From MAILER-DAEMON Tue Jun 15 10:34:51 2004 Return-Path: Received: from acsu.buffalo.edu (deliverance.acsu.buffalo.edu [128.205.7.57]) by linux00.LinuxForce.net (8.12.3/8.12.3/Debian-6.6) with SMTP id i5FEYca6008957 for ; Tue, 15 Jun 2004 10:34:41 -0400 Message-Id: <200406151434.i5FEYca6008957@linux00.LinuxForce.net> Received: (qmail 17114 invoked from network); 15 Jun 2004 14:34:38 -0000 Received: from listserv.buffalo.edu (128.205.7.35) by deliverance.acsu.buffalo.edu with SMTP; 15 Jun 2004 14:34:38 -0000 Date: Tue, 15 Jun 2004 10:34:38 -0400 From: "L-Soft list server at University at Buffalo (1.8e)" Subject: File: "GEODESIC LOG0210" To: Chris Fearnley X-Virus-Scanned: clamd / ClamAV version 0.71, clamav-milter version 0.71 X-Virus-Status: Clean Status: RO Content-Length: 375734 Lines: 9891 ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 1 Oct 2002 00:00:03 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Patrick Salsbury Subject: *MONTHLY POSTING* - GEODESIC 'how-to' info ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- This is the monthly "How To" file about the GEODESIC list. It has info on content and purpose of the list, as well as subscription info, posting instructions, etc. It should prove useful to new subscribers, as well as those who are unfamiliar with LISTSERV operations. This message is being posted on Tue Oct 1 00:00:01 PDT 2002. If you are tired of receiving this message once per month, and are reading bit.listserv.geodesic through USENET news, then you can enter this subject into your KILL/SCORE file. If you're reading through email, you can set up a filter to delete the message. Both of these tricks are WELL worth learning how to do, if you don't know already. And isn't it about time to learn something new? Isn't it always? :-) ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- GEODESIC is a forum for the discussion of the ideas and creations relating to the work of R. Buckminster (Bucky) Fuller. 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Salsbury http://www.sculptors.com/~salsbury/ ----------------------- Don't break the Law...fix it. ;^) ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 1 Oct 2002 21:22:56 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: Methane hydrate (Rifkin's deep doo-doo H2 economics?) Comments: To: synergeo@yahoogroups.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed did the article actually say, "all-space-filling," or is that just a Buckafkanologist accretion?... I do highlight the stick-drawn figures, in order to show that that's what got Bucky's goat, in most of his _S_. the regular dodecahedron's facets are parallel in pairs, which is a requirement for "filling," for any centrally-symmetrical unit-shape; if you can find an irregular one that does it (like whipped cream), then you may have made a new dyscovery; good luck! >The language may, or may not, be not up to academic standards, but a >statement such as, "an all-space filling packing of pentagonal >dodecahedra" appears to me to be pretty clear in its intent. > >Anyway, I can produce a convex (at least, I think it meets convexity >requirements) pentagonal dodecahedron that packs with copies of itself >to tile E^3 -- but pairs of its faces are co-planer. Is there a convex >pentagonal dodecahedron without co-planer faces that can tile E^3? >http://memeticdrift.net/tau/ice1h/ice1h.htm --SIGHnS: The Edison Way in Menlo Park; Homestead censors get marching-orders from As*croft? http://quincy4board.homestead.com/DeepPool.html www.watergate.com/stories/watergate.asp _________________________________________________________________ MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 1 Oct 2002 21:31:41 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: Arthur Loeb memorial Comments: To: synergeo@yahoogroups.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed actually, it's a better "place" to start, than _S_, although there are really prerequisites to Loeb's study, as well; can you say, Welcome to Milton Academy, boys & girls?... can you say, We study the sky, one night per week at Hogwarts Publick/feudal School? >much better to look into one of Loeb's last books, >in that Birkhauser series that started with Edmondson's >_A Fuller Explanation_ (?), which really does a great job >of "sytematizing" all of the shapes. > > > > "The appearance of this sizable book is symptomatic of a considerable > > > revival of interest in geometrics, a science of configurations. > > > Configurations observed in the sky constitute the laboratory of our > >oldest > > > science, astronomy. Patterns and regularities were discerned, and --SIGHnS: The Edison Way in Menlo Park; Homestead censors get orders from As*croft? http://quincy4board.homestead.com/DeepPool.html www.watergate.com/stories/watergate.asp-- _________________________________________________________________ Join the world’s largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. http://www.hotmail.com ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 1 Oct 2002 21:54:00 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: Methane hydrate (Rifkin's deep doo-doo H2 economics?) Comments: cc: synergeo@yahooGroups.