See _Dymaxion World of BF_, pages 61, 204, 209. > > Regards > David Venter (Cape Town South Africa) > .- > -- JOE S. MOORE joemoore@cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A ALTERNATE TEL AND/OR FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 USA I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 8 Feb 1996 19:53:19 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: TENTDOMES & FIBERGLASS DOMES FYI, The book _Geodesics_ by Popko has some excellent drawings that I suspect came directly from Bucky. For tent skins see figures 28-30; for fiberglass domes see figures 33-42. The book was published by the Univ of Detroit School of Architecture, Detroit, MI, USA, and is probably out of print. (in 1968) Also, Dome mag for Winter 1992-3 had an article about a John Kuhtik who produced a Fly's Eye playdome out of fiberglass (pages 4-6). Page 26 had an ad of his with the following address: EMOD, INC. 209 Willow Ave, # 4-E Hoboken, NJ 07030 USA 201-792-6831 I hear that he now has full-size models available for sale using the old molds that Bucky used. See small (26-foot diameter) Fly's Eye in _Critical Path_, page 312-3. -- JOE S. MOORE joemoore@cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A ALTERNATE TEL AND/OR FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 USA I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 8 Feb 1996 20:02:01 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: FLY'S EYE DOMES Re Fly's Eye manufacturer: John Kuhtik's email address is 72740.306@compuserv.com -- JOE S. MOORE joemoore@cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A ALTERNATE TEL AND/OR FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 USA I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 8 Feb 1996 23:33:51 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Smallshaw Subject: Re: Eathquakes and geodesic dome structures There is at least one dome at the top of Mt. Fuji at 3776 metres. I don't have any other information on it, but it has been there for a number of years and is exposed to pretty intense weather. Brian Smallshaw Saltspring Island BC Canada ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 8 Feb 1996 09:01:58 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Re: The Shape of the Universe Bucky dissolved the dilemma of the M-strip, I don't know when, by showing that the same properties apply to a bicycle-tube; of course, whether you consider the torus to be a "manifold" with no thickness, or just a bicycle-tube, changes your results somewhat! ----- "Time is the only dimension." -RBFuller Congecture on "FG#s": Non Compos Mentis!... We return thee to thou couches, Potatoes. ----- On Palmtree BBS: brihut@pro-palmtree.cts.com ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 8 Feb 1996 09:11:59 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Re: Invention Confidentiality Agreement I was going to mention my solution to the glass'n`steel dome problem, but everyone on this list must first sign the Nondisclosure Agreement -- and pay particular attention to "Disclosee irrevocably attorns to the jurisdiction of the Province of Ontario", i.e.the Queen of England!... that's the first that I've seen the verb, attorn -- I'll have to look it up, now. that ad from the R and D and Entrepreneuring outfit was cool, but I had to laugh, when he said that, as his job-prospects dwindled, his interest in enterprising "increased logarithmically", and I had to wonder why I should CARE if he knows all about govt.services in Alabama, til I read hi address in Washington. ----- "Time is the only dimension." -RBFuller Congecture on "FG#s": Non Compos Mentis!... We return thee to thou couches, Potatoes. ----- On Palmtree BBS: brihut@pro-palmtree.cts.com ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 8 Feb 1996 09:28:37 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Re: Skin for greenhouse dome Joe's got a point, about the wind, but wouldn't the suspension from the inside create an equally hairy problem for snowload (the guy from WW college said that it got cold, not if it snowed, wherever he was) ??... so, what is the problem with just wrapping the frame in a spiral of UV-treated polyethylene, which's supposed to last for about 3 years, I think?... starting form the ground, it'd just get more wavy at the top end, which you could ultimately tie-off (with rope or the plastic, itself) at the very top. Vito (?)'s 5/8 dome would keep it from flying off, two! ----- "Time is the only dimension." -RBFuller Congecture on "FG#s": Non Compos Mentis!... We return thee to thou couches, Potatoes. ----- On Palmtree BBS: brihut@pro-palmtree.cts.com ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 8 Feb 1996 10:54:46 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: misc. re James' wooden donuts (strain-relievers), maybe you ought to use 2 for each point of plastic, just to shade if from the sun on the outside ... but maybe, as the max.stress will be on the rim of the inner donut, the outside one should be slightly larger, to cover that ... not sure if it should just be loosely-attached, or with the plastic firmly-sandwiched between the 2 donuts. re James' criticism of the Catenary patent that Joe cited, was the phrase, conical portion(al)s, as used in the patent?... this is curious, as I know of no relation between conics & catenaries, although both are algebraically simple in polar coordination, nor whether cross-sections of the hanging plastic reveal simple catenaries (aargh .-) I'd love to hear more about how Curtis P.gets panels AND struts AND hubs from sheetmetal (the laser-chopping is strictly 2ndary, to me .-) John, what is a "mechanician" -- are you administration, faculty, or do you actually do some work at the U.?? J.Michael, if you don't have any detailed mechanism with which to attach the cables to your 6 telephone-poles, what DO you have? ----- "Time is the only dimension." -RBFuller Congecture on "FG#s": Non Compos Mentis!... We return thee to thou couches, Potatoes. ----- On Palmtree BBS: brihut@pro-palmtree.cts.com ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 9 Feb 1996 13:29:33 CET Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: tagdi@RUULCH.LET.RUU.NL Subject: operative principles operative principles, this might be nonsense. i came i the library, i turned left ellipticaly, again ellipticaly left-turn and i sat in. then i went out stairs to the cafteria, while i was going out i kept sliding elliptically. i opend turning myself inside, i curved with my elliptical curve to continue the ellipse shape of my gravity field. i must have turned few times in the shape of half circles, this morning i am bit disoriented. last night i tuned in to the sky, curved myself to my room, sat in the chair, and tuned in to my book. the cubic houses and rectangular streets and 90 degree edges do exist in the outside, which is partly my inside, but the actual way we move, see and do events are realy geodesical. so i sense some quite strong miscoordination that would be quite hard to correct. this email will be there in different earth location in fraction of a second, you tune in to read it, when you sit in by the screen, and then you still think the earth is flat. i can understand since our cosmology is based on the rong ideas, many theoritical centuries set the mind and hence the coordination on lever against very little operative experience and ideas. tagdi ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 9 Feb 1996 07:33:14 -0600 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: "J. Michael Rowland" Subject: Re: BUCKY LURKERS (fwd) >Hello David Venter & JOE S MOORE, > >It is indeed a great idea to compile all the knowledge on domes and >to create a CDROM of it. Count me in... I have access to a CD-ROM burner. jmr J. Michael Rowland.................................rowley@telalink.net ===========------------------------------------------------=========== |||||||(((( ASCII Text - Your BEST Entertainment Value ))))||||||| ===========------------------------------------------------=========== ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 9 Feb 1996 06:15:12 GMT Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Andy Hermetz Organization: Ohio University, Athens Ohio, USA Subject: You've got my vote on the Geodesic Dome CD-ROM! Hey gang, Sounds like a great idea. I've been messing around with various dome layouts for the last couple of years--mainly on paper, my computer is to be upgrade immediately--and would like any help I could get with the math, layout, other designs, etc. A CD-ROM with all that is currently available doesn't seem like it would be out of the question (there's really not been anything new in the last 5 or 10 years that I'm aware of...) According to the last bulletin I got from the Institute, they'd just gotten a really nice Mac, scanner, and some other goodies. Maybe we should talk to them about arranging to do a couple of projects simulataneously (digitizing the archive, World Game stuff, etc.). I know their always short-staffed, but maybe with could start farming some of this out to those with an interest and the equipment (one of the things I'm planning for in the next year is a good scanner and OCR software). Instead of pitching a Dome CD (which IS a good idea), how about finding some way to get a "Virtual" Buckminster Fuller Institute (yea, I know there's a web page with that name, but it seems fitting for now) going and staff it with those of us on the 'Net, work in cooperation with the "physical" BFI and try and expidite some of the tasks that need doing (personally, I'd like to get set-up so I could do a hypertext version of _Synergetics I & II_ plus add notes, updates [a la Robert Grey], and Amy Edmonson's Reference book too [truly a _Fuller Explaination_]; maybe, with the upcoming gigabyte CD's include basically every Bucky book ever written with hypertext links to connect the myrid of interconnection in Bucky's work. But hey, that's just me thinking out loud...) Andy Hermetz ad238@seorf.ohiou.edu ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 9 Feb 1996 10:00:54 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: James Fischer Subject: Re: misc. Brian Hutchings commented: >re James' criticism of the Catenary patent that Joe cited, >was the phrase, conical portion(al)s, as used in the patent?... >this is curious, as I know of no relation between conics & catenaries, Bucky did use the term "cone", and this surprised me too. Why would he use a simple word that any child would understand when he could make up a new hyphenated term? (just kidding!) The patent says: "...Hyperbolic paraboloid surfaces with conic convergences corresponding to the vertexes of the geodesic tubular frame..." "...this form approximates a cone and for simplicity is sometimes referred to herein as 'conical'. In some instances a truly conical form can be used, so I employ the term 'conical' as including both a true cone and such pryamidal or catenary forms..." The shape looks like a "cone" to me. I don't know better how to describe it to all, without confusing some of the folks who are not geometry freaks. The "peaks" of the "cones" project outward from a "sphere" that is smaller than the dome framework, and each "peak" points at a 5-way or 6-way strut intersection. One is forced to presume that a catenary curve exists between any two strut intersections, but one would BUILD the "tent" from two basic cloth/plastic/whatever patterns: - A Conical piece - A "between cones" piece, (which Bucky called a "diaper" in the text of the patent!) >although both are algebraically simple in polar coordination, >nor whether cross-sections of the hanging plastic reveal simple catenaries Oh, it is simple, is it? Then how does one calculate: 1) The diameter of the proper "cone shape" for any one dome? 2) The size of the "diapers" between each "cone"? 3) The height of each "cone", projected from the spherical form created by the "diapers"? 4) The distance between the strut intersections and the tip of each "cone"? 5) The optimum diameter for the "tent", given a specific dome framework? If you can work all this up, then I will agree that it is "simple". Until then, I will stick to reverse-engineering such math from projects that are known to be successful. No software will ever be able to compress information to the extent a human female does when she merely raises an eyebrow. james fischer jfischer@supercollider.com ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 9 Feb 1996 08:53:30 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: Re: Eathquakes and geodesic dome structures In-Reply-To: ; from "Brian Smallshaw" at Feb 8, 96 11:33 pm Brian Smallshaw writes: > > There is at least one dome at the top of Mt. Fuji at 3776 metres. I don't > have any other information on it, but it has been there for a number of > years and is exposed to pretty intense weather. > > Brian Smallshaw > Saltspring Island BC > Canada > .- In 1965 Japan issued a stamp with a picture of Mt. Fuji with one of Bucky's radomes on the top. See _Buckminster Fuller: An Autobiographical Monologue/Scenario_, page 143. -- JOE S. MOORE joemoore@cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A ALTERNATE TEL AND/OR FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 USA I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 9 Feb 1996 09:15:22 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: Re: BUCKY LURKERS (fwd) In-Reply-To: ; from "J. Michael Rowland" at Feb 9, 96 7:33 am J. Michael Rowland writes: > > >Hello David Venter & JOE S MOORE, > > > >It is indeed a great idea to compile all the knowledge on domes and > >to create a CDROM of it. > > Count me in... I have access to a CD-ROM burner. jmr > > J. Michael Rowland.................................rowley@telalink.net > ===========------------------------------------------------=========== > |||||||(((( ASCII Text - Your BEST Entertainment Value ))))||||||| > ===========------------------------------------------------=========== > .- Any material posted to the Geodesic list is automatically archived by the list server computer and also placed into a database. Quite a bit of material relevant to geodesic domes has accummulated by now. A copy of the database manual detailing how to perform searches can be obtained by sending the following command to the list server computer: INFO LISTDB MEMO The command INFO by itself tells the computer to send you a list of available manuals. -- JOE S. MOORE joemoore@cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A ALTERNATE TEL AND/OR FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 USA I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 9 Feb 1996 09:48:41 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: Re: misc. In-Reply-To: <199602091517.KAA24734@crucible.inmind.com>; from "James Fischer" at Feb 9, 96 10:00 am In _The Domebuilder's Handbook_ on pages 25-30 is a detailed description of how to build a 2 frequency tent dome with an interior plastic skin suspended from an exterior geodesic frame. Also, _Domebook 2_ has detailed instructions on pages 48-9. -- JOE S. MOORE joemoore@cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A ALTERNATE TEL AND/OR FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 USA I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 9 Feb 1996 11:27:37 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Nick Pine Organization: Villanova University Subject: Une serre pour Sylvain / A greenhouse for Sylvain Suppose Sylvain's Quebec greenhouse were a sort of quonset hut, a commercial plastic film structure, with curved galvanized pipes, that looks like this from the top: 100' . --------------------------------------- . | | | . . | An | solar | . . | terre noiratre | closet?| . . | . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . --------| 30' . 13' . | . | . . | As . white?| . . | . | . . --------------------------------------- East--> . . . . . . . . . . . shallow reflecting pool . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . view from the top view from the east On an average December day in Montreal, the outdoor temperature is about 21 F and about 540 Btu/ft^2/day of sun falls on a south-facing wall. This is a not an easy climate for passive solar heating... The reflectors above will augment the sun by about 50%, so the amount of sun that falls on the south side of the greenhouse will be about 810 Btu/ft^2/day. The reflecting pool also keeps vegetation from growing on the south side, which would block the sun. It might be made from a single piece of EPDM rubber, 20' wide x 100' long, costing 30 cents/ft^2. If the glazing were glass, the pool would keep people with lawn mowers at some distance, but better still to avoid mowing at all... And the reflecting pool can collect and store rainwater for use in the greenhouse. How much heat does this greenhouse need to stay warm on an average day in December? Suppose it is a commercial greenhouse, made with curved galvanized pipes on 4' centers and two thin layers of polyethylene film, inflated with a very small blower. This would have a US R-value of 1.2. The curved surface is approximately the shape of a cylinder sliced in half lengthwise, so it has a total area of about PiDL/2 = Pi(30')100'/2 = 5,000 ft^2, divided into north and south roof/walls with An = As = 2,500 ft^2. Let's ignore the east and west endwalls and the floor for now. Suppose the temperature inside the greenhouse is 68 F, 24 hours a day. Then the amount of heat that is needed to keep it warm on an average December day is Eout = 24 (68-21) 5,000 ft^2/R1.2 = 4.7 million Btu/day. Equivalent to about 40 gallons of oil a day. That's one reason people don't build real houses out of plastic film. How much solar heat comes into this greenhouse on an average December day? According to page 64 of the $35 NRAES-33 Greenhouse Engineering book (3rd revision, August 1994, written by Robert A. Aldrich and John W. Bartok, Jr., published by the Northeast Regional Agricultural Engineering Service, 152 Riley-Robb Hall, Cooperative Extension, Ithaca, NY, 14853-5701, (607) 255-7654), poly film has a solar transmission of .92, so two layers should have a solar transmission of about .92 x .92 = .85, and the south- facing wall area of the greenhouse is about 13' high x 100' long, so the total solar energy that enters the greenhouse on an average December day in Montreal will be Ein = .85 x 810 Btu/ft^2/day x 1300 ft^2 = 891,000 Btu, about 20% of what is needed to keep this greenhouse warm... Hmmm. How about putting some insulation in the north wall? Suppose we somehow slip 3 1/2" of R13 foil-faced fiberglass insulation inside the double poly film pillow of the north wall, with the foil side facing into the greenhouse. That way, sun is reflected down from the north side, so the plants will grow fairly straight rather than always leaning towards the sun ("heliotropism.") We could paint the outside of the north plastic film white to make it last a long time. Then the daily heat requirement of the greenhouse becomes Eout = 24 (68-21) (2500/R1.2 + 2500/R13) = 1128 (2083 + 192) = 1128 (2275) = 2.6 million Btu/day, equivalent to about 22 gallons of oil a day. Better, but still about 3 times more than the available solar heat. Hmmm. Let's lower the temperature of the greenhouse at night, to, say 48 F. Then, if the December day is only 6 hours long, Eout = (6 (68-21) + 18 (48-21)) 2275 = (282 + 486) 2275 = 1.75 million Btu. Better, but still about twice as much heat as the sun will supply. Well, how about a beadwall? (Or perhaps a soap bubble wall?) If we screw on 1x2 wood strips to the inside and outside curves of the 1.66" galvanized pipes, and cover the strips with a layer of thin flat polycarbonate plastic on both sides ($5,000 worth, but it should last at least 10 years), with some butyl tape and a 1/2" x 1/8" aluminum cap strip on the outside, and fill the 3.17" cavity it with R3.5/inch polystyrene beads at night, that will give the south wall an R-value of 3.17 x 3.5 = 11 at night, so Eout = 6 (68-21) 2500/R1.2 = 588K Btu south wall, daytime + 18 (48-21) 2500/R11 = 110K Btu south wall, nightime + 6 (68-21) 2500/R13 = 54K Btu north wall, daytime + 18 (48-21) 2500/R13 = 93K Btu north wall, nightime, --------- = 845K Btu/day. OK. This is slightly less than the average solar input of 891K, so we can probably make this work. There is still a large heat loss through the south wall during the day, but this IS a greenhouse... If we somehow made it taller, we could collect more solar heat in the winter. Or perhaps we should leave the beadwall closed and turn on some grow-lights when the sun is dim, or before dawn or after dark in December, like Rudy Behrens does, ie 10 watts per square foot of high pressure sodium lights. This would add some backup heat. And in order to actually grow, vs just stay dormant in winter, plants need a longer day. With this sort of backup heat, we could probably keep this greenhouse at 68 F, 24 hours a day, which is desirable for some plants, like poinsettias. Keeping them warmer at night makes them round and bushy, vs thin and tall. Maybe this is the thing to do in Quebec, where hydroelectric power is not too expensive... BTW, I wonder if we could make this a bubble wall instead of a beadwall? Steve Baer says he's tried this with solar collectors, and bubbles transmit lots of light, in fact they even reduce the reflective losses from the glazing, by serving as an index matching fluid :-) so perhaps the bubble wall should stay in place during the day, too... But Steve also says the walls of the bubbles themselves are so thin that they don't block much radiation heat loss, so the bubbles wouldn't be great insulators for a solar collector, with a high temperature inside. But it seems to me that they might work well for a greenhouse, with a low temperature inside... Steve said someone else built a bubble wall beadwall, and published the results, and Steve was surprised at how good an insulator their bubbles were. A couple of possible problems with this approach are that the bubbles might collapse on themselves by gravity if the bubble column were more than a few feet tall, or that we might have to pump so much air and bubble water through the glazing that that mass flow would collect and transfer the heat from the inside glazing to the outside glazing, making the bubble wall a poor insulator, but Steve didn't think those would be serious problems. Perhaps the bubble wall thickness and insulating value, especially for radiation insulation, depends on the composition of the soapy water used to make them. There may be a happy medium, some nice combination of soap, detergent, glycerin, oils, dyes, etc., that will make for good shortwave solar transmission and poor longwave IR heat transmission, a good "greenhouse effect," or high-pass filtering effect, like glass. Perhaps the bubble liquid should have one composition by day and another by night. Transparent bubbles by day and opaque bubbles by night. That would not be hard to arrange. This would be an interesting science fair project, that would not require a lot of equipment to do. Making a bubble wall with polyethylene film might be a problem as far as the film life goes. Consider this quote from the CT Film application note on page I-8 of the 95-96 Stuppy Greenhouse catalog ((800) 877-5025): Soap or detergent should not be left on film. If film is washed with soap or detergent, it is recommended that immediately thereafter the film be well but carefully rinsed with water. Do not use soap containing "Pine Oil" or other solvents. Is this only a problem when the soapy liquid dries, or does the plastic degrade if it is always wet? I don't know. CT Film's sales engineer Warren Manning at (517) 423-675 may know, or he may know a chemist who knows. It would be very exciting (to me :-) if someone could make a good plastic film bubblewall. "Doing more with less," as Bucky Fuller used to say. "Pathologically frugal," my friends might say. A 4 mil thick x 32' wide x 100' long roll of polyethylene greenhouse film with a 3 year guarantee costs about $140, about 4 cents per square foot. It is recyclable, and if one uses alumimum extrusion clamps to attach it, only at the edges of the structure (this costs about 60 cents per linear foot), changing the plastic film every three years is not much harder than changing a bedsheet, on a calm day :-) BTW, Stuppy also sells a product called "Varishade 2," which turns white when it is dry and transparent when it is damp. This is a permanent product, meant to be painted on plastic films. That's another way to control solar intensity and heat losses. Poly film has almost no "greenhouse effect," unlike glass. It loses a lot of heat by longwave IR transmission (77%.) Beadwall inventor Dave Harrison suggests NOT making a beadwall out of poly film, because if the film rips or tears, the 660 ft^3 of beads that get loose may be very unpopular with the neighbors, altho they are biodegradable, as I recall. Perhaps one could make a good beadwall with a layer of polycarbonate film on the outside and a layer of polyethylene film on the inside... Anyhow, the beads cost on the order of $1/ft^3, and they would fill up 78 55 gallon drums at 8.4 ft^3 per drum, or a row along the south side, about 50 drums deep by 2 drums high, and one would need 50 vacuum cleaner motors to make all this work, if one followed the well-proven Beadwall design. They would want to be sequenced in operation, because altho they would only operate a few minutes per day, the motors use 7 Amps each... A more interesting but difficult to design alternative would have only one or two vacuum cleaner motors and some holes between the drums to make a common bead store. So, what would this finally look like? The greenhouse would be 6' off the ground, sitting on top of a row of drums stacked 2-high, on each of the long sides. The drums along the south side would be welded together and filled with beads, or perhaps a lot less bubble water, and the north side of the greenhouse would have a solar closet holding up the north benches, consisting of drums stacked 2-high and perhaps 1-deep, ie 100 drums full of water, which would have a layer of fiberglass insulation on the south side, then an airspace, then a 4' layer of polycarbonate outside of that. This might also be fed with a fan that brings down some warm air from an air heater above on a sunny day. The aisle down the middle of the greenhouse might be filled with an air duct made from 55 gallon drums welded together end to tend, laid sideways, with their tops and bottoms removed, with dirt and gravel on top to make a smooth and elevated walking surface, 4' below the benches. During the day, warm air from the peak of the greenhouse might be blown down and through this duct with one or two fans, to store that heat during the day. The north benches might as well be supported by 55 gallon drums as well, in a peninsular layout with another 200 drums, inside the bead drums. They would add some desirable thermal mass to the greenhouse, but they wouldn't store much heat, since they would be at the average greenhouse temperature. Surrounding them with a polyethylene skirt and blowing some warm air down from the peak of the greenhouse during the day would make them into a lower temperature solar closet. What would the average drumwater temperature have to be to store heat for 5 cloudy days in a row? We have 300 drums, ie about 150,000 pounds of water here (vs the 200 drums full of water that David Boyer and I put into his 2,000 ft^2 poinsettia greenhouse last fall, near Philadelphia), so the drums will store 150,000 Btu per degree F above the greenhouse temperature. With the beadwall closed, at 48 F, 24 hours a day, the greenhouse needs 24 hours (48-21) (2500/R11 + 2500/R13) = 272K Btu/day to stay warmish inside, so the average drumwater temperature has to be at least 48 + 5 x 272K/150K = 57 F. This seems very doable. The outer layer of drums on the north and south sides should be insulated, eg with 3 1/2" of fiberglass insulation, covered with poly film. The north insulation should be dark on the outside, with an airspace under the glazing. Nick ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 9 Feb 1996 10:53:38 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: curtis palmer Subject: Sheet Metal Domes Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Bill Delphenich Organization: PCNet -- Public Access Internet in Connecticut! Subject: Re: Bucky Documentary > I'll just say > that -- if your report is accurate -- yet another opportunity has been lost > to present Bucky's work as more than a "curiosity point in the history of > American inventors." That's a very good point. The anniversary of RBF last year got me thinking about his impact on me. I remember there was a lot of talk here about his inventions. Some people were even going so far as to imply that since we are not driving Dymaxion cars home every night to geodesic dome houses, that RBF was therefore a failure as an inventor! GIVE ME A BREAK! Talk about missing the forest for the trees! Eventually I realized that, more than any other single person I encountered at that impressionable age, RBF taught me how to think. The direction that he sent me in back in the '60's is still the direction I'm going and the way has only improved with age and is widening more every day. ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 9 Feb 1996 07:34:21 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Bill Delphenich Organization: PCNet -- Public Access Internet in Connecticut! Subject: Posting problems How do you post to this group? Everything I send gets bounced. ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 9 Feb 1996 19:09:27 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: Re: Bucky Documentary In-Reply-To: <311B3E86.53FE@pcnet.com>; from "Bill Delphenich" at Feb 9, 96 7:31 am Bill Delphenich writes: > > I'll just say > > that -- if your report is accurate -- yet another opportunity has been lost > > to present Bucky's work as more than a "curiosity point in the history of > > American inventors." > That's a very good point. > The anniversary of RBF last year got me thinking about his impact on me. I > remember there was a lot of talk here about his inventions. Some people were > even going so far as to imply that since we are not driving Dymaxion cars > home every night to geodesic dome houses, that RBF was therefore a failure > as an inventor! > GIVE ME A BREAK! Talk about missing the forest for the trees! > Eventually I realized that, more than any other single person I encountered > at that impressionable age, RBF taught me how to think. The direction that > he sent me in back in the '60's is still the direction I'm going and the way > has only improved with age and is widening more every day. I think he caused a lot of us to change course. -- JOE S. MOORE joemoore@cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A ALTERNATE TEL AND/OR FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 USA I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 10 Feb 1996 00:41:53 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Steve Brant Subject: Re: Bucky Documentary & "Thinking" >Eventually I realized that, more than any other single person I >encountered at >that >impressionable age, RBF taught me how to think. Bucky's daughter, Allegra, told me once that teaching children "critical path thinking" was one of the most important things a child could learn to do. Bucky influenced *how* I think as much as he influenced *what* I think. I'll never forget the "Integrity Day" he did in NYC in 1983. "Only integrity is going to count. . ." was the way it was promoted. The full quote that was given away on the back of a t-shirt was: "Human Integrity is the uncompromising courage of self determining whether or not to take initiatives, support or cooperate with others in accord with all truth and nothing but the truth as it is conceived of by the divine mind always present in each individual." (Please allow for the brief editorial which follows.) Now, if the Simon & Goodman film could only capture *this* essence of Bucky, it might be a useful "tool" or "artifact" for the future (not the past) of humanity. - Steve ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 9 Feb 1996 09:04:55 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Re: Invention Confidentiality Agreement it could be just a game of two-sided Vish, "Attorn, v., what an attorney doth" and "Attorney, n., one who attorns" so, just let bigons be bigons -- even if suspiciously M-strippy! PS, I wasn't dyssing Alabamians! ----- "Time is the only dimension." -RBFuller Congecture on "FG#s": Non Compos Mentis!... We return thee to thou couches, Potatoes. ----- On Palmtree BBS: brihut@pro-palmtree.cts.com ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 10 Feb 1996 10:32:54 CET Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: tagdi@RUULCH.LET.RUU.NL Subject: Re: cold In Message Thu, 08 Feb 1996 13:45:42 -0500, Nick Pine writes: > wrote: >>misconception about cold: go north go cold >> correct: go east go cold. > >I wonder what you mean by that, Tagdi. It is my impression that the way >the earth's atmosphere flows is roughly like this: the sun shines on >the equator, which makes the warm air rise, and it is replaced by >cooler air that flows towards the equator underneath, from the poles. >Meanwhile, the earth is spinning pretty fast at the equator in tangential >ground velocity, so the air that slides in from the poles has to speed up >as it approaches the equator, while the air that flows upwards from the >equaator and makes its way towards the poles has to loses some of its >momentum. I wonder if that has to do with what you are saying somehow... > >Nick In education automation fuller writes: "in Europe you will find that the spectrum of thermal-zone lines runs north and south, contrary to the "go north go cold,go south go warm"fixation. the hottest place in Europe is spain, and Europe gets colder as we go east, not north. Napoleon, thinking as everybody does, that when you stay in your home latitude you will have about the same temperature and weather,went east into Russia prepared to find conditions smiliar to his home conditions. He was licked by the cold. He dissipated enormous amounts of energy against the cold, the great negative of energy. you would think that by the time Hitler cam along men would have learned somthing about this thermal map. they had not, and Hitler,too, went east into Russia. He was licked logistically by the unexpected magnitude of cold. For an instance, he did not have the right locomotive greases for the temperatures that his army ran into. as a consequence of the thermal ignorance, his forces were not properly supplied, and their hitting power was dissipated by the cold. the cold turned Hitler's tide. this was due, then, to the fact that concept of go north to cold is wrong. this is ignorance again typical of the educational falllacies. i am sure that parents are still going to teach this geographical error to their children, but the fact is that where 76% of humanity now exists it is "go east,go cold" and in only 24% of the world's land is "go north go cold, go south go warm" true " tagdi ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 10 Feb 1996 00:05:50 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Anthony Kalenak Organization: The Pipeline Subject: Re: Roofing Domes I think you have hit upon one of the primary reasons that we don't see more domes. No one has applied mass production and late 20th century manufacturing techniques to dome constuction. We should build domes the way we build cars, with similar finishes. glasing, closure techniques, payment plans, ancilary amenities, etc. I think the general public will then repond favorably to domes . ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 10 Feb 1996 11:37:39 CET Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: tagdi@RUULCH.LET.RUU.NL Subject: Re: Bucky Documentary & "Thinking" there is a page about world game, but i think you cant actually play the game. i thik it is possible to install the game where in fact you can play it, any comment. i think what you need is vidos for education, computers are in some ways are hindrence to learning- no body can explain how things work. I talked with Mr Arthur Lob about putting what he know in vido, he thought it was complex and that it was not possible at this time. i wonder if it is so, since you do not have to have perfect videos in the beginning, just when the vido eduction is going to start. the effort of the people who are intrested is fragmented, may be we have to think more clearly and energetically, the problem is that every one is tuned to different thing becuse of what the know best. we have to know the same thing to do somthing about somthing, you know what i mean. may be you need a sort of a certain level curriculum for people to join in a project. so far the geometry is not moving very fast, and the reason is no body is teaching it, or no one have access to a vido. for example i talked with gerald about making video, but everybody have a perfect idea of video. i think it can be doen casually, anybody who have knowlge like Mr Hart should immidiatly explain the staff in video. we must have incredible resources if anyone need to advance. and this not only for geometry but for anything else. Tagdi p.s i found a good book about writing, so this year i will try to improve my english. what a mistake, but i had my pathalogical reasons. this book is very good one, i will post the title next time. the problem with writing is how to make sentences and not as much the problem of spelling, those who complaine carry an old sendrom of being annoyed without knowing why. there are a lot of romurs in the world, and much of the confusion comes from opinions, i am just talking about myths no intention to complaine. ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 10 Feb 1996 11:46:14 CET Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: tagdi@RUULCH.LET.RUU.NL Subject: Re: Bucky Documentary & "Thinking" In Message Sat, 10 Feb 1996 00:41:53 -0500, Steve Brant writes: >>Eventually I realized that, more than any other single person I >encountered >at >>that >>impressionable age, RBF taught me how to think. > >Bucky's daughter, Allegra, told me once that teaching children "critical path >thinking" was one of the most important things a child could learn to do. > >Bucky influenced *how* I think as much as he influenced *what* I think. I'll >never forget the "Integrity Day" he did in NYC in 1983. "Only integrity is >going to count. . ." was the way it was promoted. > >The full quote that was given away on the back of a t-shirt was: > >"Human Integrity is the uncompromising courage of self determining whether or >not to take initiatives, support or cooperate with others in accord with all >truth and nothing but the truth as it is conceived of by the divine mind >always present in each individual." > >(Please allow for the brief editorial which follows.) > >Now, if the Simon & Goodman film could only capture *this* essence of Bucky, >it might be a useful "tool" or "artifact" for the future (not the past) of >humanity. > >- Steve it is good idea. Bucky have the power to excite and engage and i might even say to get the blood moving. i just want to say that somtimes i might overestmate my capacity, or responsibility, the other way is to be rational and cool about it. and speaking the truth to whome, there are some area of ambiguity there. Tagdi ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 10 Feb 1996 11:39:23 GMT Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Raffaele De Angelis Subject: Non lurking Hello Everybody, I want to be a non-lurker for a while, therefore I am posting this image, which is a 3D model of the Dymaxion House 4D I did when I was at school I might post the DXF file too, if someone would like it. Raffaele De Angelis ra.deangelis@agora.stm.it begin 644 dymax.jpg M_]C_X``02D9)1@`!`````0`!``#__@`V26UA9V5C;VYV97)S:6]N;&EB2P@5RX@5VEE9&UA;FXL(#`H,#0Y*3`"@`,`(0`! 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M@6!;_P`=!KCGI[2'=7^_3]/Q*70T-M&*["1-M&V@`VTNV@`VT;:`$VT;:`%V MTFV@`VT;:`#;2[:`.;\=VGVGX?Z@O]Q5D'_`6!_E7A@2OA.*(_[3%_W?U9M2 MV)8TRZBMW0L+JZ9[J17SL2:OPLZK*TORUL>>.PM4=1/RK$OU-)[#CN/\.PEO M$EMZ#&M0ML?ZRW M=1]=IQ7SSLKXOBJ/[RG+R9K3V)X(_G^E:5A^[OHV^O\`*OEXBGL;GVBGB?WJ M[G'RCQ-377>Q8T"2L:OAF'_B?*DY_#M6EQ71'8Y);F[X8&+B=O91_.NUM1FWS[U]%P]'_:%Z,BG_ M`!";;2[:^X.H3;2[:`$VT;:`%VT8H`-M)MH`-M+MH`-M&V@`VT8H`3;1MH`- MM&V@!=M&V@`VT;:`#;1MH`-M)MH`7;1MH`3;2[:`$VTNV@`VTF*`)=M&V@!= MM)B@`VTNV@!-M&*+`+MHVT`&VC;0`;:3;0`NVC;0`8I,4`+MI-M`"[:3;0`; M:-M`!MHVT`&VC;0`;:-M`!MHV\4`&VC;0`;:\8^(MOY'CFX8#`EC23],?TKY MWB:-\(GV:_)EPW.,9ZA=_E-?"&MC,67FKEH/M%U'"O\`$<5S('L=PDH2-47A M5&`/:GBXKL.&QU'A1MT<[?[0'Y9KO;-?]"3WYKZ;AM?OF_+]412^-D^VEVU] MH=(;:3;0`;:-M(`VT;>*8"[:3;0`;:-M`!MHVT`&VEVT`)MI=M`";:-M`!MH MVT`&VEVT`)MI=M`";:-M`!MHVT`&*-M`!MI=M`!MI-M`$VVC;0`FVEVT`)MI M=M`";:7%`!MI-M`!MHVT:`&VC;0`NVC;0`;:-M`";:7;0`FVEVT`&VDVT`+M MI-M`!MHVT`&VC;0`NVDVT`+MHVT`)MKR?XLP"+6[.ZQCS+PVK6-/<538WA<^].%S[UO M&5[\GY&-->^R7;2[:^P-PVT;:`$ MVT;:`%VTFV@`VT;:`%VTFV@!=M)MH`-M&VC0!=M)MH`-M&V@`VTNV@!-M&V@ M`VTNV@!-M&V@`VT;:`#;1MH`7;2;:`#;1MHT`EVT;:`#;1MH`-M&*`#%&V@` MVT;:`#;1B@`VT8H`,4N*`$VT;:`#%&*`#%&V@`VT;:`#%&*`#;1MH`-M+MH` M3;1MH`7%)MH`-M>:_&&W_P")+IUUCE96CS_O`'_V6O*SN/-@:B]/S14-SQUN ME0/7YL=*,`MBX<>C$5T%I*(+5(Q^/UK&.C"HM+%D7=/%U[UI"]YL7;1MKZDT#;1MH`-M&V@` MQ2[:`$Q1MH`,48H`-M&V@`Q1MH`,4;:`#%&V@`Q1MH`-M&*`#;2[:`$VT8H` 3-M&V@`Q1MH`-M&V@`Q1MH`#_V0#_ ` end sum -r/size 11331/41824 ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 10 Feb 1996 08:58:11 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: Re: Posting problems In-Reply-To: <311B3F4D.2225@pcnet.com>; from "Bill Delphenich" at Feb 9, 96 7:34 am Bill Delphenich writes: > > How do you post to this group? Everything I send gets bounced. > .- You're getting through to the Geodesic list (see your message above). If you're getting only one bounce, then it's probably a problem with only one subscriber to the list. If you got about 150 bounces, then it would be a problem with everyone on the list. In other words, your message wasn't getting through at all. This happened to me once and after a week or so the problem went away (I don't know how.) Post away and ignore the bounce notices. -- JOE S. MOORE joemoore@cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A ALTERNATE TEL AND/OR FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 USA I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 10 Feb 1996 09:01:35 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: NetDay '96 (fwd) Flemming Funch writes: > From netcom7.netcom.com!newciv.org!ffunch Fri Feb 9 22:04:09 1996 > Message-Id: > Mime-Version: 1.0 > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > Date: Fri, 9 Feb 1996 21:38:37 -0800 > To: Wholeinfo-l@netcom.com > From: Flemming Funch > Subject: NetDay '96 (fwd) > > >Date: Thu, 8 Feb 1996 23:10:30 -0800 > >From: Susan Evoy > >To: "Multiple recipients of list cpsr-announce@cpsr.org" > > > > >Date: Thu, 8 Feb 1996 16:28:59 -0800 > >From: Jay.Backstrand@Eng.Sun.COM (Jay Backstrand [CONTRACTOR]) > > > >On NetDay96, March 9, 1996, a hundred thousand volunteers in > >California will go to twelve thousand schools in California, and > >install the same Category 5 wire we use in all California business > >local area networks. We will connect five classrooms and the library > >to a central closet, in preparation for connection to the Internet. > >This is a barnraising, a kickstart for networking in the schools. > > > >Every high tech employee in California should be involved. Every > >contractor for a high tech company should be involved. > >Anyone--employee, customer, or supplier-- that you can think of who > >believes linking our children to the Internet is a good idea should be > >involved. > > > >What do you do? Go to www.netday96.com, find a school, and volunteer > >to help put that school on the Internet on March 9. Go to that school > >on Saturday, March 9, and help ten other people pull wire from five > >classrooms and a library or computer lab to a central closet--you don't > >need any particular expertise. That's it. You can choose a school from > >the twelve thousand home pages created on a server at the Well: > >www.netday96.com. All schools, private or public, are there; if it has > >more than ten children in a classroom, it's a school--if you don't see > >your school, mail netday@kqed.org and NetDay will put up a home page > >for you. > > > >As NetDay approaches, you will see pages go up for every company in > >California supporting NetDay, together with the count of participants > >from each company. > > > >We're jumpstarting the schools. Our goal is to bring every school in > >California past the first barrier to access: interior wiring. We then > >use the new capability in the schools to persuade the carriers to > >provide Internet access. And it's working. > > > >We now have commitments from MCI, Netcom, and ATT to provide free > >dialup a ccess to the Internet for every school in California. Higher > >bandwidth will come next. > > > >We've talked the vendors into creating NetDay Kits that they will ship > >directly to the schools. A standard kit, with two to three thousand > >feet of Cat 5 wire, jacks, a 24-way patch panel, connectors, and cable > >ties will cost between $350 and $500. Pacific Bell is sponsoring 1,000 > >kits. Small electrical contractors are sponsoring two or three > >schools. Individual parents are sponsoring schools. You can. Your > >district office can. All details are at the NetDay web site: > >www.netday96.com. > > > >Please sign up now. > > > >Our first need is to show a groundswell of volunteers. We announced > >NetDay in San Francisco on January 19, at a school wired by Sun and > >3Com employees on Volunteer Day in November. Vice President Gore > >arrived to praise the volunteers, and thank all California > >high-technology companies participating in NetDay. Volunteering has > >taken off, but we need to reach ten thousand in the next week or two. > > > >Please volunteer today. > > > >This Web site is the first use of the World Wide Web to organize a mass > >volunteer event. Please help make it a success. > > > >Please mail this request to anyone on your mailing lists. Please ask > >all webmasters to put a pointer to www.netday96.com on their home > >page. We are organizing this in a totally decentralized way, using the > >Web. This is the first time this has been tried, and I believe the Net > >can do it. > > > >We can do it. > > > .- > -- JOE S. MOORE joemoore@cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A ALTERNATE TEL AND/OR FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 USA I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 10 Feb 1996 09:16:24 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: Re: Bucky Documentary & "Thinking" In-Reply-To: <41875.tagdi@ruulch.let.ruu.nl>; from "tagdi@RUULCH.LET.RUU.NL" at Feb 10, 96 11:37 am Tagdi, Why don't you use a spelling checker program? Just a friendly suggestion--I think your english has greatly improved in the last year. Keep up the good work. Joe -- JOE S. MOORE joemoore@cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A ALTERNATE TEL AND/OR FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 USA I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 10 Feb 1996 09:24:13 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: Re: Non lurking In-Reply-To: <199602101143.LAA25596@agora.stm.it>; from "Raffaele De Angelis" at Feb 10, 96 11:39 am Could you give us a little more detail about your Dymax House project? For example where, when, how, cost, people's reaction to it, etc, etc? Other than Bucky's model, yours is the only other one that seems to exist. Do you still have it? -- JOE S. MOORE joemoore@cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A ALTERNATE TEL AND/OR FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 USA I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 10 Feb 1996 15:43:24 GMT Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Tom Rentz/Sun Wind Concepts Organization: InternetMCI Subject: Re: Une serre pour Sylvain / A greenhouse for Sylvain nick@vu-vlsi.ee.vill.edu (Nick Pine) wrote: >Nick, I am always impressed by the support of mathematical information in your postings. What would happen if you considered using insulated earth as the storage medium? For example: 2 layers Formular = R20, damp earth weight 33% heavier than water, polyethylene 1" tubing as coiled heat exchanger buried in the earth (insulation on all sides of the earth), blowers, small low current draw, on the order of 27 cu.ft.min to circulate the air through the tubing.........can be used as heat collector in day, and heat extractor at night. Can you run some of your imaginative scenarios in conjunction with this idea: Suppose you didn't need the heat for the greenhouse in the winter (just spring), but diverted it to heat your home at night (subtract losses through greenhouse). > Suppose Sylvain's Quebec greenhouse were a sort of quonset hut, a commercial > plastic film structure, with curved galvanized pipes, that looks like this > from the top: > > 100' . > ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 10 Feb 1996 10:50:56 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Smallshaw Subject: Re: Roofing Domes >I think you have hit upon one of the primary reasons that we don't see more >domes. >No one has applied mass production and late 20th century manufacturing >techniques to dome constuction. We should build domes the way we build >cars, with similar finishes. glasing, closure techniques, payment plans, >ancilary amenities, etc. I think the general public will then repond >favorably to domes . Absolutely. ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 10 Feb 1996 14:17:56 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: Re: Roofing Domes In-Reply-To: ; from "Brian Smallshaw" at Feb 10, 96 10:50 am Brian Smallshaw writes: > > >I think you have hit upon one of the primary reasons that we don't see more > >domes. > >No one has applied mass production and late 20th century manufacturing > >techniques to dome constuction. We should build domes the way we build > >cars, with similar finishes. glasing, closure techniques, payment plans, > >ancilary amenities, etc. I think the general public will then repond > >favorably to domes . > > Absolutely. I agree 100% also. Like "mobile" homes only domes, with latest technology in materials, manufacturing processes, etc. Either in kit form or fully assembled. Double shells for storage between of water and compressed air. -- JOE S. MOORE joemoore@cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A ALTERNATE TEL AND/OR FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 USA I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 10 Feb 1996 10:44:24 GMT Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: ECO Organization: ECO Subject: New raster GIS approaches developed, look for contacts with specialists A new theory and elevation matrices treatment sowtware developed. They form "intellectual GIS" for geoecological, geological and water resources research tasks decision. The GIS able to work both with relief-dependent calculation (raster maps of specific catchment and dispersive area, subwatersheds, gradient, aspect, curvatures,..., stored as matrices), and with usual vector GIS data (thematic maps, rivers,... stored as lines). They are used to solve geoecological (karst processes evaluation, ground water vulnerability, contaminants redistribution prediction,...), geological (lineaments and central type structures decoding,...), for soil science. ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 10 Feb 1996 10:43:16 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Re: misc. I was just referring to the simplicity of the (planar) catenaries and conics; as you quoted, the "cones" are only "approx.", and I actually doubt that there more than a few catenary (or conical) sections in each trigonal (or whatever) domain of the tent, if any, but cones can be made from flat cloth, although I guess that the (spherical?) diapers would have to be made from triga.... in other words, you can't assume that the 2D chain-hanging shape automatically goes into sagging soapfilms! likewise, the use of "hyperbolic paraboloid, although certainly a 3D (and infinite) shape, is probably not correct, whereas the name, Catenary, is more suggestive. ----- "Time is the only dimension." -RBFuller Congecture on "FG#s": Non Compos Mentis!... We return thee to thou couches, Potatoes. ----- On Palmtree BBS: brihut@pro-palmtree.cts.com ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 10 Feb 1996 11:05:23 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Re: Une serre pour Sylvain / A greenhouse for Sylvain um what was that, about the bubbles adjusting the index of refraction (?) ?? ----- "Time is the only dimension." -RBFuller Congecture on "FG#s": Non Compos Mentis!... We return thee to thou couches, Potatoes. ----- On Palmtree BBS: brihut@pro-palmtree.cts.com ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 10 Feb 1996 11:14:37 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Re: Sheet Metal Domes I don't quite grok the Way of Bending, Curtis; how can we get a write-up with diagrams? ----- "Time is the only dimension." -RBFuller Congecture on "FG#s": Non Compos Mentis!... We return thee to thou couches, Potatoes. ----- On Palmtree BBS: brihut@pro-palmtree.cts.com ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 10 Feb 1996 11:50:27 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Re: cold that quote o'Bucky just goes to show that (maybe) some things shouldn't be quoted!... I mean, he's probably correct about Napoleon's & Hitler's provinciality, but Chinese folks have to go West to get colder, faster; more generally, as the dictum about going-north-getting-colder is quite true in this hemisphere, you'd have (starting in, say, Biejing) to go somehow northwesterly, as well as "up", and your direction-of-travel- to-get-coldest (Hitler's dumber brother?) would change constantly (and often, clearly, you'd have to go back "down" .-) and , now, a bitch: please, when you're going to quote an entire posting that many of us will have just read, try to Insert Your Comments BEFORE that, so that we can skip the re-hash; thank you!... on my editor, it only requires a couple of extra steps to defeat the default, which is to append my comments to the end of the thing-quoted (.edit ... insert at 1 (or 0)). ----- "Time is the only dimension." -RBFuller Congecture on "FG#s": Non Compos Mentis!... We return thee to thou couches, Potatoes. ----- On Palmtree BBS: brihut@pro-palmtree.cts.com ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 10 Feb 1996 11:56:21 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Re: Roofing Domes what you say about mfg.of domes akin to mfg.of cars is just what Bucky saith, although he (of course) uses the aircraft industry as his paradigmatic basis ... but, on the other hand, the air (or "the" road, for that matter) is a much-more homogenous medium than the siting of any particular house/dome. so, should we really be more concerend with techniques of siting, and design of reproducible elements of building, that are useful for all sorts of designing? ----- "Time is the only dimension." -RBFuller Congecture on "FG#s": Non Compos Mentis!... We return thee to thou couches, Potatoes. ----- On Palmtree BBS: brihut@pro-palmtree.cts.com ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 11 Feb 1996 07:31:25 GMT Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Ross Keatinge Organization: Internet ProLink NZ, Auckland Subject: Re: Ships in the night (fwd) Thanks Joe and Flemming. As well as amusing, this is actually quite relevant to this list. A day after reading this I was listening to a tape of "The 7 habits of highly effective people" by Stephen R Covey. He related a similar story, and commented that "lighthouses are correct principles, they don't move". In Bucky language it would be "Lighthouses are generalised principles, they don't move". Regards to all.... -- Ross Keatinge rossk@iprolink.co.nz Auckland, New Zealand ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 11 Feb 1996 03:00:59 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Nick Pine Organization: Villanova University Subject: Re: Une serre pour Sylvain / A greenhouse for Sylvain Tom Rentz/Sun Wind Concepts wrote: >What would happen if you considered using insulated earth as the >storage medium? For example: 2 layers Formular = R20, damp earth weight >33% heavier than water, Roger Williams (willm@nbnet.nb.ca) likes the idea of earth tubes for heat storage. He built a large hydroponic tomato greenhouse in New Brunswick that works this way. If you can somehow keep the earth around the store dry, the dry earth may be fine insulation. It seems to me that an EPDM-rubber lined trench along the north side of the greenhouse would be a good heat store, if it were filled with water or sand and water, and perhaps illuminated by concentrated sun from an overhead parabolic reflective greenhouse, as in Howard Reichmuth's (reichm@aol.com) Ecotope greenhouse built in Seattle 20 years ago. The trench insulation might be 6" of dirt under the EPDM, kept dry by a vapor barrier underneath. >polyethylene 1" tubing as coiled heat exchanger You mean 1 foot? 1 inch seems pretty small. >buried in the earth (insulation on all sides of the earth), blowers, >small low current draw, on the order of 27 cu.ft.min to circulate the air >through the tubing.........can be used as heat collector in day, and heat >extractor at night. 27 cfm sounds pretty low too. That moves about 27 Btu/hour/degree F of air temperature difference. >Can you run some of your imaginative scenarios in conjunction with this idea: >Suppose you didn't need the heat for the greenhouse in the winter >(just spring), but diverted it to heat your home at night (subtract losses >through greenhouse). Sounds interesting. To do imaginative scenarios, we would want to know where the house is, how big and well insulated it is, how big the greenhouse is, etc. The greenhouse would want to be very close to the house to make this work well, so the heat is easy to transport using water or air. Incidentally, Sylvain's greenhouse could easily have another 600 drums in the middle holding up benches, making a total of 200 tons of water, which would not only keep it from blowing off of a (strong) flat roof of a building, say, but reduce the average drum temperature requirement to just 51 F. Nick ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 11 Feb 1996 14:36:28 CET Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: tagdi@RUULCH.LET.RUU.NL Subject: education operative principles, relations, and special cases are the foundation of comprehensive learning. this means that we can dispense with books as linear composite, and skip to the area we are seeking. books which are full of theoritical material are not inhancing to such an approach. we somtimes may read only 10 pages of a book, from another book 2 chapters. another suggestion is to make a list of operative ideas one wants to learn about, and ask which idea shoud i consider first. there are a lot of area about learning that one has to discover, it may take some time and invistigation. but humorous hint might go like this: whenever you observe or read a pattren of imminent or important consern to the understanding of reality and the sucess of humanity you will hear pavlo bell. Tagdi ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 11 Feb 1996 03:48:29 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Nick Pine Organization: Villanova University Subject: Re: Une serre pour Sylvain / A greenhouse for Sylvain Brian Hutchings wrote: >um what was that, about the bubbles adjusting the index of refraction (?) This is a little bit like a matching film to reduce reflection in optics or transmission lines. The matching section should ideally be 1/4 wave long and have the geometric mean of the indices of the two media, as I recall, but Steve Baer says you can easily see that a water film on glass reduces its "Fresnel loss" reflectivity: a stack of dry panes of glass reflects a strong beam of light, but if there is water between the panes, the reflection is much weaker. Nick ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 11 Feb 1996 15:50:25 CET Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: tagdi@RUULCH.LET.RUU.NL Subject: the geometry of physcis `i gram of H atoms = 6x10^23 atoms radii of an atom = 10^-8 cm (- means minus) nuclear radii =10^-12 if you compare this to close packing of Fuller then the unit lenght he talked about is in that range, you can never reach unity. at least this links fuller radious and chemical data. one way to of producing an emission spectrum is to raise the atom to a high T, example is sodium in discharge tube which give yellow light- limited numbers of yellow victors(lines). similiarly, when white light is passed through sodium vapour, dark bands is observed in the what appears to continous spectrum of the white light. this is an abosrption spectrum of sodium vapour. electorons in atoms rotate without change of energy. these are the great circles of the icosavertaxia. we can assume that Bohar equasion is applicable to find the energy of a quantum which we call the tetravertaxia when an electron go back to lower circle. the equasion E1-E2=hv ( E is energy, v is frequency). spectrum of elements arise because at cerain volatage the energy of electron in a tube filled with a gas is used to raise the atom level of energy. this leads to drop of energy reaching the anode (galvanometer measures the difference of the voltage). similar methods used to measure ionization potential of elements. these are the graphes we see in astromnomy, phsyics, and chemistry books, where the graph curves looks like a heart beat wave. these are the indication of our invisible reality. to ionize one gram of atoms of sequence of elments from He to Rn you need from 100 to 600 cal, with helium at the top. "the fact that material particles have some of the properties of waves, has been used in several important ways. the wavelength of visible light is about 10-4cm, and details much smaller than this distance cannot therefor be distinguished with optical microscopes. X-rays have wavelengths of about 10^-8 cm, the order of size of atoms and molecules, but cannot be focused. However, electorns accelerated through a hundred of volts or so have a "de Broglie" wavelength of about 10^-8 cm, and can readily be focoused, by means of magnetic coils. In the electron microscope, such an electron beam passes through a thin specimen, and is then directed on to either a flourescent screen, or visual examination of the image, or a photographic plate, for a permanent record. It has been possible in this way to see virus particles in considerable detail. Just as the diffraction of X-rays by crystals has led to much detailed structural information, so also has the diffraction of electrons by gases and crystals, and of neutrons by crystals. the foundation for invisible reality pardigma was comleted by 1927, when Schrodinger derived his wave equation. the above are operative principles. Tagdi p.s specialist have a lot of authority but are mostly silent, and also unable to accomdate ideas outside there windows. ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 11 Feb 1996 10:28:54 -0600 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Louis Bonham Organization: I-Link Inc Subject: Re: Sheet Metal Domes Regarding sheet metal domes, why are you bothering with hubs and struts at all? Bucky patented the laminar dome, which was basically just joined steet metal panels -- no struts or hubs at all. [If I'm not mistaken, the USAF geodesic radomes of the 60's utilized this technique.] If you're using laser cutting, your precision should be more than sufficient. You may be able to simplify your design dramatically by taking this approach. Regards, LKB ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 11 Feb 1996 13:37:14 -0600 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Chuck Stoffregen Subject: 3D Modeling J. Michael Roland wanted to know of a good shareware 3d Modeling program for the Mac. 3D-Vision written by Paul Bourke, works well and will even generate even frequency geodesic spherics. I can't remember where i got it though. Check a Mac software archive. Chuck Stoffregen Computer Teacher Wrestling Coach Madison Area Technical College cas1276@madison.tec.wi.us Fax (608) 246-6880 Synergy - Behavior of whole systems unpredicted by the behavior of their parts taken seperately. R.B. Fuller ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 10 Feb 1996 10:45:06 GMT Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: ECO Organization: ECO Subject: New raster GIS approaches developed, look for contacts with specialists A new theory and elevation matrices treatment sowtware developed. They form "intellectual GIS" for geoecological, geological and water resources research tasks decision. The GIS able to work both with relief-dependent calculation (raster maps of specific catchment and dispersive area, subwatersheds, gradient, aspect, curvatures,..., stored as matrices), and with usual vector GIS data (thematic maps, rivers,... stored as lines). They are used to solve geoecological (karst processes evaluation, ground water vulnerability, contaminants redistribution prediction,...), geological (lineaments and central type structures decoding,...), for soil science.X-Newsreader: WinVN 0.92.1 ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 11 Feb 1996 16:25:12 -800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: curtis palmer Subject: Sheet Metal Domes I would like to provide pictures but I do not know how to attach them to my mail. Any suggestions. ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 11 Feb 1996 18:37:47 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: Re: Sheet Metal Domes In-Reply-To: <311E1946.20BA@i-link.net>; from "Louis Bonham" at Feb 11, 96 10:28 am Louis Bonham writes: > Regarding sheet metal domes, why are you bothering with hubs and struts at all? > Bucky patented the laminar dome, which was basically just joined steet metal > panels -- no struts or hubs at all. > [If I'm not mistaken, the USAF geodesic radomes of the 60's utilized this > technique.] If you're using laser cutting, your precision should be more > than sufficient. You may be able to simplify your design dramatically by > taking this approach. I agree. See _Inventions_, pages 227-40 and US Patent # 3,203,144. -- JOE S. MOORE joemoore@cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A ALTERNATE TEL AND/OR FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 USA I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 11 Feb 1996 11:00:48 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Re: education & misc. people who use spellcheckers "can't", don't & probably won't ever learn to spell, which might not be so horrible if you always have a Vulcan mindlink to your computer -- perhaps via PacBell ?!?... unless you can find one that BEEPS, WHILE you're making the mistake, and offers a choice of possibly-proper spellings, and you can think of the beep as a positive reinforcement, or change to a sultry come-on by an animaniacal babe. Bucky's aircraft-industry paradigm (and use of Beech to prototype the Dymax.House) can, though, readily be extended to an aerospatial one, not site-dependent, which would, indeed, require the assemblyline mfg.-capabilities, I guess. the www.netday96.com thing sounds like a great thing to volunteer for, if only as a nice tutorial in the core business (of the wired parts) of PacBell etc.... personally, I'm a great fan of booklearning, although generally unconcerned with maintaining a linear readthrough, and have a great dystrust of "wiring the schools" and "education automation", insofar as these are aspects of "outcome-base education", OBE, or kindred dumbin'down movements. ----- "Time is the only dimension." -RBFuller Congecture on "FG#s": Non Compos Mentis!... We return thee to thou couches, Potatoes. ----- On Palmtree BBS: brihut@pro-palmtree.cts.com ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 12 Feb 1996 01:50:17 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Jack Lazariuk Organization: SaskNet News Distribution Subject: Re: 3D Modeling In article , Chuck Stoffregen wrote: > J. Michael Roland wanted to know of a good shareware 3d Modeling program > for the Mac. 3D-Vision written by Paul Bourke, works well and will even > generate even frequency geodesic spherics. > > I can't remember where i got it though. Check a Mac software archive. > > Chuck Stoffregen > Computer Teacher > Wrestling Coach > Madison Area Technical College > cas1276@madison.tec.wi.us > Fax (608) 246-6880 > Synergy - Behavior of whole systems unpredicted by the behavior of their > parts taken seperately. R.B. Fuller Vision3d (CIS:GO GraphDev:LIB 6-RayTrace Sources:Vis3d.sea) is a Macintosh 3-D CAD modeller, which outputs POV-Ray 2.0 syntax! It is a Shareware polygon facet modeller (i.e. no primitives, just lots of triangles), but it has lathe and extrusion capability, and some interesting effects. It can export to Super3D, Radiance, RayShade, Renderman, POV-Ray 2.0, and DXF. Paul Bourke can be reached through the internet gateway, using this CompuServe e-mail address: INTERNET:pdbourke@ccu1.auckland.ac.nz Vision3D archive can be retrieved from: hobbes.lbl.gov ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 12 Feb 1996 05:48:30 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Nick Pine Organization: Villanova University Subject: sailing and solar houses Ian Woofenden writes, in medias res, to the alternative energy mailing list: >Nick, I know for me that the sheer volume puts me off at times. I feel the same way about press releases and legislative alerts... There should be some easy way to skip over things one is not interested in, in this sort of manual hypertext. I do try to lighten it up with humor, albeit obscurely. For those who don't know, a "facultative lagoon" is a low-energy sewage treatment structure, an aerobic-anerobic pond, perhaps with mechanical surface aerators, that accumulates sludge in the winter and decomposes it in the summer. No connection with universities, living or dead. >I was sorta hoping for a 25 words or fewer description of solar closets See below. >I think the best scientists are the ones who can boil something down >to its simplest form. Then and only then are they qualified to write >children's books on the subject. Norman Saunders seemed delighted with the part of our technical paper that described the solar closet as lying in wait, lurking, ready to spring into action on a cloudy day. He thought that read like a children's story. But some things can only be boiled down so far... It would be difficult to teach a child to design a TV. Most adults would find that a difficult task. Solar closets and sunspaces are a lot simpler than that. Designing a solar closet heating system is about as hard as designing a simple beam or a PV system. >>Perhaps a part of a deep eco/environmental commitment involves getting >>familiar with this high school physics and math. That's all it is... The >>physics is easy high school physics, and the math is easy high school math. > >Fair enough. I'm working on that. In the meantime, it might be worth noting >the overwhelming majority out there don't have that knowledge and ability. Well, if you want to do alternative energy, vs. just talk about it, I still think you have to understand this stuff. If you want to do it well, that is, ie if you want to put together good, automatic, efficient, cost-effective, low-maintenance, low-lifestyle-impact systems that people won't ask to have removed from their houses after a few years. Energy really IS a technical subject, one that people have been developing for hundreds of years, and if you turn your back on all that technical knowledge and basic physics and math, and fail to somehow embrace it, the resulting systems will suffer. The solution to ill-thought out, non-cost-effective systems is better thinking, not government subsidies, IMHO. You may have heard people say that almost anyone can design a system to solve a problem, but it takes a good engineer (not necessarily a person with an engineering degree) to come up with a cost-effective solution. >>there are no sines or cosines here, or waves, or apples >>falling to the earth, or planets moving in the sky, > >We have apples falling every fall, and the planets still move here. :) Yep. Nature does not need cosines. But people do, to understand nature. >...so far, I don't see the practical users of RE flocking to those >concentrator panels. That is partly because they are ignorant. No insult intended. >And lots of people like to get trackers for fun, Hmmm. Like sailing. Consider this quote from an ad in the February issue of the magazine "Sailing: the beauty of sail": You're hit by a squall and you're sailing in big, breaking seas. You don't want to round up to reef or lower your full batten mainsail. You just want it down. Now! With 100% reliability and no hassles. Is that possible? Yes, and only yes if you have a ball bearing batten car system. The problem with long battens is that they apply load on their cars from all directions. They push and pull and above all, they torque and twist. Slide systems, no matter how slippery, won't do the job. Recirculating ball bearings sliding in a "V" groove will roll regardless of the angle of load. Harken Battcar systems use only recirculating ball bearing batten cars and feature all new batten receptacles and headboards which are lighter, easy to remove and cost less. Insist on the system that is designed to keep your mainsail under your control. Under all conditions. On all points of sail. Not just on a sunny day at the dock. The choice is yours. Sailors have fun, but a lot of them are quite serious about it... There's a story later on in this magazine about a 40ish California couple and their 9-year old son and 7-year-old daughter who finally took their dream sailing vacation, a 5 year cruise around the world on a Compass 47 cutter, a 30,000 pound, long-fin-keel, performance cruiser, which was torn open by a freighter at 3 AM on November 24 "as a vicious northeast gale roared through the rigging," 30 miles at sea, northeast of New Zealand. "Only the wife [a civil engineer] survived, washed ashore 40 hours later. When she was found, suffering from exposure and severe back injuries, she was able to give the exact coordinates of where their boat was plowed under by the ship that had come suddenly out of the black night. Co-skipper Judy Sleavin was that kind of meticulous sailor." They practiced by going from San Diego to the Caribbean and back, through the Panama Canal, twice. In her last communication home, faxed from Tonga, _before_ they hit the 50 knot gale with 20' seas, Judy Sleavin told friends This life is by no means stressless. At times I'm more stressed than I ever thought I was capable of enduring. You guys probably laugh at this, but just think of taking your home through a small pass in the coral with a strong current and once you start the approach, there is no turning around to ditch out and meanwhile the kids are fighting over a stupid little insignificant plastic toy so loudly that you can't hear the other person calling out directions. That part of the world is known for fierce storms, "howlers and screamers," that circle around the world over water with few land interruptions. A few years ago I heard another sailor talk about sailing around the world without a compass. He had a 60' steel boat, and talked of a storm in the Tasman sea, that _pitchpoled_ the boat end for end, lengthwise, leaving it upside down with the mast sticking down in the water. He said "the boat was well buttoned-up," and, he went on calmly, "after a few minutes, she righted herself." I'd like to see more of that kind of spirit among solar house owners :-) But without the stress and fatalities. Needless to say, sailors are more interested in the performance of a boat than how it looks, altho many people find sailboats beautiful. Sailors don't worry if their boat looks different from their neighbor's boat, or looks like it wasn't built 100 years ago. They care about cost, and they care about performance. I met another courageous sailor in Annapolis, on his sailboat, all built of recycled aluminum, donated by Alcoa. It was a single-handed ocean racing yacht, built for a round-the-world race, beautiful in its way, built without any wood or fiberglass. Very strong and sleek and hi-tech and simple. No curtains or cushions below, just thick diamondplate decking below, with lots of heavy struts for strength, and a serious-looking fishing chair welded to the deck in front of a thick window looking forward, with a racing car seat belt, and a composting toilet welded to the deck a few feet away. Lots of electronics, Loran, radar, etc. With a generator to run the electronics and powerful pumps, but this boat had no propellor, just beautiful sails... The pumps were to move water fast through very large pipes from one side of the boat to the other, transferring the water between two 2' diameter 60' pipes on each side. The pipes also made the boat very strong. That was how he would balance the boat, since there was only only one crewman. On the longest passage, he said he would not sleep for two weeks. He was a licensed captain, like the Exxon Valdiz driver, as was his wife. Pat Hennin of the Shelter Institute (shelterint@aol.com) would probably call this a racing machine, as he calls solar houses solar machines. Are they beautiful? Chacun a sa machine. Third-world fishermen may dream of outboard motors, but for many people these days, sailing is something they do because they want to do it, not because they have to do it. Sailors enjoy harnessing natural forces to do something that can be done far more easily with fossil fuels. They enjoy the feelings of power and competence and getting something for nothing, in this old art which is somewhat mysterious and not easy to master, even without race competitions. Sailors do not like to use motors, even if they have one. But they almost always motor in and out of crowded harbors, because sailing into a crowded harbor is often extremely dangerous and difficult. A couple of years ago, a group of Sunday sailors on vacation in the British Virgin Islands watched a breathtaking sailing performance as a crack captain and crew sailed into the crowded harbor at Soper's hole in a moderate wind on a 60' boat, on their toes, skillfully and economically tacking and veering around many other expensive anchored boats, missing some by inches, until they dropped the sails at just the right time to allow the momentum to carry the boat into a slip and let the wind gently push their boat against the dock. They were nonchalant about this tour-de-force, as they tied up the boat to a round of applause from open-mouthed people standing nearby. This is a peculiar game, no? Trying to make a 100% solar house that uses no backup heat, or perhaps one that has no backup heating system. It is futile of course, because it can never be accomplished. No matter how fine the solar house, Mother Nature in her stochastic way will someday supply a combination of cloudy-degree-days, a new record that will exhaust her solar thermal storage capacity. It is clear to me that there is a happy economic compromise between the expected yearly backup energy required for a house (something related to the tail of a Gaussian distribution?) and the cost of building the house, but as they say, a boat is a hole in the water... >A solar closet is an insulated box filled with sealed containers of water, >with a solar air heater attached to one insulated side of the box. Oops, 26 words, but close :-) >OK, I get the basic idea. Do you have one of these up and running? Yes. I think I've said that about 83 times now. But it is fairly small, only 2' x 4' x 8' tall, and it doesn't have a water heater, altho it has a nice data logger and modem, and it isn't running at the moment because we are replacing the fans with 2 watt motorized dampers, to increase the COP. We are trying to lower the cost and beat the 50:1 COP ("98% solar power, 2% fan power") that John Christopher ((603) 756-4796) achieved in his much larger CSI building in Walpole, NH, in 1981, using DOE money. >When do we see the _Home Power_ or _Solar Today_ article? As soon as somebody builds something bigger :-) Nick ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 12 Feb 1996 09:08:00 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: Re: Roofing Domes Comments: To: Brian Hutchings In-Reply-To: ; from "Brian Hutchings" at Feb 11, 96 10:17 am Brian Hutchings writes: > have you ever seen storage between domes?... the only similar thing > that I recall was in an article in Discovery; > he used plastic on rather monstrous post&beam -- > I couldn't quite figure it out! Very few people seem to realize the advantages of double-dome or envelope domes. The only examples I know of are the following: Fall 1992 article in DOME mag on pages 24-7, and _Critical Path_ on page 312. In Bucky's design there is 6 inches between domes which "this spacing produces highly effective insulation as well as an excellent hot- and cold-air ducting system." The DOME article features double shell structures designed by Lee Porter Butler lbutler@gate.net; I think his company is located at: Ekose'a Integrated Technologies Inc. 620 Biscayne Drive West Palm Beach, FL 33480 USA 407-659-7656 (This info current as of 5-10-95) -- JOE S. MOORE joemoore@cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A ALTERNATE TEL AND/OR FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 USA I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 12 Feb 1996 12:32:22 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: WATER-FLOATING HOMES WATER-FLOATING, SELF-CONTAINED, SINGLE-FAMILY DWELLINGS For more info re above see: "Ekotecture: An Integrated Approach to Sustainable Construction" by Lee Porter Butler (1994). The paper, complete with patent drawings and diagrams, is available for $50 from: Ekotecture, Inc. 323 Worth Avenue Palm Beach, FL 33480 USA 407-833-9007 lbutler@gate.net See also the book: _Into the Hidden Environment: The Oceans_ by Keith Critchlow (1974) -- JOE S. MOORE joemoore@cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A ALTERNATE TEL AND/OR FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 USA I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 12 Feb 1996 15:36:06 AST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Roger Williams Organization: The Williams House Subject: Re: Une serre pour Sylvain / A greenhouse for Sylv On 11 Feb 1996 03:00:59 -0500, nick@vu-vlsi.ee.vill.edu writes: > >Tom Rentz/Sun Wind Concepts wrote: > >>What would happen if you considered using insulated earth as the >>storage medium? For example: 2 layers Formular = R20, damp earth weight >>33% heavier than water, > >Roger Williams (willm@nbnet.nb.ca) likes the idea of earth tubes for heat >storage. He built a large hydroponic tomato greenhouse in New Brunswick that >works this way. If you can somehow keep the earth around the store dry, the >dry earth may be fine insulation. It seems to me that an EPDM-rubber lined >trench along the north side of the greenhouse would be a good heat store, if >in the middle holding up benches, making a total of 200 tons of water, >which would not only keep it from blowing off of a (strong) flat roof >of a building, say, but reduce the average drum temperature requirement >to just 51 F. > >Nick > I found that ordinary agricultural drain tile is very good at getting the heat in and out of the earth under the greenhouse, but you have to move a lot of air. Reversible fans mounted in the center of the house blowing toward the ends is the ideal from an energy standpoint.The holes in the AG tile allow some of the air to percolate up through the soil. I do not recommend north wall insulation due to light loss of about 15%. Additional light added to the house should have about 5% metal halide(blue light) along with the sodiums. The sodiums reduce flowering and fruiting. If you space your pipes properly and relatively deep (must be above the water table:-) you can store MASSIVE amounts of heat. About 30 btu/cu. ft./ deg F. 30' X 96' X 8' X 30btu =691,200 btu/deg F Roger willm@nbnet.nb.ca ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 12 Feb 1996 16:27:38 CST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Tom Dosemagen Subject: Re: Roofing Domes Natural Spaces has a system where they can have up to 24" between the outside and inside skin of the dome. They use a double strut system. The outside strut is 2x6 and the inside strut is a 2x4. They gusset the two struts together with 3/4" plywood. The initial intent was to use this space for insulation purposes, but I see no reason that other things couldn't be put in that area. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 12 Feb 1996 15:08:38 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: Re: Dome Magazine subs info... Comments: To: ap017@detroit.freenet.org In-Reply-To: <199602122058.PAA23018@detroit.freenet.org>; from "Anthony Ander" at Feb 12, 96 3:58 pm Anthony Ander writes: > Joe, would you pls give me the address/phone of the Dome mag > and other mags (if any) so I can learn more about the domes? > Thanks, Tony Ander. There's only one magazine (as far as I know) that concentrates on geodesic dome news. DOME 4401 Zephyr Street Wheat Ridge, CO 80033-3299 USA 303-934-5656 (6am-6pm Denver time) donh@hoflin.com Quarterly, $40.00/year --- There is only one newsletter (again, to the best of my knowledge) that covers Bucky-related news in general. Buckminster Fuller Institute 2040 Alameda Padre Serra, Suite 224 Santa Barbara, CA 93103 USA 805-962-0022 bfi@aol.com Quarterly, $20.00/year --- Some of the geodesic dome manufacturers publish newsletters related to their own products. You would have to contact each manufacturer separately. -- JOE S. MOORE joemoore@cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A ALTERNATE TEL AND/OR FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 USA I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 12 Feb 1996 15:52:09 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: URL SNAGGER Comments: cc: Synergetics List URL SNAGGER A web site called Alice's Restaurant provides a service called the "Green Eggs Report" that collects URL addresses that appear in various newsgroups, including bit.listserv.geodesic. BEGIN QUOTE: The Green Eggs report is a collection of URL's that were spotted by the Rumor Database System. Rumor collects URL's from the Usenet Spool as it goes by. Rumor collects about 1,500 New and Unique URL's Every Day. To make sure a URL is good, we get it. Rumor does NOT Traverse the web. Rumor only gets any FTP, Gopher and of cource HTTP web resource it finds. Rumor then places that URL in the first group from the Groups: line in the news message. To get your URL listed here just post something in news. Now that's Simple. URL's are only Listed Once! This is a serivce to the Net community! I give what I can. -alice END QUOTE. For the current list of URL's that their computer has snagged see: http://www.ar.com/ger/bit.listserv.geodesic.html -- JOE S. MOORE joemoore@cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A ALTERNATE TEL AND/OR FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 USA I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 13 Feb 1996 05:19:45 GMT Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Kirby Urner Organization: 4D Solutions Subject: Re: Non lurking Raffaele De Angelis wrote: >Hello Everybody, >I want to be a non-lurker for a while, therefore I am posting this image, >which is a 3D model of the Dymaxion House 4D I did when I was at school >I might post the DXF file too, if someone would like it. > >Raffaele De Angelis >ra.deangelis@agora.stm.it A really gorgeous picture Raffaele! Thanks for sharing it. Another project would be to make a VRML version of it, or something like it. Just looking at it makes me want to fly around, in... Kirby -------------------------------------------------------- Kirby Urner "All realities are virtual" -- KU Email: pdx4d@teleport.com Web: http://www.teleport.com/~pdx4d/ ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 13 Feb 1996 05:34:36 GMT Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Kirby Urner Organization: 4D Solutions Subject: Re: You've got my vote on the Geodesic Dome CD-ROM! ad238@seorf.ohiou.edu (Andy Hermetz) wrote: > Hey gang, > Sounds like a great idea. I've been messing around with various dome >layouts for the last couple of years--mainly on paper, my computer is to >be upgrade immediately--and would like any help I could get with the math, >layout, other designs, etc. Upgraded to a what I wonder? If a DOS machine, then you can download DOME42.EXE from ftp.teleport.com /pub/users/pdxd/bin and get spheres and sections of many frequencies, Class I and Class II, in DXF, VRML, POV-Ray and other formats. Freeware, generously contributed by Rick Bono. Also, Einar Thorsteinn is selling something for $12.95 that sounds interesting, but I have no experience using it (no demo version available). On my machine, I can generate geodesic spheres and then fly around in them using a VRML browser (I use WebFx). But that takes some serious CPU/video horsepower. > A CD-ROM with all that is currently available >doesn't seem like it would be out of the question (there's really not been >anything new in the last 5 or 10 years that I'm aware of...) > According to the last bulletin I got from the Institute, they'd just >gotten a really nice Mac, scanner, and some other goodies. Maybe we should >talk to them about arranging to do a couple of projects simulataneously >(digitizing the archive, World Game stuff, etc.). World Game [TM] handles World Game [TM] stuff, if you get my meaning, but as for digitizing the archive, that's something that BFI wants very much to get on with. They're practicing for their upcoming web debut. You may attend the dress rehearsal at: http://www.critpath.org/bfi/ . The idea is to make some good archival material available in cyberspace, though exactly what this will be I don't know (beyond a sharable Fuller Projection). >I know their always >short-staffed, but maybe with could start farming some of this out to >those with an interest and the equipment (one of the things I'm planning >for in the next year is a good scanner and OCR software). Short staffed is right. The computer expert is only in once a week and BFI still doesn't have a PPP connection, just an AOL account. But the web space is available at the above site (Kiyoshi's). The registration form for bfi.org was submitted in December, but Internic has still to come through, almost 2 months later. One project is just to get the Catalog on line, with pictures of the goodies, maybe generating some more sales, maybe getting some more revenue, maybe being able to pay someone to work on the digitizing projects more concertedly. > Instead of pitching a Dome CD (which IS a good idea), how about finding >some way to get a "Virtual" Buckminster Fuller Institute (yea, I know >there's a web page with that name, but it seems fitting for now) going and >staff it with those of us on the 'Net, work in cooperation with the >"physical" BFI and try and expidite some of the tasks that need doing >(personally, I'd like to get set-up so I could do a hypertext version of >_Synergetics I & II_ plus add notes, updates [a la Robert Grey], and Amy >Edmonson's Reference book too [truly a _Fuller Explaination_]; maybe, with >the upcoming gigabyte CD's include basically every Bucky book ever written >with hypertext links to connect the myrid of interconnection in Bucky's >work. But hey, that's just me thinking out loud...) Lots of people are anxious to move ahead along these lines. Robert Gray has set the project aside pending assurance from BFI that he was the designated hitter re Synergetics (i.e. he wouldn't work his tail off to find BFI contracting with some other entity later) -- at least that's my latest info, which may be old by now. As you know, copyright issues arise whenever one discusses publishing an already-published work in some now format (or old one). Blaine D'Amico has gone so far as to press a proto-CD on Bucky. A class project, nothing commerical-grade... yet. And other discussions have taken place. The Richard Hawkins Archive is certainly by now huge enough to supply many hours of relevant geometry videos in support of whatever synergetics was included on the CDROM. In the meantime, we have that giant shared medium, the World Wide Web, where all the puzzle pieces drift in gaseous form, linking and unlinking, never quite crystallizing. Kirby a dreamer too > > Andy Hermetz > ad238@seorf.ohiou.edu > > -------------------------------------------------------- Kirby Urner "All realities are virtual" -- KU Email: pdx4d@teleport.com Web: http://www.teleport.com/~pdx4d/ ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 13 Feb 1996 13:47:05 CET Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: tagdi@RUULCH.LET.RUU.NL Subject: Books The Rise of Merchant empires James D.Tracy Main street in crisis Cathereine Mcnicol Stock British Weights & Measures Ronald Edward The plain English guide Martin Lutts Four books that seem to be good ones, relevant to Fuller field. Tagdi ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 13 Feb 1996 14:15:19 CET Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: tagdi@RUULCH.LET.RUU.NL Subject: solar?,litracy, the zero, connection Hi Nick and the sun lovers, what is the % heat loss from a glass window? what is indices of reflection mean? i read an article in the "Gardian" few days ago about solar company in Italy. do you get this newspaper in U.S. otherwise i might have to send the article. it seem to be significant company, and which might join american ones. p.s it may be asking to much to ask those who send technical articles to explain few words at end, i think it help the operative mind. remmber we lack operative language, we need to flex the muscles. 2p.s m, there are 70 million who do not know how to write in the U.S & million 7 million. the guy who wrote the book"plain english" is envolved in big campaign for plain english. it is the simple way to write. E.B white thought he could help people write, but he himself lacks what he advised the public to do. tagdi it seems that zero is coming from buddism, 6 century b.c. have any one read Technopoly by Postman. should connection heppen in the beginning or in the end. ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 13 Feb 1996 09:51:36 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: James Fischer Subject: 3D Model Of The 4D House (Raffaele/Kirby) Kirby Urner said: >A really gorgeous picture Raffaele! Thanks for sharing it. >Another project would be to make a VRML version of it, >or something like it. Just looking at it makes me want >to fly around, in... If Raffaele approves, I will transform the dxf to a VRML, but I still have yet to figure out how to make VRML that stops one from walking/flying through walls... Do I have your permission Raffaele? Anyone have ANY ideas on the issue of "solid" objects in VRML? There seems to be no spec for this issue, nor does any browser do the obvious and "read" an object as "solid". If permission is granted, and when complete, the 3D-4D House will be at http://www.supercollider.com, which at least will not be slow, as I now have a 2nd T-1 Line in place. No software will ever be able to compress information to the extent a human female does when she merely raises an eyebrow. james fischer jfischer@supercollider.com ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 13 Feb 1996 15:50:23 +0100 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Geoff Armstrong Subject: Re: BUCKY LURKERS >To all Bucky Lurkers: > >Please don't be shy about posting. It can be anything related to RBF's work-- >a book, an article, an example of doing more with less, your hopes & dreams, >etc. This is YOUR discussion group. > >PS: We know you're out there. Send the command > >REVIEW GEODESIC NAME > >to the computer at > >LISTSERV@UBVM.CC.BUFFALO.EDU > >to get a list of the current subscribers to the GEODESIC list. > > >-- > >JOE S MOORE joemoore@cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 >850 PARK AVE, # 3-A FAX: 408-479-0733 >CAPITOLA, CA 95010 I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. I'm at the 'listening and learning' phase. I know that silence can often be interpreted as a sign of contempt; but believe me that's not the case with me. I've been thorougly enjoying many of the postings to this group and hope to participate when I've got this all into perspective. From an (almost) outside (objective) point of view the discsusions seem to range widely from the Philisophical to the purely Practical. (e.g. 'the shape of the universe' to 'geodisc math') Probably because Bucky had a simlarly 'wide bandwidth'. I must admit I lean more towards enjoyment of the philisophical discussions; but perhaps that's just because I don't have a grounding in Geodisc math etc. This has probably already been provided several times; but can anyone recommend a beginners guide to these concepts. After digesting this I may feel on more of an equal footing with the rest of the group; in the meantime many of the more technical discussions are going 'over my head' (still fascinating though). If anyone can recommend such a book, just E-mail me direct. Thanks. Geoff Armstrong ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 13 Feb 1996 09:11:32 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: Re: BUCKY LURKERS In-Reply-To: ; from "Geoff Armstrong" at Feb 13, 96 3:50 pm For a general intro to Bucky's ideas I recommend the following: _Operating Manual for Spaceship Earth_ (available thru BFI: bfi@aol.com) _Dymaxion World of Buckminster Fuller_ (out of print--use library) --- For a general intro to his geometry I recommend: _Fuller's Earth_ by Brenneman (out of print--use library) _Bucky for Beginners_ by Laycock (available thru BFI: bfi@aol.com) --- PS: If you contact BFI, ask them for a sample newsletter along with their catalog. They carry a lot of Bucky-books that are out of print. PPS: _Operating Manual_ is the most popular Bucky-book in China. -- JOE S. MOORE joemoore@cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A ALTERNATE TEL AND/OR FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 USA I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 13 Feb 1996 10:03:23 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: DREAM HOME Comments: To: nick@ee.vill.edu FULLER'S SELF-CONTAINED GEODESIC DOME HOMES "The Fly's Eye uses a very few types of nestable, mass-produced fiberglass, sheet aluminum of thin guage, <---\ metal--no wood or polyester-coated sheet steel components <---/ that, when assembled, produce a 5/8 sphere of the 'Hex-Pent' geodesic configuration." "As with the ports and pores of all organic systems, the size and shape of these openings sort, sieve and classify the in-bound and out-bound physical-component traffic of metabolic regeneration which the Fly's Eye domes embody." "The Fly's Eye domes' 'pores' are all seven-foot-diameter circular openings." "These circular openings serve alternatively as doors, vents, solar-energy-cell mounts, etc." <---note "The circular openings constitute three-fourths of the surface area of the domes, while the manufactured shell-structure components constitute only one-fourth of the structures' surface." "Since the circles have rigid rims, the closure of the circles can be accomplished by two, spread-apart drumheads of tensed, thin film or fabric materials-- ergo, at low relative cost." "The structural shell components constitute a comprehensive leakproof, watershedding system that, with the circular openings covered, leads all rain and melting snow into the shell's watercourse cisterning system." <--- "The cylindrically rimmed circular openings will be tensilely covered with opaque, translucent, or transparent glass, plastic film, metal glazing or screening, or some combination thereof." "They will serve as energy harvesters <--- in the operation of the dwelling by parabolically collecting incoming energy <---solar in sunlight foci, liquid-heating cells <---"liquid" and by circular-opening-mounted, wind-drag-driven, air turbines." <---wind "Fly's Eye domes are of two sizes." "The smaller twenty-six-foot-diameter one is constructed of only one type of mass-produced, strong, lightweight, hyperbolic-saddle-form component;" "The larger fifty-foot-diameter one is comprised of only two types of mass-produced structural shell and watershed-constituting components, which are also of the hyperbolic-saddle type." "Both twenty-six- and fifty-foot-diameter domes can consist of two concentric identical domes <---double shell with a space of six inches between <---6" and no metallic interconnectors-- this spacing produces highly effective insulation as well as an excellent hot- and cold-air ducting system." <---air "The concentric domes' interconnection is accomplished with a seven-foot- diameter outside circle and six-inch-deep conic tubes made fast at the seven-foot outside end of the circular openings of the spheres." "The smaller Fly's Eye provides the optimally workable fundamentals for comfortable, efficient living in a two-story shelter." "It is small compared to a conventional house, but huge next to a van, camper, or almost any of the thousands of yachts enthusiastically occupied while tied up at the marina slips." "Optimum use of space will be important." "The larger Fly's Eye is fifty feet in diameter, capable of enclosing three or more stories (each of 2000-square-foot floor area), a garden, trees, and a pool." "While also equipped with all the living essentials at different levels, its space utilization will be quite different from the smaller Fly's Eye-- the fifty-footer accommodates what we call the Garden of Eden living-- living in a garden." "The Fly's Eye domes are designed as components of a 'livingry' service." "The basic hardware components will produce a beautiful, fully equipped, air-deliverable house that weighs and costs about as much as a good automobile." <---weight "Not only will it be highly efficient in its use of energy and materials, it also will be capable of harvesting incoming light and wind energies." <---renewable energy "The software part of the product will include a service industry to air- or highway-transport, install, lease, maintain, remove, and relocate the domes or their separate hardware components." "And as mentioned, they will not be sold." "Both the twenty-six- and fifty-foot Fly's Eye domes are semiautonomous-- i.e., have no sewer, <---\ water-pipe, <---->self-contained or electric-power-supply connections." <---/ "The personal hygiene, clothes- and utensil-washing functions <--washer/dryer & dishwasher are accomplished with the high-pressure, compressed air and atomized water fog gun <---compressed air which requires only a pint of water per hour." <"shower" "The human excrement is sittingly deposited in the dry-packaging toilet." <---toilet "The human sits on fresh, plastic-film-covered, fore-and-aft seat halves." "The excrement falls into the top-open plastic tube as it is formed by the two converging edges of the two plastic sheets, which are then electrosealed together from the originally separate two plastic film rolls, whose filmstrips first covered the two seat-sides." "The hermetically sealed-off tubular section containing the excrement is then mechanically detached and conveyed away as litter to be neatly packed in a corrugated carton clearly marked for pickup and dispatch to the methane-gas-producing plant and the dry-power fertilizer manufacturer or to be processed into methane gas and fertilizer powder by accessory equipment of the dome home itself." <---recycle sewage Please see _Critical Path_ by R.Buckminster Fuller, pages 310-15. -- JOE S. MOORE joemoore@cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A ALTERNATE TEL AND/OR FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 USA I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 12 Feb 1996 15:55:16 GMT Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Ted Dunning Organization: Computing Research Lab/New Mexico State University Subject: Re: Une serre pour Sylvain / A greenhouse for Sylvain In-Reply-To: nick@vu-vlsi.ee.vill.edu's message of 11 Feb 1996 03:00:59 -0500 another thing to remember with greenhouse design is that the crucial temperature is the temperature of the *roots* of the plants. the ambient temperature is much less important. this can lead to a design where you store heat in barrels which support the plants, but you don't try to circulate either the air or the water. this has three major advantages: a) letting the air cool decrease heat loss through the greenhouse walls without materially affecting growth conditions. b) letting the water stratify keeps the remaining heat energy near the plant roots where it does the most good. c) not circulating the air more than necessary avoids the problem of increased transpiration by the plants. this radically decreases the watering and heating requirements. since enhanced levels of CO2 encourage plant growth, adding a small burner to increase CO2 levels is often done. these burners (and any lighting to extend the growing day) should both have substantial impacts on the energy balance of the greenhouse. ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 13 Feb 1996 11:43:26 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Nick Pine Organization: Villanova University Subject: Re: solar?, literacy, the zero, connection >Hi Nick and the sun lovers, Hiya Tag, >what is the % heat loss from a glass window? % of what? That depends on the temperature inside and outside the window. I usually assume that a window with a single layer of glass has an R-value of 1 in US units, and use "Ohm's law for heatflow," U = (T1- T2)A/R, where U is in Btu/hour, the Ts are the temperatures on each side of the surface in degrees F, A is the area of the surface in ft^2, and R is the US R-value from one side to the other through the surface. So if it's 72 F inside and 32 F outside, and the window has one square foot of glass, U = (72 F - 32 F) 1 ft^2/R1 = 40 Btu/hour. If the sun is shining, about 300 Btu/ft^2/hour fall on the glass, as a maximum, or about 1,000 Btu/ft^2/day on a south wall in winter where I live, and I usually assume that all of that solar heat gets through the glass. If 300 goes in, and 40 goes out, the percent heat lost from the window is about 13%, and the solar collection efficiency is about 87%. Pretty good. If the temperature inside the window were 132 F, about 100 Btu/hour would be lost, and the solar collection efficiency would be 66%. Still pretty good. What would the temperature inside the glass be if the solar collection efficiency were 0%, with this simple model? Power in = power out... (Reality is more complicated.) You can do all this with watts and meters and degrees C too, BTW. >what is indices of reflection mean? That's index of refraction, or the refractive index of a material. That has to do with how fast light travels through a material. If light travels slowly through the material, people say the material has a high index of refraction, like glass. If light travels fast, as in air, the material has a low index. The lowest index is 1, in a vacuum, where light travels fast, about one foot per nanosecond, one way, or 10 microseconds per mile, round trip. Air is very close to 1. Glass and copper are close to 1.5, ie light and electricity travel about 2/3 as fast in glass and copper as in air. (Which slows down computers and makes lenses bend light.) Whenever electromagnetic waves (eg light) travel from a substance with one index to a substance with a different one, some of the light is reflected back at the interface. This is called a Fresnel loss or a reflection resulting from an impedance mismatch. The amount of reflction depends on the angle of the light striking the surface. Grazing angles make good reflections. If light hits perpendicularly on the surface of a material with index n, and the other surface is air, the fraction of light reflected at each surface is ((n-1)/(n+1)), squared, ie about 4% at each interface. Some plastics have lower indices, so there is less reflection, and glass can be treated with index matching coatings or etchings to reduce this reflection to almost zero, but that can be expensive. If a substance is very thin compared to a wavelength of light or heat, like a very thin soap bubble wall, it apparently doesn't reflect much light at all. Light that travels from a substance with index n1, and enters another with index n2, at an angle A1 from the perpendicular, enters the n2 medium with an angle from the perpendicular A2 such that n1/n2 = sin A2/sin A1. This is known as "Snell's law." (Some birds know this intuitively, as they dive for fish that look to be elsewhere.) Here is the last and most complicated part of the picture, how to predict how much energy will be reflected from a surface if the sun is not shining directly at it. For instance we might want to guess how much low-angle winter sun will be reflected from a shallow pond in the winter, onto a solar house. If light strikes a surface at angle A1 from the vertical, the fraction of energy reflected is r = (Rper + Rpar)/2, where Rper = (sin(A2-A1)/sin(A2+A1))^2, and Rpar = (tan(A2-A1)/tan(A2+A1))^2. >p.s it may be asking to much to ask those who send technical articles > to explain few words at end, i think it help the operative mind. Maybe that's a good idea. But then we wouldn't be techno-priests, would we? >2p.s m, there are 70 million who do not know how to write in the U.S Really? That's a lot... > should connection heppen in the beginning or in the end. Is this something to do with chickens and eggs? :-) Nick ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 13 Feb 1996 18:01:31 -0400 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: LORETTA LORANCE Subject: Re: Non lurking Please send the image as either MIME or BinHex. My Eudora Light email account cannot convert it as originally sent. Thanks. At 11:39 AM 2/10/96 +0000, you wrote: >M%'5F\9RG:*$:U:/2H6NHAO89,BC@OW[#O_GBOMJN[N;,@W1\?>4Y%9VM3F/PU?7$+E62!W1AV(&0?S%0MS(\FL-8U&\F2ZDNV= >M&#A00#G;GGI[5,9YIU3S6SF%G/&.1NQ_(5T)6(*+:;:S7*)*I*O`7;GOS_\` >MJJO#X=M0/):2;*0E\[AD]<=OI5M$_@*\4^S^U?>\-Z4'_7MW=/B'Y[C_6N.K+_:*?I+]!]#'^S^U'V?VKLYA!]G]J/L_M1S`'V?VH^S^U', >M`?9_:C[/[451<`\JHWC_>1?[Q_D:RK/W?FOS0 >MT2>51Y5:W$'E4>51<#TGPC&%\.6Q(X*R9_#=6W`J&Z(ZC,1'\J_,LV_WNIZC >MCL5HD#W,RGAMCY`[=?\`"J>J)YEOMG;GIQ^?Y4Z5K[R&WI'(`-W*],5OH9:B17/EQ`)!)Y?.UD;''TJ_:2+)H6M2% >MIMN+<-O'(&\@X]N:B:T^:_,NF]?O_(JB]EQ\DEM(`,\Y3C\<54(#[7>`#:[! >ML-G(^]Q_+TK2*2,ST6TO+8P0.^\`QJ%X'ISW^M1/<6XCF9<"/YAW[_=[>N>F >M>U>U"+2NS-M$]J,HD/ECRPH_=]=WKDYYY[52U98[FT>(8V1NK,!@[CV_#Z8Z >M5%1?NY-]BEND9=(>!7BHZ0`P*ANU8[9DYD!4?EP.A_S^--">P[SQY`E0X.0J >M`_WST'4=.OX4L09(OG)+L2S9]3_D#\*0(6DJAF[:1Q&P0.GRE/FQUZ?4?3\: >MH:@HB:.W<"/9G#D_PC`[X&!VZ5[%?_=_N.=:2,#R_,OWO6^88V1D#C`[\C(/ >M;\^QJ7'S;1UQG'M7BHZ!4!9MJ`L?04JR".89QD=5-%U<9')&(-3*Q$O#-F3= 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>MPVT;:8@VT;:`#;1MI##;1MH$&VC;0`;:-M`PVT;:!!MHVTP#;1MI`&VC;0`; >M:-M`PVT;:8B3;2[:`$VT;:`%VT;:`$VTNV@`Q2;:`#%&V@`VT;:`#;2[:`#; >M2;:`#;1MH`7;1MH`-M&V@!-M&*`%VT;:`$VT;:`#;1MH`7;1MH`3;7@_BFV% >MMXRU*+&!]H9O^^N?ZU\OQ3']Q"7G^AI`QS49;"DU\440BZYZU.ES[UDI$\IU >M.BQA=.$K?>DY_#M6EQ71'8Y);F[X8&+B=O91_.NUM1FWS[U]%P]'_:%Z,BG_ >M`!";;2[:^X.H3;2[:`$VT;:`%VT8H`-M)MH`-M+MH`-M&V@`VT8H`3;1MH`- >MM&V@!=M&V@`VT;:`#;1MH`-M)MH`7;1MH`3;2[:`$VTNV@`VTF*`)=M&V@!= >MM)B@`VTNV@!-M&*+`+MHVT`&VC;0`;:3;0`NVC;0`8I,4`+MI-M`"[:3;0`; >M:-M`!MHVT`&VC;0`;:-M`!MHV\4`&VC;0`;:\8^(MOY'CFX8#`EC23],?TKY >MWB:-\(GV:_)EPW.,9ZA=_E-?"&MC,67FKEH/M%U'"O\`$<5S('L=PDH2-47A >M5&`/:GBXKL.&QU'A1MT<[?[0'Y9KO;-?]"3WYKZ;AM?OF_+]412^-D^VEVU] >MH=(;:3;0`;:-M(`VT;>*8"[:3;0`;:-M`!MHVT`&VEVT`)MI=M`";:-M`!MH >MVT`&VEVT`)MI=M`";:-M`!MHVT`&*-M`!MI=M`!MI-M`$VVC;0`FVEVT`)MI >M=M`";:7%`!MI-M`!MHVT:`&VC;0`NVC;0`;:-M`";:7;0`FVEVT`&VDVT`+M >MI-M`!MHVT`&VC;0`NVDVT`+MHVT`)MKR?XLP"+6[.ZQCS+MC?`R?9K\RX;GF)-0L:_/3=&*LF'(].*WM"^^UP>PVK6-/<538WA<^].%S[UO >M&5[\GY&-->^R7;2[:^P-PVT;:`$ >MVT;:`%VTFV@`VT;:`%VTFV@!=M)MH`-M&VC0!=M)MH`-M&V@`VTNV@!-M&V@ >M`VTNV@!-M&V@`VT;:`#;1MH`7;2;:`#;1MHT`EVT;:`#;1MH`-M&*`#%&V@` >MVT;:`#;1B@`VT8H`,4N*`$VT;:`#%&*`#%&V@`VT;:`#%&*`#;1MH`-M+MH` >M3;1MH`7%)MH`-M>:_&&W_P")+IUUCE96CS_O`'_V6O*SN/-@:B]/S14-SQUN >ME0/7YL=*,`MBX<>C$5T%I*(+5(Q^/UK&.C"HM+%D7=/%U[UIMPQIUEE('YX_I7K*QA8PHZ`8K[?ABG[DI^B.>"]YL7;1MKZDT#;1MH`-M&V@` >MQ2[:`$Q1MH`,48H`-M&V@`Q1MH`,4;:`#%&V@`Q1MH`-M&*`#;2[:`$VT8H` >3-M&V@`Q1MH`-M&V@`Q1MH`#_V0#_ >` >end >sum -r/size 11331/41824 > > ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 13 Feb 1996 15:14:18 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: Re: DREAM HOME Comments: To: Nick Pine In-Reply-To: <199602131832.NAA10242@vu-vlsi.ee.vill.edu>; from "Nick Pine" at Feb 13, 96 1:32 pm No one has ever built a prototype of the small Fly's Eye (except the inner shell), not even in "3D" ciberspace. If this could be done, then maybe it's various performance characteristics could be simulated and evaluated. -- JOE S. MOORE joemoore@cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A ALTERNATE TEL AND/OR FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 USA I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 13 Feb 1996 20:24:49 GMT Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Chris Fearnley Organization: Philadelphia's Complete Internet Provider Subject: Re: Books tagdi@RUULCH.LET.RUU.NL wrote: : The Rise of Merchant empires James D.Tracy : Main street in crisis Cathereine Mcnicol Stock : British Weights & Measures Ronald Edward : The plain English guide Martin Lutts : : Four books that seem to be good ones, relevant to Fuller field. : Tagdi I finally found a copy of Alfred Korzybski's _Scince_and_Sanity_ (1948). I remember Bucky referred to Korzybski in several places and when I saw the book in an antiquarian bookstore, I picked it up and started reading it. It's clear that Bucky and Korzybski have much in common! -- Christopher J. Fearnley | UNIX SIG Leader at PACS cjf@netaxs.com | (Philadelphia Area Computer Society) http://www.netaxs.com/~cjf | Design Science Revolutionary ftp://ftp.netaxs.com/people/cjf | Explorer in Universe "Dare to be Naive" -- Bucky Fuller | Linux Advocate ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 12 Feb 1996 22:47:13 GMT Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Tognon Marco Organization: PING Belgium Subject: Re: Database Manual Tognon Marco wrote: > > INFO LISTDB MEMO This is not the way! How to then? Can anybody give a hint? The instructions ar not so clear (to me that is...) Thank you. Marco ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 13 Feb 1996 21:01:41 -0600 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: "J. Michael Rowland" Subject: Re: BUCKY LURKERS Geoff Armstrong sez: >I must admit I lean more towards enjoyment of the philisophical >discussions; but perhaps that's just because I don't have a grounding in >Geodisc math etc. > >This has probably already been provided several times; but can anyone >recommend a beginners guide to these concepts. After digesting this I may >feel on more of an equal footing with the rest of the group; in the >meantime many of the more technical discussions are going 'over my head' >(still fascinating though). > >If anyone can recommend such a book, just E-mail me direct. Thanks. Well, I don't know how good an introduction to geodesic math this is, but it is enjoyable philosophical reading, and it does provide the basis for the geodesic concepts: COSMOGRAPHY, Bucky's last book, published posthumously. I enjoyed it a lot, and I thought it explained some of his geometry in a way that made it more accessible to me. I recommend it, though it won't tell you how to build a house :-) jmr J. Michael Rowland.................................rowley@telalink.net ===========------------------------------------------------=========== |||||||(((( ASCII Text - Your BEST Entertainment Value ))))||||||| ===========------------------------------------------------=========== ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 14 Feb 1996 02:25:05 GMT Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Rick Bono Organization: Concentric Internet Services Subject: Re: Fullerene Special On Wed, 20 Dec 1995 17:41:47 -0500, James McCaig wrote: >At 12:52 PM 12/20/95 PST, Joe Moore wrote: > >>You're more than welcome! It was a great show. I noticed it was copyright >>1992; I wonder what they have discovered since? >> >Thanks also Joe. Does anyone know of any manufacturers or data about the >"geodesic tube" that was shown on the show? This could be very desirable in >conjunction with dome structures, which fascinate me. > >Does anyone know of software that runs on a PC for playing with domes, etc? > Try my freeware DOME program. You can find it at http://www.cris.com/~rjbono/index.html Follow the gedoesic dome links. You can also get there via Kirby Urner's web site. >Warm regards, > > >Maharaj James McCaig | Sufi Center of Washington >Brotherhood/Sisterhood Representative | Keepers of Sufi Center Bookstore >United States | http://guess.worldweb.net/suf >i > > jmccaig@worldweb.net ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 14 Feb 1996 02:25:10 GMT Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Rick Bono Organization: Concentric Internet Services Subject: Re: You've got my vote on the Geodesic Dome CD-ROM! On Tue, 13 Feb 1996 05:34:36 GMT, pdx4d@teleport.com (Kirby Urner) wrote: >ad238@seorf.ohiou.edu (Andy Hermetz) wrote: > >> Hey gang, >> Sounds like a great idea. I've been messing around with various dome >>layouts for the last couple of years--mainly on paper, my computer is to >>be upgrade immediately--and would like any help I could get with the math, >>layout, other designs, etc. > >Upgraded to a what I wonder? If a DOS machine, then you can download >DOME42.EXE from ftp.teleport.com /pub/users/pdxd/bin and get spheres >and sections of many frequencies, Class I and Class II, in DXF, >VRML, POV-Ray and other formats. Freeware, generously contributed >by Rick Bono. Also, Einar Thorsteinn is selling something for $12.95 >that sounds interesting, but I have no experience using it (no demo >version available). On my machine, I can generate geodesic spheres >and then fly around in them using a VRML browser (I use WebFx). But >that takes some serious CPU/video horsepower. > Just a short reminder, DOME comes complete with C++ source code and can be readily recompiled to run on Unix or Linux based machines (thanks to Chris Fearnley for providing a g++ make file and testing the port). Also, DOME can easily be run in a DOS session on the various MS Windows versions. Some folks have also ported previous versions of DOME to the Mac. Hope you all have fun with DOME! Rick Bono ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 14 Feb 1996 11:20:17 CST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: tagdi@RUULCH.LET.RUU.NL Subject: Re: Books In Message Tue, 13 Feb 1996 20:24:49 +0000 (GMT), Chris Fearnley writes: >tagdi@RUULCH.LET.RUU.NL wrote: >: The Rise of Merchant empires James D.Tracy >: Main street in crisis Cathereine Mcnicol Stock >: British Weights & Measures Ronald Edward >: The plain English guide Martin Lutts >: >: Four books that seem to be good ones, relevant to Fuller field. >: Tagdi > >I finally found a copy of Alfred Korzybski's _Scince_and_Sanity_ >(1948). I remember Bucky referred to Korzybski in several places and >when I saw the book in an antiquarian bookstore, I picked it up and >started reading it. It's clear that Bucky and Korzybski have much in >common! are you recommending this book? i always say that i will come to the writers Fuller had mentioned, but i keep forgetting. i hope soon, in particular the thinker( name is not at hand) who wrote about operative philosphy in the end of 19 century. p.s. the integration of paragraph = 1 or 2 sentence. and to think about the sentence and the verb is to close the case- maybe. tagdi ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 14 Feb 1996 07:54:54 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: Re: Database Manual In-Reply-To: <4fog1h$n9g@ping1.ping.be>; from "Tognon Marco" at Feb 12, 96 10:47 pm Tognon Marco writes: > Tognon Marco wrote: > > INFO LISTDB MEMO > > This is not the way! > How to then? > Can anybody give a hint? > The instructions ar not so clear (to me that is...) In the "To" line put: listserv@ubvm.cc.buffalo.edu Leave the "Subject" line blank. In the body of your post at the left margin put: info listdb memo ^^^^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ command type of info requested which db document (send the command HELP by itself to get a list of commands) Please keep in mind that the list server computer serves NUMEROUS lists (hundreds?). You are sending commands to the SERVER computer, not to a particular LIST maintained by the computer (such as GEODESIC). -- JOE S. MOORE joemoore@cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A ALTERNATE TEL AND/OR FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 USA I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 14 Feb 1996 08:29:17 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: Re: syn-l: geometry of metals Comments: To: synergetics-l@teleport.com In-Reply-To: <42439.tagdi@ruulch.let.ruu.nl>; from "tagdi@ruulch.let.ruu.nl" at Feb 14, 96 11:47 am tagdi@ruulch.let.ruu.nl writes: > > trying to enter the periodical table by way of synergetics. The chemical properties of an element is determined by the configuration of electrons surrounding it, which is controlled by the number of protons in the nucleus. A model of a nucleus can be built by assembling MITES (quarks). 3 mites will make 1 proton or 1 neutron, depending on its orientation (Hydrogen). 12 mites will form a model of Helium. 36 mites will build a model of Carbon. 48 mites will form Oxygen, and so on. See _Synergetics 1_, 940.00, 950.00 -- JOE S. MOORE joemoore@cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A ALTERNATE TEL AND/OR FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 USA I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 14 Feb 1996 09:01:25 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: Re: Geodesic Domes Comments: To: Cfrankel@aol.com In-Reply-To: <960214080259_143848220@emout09.mail.aol.com>; from "Cfrankel@aol.com" at Feb 14, 96 8:03 am Cfrankel@aol.com writes: > Hope you don't mind the e-intrusion -- picked up your great list of dome > manufacturers and hoped you wouldn't mind my asking you some questions The list is constantly changing--companies going in and out of business. Check the Thomas Register of American Manufacturers for a reasonably up to date list of active dome companies (I've been meaning to do that, but haven't been able to get to that project yet). > directly. I am seriously interested in building a geodesic dome as a > combination home/home-office but have some unresolved issues. > First: Any manufacturers you would recommend in particular (confidentially, > if you like)? Don't want to get into the recommending business--at least as far as dome manufacturers goes. > Second: aluminum or wood? (are there other options?) Let me put it this way: I don't like ANY material that can burn, rot, or be eaten by bugs, and I don't like materials that weigh a lot. > Third: I have heard horror stories about leaking -- when I told a friend I > was thinking of buying/building a geodesic dome, he said, "Does the kit come > with drip buckets?" Are the horror stories warranted? How can the problem, if > it exists, be circumvented? Yes and no. Depends on the particular design. I have seen articles on both sides of the argument. I'm not really an expert in this area. > Finally: Any other hot tips for me? Not really. You're going to have to do a lot of reading. Send away for the materials from the various manufacturers (literature, videotapes, etc). Talk to people who have already been through the process you're just starting. The Geodesic list is one good place. > Thanks for your help on this ... > BTW, I'm based in Connecticut .. maybe that info will help guide you re > construction, manufacturers etc ... > Best wishes (and thanks again), > Carl Frankel I'm going to forward your note to the Geodesic list and the corresponding newsgroup. There are bound to be at least a few people out there that can help you more than I can. Good luck and let us know how your quest is progressing. -- JOE S. MOORE joemoore@cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A ALTERNATE TEL AND/OR FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 USA I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 14 Feb 1996 20:37:47 CET Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: tagdi@RUULCH.LET.RUU.NL Subject: Re: solar?, literacy, the zero, connection In Message Tue, 13 Feb 1996 11:43:26 -0500, Nick Pine writes: >>Hi Nick and the sun lovers, > >Hiya Tag, > >>what is the % heat loss from a glass window? > >% of what? > >That depends on the temperature inside and outside the window. I usually >assume that a window with a single layer of glass has an R-value of 1 >in US units, and use "Ohm's law for heatflow," > >U = (T1- T2)A/R, > >where U is in Btu/hour, the Ts are the temperatures on each side of the >surface in degrees F, A is the area of the surface in ft^2, and R is the >US R-value from one side to the other through the surface. > >So if it's 72 F inside and 32 F outside, and the window has one square >foot of glass, > >U = (72 F - 32 F) 1 ft^2/R1 = 40 Btu/hour. > >If the sun is shining, about 300 Btu/ft^2/hour fall on the glass, as a >maximum, or about 1,000 Btu/ft^2/day on a south wall in winter where I live, >and I usually assume that all of that solar heat gets through the glass. >If 300 goes in, and 40 goes out, the percent heat lost from the window is >about 13%, and the solar collection efficiency is about 87%. Pretty good. > >If the temperature inside the window were 132 F, about 100 Btu/hour would be >lost, and the solar collection efficiency would be 66%. Still pretty good. sorry, i find the units of measurment in general so confusing, the above is understood. but how much of electricity in watts is lost every hour. remember that kw = to a 100 watt lamp running for 10 hour. if you go back and study the history of "english measurment", which is passed to them from the Romans you will see why this units are so messed up. i am quite sure that if you read the staff, you will find a lot of insights, you being the master of units. >You can do all this with watts and meters and degrees C too, BTW. i indexed the above for future refrence. >>what is indices of reflection mean? > >That's index of refraction, or the refractive index of a material. >That has to do with how fast light travels through a material. If >light travels slowly through the material, people say the material >has a high index of refraction, like glass. > >If light travels fast, as in air, the material has a low index. The lowest >index is 1, in a vacuum, where light travels fast, about one foot per >nanosecond, one way, or 10 microseconds per mile, round trip. Air is very >close to 1. Glass and copper are close to 1.5, ie light and electricity >travel about 2/3 as fast in glass and copper as in air. (Which slows down >computers and makes lenses bend light.) i take it that nanosecon is = 100,000,000 th of second. >Whenever electromagnetic waves (eg light) travel from a substance with >one index to a substance with a different one, some of the light is >reflected back at the interface. This is called a Fresnel loss or a >reflection resulting from an impedance mismatch. > >The amount of reflction depends on the angle of the light striking the >surface. Grazing angles make good reflections. If light hits perpendicularly >on the surface of a material with index n, and the other surface is air, >the fraction of light reflected at each surface is ((n-1)/(n+1)), squared, >ie about 4% at each interface. Some plastics have lower indices, so there >is less reflection, and glass can be treated with index matching coatings or >etchings to reduce this reflection to almost zero, but that can be expensive. >If a substance is very thin compared to a wavelength of light or heat, like >a very thin soap bubble wall, it apparently doesn't reflect much light at all. >Light that travels from a substance with index n1, and enters another with >index n2, at an angle A1 from the perpendicular, enters the n2 medium with >an angle from the perpendicular A2 such that >n1/n2 = sin A2/sin A1. > >This is known as "Snell's law." (Some birds know this intuitively, as they >dive for fish that look to be elsewhere.) fish eyes have the same index of refraction as the water, and therefor they do not need lense to limit the light going in. amphibians eye ball flatten as they go out to land, i wonder if the bird's eyes have somthing related to this staff. by the way tears cleans the eyes in mammales. > >>p.s it may be asking to much to ask those who send technical articles >> to explain few words at end, i think it help the operative mind. > >Maybe that's a good idea. But then we wouldn't be techno-priests, would we? i mean just 2 or 3 words. may be we should lean on the intutive side, i wonder how. by the way, they say that the arabic language have 40, or 200- i am not sure -names for donky, donkies treated very badly specially in Morocco, where they transport huge part of the load in that country. Morocco is very poor place. they also say repetition teaches the donky, i somtimes use that stratagey to learn the difficult staff. >>2p.s m, there are 70 million who do not know how to write in the U.S > >Really? That's a lot... > >> should connection happen in the beginning or in the end. > >Is this something to do with chickens and eggs? :-) yes, it sound wise. somehow the subconcious know more than the c. h- thanks Nick, i under'stood 90% of the above. Nick ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 14 Feb 1996 16:14:56 GMT Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: bill paton Organization: bp ent. Subject: The non-PhD "hobbyist" pathway for scientific research Here is something that I cam across which should be of real interest to Dymaxions, since it is along the lines that Bucky himself pursued, but with more access to research and knowledgable minds. Bill From: komaromi@ucla.edu (Dan Komaromi) Newsgroups: alt.inventors Subject: The non-Ph.D. "hobbyist" pathway for science research mailing list Date: Mon, 05 Feb 1996 22:27:45 GMT Organization: University of California, Los Angeles To join this list, reply via email to this post with the word "subscribe" anywhere in the message. To give you an idea what it's all about, I've included the welcome message below. Please keep in mind that we intend to be serious in maintaining high standards of scientific inquiry, using only rational, logical approaches (i.e. new age enthusiasts, herbalists, and scientologists need not apply!). The main purpose is to encourage creative, hard-working, and disciplined individuals to pursue their dream of contributing to science, without the bureaucracy associated with entering a Ph.D. program, college loans, etc. ------- Dear New Member, This is to acknowledge your request to join the mailing list, tentatively entitled "The 2nd Renaissance." The purpose of this list is to discuss tips, techniques, and the organization of a society for the creative science hobbyist. For example, we will be discussing ways to get published in scientific journals without having a Ph.D. or university affiliation, access to advanced research facilities and libraries, and the process of invention and patent issues. In the next few months, I will be gathering email addresses for the distribution list. Soon thereafter, I will announce the opening of the forum for your contributions. Dan Komaromi ___________________________ Email: komaromi@ucla.edu Phone: (310) 312-0570 10969 Rochester Avenue #202 Westwood, CA 90024 ___________________________ President, UCLA Neuroscience Undergraduate Society http://www.mednet.ucla.edu/dept/bri/NUS/welcome.htm Newsgroup: ucla.org.neurosci.undergrad.society ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 14 Feb 1996 22:36:27 GMT Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Chris Fearnley Organization: Philadelphia's Complete Internet Provider Subject: Re: Books tagdi@RUULCH.LET.RUU.NL wrote: : In Message Tue, 13 Feb 1996 20:24:49 +0000 (GMT), : Chris Fearnley writes: : >I finally found a copy of Alfred Korzybski's _Scince_and_Sanity_ : >(1948). I remember Bucky referred to Korzybski in several places and : >when I saw the book in an antiquarian bookstore, I picked it up and : >started reading it. It's clear that Bucky and Korzybski have much in : >common! : : are you recommending this book? I'm recommending one be aware of it. I've only just begun reading it, so I don't have an opinion on content. From the preface it's clear that Bucky and Korzybski were kindred spirits. It is not yet clear to me how useful Korzybski is. It's a big book, so I hope he has something to say :) -- Christopher J. Fearnley | UNIX SIG Leader at PACS cjf@netaxs.com | (Philadelphia Area Computer Society) http://www.netaxs.com/~cjf | Design Science Revolutionary ftp://ftp.netaxs.com/people/cjf | Explorer in Universe "Dare to be Naive" -- Bucky Fuller | Linux Advocate ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 14 Feb 1996 09:34:36 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Re: DREAM HOME -- d'eye de fly I was just wondering about the presumed "idnentical"ness of the inner & outer domes; doesn't this mean that one is raised 6" higher off of the ground then the inner one?... that's porbably fine, as far as insulative properties go (more at top), and'd require a slightly finicky shape of "conical" connection between the two, as well as a simple 6" cylinder at the base --presuming that it's a half-dome, which I don't recall of hex-pent; is it?... is fly's eye geometrically correct snslog (think so) ??... I don't get the idea of having the windmill IN the circular opening, although I just love that of having a whole-house compressed- (and sucked-) air system for powering tools & washing yo'friends (before they cross the incoming threshold/lip .-)... there really ought to be an interior lip for interior membranes on each of the cicles; is there, or isn't there? ----- "Time is the only dimension." -RBFuller Congecture on "FG#s": Non Compos Mentis!... We return thee to thou couches, Potatoes. ----- On Palmtree BBS: brihut@pro-palmtree.cts.com ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 14 Feb 1996 10:18:13 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Re: syn-l: Tensegrity: Warping into The Fourth Comments: To: "teleport.com geodesic"@ubvm.cc.buffalo.edu [plus "misc."] it seems like your bicolored smoke is a fuzzed rendition of the struts' Voronoi cells (although those are generally concerned with domains of points, so I'm not sure about that); I'm unsure as to where the 4th D is supposed to precipitate, there, as I'd like to see if the rest-states can be accomodated in ordinary space (what ever it is) by other means (loose tensegrities e.g.), Gerald. Eco@adm.pgu.serpukhov.su, do you work at Archer Daniels Midland?... could you please give SOME indication of the geomath of this "intellectual GIS" ?? Nick, were you implying that the shape of the bubbles is essentially irrelavent, as long as there's a film "match" the indices of the two media (viz, glass & air & glass) ?? Tagdi, the Gaurdian is a Breeteesh socialist rag, avail.in the states, not that I'd read it without strong compulsion (monetary incentive .-)... my above use or "irrelavent", as opposed to the dictionary's "irrelevant", is just to make it more like "relative", and is one of my few concessions to "plain English"; it this refers to simplyfying the spelling, mainly, or "Esperantizing" (i.e.Latinizing) the grammar, I don't have a problem with schemes to do the latter, but the former, tends to obscure the origins of the words! ----- "Time is the only dimension." -RBFuller Congecture on "FG#s": Non Compos Mentis!... We return thee to thou couches, Potatoes. ----- On Palmtree BBS: brihut@pro-palmtree.cts.com ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 15 Feb 1996 02:02:23 -0500 Reply-To: JustWINK Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: JustWINK Organization: America Online, Inc. (1-800-827-6364) Subject: Re: Books Speaking of books, Hasn't anybody but me read this? THE EVOLUTION OF PROGRESS by C. Owen Paepke Highly relevant to Fuller's ideas, though the primary message is not one that all will like to hear or agree with. Charles E. Peck ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 15 Feb 1996 06:25:19 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Bruce Lieberman Subject: Re: 'DOME' on the Mac Hey, can someone holler if they compile Rick's latest version of DOME on the Mac? I'd like to tinker with it, but I'm so buried I have NO time to play around with it and I'm not proficient in C++ to begin with. Thanks, Bruce ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 15 Feb 1996 08:32:42 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: Re: Books Comments: To: justwink@AOL.COM In-Reply-To: <4fulpv$kku@newsbf02.news.aol.com>; from "JustWINK" at Feb 15, 96 2:02 am JustWINK writes: > Hasn't anybody but me read this? > > THE EVOLUTION OF PROGRESS > by C. Owen Paepke > > Highly relevant to Fuller's ideas, though the > primary message is not one that all will like > to hear or agree with. > > Charles E. Peck Could you post the Table of Contents? -- JOE S. MOORE joemoore@cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A ALTERNATE TEL AND/OR FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 USA I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 15 Feb 1996 19:50:34 CET Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: tagdi@RUULCH.LET.RUU.NL Subject: The gardian, and books >Brain >>Tagdi, the Gaurdian is a Breeteesh socialist rag, avail.in the states, >>not that I'd read it without strong compulsion (monetary incentive .-)... >>my above use or "irrelavent", as opposed to the dictionary's "irrelevant", >>is just to make it more like "relative", and is one of my few concessions > >tag > that is sure not plain english to me, anyway i never read more than one > or two articles- which have relation with general patterns- like the last > about a solar electric plant in Italy. i agree with you, just like the >english hertage criticism with no goal- anyway i have little understanding > of that garbage. > >>to "plain English"; it this refers to simplyfying the spelling, mainly, >>or "Esperantizing" (i.e.Latinizing) the grammar, >>I don't have a problem with schemes to do the latter, but >>the former, tends to obscure the origins of the words! > >the book is not about spelling, it is about how to make your writing >simple(grammar is included). i read few pages once in a while, it is a >very good book- but who knows may be you are beyond repair. >tagdi ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 15 Feb 1996 09:16:16 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Nick Pine Organization: Villanova University Subject: Re: solar?, literacy, the zero, connection wrote: > Nick Pine writes: >> >>If the temperature inside the window were 132 F, about 100 Btu/hour would be >>lost, and the solar collection efficiency would be 66%. Still pretty good. > > sorry, i find the units of measurment in general so confusing, the above > is understood. but how much of electricity in watts is lost every hour. A Watt-hour is 3.41 Btu... h > remember that kw^= to a 100 watt lamp running for 10 hour. > i take it that nanosecon is = 100,000,000 th of second. One more 0: 10^-12 second. >> >>> should connection happen in the beginning or in the end. >> >>Is this something to do with chickens and eggs? :-) > > yes, it sound wise. somehow the subconcious know more than the c. Thanks for clearing tht up, Tag :-) Nick ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 15 Feb 1996 22:19:45 +0100 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Geoff Armstrong Subject: Re: BUCKY LURKERS >Geoff Armstrong sez: > >>I must admit I lean more towards enjoyment of the philisophical >>discussions; but perhaps that's just because I don't have a grounding in >>Geodisc math etc. >> >>This has probably already been provided several times; but can anyone >>recommend a beginners guide to these concepts. After digesting this I may >>feel on more of an equal footing with the rest of the group; in the >>meantime many of the more technical discussions are going 'over my head' >>(still fascinating though). >> >>If anyone can recommend such a book, just E-mail me direct. Thanks. > > >Well, I don't know how good an introduction to geodesic math this is, but >it is enjoyable philosophical reading, and it does provide the basis for >the geodesic concepts: COSMOGRAPHY, Bucky's last book, published >posthumously. I enjoyed it a lot, and I thought it explained some of his >geometry in a way that made it more accessible to me. I recommend it, >though it won't tell you how to build a house :-) > >jmr > >J. Michael Rowland.................................rowley@telalink.net >===========------------------------------------------------=========== >|||||||(((( ASCII Text - Your BEST Entertainment Value ))))||||||| >===========------------------------------------------------=========== Thanks, I'll try and track it down. Geoff ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 15 Feb 1996 17:16:33 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: MISSION TO PLANET EARTH NASA'S MISSION TO PLANET EARTH QUOTE: NASA's Mission to Planet Earth is a comprehensive science research enterprise designed to observe the Earth's land, atmosphere, and oceans from a global perspective using satellites, aircraft and ground-based measurements. Such studies will yield improved weather forecasts, better tools for managing agriculture and forests, information for ocean-related industries and coastal planners, and, eventually, an ability to predict how the Earth's climate will change in the future. ENDQUOTE. -------- NASA press releases and other information are available automatically by sending an Internet electronic mail message to: domo@hq.nasa.gov In the body of the message (not the subject line) users should type the words "subscribe press-release" (no quotes) The system will reply with a confirmation via E-mail of each subscription. A second automatic message will include additional information on the service. -- JOE S. MOORE joemoore@cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A ALTERNATE TEL AND/OR FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 USA I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 15 Feb 1996 17:20:24 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: Re: BUCKY LURKERS In-Reply-To: ; from "Geoff Armstrong" at Feb 15, 96 10:19 pm _Cosmography_ available from BFI (bfi@aol.com). Don't know the price. Ask for their catalog and free sample newsletter. -- JOE S. MOORE joemoore@cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A ALTERNATE TEL AND/OR FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 USA I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 15 Feb 1996 21:11:54 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Steve Brant Subject: Re: evolution of progress Comments: To: JustWINK@aol.com Does the author have the same awareness of the milestone achieved in human evolution that Bucky had? (I am referring, of course, to Bucky's awareness that sometime in the 1950's humanity evolved to the point of having the technical ability to provide for everyone's basic needs -- no more "win-lose," Darwinian, Malthusian world.) This would, to me, make the book either "accurate" or "inaccurate" regarding its claim to be telling the full story of the evolution of progress. ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 15 Feb 1996 20:22:43 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: JOURNAL GRAPHICS ONLINE I found the following material through my local online junior college library (while sitting in the comfort of my den): QUOTE: ----------------------------------------------------Journal Graphics Online- Host/Reporter: Correspondent Headline: `World Game' Students Live the World's Problems Program name: Future Watch (CNN) Network: Cable News Network Summary: College students in Illinois are playing a game that will teach them how to beat hunger, illiteracy and war. The inventor created the game after the ideas of Buckminster Fuller. Section: Science Show topics: Hunger & Famine Politics (non-U.S.) Education Guests: MEDARD GABEL, World Game Institute; CHRISTOPHER MODERSON, Rockford College; Air date: 09/03/1994 Show #: 127 Segment: 1 Program type: Show 1399 words ----------------------------------------------------Journal Graphics Online Host/Reporter: Correspondent Headline: Program name: Science & Technology Week (CNN) Network: Cable News Network Summary: Scientists have discovered that Carbon 60 (also called Buckminster Fullerene) superconductor. It can also be combined with other elements to develop new materials. Section: Science Show topics: Science & Technology Air date: 04/20/1991 Show #: 60 Segment: 2 Program type: Package ----------------------------------------------------Journal Graphics Online- Host/Reporter: Correspondent Headline: Biosphere Dome Rebirth Benefits Canadian Environment Program name: Future Watch (CNN) Network: Cable News Network Summary: The biosphere dome built for the 1967 World Fair in Montreal was partially burned down in the 1970s. Now, the Canadian government has renovated it as a high-tech environmental museum. Section: Science Show topics: Environment Science & Technology Canada Air date: 06/11/1995 Show #: 166 Segment: 5 Program type: ----------------------------------------------------Journal Graphics Online- Host/Reporter: Correspondent Headline: Genesis Program name: Future Watch (CNN) Network: Cable News Network Summary: A dome-like community in Los Angeles allows homeless people to govern their own community. Organizers insist this is temporary housing aimed at helping homeless people get back on their feet. Show topics: Homelessness Air date: 11/27/1993 Show #: 88 Segment: 1 ----------------------------------------------------Journal Graphics Online- Host/Reporter: Correspondent Headline: Indoor Skiing Program name: Future Watch (CNN) Network: Cable News Network Summary: A company in Japan has built a giant dome for indoor skiing. Section: Science Show topics: Sports Japan Air date: 07/24/1993 Show #: 70 Segment: 4 Program type: Package ----------------------------------------------------Journal Graphics Online- Host/Reporter: STUART VARNEY Anchor BILL DOORMAN Correspondent DEBORAH MARCHINI Anchor Headline: Shipbuilding Research Leads to Indoor Japanese Ski-Dome Program name: Business Morning (CNN) Network: Cable News Network Summary: The story behind the all-season ``ski-dome'' allowing Japanese to ski indoors goes beyond the novelty. NKK, the giant steelmaker, learned how to make the snow in research for its shipbuilding business. Section: News; International Show topics: Japan Sports Metals & Mining Guests: KATSUHIKO MURATA, Amenity Development, NKK Corp. (LIVE) Air date: 07/21/1993 Show #: 331 Segment: 3 Start time: 06:57 Program type: Package more follows -- press (Q to quit) 400 words ----------------------------------------------------Journal Graphics Online- Host/Reporter: Correspondent Headline: Georgia Dome Program name: Science & Technology Week (CNN) Network: Cable News Network Summary: Engineers are using classical theories of geometry to build the largest fabric dome in the world. Section: Science Show topics: Development & Construction Air date: 08/24/1991 Show #: 78 Segment: 2 Program type: Package 700 words ----------------------------------------------------Journal Graphics Online- Host/Reporter: Correspondent Headline: Houston Oilers Want New Stadium - Or Else Program name: Morning Edition (NPR) Network: National Public Radio Summary: Bud Adams, owner of the Houston Oilers, says another facelift on the Houston Astrodome won't do, and if the city wants to keep the NFL Houston Oilers in town, they'd better build a new downtown domed stadium. Section: News; Sports Show topics: Sports Guests: STEVE RADDICK, Commissioner, Harris County; JIM KOLER, President and CEO, Greater Houston Partnership Air date: 09/01/1995 Show #: 1685 Segment: 8 Program type: 592 words ----------------------------------------------------Journal Graphics Online- Host/Reporter: Correspondent Headline: Genesis One Project Puts California Homeless in Igloos Program name: Morning Edition (NPR) Network: National Public Radio Summary: Homeless in California are being given a second chance. A domed housing project known as Genesis One is large enough to hold two to four people, and come equipped with toilets, showers, and laundry facilities. Section: News; Domestic Show topics: Homelessness Los Angeles Guests: TED HAYES, Genesis One; EDDIE BURNS, Former Homeless Person; JAMES, Genesis One Resident; BILL, Genesis One Resident Air date: 11/15/1993 Show #: 1216 Segment: 4 Program type: Package 1167 words ----------------------------------------------------Journal Graphics Online- Host/Reporter: PATRICK GREENLAW Anchor CHARLES JACO Correspondent Headline: Tampa Wants to End Baseball Futility, Threatens Actions Program name: Prime News (CNN) Network: Cable News Network Summary: After unsuccessful bids to lure the Chicago White Sox and Seattle Mariners to their state-of-the-art domed stadium, the cities of Tampa and St Petersburg threaten legal action if they don't get the Giants. Section: News; Domestic Show topics: Sports Law, Justice & the Courts U.S. Southern States Guests: RICK MUSSETT, St. Petersburg Development Agency; BOB BUTTERWORTH, Florida Attorney General; Sen. CONNIE MACK (R-FL) Air date: 11/09/1992 Show #: 223 Segment: 3 Start time: 20:49 more follows -- press (Q to quit) Program type: Package 552 words ----------------------------------------------------Journal Graphics Online- Host/Reporter: TED TEXTOR Meteorologist ANNE KELLAN Correspondent Headline: Students Learn Geometry by Building Models Program name: Science and Technology Week Network: Cable News Network Summary: Schools in Albany, Oregon, teach geometry by having students build models of a domed sports stadium. Section: Science Show topics: Education Science & Technology U.S. Western States Guests: DIANE SMITH, Greater Albany Public Schools; CLARK POOLE, Math Teacher Calapooia Middle School; ERIC GARRETT, South Albany High School Air date: 05/16/1992 Show #: 115 Segment: 6 Start time: 09:24 Program type: Package 668 words UNQUOTE. -- JOE S. MOORE joemoore@cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A ALTERNATE TEL AND/OR FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 USA I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 15 Feb 1996 21:12:38 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: THOMAS REGISTER I found the following geodesic dome manufacturers using the Thomas Register of American Manufacturers "Supplier Finder" with the key words "geodesic" and "dome": (http://www.thomasRegister.com) ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- CONSERVATEK Conroe, TX 77305 USA 409-539-1747 FAX: 409-539-5355 Clear Span Aluminum Domes & Vaults ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ENERGY STRUCTURES, INC. St. Paul, MN 55106-5627 USA 612-772-3559 FAX: 612-772-1207 Geodesic Domes, Permanent Wood Foundations, Triangle Windows. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- FIBERGLASS PRODUCTS, INC. St. Louis, MO 63107 USA Call Toll Free: 800-473-3973 FAX: 314-535-7825 Fiberglass Fabricator Offering Corrosion Products, Tanks, Tank Linings, Pipe, Gratings, Structural & Field Repair Work. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- GEODESIC DOMES & HOMES Whitehouse, TX 75791-3038 USA 903-839-2000 FAX: 903-839-7228 Dome Systems, Skylights, Urethane Insulation. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- LUNN COMPOSITES, A DIV. OF LUNN INDUSTRIES Wyandanch, NY 11798 USA 516-643-8900 FAX: 516-643-5821 Advanced Reinforced Composite Product Technology From Conception To Production ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- NEVATECH INDUSTRIES, INC. Reno, NV 89523-8910 USA 702-747-3333 FAX: 702-747-3678 Engineered Composite Structures. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ORION CORP. Sarasota, FL 34243-2232 USA 813-351-1715 FAX: 813-351-1715 Fabric Structures, Air Supported, Tension ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- R.P.S. ENGINEERING INC. South Elgin, IL 60177 USA 847-931-1950 FAX: 847-931-4274 Conveyor Covers, Windows Wells, Areawalls, Corrugated Culvet Pipe, Corrugated Steel & Aluminum Siding. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- STARNET INTERNATIONAL CORP. Longwood, FL 32750 USA 407-830-1199 FAX: 407-830-1817 Designers, Engineers, Fabricators & Assemblers Of Spaceframes, Arches & Dome Enclosures With Integrated Metal Decking, Membrane, Glass & Acrylic Cladding Options ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- TECHNICAL INNOVATIONS, INC. Barnesville, MD 20838 USA 301-972-8040 FAX: 301-349-2441 Fiberglass Domes For Industry ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- TEMCOR Carson, CA 90745 USA 310-549-4311 FAX: 310-549-4588 Aluminum Clear Span Systems For Arenas, Gymnasiums, Ice Hockey Rinks, Tank Covers, Bulk Storage Facilities ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ULTRAFLOTE CORP. Houston, TX 77024 USA 713-461-2100 FAX: 713-461-2213 Floating Roofs & Clear Span Aluminum Geodesic Domes ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- JOE S. MOORE joemoore@cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A ALTERNATE TEL AND/OR FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 USA I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 16 Feb 1996 12:29:45 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Kirby Urner Subject: RBF & Whole Systems in Wired Mag (March) Comments: To: synergetics-l@teleport.com Thanks to Mark Kelly at BFI for bringing this one to my attention (from March '96 WIRED, pg. 179): WHOLLY WEBBED Although Buckminster Fuller first wrote about whole systems in his 1969 work Operation Manual for Spaceship Earth, a systems-based idea of connections among all things has managed to shrug off exacting definition. With strong regard for a universal holonomy, strengthened in resolve by scientific explorations in chaos, complexity, and quantification, members of the Whole Systems discussion group share provocative notions that would make Fuller proud. Topics have included: Virtual Society and Sustainability, New Circuit Designs for Motherboard Earth, Object Orientation Paradox, and Social Artistry. A short quote by pdx4d@teleport.com is a good example of the substantive content: "What you see on your screen is more nature -- human language variables shifting this way and that, propagating waves of meaning, all within nature's biome, and not consciously guided by any one ego." To get involved, send an e-mail message to listserv@netcom.com with subscribe wholesys-l in the body of the message. For even greater wholeness, hit http://newciv.org/worldtrans/whole.html and participate in the paradigms evolution. ---------------- Kirby -------------------------------------------------------- Kirby Urner "All realities are virtual" -- KU Email: pdx4d@teleport.com Web: http://www.teleport.com/~pdx4d/ ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 16 Feb 1996 15:39:48 -0600 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Chuck Stoffregen Subject: Class Just to quickly update all of you, the classes I had planned to teach at Madison Area Technical College fell through. Not enough interest in the area, I am afraid. In order to share information with the group, I willneed copyright clearence from David Kurske, formerly of Windworks (a Bucky Fuller company). He wrote the Geodesic Cookbook, the address on the book was Wild Rose, WI. In Kurby's 4-D Chronicler, he mentioned Windworks. Any ideas where David may be reached? Chuck Stoffregen Computer Teacher Wrestling Coach Madison Area Technical College cas1276@madison.tec.wi.us Fax (608) 246-6880 Synergy - Behavior of whole systems unpredicted by the behavior of their parts taken seperately. R.B. Fuller ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 16 Feb 1996 18:51:57 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: Re: Class In-Reply-To: ; from "Chuck Stoffregen" at Feb 16, 96 3:39 pm Chuck Stoffregen writes: > In order to share information with the group, I will need copyright > clearence from David Kurske, formerly of Windworks (a Bucky Fuller > company). He wrote the Geodesic Cookbook, the address on the book was Wild > Rose, WI. > In Kurby's 4-D Chronicler, he mentioned Windworks. Any ideas where David > may be reached? In the back of _Dome Notes_ by Hjersman (page 197) he gives the address of a David Kruschke as 2135 W.Juneau Ave, Milwaukee, WI 53233. The name of his self-published book was _Dome Cookbook of Geodesic Geometry_ (1975). Could this be the same person and book? > Chuck Stoffregen > Computer Teacher > Wrestling Coach > Madison Area Technical College > cas1276@madison.tec.wi.us > Fax (608) 246-6880 -- JOE S. MOORE joemoore@cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A ALTERNATE TEL AND/OR FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 USA I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 16 Feb 1996 11:58:34 -0500 Reply-To: JustWINK Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: JustWINK Organization: America Online, Inc. (1-800-827-6364) Subject: Re: Books >Could you post the Table of Contents? I don't have OCR, and am not sure that this group is really that interested. Here is a review quote: "This is a carefuly written book for everyone about where we are and where we're going. Amidst all the gloom about how 'America has lost its way" and 'Progress has ended,' this book says that what appears to be the end of progress is merely a change in direction. It makes you want to live on, just to see if the predictions are right." Robert Pirsig And, from the dust jacket: "In the coming days, Paepke says, we will not be wealthier, but our grandchildren will be smarter and healthier, our lives will be longer, and our computers will be thinking for themselves. Exploring the frontiers of the latest scientific research, Paepke maps the contours of a new paradigm for progress and offers a vision of how these fields will transform the way we live." THE EVOLUTION OF PROGRESS - The End of Economic Growth and the Beginning of Human Transformation by C. Owen Paepke 1993, Random House ISBN 0-679-41582-3 Recently available for only a few dollars at major booksellers. It apparently didn't sell well. ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 16 Feb 1996 18:29:58 GMT Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Kirby Urner Organization: 4D Solutions Subject: Re: You've got my vote on the Geodesic Dome CD-ROM! rjbono@cris.com (Rick Bono) wrote: > >Hope you all have fun with DOME! > >Rick Bono > Right. Apologies for artificially limiting the platforms for DOME to DOS alone. >Some folks have also ported previous >versions of DOME to the Mac. This I didn't know. Do we have a DOMEMAC.ZIP to make available to the public then? Kirby "having fun with DOME!" Urner -------------------------------------------------------- Kirby Urner "All realities are virtual" -- KU Email: pdx4d@teleport.com Web: http://www.teleport.com/~pdx4d/ ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 17 Feb 1996 03:22:29 GMT Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Rick Bono Organization: Concentric Internet Services Subject: Re: You've got my vote on the Geodesic Dome CD-ROM! On Fri, 16 Feb 1996 18:29:58 GMT, pdx4d@teleport.com (Kirby Urner) wrote: >rjbono@cris.com (Rick Bono) wrote: > >> >>Hope you all have fun with DOME! >> >>Rick Bono >> > >Right. Apologies for artificially limiting the platforms for DOME >to DOS alone. > >>Some folks have also ported previous >>versions of DOME to the Mac. > >This I didn't know. Do we have a DOMEMAC.ZIP to make available to the >public then? > >Kirby "having fun with DOME!" Urner > >-------------------------------------------------------- >Kirby Urner "All realities are virtual" -- KU >Email: pdx4d@teleport.com >Web: http://www.teleport.com/~pdx4d/ To clarify a bit, I know of one individual who ported version 3.5 to the Mac. He had some problems with his compiler and the numerical results and I'm not sure if he worked them out. I will try and contact him and see if he is still interested in helping out. Other people on Mac platforms have talked about running the DOS version with some emulator software. My understanding is that the Macs based on the Power PC have that ability built-in. I don;t know if other Mac users have software emulator available. I'll let you all know if I hear something on this... Rick "Having Fun Writing DOME" Bono ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 17 Feb 1996 12:21:56 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Re: Learning and Mathematics: Tobias, Not Dumb (fwd) Comments: To: "teleport.com geodesic"@ubvm.cc.buffalo.edu ------ Forwarded Message ------ >From vm2!math.Princeton.EDU!conway Thu Feb 15 00:17:36 1996 Date: Wed, 14 Feb 1996 12:45:08 -0500 (EST) From: John Conway Subject: Re: Learning and Mathematics: Tobias, Not Dumb To: Brian Hutchings Cc: geometry-pre-college@forum.swarthmore.edu On 14 Feb 1996, Brian Hutchings wrote: > sorry to stray from thread, perhaps this could be addressed > in another; can someone give an idea of the problems > in which Newton's dotty notation is preferable > to Liebniz' dx etc., and the other way around, or > when either is just as good? > > "Time is the only dimension." -RBFuller ... Conjecture on "FG#s": > Non Compos Mentis! > We return you to your regular channel. > Since I've just mentioned the Cambridge Philosophical Society in another connection, let me remark that it was founded by a group of young mathematicians who advocated "the principles of pure d-ism as opposed to the dotage of the University" In misguided homage to Newton, Cambridge persisted in using only his "dot" notation. The result was a steady decline in the quality of mathematics at Cambridge (and indeed in Britain more generally), so that very little good mathematics appeared there from about 1740 to 1840, when the Philosophical Society's reforms began to take effect, despite the fantastic advances on the continent. But let me try to answer your question, albeit rather indirectly. The Leibnitz notation is of great help in almost all elementary calculus computations, especially when one's changing variables, because it makes the formulae almost automatic. So for instance the x=b integral f(x)dx x=a might well be simplified by the change of variable x = y^2. Using Leibnitz' notation (as we are), it's "obvious" that it becomes y=root(b) integral f(y^2).2y.dy y=root(a) since dx = d(y^2) = 2y.dy. [I'm supposing that the problem is such that this is sensible - say 0 < a < b.] Again, Leibnitz' "chain rule" dz/dx = dz/dy times dy/dx, is made "obvious" by his notation. In the Newtonian notation (except that I'll use f' rather than f with a dot over it), this isn't so obvious, the formula being If h(x) = f(g(x), then h'(x) = f'(g(x)).g'(x). These good properties of the Leibnitzian notation become even more evident when one has functions of several independent variables: these are handled very poorly in the Newtonian notations - one has to use different styles of "dot" for each variable. The Newtonian notation's great strength is that it describes the differentiation map from functions to functions rather well. The derived function of f is just called f'. Leibnitz's notation demands a choice of dummy variable here - it only has a name for the value of this derived function at a variable number x, namely df(x)/dx. It has no name for the new function f' itself, and not even a name for f'(3) (say). So: we'd find it very hard to work in the calculus if we were deprived of the use of either of the two notations! John Conway ---- End Forwarded Message ---- On Wed, 14 Feb 1996 10:57:55 -0600 (CST), wrote: > Subject: Re: Learning and Mathematics: Tobias, Not Dumb > > Well to continue on this stray thread.... > > I'm currently a physics major over here at Carleton College and i find Newtons > "dotty" method preferable to the "dy/dx" notation simply becasue it is shorter > and quicker to write. When you proofs or derivations go for pages it is a > blessing on your hand. > > B. Geyer. ----- "Time is the only dimension." -RBFuller Congecture on "FG#s": Non Compos Mentis!... We return thee to thou couches, Potatoes. ----- On Palmtree BBS: brihut@pro-palmtree.cts.com ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 17 Feb 1996 13:46:13 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: To: Dr. Brian Hutchings [sic] (fwd) eco's previous note to me suggested that you ask him for any more info, as well as a demo. ------ Forwarded Message ------ >From vm2!adm.pgu.serpukhov.su!ECO Sat Feb 17 00:17:46 1996 To: brihut@pro-palmtree.cts.com From: ECO@adm.pgu.serpukhov.su Date: 16 Feb 96 16:33:36 GMT+3 Subject: To: Dr. Brian Hutchings The "intellectual GIS" (IGIS) approaches, a general overview of ideas and applications. 1) Objects, IGIS is dealing with, are matrices of "noised" surfaces (in general case, placed into a vector field - gravity, Sun radiation,...), such as those of land surface elevations, or human skin temperature. The general idea is to classify surface forms, and than extract data on forms of interest using classes and calculated for them matrices (=maps= images). To make this not a partial approach, fundamental classifications must be introduced, which cannot be revised for a long time (e.g., as Mendeleev's table). This is what I consider as "complete" classifications. At the time, no general complete surface forms classification is discovered. Complete classifications and corresponding variables for a "local" level have been introduced in my theoretical work [1]. To achieve this aim, I've introduced 5 new variables from fundamentally introduced 17 ones, and created 3 new classifications [1]. I used this idea for geological applications: to decode masked central type structures, lineaments, etc. I've found that for some terrains only new methods are effective for geological features decoding using an elevation matrix as only data source, including those 2 km under the Earth surface. The new approaches have also been used for probable karst and even induced seismic phenomena predictions. 2) Another idea is that practically all used in Earth sciences variables (concepts) do not describe landforms (=relative position of land surface parts). For example, gradient has no sense without gravity, because its definition needs vertical direction. I've introduced an another classification [1], for landforms ability to influence migrants (water, soils, contaminants,...) flows. So, IGIS approaches include direct landforms mapping (e.g., C-ridges and C-valleys in [1]); I've not found similar methods, maps or theories in literature (see geological applications above). 3) J.G.Speight's idea (1974) was that variables may be either local, or global. Earth scientists define a depression by its ability to hold a water (not by its concave form), so that sufficient surface inclination causes a concave pit to be not a depression. A planet, completely covered by an ocean, demonstrates that any planet is a single depression (==> depression concept is "global"). Only two global variables are known in Earth sciences at the time, both describing flows precautions, not forms; as to my knowledge, such variables are not known presently for landforms. My idea was to obtain a conceptual scheme for hydrogeological applications, carrying out a planetary consideration and deducing correspondidng natural hierarchies. This my work resulted in a founding that so called specific catchment area critical valu 4) Present-time commercial GIS's (e.g., ArcInfo, Intergraph) ability to predict geoecological measures sequences (such as contaminants redistribution, ground water vulnerability,...) or to decode geological features is essentially restricted. Usually, this is considered as a task for "modellers", which imply usage of subsets of really infinite data sets and empirical parameters; results are not objective. My idea is to use objectively calculated maps (matrices), based only on well-tried methods of initial elevation matrix transformations. This appeared to be an effective way for predictions and decoding. One (known) example is to calculate area for each matrix element, from which migrants (water,...) may contribute to this element, taking also possible depressions filling into account (e.g., for floods prediction). This is known as [maximal] specific catchment area. So, IGIS is not a modeller (it doesn't solve substantial equations), and differs from usual GIS's by its ability to calculate objective maps, which contain new useful for prognoses information. 5) For IGIS tools, also user-defined areas can be given (e.g., in vector form) and specific landscape features can be calculated for them. For example, users can receive for this area a subwatershed with drawn specific catchments area in it, that is, that terrain part, from which migrants (water,...) may contribute to this chosen area. Now not objective suggestions lie only in user interpretations (e.g., "if some contaminants concentrations are small, they cannot be collected"). Peter A. Shary ---- End Forwarded Message ---- ----- "Time is the only dimension." -RBFuller Congecture on "FG#s": Non Compos Mentis!... We return thee to thou couches, Potatoes. ----- On Palmtree BBS: brihut@pro-palmtree.cts.com ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 17 Feb 1996 14:45:46 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Re: syn-l: Tensegrity: Looseness Comments: To: "teleport.com geodesic"@ubvm.cc.buffalo.edu [and misc.] well, I realize that intersting stuff can congeal from that glob of mystiqual verbiage, so that I won't bitch too loudly, Gelard!... nor do I think that nothing can come from your little model of a paradigmatic elephant, about pushers' pasts & pullers futures but, if we assume that the 12 "nows" are connected by only 6 pushers, either the 6 of "expanded octah." or those through the middle (and I'm assuming that Struck doesn't bother with'em passing through each-other), what does that imply?... I didn't grok that stuff about the red & blue potsmoke (??) or cosmical jel-lo, but is it supposed to be connected to A & B modules -- or have you been hanging at too many "coffeeshops" in Amsterdam ?!?... the thing about the isocolored surface (or manifold, in Riemann's language) is of interest, womehow, two, but the warping of space is so clearly manifest, in time, by the movement of planets & the warping of light, that it may not require much in way of hyperthetical explaining-away; eh? Tagdi> _Plain English_ I'm glad to hear that it's just a book on writing well, and not a treatise on unscrewing Eengleesh!... also, I don't intend to "dumb-down" my typing for anyone in particular, without remuneration ($$$) !! Joe, was there any overlap from that listing of dome mfgs. in Sweets, with your list -- have you added'em to the next release? Robert> uncertainty principle I don't grok why it's necessary to assume that, just because the atom is teeny-weeny, that means that "x" (of "dx") of one electron is well-known; isn't it clear that it is not, relative to the position of the other electrons, speaking in terms of particles-not-waves, or to that "probability-amplitude" of even the single electron of a hydrogen atom?... it seems that a lot of physics-folk automatically assume that, because the act of measurement hopelessly pings the electron's trajectory, however that is conceived, that means that the electron "is" a fuzzy probability-anplitude ... and then you go off into endless mindscrewing about "vacuum energy" and Schroedinger's exploding joke-kittens! ----- "Time is the only dimension." -RBFuller Congecture on "FG#s": Non Compos Mentis!... We return thee to thou couches, Potatoes. ----- On Palmtree BBS: brihut@pro-palmtree.cts.com ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 18 Feb 1996 06:49:18 GMT Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Kirby Urner Organization: 4D Solutions Subject: Re: evolution of progress Steve Brant wrote: >Does the author have the same awareness of the milestone achieved in human >evolution that Bucky had? (I am referring, of course, to Bucky's awareness >that sometime in the 1950's humanity evolved to the point of having the >technical ability to provide for everyone's basic needs I believe that threshold was crossed in the 1970s -- according to Bucky. Somebody check me. Kirby -------------------------------------------------------- Kirby Urner "All realities are virtual" -- KU Email: pdx4d@teleport.com Web: http://www.teleport.com/~pdx4d/ ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 18 Feb 1996 16:09:34 CET Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: tagdi@RUULCH.LET.RUU.NL Subject: Re: evolution of progress In Message Sun, 18 Feb 1996 06:49:18 +0000 (GMT), Kirby Urner writes: >Steve Brant wrote: > >>Does the author have the same awareness of the milestone achieved in human >>evolution that Bucky had? (I am referring, of course, to Bucky's awareness >>that sometime in the 1950's humanity evolved to the point of having the >>technical ability to provide for everyone's basic needs > >I believe that threshold was crossed in the 1970s -- according to Bucky. >Somebody check me. > >Kirby> good students , you are right Kirby, that comes through his energy calculation( end of revoultions). i think political administration is so far behind that if you do the right thing we might send them home very very soon. the rate of change, invention coming every minute, all of that can not be adminstred with dull heads 2( Whitehead). Tagdi i personaly hate the s.., b ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 18 Feb 1996 17:27:03 CET Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: tagdi@RUULCH.LET.RUU.NL Subject: Re: Books >: Chris Fearnley writes: >: >I finally found a copy of Alfred Korzybski's _Scince_and_Sanity_ >: >(1948). I remember Bucky referred to Korzybski in several places and >: >when I saw the book in an antiquarian bookstore, I picked it up and >: >started reading it. It's clear that Bucky and Korzybski have much in >: >common! >: >: are you recommending this book? > >I'm recommending one be aware of it. I've only just begun reading it, >so I don't have an opinion on content. From the preface it's clear >that Bucky and Korzybski were kindred spirits. It is not yet clear to >me how useful Korzybski is. It's a big book, so I hope he has >something to say :) usualy when you are in contact with a thinker you have more of feeling of what he is talking about than reading a book by him. i watched a short T.V program about two clasrooms that recieved lessons from a teacher by video and computer, the atmospher was more free than a normal school, it may have to do with absence of the bold presence of the teacher authority. one school was in north of Filand with poppulation of150-200, and the other is in Hilsnki. Tagdi ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 18 Feb 1996 17:44:24 CET Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: tagdi@RUULCH.LET.RUU.NL Subject: Re: Books In Message Wed, 14 Feb 1996 11:20:17 -0600 (CST), Mohamed.Tagdi@let.ruu.nl writes: >In Message Tue, 13 Feb 1996 20:24:49 +0000 (GMT), > Chris Fearnley writes: > >>tagdi@RUULCH.LET.RUU.NL wrote: >>: The Rise of Merchant empires James D.Tracy >>: Main street in crisis Cathereine Mcnicol Stock >>: British Weights & Measures Ronald Edward >>: The plain English guide Martin Lutts >>: >>: Four books that seem to be good ones, relevant to Fuller field. >>: Tagdi i take " Main street in cirsis", out of my list or recommendation since it is too specialized. i thought it was about the bankers- and Lawcap, instead it was about the State of Dakota in the depression times. * three primary patteren for casual reading would be, the pirates hold on commerce in 19c and befor, the Banker Morgen, the assemblyline-lord Ford, Lawcap. Tagdi here is a refined classification for the structure of comprehensive ecucation. 1. ecological design of nature 2. invisible science of man 3. history of artificts to 1990 4. future artifacts from 1990 Tagdi ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 18 Feb 1996 08:33:21 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: Re: syn-l: Tensegrity: Looseness Comments: To: synergetics-l@teleport.com In-Reply-To: <199602181033.AA09542@xs1.xs4all.nl>; from "Gerald A. de Jong" at Feb 18, 96 11:33 am Time IS frequency, according to Bucky. No frequency, no time. -- JOE S. MOORE joemoore@bbs.cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A ALTERNATE TEL AND/OR FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 USA I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 18 Feb 1996 14:23:55 -0600 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Chuck Stoffregen Subject: Re: Class >> In order to share information with the group, I will need copyright >> clearence from David Kurske, formerly of Windworks (a Bucky Fuller >> company). He wrote the Geodesic Cookbook, the address on the book was Wild >> Rose, WI. >> In Kurby's 4-D Chronicler, he mentioned Windworks. Any ideas where David >> may be reached? > >In the back of _Dome Notes_ by Hjersman (page 197) he gives the address of a >David Kruschke as 2135 W.Juneau Ave, Milwaukee, WI 53233. The name of his >self-published book was _Dome Cookbook of Geodesic Geometry_ (1975). Could >this be the same person and book? > >> Chuck Stoffregen >> Computer Teacher >> Wrestling Coach >> Madison Area Technical College >> cas1276@madison.tec.wi.us >> Fax (608) 246-6880 > Bingo! Joe, that's the correct book and Author. Does anyone know his whereabouts? Chuck Stoffregen Computer Teacher Wrestling Coach Madison Area Technical College cas1276@madison.tec.wi.us Fax (608) 246-6880 Synergy - Behavior of whole systems unpredicted by the behavior of their parts taken seperately. R.B. Fuller ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 18 Feb 1996 15:49:06 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: "David F. Watkins" Subject: Re: evolution of progress In-Reply-To: <3126cbc4.79770083@news.teleport.com> Kirby, Here is a Bucky quote I often use that supports the early 70s. Unfortunately, I'm not sure of the original source for this quote. "For the first time in history it is now possible to take care of everybody at a higher standard of living than any have ever known. Only ten years ago the 'more with less' technology reached the point where this could be done. All humanity now has the option of becoming enduringly successful." - Buckminster Fuller, 1980. Dave Watkins On Sun, 18 Feb 1996, Kirby Urner wrote: > Steve Brant wrote: > > >Does the author have the same awareness of the milestone achieved in human > >evolution that Bucky had? (I am referring, of course, to Bucky's awareness > >that sometime in the 1950's humanity evolved to the point of having the > >technical ability to provide for everyone's basic needs > > I believe that threshold was crossed in the 1970s -- according to Bucky. > Somebody check me. > > Kirby > > -------------------------------------------------------- > Kirby Urner "All realities are virtual" -- KU > Email: pdx4d@teleport.com > Web: http://www.teleport.com/~pdx4d/ > ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 18 Feb 1996 12:46:36 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: HANGING SHELF--ABSTRACT HANGING STORAGE SHELF UNIT Abstract of U.S.A. Patent # 4,377,114 by R. Buckminster Fuller Filed: 10-05-81 Issued: 03-22-83 QUOTE: The present invention provides hanging storage compartment apparatus with various shelf levels adapted to be suspended by a plurality of tension lines from an overhead structure, such as a ceiling. The storage apparatus includes at least one storage unit rotatably mounted to a suspended stationary member, such as a platform. Tension lines secured to the suspended member or platform are used to hang the storage apparatus from the overhead structure. A rotation bearing, such as a ball bearing ring, interposed between the suspended member or platform and the storage unit enables rotation of the storage unit relative to this suspended stationary member. In a further embodiment of the invention, upper and lower storage units, both of which are rotatable, may be mounted respectively above and below the suspended platform. A rotatable shaft passing through the suspended platform concentric with the rotation bearing, joins the upper and lower units so that rotation of either unit relative to the suspended platform simultaneously rotates the other unit by a corresponding amount. The weight of the storage shelves and contents keeps the suspension lines taut and thus provides overall stability. In another embodiment of the invention, a non- rotatable suspended storage shelf unit is hung from an overhead structure, such as a ceiling, so that the unit is positioned in a desired attractive location in a room, elevated above the floor. END QUOTE. Source Translation & Optimization (STO) Gregory Aharonian, Publisher Internet Patent News Service http://sunsite.unc.edu/patents/intropat.html P.O.Box 404 Belmont, MA 02178 USA 617-489-3727 patents@world.std.com -- JOE S. MOORE joemoore@bbs.cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A ALTERNATE TEL AND/OR FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 USA I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 19 Feb 1996 01:14:55 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Steve Brant Subject: When humanity crossed the threshold Kirby asks for clarification of humanity's crossing of the threshold between a "you or me" world and one in which we had the ability to take care of everyone's basic survival needs. This is one of my favorite subjects, so here's what I know: In Bucky's "Keynote Address at Vision 65" (from the book Utopia of Oblivion: the Prospects for Humanity) he says the following: "Only one decade ago, at the meeting in Geneva and its companion meeting of the Food and Agricultural Organizatoin of the United Nations, it cam so clearly into scientific view that theleading world politicians could acknowledge it to be true that -- as reported unequivocally by Gerard Piel, publisher of the Scientific American -- for the first time in the history of man, it was in evidence that there could be enough of the fundamental metabolic and mechanical energy sustenance for everybody to survive at high standards of living -- and furthermore, there could be enough of everything to take care of the increasing population while also always improving the comprehensive standards of living. Granted the proper integratioin of the word around potentials by political unblockings, there could be enough to provide for all men to enjoy all earth at a higher standard of living than all yesterday's kings, wityout self-interferences and with no one being advantaged at the expense of another." (This is on page 123 of the hardcover book, which is copyright 1969 by Bucky and published by The Overlook Press, Woodstock, NY -- what a great year and place for this book to have been published.) I tracked down the reference to Gerard Piel's essay, referred to by Bucky. Even though Mr. Piel was the publisher of Scientific American, his essay appeared in The Bulletin of the Atomic Scientist in one of its 1955 issues (I can't track down the issue at the moment). I have read the article and Mr. Piel explicitly refers to humanity's newly achieved ability to impact our environment (both positively and negatively). In his most recent book, Only One World: Our Own to Make and to Keep (1992, W.H. Freeman & Co.), Mr. Piel says: "Ever since the beginig of civilization, people have organized their social institutions to secure the inequitable distribution of goods that wer alway, until recent times, in short supply. Now the inequity that divides humankind is international; people are inhabitants of rich nations or of poor nations. And the rich go on living at the expense of the poor. >From historic habit, nations make policy and people continue to root their morality in the assumption that ther can never be enoug to go around. The industrial revolution has confuted that assumption. If people will use industrial technology equitably and wisely, they may at last, in the words of Indira Gandhi, "make this only Earth a fit home for man."" In summary, I use the year 1955 as the time when the threshold was crossed, based on Gerard Piel's original article. (It also happens to be the year in which I was born, which is sort of fun.) Hope this helps, Kirby; although I'd certainly be interested in any other information people have seen about this subject. - Steve ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 19 Feb 1996 08:53:25 GMT+0200 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: "Venter, Dawie" Organization: Denel Informatics, Cape Reg Office Subject: Geodesic Stress Analysis Is anybody aware if any stress analysis data for 3/8, 5/8 geodesic dome structures are available somewhere? I want to know if all the components of the structure are under compression, or are there some under tension as well? Where are the highest loads concentrated under static and wind loading conditions, etc.? So many questions so few answers. I'm not a structural engineer, and battling my butt off to find out how strong to make the components (triangular panels) for a 4 meter radius fibreglass dome. Regards Dawie Venter (Cape Town, South-Africa) ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 18 Feb 1996 14:21:04 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Re: syn-l: Tensegrity: Looseness [and misc.] Comments: To: "teleport.com geodesic"@ubvm.cc.buffalo.edu it seems to me that a simple linear factor, multiplying all of the springs, ought to adjust the explosive, all-push tenseg. into some sort of balance, but I don't know that it can be done in integral powers of phi; it's just another experiment from the tetspatial one, I guess.... as for the putative manifold, I really don't follow Riemann, as much as I love'im, but you were going-on about a 4D thingy, or what could possibly be considered as a 3d manifold in a 4d space, although it's too undefined, now, for anyone to say, one way or t'other, let-alone myself!... there may, indeed, be 4th-powering involved in the shovin'an'jerkin' between the two phases of spring, but there may not be sufficient reason to chuck Bucky's dictum, Time is not a dimension/[and/or see below] ... if it is workable, in that form, as a model of something, anyway; obviously, if you can fabricate a nice model, something'll eventiually map onto it! about the motorcycle-mechanic's review of Paeske's book, which is news to me, the NewInfoAgeOrder stuff about the end of growth, usually inferring human population in quamalthusian terms, increasingly the same thing as the rhetorical effluvia of "Republicans" R Them, is generally based upon a presumption of a "post-industrial society" that is really, largely, feudalism (see, for instance, the above-cited Exec.Intel.Rev., or their cheaper newpaper .-)... I realize that Bucky's talk of ephemeralization (doin'more with less) seems to put that in a different light, but it is NOT post-industrial, although the US practically is, in a very scarey & improper way. re the quark/mite analogy, I also wholeheartedly agree with Robert's analysis, but I'm not going to quote it for everyone, for the 3rd time!... you'd understand, if you were scrolling at 300baud, that it was such a simple review as to make quoting utterly unneedful!... indeed, mites could have some relavence to quarks et vise versa, end of story. James, why didn't you ask Steve-o about mites ?!?... flat taxing is a sort of a non-issue, compared to the deficit, which SHOULD be a non-issue, except that it's mostly due to the interest-bearing issue of El Phed, that nonconstitutional usurpation of the function of govt. to make credit available to the nation a nominal cost, not according to the "free market" whims of an absolute ideologue from Ayn Remington Rand's "Class of'42", the current chairmonster thereof. Kirby, congratulations on getting quoted by Wired, although anything associated with Point is way down on my list of accolades; sorry, but I haven't re-subscribed to WER (and will never buy Wired, which is such a load of hype & some good stuff), since I discoverd that Stew Brand has a God-am "shrine" to Churchill in his toolshed; when you add that to his assoc.with Royal Dutch/Brit.Shell in the "GBN", it just makes me puke, red & blue contours! I'd like to hear more about Waterman's stuff, or cites to it, esp.with regard to IVM-points! Robert, those cites didn't include any to Snelson's model; did they?... it seems to've dysappeared into a black hole, since it was out on tour in'90! ----- "Time is the only dimension." -RBFuller Congecture on "FG#s": Non Compos Mentis!... We return thee to thou couches, Potatoes. ----- On Palmtree BBS: brihut@pro-palmtree.cts.com ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 19 Feb 1996 12:20:53 +0100 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Arne Buchholz Subject: Mailing List I was told:" There are mailing list servers devoted to Fuller, Multiple recipients of list GEODESIC ". If that is so, I would appreciated it if you could add me to this mailing list. Thanx in advance. Arne Buchholz (uzs3fe@ibm.rhrz.uni-bonn.de)____o00________00o_____ | | ____ | | |_/ 0o \_| | vvvv ERROR. REALITY.SYS CORRUPT. REBOOT UNIVERSE (Y/N/Q)? ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 19 Feb 1996 13:30:06 CST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: tagdi@RUULCH.LET.RUU.NL Subject: syn-l: MITE and Coupler Comments: To: synergetics-l@teleport.com the coupler octahedron(vertaxia) is allspace-filling and of the same 24 module volume as the regular tetra. the coupler is asymmetric octahedron, its 8 positive or negative Mite aab module. sytes 4As and 2Bs, 3 ways to build which add to 24 units. 8 ways to build the mites x 3 quanta = 24 quanta = one tetra. this a bit mixed up, i am just trying to see where the coupler fit. if i am not mistaken Fuller associate the coupler with the neutron and the proton. * Stev Comb few months ago refered to a book title " alphabet of the heart", i try to find but with no luck. anyone read that book. * synergetics is about 10% matematical, 90 pulp. the language is importand, a mine of ways to see Universe, while if we only want to understand the mathematical data, we can leave it out. if we have this 10% condensed, i would think that we will be clear about the extent of our understanding of the geometry and can extend the research outwardly to related connection. Tagdi ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 19 Feb 1996 09:28:22 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: Re: Mailing List In-Reply-To: ; from "Arne Buchholz" at Feb 19, 96 12:20 pm Arne Buchholz writes: > If that is so, I would appreciated it if you could add me to this > mailing list. You have already successfully subscribed because I got your post through the Geodesic list. Welcome aboard. -- JOE S. MOORE joemoore@bbs.cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A ALTERNATE TEL AND/OR FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 USA I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 19 Feb 1996 14:00:53 GMT Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: bill paton Organization: bp ent. Subject: The Third Wave I am reading The Third Wave by Alvin Toffler, who writes along the lines of Buckminster Fuller. In fact, I feel like he is writing where Bucky left off. Even though this book is written in 1980, it is still relevant today. I intend to give a brief synopsis of the book when I am finished it, so that other Dymaxions are aware of what it is all about. Bill ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 19 Feb 1996 10:09:08 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: Re: syn-l: MITEs, Quarks, and "SuperStrings" Comments: To: synergetics-l@teleport.com In-Reply-To: <199602190452.XAA21685@crucible.inmind.com>; from "James Fischer" at Feb 18, 96 11:52 pm A drawing of Bucky's Unified Field model is in _Synergetics 1_. See fig 982.61 in the Drawings Section and 982.61 in the text. See 1077.11 in _Synergetics 2_ for the corresponding formula. -- JOE S. MOORE joemoore@bbs.cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A ALTERNATE TEL AND/OR FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 USA I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 19 Feb 1996 14:11:02 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Steve Brant Subject: Film about Bucky - original PR I just found the press release from 1991 that announced the Simon & Goodman Company's film project about Bucky. I'm posting its text here. I'm curious to know how the actual film, seen at the Sundance Film Festival by someone in this group, matches with the intention as stated in the press release. "Intuition: A Voyage with R. Buckminster Fuller is an hour long film to be broadcast as part of the critically acclaimed Amercican Masters series on Public Television. Fuller was best known as an architiect and creator of the Geodesic Dome -- but he was also a scientist, a designer, a mathamatician, poet, and engineer, a philosopher, an inventor and perhaps most of all a humanitarian. A self-proclaimed "citizen of the world," Fuller believed that only through the creative use of technology would man be able to ensure his survival on the planet he called Spaceship Earth. Thus he devoted his life to improving the human lot, in whatever way possible. INTUITION will be the dramatic story of a man whose goal was to see how far one mans potential could reach, defying boundaries imposed by conventional culture, recognized disciplines and simple chronology. The counter-culture of the sixties adopted him, but Fuller transcends trendy categories; his challenges to orthodoxy were bold in the thirties; they are no less so today. The program will include a selection of material from the Fuller Institute's vast archive, which the Smithsonian called the "most expensive personal archive in existence." The film will carefully weave material from the archive together with new original photography of Fuller's work. It will include interviews with some of his prominent collegues in the arts and the sciences providing added insight and first-person narrative. Exploring Fuller's life and work in both a historical and contemporary context, the program will also focus on ways in which his impact is powerfully apparent today. Because Fuller translated philosophy into physical constructs, his contributions have enourmous potential for film. Because his visual creations sprang from profound insights, their beauty expands with the historical exploration of the concepts that gave them seed." Not having read this release in over five years, I was struck by its vision. I am curious to know if the film makers were able to come close to this vision with their final product. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 19 Feb 1996 11:12:18 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: ELECTRON SHELL MODELS Comments: cc: Synergetics List AN IMPROVED MODEL OF ELECTRON SHELLS by Joe S. Moore Revised 8-12-95 In 1966 and 1978 the sculptor, Kenneth Snelson, patented an improved way of modeling the various electron shells. His models reflect nature's geometry as discovered by R. Buckminster Fuller. Snelson's models demonstrate that there are only seven possible geometric shapes that the local electron orbits can take. For further information see: "A Design for the Atom", Industrial Design (mag) by Kenneth Snelson Feb 1, 1963 pages 48-57 "Model for Atomic Forms" Oct ?_, 1966 by Kenneth Snelson U.S.Patent 3,276,148 "Model for Atomic Forms" Jul 11, 1978 by Kenneth Snelson U.S.Patent 4,099,339 'Portrait of an Atom: An Exhibition', Maryland Science Center, Baltimore, MD by Kenneth Snelson _?_ ?_, 1981 26 pages -- JOE S. MOORE joemoore@bbs.cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A ALTERNATE TEL AND/OR FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 USA I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 19 Feb 1996 10:57:59 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: Re: The Third Wave In-Reply-To: ; from "bill paton" at Feb 19, 96 2:00 pm bill paton writes: > I am reading The Third Wave by Alvin Toffler, who writes along the lines How about posting the table of contents in the meantime? > I intend to give a brief synopsis of the book when I am finished it, so > that other Dymaxions are aware of what it is all about. -- JOE S. MOORE joemoore@bbs.cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A ALTERNATE TEL AND/OR FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 USA I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 19 Feb 1996 16:48:35 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: "Dr. Rick Kirschner" Subject: Fwd: *** Feb. 29 Email to President Comments: To: Winsor White III <73443.256@compuserve.com>, Bones <71601.1522@compuserve.com>, Ponytail , Ektnyc@aol.com, Spock , Lavonne Mullet , "Dr. Bruce Canvassar" , Allan Russell , Robert Timberlake <75213.2063@compuserve.com>, John Weeks , Kate Wilhelm , Deb Lilly <73241.416@compuserve.com>, Louise Edwards <75407.3721@compuserve.com>, Gary Kirschner Subject: *** Feb. 29 Email to President Sent: 02/19 1:23 PM Received: 02/19 4:37 PM From: Scott McKeown, smckeown@pa.mother.com To: drrick@mind.net FYI >X-POP3-Rcpt: smckeown@pa >X-Sender: kmitchel@netcom6.netcom.com >Date: Mon, 19 Feb 1996 10:59:52 -0800 >To: compinst-l@netcom.com >From: Kenneth Mitchell >Subject: *** Feb. 29 Email to President >Sender: owner-compinst-l@netcom.com >X-Status: > > >To whoever may read this, >This is not a typical chain letter, in that by passing it on to as many >people as you can, you are taking part in what may yet become the world's >biggest practical joke. The U.S. Government has recently passed an act which >enforces censorship on the internet. A group of internet users has now come >together to kick back at this oppression, and have a bit of fun at the same >time. > >The aim of this exercise is to re-establish the United States as "The land >of the Free", not a fascist state where freedom of speech and thought are >curtailed. Communist Russia fell as a result of such limits being placed >upon the minds of the general populous. On receiving this letter, please pass >it on to as many friends or E-mail lists as you can. We predict that if >everybody copies the letter to 5 other addresses, by February 29th 1996, >this letter should have reached in excess of 2 million people. That's when >the fun begins........ By sending the letter on the date above, you will >contribute to either one huge petition for freedom, or else lead to a crash >of the Whitehouse server. > >On February 29th, please send the following message to: > > President@Whitehouse.gov >- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - > >TO: The President of the United States of America >FROM: We the People (your boss) > > >Dear Mr. President, > >DO YOU REMEMBER THIS???? > > > THE BILL OF RIGHTS > >Amendment I > >Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or >prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, >or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to >petition the government for a redress of grievances. > > >Amendment II > >A well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free state, >the right of the people to keep and bear arms, shall not be infringed. > > >Amendment III > >No soldier shall, in time of peace be quartered in any house, without >the consent of the owner, nor in time of war, but in a manner to be >prescribed by law. > > >Amendment IV > >The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, >and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be >violated, and no warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported >by oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be >searched, and the persons or things to be seized. > > >Amendment V > >No person shall be held to answer for a capital, or otherwise infamous >crime, unless on a presentment or indictment of a grand jury, except in >cases arising in the land or naval forces, or in the militia, when >in actual service in time of war or public danger; nor shall any person be >subject for the same offense to be twice put in jeopardy of >life or limb; nor shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness >against himself, nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due >process of law; nor shall private property be taken for public use, without >just compensation. > > >Amendment VI > >In all criminal prosecutions, the accused shall enjoy the right to a speedy >and public trial, by an impartial jury of the state and district wherein the >crime shall have been committed, which district shall have been previously >ascertained by law, and to be informed of the nature and cause of the >accusation; to be confronted with the witnesses against him; to have >compulsory process for obtaining witnesses in his favor, and to have the >assistance of counsel for his defense. > > >Amendment VII > >In suits at common law, where the value in controversy shall exceed twenty >dollars, the right of trial by jury shall be preserved, and no >fact tried by a jury, shall be otherwise reexamined in any court of the >United States, than according to the rules of the common law. > > >Amendment VIII > >Excessive bail shall not be required, nor excessive fines imposed, nor >cruel and unusual punishments inflicted. > > >Amendment IX > >The enumeration in the Constitution, of certain rights, shall not be >construed to deny or disparage others retained by the people. > > >Amendment X > >The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor >prohibited by it to the states, are reserved to the states respectively, or >to the people. > > >=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= -= >--------------------------------------------------------------------------- >Kenneth Mitchell | "Writing in Roll Call, [Sen. Feinstein] proposes what >8037 Stone Cyn Cir |would in effect be a national identity card system for >Citrus Heights, CA |all American workers. To reduce the inevitable fraud, >95610 |she doesn't mind if each card has 'a magnetic strip on >916-449-9152 (vm) |which the bearer's unique voice, retina pattern, or >916-729-0966 (fax) |fingerprint is digitally encoded.' " >Finger for PGP | Paul Gigot, WSJ, 5/26/94 >Public Key! | >kmitchel@netcom.com| "Let me see your identity papers. NOW, citizen!" >------------------http://www.vpm.com/kmitchel/home.htm-------------------- > > > Buckminster Fuller said "If humanity does not opt for integrity, we are through completely. It is absolutely touch and go. Any one of us could make the difference." Dr. Rick Kirschner CoOwner, Creative Director R&R Productions Homepage: http://id.mind.net/~drrick Website: http://www.teleport.com/~tworicks ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Feb 1996 01:37:55 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: James Fischer Subject: E-mail to the President (A Rebuttal) Comments: cc: drrick@MIND.NET, postmaster@MIND.NET, Winsor White III <73443.256@compuserve.com>, Bones <71601.1522@compuserve.com>, Robert Timberlake <75213.2063@compuserve.com>, Deb Lilly <73241.416@compuserve.com>, Louise Edwards <75407.3721@compuserve.com>, postmaster@compuserve.com, Spock , Ponytail , "Dr. Bruce Canvassar" , postmaster@eworld.com, Ektnyc@aol.com, Lavonne Mullet , John Weeks , postmaster@aol.com, Allan Russell , postmaster@lotus.com, Kate Wilhelm , postmaster@sedona.net, Gary Kirschner , postmaster@netcom.com Postmasters: The "cc: list above (except for postmasters) was listed in "Comments To" on the copy of the spam I was sent. One might conclude that these parties are involved in this planned "prank", but I hesitate to accuse anyone of actions that are grounds for instant termination of their accounts. Dr. Rick Kirschner (drrick@mind.net) blessed our little group with a forwarded load of 100% spam, aged well beyond the "expires by" date printed on the can by Hormel. He appears to have been duped by the latest "Death of the Net, film at 11" spam. Forgive him, as we must conclude that he knows not what he does. <><><><><><> Spam Below - Comments Are Mine <><><><><><><><><><><><><><> ><><><><><><> If you cut here, you will break your display <><><><><><>< >>To whoever may read this, if anyone... >>This is not a typical chain letter, How is it not typical? It seems like a rather poor example, which, sadly, IS more and more typical these days, now that every pop-tart on the planet has bought a modem. >>in that by passing it on to as many people as you can, you are taking part >>in what may yet become the world's biggest practical joke. How amusing. Let's all waste bandwidth, storage, and time to "keep the Net free". Let's make a feeble attempt to crash a sacrifical host somewhere, and feed the egos of a few newbies who are gulible enough to think that e-mail to "whitehouse.gov" goes anywhere near the White House. >>The U.S. Government... ...which may ITSELF be the biggest practical joke on the planet... >>...has recently passed an act which enforces censorship on the internet. ...and is being challenged in court by the ACLU, which is the proper way to address such issues. Take a civics course, and find out how governments work. THEN you can figure out how to do something within the system, or at least overthrow it. I like political action. I like grass-roots action. I even enjoy the occasional bloodless coup, if it does not pre-empt the World Cup playoffs, but I am getting sick of all this useless impotent thrashing about by people who would not even know their elected representatives if they bumped into them on the street. >>A group of internet users ...surely you mean "internet loosers", here. Musta been a typo. >>has now come together to kick back at this oppression, and have a bit >>of fun at the same time. "Opression" that one can "kick back at" is not opression at all. >>The aim of this exercise is to re-establish the United States as "The land >>of the Free", This land is so free, that even blatant stupidity like this is tolerated with a smile. But not by me, rest assured. Not by me. >>By sending the letter on the date above, you will contribute to either >>one huge petition for freedom, or else lead to a crash of the >>Whitehouse server. As if they have no idea how to set up their server to send messages with certain headers to /dev/null. As if the White House server is even in the same domain as "whitehouse.gov". Buy a vowel, you fruit-filled toaster pastries. All this sort of unmitigated crap does is run up everyone's bills a tiny little bit. This sort of foolishness only plays into the hands of the gang currently in possession, since it "proves" that the Net is the playground of childish fools, who "need" to be controlled. Until recently, the Net was a calm place where much work got done, and such legislation would have been met with bemused but thoughtful observations about the futility of the law as proposed. Now, the newbies want to turn it into not only a shopping mall, a video arcade, and a "1-900" singles line, but they also want to turn it into a "grass-roots forum" for 100% counter-productive, self-described "pranks". (A "prank" would be to make hundreds of thousands of messages appear to be sent BETWEEN those who voted for the bill at issue. Since the planners behind the suggested prank have no clue how to execute a well thought-out prank, they settle for actions that will be 100% not funny, and 100% useless.) I pay for dual T1s, redundant POPs, nearly 700 terrabytes of storage, and THIS DRIVEL is what I get in my low-pirority mail stream? Pardon me while I go bang my head against a rack of SCSI drives... ah, I feel much better now. There are much more productive ways to use the Net to add some value to efforts to "keep the net free". I would suggest that one look to the Electronic Freedom Foundation for examples and models. Speaking for myself and the Information Supercollider, we are sick are tired of spams like this. This 100% content- free excrement is exactly why costs are higher, Newsfeeds exceed 300MB per day, and the "net result" is boredom. Given that we have the raw cycles, multiple fat pipes, and fault-tolerant linkages to multiple backbones to stay up when the majority of the Net goes down, we will watch and wait. Rather, the machines will watch and wait for us. If I were a mean-spirited person... and I noticed even the SLIGHTEST lag in traffic on the major backbones, or saw even ONE major server with which I interact go down on February 28th, I might insure that each and every person that sent or posted the subject chain-mail letter to any newsgroup or e-mail list would receive (absolutely free of charge) 10,000 or so null e-mail messages from random addresses, with random subject lines (uses much less bandwidth than the proposed "prank", but packs the same impact). Given the fact that Deja News and all the various mail-list archives could be scanned in less than an hour, I would be able to find the majority of the "pranksters" by roughly 05:00 GMT 01/29/95. The traffic created by any such retaliation would have to be spread over a 2-day period, and various twisty-turny paths would be used so as to not put an unusual load on any single backbone or anon server. Any such "counter-prank" effort, would of course, be untraceable. Correction. Traceable to roughly 1.5 millon randomly-selected, completely uninvolved parties. But I am not a mean-spirited person... or am I? You see, any number can play this game, at nearly the speed of light. No software will ever be able to compress information to the extent a human female does when she merely raises an eyebrow. james fischer jfischer@supercollider.com ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 19 Feb 1996 09:24:47 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: norbert Veener; sillystrings Comments: To: "teleport.com geodesic"@ubvm.cc.buffalo.edu someone posted an HTML sourcefile about Stafford Beer's work in mgmt./info.theory that was rather astounding in its geometrical referents to Bucky; specifically, his Syntegrity Team Model's illustrative model is an icosahedron (not, apparently, meaningfully tensegritous, unless the "critics", which seem to involve the dual (p.dodecah.), do that) whose struts represent the persons of the team (30 of'em in this hypothetical org., of course .