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed I should add that "centrally-s." *implies* that all of the facets are parallel-in-pairs. if the "tile" shape isn't, it could tile space -- tiling is probably the simplest term to use -- but not periodically. for instance, in the plane, it's an unsolved problem, as to whether all of the pentagons that tile it, have been found. as far as i know, the Weire-Phelan shape is centrally-s. (as it's the one with 12 pentagona and 2 hexagona, not the one with 3 or 4 hexagona -- the one with 3 couldn't be centrally-s.; eh? thus quoth: We're assuming regular pentagonal dodecahedra don't tile space. http://memeticdrift.net/tau/ice1h/ice1h.htm --SIGHnS: The Edison Way in Menlo Park; Homestead censors get orders from As*croft? http://quincy4board.homestead.com/DeepPool.html _________________________________________________________________ Join the world’s largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. http://www.hotmail.com ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Oct 2002 00:18:53 +0100 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Paul Taylor Subject: FW: A major scientific fraud has just been confirmed In-Reply-To: <3D99D8FD.F484B171@sccmail.maricopa.edu> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Hello, As this concerns buckminsterfullerenes, I am posting this remarkable article. Regards, Paul Taylor ---------- http://www.economist.com/science/displayStory.cfm?story_id=3D1352850 Outside the Bell curve Sep 26th 2002 >From The Economist print edition A major scientific fraud has just been confirmed THE sound of swallowed pride is rare but welcome. Bell Laboratories, one of the most venerable names in science, the home of the transistor and currently the research arm of Lucent Technologies, is prouder than many. But it has been taken for an enormous ride, and on September 25th it had the grace to admit it. That was the day that a report into the activities of Jan Hendrik Sch=F6n, one of the laboratory's highest-flying physicists, was released. Dr. Sch=F6n has spent the past few years turning out results of a quantity and apparent quality that were, until a few months ago, universally acknowledged to be worthy of a Nobel prize. Unfortunately, he seems to have made them up. Moreover, he did so in a surprisingly artless way. Though suspicions were aroused when other labs could not duplicate them, these suspicions were generally explained as the result of differences in equipment. Indeed, the fact that Dr Sch=F6n could, by his own admission, achieve some findings only 10% of the time helped to allay people's fears. It began to look as if a quirk of his kit might be responsible, and the search turned to what that quirk might be. What caught him out in the end was that he used identical (though differently labelled) graphs to illustrate papers in fields as diverse as the physics of semiconductors and superconductors. When that emerged in May, Bell Labs immediately formed a committee of independent scientists, under the chairmanship of Malcolm Beasley, a respected physicist from Stanford University, to investigate what had happened. It is their report that has just been published. What a tangled web we weave Semiconductivity and superconductivity are critical to electronics. Dr Sch=F6n began his career looking at semiconductors made not of silicon (the preferred material for most commercial applications), but of organic molecules. In chemical parlance an organic molecule need not necessarily have come from a living creature. The term refers to molecules (often quite complex ones) that are built around a skeleton of interlinked carbon atoms. Materials made of organic molecules are often flexible (plastics are organics). They are often cheap to manufacture too. But although signs of semiconductivity had been observed in a group of organic molecules called pentacenes, no one had been able to use them to build actual semiconducting devices, such as transistors. So when Dr Sch=F6n announced, in 2000, that he was able to make transistors out of pentacene, and then went on to demonstrate a number of abstruse semiconducting phenomena, such as the quantum Hall effect, in his pentacenes, everybody sat up and took notice. He then capped this work by taking buckminsterfullerene, another organic molecule (also known as a buckyball because it has the shape of a miniature soccer ball), and, so he claimed, turning it into a superconductor. Not any old superconductor either. His bucky-superconductors worked at surprisingly high temperatures. Superconductors (so called because they conduct electricity without resistance) work only below a certain, critical temperature. For the original superconductors, discovered almost a century ago, that temperature was so close to absolute zero that commercialisation was very restricted. In the late 1980s, it was found that some materials called perovskites would superconduct at temperatures higher than 77=B0 above absolute zero. That meant they could be cooled with liquid nitrogen, which is cheap. Perovskites, however, are difficult to fabricate, so commercial applications were still limited. Dr Sch=F6n's first bucky-superconductor =93worked=94 at 11=B0 above absolute zero. Through a carefully staged set of =93improvements=94 to the technique, he got this up to 117=B0=97well into the liquid nitrogen zone. Buckyballs are a discovery looking for an application, and it seemed as though Dr Sch=F6n alone had found one. And that last sentence holds the key to the fraud. For modern science is generally a collaborative effort. All of Dr Sch=F6n's 90 papers had co-authors=97people who should, if things had worked the way they are supposed to, have been able to vouch for the quality of the research. But in practice, Dr Sch=F6n was actually working by himself. As the Beasley inquiry report puts it: =93None of the most significant physical results was witnessed by any co-author or other colleague.=94 That did not stop them putting their names to the work, though. It did not stop the report exonerating all the co-authors either: =93The committee does not endorse the view that each co-author is responsible for the entirety of a collaborative endeavour.=94 In other words, where more than one person might carry the can, nobody shall be to blame. Except, of course, Dr Sch=F6n. But he is no scapegoat. The fraud was his responsibility. So are the millions of dollars that have been wasted following his =93results=94 up. He will never work in science again. 20:20 hindsight Mistakes happen. The important thing is to learn from them. There are probably two lessons to learn from this sordid episode. The first, in case anybody had forgotten, is that scientists are humans too. Some of them will do stupid and mendacious things. The second, and more important lesson, is that you can't cheat nature. There will probably be a lot of finger-pointing at the system of peer review, in which journals send papers out to independent experts to be evaluated. Some scrutiny of the peer-review process might be welcome. In this case the results were so exciting that critical faculties may, on occasion, have been suspended. Indeed, several people have commented in retrospect that the results were too good. They matched theory exactly, which is unlikely both because experiments and theory are rarely in perfect agreement=97particularly with preliminary work=97and because the theories were developed for inorganic semiconductors such as silicon. It really would be a surprise if organic semiconductors were to behave in exactly the same way as inorganic ones. The harshest examiner, however, is not a scientist's peers, but reality itself. The more significant a result is, the more it will be tested by that reality. In the case of Dr. Sch=F6n's results, several of which had technologists licking their lips in anticipation of the inventions that might flow from them, the reality test was going to be enormous. How he expected to get away with it is mysterious. So, perhaps there is a third lesson as well. If you do cheat at science, do so in a field which is so insignificant that no one will bother to check. -- ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Jeffry P. Ricker, Ph.D. Chair, Behavioral Sciences ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Scottsdale Community College 9000 E. Chaparral Road Scottsdale, AZ 85256-2626 Phone (480) 423-6213 Fax (480) 423-6298 jeff.ricker@sccmail.maricopa.edu PESTS (Psychologists Educating Students to Think Skeptically) http://www.sc.maricopa.edu/sbscience/pests/ The Psychology Student: Learning About the Science of Psychology http://www.sc.maricopa.edu/sbscience/psychscience/index.html ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Oct 2002 21:42:16 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: disabled (KMM3190575V14540L0KM) Comments: To: support@homesteadsupport.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed that info doesn't "help;" you have to be kidding, mister "Felipe...." my account was closed before the supposed extra month, and I was only told about *that* afterwards. nevermind. get me the phone#, which has been deleted from your website, because I have to talk to mister Griffin. (since "Riley," "Jude" et al say that they can't do anything, no matter how reasonable my requests for info & service might be; eh?) >Your account was closed due to non-payment. If you'd like to have us >re-open your account, please let me know. However, you should be aware that >to do so, you'll have to pay any outstanding fees, and your account will be >subject to a $20 reopen fee. > >I hope that this information helps. Please let me know if you have any >other questions. > > >Regards, > >Felipe >Homestead Support >[Case #1292482] >Original Message Follows: >------------------------- > > >that was an irrelevancy that HS didn't need to know, >but thanks you, anyway, Dear! > > >It seems you have prematurely disabled the homestead web-site of my > > >--SIGHnS: The Edison Way in Menlo Park; >Homestead censors get orders from As*croft? >http://quincy4board.homestead.com/DeepPool.html > www.watergate.com/stories/watergate.asp Homestead Technologies, Inc. 3375 Edison Way Menlo Park, CA 94025 Fax(650) 364-7329 Note: this is NOT a help/customer support phone number. To get help, please click here. Web Sitehttp://www.homestead.com Getting to our Office by Car Click here to get directions to Homestead from MapBlast. >From San Francisco: Take 101 South to the Marsh Road exit (between Woodside Rd. exit and Willow Rd. exit). Turn right at the first stoplight onto Marsh Road. Continue on Marsh Road through three stoplights, then get into the right lane. As the right lane begins to end, you'll see an auto detailing shop on the right. Turn right onto that street, Fair Oaks. Take Fair Oaks to the end and turn left on Edison Way. Our building (3375 Edison Way) will be on your right. _________________________________________________________________ Join the world’s largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. http://www.hotmail.com ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 2 Oct 2002 18:04:48 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Organization: (Retired) Subject: Re: Domes in AZ Comments: To: Spencer W Hunter MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Oops! I forgot about that one. Thanks. Will add to list. In the meantime I found another: 102' diam Multi-Purpose Amphitheater Dome Chinle Elementary & Junior High School Navajo Reservation Chinle & Many Farms, AZ For a pic see http://www.starnetint.com/Business/Projects/A2792AB.HTM ============================== Joe S Moore joe_s_moore@hotmail.com http://buckminster.info <== NEW Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute ============================= ----- Original Message ----- From: "Spencer W Hunter" To: "Joe S Moore" Sent: Tuesday, October 01, 2002 12:07 PM Subject: Re: Domes in AZ > Looks good! I didn't see this one in your list: > > CENTER FOR DESERT ARCHITECTURE > Address: 1209 N FREMONT AVE > > If you recall, there's a small (about 20 feet diameter) 2-frequency dome > in the back yard we looked at where the architecture students experiment > with different angles of light on their models. > > Spencer Hunter, Library Specialist > gopher://www.u.arizona.edu:80/hGET%20/%7Eshunter > > On Fri, 27 Sep 2002, Joe S Moore wrote: > > > Spencer, > > > > I'm putting together a list of domes for the whole world. Here's the list > > for Arizona; the format is City, Owner, Diameter, Year, Comment: (It's in > > text format because I know you prefer that.) > > > > Flagstaff > > NEXRAD Weather Station > > 35? > > 19?? > > Radome > > " > > Flagstaff > > Northern Arizona University > > 502 > > 1977 > > J L Walkup Skydome > > " > > Mesa > > Wastewater Treatment Plant > > ?? > > 19?? > > 4 Tank Covers > > " > > Mt Lemmon > > Mt Lemmon Infrared Observatory > > ?? > > 1970? > > Radome > > " > > Page Ranch > > University of Arizona Landfill > > ?? > > 19?? > > Unused Ramada Dome > > " > > Phoenix > > ARCO > > 67 > > 19?? > > 2 Jet Fuel Tank Covers > > " > > Phoenix > > NEXRAD Weather Station > > 35? > > 19?? > > Radome > > " > > Prescott > > Church? > > 20 > > 19?? > > Stained Glass Skylight > > " > > Prescott > > 2 Private Residences > > ?? > > 19?? > > Addresses? > > " > > Springerville > > Round Valley High School > > 440 > > 19?? > > Football Stadium > > " > > Scottsdale > > Private Residence > > 74 > > 19?? > > Address? > > " > > Sedona > > Healing Center of Arizona > > ?? > > 1979? > > Hotel/Spa Domes > > " > > Show Low > > Apache Pavilion Restaurant > > ?? > > 1968? > > Dome Cafe > > " > > St Johns > > Remote Earth Station > > 28 > > 19?? > > 2 Radomes > > " > > Tempe > > Bank One > > ?? > > 1962 > > Was Valley National Bank > > " > > Tucson > > NEXRAD Weather Station > > 35? > > 19?? > > Radome > > " > > Tucson > > Private Residence > > ?? > > 19?? > > N Bonita Dr > > " > > Tucson > > Private Residence > > ?? > > 19?? > > W Potvin Lane > > " > > " > > Shell Oil Terminal > > ?? > > 19?? > > 5 Petroleum Tank Covers > > " > > Yucca > > Private Residence > > ?? > > 19?? > > Spherical; based on octahedra > > " > > Yuma > > NEXRAD Weather Station > > 35? > > 19?? > > Radome > > > > ============================== > > Joe S Moore > > joe_s_moore@hotmail.com > > http://buckminster.info <== NEW > > Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute > > ============================= > > > ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 4 Oct 2002 01:41:56 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: gravity and finding her Comments: cc: synergeo@yahooGroups.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed are you propozing an *a priori* "structure for space-time?... have you found a good hypothesis (say in the lit.) on "quantization" of time? you can't ask such a silly question, without making some hypothesis. or, is the hypothesis, Can I in *deed* ask silly questions like this?... What is the sound of one hand clapping?... or, my favorite silly paradox, as regurgitated by Lord Berty, I'm not lying; you are lying! you can certainly "run with" your Universe, that is squished by a tensional membrane, as a suppozed boundary-condition (for, say, a big bang, if you're going for the Macarthur thing .-) thus quoth: http://math.ucr.edu/home/baez/RelWWW/tests.html#gw Is Tverse's compressed order-mostly-twelve network of pionts an "aether?" Would *any* geometrical structure for spacetime, which its purveyor claimed was "real" enough to have some effect (perhaps a nonlocal effect only?) on matter/energy, be accused of being an Aether? --SIGHnS: The Edison Way in Menlo Park; Homestead censors get orders from As*croft? http://quincy4board.homestead.com/DeepPool.html www.watergate.com/stories/watergate.asp-- _________________________________________________________________ Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 4 Oct 2002 14:09:15 -0400 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Seth Itzkan Subject: Bucky Stamp in 2004 Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Thomas Zung also revealed to us that the U.S. Post Office will issue a Buckminster Fuller stamp in 2004. -- Seth J. Itzkan Planet-TECH Associates 70 Marshall St. Medford, MA 02155 781-874-0206 sitzkan@planet-tech.com ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 4 Oct 2002 14:02:23 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Leifur Thor Subject: Re: Bucky Stamp in 2004 In-Reply-To: <20021004180639772.AAA131@dns.bridgemedia.net@[24.61.59.100]> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!about bloody time!