-)... well, he got the Norbert Wiener Gold, amongst tons of other stuff and lots of corporate experience, but you might want to look into a gropu of folks that take strong issue with the info/game/chaos/etc.(systems?) theorists, as much to say that they're mostly virtually nuts!... that's the group that publishes the above-cited 21st C.Sci.and Tech., of whom I can assure you that their geometrical savvy goes well-beyond that of Beer's combinatorial use of the icosah. (if I'm correct about that .-) James, what's the big, bad deal about sillystrings?... it's just going one step beyond particles-as-infinitessimal-points to tubes-with-no-girth. indeed, it has been noted that one can get into sillysurfaces & sillbodies, which they probably should do, conceptually, although it might make the math even hairier. ----- "Time is the only dimension." -RBFuller Congecture on "FG#s": Non Compos Mentis!... We return thee to thou couches, Potatoes. ----- On Palmtree BBS: brihut@pro-palmtree.cts.com ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 19 Feb 1996 09:27:30 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Beer's bookl Comments: To: "teleport.com geodesic"@ubvm.cc.buffalo.edu oopps; in case that you missed it, the Syntegrity Team Model is studied in _Beyond Dispute_, (Wiley'94). ----- "Time is the only dimension." -RBFuller Congecture on "FG#s": Non Compos Mentis!... We return thee to thou couches, Potatoes. ----- On Palmtree BBS: brihut@pro-palmtree.cts.com ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Feb 1996 12:58:20 CST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: tagdi@RUULCH.LET.RUU.NL Subject: English measurment which they probably took to America the Roman dominated england for 4 century, in this time the english used the Roman measurment system which was the same in the whole of the empire. Roman linear measurment was based upon standard foot(pes) which was divided in to 16 digit or 12 inch(now 296 mm) or 11.65 BI. palm is defined as 1/4 foot, 74mm, 2.91BI. Romand digit nearly identical to Egyption which 1/54 meter. Roman foot 24/25 of the Greek. cubit 1 1/2 feet, smaller than the Greek's,463mm 5 feet make the pace(passus) 1.48 meter. i stad= 625 feet or 125 pases, 1/8 of mile the Romman mile = 8 stads similiar to the Greek unit of olympic stadia. mile defined as 1000 paces or double steps. i use to think that mile was american unit. well, now i know better. tagdi ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Feb 1996 13:17:28 CST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: tagdi@RUULCH.LET.RUU.NL Subject: sun view- sunshine on my shoulder makes me feel rich the earth rotating around the sun came toward it every early morning including today. this made the sun appear, there is somthing rong wtih this sentence, never mine let us keep going,. apearing slowly as we rotate, the illusion is closness of the sun which by noon will persist but this time more further, much further distance illusion of the disc, the round orange ball full of b quantas 10^40 or more quantas radiate toward us. as we adjust our reflex toward more accurate informttion which is sent through the the spine for milder adjustment. in the morning i must go instairs to my living-room , i geusse i must be ecological specialized unit, like an adminstrated mouse, or specialized one sheep( red Indian language). in this action of sliding instairs toward the T.v room i feel a sort of surge of being zoomed around the sun( i realy don't know) but i must try to invistigate this old nomadic fixed inspite of movment reflexes. tagdi ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Feb 1996 08:14:46 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: Re: E-mail to the President (A Rebuttal) In-Reply-To: <199602200638.BAA01781@crucible.inmind.com>; from "James Fischer" at Feb 20, 96 1:37 am Thanks, James. -- JOE S. MOORE joemoore@bbs.cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A ALTERNATE TEL AND/OR FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 USA I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Feb 1996 12:19:23 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: James McCaig Subject: Re: E-mail to the President (A Rebuttal) At 01:37 AM 2/20/96 -0500, James Fischer wrote: > > How is it not typical? It seems like a rather poor example, > which, sadly, IS more and more typical these days, now that > every pop-tart on the planet has bought a modem. > Dear James, Thank you for an informative and rather dazzling rebuttal. One can see that even though we have been on the net for some time there is much to learn from and about this medium. It is easy to understand the frustration that spawned the post to which you have so articulately replied. It is not so easy to understand how one can take responsible, effective action on the net to express our frustration with the attempts of the politicians to gain control of this environment. Perhaps with your great knowledge you could help us understand how to effectively use this tool to keep the environment free and safe from government domination and suppression. Until now, it seems to this novice, the best defense has been the weak offense. Perhaps this will now escalate, under the new laws that have been promulgated, into a different, more complex skirmish. It will be a pleasure to see your ideas on this subject from time to time. Perhaps you could justify putting these ideas in this forum if there is a way to link the defensive formation to Fuller's geometry. Please understand this suggestion is coming from a non-mathematician, lurker, who enjoys this list very much. Warm regards, Maharaj James McCaig | Sufi Center of Washington Brotherhood/Sisterhood Representative | Keepers of Sufi Center Bookstore United States | http://guess.worldweb.net/sufi jmccaig@worldweb.net ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Feb 1996 14:20:06 GMT Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Rick Bono Subject: DOME on the MAC I have been unable to contact the person who had ported DOME 3.5 to the MAC. Any MAC C++ programmers out there like to try porting DOME 4.2? I'll be happy to lend any support that I can to this effort. Rick ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Feb 1996 18:04:39 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: James Fischer Subject: Re: E-mail to President (A CORRECTION to the Rebuttal) Maharaj James McCaig said: >At 01:37 AM 2/20/96 -0500, James Fischer wrote: >> >> How is it not typical? It seems like a rather poor example, >> which, sadly, IS more and more typical these days, now that >> every pop-tart on the planet has bought a modem.... >> >Dear James, > >Thank you for an informative and rather dazzling rebuttal. One can see that >even though we have been on the net for some time there is much to learn >from and about this medium. As you are a Sufi, you will enjoy the irony inherent in the below. It shows that we ALL have much to learn, but mostly that >> I << have much to learn. The message sent to the Geodesic list was sent in ERROR. Rick Kirschner copied "all" his friends in his attempt to spread the chain-letter, and the Geodesic list got "spammed" as a side-effect. He told me as much in a private e-mail this AM. Inadvertent "spam" cannot be considered anything more than a simple minor error. My mistake was bigger, as I presumed that the e-mail headers were accurate, and copied a rather long list of folks, presuming that they WANTED comments (after all, their names were in the "Comments To:" header section...) Therefore my (as you say) "rather dazzling rebuttal" was misdirected. Worse yet, the folks listed in the "Comments To:" section of the original e-mail were the people to which Rick was sending the message, which means that I seem to have "flamed" Rick's entire family. Makes me look like some sort of digital Visigoth - at least I did not sack the city and salt the fields... Lucky for me, Rick has a well-developed sense of humor, and has NOT hired someone to drive up the mountain and try to break my legs. Rick, I will NOT copy this to anyone who was on this "Comments To:" list, since I doubt if they want to see anymore e-mail from the Supercollider in this lifetime. Please do your own distribution. So, it seems that I am still learning how to learn... very Sufi, eh? >It is easy to understand the frustration that spawned the post to which you >have so articulately replied. It is not so easy to understand how one can >take responsible, effective action on the net to express our frustration >with the attempts of the politicians to gain control of this environment. The whole concept of a multi-computer network for use by the general public for e-mail and such was an act of rebellion. In the early days, we STOLE equipment and computer time from our employers, our colleges, and our government. We did with it as we wished, hence the internet. The majority of sites that were part of the internet at that time had no idea that their computer center had been co-opted by the "underground". >Perhaps with your great knowledge... Snort! My recent track record looks none too good, it seems. >you could help us understand how to effectively use this tool to keep the >environment free and safe from government domination and suppression. I am not too worried about the "gang currently in possession". As you may recall, they threw everything they had at Iraq, and while they were the hands-down "winner" of the "war", Iraq's command and control network did not go down. Iraq bought off- the-shelf stuff, and modeled their network on the Internet, using slightly outdated software and hardware. I doubt that our elected figureheads would care to send stealth bombers with smart bombs to inforce some silly concern about pre-teens finding the occasional shrine to the marvels of breast implants, lace, and diffuse lighting. (Not that it would work any better against our net than it did against Iraq's.) >Until now, it seems to this novice, the best defense has been the >weak offense. Perhaps this will now escalate, under the new laws >that have been promulgated, into a different, more complex skirmish. Many have made a big point of the "Right To Bear Arms" (or is it "the right to arm bears"? - I forget). In a digital environment, what are "arms"? They are much more complex than a tube that flings a hunk of metal, but they can be used to similar ends. More I should not say, since just as any toolsmith can make a gun, any software toolsmith can build nasty programs. "Computer Viruses" are unaimed weapons, and cause nothing but collateral damage to random systems and people. Of course, Windows 95 appears to be a "virus" to many who purchased it... No software will ever be able to compress information to the extent a human female does when she merely raises an eyebrow. james fischer jfischer@supercollider.com ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Feb 1996 18:56:31 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: James McCaig Subject: Re: E-mail to President (A CORRECTION to the Rebuttal) At 06:04 PM 2/20/96 -0500, James Fischer wrote: > As you are a Sufi, you will enjoy the irony inherent in the > below. It shows that we ALL have much to learn, but mostly > that >> I << have much to learn. > Dear James, Yes, as a Sufi the most enjoyable part was your graceful apology and gentle manner. A further question, if I may. Does this list not send a copy to the sender of a message? I haven't received one, so if this reply had not been forthcoming, I wouldn't have known for sure that my mail was distributed. Maharaj James McCaig | Sufi Center of Washington Brotherhood/Sisterhood Representative | Keepers of Sufi Center Bookstore United States | http://guess.worldweb.net/sufi jmccaig@worldweb.net ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Feb 1996 19:58:57 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: COPY OF OWN POSTS It seems that the computer for the Geodesic list does NOT automatically send a person a copy of their own post. The default setting seems to be "NOREPro". To get a copy of the list of commands that the computer recognizes in order to change your settings (and do a lot of other things), do the following: In the "To" line put listserv@ubvm.cc.buffalo.edu Leave the "Subject" line blank. In the body of your post at the left margin put the command Help --- When you get the LISTSERV command reference card follow the instructions carefully. -- JOE S. MOORE joemoore@bbs.cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A ALTERNATE TEL AND/OR FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 USA I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Feb 1996 22:13:50 -0600 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: "J. Michael Rowland" Subject: Re: DOME on the MAC >I have been unable to contact the person who had ported DOME 3.5 to the MAC. >Any MAC C++ programmers out there like to try porting DOME 4.2? I'll be happy >to lend any support that I can to this effort. > >Rick I would be glad to give it a try. Is the source code available? J. Michael Rowland.................................rowley@telalink.net ===========------------------------------------------------=========== |||||||(((( ASCII Text - Your BEST Entertainment Value ))))||||||| ===========------------------------------------------------=========== ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Feb 1996 22:36:24 -0600 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: "J. Michael Rowland" Subject: Re: E-mail to President (A CORRECTION to the Rebuttal) I would like to add my two cents to this thread (now that I've lost my lurker status) and respond thus to the original post: As much as I deplore censorship, I really *really* hate to see the Bill Of Rights turned into an e-mail bomb -- it reveals nothing but a glaring lack of respect for both the message AND the medium. "I had to destroy the village in order to save it!" That's a lie. Stop wasting your own bandwidth. Be honest with yourself -- or else next you'll be using the same tactic for pay in the service of someone else's marketing department. J. Michael Rowland.................................rowley@telalink.net ===========------------------------------------------------=========== |||||||(((( ASCII Text - Your BEST Entertainment Value ))))||||||| ===========------------------------------------------------=========== ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 1996 01:48:30 GMT Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: "Peter M. Blackman" Organization: Netcom Subject: Re: Une serre pour Sylvain / A greenhouse for Sylvain In ted@crl.nmsu.edu (Ted Dunning) writes: > > >another thing to remember with greenhouse design is that the crucial >temperature is the temperature of the *roots* of the plants. the >ambient temperature is much less important. this can lead to a design >where you store heat in barrels which support the plants, but you >don't try to circulate either the air or the water. this has three >major advantages: > >a) letting the air cool decrease heat loss through the greenhouse >walls without materially affecting growth conditions. > >b) letting the water stratify keeps the remaining heat energy near the >plant roots where it does the most good. > >c) not circulating the air more than necessary avoids the problem of >increased transpiration by the plants. this radically decreases the >watering and heating requirements. > > >since enhanced levels of CO2 encourage plant growth, adding a small >burner to increase CO2 levels is often done. these burners (and any >lighting to extend the growing day) should both have substantial >impacts on the energy balance of the greenhouse. > > I am looking to design my own greenhouse. I am looking for a company that supplies material that will allow me the flexibliity to do what I want. Any help would be appreciated. ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 20 Feb 1996 21:47:44 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Snelson & misc. Comments: To: "teleport.com geodesic"@ubvm.cc.buffalo.edu wow, omnicitationsville, and I can send for the patents (later) !!... apparently, the exhibit that toured in'89-90 (New York, first, then Houston, I think, then I moved back West form Mass., and the exhibit followed me to a little gallery in Laurel Canyon, but I forgot all about it!... I had the impression, from a single ad in (I think) New Scientist, that I saw out East, that it was computerized display of the model, whatever it is; I THINK that I vaguely recall lesser circles in the ad, but I ain't 99.47% usre about that. as I recall, the "unified field" o'Bucky was a planar pattern, but I don't recall the formula. Gerard, I'd nmever have thought of using the opposite of one of Bucky's tensional nets (with impinging ricochets on the inside), by putting the "pushes" on the outside & the "pulls" holding'em together!... well, I guess that that isn't miscellaneous. ----- "Time is the only dimension." -RBFuller Congecture on "FG#s": Non Compos Mentis!... We return thee to thou couches, Potatoes. ----- On Palmtree BBS: brihut@pro-palmtree.cts.com ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 1996 12:25:55 CET Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: tagdi@RUULCH.LET.RUU.NL Subject: Re: sun view- sunshine on my shoulder makes me feel rich corrected: >the earth rotating around the sun came toward it every early morning >including today. this made the sun appear, there is somthing rong >with this sentence, never mine let us keep going,. apearing slowly >as we rotate, the illusion is closness of the sun which by noon >will persist but this time more further, at much further distance. >the illusive disc, the round orange ball full of b quantas 10^40 or >more- quantas that radiate toward us. as we adjust our reflex to a more >accurate informttion which is sent through the the spine for incremental >adjustment. this morning i has to go instairs to my"living-room"- >, i guess, i must be an ecological specialized unit, like an administrated >1984 man, or specialized one sheep. >in this action of sliding instairs to the T.v room i feel >as if i have been free falling ( of being zoomed around the sun) , a sort of feeling in the blood- may be in the spine also. tagdi ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 1996 08:13:05 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: Re: syn-l: Re: sillystrings Comments: To: synergetics-l@teleport.com In-Reply-To: <199602211419.JAA23383@darius.cris.com>; from "Rick Bono" at Feb 21, 96 9:19 am Who says that ideas can't have "volume" also? The minimum idea is a tetrahedron. -- JOE S. MOORE joemoore@bbs.cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A ALTERNATE TEL AND/OR FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 USA I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 1996 22:02:29 CET Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: tagdi@RUULCH.LET.RUU.NL Subject: Re: syn-l: Re: sillystrings Comments: To: synergetics-l@teleport.com it is time to get serious, is that possible. i consider the following as artifacts of design: 1. Rick Bono software program of geodesic calculation ( do more with less) 2.Gerald de Jong struck software. 3.Richard geometrical computer figures. 4.Heart, Kirby Home page and all these pages which have smiliar content. 5.I would almost include Nick Pine, the only problem is that he have not produce easy to use application for many users. 6.Joe More almost total dedication for giving vast amount of refrence. i will include more, but because i cant understand everything sent i am limited to including only the people who frequently participate, that does not mean that the rest of you are not good individuals. i am not a professor or Alfred Nobel, i am just little alinated individual seeking to find his soul; is that possible, i doubted. and i thought it is good to bring the idea of design again. Tagdi P.s do you think this is an invention, for people who want to make polyhedrons quickly, you design a sort of ruller where you can draw 4 tringles at one time as many times as you want(plastic form) on a thick paper and then you just cut them join them by tape. you can use this for different forms- oct, icosa, and the 6 penta in one strock. 2. the bell telephon company have a black world map, where different colour dotes can be shown to monitor their network at different location in the world. In the same way i thought you can make black Bucky map, it will draw more attention, and it may have other uses. 3. a real struck 4. a screw poly toy, where you connect the struts by turning them in a femele socket.(sorry i don know the word). 5. a software where you can learn about how goverment work doen in the spirit to inform about how dull the goverment in relation to Multinational organizers. p.s2 Gerald, can you animate A and B quanta. then we can add them together and rotate them. it will be doing neuclear physics and if F theory ever become verified, we will be the non.phd to get the humanitarian parallel to Nobel prize established by an english stamp collector( the gardian). ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 1996 23:02:10 CET Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: tagdi@RUULCH.LET.RUU.NL Subject: Re: Roofing Domes >I have produced an experimental dome in steel using laser cutting as the >preferred fabricating tech. Unfortunately it is only 2 ft. in diameter, >though it could be scaled up easily. My technique uses one fabrication >method to manufacture struts, hubs, panels entirely from standard sheet >stock. Tolerances of laser cutting can be controlled to 0.001" for each >component but I haven't measured the resultant accumulated error. can anyone use laser to cut meatals, and how much it cost to buy th tool. i ask just for information sake tagdi ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 1996 13:47:20 -0500 Reply-To: OREGDOME Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: OREGDOME Organization: America Online, Inc. (1-800-827-6364) Subject: Re: Eathquakes and geodesic dome structures We have been told that there are areas in California that domes are the only multi-story residential homes that can be built due to codes or building inspectors. This is due to the earthquake survivability of domes. We have had domes that have survived hurricanes and tornados (and at least once both) while square/rectangle houses around them crumbled. The aerodynamics of the dome also seem to help it in wild and forest fire situations. Finally, the domes have suvived numerous tree impacts. One of our domes in Portland, OR took three large tree hits and still protected the family within. It now looks like it was attacked by arrows, with branches piercing the shell, but it still stands and is being repaired as I type. I don't want to use this group as a selling environment, but we (Oregon Dome) do have information about the domes available upon request. Specific titles about disaster fitness, energy efficiency and plan differences are available. Nathan Burke, Oregon Dome, Inc. oregdome@aol.com ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 1996 21:23:08 GMT Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Rick Bono Organization: HiLINE Internet Services, Inc. Subject: Re: DOME on the MAC In article , rowley@TELALINK.NET says... > >>I have been unable to contact the person who had ported DOME 3.5 to the MAC. >>Any MAC C++ programmers out there like to try porting DOME 4.2? I'll be happy >>to lend any support that I can to this effort. >> >>Rick > >I would be glad to give it a try. Is the source code available? > >J. Michael Rowland.................................rowley@telalink.net >===========------------------------------------------------=========== >|||||||(((( ASCII Text - Your BEST Entertainment Value ))))||||||| >===========------------------------------------------------=========== Thanks for the offer! The source code comes with the zip file containing the executables. Point your web browser to: http://www.cris.com/~rjbono/html/domes.html and download the file. By all means let me know if you have any questions on the source. Thanks again for your offer. Rick ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 1996 21:42:11 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: James Fischer Subject: Re: syn-l: Re: sillystrings (Directed To Joe) Joe Moore said: >Who says that ideas can't have "volume" also? The minimum idea is a >tetrahedron. Good point, Joe. Ooops, wait a sec, I guess the minimum idea should be a point. Game over, insert new quarter... Tounge Firmly Planted In Cheek, james No software will ever be able to compress information to the extent a human female does when she merely raises an eyebrow. james fischer jfischer@supercollider.com ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 1996 18:38:11 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: Re: syn-l: Re: sillystrings Comments: To: synergetics-l@teleport.com In-Reply-To: ; from "Jack Lazariuk" at Feb 21, 96 12:31 pm Jack Lazariuk writes: > Bono wrote > >At 08:32 AM 2/20/96 PST, you wrote: > >>I agree with James. Anything that doesn't have volume does not exist. > >>JOE S. MOORE joemoore@bbs.cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 > >Hmmmm.... > >This message doesn't exist. My thoughts on writing this message that doesn't > >exist, don't exist. Knowledge and emotion don't exist. The metaphysical half > >of Universe doesn't exist. I suppose that since my thoughts don't exist then > >I can't view the "otherness" that is around me. Therefore even things with > >volume > >(which doesn't exist) doesn't exist. That means that I don't exi...POOF > >Note: At this point the writer has logic bombed his way into a corner and > >vanished without a trace along with the rest of Universe. > >Rick "How can I type if I don't exist?" Bono > The original dicussion was I believe in reference to Bucky's view that all > universe is a hierarchy of systems and that a minimun system has both an > inside and outside. This would apply to both the metaphysical and physical > and so did the above writer mean that anything that doesn't have an inside > and an outside does not exist? > Jack Lazariuk > e.mail lazariukj@process.cyancorp.com YES. You understand me better than I do. I contend that even IDEAS have an inside and an outside. After all, the title to Bucky's book is _Synergetics: Explorations in the Geometry of THINKING_. An idea is a system, and therefore the minimum idea can be modeled as a tetrahedron. Very complex ideas are high frequency icosahedra. -- JOE S. MOORE joemoore@bbs.cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A ALTERNATE TEL AND/OR FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 USA I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 1996 18:52:05 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: Re: Eathquakes and geodesic dome structures Comments: To: oregdome@AOL.COM In-Reply-To: <4gfpbo$bel@newsbf02.news.aol.com>; from "OREGDOME" at Feb 21, 96 1:47 pm OREGDOME writes: > I don't want to use this group as a selling environment, but we (Oregon > Dome) do have information about the domes available upon request. > Specific titles about disaster fitness, energy efficiency and plan > differences are available. > > Nathan Burke, > Oregon Dome, Inc. > oregdome@aol.com Would you mind posting some specifics about your domes? Sizes, materials, costs, etc. If you have a web page, would you include the address? Please include your mailing address and phone number(s) also. Thanks. -- JOE S. MOORE joemoore@bbs.cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A ALTERNATE TEL AND/OR FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 USA I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 1996 18:55:23 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: Constructions Lab & Kingdomes (fwd) John Kuhtik writes: > From dub-img-5.compuserve.com!compuserve.com!72740.306 Wed Feb 21 17:59:22 1996 > Date: 21 Feb 96 21:01:56 EST > From: John Kuhtik <72740.306@compuserve.com> > To: Joe Moore > Subject: Constructions Lab & Kingdomes > Message-ID: <960222020155_72740.306_IHD36-1@CompuServe.COM> > > CONSTRUCTIONS LAB & KINGDOMES > C/O EINAR THORSTEINN > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > About Constructions Lab and Einar Thorsteinn > > Here you will find information based on our own research about the > following : > > GEODESIC DOMES > TENT STRUCTURES > ECOLOGY IN BUILDINGS > HEALTH & HOUSING > 3-D GEOMETRY > DIVERSE NEW SCIENCE FIELDS > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > Kingdome Calculator ONE > > Kingdome Calculator ONE computes all the numbers and values for your > dome and gives you pictures of existing domes. Also good for timber > quantity calculations. Included FREE with your copy is a plan for > any frequency of your dome and a icosahedron-model. Special > Introductary Offer: only 12.50! Runs on Windows 3.1 or above. > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > FREE! Download a free copy of geodesic dome calcualtions. (Word document > 13 KB) > > The geodesic dome material which is all in english and you can order > from is this: > > A: 42 minutes VHS video of how to * US$29.95 plus US$6.00 for S & H > build a 2 FQ hemisphere. > > B: Dome-It-Yourself instructions, > same as video. * US$14.95 plus US$3.00 for S & H > > A & B: Complete set of DMIY * US$39.95 plus US$6.00 for S & H > instructions. > > C: Models of 5 different types. * US$7.00 plus US$3.00 for S & H > > D: Kingdomes Correspondence > School information. * US$5.00 plus US$1.00 for S & H > > E: Natures Forms with cutouts * US$20.00 plus US$4.00 for S & H > and introduction by Bucky Fuller. > > F: The Development Pattern of * US$12.00 plus US$3.00 for S & H > Geometric Structures: A basis for > the Natural Symmetries Unification > Theory. > > G: Articles by Einar Thorsteinn on * US$5.00 plus US$3.00 for S & H > geodesic domes from Dome > Magazine in Colorado. > (E-mail: cindyk@hoflin.com) > > H: The EDC booklet with 163 * US$20.00 plus US$4.00 for S & H > domes and dome projects 1972-92. > (from this booklet you can order > exact plans of the domes described > for 10.00 US$ each plus 3.00 US$ for H & M) > > J: Items A-H Special! * US$100.00 plus US$8.00 for S & H > > K: Join the KGB-Club! * US$150.00 plus US$8.00 for S & H > You will receive the KGB-Manual: > The Kingdomes Geodesic Building > Manual. This gives you the > opportunity to build a professional > dome. Save US$3000.00! > > L: Kingdome Calculator ONE * US$ 12.50 (including postage). > Computes all the numbers and values > for your dome and gives you pictures of > existing domes. Also good for timber > quantity calculations. Included FREE > with your copy is a plan for any > frequency of your dome and a > icosahedron-model. Runs on Windows 3.1 > or above. > > TO ORDER: Have your credit card ready, plus your name and address. Or > send check or money-order. > > Ask for what further information on domes is in the making by > Constructions Lab or ask for information on other works of Einar > Thorsteinn. Contact us on any other subject that is named in our > introduction here and we will exchange information in the same field you > have with you. > > Or contact Einar Thorsteinn in E-Mail: kingdome@mmedia.is > KCS p.o. box 427980 > Houston TX 77098 > or > CL p.o. box 1464 > IS-121 Reykjavik > Iceland > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > kingdome@mmedia.is > > .- > -- JOE S. MOORE joemoore@bbs.cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A ALTERNATE TEL AND/OR FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 USA I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 1996 19:55:27 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: FLY'S EYE DOMES FULLER'S FLY'S EYE DOME HOME I received the following paper from John Kuhtik <72740.306@compuserve.com> QUOTE: As he sought to see what one man could do on his own to facilitate world-around human success, his researches led him to believe that there is enough to go around for the whole human family - all 5.5 billion of us can have sufficient life support systems available for happy and healthy living. His belief, derived from the principle that technological development continually improves the ratio of benefit compared to materials and energy consumed - in other words, we're always doing more with less. Starting in 1927 with the "Dymaxion House", and culminating with the Fly's Eye Dome, his last manufactured dwelling design, Fuller conceived and prototyped manufactured housing designs that utilized the most modern and well-developed industrial technologies to accomplish resource and energy efficient "dwelling machines". The Fly's Eye shell - so named by Fuller because it looks somewhat like a fly's eye when bulbous circular panels are installed in the round openings - was prototyped in two sizes: a 26' dia. sphere, or partial sphere, requiring two almost identical panels plus circle closures, and a 50; dia. model requiring three very similar panels plus circle closures. Because of the modular repeatability of the panel components making up the shell, highly industrialized fabrication techniques can be employed to produce low-cost parts through high-volume production and state of the art "tooling-up". Some advantages of the Fly's Eye Dome are: low-cost high strength structuring, light weight easily transported components, bolt together assembly facilitates installation and moving. Also, some advantages of dome structures over rectilinear buildings: greater surface to volume ratio, as a result you have lower heating and cooling costs. Spherical buildings are stronger than conventional buildings and have proven themselves as safer buildings to be in during a natural disaster. One third less material is used to enclose a space with a dome compared to enclosing the same square footage with four walls and a roof (massive savings on resources and labor). EMOD, Inc. would like to finish what Buckminster Fuller started. We would like to work with the Fly's Eye shell as the environmental controlling shell, add to it all the necessary equipment that make it a home and sell or rent them to individuals who are looking for an alternative to what is currently available. Autonomous dwelling is the goal and we can reach it due to all the technological advances humans have made throughout the years. It is now time to embark on a project that is long past due. Design Science (or Comprehensive Anticipatory Design Science) is a term used by Buckminster Fuller. As he states in a book titled Synergetics: "Generalized design-science exploration is concerned with discovery and use by human mind of complex aggregates of generalized principles in specific-longevity, special-case innovations designed to induce humanity's consciously competent participation in local evolutionary transformation events invoking the conscious comprehension by ever-increasing proportions of humanity of the comically unique functioning of humans in the generalized design scheme of Universe. This conscious comprehension must in turn realize ever-improving implementations of the unique human functioning as well as an ever-increasingly effective concern for the relevant ecological inter-complementation involved in local Universe support of humanity's functioning as subjective discoverer of local order and thereafter as objective design-science inventor of local Universe solutions of otherwise unsolvable problems, design-science solutions of which will provide special-case, local-Universe supports of eternally regenerative generalized Universe." Buckminster Fuller In other words, Design Science is working with Universal Principles to build and employ environmental controlling systems which enable us to do more with less. We humans are here (in Universe) to apprehend, comprehend and employ principles of Universe. "With our growing understanding of the principles in nature, we have increased our ability to get more useful units of life support for more people with less investment of resources per unit. The effort to consciously organize out total environment in order to make the earth's finite resources meet growing human needs without disrupting the orderly ecological process of the planet is what Fuller called Design Science. This approach involves finding ways to gain the greatest possible advantage from the least possible investment of physical resources." Howard J. Brown END QUOTE. (Note: The 33' diameter are available for sale. Please contact below for details.) John Kuhtik EMOD, Inc. 209 Willow Ave., # 4-E Hoboken, NJ 07030 USA 201-792-6831 72740.306@compuserve.com -- JOE S. MOORE joemoore@bbs.cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A ALTERNATE TEL AND/OR FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 USA I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 1996 08:48:14 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: LLUncoolJr. & misc. Comments: To: "teleport.com geodesic"@ubvm.cc.buffalo.edu I think that y'all are well-warranted to be cautious about having your mindspace polluted by the journals, newspaper and paphlets associated with the media-convicted felon, Junior; he's appealing to the 4th Circuit for exhoneration over that covert op, although there have already been 2 federal and 1 state (NY, I think) rulings in his (and the others of the "LaRouche Seven") favor, notably a reversal by the judge who'd ruled on the involuntary bankruptcy proceedings, Botstetter, because they were a "constructive fraud" upon his court; the original ruling shutdown the paper & the journal of science, and allowed a raid by a provacative, 400-strong, multi-uniformed goon- squad over supposed "creditcardfraud". however, the publications were simply re-incorporated, with their names changed to 21CS&T and The New Federalist. the cover of the cutrrent issue of the former has a new, phi-based, stellated polyh.by Wenninger, and the text includes how-to-make-it details; the rest of it is, shall we say, paradigmatic of a deep study of science and it's historical (not to not say, political) roots, although parts of it are gauranteed to put you off or just piss! they've documented the 3-decades of careerists who run the Justice dept.who victimized them, over the heads of the appointees to AG etc., up to including Ruby Ridge, Waco etc., but you won't have to read about that #### in 21CS&T, unfortunately (a-hem), but the fact, as recently found by me in the mainstream papers, that 2 appointees for the 4th are being held- over til after the election by "Republicans" R Them is, almost, a sufficient reason to "vote Clinton(s)", because you never know how much an appeal can rest upon the mere paryt- affiliation of the apealer (in this case, he's on the Demo.primary ballot in at least 20 states .-) you don't have to believe me, either! ----- "Time is the only dimension." -RBFuller Congecture on "FG#s": Non Compos Mentis!... We return thee to thou couches, Potatoes. ----- On Palmtree BBS: brihut@pro-palmtree.cts.com ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 21 Feb 1996 09:11:44 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: MISC. and LLUncoolJr. Comments: To: "teleport.com geodesic"@ubvm.cc.buffalo.edu whoops; I got so wound-up in that politcal stuff, that I forgot the "misc." (also, you can see LL's own webpagestuffin'by looking under Politics:Elections in Yahoo or whatever .-) Joe & James> nonvolumetrical sillystrings hey, that's the whole problem with the Standard Theory, or a big part of it, being based-upon zero-point particles, hence the inmfinities that have to got-around via "renormalization" -- it's just a word in quotes, to me, althopugh you might peruse the lecture-notes o'Feynman to grok it! ThomasM451> de Beer's Syntegritous Temworks are you on a foreign affiliate of AOL?... it just seemed that something was lost in the translation, but it could've been the everpresent ambiguity of language. anyway, firstly, an icosah.is certainly a proper geodesical framwork, albeit of "0 frequency"; secondly, when I said that the icosah.was not apparently tensegritous, I meant that Beer's USE of it, at least as shown, was not (but all systems are inherently tensegritous, although most of the manmade ones do not conscioously use it, as with the typical model of an icosah.(or any other polyh.), but that it seemed to be strictly combinatorial; thirdly, I thought that your synopsis said that the EDGES were concieved as the persons ... OK, that might fit with the vertices as teams, yes, but, in any case, Beer's model was clearly not limited to 30-member corporations (or whatever, although, for instance, there can only be polyh. with even numbers of triga -- the deltahedra or, perhaps, the polytrigahedra. Gerald> Amoebaspace you simply MUST have an "inversion" function, to exchange the roles of pushin'an'pullin'; merci beaucoup en advance! ----- "Time is the only dimension." -RBFuller Congecture on "FG#s": Non Compos Mentis!... We return thee to thou couches, Potatoes. ----- On Palmtree BBS: brihut@pro-palmtree.cts.com ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 22 Feb 1996 04:14:39 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: James Fischer Subject: The 3D 4D House Is Open For Tours (via VRML) Comments: cc: synergetics-l@teleport.com, owner-wholesys-l@netcom.com Well, the Supercollider thought about it for a whole 7.2 seconds, and then spat out some VRML code. The result is the VRML version of the Buckminster Fuller 4-D house. It is open for touring at: http://www.supercollider.com/dymax Notes: 1) You need a VRML browser to see it, walk through it, or fly around it. If you do not have VRML code (or a recent-issue WebBrowser that supports VRML), go slog through Netscape's homepage at: http://www.netscape.com 2) It is a MONSTER!! The VRML runs 217K bytes to 220K bytes, and the background is another 26K bytes, since VRML forces one to use (gack!) bitmap files rather than gifs or jpegs. Since it is a monster, navigational response may be slow. Wait a bit, and you WILL move they way you wanted to move. Sorry, I stripped it down as much as I could... 3) Better that you download the zipfile version, and search the usual search engines for a handy little program named "nullsock". You load nullsock rather than Winsock, and then you can run NetScape (or whatever) without being connected to the Net. 4) Anyone who sends me e-mail can ask for their favorite method (cpio, tar, g-zip, whatever) added to the page if they have problems (emotional or otherwise) with the use of zip. 5) WARNING: The Supercollider homepage (http://www.supercollider.com) will NOT link you to the "dymax" page. The Supercollider homepage is designed to repell spiders, agents, and even human intrusions. It is a fun page if your browser is modern, since it does some animation and some JavaScript as it tells people to "go away". It also has a habit of crashing the browsers of folks who stay connected too long, so after you watch the fun for a bit, leave or be crashed. If the dymax page crashes, it is an error. The dymax page is "friendly" to visitors. 6) The house has "glass walls" around the exterior perimeter so as to allow easy navigation as we all learn to fly our VRML browsers. Please excuse the tasteless color scheme and the lack of photo-realism. You don't even WANT to know how big the "pretty" version would be... 7) If I can resolve the beauty/size issues, I will put up an improved rendering. I may at least "label" things so that various items "talk" about the house when you move your mouse over them. Suggestions from experts on the 4D House are welcome. 8) Go play quick - at the first sign of an attempt to break into the Supercollider via this facility, the firewall will slam the gateway shut, and I will be forced to reconsider the whole thing. (There are people who are very dependent upon the real work and output of the Supercollider, and I cannot let them down over a "toy".) 9) I hate VRML. Java is worse. Even HTML was a bad idea. Check out the "Internet Weather Report" at http://www.mids.org to find out why. 10) Anyone who wants to "mirror" this facility as a part of their "Bucky" site is welcome to do so. Just grab the zip file, and have fun. No software will ever be able to compress information to the extent a human female does when she merely raises an eyebrow. james fischer jfischer@supercollider.com ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 22 Feb 1996 13:05:29 CST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: tagdi@RUULCH.LET.RUU.NL Subject: Looking back 1965 (paper use) Norber winer" declares that since the superiority of humans over other animals is mental rather than physical, we should strive for more use of high level decision- makeing abilities in manging and less use of the biceps and ganglia in which other animals excel or which can be simulated by machines with great efficiency." both Fuller and Norber came to the same conclusion at the same time. 1952 8 billion checks were processsed in the U.S. 1557 14 billion = = = = worth 2 1/2 trillion dollars 1963 20 billion checks Fortune: one dollar out of every 8 goes for "nothin more intrinsically useful than marks on a piece of paper" we are hoplessly entangled in wilderness of communicative detail. 1900 1 worker in 40 was a clelrk. using pen and ink he was able to keep up with the record keeping, accounting, and statisical needs of the time. today (1965) 1 out of 7 is a paper worker even though he has a lot of mechanical help. in 1900 U.s paper consumtion was 60 pound per man, woman and child today (1965) it excceds 400 pound. computer sort 1500 checks in a minute, compared with 1000 an hour befor. integrated data processing is a widly-used term-refering to the coordination of all major statistical and accounting functions of an enterprise. 7% of all office work in the U.S is now done by automatic machines, according to IBM- who hopes to see 35% automated in foceeble future. according to Fuller 80% of all work does not contribute to survival. a note to J.Fisher; some time ago you mentioned that to change a car from running on gazoline to running on methane is quite easy process. well in egypt it becomes quite routine procedure, the goverment trying to control the polution in cairo started this program. the only thing is that you can only use the car in the city, they do not have many station for methane refuling. it is ineresting to see snap shots of the process, it gives the idea that some technology adaptation in critical time can be doen quickly. by the way Cairo is the most polluted city in the poor parts of the icosa map. Tagdi ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 22 Feb 1996 08:47:46 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: Re: syn-l: The 3D 4D House Is Open For Tours (via VRML) Comments: To: synergetics-l@teleport.com In-Reply-To: <199602220915.EAA28537@crucible.inmind.com>; from "James Fischer" at Feb 22, 96 4:14 am James, I think having a virtual Dymaxion house available online to anyone in the world is a wonderful idea. Bucky would be amazed if he could see how things are evolving! May I make a suggestion for your next project? How about a virtual version of his proposed Fly's Eye Self-contained, Portable Dome Home? A full-scale prototype has never been built, virtually or physically (except for the inner shell). It's projects like yours that will finally prompt me to upgrade to a state-of-the-art system so that I can experience what you have done. Joe -- JOE S. MOORE joemoore@bbs.cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A ALTERNATE TEL AND/OR FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 USA I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 22 Feb 1996 09:34:35 -0500 Reply-To: Edlantz Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Edlantz Organization: America Online, Inc. (1-800-827-6364) Subject: Virtuarium: Domed Virtual Reality Check out the Virtuarium at GOTO's web site (http://www.bekkoame.or.jp/~goto-co). They are using video projected on a domed screen for group virtual reality. This is the first of many such systems. For more information on domed projection screens, drop me a line. Ed Lantz Spitz, Inc. P.O. Box 198, Route 1 Chadds Ford, PA 19317 edlantz@aol.com (610) 459-5200 x27 ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 22 Feb 1996 15:46:59 GMT Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: bill paton Organization: bp ent. Subject: Mind's Eye Book Notes MIND'S EYE OF RICHARD BUCKMINSTER FULLER By Donald W. Robertson(Bucky's Patent Lawyer) New York: St. Martin's Press, 1974. ISBN: 0-312-53346-2 These are my notes from readings of the Book.I hope they are of use to you. They may seem confusing if they are taken out of context, but alot is self explanatory. Bill "They asked,'Why houses in the round?' Why make them square? said he. But more, why tie your thoughts at all, To round, or square. Or old geometry, That's dead and strange to all reality. For Universe is life and motion. There's more of form and energy Than of material things we see. We must think comprehensively." - Why tie your thoughts at all, To round or square. - ... the totality of a problem. -"The primary modus operandi of his mind causes him to see the whole of anything before he begins to analyze its parts." - In Fuller's eyes the first step would be to break away altogether from existing concepts so that he could start afresh in hope of reaching a more comprehensive solution. - Begin again from the very beginning. Let no old thought intrude, however hallowed by time. - Fuller's habitual exercise of comprehensive thought. - Let imagination spring from a real, broad base. To be truly comprehensive it must consist of "the totality of human experience". - Fuller's method of comprehensive thought is to go behind the 'known' theory and begin once more at the experimentally informed beginning, being careful to avoid distraction by scientific dogma, mind alert to examine fresh approaches and to formulate new interpretations of what men thought they understood before. - Intuitively, the fabric of thought is spun between a complex of points as it inventories... - Igloos are heat efficient and size efficient. - Geodesics is the opposite of an apex based, polarized dome. Geodesics are non-polarized and force-distributing. - racing towards the forever of the future. - Tensegrity= conservation of material resources + conservation of time. Conserves materials, fewer time and fewer workers. - Fuller's breakthroughs reveal force patterns of universal application in what we have become accustomed to think of as so many different fields of sciences. - Fuller's thought stream is characterized by a) emphasis on dynamics, b) grasp of synergy as true reality, c) link to energetic/synergetic geometry, & d) awareness of underlying patterns in the universe. - Tensile Integrity (Tensegrity) means continuity in pattern of tension forces throughout the structure. Tension is relied on more, comprehension less. More pull, less push & therefore greater use of what is best in structural materials: their strength to resist pull. - An inventor is his own lexicographer - Fuller... searches out the total of reality in terms of the dynamics of universe. - As Fuller taught, he also listened. As he listened, he translated. As he translated, the scope of his teaching grew. The effect was regenerative as the teacher's mind responded to the expanding thought pattern of the studen therefore...'positive feed-back' the process by which one idea fed into his mind from any observed or translated experience of man generates a family of related ideas from which a broader generalization of the beginning idea emerges.... - Direct feed-back and gestation of a mind, free from formal knowledge limitations. Reason suggests it is this freedom which affords to his mind the increased potential for regenerative action. - forward-looking Japan. - the striking simplicity of componentation. - [tensegrity is] the ascendency of tension to the throne occupied for so long by King Compression is high drama. At long last, builders can begin to realize on the tension potential of a dynamic universe. And it is a universe whose destiny is shaped by the invisible tension network which holds the planets to their celestial orbits. What a pleasing harmony of nature Fuller found in this discovery of a geometrical network of tension that can hold a building erect. - ...Fuller's ultimate preoccupation was with education, not profits. The patents, when royalties came, were being used to spread knowledge of the inventions and the gain to others in using them... - ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 22 Feb 1996 21:25:44 CET Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: tagdi@RUULCH.LET.RUU.NL Subject: particle physics quesion just to bring more physics into relation to F geometry. what is strange lambdas, sigmas,K's and X's- and what is the theory of strangness. Tagdi ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 22 Feb 1996 21:41:43 CET Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: tagdi@RUULCH.LET.RUU.NL Subject: Re: Mind's Eye Book Notes In Message Thu, 22 Feb 1996 15:46:59 +0000 (GMT), bill paton writes: >MIND'S EYE OF RICHARD BUCKMINSTER FULLER >By Donald W. Robertson(Bucky's Patent Lawyer) >New York: St. Martin's Press, 1974. >ISBN: 0-312-53346-2 > >These are my notes from readings of the Book.I hope they are of use to >you. They may seem confusing if they are taken out of context, but alot is >self explanatory. Bill > >"They asked,'Why houses in the round?' >Why make them square? said he. >But more, why tie your thoughts at all, >To round, or square. Or old geometry, >That's dead and strange to all reality. >For Universe is life and motion. >There's more of form and energy >Than of material things we see. >We must think comprehensively." nice notes. specialization is cubic. Tagdi p.s is there a limit to the brain storage- is that the rong question. ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 22 Feb 1996 19:13:25 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: Re: Dymaxion Map? Comments: To: Jeff Ross In-Reply-To: ; from "Jeff Ross" at Feb 22, 96 3:48 pm Jeff Ross writes: > I've been lurking on the geodesic list for quite a while. I recently saw, > and saved, a link to a Dymaxion Map on the 'net > (http://metro.turnpike.net/G/GoatBoy/bucky.html) for downloads. This link > leads, ultimately, to the Bucky Fuller Virtual Institute. Maybe it's me, > but I can't find any Dymaxion Maps, for download or viewing, at BFVI. > Am I missing something? Is the link bad? If the link is bad, can you > point me to a better link? Goat Boy's version of the BFVI is a little dated. Try poking around at Kirby Urner's site: http://www.teleport.com/~pdx4d/ I'm pretty sure he has some map pics or pointers to sites that do. Check out the New Civilization site also: http://www.newciv.org/Synergetic_Geometry -- JOE S. MOORE joemoore@bbs.cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A ALTERNATE TEL AND/OR FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 USA I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 22 Feb 1996 21:48:25 -0500 Reply-To: OREGDOME Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: OREGDOME Organization: America Online, Inc. (1-800-827-6364) Subject: Oregon Dome Joe Moore asked us to post some information about our domes and our company. We produce panelized geodesic domes made out of douglas fir with OSB sheathing. Our dome kits include all of the dome panels, all of the exterior walls which are framed up for your specified rough openings, and pre-curbed skylight panels. All of the usual extensions and dormers are available. Our panelized kits are the most complete available, with dome assembly taking one or two days for residential applications. No extensive hub & strut assembly time is required, nor are complex carpentry skills needed for the exterior walls and dome raising. We have thousands of stock plans and a design staff that is able to customize any plan to your desires. Our plans are engineered to your site specifications and are engineer stamped for your local building code. We produce 3/8 and 5/8 sphere, 3v domes in16' to 75' diameter. We also produce 1/4 sphere, 8v domes in 58' to 134' diameter. Our residential dome homes typically are finished with a completed home cost of about $10.00 less per square foot than a conventional shaped home. We have extensive budgeting experience and will work to provide accurate cost analysis for your projects. Our kits typically appear more expensive than other manufacturers, but that is due to the completeness of the product. The difference will be made up in assembly expenditures on labor, materials, and rework. The kits range in price from $5,670 to $175,000. I realize that this is a long and self-promoting post and one that I would have rather avoided. I'm not sure that a newsgroup should be used for self-promotion of this sort, but I was asked, so if I offended you, please forgive. Our addresses: Oregon Dome, Inc. 3215 Meadow Lane Eugene OR 97402 Phone: (800) 572-8943 (ask for Nathan) Fax: (541) 689-9275 email: oregdome@aol.com (soon to be changed to: oregon@domes.com) URL: soon to be announced (some time next week!) Literature: Information Series: Pamphlets that cover individual aspects of dome ownership and the dome building process (see the web page when it is up). Complementary Information: Free!! Introduces you to the domes and company. Lots of color pictures. Catalog: A book of floor plans that introduces you to the families of plans that we have in stock. Another book showing what current dome owners have done with their interiors and exteriors. Complete price list. $12.00 Video: Interviews with dome owners, scenes from a dome raising, and even a clip of Bucky himself! $20.00 Guide to Construction Management: The ultimate in planning and building resources. Takes you though the building process and will help with the research and budgeting that is required to make a home project successful. $42.95 I can't really think of what else to tell you. I'm sure that there will be some response and requests for more info, so I'll wait anxiously by the computer to write some more. Thanks for the bandwidth, Nathan Burke Oregon Dome, Inc. ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 22 Feb 1996 17:49:03 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: misc. Comments: To: "teleport.com geodesic"@ubvm.cc.buffalo.edu James> predictions of sillystrings well, I thought that the elimination of blackholes was a significant step, however theoretical & namby-pamby!... being so hotly related to The Big Bang, I never cared for them very much (see the book by Erik Lerner .-)... as for the rolled-up or "compact" Ds, it hardly seems necessary to go to such lengths, just because the 5D Kaluza-Klein model was so successful; a bit of a tangle for the stringy stuff! Joe> complex ideas = icosahedra (high F) wait, and any other symmetries! ----- "Time is the only dimension." -RBFuller Congecture on "FG#s": Non Compos Mentis!... We return thee to thou couches, Potatoes. ----- On Palmtree BBS: brihut@pro-palmtree.cts.com ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 23 Feb 1996 12:24:18 CET Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: tagdi@RUULCH.LET.RUU.NL Subject: Re: syn-l: Re: sillystrings (Directed To Joe) In Message Wed, 21 Feb 1996 21:42:11 -0500, James Fischer writes: > Joe Moore said: > >>Who says that ideas can't have "volume" also? The minimum idea is a >>tetrahedron. > > Good point, Joe. > > Ooops, wait a sec, I guess the minimum idea should be a point. > > Game over, insert new quarter... > if minimum idea is a point then you have to go to the next point to think about the nex point, a linear geometry of the cube is implicit here. i think that fuller 4 min idea thinking limit is derived by deductive reasoning and it has much to supported from information theory mathematical calculation, i am refering to simple law. but it has also intuition part which one can see a bit if one think about this idea. any way if one thought in points it is still a geomtry but very slow one, so the spectrum tuning might well be quite accurate, and think of transformability from one idea to another, how long it takes to to go over a huge cubical structure. here is a senario of 4 ideas: a woman a horse she is sitting that is 3 if you dont supply the 4 you wouldn't see her sitting on the horse- a random example. because the physical brain conjure these 4 ideas, the magnatic field close them together otherwise they are not stable. that is why ideas feel magnatic and we are some much in love with them, we are basiclly adicted. just speculation. Tagdi ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 23 Feb 1996 12:32:31 CET Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: tagdi@RUULCH.LET.RUU.NL the human face could be a truncated and stelliated, in the same time, high f icos- pentdodecaha- or rhombic dodecahvertaxia. so no spher and no circle. tagdi ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 23 Feb 1996 10:54:38 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Ed Applewhite Subject: Re: Mind's Eye Book Notes I appreciate your thoughtful summary which I have printed to file with my copy of the Donald Robertson book. Ed Apple ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 23 Feb 1996 08:08:11 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: STRESS ANALYSIS STRESS ANALYSIS OF GEODESIC DOMES by Joe S. Moore Revised 8-12-95 Geodesic domes should be analyzed as hydraulic or pneumatic structures. See: "Stresses in Framed Surface Domes" (Masters thesis, N.Carolina State Univ) by R. Feng 1962 _?_ pages "A Study of the Stability of Framed, Triangulated Geodesic Domes Under the by R. J. Aguilar Action of Concentrated Loads" Doctoral thesis, N Carolina State Univ 1964 _?_ pages "Membrane Forces & Buckling in Reticulated Shells",Journl Structural Div,ASCE by Douglas T. Wright Feb 1, 1965 pages 173-201 'Steel Space Structures' _?_ __, 1965 by Z. S. Makowski pages 62-3, 72-6, 123 & 149-55 "Buckling of Framed Domes", Engineering Journal, A. I. S. C. 2(4) by Kenneth P. Buchert _?_ __, 1965 pages 120-1 'Geodesics' 1968 by Edward Popko figure 14. "3/4 Three Frequency Icosahedron-Alternate Geodesic Dome, Mathematical by David L. Wasley Structural Analysis & Physical Tests" Marin Co.Bldg.Dept, San Rafael, CA Feb __, 1971 _?_ pages 'Domebook 2' by Pacific Domes 1971 page 114 'Dome Notes' 1975 by Peter Hjersman pages 89-106 'Geodesic Math and How to Use It' 1976 by Hugh Kenner pages 1-35 'The Artifacts of R. Buckminster Fuller, Vol 3' edited by James Ward 1985 page 15 'Buckminster Fuller' 1990 by Martin Pawley page 150 -- JOE S. MOORE joemoore@bbs.cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A ALTERNATE TEL AND/OR FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 USA I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 23 Feb 1996 15:03:52 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Michael Burr Subject: Using DOME 4.2 output in CAD systems Hi everyone, Has anybody imported the output from Richard Bono's excellent DOME program (thanks Richard for sharing this with us), into a 3D CAD program and built a 3/8 or 5/8 dome shell model. I'm trying to do this with Autodesk's Generic 3D progam and having problems. You would think you could just do a radial copy about the vertical axis but it's not turning out that simple... Any hints or techniques would really be appreciated. Thanks, Michael Burr: mburr@coho.halcyon.com ------------------------------------------------------------------------ "I am torn up inside when I see waste. Waste comes in many forms: underutilized spaces, discarded materials, traffic jams, empty buses." -- Eric Konheim 1963-1991 -- ------------------------------------------------------------------------ ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 23 Feb 1996 20:53:23 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: James Fischer Subject: Re: Using DOME 4.2 output in CAD systems Michael Burr said: >Has anybody imported the output from Richard Bono's excellent DOME >program (thanks Richard for sharing this with us), into a 3D CAD >program and built a 3/8 or 5/8 dome shell model. Yes, works great from Dome to Microstation. I refuse to use AutoCad on artistic grounds, so I have not used AutoCad since "AutoCad For Windows" came out and convinced me that AutoDesk needs a cranial-rectal extraction. >I'm trying to do this with Autodesk's Generic 3D progam and having >problems. You would think you could just do a radial copy about the >vertical axis but it's not turning out that simple... Assuming that AutoDesk can support their own dxf format, I would suggest that you output the FULL SPHERE, and delete the parts that you do not need. Recall that you are dealing with surfaces rather that an empty "wireframe" framework, so rendering as "filled solids" can help you to see "where" you are, and prevent errors caused by clicking on the "far" side of the structure when you wanted the "near" side. In general, fiting a "complex" shape to another complex shape is a pain. I have a dual trackball kludged to my digitizer (don't try this at home, folks!) to solve some of the problems of messing about in (x,y,z) space, and it is still frustrating to get right without multiple passes. One trick is to pick a point on your target, snap to the point, and move/copy the object to that point. You now have the two objects "joined", perhaps only at that one point. Then rotate the object with the "rotation point" being the SAME EXACT POINT you picked above. If you open up multiple windows/viewspaces at the same time, you can check the alignment in all the orthagonal views as you rotate it in each plane in turn. (In other words, rotate it in x space, then y, then z) No software will ever be able to compress information to the extent a human female does when she merely raises an eyebrow. james fischer jfischer@supercollider.com ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 23 Feb 1996 20:54:26 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Re: NASA, McDonnell Douglas to Unveil X-36 well ah hmm. On Thu, 22 Feb 1996 16:16:46 -0500, NASA HQ Public Affairs Office wrote: > Subject: NASA, McDonnell Douglas to Unveil X-36 > > Don Nolan-Proxmire > Headquarters, Washington, DC February 22, 1996 > (Phone: 202/358-1983) > > Michael Marlaire > Ames Research Center, Mountain View, CA > (Phone: 415/604-4190) > > RELEASE: 96-36 > > NASA, MCDONNELL DOUGLAS TO UNVEIL X-36 > > NASA and the McDonnell Douglas Corporation (MDC) have > announced a joint research program for a subscale vehicle, > designated the X-36, that will demonstrate breakthrough > technologies for future tailless fighters. > > The upcoming flight tests of the X-36, a remotely piloted > tailless research aircraft, will demonstrate the feasibility > for future tailless fighters that can achieve agility levels > superior to today's fighters. The X-36 aircraft will be > unveiled to the public for the first time in a joint NASA/MDC > roll out ceremony to be held at MDC facilities in St. Louis, MO > on March 19. Following this ceremony, the aircraft will be > shipped to NASA Dryden Flight Research Center, Edwards, CA, to > prepare for its first flight this summer. > > "NASA's mission in aeronautics is to work together with > U.S. industry, the Department of Defense, and universities to > continually produce the breakthroughs in technology that must > be achieved if we are to maintain our world leadership in civil > and military aviation," said NASA Administrator > Daniel S. Goldin. "This cooperative program between NASA and > the McDonnell Douglas Corporation is an excellent example of > the new way in which NASA is striving for a 'better, cheaper, > faster' approach to fulfilling its mission," Goldin said. > > "NASA research in aerodynamics, flight controls and > propulsion continues to provide design options and tools for > designers of future fighter aircraft," said NASAUs X-36 Program > Manager, Dr. Larry Birckelbaw of NASA's Ames Research Center, > Moffett Field, CA. "The X-36 technologies, which allow the > reduction or removal of vertical tails, will reduce the weight, > increase the range and improve the survivability of tomorrow's > fighters," Birckelbaw said. The X-36 flight test program will > establish the confidence to incorporate these technologies in > future piloted vehicles. > > Coordinated research has been underway within each of the > four NASA aeronautics centers and DOD labs since the 1980s to > evaluate the ability to direct the engine thrust in multiple > directions. Recent flight tests conducted using NASA's F-18 > High Angle of Attack Research Vehicle (HARV), the United States > Air Force Multi-Axis Thrust Vectoring F-16 and the DOD/German > Ministry of Defense X-31 research aircraft have all > demonstrated that thrust vectoring can provide significant > improvements in both the agility and control of fighter aircraft. > > McDonnell Douglas Corporation, St. Louis, MO, is > responsible for the detailed design and fabrication of the two > X-36 aircraft. "The X-36 program is an entirely new, more > efficient approach to maturing advanced technologies," said > John Capellupo, President, McDonnell Douglas Aerospace. "We > wanted to team with NASA to demonstrate our new Phantom Works > capability for developing new products in less time and at > significantly lower costs. We were able to incorporate > breakthroughs in fabrication, tooling, and assembly to achieve > these savings," Capellupo said. MDC has been working in > partnership with Ames Research Center since 1989 and first > proposed the concept of using a subscale aircraft to > demonstrate the feasibility for a future tailless fighter in > early 1993. "Affordability was a key issue in selecting a > subscale vehicle. At 28 percent scale we will be able to > demonstrate all of the key controls integration technologies at > a fraction of the cost of a full scale, piloted aircraft," said > MDC X-36 Program Manager Dave Manley. > > NASA and MDC agreed to a roughly 50/50 cost share > arrangement in early 1994 to design, build and flight test the > two X-36 research aircraft. Under this arrangement, Ames is > responsible for the continued development of the critical > technologies and the flight test activities and MDC is > responsible for the fabrication. The combined program cost for > the development, fabrication and flight testing of the two > aircraft is approximately $17 million. > > Imagery of the new research vehicle will be available on > the day of roll out. > > - end- > > NASA press releases and other information are available > automatically by sending an Internet electronic mail message to > domo@hq.nasa.gov. In the body of the message (not the subject > line) users should type the words "subscribe press-release" (no > quotes). The system will reply with a confirmation via E-mail > of each subscription. A second automatic message will include > additional information on the service. NASA releases also are > available via CompuServe using the command GO NASA. ----- "Time is the only dimension." -RBFuller Congecture on "FG#s": Non Compos Mentis!... We return thee to thou couches, Potatoes. ----- On Palmtree BBS: brihut@pro-palmtree.cts.com ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 23 Feb 1996 21:40:01 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: misc and [deletives impleted] Comments: To: "teleport.com geodesic"@ubvm.cc.buffalo.edu Michael> "the Monad has no windows" by Liebniz he is such a wonderful reason to learn German; most of his archives haven't been translated, although a lot of this is related to his work in political economy, as it used to be called (and why he was attacked by Newt-1 -- too much influence on QAnne, but that's another story, kids .-) Gerald> why invert tensegs? can't really say, but I was simply struck by the notion of having a net of repellant integrity, for lack of a nicer term -- not that I don't like it! I'm sorry to have injected redolent notions of things political, but I was wondering if the fellow (John Braly?) who brought it up had found some cache of LL-bashing that I could compare to their own site. I've folowed them for years, since I happened to land in Massachussetts in the aftermath of the Boston trial (which was declared a mistrial at the govt's fault, and the paper polled the jurors'd've unanimously acquitted 'em), which caused'em to send their literature to (apparently) most of the MA libraries, which found me agape at the subsequent "rocket docket" in the Beltway (Alexandria), all of the convicts of which, excepting the ringleader (sic), are still in prison, with 2 having sentences of 77 years for "securities fraud", as defined retroactively.... and poor USAG Reno is essentially at the mercy of these same careerists, not that they initiated anything. anyway, their scientific reportage is absolutely fabulous, better than Sci.Am., Nature, New Sci.etc., in my opinion, and unparalleled (sic) in geometrical wisdom, present company excepted. of course, it ain't everyone's cup o'manure-tea, esp.when you consider that their political economy could be paraphrased as, doing even more with more. so, I'm not expecting an avalanche of queries about this, which is good, as I may be somewhat limited in my access for the next month or so. I'm just going to repeat an earlier request, on the grounds that it may benefit others with limited bandwidth or funkey access (that's me, on both counts) or PCJrs (me, again) or a bad connection from Rwanda or what ever, or who wants to slog through the archive without endlessly-annoying repetition -- it's bad enough, on a timely/daily basis: please, put your response before the quoted stuff, if possible. (tagdi, this means YOU .-) ----- "Time is the only dimension." -RBFuller Congecture on "FG#s": Non Compos Mentis!... We return thee to thou couches, Potatoes. ----- On Palmtree BBS: brihut@pro-palmtree.cts.com ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 24 Feb 1996 11:51:32 CET Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: tagdi@RUULCH.LET.RUU.NL Subject: Re: syn-l: Using DOME 4.2 output in CAD systems (fwd) >> Michael Burr: mburr@coho.halcyon.com >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> "I am torn up inside when I see waste. Waste comes in many forms: >> underutilized spaces, discarded materials, traffic jams, empty buses." >> -- Eric Konheim 1963-1991 -- >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ it is easier to talk to a congress memeber than to a bureacrat in any department of consern, and don't think that is only true in the U.S, it true everywhere. that means if you are waiting for politician to do somthing forget it. tag ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 24 Feb 1996 12:31:56 CET Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: tagdi@RUULCH.LET.RUU.NL Subject: Re: misc and [deletives impleted] Brian >if possible. (tagdi, >this means YOU .-) me what, only me, poor me. look i wrote an email about paper use and that is my notes from the article. since it is an informative staff, i didn't have much of a response. look may be you can explain what you mean, there is very little communication here about email and use of computer, when i was in the U.S, your brain gets enlightend by communication i felt i was part of it even when i was an alien but here basically there is no much communication, everyone keeps his knowldge to himself and may be they dont know much. do you consider that everyone have the same ideas when you communicate and do you assume that everyone understand you. that is a problem no one wants to adress, if we have different ideas we look from different angles whcih leads to minimum communication, there is more noise than communiction considering the whole. Tagdi P.S have you red Utopia or Oblivion. informal groups search for a leader, public administration research finding. fear is lurking somewhere. ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 24 Feb 1996 09:45:09 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Digital Arts Subject: Re: Using DOME 4.2 output in CAD systems In-Reply-To: <199602240153.UAA17216@crucible.inmind.com> I will have to add here that I too applaud the author of the DOME calculator for what appears to be its excellence in simplicity of usage and accuracy of output. I had a "ball" totally absorbed for entire weekend...just seeing what I could do with the output. In response to this dialog...yes I've imported the results of the DOME calculator as an entire shpere into plain vanilla AutoCad R12C3. This works very predictably...however, the real fun involved the use of a new rendering program call Tri-Spectives. Check this out!@! It's basically a drag 'n drop graphics editor that imports and exports to the largest audience of interfaces I've seen yet and claims to be able to produce broadcast quality video output. Try using the DOME calculator output with this package...it slips right in and the next thing you know your looking at a jewel! ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 24 Feb 1996 10:03:41 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: Re: Paradigms, Systems, and TQM Comments: To: de Bivort - Lawry In-Reply-To: ; from "de Bivort - Lawry" at Feb 24, 96 10:17 am Fuller's geometry is all about SYSTEMS--of any kind. And he defines a system as that which divides the universe into three parts: Inside the system, outside the system, and the system itself. Then he goes on to determine through experiment what constitutes a minimum system and a maximum system. Since human organizations are systems, the insights derived from Fuller's geometry can be used to better understand human systems. I need to poke around in my Bucky database to come up with two references that I remember--two organizations that are applying his geometry to human groups, plus maybe Fuller actually mentioned this in his books--not sure--have to check. PS: What is TQM? -- JOE S. MOORE joemoore@bbs.cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A ALTERNATE TEL AND/OR FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 USA I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 24 Feb 1996 11:18:55 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: GEODESIC ORGANIZATIONS APPLYING FULLER'S GEOMETRY TO HUMAN ORGANIZATIONS Compiled by Joe S. Moore, Feb. 24, 1996 ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- The Networking Institute, Inc. (TNI) 505 Waltham Street West Newton, MA, 02165 USA TEL: 617-965-3340 WEB: http://www.netage.com FAX: 617-965-2341 EML: info@netage.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- _From Networking to Tensegrity Organization_ by A.J.N.Judge, editor (1984). Published by the: Union of International Associations 40 rue Washington 1050 Brussels, BELGIUM UIA Publication # 263 ISBN: 92-834-1263-8 "Collection of papers in response to the concerns of the Networks Sub-Project of the Goals, Processes and Indicators of Development Project of the United Nations University." (Tokyo) Coordinated from the Institut Universitaire d'Etudes du Developpement-Geneva ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- _Synergetics_ by R. Buckminster Fuller (1975). See the chapter on Tensegrity, section 700.00 -- JOE S. MOORE joemoore@bbs.cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A ALTERNATE TEL AND/OR FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 USA I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 24 Feb 1996 15:07:54 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: ll Subject: Fwd: World Game(TM) Sponsorship Request ------------------------------------------------------------ REQUEST FOR SPONSORSHIP OF WORLD GAMES in San Diego and Santa Barbara -- April 26-28 As most of you know, Global Energy Network International (GENI) hosted the Buckminster Fuller Centennial Symposium and Celebration last summer in San Diego. Over 500 people from around the world attended seminars on Synergetics, Buckyballs, Architecture and Design, Critical Path, Consious Evolution and Generalized Principals of Universe. The Dymaxion Car was featured at the Auto Museum, 2 Bucky films played repeatedly to full houses at the Space Theater and Science Center, and a 2 day "Bucky for Kids" Festival -- all in Balboa Park. We played the World Game(TM) six times in three days. It was a lot, and we were both privileged to produce the event and inspired by the people and commitment that has showed up since. As we move to the completion of Bucky's Centennial Anniversary, we have again been offered the opportuntity to feature the World Game(TM) in both San Diego (April 26 & 27) and Santa Barbara (April 28), home of the Buckminster Fuller Institute. We hope to take full advantage of the PBS Film on Bucky that will air nationally on April 10th -- "Buckminster Fuller: Thinking Out Loud". In fact, the venue for the World(TM) in San Diego is planned for the big sound stage in the KPBS studios! With our lighting wizard, Joel Heathcote, and A/V master, William Martin, these presentation hold great promise for future film opportunities. We've even invited the leadership of the Gorbachev Foundation in San Francisco to consider preveiwing these Games for possible inclusion in this year's State of the World Forum (October). REQUEST: We would like to invite your support of the one-of-a-king global educational experience. We now have sponsorship for 2/3 of the required $13,000 budget. Two weeks ago, the GENI Board of Directors met, and said the event needs full underwriting by the end of February. We are fully confident that the goal will be met, but we could use help from everyone. Please consider a generous contribution to make this event a reality. Your ante into this game can make all the difference. BENEFITS OF SPONSORSHIP: * Your contribution is tax deductible * Your name listed on all promotional materials (if $500 or more) Three lead sponsors right now: GENI, Coopers & Lybrand, Mark Victor Hansen * You are your key associates will participate in this one-of-a-kind global experience, gaining insights into world issues, problems and global marketing opportunities. * Affiliation with the World Game Institute, Buckminster Fuller Institute and GENI. FURTHER INFORMATION: Please contact Peter Meisen or Patricia Stevens at the numbers below. We invite you to share this communication with others interested in advancing Fuller's work in the world. We know that if everyone did their part, we will get this job done with more impact and enjoyment. Peter Meisen, President Patricia Stevens, Executive Director Global Energy Network International (GENI) P O Box 81565 San Diego, CA 92138 USA TEL: 619-595-0139 FAX: 619-595-0403 E: geni@cerf.net GENI: a Solution to Global Problems GENI is a non-profit 501(c)(3) corporation conducting research and education into Buckminster Fuller's highest global priority of the World Game(TM) -- the electrical interconnection of power networks between countries and continents, with an emphasis on tapping remote renewable energy resources. GLOBAL ENERGY NETWORK INTERNATIONAL Peter Meisen P.O.Box 8156 San Diego, CA 92138 (619) 595-0139 FAX: (619) 595-0403 Visit the GENI World Wide Web Home Page: http://www.geni.org/ Email: Internet: geni@cerf.net Compuserve: 75543.520@compuserve.com ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 25 Feb 1996 01:29:53 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Ted Caplan Subject: Re: Film about Bucky - original PR At 2:11 PM 2/19/96 -0500, Steve Brant wrote: >I just found the press release from 1991 that announced the Simon & Goodman >Company's film project about Bucky. I'm posting its text here. I'm curious >to know how the actual film, seen at the Sundance Film Festival by someone in >this group, matches with the intention as stated in the press release. > >"Intuition: A Voyage with R. Buckminster Fuller is an hour long film to be >broadcast as part of the critically acclaimed Amercican Masters series on >Public Television. > >Fuller was best known as an architiect and creator of the Geodesic Dome -- >but he was also a scientist, a designer, a mathamatician, poet, and engineer, >a philosopher, an inventor and perhaps most of all a humanitarian. A >self-proclaimed "citizen of the world," Fuller believed that only through the >creative use of technology would man be able to ensure his survival on the >planet he called Spaceship Earth. Thus he devoted his life to improving the >human lot, in whatever way possible. >INTUITION will be the dramatic story of a man whose goal was to see how far >one mans potential could reach, defying boundaries imposed by conventional >culture, recognized disciplines and simple chronology. The counter-culture >of the sixties adopted him, but Fuller transcends trendy categories; his >challenges to orthodoxy were bold in the thirties; they are no less so today. >The program will include a selection of material from the Fuller Institute's >vast archive, which the Smithsonian called the "most expensive personal >archive in existence." The film will carefully weave material from the >archive together with new original photography of Fuller's work. It will >include interviews with some of his prominent collegues in the arts and the >sciences providing added insight and first-person narrative. Exploring >Fuller's life and work in both a historical and contemporary context, the >program will also focus on ways in which his impact is powerfully apparent >today. >Because Fuller translated philosophy into physical constructs, his >contributions have enourmous potential for film. Because his visual >creations sprang from profound insights, their beauty expands with the >historical exploration of the concepts that gave them seed." > > >Not having read this release in over five years, I was struck by its vision. > I am curious to know if the film makers were able to come close to this >vision with their final product. Sorry to take so long in responding- haven't checked mail recently. I think the main difference between the proposal and the actual film is that the fil portrays Bucky as a kind of crazed visionary- a man with fascinating ideas that but who may have been a bit off his rocker. When they show him with the college crowd in the sixties there seems to be a bit of mockery (maybe my own interpretation)- the idea that he could only find young, radical hippy kids to listen. They did not mention his involvement in the government or other 'respectable' people who valued Bucky's opinion. The interviews with people who were influenced range from John Cage, experimental composer, to writers, architects, engineers, politicians, etc- but they seem to say that his work was 'interesting' but never insisting on their usefullness- except for the dome. There was nothing about the World Game (that I can remember) or about Synergetics. I think they left synergetics out because it is the most uncinematic part of his career- no living models like the car or the domes. I guess, while I liked the film, I felt it portrayed Bucky mainly as an eccentric rather then a revolutionary. This is not to say that they don't show his revolutionary ideas but rather it seemed that the audience was amused rather then enlightened by his exploits. Now, Bucky wasn amusing but that is not what I would want first time viewers to walk away with. I can say that they used a good deal of archival footage quite well as I wrote in my last post. I hope that answers your question- my ability to be cohesive at 1:30 am is weak to say the least. ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 25 Feb 1996 01:56:53 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Ted Caplan Subject: Re: Bucky Documentary At 11:06 PM 1/28/96 -0500, Steve Brant wrote: >No mention of the Global Energy Grid? >Excuse me while I vent a little here. This documentary has been under >development at least since I first heard about it in 1990. (At that time,all >the people who belonged to the Bucky Fuller Institute were invited to >celebrate his life at John Denver's Windstar Foundation's Choices for the >Future Symposium in Aspen, CO.) >Info I was sent at the time said that an American Masters documentary was >being produced by the Simon & Goodman Film Co. (American Masters being the >Public Television series on famous Americans) >Since I don't have any knowledge of the kinds of contact that Simon and >Goodman had with people like us as they developed their film, I'll just say >that -- if your report is accurate -- yet another opportunity has been lost >to present Bucky's work as more than a "curiosity point in the history of >American inventors." >It sounds as if the film will offer precious little context for seeing >Bucky's extraordinary relevance to today's world. All one has to do is look >at the ongoing contamination of society by the "us against them/we can't all >make it" mentality -- congress is absolutely infested with it, that's why all >the "moderates" are quitting -- to know what I mean. Bucky's primary message >is "We can all make it. We have the technology." However, in order to make >it, we're going to have to start learning how to work together. >President Clinton almost made the complete point in his State of the Union, >when he talked about us all working together and not creating a "survival of >the fittest" culture. What he didn't mention is that we need to learn how to >cooperate. We must learn to give up the old psychology of "win-lose" and >replace it with a "win-win" psychology (something Stephen Covey teaches >pretty well.) >That's it for now. >I would very much appreciate it if the person who saw the film would offer >additional commentary based on my above expressed concerns. >Thanks for listening, everyone. > >Steve Brant Let me say that, if anything, the film is most respectful of his philosophy. There are many quotes by him and the idea that he thinks we can all survive if we just work together comes across pretty well- though, again, no mention of the tangible ways in which we can do that- ie- GENI. We are left thinking that he had one great success- the dome- and a lot of fascinating, 'idealistic' thoughts. It is perhaps more a personal account of his life- his relationship to his wife, his struggles for success, insecurity that led to rigidity in working with companies that would make his products viable, the loss of his daughter, his childhood and much more. I think it is valuable that they are trying to make Bucky human but, in the process, they have discounted a lot of what he has done and neglected to impart a lot of relevant information. I think most of us are worried that this documentary will portray him as a think of the past. I don't think that is unfounded. I can see an unknowledgable viewer going out after seeing the film and perhaps seeing a dome and saying, "Hey that guy did that..." and there is ends. Perhaps that is a good start, or perhaps an opportunity missed? I would hate to be the final word on that. I enjoyed the film but, nevertheless, did feel as though it did not tell the audience what I would have told them if I had made the film. As a filmmaker, I can say I know the difficulty in putting together a story of a man's life in ninety minutes. As a defender of the trade, be forgiving because it is a virtual miracle that the film was made in the first place and is as coherant as it is. But Bucky deserves a miniserie not a hour and a half! ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 25 Feb 1996 15:09:49 CET Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: tagdi@RUULCH.LET.RUU.NL Subject: Gibbs combininig of steam with mechanical power started good deal of study into relations between heat, tempreture, volume, presure and work. Clause has introduced the word entropy from the Greek" transformation". Gibbs was theoritical physicist, probably had not red Dalton, formulated his theories in mathematical terms hardly any can read. he represented thermodynamic properties of substance as volume; and concluded that we can deduce the physical state of substance from its surface. Gibbs phase rule is a simple mathematical formula, that predicted the number of different physical combination in which the component of the substance mixture could exist. Tagdi ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 25 Feb 1996 01:53:18 GMT Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Jeremy Holberg Organization: Texas A&M University Subject: Re: pics of Mariah Carey Where are the pics? ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 25 Feb 1996 09:55:05 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: Re: STRESS ANALYSIS Comments: To: Brian Hutchings In-Reply-To: ; from "Brian Hutchings" at Feb 24, 96 8:52 am Thanks. I have compiled 50 "poopsheets" on various topics into what I call _Basic Bucky_. See Richard Henderson's web site at http://metro.turnpike.net/G/GoatBoy/bucky.html -- JOE S. MOORE joemoore@bbs.cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A ALTERNATE TEL AND/OR FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 USA I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 25 Feb 1996 10:12:41 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: Re: pics of Mariah Carey In-Reply-To: <4gofee$e4t@news.tamu.edu>; from "Jeremy Holberg" at Feb 25, 96 1:53 am Jeremy Holberg writes: > Where are the pics? Pics of a female rock star--don't know. Pics related to the work of R.Buckminster Fuller--see: http://www.newciv.org/Bucky/BuckyPics.html (Several hundred of about 3 megs in compressed Amiga format) -- JOE S. MOORE joemoore@bbs.cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A ALTERNATE TEL AND/OR FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 USA I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 25 Feb 1996 10:47:15 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: WORLD GAME URL Comments: cc: Synergetics List World Game's new address is: http://www.worldgame.org/~wgi -- JOE S. MOORE joemoore@bbs.cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A ALTERNATE TEL AND/OR FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 USA I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 25 Feb 1996 13:01:37 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: WORLD GAMES 1996 World Game '96 Workshop Series _________________________________________________________________ 1996 WORLD GAME WORKSHOPS SCHEDULE (As of February 1, 1996) We invite you to visit an upcoming event. Please contact World Game Institute for more information. ____________________________________________________________________________ DATE H______O______S______T C___I___T___Y, ST, CONTRY,TYPE_OF_WORKSHOP_ February 1996 6 Darien High School Darien, CT U.S.A. World Issues 13 Kinnelon High School Kinnelon, NJ, U.S.A. World Issues 16 University of North Carolina Wilmington, NC, U.S.A. World Issues 17 University of Illinois Urbana, IL, U.S.A. Environmental 17 Univ of Wisconsin-Parkside Kenosha, WI, U.S.A. Diversity 20 Motorola Corp. Austin, TX, U.S.A. Corporate 28 Tottenville HS,NYC Voctn Cnt, New York City, NY, U.S.A. World Issues 29 Cedar Drive School Colts Neck, NJ, U.S.A. Diversity March 1996 1 Choir Academy of Harlem New York City, NY, U.S.A. World Issues 4 Conservation Foundation Downers Grove, IL, U.S.A. Environmental 6 Seward Park High School Manhattan, NY, U.S.A. World Issues 6 Brookside School Allendale, NJ, U.S.A. World Issues 7 Wingate High School Brooklyn, NY, U.S.A. World Issues 9 Murry Bergtraum High School Manhattan, NY, U.S.A. World Issues 11 Roosevelt High School Bronx, NY, U.S.A. World Issues 13 & 27- Schuylkill Center Philadelphia, PA, U.S.A. Environmental 14 Offsite Educational Services, New York City, NY, U.S.A.,World Issues 15 East New York Family Academy, New York City, NY, U.S.A. World Issues 15 Titusville High School Titusville, PA, U.S.A. World Issues 16 Newtown High School Queens, NY, U.S.A. World Issues 18 Assoc.of College Unions Int'l Conf, Phila, PA, U.S.A. World Issues 26 St. Joan of Arc School Marlton, NJ, U.S.A. World Issues 26 Motorola Corp. Schaumburg, IL, U.S.A. Corporate 27 Shore Consortium for G & T Atl, Highlands, NJ, U.S.A. World Issues April 1996 2 North Arlington High School N.Arlington, NJ, U.S.A. Diversity 3 Morris Knolls High School Rockaway, NJ, U.S.A. Diversity 4 Western New England College Springfield, MA, U.S.A. World Issues 10 Eastern Kentucky University Richmond, KY, U.S.A. World Issues 13 International House Philadelphia, PA, U.S.A. World Issues 13 Michigan State University East Lansing, MI, U.S.A. Diversity 18 Broome Community College Binghamton, NY, U.S.A. World Issues 18-20 Johnson, Long & Co. Austin, TX, U.S.A. Corporate 19,20 Boonsboro Ruritan Club Lynchburg, VA, U.S.A. World Issues 24 Diversity 2000 Union, NJ, U.S.A. World Issues 25 Museum of Discovery & Science,Ft.Lauderdale, FL, U.S.A. Environmental 30 Motorola Corp. Schaumburg, IL, U.S.A. Corporate May 1996 3 Hatboro-Horsham Sr.High Sch Horsham, PA, U.S.A. World Issues 7 Markham Place School Little Silver, NJ, U.S.A. World Issues 10 Allentown High School Allentown, NJ, U.S.A. World Issues 22 Thomas Jefferson Middle Sch Edison, NJ, U.S.A. Environmental June 1996 3 Freehold High School Freehold, NJ, U.S.A. Diversity 4 Motorola Corp. Schaumburg, IL, U.S.A. Corporate 22 Rotary International Calgary, , CANADA,Interactive Lectr July 1996 3-10 YPO University Atlanta, GA, U.S.A. Corporate 15 Univ of DE Governor's School Newark, DE, U.S.A. World Issues ____________________________________________________________________________ Global Recall and The World Game are registered trademarks of World Game Institute 3215 Race St. Philadelphia, PA 19104 USA Tel: 215-387-0220 E-Mail: wgi@worldgame.org West Coast/Pacific Northwest office: cdingee@worldgame.org World Wide Web Address: http://www.worldgame.org/~wgi ____________________________________________________________________________ (This page has been accessed 51 times) ©1995 World Game Institute -- JOE S. MOORE joemoore@bbs.cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A ALTERNATE TEL AND/OR FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 USA ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 25 Feb 1996 21:19:33 EST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: MR DALE SMITH Subject: Ferrocement question ? -- [ From: Dale Smith * EMC.Ver #2.10P ] -- I was wondering if anyone has used ferrocement on a geodesic dome, or any other projects.I would appreciate any comments on this subject. Thanks, Dale RTHN49a@PRODIGY.COM ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 25 Feb 1996 20:36:20 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: Re: Ferrocement question ? In-Reply-To: <096.02084173.RTHN49A@prodigy.com>; from "MR DALE SMITH" at Feb 25, 96 9:19 pm MR DALE SMITH writes: > I was wondering if anyone has used ferrocement on a geodesic dome, or > any other projects.I would appreciate any comments on this subject. > Thanks, > Dale > RTHN49a@PRODIGY.COM Try to get ahold of a book called _CHARAS: The Improbable Dome Builders_ by Syeus Mottel. It contains a detailed description of the construction of a ferrocement dome under the direction of one of Bucky's assistants. It even has technical details in the back. The book was published in 1973--so you probably will have to use an interlibrary loan to borrow it. See also pages 68-9 of _Domebook 2_ by Pacific Domes (1971). Again, you may have a hard time borrowing the book. -- JOE S. MOORE joemoore@bbs.cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A ALTERNATE TEL AND/OR FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 USA I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 25 Feb 1996 23:59:28 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Elias Tabello Subject: WIRED magazine: nanotubes Also in the March (4.03, p45) and horribly green edition of WIRED: The latest holy grail is an inexpensive, hi-res flat screen. While most R&D labs are still tinkering with LCD technology, a research team led by Walt de Heer and Andre Chatelain from the Swiss Federal Institute of Tech. are aiming to leapfrom them by using microscopic "nanotubes." "They work like lightening rods in reverse," says physicist de Heer. Invented in 1991, nanotubes are tiny graphite needles less than 1 micron in both length and diameter. When arranged on a Teflon sheet and blasted with voltage, nanotubes behave similarly to current display systems but use less power, are cheaper to produce, and will easily surpass the clarity of LCDs. Will this mean a sharp, clear, paper-thin screen for your PowerBook? "We do not have a display yet," de Heer admits, "but if all goes well, I think we're looking at about five years." -by Micheal Behar I thought nanotubes and buckytubules were the same thing. In any case this technology is a case of doing more with less regardless of geometry. elias@magi.com visit www.hempbc.com ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 26 Feb 1996 00:17:33 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Steve Brant Subject: Re: Paradigms, Systems, and TQM Regarding Bucky, Systems, and Human Organizations - the "quality management profession," as represented by the trade organizations ASQC (American Society for Quality Control) and AQP (Association for Quality and Participation), is the profession that uses "systems thinking" in the design of human organizations. Peter Senge, author of "The Fifth Discipline: The Art of The Learning Organization," is one of the management gurus currently promoting systems thinking. Dr. Russell Ackoff, Chairman of the Board of INTERACE: the Institute for Interactive Management is an even more highly regarded "systems thinking" organizational consultant. Both men knew/studied Bucky's work. Ackoff is on the Advisory Board of The World Game Institute. Finally, Dr. W. Edwards Deming, the father of modern quality management (he died in 1993 at the age of 93), included systems thinking as one of the four cornerstones of what he called Profound Knowledge (knowledge capable of transforming western civilizations concept of management). The other three cornerstones are: Statistical Variation Analysis, Learning Theory, and Human Psychology. Quality management (itself a "lable" for the profession) has produced many names for what it does. TQM (Total Quality Management) is one such lable. Dr. Deming never used the term, although for purposes of there being some visibility for the profession, the TQM term has been widely used in the press. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 26 Feb 1996 00:49:35 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Elias Tabello Subject: Re: Roofing Domes >No one has applied mass production...to dome constuction. True, but the market has a way of doing things when its good and ready. Fuller explained this as the gestation lag every new technology has before it is implemented. By that time we'll probably be using patented Japanese technology to build high strength ceramic structures that can be delivered whole. They'd only need to be fitted with windows--easy! Hopefully, you could design your structure with a computer and upload it to orders@house.jp Workers in Springfield USA would oversee manufacture, quality assurance and delivery to your lot. At the Bucky centennial in San Diego this summer, SDSU prof Eugene Ray spoke of how the Japanese were researching high strength ceramic designs. >No one has applied...late 20th century manufacturing techniques to dome >constuction. Not True. TEMCOR, a company that I believe Fuller founded, has build a number of amazing domes. Mostly large projects (this makes sense as the strengh of a dome icreases proportionally to its size) such as arenas, churches, mosques, industrial complexes (Covers for those big round cylinders at oil refineries, waste water facilities, airplane hangars, and the South Pole Dome). >We should build domes the way we build cars Hopefully without the corruption. Car companies could be producing cars that get on average 4 times the number of miles per gallon (ie 100MPG). These cars have been prototyped and could be produced at competitive prices. I just think that the car companies own too many oil companies or vice-versa. A good book is CAR TROUBLE by Steve Nadis and James Mackenzie. Lots of facts in this book, much of it from the US government. ISBN 0-8070-8523-5. elias@magi.com visit www.realaudio.com they have links to NPR & ABC & more in Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: TlineDomes Organization: America Online, Inc. (1-800-827-6364) Subject: Re: Eathquakes and geodesic dome structures The ability of the dome to withstand earthquakes is due to the structure being made from a seires of intelocking triangles. Triangles are of course the strongest shape known. The dome shape distributes the forces very efficiently and the triangles provide the strength. We have a customer in Chatsworth CA, three miles from the epicenter of the Northridge quake. He has two domes (a 40' 5/8 and a 45' 5/8) and while many of his neighbors suffered significant damage, he did not even lose a coffee cup. If you would like some free information on our domes, e mail us with your name and address or call us at 1-800-DOME-HOME or 510-849-4481. Fax: 510-849-3265. Timberline Geodesics Designing and manufacturing geodesic domes since 1969. 1-800-DOME-HOME - 510-849-4481 TLineDomes@aol.com ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 26 Feb 1996 15:33:53 GMT+0200 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: "Venter, Dawie" Organization: Denel Informatics, Cape Reg Office Subject: Re: Ferrocement question ? Dale Smith wrote >I was wondering if anyone has used ferrocement on a geodesic dome, or any other projects.I would appreciate any comments on this subject.< I've built a 4 metre radius geodesic dome (on riser walls) using ferro cement. The cement was hand stacked against the dome's space-frame steel mesh panels, which incorporated a poly -urathane insulation foam core. There are also contractors here, building ferro cement domes over igloo shaped inflated "balloon" formers. Various diameter "balloons" as well as "stretched" versions are used and linked in clusters to obtain the desired floor-plan lay-out. The dome shell is about 50mm thick, hand stacked, incorporating two layers of mesh and a concrete waterproofing coating on the exterior. The domes are used from budget housing on farms, to comfortable holiday cottages at the coast here. The dome building contractor charges about 25% less per m^2 than the going rate for conventional (brick and mortar) buildings. Regards Dawie Venter (Cape Town, South Africa) ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 26 Feb 1996 09:15:19 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: Re: STRESS ANALYSIS Comments: To: Venter Dawie In-Reply-To: <419A0F392A@i1.iplan.co.za>; from "Venter, Dawie" at Feb 26, 96 9:25 am Venter, Dawie writes: > hundredfold over the last month alone. One last question, any idea > of how to get hold of the two thesis (listed below) from the Carolaina State > University? Any chance of downloading a file perhaps? > > "Stresses in Framed Surface Domes" (Masters thesis, N.Carolina State Univ) > by R. Feng 1962 _?_ pages > > "A Study of the Stability of Framed, Triangulated Geodesic Domes Under the > by R. J. Aguilar Action of Concentrated Loads" > Doctoral thesis, N Carolina State Univ 1964 _?_ pages I know that N.Carolina State U is on the web. A search using "Carolina" should turn up their address. You might be able to purchase a copy directly, or maybe you could use the interlibrary loan service of your local library. If the papers aren't too long they will just send photocopies. Offer to pay the library for their trouble. That's what I've done several times--I've collected quite a bit of material that way. -- JOE S. MOORE joemoore@bbs.cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A ALTERNATE TEL AND/OR FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 USA I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 26 Feb 1996 21:19:41 CET Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: tagdi@RUULCH.LET.RUU.NL Subject: Re: Eathquakes and geodesic dome structures TlineDomes writes: >The ability of the dome to withstand earthquakes is due to the structure >being made from a seires of intelocking triangles. Triangles are of >course the strongest shape known. The dome shape distributes the forces >very efficiently and the triangles provide the strength. To everyone. I wonder if everyone can join together and start plant for mass-production of domes. The housing problem will never be solved by conventional building system. We must at least design the system, the best would be automated one. i think it important that we think on a large scale. The problem that we do not even know our potential and few know what other's are intrested in, what they hope to accomplish and what they need to know. I think it is worth it to think on a large scale. Possible goverments that could initiate such a massive project,if qualified people could persuade them, this is just speculation. Japan Soviet Union Eygept libya Kwait Tunis South Africa Hungary Tagdi ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 26 Feb 1996 22:17:50 CET Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: tagdi@RUULCH.LET.RUU.NL Subject: Asking oneself questions I write to those who are interested in education. Fuller asked himself pertinent(important) quesions, such as what is science what is structure, what's reform the enviroment. lately i find that i have similiar quesions. in order for him to had had answered them, he had to completly disregard all the specialized dictum, and he just went only to those questions. lately, i thought about such things and i realize that i do not actualy know much by experience. why, becuause i did not start with fundementals such as: generalized principle, what is line, what is a chemical reaction,.. alloys. i was thinking in specialize way. i would think that if one does not answer these sort of questions on his own terms, there would be confusion of going about everything at once. this means that one need to use words in personal way, what the one understand, and dismissing the scintific jargon. this is a slow process, this might be what Fuller advised us to do, except he was not succesful in transmiting the message. i am attempting again to redefine my experience. tagdi ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 26 Feb 1996 14:23:00 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: Re: STRESS ANALYSIS In-Reply-To: <9602260915.aa07552@bbs.cruzio.com>; from "Joe Moore" at Feb 26, 96 9:15 am Joe Moore writes: > Venter, Dawie writes: > > hundredfold over the last month alone. One last question, any idea > > of how to get hold of the two thesis (listed below) from the Carolaina State > > University? Any chance of downloading a file perhaps? > > "Stresses in Framed Surface Domes" (Masters thesis, N.Carolina State Univ) > > by R. Feng 1962 _?_ pages > > "A Study of the Stability of Framed, Triangulated Geodesic Domes Under the > > by R. J. Aguilar Action of Concentrated Loads" > > Doctoral thesis, N Carolina State Univ 1964 _?_ pages > I know that N.Carolina State U is on the web. A search using "Carolina" should > turn up their address. You might be able to purchase a copy directly, or > maybe you could use the interlibrary loan service of your local library. If > the papers aren't too long they will just send photocopies. Offer to pay the > library for their trouble. That's what I've done several times--I've > collected quite a bit of material that way. N.Carolina State Univ web address is: http://www.ncsu.edu -- JOE S. MOORE joemoore@bbs.cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A ALTERNATE TEL AND/OR FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 USA I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 26 Feb 1996 17:28:24 GMT Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Tognon Marco Organization: PING Belgium Subject: Books on Domes Helo there, Belgium calling... Some of you now that I'm too a Dome Affacionado, constantly seeking information and knowledge on domes in all their aspects. But horror, here in Belgium no books on the subject are to be found. Who heard of Buckminster Fuller? What do you say, Domes? Your weird, man, stop dreaming... Iglos, ... No American books, sorry Sounds familiar? Its an allmost impossible task to find THE good books on domes and the technologie behind it. Scraps from friends, collected during the many years working abroad, are the only resources available. Internet is a wonderfull means to search for these treasured goodies. But after extensive searches, no books found... I wonder if it is possible to make copies of these prints and distribute them for cost price? It is not the fact of copying them, I'm shure that a lot off us like to pay the regular price for it and even more, but, they are no longer available... I do understand thet copyrights are to be taken into account, but what to do if you can not buy them!!! So to finisch my question; 1. Can this be done? 2. Is it legal? If both answers are no, then something is to be done to make this information available to the public again. Let me know what YOU think, folks... Regards, Marco Tognon ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 26 Feb 1996 15:52:15 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: Re: Books on Domes In-Reply-To: <4gsqjo$p8p@ping1.ping.be>; from "Tognon Marco" at Feb 26, 96 5:28 pm Tognon Marco writes: > But horror, here in Belgium no books on the subject are to be found. > Its an allmost impossible task to find THE good books on domes and > the technologie behind it. > I wonder if it is possible to make copies of these prints > and distribute them for cost price? > It is not the fact of copying them, I'm shure that > a lot off us like to pay the regular price for it > and even more, but, they are no longer available... > Marco Tognon Check out the Buckminster Fuller Institute's web page at: http://www.critpath.org/bfi/ There should be a list of books that ARE available from the BFI. -- JOE S. MOORE joemoore@bbs.cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A ALTERNATE TEL AND/OR FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 USA I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 26 Feb 1996 15:54:54 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: FOG GUN UPDATE FULLER'S FOG GUN CLEANING SYSTEM by Joe S. Moore Revised 2-26-96 As far back as 1948 R. Buckminster Fuller demonstrated a design for a scientific method of cleaning. 'Dymaxion World...' states: "His fog gun....afforded a new kind of bathing. It combined compressed air (200 psi) and atomized water with triggered-in solvents. The kinetic force of the high-pressure air stream was utilized without the skin- damaging effect unavoidable in high-pressure needle-pointing of water streams....." "....A one-hour massaging pressure bath used only a pint of water. If fog gun bathing were done in front of a heat lamp, all the sanitary and muscle-relaxing effects of other types of bathing could be effected without the use of any bathroom." This idea could also be adapted to washing dishes, clothes, vehicles, etc. 'The Dymaxion World of Buckminster Fuller' 1973 by R. Buckminster Fuller & Robert Marks pages 99-100 "Energy Economics", Ekistics (magazine) vol.269 5-78 by R. Buckminster Fuller page 167 'Water Conservation & the Mist Experience', McGill Univ, Montreal, Canada by Alex Morse, Vikram Bhatt, & Witold Rybczynsky 7-78 60 pages (Available for $4.00 from McGill University, School of Architecture,) (3480 University Street, Montreal, PQ, CANADA H3A 2A7.) (http://architecture.mcgill.ca) _Critical Path_ 1981 by R. Buckminster Fuller pgs 149, 212, 314 _Buckminster Fuller's Universe_ 1989 by Lloyd S. Sieden pages 199-200 -- JOE S. MOORE joemoore@bbs.cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A ALTERNATE TEL AND/OR FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 USA I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 26 Feb 1996 08:52:47 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Brian Hutchings Subject: Re: Eathquakes and geodesic dome structures ah, well, if "he didn't..lose a coffee cup", he either doesn't drink coffee, or his ground didn'shake so much; the patterns of release of energy amongst the edges of the movin'plates are very involved & nonlinear, and the notion of an epicenter is probably largely an artifact.... or is this one o'those ceramic domes ?!?... the #focusC (focus) of a quake may have to do with an explosive (fission and/or fusion) release in a small area, in the deep-focus cases, at least, but any transmission amongst the plates is another matter. ----- "Time is the only dimension." -RBFuller Congecture on "FG#s": Non Compos Mentis!... We return thee to thou couches, Potatoes. ----- On Palmtree BBS: brihut@pro-palmtree.cts.com ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 27 Feb 1996 19:58:19 WST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: John Mac Cosham Subject: Re: Ferrocement question ? >Dale Smith wrote > >>I was wondering if anyone has used ferrocement on a geodesic dome, or >any other projects.I would appreciate any comments on this subject.< > >I've built a 4 metre radius geodesic dome (on riser walls) using >ferro cement. The cement was hand stacked against the dome's >space-frame steel mesh panels, which incorporated a poly -urathane >insulation foam core. Dear Dale: You write of space-frame steel mesh panels. This sounds very interesting. Could you describe these in more detail. Were they hand made? Thankyou Swami dharmraj aka John Mac Cosham dharmraj@highway1.com.au ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 27 Feb 1996 16:20:59 GMT+0200 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: "Venter, Dawie" Organization: Denel Informatics, Cape Reg Office Subject: Re: Ferrocement question ? John Mac Cosham (dharmraj@highway1.com.au) wrote: >This sounds very interesting. Could you describe these in more detail. Were they hand made?< Hello John The steel space frame panels were factory manufactured and intended to be used for the construction of dwelling walls, up to two stories high. It comprises of two layers of square welded re-inforcing mesh, spaced about 35 mm from each other by means of welded wire spacers. The wire spacers are of the same gauge wire as the mesh itself, and spot-welded to the two mesh layers at an angle of about 60 degrees. The angled spacers and mesh results in very rigid space frame construction panel. (Sounds terribly complicated in words, but will provide a bitmap if required). The angled spacers also support a layer of polyurethane foam (of about 15 mm thick) in the centre of the panel, which acts as an insulation layer and prevents the stacked or sprayed concrete from flying right through the mesh. If I recall correctly, the panels were manufactured in standard 1.2 m X 2.4 m sheets and are easily cut with an angle-grinder or set of pliers. Joints between two space frame panels are re-inforced with a band of mesh, overlapping both panels by about two squares, affixed to both sides of the joint by means of a small hand operated staple-crimping tool. The structure is strong enough to support roof trusses, window and door frames, electrical and water ducting, before the concrete stucco is even applied. I used the same panel, cut triangles from it and built a 4m radius 3/8 geodesic dome on riser walls. Regards Dawie Venter (Cape Town, South Africa) ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 27 Feb 1996 10:05:45 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Nick Pine Organization: Villanova University Subject: A zero-fossil-fuel studio? Here is another simulation, for an 8' x 12' garden shed built on top of 18 vertical 55 gallon drums full of water. This BASIC program also shows how to calculate the heat loss coefficient for the shed, ie how much heat is lost from the shed per hour for certain indoor and outdoor temperatures. It also allows having different indoor temperatures during the day and at night (line 370 below.) The input file is derived from NREL Philadelphia TMY2 solar weather data. This shed might have single layer transparent north-sloping Dynaglas roof :-) and a 12' x 12' south wall that is entirely glazed with polyethylene greenhouse film, over a 2" air gap and 3 1/2" of fiberglass insulation, painted dark on the paper side, stapled to some 4' x 8' modular panels made by screwing some 1 x 6 picture frames to a piece of thin exterior flakeboard on the inside. The solar closet might be convection-powered, or it might have a fan, eg a 12 VDC fan powered by a PV panel under the poly film sunspace. BASIC is an easy programming language to learn, even for people who like to talk about global warming a lot. Many 13 year old children have learned BASIC. The language is completely described (along with a lot of other things) in Russ Walter's _Secret Guide to Computers_ ("The world's top rated computer tutorial," 20th edition?), which is available from Russ at 617-666-2666. "Call the author at his home for FREE help. Call Russ, day or night, 24 hours. He's usually in, and he sleeps just lightly." 640 pages for $15. 10 'TMY2 simulation for a Phila solar house 20 'input file data format--day # (1-212), avg. daytime temp (F), 30 ' hourly total solar radiation on a south wall (Btu/ft^2/day) 40 DIM DAY(220),TMP(220),RAD(220) 50 OPEN "tmyweth" FOR INPUT AS 1 60 FOR D=1 TO 212'read input data file 70 INPUT #1, DAY(D),TMP(D),RAD 80 RAD(D)=RAD*1.2'add ground reflection to rad 90 NEXT D 100 AGSS=12*12'sunspace glazing area (ft^2) 110 TSG=.92'sunspace glazing solar transmission 120 TSUP=80'upper temp limit for sunspace (F) 130 AGSC=4*12'solar closet glazing area (ft^2) 140 TCG=.92'closet glazing solar transmission 150 TCUP=200'upper temp limit for solar closet 160 DHWL=0*3*10*8*(110-55)'daily Domestic Hot Water heating load (Btu) 170 NS=0'number of 1500 gallon septic tanks in closet 180 ND=18'number of 55 gallon drums in closet 190 C=NS*1500*8+ND*450'solar closet heat capacity 200 TMA=NS*(6+12)*2+ND*25'thermal mass heat transfer area (ft^2) 210 TMGAR=TMA/AGSC'thermal mass area/closet glazing area ratio 220 TSC=100'initial value for solar closet water temp (F) 230 HL=12'east-west dimension of house (ft) 240 HW=8'north-south dimension of house (ft) 250 HH=12'house height (ft) 260 WINDA=8'total house window area (ft^2) 270 RWALL=13'R-value of walls (F-hr-ft^2/Btu) 280 RWIND=2'R-value of windows (F-hr-ft^2/Btu) 290 RCEIL=1'R-value of ceiling (F-hr-ft^2/Btu) 300 WALLA=HH*(HL+HW)*2-WINDA'wall area of house (ft^2) 310 CEILA=HL*HW'ceiling area (ft^2) 320 HLC=WALLA/RWALL+WINDA/RWIND+CEILA/RCEIL'heat loss coefficient for house 330 TSCM=1000'initialize minimum water closet temp variable 340 OPEN "simout" FOR OUTPUT AS 2 350 FOR D=1 TO 212'simulate house for a heating season, day by day 360 IF TMP(D) > 68 THEN TMP(D)=68'limit upper ambient temp 370 TNIGHT=50'minimum nightime house temperature 380 HLOSSD=8*HLC*(68-TMP(D))'daytime house heat loss 390 HLOSSN=16*HLC*(TNIGHT-TMP(D))'nightime house heat loss 400 IF HLOSSN<0 THEN HLOSSN=0'ignore night warming from outdoor temp 410 HLOSS=HLOSSD+HLOSSN 420 SSUNIN=RAD(D)*TSG*AGSS'daily sun energy entering sunspace 430 SSLOSS=6*AGSS*(TSUP-TMP(D))'daily heat loss from Tsup sunspace, if used 440 IF SSUNIN68 THEN TSC=TSC-HLOSS/C:HLOSS=0'take house heat from closet 530 BACKUP = BACKUP + HLOSS'supply house with backup heat if needed (Btu) 540 TSC=TSC-DHWL/C'take DHW heating load from closet 550 IF TSC > TCUP THEN TSC = TCUP'limit upper closet temp 560 TMP(D)=INT(TMP(D)+.5)'rounding 570 RAD(D)=INT(RAD(D)+.5)'rounding 580 TSC=INT(TSC+.5)'rounding 590 IF TSC20 THEN TSCM=TSC'save minimum closet water temp 600 IF D MOD 7 <> 0 GOTO 640'report once a week 610 PRINT D;TAB(6);TMP(D);TAB(12);RAD(D);TAB(20);TSC;TAB(28);BACKUP/100000! 620 PRINT #2, D;TAB(6);TMP(D);TAB(12);RAD(D);TAB(20);TSC;TAB(28);BACKUP/100000! 630 'FOR I=1 TO 50000!:NEXT'delay loop 640 NEXT D 710 PRINT #2, 720 PRINT #2,"Thermal mass/glazing area ratio:";TMGAR 730 PRINT #2,"(suggest >10 for natural convection, >5 with a fan)" 740 PRINT #2, 750 PRINT #2,"Heat loss coefficient for house (Btu/hr-F): ";HLC 760 PRINT #2,"Minimum water closet temp for year (F): ";TSCM 770 CLOSE #2 Output file simout: day avg. sun water cum backup # temp Btu temp heat 7 65 955 162 0 October 7 14 66 718 200 0 21 59 2154 200 0 28 49 1607 200 0 35 68 694 200 0 42 39 4033 200 0 49 41 2857 200 0 56 48 2742 196 0 63 48 1340 193 0 70 31 606 184 0 77 35 1559 182 0 84 53 1000 182 0 91 34 3658 184 0 December 30 98 29 622 194 0 105 30 937 199 0 112 35 600 181 0 119 26 4118 185 0 126 38 412 173 0 133 29 4241 200 0 140 32 648 196 0 147 33 942 198 0 154 30 4845 200 0 161 37 1210 200 0 168 40 952 200 0 175 50 3959 200 0 182 54 679 200 0 189 49 3435 200 0 196 43 830 200 0 203 46 1311 200 0 210 65 1353 200 0 April 28 Thermal mass/glazing area ratio: 9.375 (suggest >10 for natural convection, >5 with a fan) House heat loss coefficient (Btu/hr-F): 136 Minimum water closet temp for year (F): 162 (The estimated 24 hour daily average outdoor temperatures above are slightly less than the temperatures posted before, which were average daytime temps.) Nick ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 27 Feb 1996 21:00:00 CET Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: tagdi@RUULCH.LET.RUU.NL Subject: Article There is an article about F.carbon in Science Magazine(February). Tagdi ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 27 Feb 1996 12:53:44 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: Re: Paradigms, Systems, and TQM Comments: To: John Woods In-Reply-To: <199602272037.OAA22005@mail.execpc.com>; from "John Woods" at Feb 27, 96 2:37 pm I see your point. I tend sometimes to be a little too much a Bucky fan. Nevertheless, I think what excites me is the idea that one could actually build a physical model of an organization--a high frequency geodesic dome (depending on the size of the organization). With electronic communication organizations are tending to "flatten out" (actually, become spherical). Each member is a node of a geodesic network. -- JOE S. MOORE joemoore@bbs.cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A ALTERNATE TEL AND/OR FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 USA I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 27 Feb 1996 13:27:26 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: SHELTER SYSTEMS SHELTER SYSTEMS I recently found the following information regarding this dome manufacturer: QUOTE: Shelter Systems is a family owned business dedicated to providing efficient and enviromentally sound solutions to shelter needs. Through a careful search for the best materials and geometric designs, we have arrived at a shelter that works without waste. In our 16 years of business we have been granted 12 patents, covering everything from the structural concepts to the molded clips used in construction. [IMAGE] Shelter Systems has a long history in design of tensile structures, revolutionizing the tent industry in 1976 by designing the first geodesic camping tent, The Oval Intention. Our portable shelters are at work around the world protecting people by providing shelter in all types of conditions. Our greenhouse line has resulted from the blending of business with lifestyle. While working with structural design over the years, the domes naturally found their way into the garden, where we were delighted to discover some of their best applications! The domes you find offered in this catalog have been extensively tested for durability, ease of use and watertightness. We hope one will suit your needs. UNQUOTE. Robert E. Gillis, President Shelter Systems-OL 224 West O'Connor St. Menlo Park, CA 94025 USA Email: shelter@best.com FAX: 415-323-1220 Phone: 415-323-6202 WWW: http://www.shelter-systems.com -- JOE S. MOORE joemoore@bbs.cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A ALTERNATE TEL AND/OR FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 USA I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 27 Feb 1996 18:08:12 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: LYDICK DOMES LYDICK'S DOMES UNLIMITED QUOTE: Lydick's Domes Unlimited was founded in 1983 by Jack and Linda Lydick after being involved in the construction industry for 12 years. In the 13 years since, we have established the premier dome dealership in the nation. Lydick's Domes offers domes manufactured by Oregon Dome Inc. After much research we chose them as best in overall quality, product availability, design, and responsiveness. Originally opened to serve Western Pennsylvania, we have now erected domes in Ohio, West Virginia, Virginia, Texas, Wisconsin, Kentucky, Vermont, and South Carolina. We are now capable of world wide delivery and support. All of our domes are wood frame, wood sheathed, panelized structures. [IMAGE] In our commercial line, we offer domes that range from 45' in diameter (1800 sq. ft.) to 134' in diameter (15,000 sq. ft.) In our residential line, we offer domes that range from 30' in diameter (800 sq. ft.) to 60' in diameter, (5000 sq. ft.) [IMAGE] UNQUOTE. (snip) QUOTE: [IMAGE] We have a complete line of promotional materials available for you to choose from. Our free color pamphlet titled "Imagine", a 4 page color brocheur titled "Building Homes For Families"-cost $1.00, a full color catalog-cost $12.00, our " Guide To Construction Management" (all that you would ever need to know about designing and building your own dome) - cost $42.00, and 8 1/2"x11" individual floor plan sheets - cost $.25 each. UNQUOTE: Lydick's Domes Unlimited 173 Harvey Rd. Sarver, PA U.S.A. 16055 Tel: 412-353-0098 Fax: 412-353-0098 Eml: domeking@nauticom.net WWW: http://www.nauticom.net/www/domeking -- JOE S. MOORE joemoore@bbs.cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A ALTERNATE TEL AND/OR FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 USA I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 27 Feb 1996 20:52:13 GMT Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Kirby Urner Organization: 4D Solutions Subject: Re: When humanity crossed the threshold Steve Brant wrote: >Kirby asks for clarification of humanity's crossing of the threshold between >a "you or me" world and one in which we had the ability to take care of >everyone's basic survival needs. > >This is one of my favorite subjects, so here's what I know: > >In Bucky's "Keynote Address at Vision 65" (from the book Utopia of Oblivion: >the Prospects for Humanity) he says the following: > >"Only one decade ago, at the meeting in Geneva and its companion meeting of >the Food and Agricultural Organizatoin of the United Nations, it cam so >clearly into scientific view that theleading world politicians could >acknowledge it to be true that -- as reported unequivocally by Gerard Piel, >publisher of the Scientific American -- for the first time in the history of >man, it was in evidence that there could be enough of the fundamental >metabolic and mechanical energy sustenance for everybody to survive at high >standards of living -- Thanks for the quote Steve! I guess the quote I was thinking of was from GRUNCH OF GIANTS: [ In technology's "invisible" world, inventors continually increase the quantity and quality of performed work per each volume or pound of material, erg of energy, and unit of worker and "overhead" time invested in each given increment of attained functional performance. This complex process we call progressive ephemeralization. In 1970, the sum total of increases in overall technological know how and their comprehensive integration took humanity across the epochal but invisible threshold into a state of technically realizable and economically feasible universal success for all humanity. This actual but invisible threshold crossing began in 1969 when humans' scientific knowledge and technological ingenuity, backed exclusively by adequate citizens' tax raised government financing, learned how to do so much with so little as to be able to place humans on the Moon and return them safely to Earth. ] -------------------------------------------------------- Kirby Urner "All realities are virtual" -- KU Email: pdx4d@teleport.com Web: http://www.teleport.com/~pdx4d/ ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 27 Feb 1996 18:11:36 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Nick Pine Organization: Villanova University Subject: A zero-fossil-fuel hot tub? Here is yet another simulation for an outdoor solar heated hot tub enclosure. The tub would be a $300 epoxy-lined 500 gallon septic tank, about 5' wide x 6' long x 5' tall, with about 4' of water inside. The tub water would not be useful as thermal mass, since it would have a constant temperature of about 104 F. The usable thermal mass would be 2 liter soda bottles stacked up 3-high in hard plastic crates containing 8 bottles each. The septic tank would normally lose about 4 F per day in the winter, if the 4" Styrofoam lid were mostly closed. Its temperature would be controlled by opening and closing a butterfly foamboard flap between the south side of the tank and the solar closet, either automatically, or with a handle. The roof might have a layer of poly film under the clear corrugated polycarbonate, so it would have an R-value of about 2 to reduce condensation when the hinged tub lid is open. The sides might have an R-value of 10, if they were made of 2" Styrofoam, with latex paint on the outside. The structure would be 8' x 8' x 12' tall, and it might be used for an hour a day, on the average... Or, this might be built without a full upper enclosure, just a hinged cover with a counterweight. Perhaps one could allow some rainwater to flow through the tub to keep it clean, and use fewer chemicals. 10 'TMY2 simulation for a Phila solar house 20 'input file data format--day # (1-212), avg. daytime temp (F), 30 ' hourly total solar radiation on a south wall (Btu/ft^2/day) 40 DIM DAY(220),TMP(220),RAD(220) 50 OPEN "tmyweth" FOR INPUT AS 1 60 FOR D=1 TO 212 70 INPUT #1, DAY(D),TMP(D),RAD 80 RAD(D)=RAD*1.2'add ground reflection to rad 90 NEXT D 100 AGSS=8*12'sunspace glazing area (ft^2) 110 TSG=.92'sunspace glazing solar transmission 120 TSUP=80'upper temp limit for sunspace (F) 130 AGSC=8*4'solar closet glazing area (ft^2) 140 TCG=.92'closet glazing solar transmission 150 TCUP=200'upper temp limit for solar closet 160 DHWL=0*3*10*8*(110-55)'daily Domestic Hot Water heating load (Btu) 170 NS=0'number of 1500 gallon septic tanks in closet 180 ND=0'number of 55 gallon drums in closet 190 NB=3*8*18'number of 2-liter soda bottles in closet 200 C=NS*1500*8+ND*450+NB*4.2'solar closet heat capacity 210 TMA=NS*(6+12)*2+ND*25+NB*1.22'thermal mass heat transfer area (ft^2) 220 TMGAR=TMA/AGSC'thermal mass area/closet glazing area ratio 230 TSC=100'initial value for solar closet water temp (F) 240 HL=8'east-west dimension of house (ft) 250 HW=8'north-south dimension of house (ft) 260 HH=12'house height (ft) 270 WINDA=4'total house window area (ft^2) 280 RWALL=10'R-value of walls (F-hr-ft^2/Btu) 290 RWIND=2'R-value of windows (F-hr-ft^2/Btu) 300 RCEIL=2'R-value of ceiling (F-hr-ft^2/Btu) 310 WALLA=HH*(HL+HW)*2-WINDA'wall area of house (ft^2) 320 CEILA=HL*HW'ceiling area (ft^2) 330 HLC=WALLA/RWALL+WINDA/RWIND+CEILA/RCEIL'heat loss coefficient for house 340 TSCM=1000'initialize minimum water closet temp variable 350 OPEN "simout" FOR OUTPUT AS 2 360 FOR D=1 TO 212 370 IF TMP(D) > 68 THEN TMP(D)=68'limit upper ambient temp 380 TN=40'minimum nightime house temperature 390 HLOSSD=8*HLC*(68-TMP(D))'daytime house heat loss [shoulda been 1, not 8] 400 HLOSSN=23*HLC*(TN-TMP(D))'nightime house heat loss 410 IF HLOSSN<0 THEN HLOSSN=0'ignore night warming from outdoor temp 420 HLOSS=HLOSSD+HLOSSN'daily house heat loss 430 SSUNIN=RAD(D)*TSG*AGSS'daily sun energy entering sunspace 440 SSLOSS=6*AGSS*(TSUP-TMP(D))'daily heat loss from Tsup sunspace, if used 450 IF SSUNIN68 THEN TSC=TSC-HLOSS/C:HLOSS=0'take house heat from closet 540 BACKUP = BACKUP + HLOSS'supply house with backup heat if needed 550 TSC=TSC-DHWL/C'take DHW heating load from closet 560 IF TSC > TCUP THEN TSC = TCUP'limit upper closet temp 570 TMP(D)=INT(TMP(D)+.5)'rounding 580 RAD(D)=INT(RAD(D)+.5)'rounding 590 TSC=INT(TSC+.5)'rounding 600 IF TSC20 THEN TSCM=TSC'save minimum closet water temp 610 IF D MOD 7 <> 0 GOTO 650'report once a week 620 PRINT D;TAB(6);TMP(D);TAB(12);RAD(D);TAB(20);TSC;TAB(28);BACKUP 630 PRINT #2, D;TAB(6);TMP(D);TAB(12);RAD(D);TAB(20);TSC;TAB(28);BACKUP! 640 'FOR I=1 TO 50000!:NEXT'delay loop 650 NEXT 720 PRINT #2, 730 PRINT #2,"Thermal mass/glazing area ratio:";TMGAR 740 PRINT #2,"(suggest >10 for natural convection, >5 with a fan)" 750 PRINT #2, 760 PRINT #2,"Heat loss coefficient for house (Btu/hr-F): ";HLC 770 PRINT #2,"Minimum water closet temp for year (F): ";TSCM 780 CLOSE #2 Output file simout: day avg. sun water cumulative # temp (Btu) temp backup heat 7 65 955 200 0 October 7 14 66 718 200 0 21 59 2154 200 0 28 49 1607 200 0 35 68 694 200 0 42 39 4033 200 0 49 41 2857 200 0 56 48 2742 200 0 63 48 1340 189 0 70 31 606 192 0 77 35 1559 183 0 84 53 1000 190 0 91 34 3658 200 0 December 30 98 29 622 192 0 105 30 937 200 0 112 35 600 184 0 119 26 4118 200 0 126 38 412 170 0 133 29 4241 200 0 140 32 648 198 0 147 33 942 200 0 154 30 4845 200 0 161 37 1210 200 0 168 40 952 200 0 175 50 3959 200 0 182 54 679 200 0 189 49 3435 200 0 196 43 830 200 0 203 46 1311 200 0 210 65 1353 200 0 Thermal mass/glazing area ratio: 16.47 (suggest >10 for natural convection, >5 with a fan) House heat loss coefficient (Btu/hr-F): 72 Minimum water closet temp for year (F): 161 It's probably better to limit the maximum closet water temperature to about 160 F, since plastic soda bottles shrink by about 50% when filled with boiling water. That way, the solar closet collection efficiency would be and the minimum water temperature over the winter would be about 120 F, 40 F less than the max and 20 F more than the tub temperature. Nick ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 28 Feb 1996 15:51:02 GMT Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: bill paton Organization: bp ent. Subject: Re: Paradigms, Systems, and TQM In article <9602241003.aa02473@bbs.cruzio.com>, Joe Moore wrote: > Fuller's geometry is all about SYSTEMS--of any kind. And he defines a system > as that which divides the universe into three parts: Inside the system, > outside the system, and the system itself. Then he goes on to determine > through experiment what constitutes a minimum system and a maximum system. > > Since human organizations are systems, the insights derived from Fuller's > geometry can be used to better understand human systems. > > I need to poke around in my Bucky database to come up with two references that > I remember--two organizations that are applying his geometry to human groups, > plus maybe Fuller actually mentioned this in his books--not sure--have to > check. There is a book reviewed in Whole Earth Review #86, Summer 1995 called "Beyond Dispute" whihc sets up an information handling and people interaction format which uses a Geodesic system which allows group dynamics to solve problems and to sift differing viewpoints into a unified vision. Bill ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 28 Feb 1996 15:53:50 GMT Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: bill paton Organization: bp ent. Subject: Notes on The Third Wave by Alvin Toffler Here is the start of my Notes on the Third Wave. This is all about the second wave. There are many interesting parallels to Bucky's works, and I see him as a precurser to the Third Wave man. More to follow as I continue reading and making notes. Bill NOTES ON THE THIRD WAVE BY ALVIN TOFFLER Copyright 1980 1st Wave of Change: Agriculturalism 2nd Wave of Change: Industrialization 3rd Wave of Change: Informationalization Understanding this is the secret to making sense of much of the political and social conflict we see around us. 1st Wave: Extended Family. 2nd Wave: Move to the Nuclear Family, Mass Education, preparing people for rote and repetition, promptness, obedience, Factory. The Precondition of any civilization, old or new, is energy. The Second Wave (Industrialization) has several principles that made its unique design: 1.STANDARDIZATION: Identical products, Govt. Standards 2.SPECIALIZATION: of Jobs. 3.SYNCHRONIZATION: Punctuality, Work by clock rather than daytime or seasons time. 4.CONCENTRATION: Urban centres, People work in factories, Giant Corporations. 5.MAXIMIZATION: Big means efficient, Growth important even if shortsighted. 6.CENTRALIZATION: Centralizing of Power, Central Banking, Centralized Government These 6 principles reinforced each other and led to rise of bureaucracy; so who runs things? The integrators who integrate all levels of govt, society. By relieving families of need to raise children (Education) or take care of old (pensions, etc) they orchestrated the complexities of second wave civilizations. Governments as managers rather than as creative social and political leades. -Engineers have two types of machines: "Batch-processing", function intermittents, and "Continuous-Flow" - function all the time. Voting is Batch proceesing, Lobbying and Pressure groups are continuous flow, so they control the power. 2nd Wave Political structures are increasingly unable to cope with today's complexities. Another 2nd Wave Institution: The Nation State. -Economic Integration impossible without political integration. 2nd Wave technology could only be amortized if they produced good for larger than local markets. -2nd Wave multiplied the number of people with a stake in the larger world, so bit by bit, psychological horizons expanded. Localism faded, National Consciousness stirred. Starting with the American (1776) and French (1789) Revolutions and continuing through the 19th Century, Nationalism swept across the industrialized world. Germany's 350 mini-states became das Vaterland. What we call the Modern Nation is a 2nd Wave Phenomenon (a) a single integrated political authority superimposed on or fused with (b) a single integrated economy. Expansionism took place through the "Space Race" of the 19th Century: Building Railroads. The drive towards integration did not end at nation-state borders. Industrial Civilization had to feed from without and could not survive unless it is integrated into the world's money system and controlled that system for its own benefit. Colonizers of the First World viewed them as backwards and underdeveloped. They needed their cheap resources. They got what they wanted through bribes or threats and then the "Law of First Price" in which the initial low prices had to be given to everyone. First wave peoples were no longer self-sufficient since they had to work around one industry. They became dependent on the marketplace they could not control. In 1944 the World (Primarily the United States) set up the Internation Monetary Fund (IMF) and the World Bank. Countries money was pegged to the US Dollar or Gold Standard. The World Bank was established primarily to provide post-war reconstruction funds to Europe. Soon, the General Agreement of Tariffs and Trade (GATT) was established to liberalized trade but made it more difficult for poorer, less technologically advanced countries to protect their tiny industries. Then the World Bank was prohibited to make loans to countries not in the IMF or obeying the GATT. From 1944 until the early 1970s, the US basically dominated this system. The USSR did the same with its satellites and the 1st wave nations. Rampant Industrialization was more than a political, economic, or social system; it was also a way of life and way of thinking. It produced a 2nd Wave mentality. This 2nd Wave mentality is a key obstacle in creating a workable 3rd Wave civilization. INDUST-REALITY. ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 28 Feb 1996 15:55:42 GMT Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: bill paton Organization: bp ent. Subject: Notes on AldenHatch's book "BF:At home in the Universe Here are my notes on the book:"Buckminster Fuller: At home in the Universe" by Alden Hatch Notes on Buckminster Fuller: At home in the Universe by Alden Hatch -The reasons for his hold upon the young are quite simple. They believe in him because he believes in them, believes that their uncluttered, tradition-spurning minds will lead humankind out of the wilderness of fallacious reasoning and outworn concepts into a glorious era of new enlightenment when, by intelligent use of never-diminished energy and by ephemeralization- doing ever more with less - all men will enjoy a standard of living as high or higher than the most fortunate 5 percent of now-living people...he alone gives them hope and a reason for being and striving. -He believes that the great discoveries of general principles by which the mind of mankind has suddenly leaped forward are not entirely due to the laborious piling up of data upon data until a general principle becomes clear, but are sudden flashes of intuition that come as some exceptionally gifted mind meshes briefly with a Greater Intelligence to obtain a revelation of Truth, later to be proved by conventional pragmatic experimentation. -"Mind relates to the generalized principles, and mind alone can discover them. The mind makes contact with the eternal in these moments of discovery" -RBF -he does not think of himself as an inventor, but rather a discoverer of general principles. For all of his remarkable contributions to technology are simply fallout from these principles. He is a philosopher, some of whose revelations happen to have a practical application. -"Athletics; which greatly heightened what I call the intuitive dynamic sense, a fundamental I am convinced, of competent anticipatory design formation"-RBF -"I don't care if I am not understood as long as I am not misunderstood". -RBF -If I am to believe in myself and the validity of my own ideas, I must stop thinking as other people told me to and rely on my own experience." -He proposed to reform the environment, not man. -Progress meant mobility. "Trees have roots; men have legs." so they should not be rooted in one place. -Conceived or gestating in his mind during the great silence were such revolutionary ideas as his energetic-synergetic geometry; his theory of the origin of homo sapiens in the western Pacific, thereafter spreading around the globe by the sea routes following favourable winds and currents, which proved that there were no different races of men, but only one human race; his principle of the tetrahedron as the basic unit of Universe; the dictum that "nature never fails; it always complies with its own laws. Nature is infallible"; apparent failure is due to man's knowledge being inadequate; life as a pattern in integrity; man as an essential function in Universe and the probability of the ultimate success of man as such; the concept of real wealth as the application of intellect to energy, which can never diminish but must always and forever increase; and the necessity for design science planning on a cosmic scale - that is not through specialization, because nature is never compartmented, but is one indivisible, exquisitely coordinated system. -RBF considered fear responsible for most of the evils of the world. -Best way to study the thoughts of whatever scientist he was reading was to explain this to Allegra, his daughter. ...the terribly important part intuition plays in design. Everything in me, my subconscious experience, said that if you got a revelation of that sort you just grabbed it. The intuitive dynamic sense has to do with things like pole vaulting or the way a man throws a baseball. When you design something you coordinate instinctively as an athlete does. You get a personal feeling as to how, if it's a boat, it will behave in the water. " -Never show people both work. Don't ever demonstrate a principle in inadequate materials. If you get up an old beer can that has your principle embodied in it but is hammered out of tin, people will call it a jalopy.-Starling Burgess -If you don't do it right, you have no right to do it at all- Starling Burgess" -"Every time a man uses his know-how, his experience increases and his intellectual advantage automatically increases. Energy cannot decrease. Know-how can only increase. Wealth which combines energy and intellect can only increase with use...the faster the more!"-RBF -"I found that my drinking was interfering with the design revolution; because when you are drinking, even if it doesn't distort the sense of what you are saying, people think it does. They think you are just babbling. I realized that you cannot drink and be taken seriously as a prophet of the future. So I stopped." -RBF -the mind is one thing on earth which, once enlarged, never again quite retracts. -"What really count is what we have done for humanity. That is the payoff and it is incalculable."-RBF -In 1946, Bucky had chartered the Fuller Research Institute dedicated to implement: "Commonwealth pertinent, individually conceived, intuitively urged and spontaneously joined search, research and enterprise in the borderline realm of 'just not impossible', where transcendentally in altocumulous thought- cloud, orderly trending concepts accrue, differentiate and integrate...." -Development is programmable; discovery is not. -RBF -"Development is programmable; discovery is not. It is not something a computer or the human brain can make through calculation or ratiocination, for "knowledge is of the brain and wisdom is of the mind; discovery comes to the weightless, metaphysical mind as a flash of transcendental light. It is synergy, a sudden comprehension of the behavior of a whole system, totally unpredictable by the behavior of any of its components or subsystems, and therefore cannot be sought by empirical methods - since the brain cannot know what it is looking for - but only apprehended it as a revelation by -'exquisitively prescient minds'. "-RBF -"Nature employs discontinuous compression and continuous tension; for this reason compression is plural, tension singular." -Anything that is exquisitely well designed of any period harmonizes with things that are equally well designed no matter when they were crafted.-RBF -His recurrent theme [is] that the mistake of modern education is the production of specialists when what the world needs is men who see things whole. -It is the customs and traditions that seem so fine and valuable that may bring about bloody revolutions because nobody wants to change them. Yet they stand in the way of progress. Bucky has Fourteen Concepts. They are: Concept One: Universe Bucky always starts with Universe. This is his definition of it: "Universe is the aggregate of all humanity's all time consciously apprehended and communicated experiences." Concept Two: Humanity The human is not an accidental onlooker "who happened in on the 'Play of Life,' but an essential syntropic function of Universe." Concept Three: Children "Focus on new life. Since children are the hope of the future and 98% of the environment's positive or negative effects upon new life are wrought by age thirteen, it is obvious that effective work in advantaging life through environment can mainly be realized within the first thirteen years." Concept Four: Teleology Teleology by Bucky's definition means "the intuitive conversion by brain and mind of special case, subjective experiences into generalized principles...which permit the individual to reform the environment...so as to provide ultimately higher advantages for men" and to inspire others to do likewise. Concept Five: Reform the Environment, Not Man. Bucky's philosophy and strategy confine design initiative to reforming only the environment and never to emulate the almost universal attempts of humans to reform and restrain other humans by political actions, laws, and codes. Concept Six: General Systems Theory Using the generalized principles he has discovered, Bucky says "I always start all problem-solving with Universe, and thereafter subdivide progressively to identify a special local problem within the total of problems." He thus attacks it comprehensively and anticipatorily. Concept Seven: Industrialization. "Industrialization consists of tools". It involves "all experiences of all men everywhere in history." Bucky sees it as inherently comprehensive and omni-interrelated in respect to all humanity. And he believes that, though subsystems of it are run shortsightedly by selfishly motivated people, the whole works inadvertently towards ultimately providing all men with higher standards of living....Because energy plus know-how is wealth, "the integrating world industrial networks mean ultimate access of all humanity to the total operative commonwealth of Earth." Concept Eight: Design Science Design Science is concerned "with the scheduling of the complex interaction of the general systems events of industrialization." The rapid advance of technology in one field- air transportation, for example - must be "comprehensively integrated with all other vastly accelerating environment relationship transformations." Concept Nine: The Service Industry "Humanity is gradually trending towards becoming Worldians." Therefore, the static appurtenances of life - houses, automobiles, even typewriters - will all be rented like telephones because of man's increasing mobility. Amplifying this thought in another article, Bucky foresees man's ability to deploy at will all over the earth and the solar system by means of autonomous structures made livable by our astronauts life-support 'black box'. And he adds, "Quite clearly, man, free to enjoy all of his planets...will also be swiftly outward bound to occupy even greater ranges of the universe." Concept Ten: Ephemeralization "The acceleration of doing more with less...will complete the task of providing enough for all humanity within another thirty-four years...despite political systems that deliberately divide society and set one group against another." Bucky believes that without the interference of political systems it could be done in twenty years. Concept Eleven: Prime Design Initiative Bucky believes that it is essential for the individual, invention-developing pioneer to maintain his economic initiative and not get tied up with the massive capital-cum-bureaucracy of large corporations, despite the leverage of their wealth. Concept Twelve: Self-Discipline Instead of the obligation to make a living, Bucky substitutes the higher obligation of the individual's syntropic responsibility in Universe. Concept Thirteen: Comprehensive Coordination Comprehensivity instead of specialization is Bucky's key to successful design competence. His foremost self-discipline is never to try to sell one of his ideas to others. He will just design and test it, and wait for others, who need it, to come to him. He only goes where he is asked to speak because, if you force your ideas on people they listen unwillingly, but if they ask you to speak to them - especially if they pay a high fee -"they are very receptive." Bucky incessantly engages in trying to make all his previous inventions obsolete by designing better ones. Concept Fourteen: World Community and its Subcommunities Bucky believes that Chapter Three of World History is just beginning, in which world man will realize his potential for success as a function of Universe through his accelerating mastery of "vast inanimate, inexhaustible energy sources combined with doing more with less." Bucky believe in his Global Energy Network as a stop-gap method until better forms of power could come out. He believed Wind power was the hope for the future, as well as Hydrogen fuel cells. -"We are moving from the Industrial Age into the Age of Cybernetics. This is the most difficult transition in history because it has to be accomplished consciously, whereas the other transformations through which mankind has passed have been accomplished inadvertently."