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! excellent! > From: Seth Itzkan > Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works > > Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic > Date: Fri, 4 Oct 2002 14:09:15 -0400 > To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > Subject: Bucky Stamp in 2004 > > Thomas Zung also revealed to us that the U.S. Post Office will issue a > Buckminster Fuller stamp in 2004. > > > -- > > Seth J. Itzkan > Planet-TECH Associates > 70 Marshall St. > Medford, MA 02155 > 781-874-0206 > sitzkan@planet-tech.com ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 4 Oct 2002 14:12:03 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Peter Meisen Subject: Re: Bucky Stamp in 2004 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Fabulous news. It's another leveraged way to remind people of Bucky and his artifacts. GENI will use that stamp exclusively when it becomes available. Peter Meisen Seth Itzkan wrote: >Thomas Zung also revealed to us that the U.S. Post Office will issue a >Buckminster Fuller stamp in 2004. > > >-- > >Seth J. Itzkan >Planet-TECH Associates >70 Marshall St. >Medford, MA 02155 >781-874-0206 >sitzkan@planet-tech.com > -- The Global Energy Network Institute focuses on the interconnection of electric power networks between nations and continents, with an emphasis on tapping abundant renewable energy resources. This strategy is the highest priority of the World Game simulation developed by Dr. Buckminster Fuller three decades ago. TEL: 619-595-0139 petermeisen@cs.com http://www.geni.org ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 4 Oct 2002 22:17:10 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: Bucky Stamp in 2004 Comments: cc: synergeo@yahooGroups.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed marvelous; let us hope (or pray) that the Committee decides upon a trigonal shape, with fold-lines & tabs to make a tetrahedron (or a tetragon (square) with those for an "E-quanta module" !-) thus quoth: >Thomas Zung also revealed to us that the U.S. Post Office will issue a >Buckminster Fuller stamp in 2004. --A HYDROGEN (sic; cracked methane) ECONOMY?... The Three Phases of Exploitation of the Protocols of the Elders of Kyoto: (FOSSILISATION [McCainanites?] (TM/sic))/ BORE/GUSH/NADIR "@" http://www.tarpley.net/aobook.htm. Http://www.tarpley.net/bushb.htm (partial contents, below): 17 -- THE ATTEMPTED COUP D'ETAT, 3/30/81 (87K) 18 -- IRAN-CONTRA (140K) 19 -- THE LEVERAGED BUYOUT MOB (67K) 20 -- THE PHONY WAR ON DRUGS (26K) 21 -- OMAHA (25K) 22 -- GEORGE "#9" TAKES THE PRESIDENCY (112K) 23 -- THE END OF HISTORY (168K) 24 -- THE NEW WORLD ORDER (255K) 25 -- THYROID STORM (139K) _________________________________________________________________ Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 4 Oct 2002 23:00:27 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: gravity and finding her Comments: cc: synergeo@yahooGroups.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed I found a quote of Einstein, to the effect of "Dayton Miller's recalibration of the Michelson-Morley findings have to be wrong, but I wouldn't say so, publically." That is, he helped to shoot it down with a rumor, whilst he was visiting his office at Caltech!... The weird thing: all of these experiments found anomalies that were repeatable, if rather small. (If one looks at a recent issue of *Nude Scientist*, they seem to be embedding this possibility into their pop-sci speak on the microwave "background" radiation, but that's just my opinion, and the article contained no citations, as I recall.) It must always be asked, How can "photon" be a wave?… There's a lot of obfuscation in Broglie's, Bohm's, et al's approaches -- and Bohm was famously "helped" in this by Krishnamurthi, although it didn't seem to effect the raw mathematics -- but it simply boils-down to the question, Of what necessity is a photon, anyhow? Anyway, I figured that STR meant, special theory of r. There is also a part (that I read a quote of) in Einstein, where he dysmisses the subject of "homopolar generators," which is apparently a small problem in STR, and which shows a misunderstanding of Ampere's electrodynamics. One might also wonder, if "Euclidean space" can be transformed into other spaces, such that (in particular) geodesics are also transformed, when do we really have to entertain this philosophical question? (Or, "Gauss, I refute thee!" ?-) cool tools?... http://pauillac.inria.fr/algo/bsolve/constant/constant.html Thus quoth: involves no ``prior geometry'' (such as the euclidean geometry of ``space'' which has assumed by Maxwell and his contemporaries), much less any ``preferred frame''. Nonetheless, gtr does not quite say there is ``nothing'' in ``empty space''; in general there will be gravitational waves running about, and these carry (very tiny) amounts of energy, which gravitate. So in this sense, a very different kind of ``aether'' in the very weak sense of there being ``something there'' in a vacuum (namely --A HYDROGEN (sic; cracked methane) ECONOMY?... The Three Phases of Exploitation of the Protocols of the Elders of Kyoto: (FOSSILISATION [McCainanites?] (TM/sic))/ BORE/GUSH/NADIR "@" http://www.tarpley.net/aobook.htm. Http://www.tarpley.net/bushb.htm (partial contents, below): 17 -- THE ATTEMPTED COUP D'ETAT, 3/30/81 (87K) 18 -- IRAN-CONTRA (140K) 19 -- THE LEVERAGED BUYOUT MOB (67K) 20 -- THE PHONY WAR ON DRUGS (26K) 21 -- OMAHA (25K) 22 -- GEORGE "#9" TAKES THE PRESIDENCY (112K) 23 -- THE END OF HISTORY (168K) 24 -- THE NEW WORLD ORDER (255K) 25 -- THYROID STORM (139K) _________________________________________________________________ MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 4 Oct 2002 23:01:39 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: what the ****? Comments: To: synergeo@yahooGroups.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed I've gotten the form for Small Claims Court, today -- HS personnel were unavailable, because they were having their "8th Ann. gathering" in beautiful Menlo Park -- so, I'll make a special trip downtown, to talk to the Small Claims Advisor at the county office of Consumer-whatever. The advisor will surely give me a green light for going for the max. $5000 or, say, Lifetime Gold Membership. For taking this amount of trouble, I'll settle for an extra year, Gold. Of course, that's for neglect, intransigence, pain, suffering, Columbine-High-type vertigo and sexual dysorientation (if the tests come back, dyspositive .