-RBF -Sees future education coming by television and with electronic call-up which can access documentary information about the great thinkers on various topics. The documentaries will be there and accessed in ways that now students use encyclopedias. -RBF lives on the cresting wave of knowledge. -He believes in love as the most important principle of Universe, more important even than intuition. -"I really love human beings, but I do need time to do some thinking, and do some forward work. I live on the frontier of science and design; and you've got to put in, in order to put out." ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 28 Feb 1996 15:58:39 GMT Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: bill paton Organization: bp ent. Subject: Fuller Research Institute Manifesto? In 1946, Bucky had chartered the Fuller Research Institute dedicated to implement: "Commonwealth pertinent, individually conceived, intuitively urged and spontaneously joined search, research and enterprise in the borderline realm of 'just not impossible', where transcendentally in altocumulous thought- cloud, orderly trending concepts accrue, differentiate and integrate...." I am interested in finding more about this specific manifesto, along with any of Bucky's others. I am primarily interested in adapting a manifesto for change which would allow fellow Dymaxions to be involved in a Design Science revolution. Any specific ideas can be directed to bpaton@inforamp.net ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 28 Feb 1996 16:09:24 GMT Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: bill paton Organization: bp ent. Subject: Magna Carta for the Knowledge Age Magna Carta for the Knowledge Age Send e-mail to remarks@crimson.com Release 1.2 August 22, 1994 This statement represents the cumulative wisdom and innovation of many dozens of people. It is based primarily on the thoughts of four "co-authors": Ms. Esther Dyson; Mr. George Gilder; Dr. George Keyworth; and Dr. Alvin Toffler. This release 1.2 has the final "imprimatur" of no one. In the spirit of the age: It is copyrighted solely for the purpose of preventing someone else from doing so. If you have it, you can use it any way you want. However, major passages are from works copyrighted individually by the authors, used here by permission. PREAMBLE The central event of the 20th century is the overthrow of matter. In technology, economics, and the politics of nations, wealth -- in the form of physical resources -- has been losing value and significance. The powers of mind are everywhere ascendant over the brute force of things. In a First Wave economy, land and farm labor are the main "factors of production." In a Second Wave economy, the land remains valuable while the "labor" becomes massified around machines and larger industries. In a Third Wave economy, the central resource -- a single word broadly encompassing data, information, images, symbols, culture, ideology, and values -- is _actionable_ knowledge. The industrial age is not fully over. In fact, classic Second Wave sectors (oil, steel, auto-production) have learned how to benefit from Third Wave technological breakthroughs -- just as the First Wave's agricultural productivity benefited exponentially from the Second Wave's farm-mechanization. But the Third Wave, and the _Knowledge Age_ it has opened, will not deliver on its potential unless it adds social and political dominance to its accelerating technological and economic strength. This means repealing Second Wave laws and retiring Second Wave attitudes. It also gives to leaders of the advanced democracies a special responsibility -- to facilitate, hasten, and explain the transition. As humankind explores this new "electronic frontier" of knowledge, it must confront again the most profound questions of how to organize itself for the common good. The meaning of freedom, structures of self-government, definition of property, nature of competition, conditions for cooperation, sense of community and nature of progress will each be redefined for the Knowledge Age -- just as they were redefined for a new age of industry some 250 years ago. What our 20th-century countrymen came to think of as the "American dream," and what resonant thinkers referred to as "the promise of American life" or "the American Idea," emerged from the turmoil of 19th-century industrialization. Now it's our turn: The knowledge revolution, and the Third Wave of historical change it powers, summon us to renew the dream and enhance the promise. THE NATURE OF CYBERSPACE The Internet -- the huge (2.2 million computers), global (135 countries), rapidly growing (10-15% a month) network that has captured the American imagination -- is only a tiny part of cyberspace. So just what is cyberspace? More ecosystem than machine, cyberspace is a bioelectronic environment that is literally universal: It exists everywhere there are telephone wires, coaxial cables, fiber-optic lines or electromagnetic waves. This environment is "inhabited" by knowledge, including incorrect ideas, existing in electronic form. It is connected to the physical environment by portals which allow people to see what's inside, to put knowledge in, to alter it, and to take knowledge out. Some of these portals are one-way (e.g. television receivers and television transmitters); others are two-way (e.g. telephones, computer modems). Most of the knowledge in cyberspace lives the most temporary (or so we think) existence: Your voice, on a telephone wire or microwave, travels through space at the speed of light, reaches the ear of your listener, and is gone forever. But people are increasingly building cyberspatial "warehouses" of data, knowledge, information and _mis_information in digital form, the ones and zeros of binary computer code. The storehouses themselves display a physical form (discs, tapes, CD-ROMs) -- but what they contain is accessible only to those with the right kind of portal and the right kind of key. The key is software, a special form of electronic knowledge that allows people to navigate through the cyberspace environment and make its contents understandable to the human senses in the form of written language, pictures and sound. People are adding to cyberspace -- creating it, defining it, expanding it -- at a rate that is already explosive and getting faster. Faster computers, cheaper means of electronic storage, improved software and more capable communications channels (satellites, fiber-optic lines) -- each of these factors independently add to cyberspace. But the real explosion comes from the combination of all of them, working together in ways we still do not understand. The bioelectronic _frontier_ is an appropriate metaphor for what is happening in cyberspace, calling to mind as it does the spirit of invention and discovery that led ancient mariners to explore the world, generations of pioneers to tame the American continent and, more recently, to man's first exploration of outer space. But the exploration of cyberspace brings both greater opportunity, and in some ways more difficult challenges, than any previous human adventure. Cyberspace is the land of knowledge, and the exploration of that land can be a civilization's truest, highest calling. The opportunity is now before us to empower every person to pursue that calling in his or her own way. The challenge is as daunting as the opportunity is great. The Third Wave has profound implications for the nature and meaning of property, of the marketplace, of community and of individual freedom. As it emerges, it shapes new codes of behavior that move each organism and institution -- family, neighborhood, church group, company, government, nation -- inexorably beyond standardization and centralization, as well as beyond the materialist's obsession with energy, money and control. Turning the economics of mass-production inside out, new information technologies are driving the financial costs of diversity -- both product and personal -- down toward zero, "demassifying" our institutions and our culture. Accelerating demassification creates the potential for vastly increased human freedom. It also spells the death of the central institutional paradigm of modern life, the bureaucratic organization. (Governments, including the American government, are the last great redoubt of bureaucratic power on the face of the planet, and for them the coming change will be profound and probably traumatic.) In this context, the one metaphor that is perhaps least helpful in thinking about cyberspace is -- unhappily -- the one that has gained the most currency: The Information Superhighway. Can you imagine a phrase less descriptive of the nature of cyberspace, or more misleading in thinking about its implications? Consider the following set of polarities: _Information Superhighway_ / _Cyberspace_ Limited Matter / Unlimited Knowledge Centralized / Decentralized Moving on a grid / Moving in space Government ownership / A vast array of ownerships Bureaucracy / Empowerment Efficient but not hospitable / Hospitable if you customize it Withstand the elements / Flow, float and fine-tune Unions and contractors / Associations and volunteers Liberation from First Wave / Liberation from Second Wave Culmination of Second Wave / Riding the Third Wave The highway analogy is all wrong," explained Peter Huber in Forbes this spring, "for reasons rooted in basic economics. Solid things obey immutable laws of conservation -- what goes south on the highway must go back north, or you end up with a mountain of cars in Miami. By the same token, production and consumption must balance. The average Joe can consume only as much wheat as the average Jane can grow. Information is completely different. It can be replicated at almost no cost -- so every individual can (in theory) consume society's entire output. Rich and poor alike, we all run information deficits. We all take in more than we put out." THE NATURE AND OWNERSHIP OF PROPERTY Clear and enforceable property rights are essential for markets to work. Defining them is a central function of government. Most of us have "known" that for a long time. But to create the new cyberspace environment is to create _new _ property -- that is, new means of creating goods (including ideas) that serve people. The property that makes up cyberspace comes in several forms: Wires, coaxial cable, computers and other "hardware"; the electromagnetic spectrum; and "intellectual property" -- the knowledge that dwells in and defines cyberspace. In each of these areas, two questions that must be answered. First, what does "ownership" _mean_? What is the nature of the property itself, and what does it mean to own it? Second, once we understand what ownership means, _who_ is the owner? At the level of first principles, should ownership be public (i.e. government) or private (i.e. individuals)? The answers to these two questions will set the basic terms upon which America and the world will enter the Third Wave. For the most part, however, these questions are not yet even being asked. Instead, at least in America, governments are attempting to take Second Wave concepts of property and ownership and apply them to the Third Wave. Or they are ignoring the problem altogether. For example, a great deal of attention has been focused recently on the nature of "intellectual property" -- i.e. the fact that knowledge is what economists call a "public good," and thus requires special treatment in the form of copyright and patent protection. Major changes in U.S. copyright and patent law during the past two decades have broadened these protections to incorporate "electronic property." In essence, these reforms have attempted to take a body of law that originated in the 15th century, with Gutenberg's invention of the printing press, and apply it to the electronically stored and transmitted knowledge of the Third Wave. A more sophisticated approach starts with recognizing how the Third Wave has fundamentally altered the nature of knowledge as a "good," and that the operative effect is not technology per se (the shift from printed books to electronic storage and retrieval systems), but rather the shift from a mass-production, mass-media, mass-culture civilization to a demassified civilization. The big change, in other words, is the demassification of actionable knowledge. The dominant form of new knowledge in the Third Wave is perishable, transient, _ customized_ knowledge: The right information, combined with the right software and presentation, at precisely the right time. Unlike the mass knowledge of the Second Wave -- "public good" knowledge that was useful to everyone because most people's information needs were standardized -- Third Wave customized knowledge is by nature a private good. If this analysis is correct, copyright and patent protection of knowledge (or at least many forms of it) may no longer be unnecessary. In fact, the marketplace may already be creating vehicles to compensate creators of customized knowledge outside the cumbersome copyright/patent process, as suggested last year by John Perry Barlow: "One existing model for the future conveyance of intellectual property is real-time performance, a medium currently used only in theater, music, lectures, stand-up comedy and pedagogy. I believe the concept of performance will expand to include most of the information economy, from multi-casted soap operas to stock analysis. In these instances, commercial exchange will be more like ticket sales to a continuous show than the purchase of discrete bundles of that which is being shown. The other model, of course, is service. The entire professional class -- doctors, lawyers, consultants, architects, etc. -- are already being paid directly for their intellectual property. Who needs copyright when you're on a retainer?" Copyright, patent and intellectual property represent only a few of the "rights" issues now at hand. Here are some of the others: * Ownership of the electromagnetic spectrum, traditionally considered to be "public property," is now being "auctioned" by the Federal Communications Commission to private companies. Or is it? Is the very limited "bundle of rights" sold in those auctions really property, or more in the nature of a use permit -- the right to use a part of the spectrum for a limited time, for limited purposes? In either case, are the rights being auctioned defined in a way that makes technological sense? * Ownership over the infrastructure of wires, coaxial cable and fiber-optic lines that are such prominent features in the geography of cyberspace is today much less clear than might be imagined. Regulation, especially price regulation, of this property can be tantamount to confiscation, as America's cable operators recently learned when the Federal government imposed price limits on them and effectively confiscated an estimated $___ billion of their net worth. (Whatever one's stance on the FCC's decision and the law behind it, there is no disagreeing with the proposition that one's ownership of a good is less meaningful when the government can step in, at will, and dramatically reduce its value.) * The nature of capital in the Third Wave -- tangible capital as well as intangible -- is to depreciate in real value much faster than industrial-age capital -- driven, if nothing else, by Moore's Law, which states that the processing power of the microchip doubles at least every 18 _months_. Yet accounting and tax regulations still require property to be depreciated over periods as long as 30 _years_. The result is a heavy bias in favor of "heavy industry" and against nimble, fast-moving baby businesses. Who will define the nature of cyberspace property rights, and how? How can we strike a balance between interoperable open systems and protection of property? THE NATURE OF THE MARKETPLACE Inexpensive knowledge destroys economies-of-scale. Customized knowledge permits "just in time" production for an ever rising number of goods. Technological progress creates new means of serving old markets, turning one-time monopolies into competitive battlegrounds. These phenomena are altering the nature of the marketplace, not just for information technology but for all goods and materials, shipping and services. In cyberspace itself, market after market is being transformed by technological progress from a "natural monopoly" to one in which competition is the rule. Three recent examples: * The market for "mail" has been made competitive by the development of fax machines and overnight delivery -- even though the "private express statutes" that technically grant the U.S. Postal Service a monopoly over mail delivery remain in place. * During the past 20 years, the market for television has been transformed from one in which there were at most a few broadcast TV stations to one in which consumers can choose among broadcast, cable and satellite services. * The market for local telephone services, until recently a monopoly based on twisted-pair copper cables, is rapidly being made competitive by the advent of wireless service and the entry of cable television into voice communication. In England, Mexico, New Zealand and a host of developing countries, government restrictions preventing such competition have already been removed and consumers actually have the freedom to choose. The advent of new technology and new products creates the potential for _ dynamic competition_ -- competition between and among technologies and industries, each seeking to find the best way of serving customers' needs. Dynamic competition is different from static competition, in which many providers compete to sell essentially similar products at the lowest price. Static competition is good, because it forces costs and prices to the lowest levels possible for a given product. Dynamic competition is better, because it allows competing technologies and new products to challenge the old ones and, if they really are better, to replace them. Static competition might lead to faster and stronger horses. Dynamic competition gives us the automobile. Such dynamic competition -- the essence of what Austrian economist Joseph Schumpeter called "creative destruction" -- creates winners and losers on a massive scale. New technologies can render instantly obsolete billions of dollars of embedded infrastructure, accumulated over decades. The transformation of the U.S. computer industry since 1980 is a case in point. In 1980, everyone knew who led in computer technology. Apart from the minicomputer boom, mainframe computers _were_ the market, and America's dominance was largely based upon the position of a dominant vendor -- IBM, with over 50% world market-share. Then the personal-computing industry exploded, leaving older-style big-business-focused computing with a stagnant, piece of a burgeoning total market. As IBM lost market-share, many people became convinced that America had lost the ability to compete. By the mid-1980s, such alarmism had reached from Washington all the way into the heart of Silicon Valley. But the real story was the renaissance of American business and technological leadership. In the transition from mainframes to PCs, a vast new market was created. This market was characterized by dynamic competition consisting of easy access and low barriers to entry. Start-ups by the dozens took on the larger established companies -- and won. After a decade of angst, the surprising outcome is that America is not only competitive internationally, but, by any measurable standard, America dominates the growth sectors in world economics -- telecommunications, microelectronics, computer networking (or "connected computing") and software systems and applications. The reason for America's victory in the computer wars of the 1980s is that dynamic competition was allowed to occur, in an area so breakneck and pell-mell that government would've had a hard time controlling it _even had it been paying attention_. The challenge for policy in the 1990s is to permit, even encourage, dynamic competition in every aspect of the cyberspace marketplace. THE NATURE OF FREEDOM Overseas friends of America sometimes point out that the U.S. Constitution is unique -- because it states explicitly that power resides with the people, who delegate it to the government, rather than the other way around. This idea -- central to our free society -- was the result of more than 150 years of intellectual and political ferment, from the Mayflower Compact to the U.S. Constitution, as explorers struggled to establish the terms under which they would tame a new frontier. And as America continued to explore new frontiers -- from the Northwest Territory to the Oklahoma land-rush -- it consistently returned to this fundamental principle of rights, reaffirming, time after time, that power resides with the people. Cyberspace is the latest American frontier. As this and other societies make ever deeper forays into it, the proposition that ownership of this frontier resides first _with the people_ is central to achieving its true potential. To some people, that statement will seem melodramatic. America, after all, remains a land of individual freedom, and this freedom clearly extends to cyberspace. How else to explain the uniquely American phenomenon of the hacker, who ignored every social pressure and violated every rule to develop a set of skills through an early and intense exposure to low-cost, ubiquitous computing. Those skills eventually made him or her highly marketable, whether in developing applications-software or implementing networks. The hacker became a technician, an inventor and, in case after case, a creator of new wealth in the form of the baby businesses that have given America the lead in cyberspatial exploration and settlement. It is hard to imagine hackers surviving, let alone thriving, in the more formalized and regulated democracies of Europe and Japan. In America, they've become vital for economic growth and trade leadership. Why? Because Americans still celebrate individuality over conformity, reward achievement over consensus and militantly protect the right to be different. But the need to affirm the basic principles of freedom is real. Such an affirmation is needed in part because we are entering new territory, where there are as yet no rules -- just as there were no rules on the American continent in 1620, or in the Northwest Territory in 1787. Centuries later, an affirmation of freedom -- by this document and similar efforts -- is needed for a second reason: We are at the end of a century dominated by the mass institutions of the industrial age. The industrial age encouraged _conformity_ and relied on _standardization_. And the institutions of the day -- corporate and government bureaucracies, huge civilian and military administrations, schools of all types -- reflected these priorities. Individual liberty suffered -- sometimes only a little, sometimes a lot: * In a Second Wave world, it might make sense for government to insist on the right to peer into every computer by requiring that each contain a special "clipper chip." * In a Second Wave world, it might make sense for government to assume ownership over the broadcast spectrum and demand massive payments from citizens for the right to use it. * In a Second Wave world, it might make sense for government to prohibit entrepreneurs from entering new markets and providing new services. * And, in a Second Wave world, dominated by a few old-fashioned, one-way media "networks," it might even make sense for government to influence which political viewpoints would be carried over the airwaves. All of these interventions might have made sense in a Second Wave world, where standardization dominated and where it was assumed that the scarcity of knowledge (plus a scarcity of telecommunications capacity) made bureaucracies and other elites better able to make decisions than the average person. But, whether they made sense before or not, these and literally thousands of other infringements on individual rights now taken for granted make no sense at all in the Third Wave. For a century, those who lean ideologically in favor of freedom have found themselves at war not only with their ideological opponents, but with a time in history when the value of conformity was at its peak. However desirable as an ideal, individual freedom often seemed impractical. The mass institutions of the Second Wave required us to give up freedom in order for the system to "work." The coming of the Third Wave turns that equation inside-out. The complexity of Third Wave society is too great for any centrally planned bureaucracy to manage. Demassification, customization, individuality, freedom -- these are the keys to success for Third Wave civilization. THE ESSENCE OF COMMUNITY If the transition to the Third Wave is so positive, why are we experiencing so much anxiety? Why are the statistics of social decay at or near all-time highs? Why does cyberspatial "rapture" strike millions of prosperous Westerners as lifestyle _rupture_? Why do the principles that have held us together as a nation seem no longer sufficient -- or even wrong? The incoherence of political life is mirrored in disintegrating personalities. Whether 100% covered by health plans or not, psychotherapists and gurus do a land-office business, as people wander aimlessly amid competing therapies. People slip into cults and covens or, alternatively, into a pathological privatism, convinced that reality is absurd, insane or meaningless. "If things are so good," Forbes magazine asked recently, "why do we feel so bad?" In part, this is why: Because we constitute the final generation of an old civilization and, at the very same time, the first generation of a new one. Much of our personal confusion and social disorientation is traceable to conflict _within us_ and within our political institutions -- between the dying Second Wave civilization and the emergent Third Wave civilization thundering in to take its place. Second Wave ideologues routinely lament the breakup of mass society. Rather than seeing this enriched diversity as an opportunity for human development, they attach it as "fragmentation" and "balkanization." But to reconstitute democracy in Third Wave terms, we need to jettison the frightening but false assumption that more diversity automatically brings more tension and conflict in society. Indeed, the exact reverse can be true: If 100 people all desperately want the same brass ring, they may be forced to fight for it. On the other hand, if each of the 100 has a different objective, it is far more rewarding for them to trade, cooperate, and form symbiotic relationships. Given appropriate social arrangements, diversity can make for a secure and stable civilization. No one knows what the Third Wave communities of the future will look like, or where "demassification" will ultimately lead. It is clear, however, that cyberspace will play an important role knitting together in the diverse communities of tomorrow, facilitating the creation of "electronic neighborhoods" bound together not by geography but by shared interests. Socially, putting advanced computing power in the hands of entire populations will alleviate pressure on highways, reduce air pollution, allow people to live further away from crowded or dangerous urban areas, and expand family time. The late Phil Salin (in Release 1.0 11/25/91) offered this perspective: "[B]y 2000, multiple cyberspaces will have emerged, diverse and increasingly rich. Contrary to naive views, these cyberspaces will not all be the same, and they will not all be open to the general public. The global network is a connected 'platform' for a collection of diverse communities, but only a loose, heterogeneous community itself. Just as access to homes, offices, churches and department stores is controlled by their owners or managers, most virtual locations will exist as distinct places of private property." "But unlike the private property of today," Salin continued, "the potential variations on design and prevailing customs will explode, because many variations can be implemented cheaply in software. And the 'externalities' associated with variations can drop; what happens in one cyberspace can be kept from affecting other cyberspaces." "Cyberspaces" is a wonderful _pluralistic_ word to open more minds to the Third Wave's civilizing potential. Rather than being a centrifugal force helping to tear society apart, cyberspace can be one of the main forms of glue holding together an increasingly free and diverse society. THE ROLE OF GOVERNMENT The current Administration has identified the right goal: Reinventing government for the 21st Century. To accomplish that goal is another matter, and for reasons explained in the next and final section, it is not likely to be fully accomplished in the immediate future. This said, it is essential that we understand what it really means to create a Third Wave government and begin the process of transformation. Eventually, the Third Wave will affect virtually everything government does. The most pressing need, however, is to revamp the policies and programs that are slowing the creation of cyberspace. Second Wave programs for Second Wave industries -- the status quo for the status quo -- will do little damage in the short run. It is the government's efforts to apply its Second Wave modus operandi to the fast-moving, decentralized creatures of the Third Wave that is the real threat to progress. Indeed, if there is to be an "industrial policy for the knowledge age," it should focus on removing barriers to competition and massively deregulating the fast-growing telecommunications and computing industries. One further point should be made at the outset: Government should be as strong and as big as it needs to be to accomplish its central functions effectively and efficiently. The reality is that a Third Wave government will be vastly smaller (perhaps by 50 percent or more) than the current one -- this is an inevitable implication of the transition from the centralized power structures of the industrial age to the dispersed, decentralized institutions of the Third. But smaller government does not imply weak government; nor does arguing for smaller government require being "against" government for narrowly ideological reasons. Indeed, the transition from the Second Wave to the Third Wave will require a level of government _activity_ not seen since the New Deal. Here are five proposals to back up the point. 1. The Path to Interactive Multimedia Access The "Jeffersonian Vision" offered by Mitch Kapor and Jerry Berman has propelled the Electronic Frontier Foundation's campaign for an "open platform" telecom architecture: "The amount of electronic material the superhighway can carry is dizzying, compared to the relatively narrow range of broadcast TV and the limited number of cable channels. Properly constructed and regulated, it could be open to all who wish to speak, publish and communicate. None of the interactive services will be possible, however, if we have an eight-lane data superhighway rushing into every home and only a narrow footpath coming back out. Instead of settling for a multimedia version of the same entertainment that is increasingly dissatisfying on today's TV, we need a superhighway that encourages the production and distribution of a broader, more diverse range of programming" (New York Times 11/24/93 p. A25). The question is: What role should government play in bringing this vision to reality? But also: Will incentives for the openly-accessible, "many to many," national multimedia network envisioned by EFF harm the rights of those now constructing thousands of non-open local area networks? These days, interactive multimedia is the daily servant only of avant-garde firms and other elites. But the same thing could have been said about word-processors 12 years ago, or phone-line networks six years ago. Today we have, in effect, universal access to personal computing -- which no political coalition ever subsidized or "planned." And America's _networking_ menu is in a hyper-growth phase. Whereas the accessing software cost $50 two years ago, today the same companies hand it out free -- to get more people on-line. This egalitarian explosion has occurred in large measure because government has stayed out of these markets, letting personal computing take over while mainframes rot (almost literally) in warehouses, and allowing (no doubt more by omission than commission) computer networks to grow, free of the kinds of regulatory restraints that affect phones, broadcast and cable. All of which leaves reducing barriers to entry and innovation as the only effective near-term path to Universal Access. In fact, it can be argued that a near-term national interactive multimedia network is impossible unless regulators permit much greater collaboration between the cable industry and phone companies. The latter's huge fiber resources (nine times as extensive as industry fiber and rising rapidly) could be joined with the huge asset of 57 million broadband links (i.e. into homes now receiving cable-TV service) to produce a new kind of national network -- multimedia, interactive and (as costs fall) increasingly accessible to Americans of modest means. That is why obstructing such collaboration -- in the cause of forcing a competition between the cable and phone industries -- is socially elitist. To the extent it prevents collaboration between the cable industry and the phone companies, present federal policy actually thwarts the Administ ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 28 Feb 1996 16:11:32 GMT Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: bill paton Organization: bp ent. Subject: Dymaxion Map Flag I would be interested in getting a Flag (Various sizes) with the Dymaxion map. It seems to me to be the perfect map promoting a new world, since it is apolitical (unlike the United Nations Flag) and it shows the entire world. Anyone else interested in this before I submit the idea to the Buckminster Fuller Institute? ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 28 Feb 1996 12:18:07 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: eric steven sommer Dear People, Can you tell me how to join your list. Sincerely, Eric Sommer CEO, Advanced Data Management and member of the Stewards Planetary House ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 28 Feb 1996 18:56:02 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: Re: Dymaxion Map Flag In-Reply-To: ; from "bill paton" at Feb 28, 96 4:11 pm Excellent idea. Excellent posts! -- JOE S. MOORE joemoore@bbs.cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A ALTERNATE TEL AND/OR FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 USA I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 28 Feb 1996 19:07:02 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: Re: your mail Comments: cc: esommer@DIRECT.CA In-Reply-To: <96Feb28.120345-0800pdt.206577-314+837@orb.direct.ca>; from "eric steven sommer" at Feb 28, 96 12:18 pm eric steven sommer writes: > > Dear People, > Can you tell me how to join your list. > > Sincerely, > Eric Sommer > CEO, Advanced Data Management > and member of the Stewards Planetary House > .- > To: listserv@ubvm.cc.buffalo.edu Subject: (blank) subscribe GEODESIC yourfirstname yourlastname -- JOE S. MOORE joemoore@bbs.cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A ALTERNATE TEL AND/OR FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 USA I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 29 Feb 1996 12:18:10 CET Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: tagdi@RUULCH.LET.RUU.NL Subject: self portrata. there will be time after time of nonsense me stock in the tissues of muddy time, and time again me under the micrscope of divine nature. just musing on the nature of vivaldi i like the chalange of competition to know more than other humans. at le ast to now. since ego ism may be evil event and nature is evil, note i am using light version of the meaning of evil, i shall do evil because of the evil doen to me: nature is primarly evil till the day when there will be no evil, note that evil is light word. i have seen many people who say the revers becuase they can offerd to say so because the are egot list. tagdi ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 29 Feb 1996 12:43:31 CET Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: tagdi@RUULCH.LET.RUU.NL Subject: Re: Dymaxion Map Flag In Message Wed, 28 Feb 1996 16:11:32 +0000 (GMT), bill paton writes: >I would be interested in getting a Flag (Various sizes) with the Dymaxion >map. It seems to me to be the perfect map promoting a new world, since it >is apolitical (unlike the United Nations Flag) and it shows the entire >world. Anyone else interested in this before I submit the idea to the >Buckminster Fuller Institute? i think flags have dirty smell about them, but may be not in this case. two days ago i was thinking of map lamp. tagdi ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 29 Feb 1996 13:24:48 CET Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: tagdi@RUULCH.LET.RUU.NL Subject: science and physics science is the atempt to reach precise statments out phenomenas, to test the validity of an event we rely on repetion, does it repete. end of 19: wether in america use to be send by telegraph till radio came along, a farmer learned about it from signal-flags on passing train or from hanging one on public building. less than 1% of population could geta degree. 1873 -1890 only 22 american physcist took phd at home. only 17 institutions of higher education had more than 2 faculty only 4 had endoment of more than 1million $ incom of of a physcist professor was 1400 dollars a year. it cost Michelson 200 $ (from his father in law) to perform his first significant his experiment , measurment of speed of light to unprecedented accuracy.( end of 19 c) lurking on the past , not to remember. Tagdi ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 29 Feb 1996 08:06:02 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: syn-l: Request for help (fwd) ThomasM451@aol.com writes: > From desiree.teleport.com!teleport.com!owner-synergetics-l Wed Feb 28 20:40:54 1996 > From: ThomasM451@aol.com > Date: Wed, 28 Feb 1996 23:39:43 -0500 > Message-ID: <960228233941_336378421@mail06.mail.aol.com> > To: synergetics-l@teleport.com > Subject: syn-l: Request for help > Sender: owner-synergetics-l@teleport.com > Reply-To: synergetics-l@teleport.com > Precedence: bulk > > I have a very elementary problem. I am constructing a model. I want it to > look like a globe. Around the equator of the globe, I want to signify a > taxonomy of systems, such that at one point on the circle, we have say > physical systems. Moving around the cirle, the systems would get more > complex. Eventually the systems would evolve taxonomically the most complex > on the other side of the globe. I then envision a movement toward man-made > systems which also evolve to the most complex eventually ending at the > starting point where man-made systems are equal to the simplest natural > systems. This would then be a systemic taxonomy. > > Perpendicular to the equator, we identify systemics methodologies, such that > horizontal is systems, vertical is methodologies. While any single system and > methodology would appear as two perpendicular circles, all the systems and > methodologies together, would appear as a globe. Obviously, the > methodologies are somewhat independant of the systems per se, that is, any > vertical circle could be placed at any horizontal point. > > What I need to know is the correct terminology for this model, I would prefer > common ordinary terms as opposed to esoteric. > > Thank you in advance, > Tom Mandel, editor > General Systems Inquiry Primer Project > .- > -- JOE S. MOORE joemoore@bbs.cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A ALTERNATE TEL AND/OR FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 USA I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 29 Feb 1996 10:25:38 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: FULLER RESEARCH FOUNDATION FULLER RESEARCH FOUNDATION Compiled by Joe S. Moore 2-28-96 Chartered: 1946; Disbanded in 1954. Two Divisions: Canadian and USA. See: _No More Secondhand God_ by R.B.F., pages 65-73 (chapter 5). _Buckminster Fuller: At Home in the Universe_ by A. Hatch, page 197. _Dymaxion World of Buckminster Fuller_ by R. Marks, page 186 (figs 326-8). _Buckminster Fuller's Universe_ by L. Sieden, page 317. _Synergetics 1_ by R.B.F., page 819 (in Afterpiece). -- JOE S. MOORE joemoore@bbs.cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A ALTERNATE TEL AND/OR FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 USA I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 29 Feb 1996 23:28:19 CET Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: tagdi@RUULCH.LET.RUU.NL Subject: AledenH book Me... >i am starting from the begining; it sound exciting just to see the potential >to verifying your own experiencing by yourself eventhough it is a very >slow thinking processing. >and i am going to make a very simple models, this is doing, to see >actually what happen when you do. one is to make a ruler to draw 4 >triangls at once, the other small geodesic dome, using plastic covering. >i am very undoing person, i like changing that. >few books: >TheU.S defense mobilization >Industrial mobilization >Education of a Navy >these are titles i have not yet red, but looking forward to read >i have no idea what is the content, but because of the subject >i think they will have some relevance. >Tagdi ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 29 Feb 1996 13:35:25 PST Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe Moore Subject: THOUGHT (IDEA) MODELS Comments: cc: Synergetics List GEOMETRIC MODELS OF THOUGHTS (IDEAS) Compiled by Joe S. Moore 2-29 96 "Any conceptual thought is a system and is structured tetrahedrally." RBF, _Synergetics 1_, sec 501.101. "Tetrahedron becomes the minimum thinkable set, the minimum reconsiderable set, and it turns out to be the fundamental increment out of which all thoughts are constructed." RBF, _Synergetics 1_, sec 510.02. See also: _No More Secondhand God_, by RBF, chapter 7 "Introduction to Omnidirectional Halo" and chapter 8 "Omnidirectional Halo". -- JOE S. MOORE joemoore@bbs.cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A ALTERNATE TEL AND/OR FAX: 408-479-0733 CAPITOLA, CA 95010 USA I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 29 Feb 1996 23:43:47 CET Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: tagdi@RUULCH.LET.RUU.NL Subject: Lydic Domes >>Subject: RE: LYDICK DOMES >> >>> [IMAGE] >>> We have a complete line of promotional materials available for you to >>> choose from. Our free color pamphlet titled "Imagine", a 4 page color >>> brocheur titled "Building Homes For Families"-cost $1.00, a full color >>> catalog-cost $12.00, our " Guide To Construction Management" (all that >>> you would ever need to know about designing and building your own >>> dome) - cost $42.00, and 8 1/2"x11" individual floor plan sheets - >>> cost $.25 each. >>> >> >> just an advise about the english language, not to be taken seriously. >> one man asked a business friend, why his business is very successful, >> he replied: because i tell them that i am selling crab. >> he uses plane english, a book published by Oxford University >> Tagdi ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 29 Feb 1996 13:08:13 GMT Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: "James E. Hoburg" Organization: AT&T Bell Laboratories, Columbus, Ohio Subject: Re: Paradigms, Systems, and TQM In-Reply-To: bpaton@inforamp.net.'s message of 28 Feb 1996 15:51:02 GMT In article bpaton@inforamp.net. (bill paton) writes: > There is a book reviewed in Whole Earth Review #86, Summer 1995 called > "Beyond Dispute" whihc sets up an information handling and people > interaction format which uses a Geodesic system which allows group > dynamics to solve problems and to sift differing viewpoints into a unified > vision. _Beyond Dispute_ by Stafford Beer. Wiley, 1994. (Sorry, no ISBN to hand.) Beer is a pioneering management cyberneticist and systems thinker who is certainly interesting in his own right--and he is definitely familiar with RBF and Synergetics. I snagged this overview of a recent course taught by him in the UK: We begin by considering how the success of 'the scientific method' has meant the reduction of complex wholes into smaller and smaller parts. This reductionism succeeds because it provides an ever- increasing understanding of how everything works. The price we pay in any given case is not to know how everything works. The problem is that reductionism has become for us a habit of mind, especially in the social sciences: which include economics and politics and management... People have become aware of this, and there is much talk of 'the holistic approach' - particularly in the fields of environmental study and of medicine, where practically no-one is aware of it. We continue to look at management as a bundle of esoteric teachings that are barely related, never mind special ways of describing the same thing: the firm, the family, the government. Is it possible to approach this issue without getting lost in a labyrinth of mathematical delights, overwhelmed by complexity, or plunging into the 'virtual reality' of cyberspace right inside the computer? Yes, it is. But more difficult than mathematics, more complicated than complexity, more real than the science fiction that is never more than one step ahead of the game, comes thinking differently. That reductionist habit of mind makes the would-be holist say: 'Right. We've got a total system here. What are its components, what are its goals, what are its priorities?' Too late already. We are in reductionist mode - and linear space-time. We might as well have stayed at home and watched TV. What happens to democracy, a complex whole system, when there's a Gulf War? Why doesn't the wish to care for aboriginal people in a whole system such as Canada not actually work? Why do complex companies discovered after a special search for excellence collapse before their stories can be reprinted? Why does a whole health service or education system degenerate into a machine for escalating costs? Can we understand our firm as a whole? Can we understand our own self as a whole? These are the kinds of question we shall explore, as the class and our insights dictate, in the process of identifying the key principles and techniques of the holistic approach. Cheers, jeh -- Cheers, jeh "Email: ft microcontroller real-world; information-intense office." ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 29 Feb 1996 20:18:31 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: de Bivort - Lawry Subject: Re: Paradigms, Systems, and TQM Comments: To: Joe Moore In-Reply-To: <9602241003.aa02473@bbs.cruzio.com> Thanks Joe. I hope you find some material to post back to me re. what might be called the geometry of organizations. TQM stands for Total Quality Management. It is one of the more startegies through which people are trying to raise the performance of organizations. Other strategies include BPR Business Process Engineering, Employee Participation, Teamwork. They are all pretty limited and overall have a miserable success rate. Organizational performance requires a lot of different things to be done well, and most organizational performance initiatives ignore this. Regards, Lawrence de Bivort ESI On Sat, 24 Feb 1996, Joe Moore wrote: > Fuller's geometry is all about SYSTEMS--of any kind. And he defines a system > as that which divides the universe into three parts: Inside the system, > outside the system, and the system itself. Then he goes on to determine > through experiment what constitutes a minimum system and a maximum system. > > Since human organizations are systems, the insights derived from Fuller's > geometry can be used to better understand human systems. > > I need to poke around in my Bucky database to come up with two references that > I remember--two organizations that are applying his geometry to human groups, > plus maybe Fuller actually mentioned this in his books--not sure--have to > check. > > PS: What is TQM? > -- > > JOE S. MOORE joemoore@bbs.cruzio.com TEL: 408-464-3743 > 850 PARK AVE, # 3-A ALTERNATE TEL AND/OR FAX: 408-479-0733 > CAPITOLA, CA 95010 USA I hereby declare this post to be in the public domain. > ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 29 Feb 1996 15:08:21 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Barbara Greene Organization: CRL Dialup Internet Access (415) 705-6060 [Login: guest] Subject: Re: Ferrocement question ? More good books - "Thin Shell Concrete Structures" David Billington, Prof Civil Engineering, Princeton (McGraw Hill 1965) equations, structural analysis (for building code and planning) Lots on ferrocement - mostly used for boats - anyone want cites? ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 29 Feb 1996 19:00:29 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Karl Erickson Subject: modeling technique Comments: To: synergetics-l@teleport.com i've been trying to come up with a modeling technique that uses cheap, readily available parts, and that will allow rapid connecting-and-unconnecting of struts in flexible joints. too expensive: design science toys has a great modeling kit called 'roger's connection' that uses magnetized struts and steel balls, but it is expensive, won't allow angles of much less than 60 degrees, and has components that are too heavy to allow large structures. i have 120 of these struts, and this is about the upper limit for useful modeling, depending on the structure, of course. in these small realms, however, it's a great tool - flexible, easy to use, etc. too slow: for more complex models, i've made due with 2 inch drinking-straw pieces necklaced together in triangles with loops of elastic string. this is a fantastic technique, very inexpensive, that allows quite complex, flexible structures. unfortunately, tying the knots in the elastic string is an extremely time-consuming process, and the models cannot be easily changed. it is a technique best for building models already designed, but it is a poor exploration tool. cyber: gerald de jong's 'struck' program is an ideal experimental modeling environment, allowing tensegrity structures and struts of multiple lengths. the only 'flaw' here is that you can't toss it around in your hands. ideal?: here's a technique that i came up with today, that might fulfil my physical modeling dreams. the only problem is in finding/making the right stuff. it uses straw-segments as described above, rubber-bands, and special hooks. these hooks are the key to accomodating easily buildable/take-apartable structures. they look like this (monospaced font required): /|\ /||\ / O \ / \/ \ / \ / \ / \ or / \ the 'legs' make a 60 degree angle, and the 'peak' should be as sharp as possible. a rubber-band runs through the loop under the peak, so the loop should be closed so that the clip will stay on the rubber-band. each rubber-band would have three of these clips attatched. the legs of the clips go into the straws. each clip therefore connects two straws in a 60 degree angle. the tension of the rubber-band holds the clips in place. the rubber-band would then run along the outside of the straws, inside the triangle thus formed. multiple triangles can be attatched together. this technique is basically like the elastic-string technique above, but with the elastic on the *outside*, where it can be easily undone. i've experimented making these clips out of paperclips, bobby-pins, and safety-pins (with the ends clipped off). the technique seems sound, but nothing i've tried so far seems 'right'. i've also browsed through the hardware store, looking for something that can be adapted to the purpose, but have found nothing. has anybody perhaps more familiar with hardware seen anything that could be made to fit this purpose? it would be ideal if there were some part already pre-manufactured out there that i could use. barring that, i'll have to make them myself with wire and pliers. stuart quimby, if you are out there, perhaps these clips could be mass-produced somehow. i think this would be a great addition to your design-science toys catalog. perhaps the clips could be made with colored plastic, and 2-inch hard plastic tubes could be provided in place of straws. the rubber-bands could be replaced with colorful elastic loops. anyway, i hope this idea, or some other idea fulfilling my modeling dreams, will soon be developed. ideas and comments are welcome. syn-l and list geodesic seem like the best places for these ideas to get worked out. -k. erixon - setebos@wolfenet.com