-) thus saith: if anyone wants to lobby for me, the number is 800/797-2958; 3375 Edison Way, Menlo Park, if you're in the area (how far to BFI?). --SIGHnS: The Edison Way in Menlo Park; Homestead censors get orders from As*croft? http://quincy4board.homestead.com/DeepPool.html www.watergate.com/stories/watergate.asp-- _________________________________________________________________ Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 4 Oct 2002 20:08:40 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Organization: (Retired) Subject: Re: Fuller dome/San Marcos? Comments: To: Dirk Sutro MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Dear Mr Sutro, This is what I know: Fuller spoke at Palomar College in San Marcos, CA, on Jan 20, 1978. At some point in time a geodesic dome-covered gym was built. (See = _Ideas & Integrities_, p 96-j). Based on the picture, it appears to be = an aluminum dome manufactured by Kaiser Aluminum of Oakland, CA. As = Fuller's geodesic dome patent was still in force around that time, = Kaiser had to be a licensee of Fuller's. It's quite possible that = Fuller had no direct involvement in that particular project. I would = think that the authorities at Palomar College would have more details = about their gym. If you do find more information about that gym = (diameter, year built, architect, contractor, cost, etc), would you mind = passing a copy along to me so that I can update my files? A color pic = would be nice, also; I only have that black & white from Bucky's book. Thanks, =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D Joe S Moore joe_s_moore@hotmail.com http://buckminster.info <=3D=3D NEW Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Dirk Sutro=20 To: joe_s_moore@hotmail.com=20 Sent: Thursday, October 03, 2002 3:04 PM Subject: Fuller dome/San Marcos? Your list a Bucky Fuller dome at Palomar College in San Marcos, but my = sources (including a local architect who says HE designed it) say that = Fuller had nothing to do with this particular dome---although it was = directly inspired by a Fuller dome in Hawaii. Do you have info that confirms any direct involvement of Fuller? Best, Dirk Sutro, author AIA Guide to San Diego Architecture ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 5 Oct 2002 08:09:08 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: two geodesic groups MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Have there been two geodesic groups long? I guess google has one, too. bit.listserv.geodesic __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Faith Hill - Exclusive Performances, Videos & More http://faith.yahoo.com ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 5 Oct 2002 18:07:48 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: two geodesic groups Comments: cc: synergeo@yahooGroups.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed couldn't find it on google, list-wize; sure it's not the same group? >bit.listserv.geodesic --SIGHnS: The Edison Way in Menlo Park; Homestead censors get orders from As*croft? http://quincy4board.homestead.com/DeepPool.html www.watergate.com/stories/watergate.asp-- _________________________________________________________________ Join the world’s largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. http://www.hotmail.com ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 5 Oct 2002 18:57:47 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: Methane hydrate (Rifkin's deep doo-doo H2 economics?) Comments: To: synergeo@yahoogroups.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed so, I looked at the article in the current *Science*, and it plainly uses dodecahedra *and* the shape with 4 "extra" hexagona, in the lattice. also, as I recall, "oxygen at each vertex and hydrogen at each edge," to make the ice. (2 or 4 molecules of H2, inside of each of these "cells.") thus saith: >did the article actually say, "all-space-filling," or >is that just a Buckafkanologist accretion?... I do >highlight the stick-drawn figures, in order >to show that that's what got Bucky's goat, >in most of his _S_. > the regular dodecahedron's facets are parallel >in pairs, which is a requirement for "filling," >for any centrally-symmetrical unit-shape; >if you can find an irregular one >that does it (like whipped cream), then >you may have made a new dyscovery; good luck! >I should add that "centrally-s." *implies* that >all of the facets are parallel-in-pairs. if >the "tile" shape isn't, it could tile space >-- tiling is probably the simplest term to use -- >but not periodically. for instance, >in the plane, it's an unsolved problem, >as to whether all of the pentagons that tile it, >have been found. as far as i know, >the Weire-Phelan shape is centrally-s. (as >it's the one with 12 pentagona and 2 hexagona, >not the one with 3 or 4 hexagona -- >the one with 3 couldn't be centrally-s.; eh? >http://memeticdrift.net/tau/ice1h/ice1h.htm --A HYDROGEN (sic; cracked methane) ECONOMY?... The Three Phases of Exploitation of the Protocols of the Elders of Kyoto: (FOSSILISATION [McCainanites?] (TM/sic))/ BORE/GUSH/NADIR "@" http://www.tarpley.net/aobook.htm. Http://www.tarpley.net/bushb.htm (partial contents, below): 17 -- THE ATTEMPTED COUP D'ETAT, 3/30/81 (87K) 18 -- IRAN-CONTRA (140K) 19 -- THE LEVERAGED BUYOUT MOB (67K) 20 -- THE PHONY WAR ON DRUGS (26K) 21 -- OMAHA (25K) 22 -- GEORGE "#9" TAKES THE PRESIDENCY (112K) 23 -- THE END OF HISTORY (168K) 24 -- THE NEW WORLD ORDER (255K) 25 -- THYROID STORM (139K) _________________________________________________________________ Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 5 Oct 2002 13:07:17 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Re: two geodesic groups In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii It has the same archives but it is not the same as the U of Buffalo list. At least, it is not familiar to me. Maybe it split in two. Try: http://groups.google.ca/groups?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&group=bit.listserv.geodesic Here is the other: http://listserv.acsu.buffalo.edu/archives/geodesic.html --- In synergeo@y..., "Quincy Quincy Quincy" wrote: > > couldn't find it on google, list-wize; > sure it's not the same group? > > > >bit.listserv.geodesic __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Faith Hill - Exclusive Performances, Videos & More http://faith.yahoo.com ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 5 Oct 2002 23:45:41 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: gravity and finding her Comments: cc: synergeo@yahooGroups.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed sorry; the "quote" of Einstein was second-hand, so that it's better to say that it was "according to so-and-so, he said that about Miller's experiments" -- and I haven't recalled the large book that it was from, in any case. also, Einstein had an *apartment*, I think, not just an office at Caltech. --SIGHnS: The Edison Way in Menlo Park; Homestead censors get orders from As*croft? http://quincy4board.homestead.com/DeepPool.html www.watergate.com/stories/watergate.asp-- _________________________________________________________________ Join the world’s largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. http://www.hotmail.com ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 5 Oct 2002 20:38:34 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Organization: (Retired) Subject: Fw: buckminster fuller play returns to San Francisco MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable [Play runs from Oct 16 thru Dec 30, 2002] =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D Joe S Moore joe_s_moore@hotmail.com http://buckminster.info <=3D=3D NEW Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Jeff Rowlings=20 To: joe_s_moore@hotmail.com=20 Sent: Monday, September 30, 2002 8:30 AM Subject: buckminster fuller play returns to San Francisco Joe, Thought you might want to know that we are reviving our hit production, = "R. Buckminster Fuller: THE HISTORY (and Mystery) OF THE UNIVERSE" in = San Francisco. Attached Word file is a quick sheet with info. Much = more at our website, www.foghouse.com. Any inclusion about the show you = could work into your next update would be appreciated. Thanks, Jeff Rowlings Producer -- Foghouse Productions 322 Cortland Avenue #225 San Francisco, CA 94110 (415) 777-FOG7 (415) 333-9595 fax www.foghouse.com ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 5 Oct 2002 20:56:45 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Organization: (Retired) Subject: Re: quiet NG... Comments: To: William Robertson MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit William, Please see my collection of references about geodesic dome math: http://www.buckminster.info//Index/Domes-M.htm (scroll to "Math/Geometry") It is quite possible to design domes based on the tetrahedron rather than an octahedron or an icosahedron. Each basic shape has it's advantages & disadvantages. See also http://www.buckminster.info//Ideas/03-Tet.htm (scroll to "Trusses") ============================== Joe S Moore joe_s_moore@hotmail.com http://buckminster.info <== NEW Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute ============================= ----- Original Message ----- From: "William Robertson" Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic Sent: Saturday, October 05, 2002 5:53 AM Subject: quiet NG... > After sitting watching this NG for a while...maybe I'm looking in the wrong > place? No matter. I've done extensive net searches/researches on Geodomes, > and am currently trying to engage my brain on the maths. (math for the US > contingent.) > > Is there a geometric shape that is similar to a truncated icosahedron that > only uses ONE size of polyhedron (one geometric shape) ? > > Or do I *always* need at least two shapes? (pentagon and hexagon) Which in > turn can be made up of triangles. > -- > somewherein@Africa > ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 6 Oct 2002 07:05:14 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Re: quiet NG... In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Bill- Here is a dome that uses only one size element, but every edge is a different length. Very simple. Almost no maths. http://groups.msn.com/BuckminsterFuller/shoebox.msnw?Page=7 > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "William Robertson" > > After sitting watching this NG for a while...maybe I'm > looking in the > wrong > > place? No matter. I've done extensive net > searches/researches on Geodomes, > > and am currently trying to engage my brain on the > maths. (math for the US > > contingent.) > > > > Is there a geometric shape that is similar to a > truncated icosahedron > that > > only uses ONE size of polyhedron (one geometric shape) > ? > > > > Or do I *always* need at least two shapes? (pentagon > and hexagon) Which in > > turn can be made up of triangles. > > -- > > somewherein@Africa > > __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Faith Hill - Exclusive Performances, Videos & More http://faith.yahoo.com ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 6 Oct 2002 23:18:40 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: quiet NG... Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed wouldn't it be a better dyscription of these artifacts, to say, "I still don't know what in Hell I did, to get all of these 'unit-length struts' to go together, or if they'd actaully close-up to make a sphere." alas, poor Yorick; Reality used to be friend of his! >Bill- Here is a dome that uses only one size element, but >every edge is a different length. Very simple. Almost no >maths. > >http://groups.msn.com/BuckminsterFuller/shoebox.msnw?Page=7 --SIGHnS: The Edison Way in Menlo Park; Homestead censors get orders from As*croft? http://quincy4board.homestead.com/DeepPool.html www.watergate.com/stories/watergate.asp-- _________________________________________________________________ Join the world’s largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. http://www.hotmail.com ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 6 Oct 2002 23:29:08 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: quiet NG... Comments: cc: synergeo@yahooGroups.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed what is an NG? the only polyhedra that are made of all of the same polygon, are known as the Catalan solids. they are the duals to the Archimedean ones, which unsurpizingly consist of all identical vertices. there are about a 100 of each. (regularity of the facets or vertices makes for a subset taht belongs to both categories, a.k.a. the Platonic solids.) thus quoth: > > Is there a geometric shape that is similar to a truncated icosahedron >that > > only uses ONE size of polyhedron (one geometric shape) ? > > > > Or do I *always* need at least two shapes? (pentagon and hexagon) Which >in > > turn can be made up of triangles. > > -- > > somewherein@Africa > > --SIGHnS: The Edison Way in Menlo Park; Homestead censors get orders from As*croft? http://quincy4board.homestead.com/DeepPool.html www.watergate.com/stories/watergate.asp-- --A HYDROGEN (sic; cracked methane) ECONOMY?... The Three Phases of Exploitation of the Protocols of the Elders of Kyoto: (FOSSILISATION [McCainanites?] (TM/sic))/ BORE/GUSH/NADIR "@" http://www.tarpley.net/aobook.htm. Http://www.tarpley.net/bushb.htm (partial contents, below): 17 -- THE ATTEMPTED COUP D'ETAT, 3/30/81 (87K) 18 -- IRAN-CONTRA (140K) 19 -- THE LEVERAGED BUYOUT MOB (67K) 20 -- THE PHONY WAR ON DRUGS (26K) 21 -- OMAHA (25K) 22 -- GEORGE "#9" TAKES THE PRESIDENCY (112K) 23 -- THE END OF HISTORY (168K) 24 -- THE NEW WORLD ORDER (255K) 25 -- THYROID STORM (139K) _________________________________________________________________ MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 7 Oct 2002 05:14:29 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Re: quiet NG... In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii You do get, Quin, that all the struts are different lengths, don't you? They also close just fine. --- Quincy Quincy Quincy wrote: > wouldn't it be a better dyscription of these artifacts, > to say, "I still don't know what in Hell I did, > to get all of these 'unit-length struts' to go together, > or if they'd actaully close-up to make a sphere." > > alas, poor Yorick; > Reality used to be friend of his! > > >Bill- Here is a dome that uses only one size element, > but > >every edge is a different length. Very simple. Almost no > >maths. > > > >http://groups.msn.com/BuckminsterFuller/shoebox.msnw?Page=7 __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Faith Hill - Exclusive Performances, Videos & More http://faith.yahoo.com ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 7 Oct 2002 07:23:02 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: failure strain Comments: To: synergeo MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Something to consider. I wonder if this is true for most materials, like wood, metal. From: http://pygarg.ps.umist.ac.uk/ianson/paper_physics/Bending_Stiffness.html "Interesting point: did you know that, when you bend a sheet of board until it becomes permanently damaged with a crease, it always fails on the inside of the curve? This is because the outside is being stretched but the inside is being compressed and the failure strain under compression is lower than that for extension." __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Faith Hill - Exclusive Performances, Videos & More http://faith.yahoo.com ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 7 Oct 2002 19:58:52 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: quiet NG... Comments: cc: synergeo@yahooGroups.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed sorry, but I was confuzed by your statement, "uses only one size element, but every edge is a different length," that ameliorates your 'methode craftique' and, since you left no notes on your methode, any one who stumbles into your site will be at least as confuzed as I was. (but, you don't have to trim the excess off o'the struts, unless you want to, say, apply glazing!) your models clearly do not close-up, because you didn't bother to do that, because to try to do so "without any maths" is to fail, insofar as you have ignored every thing that's been said in critique of them. on the other hand, that is the best way to knowledge! unless your joints are flexible, you won't be able to cram the model to closure, except by occaisional luck -- all-praise the goddess, Fortuna! thus quoth: >You do get, Quin, that all the struts are different >lengths, don't you? They also close just fine. > >--- Quincy Quincy Quincy wrote: > > wouldn't it be a better dyscription of these artifacts, > > to say, "I still don't know what in Hell I did, > > to get all of these 'unit-length struts' to go together, > > or if they'd actaully close-up to make a sphere." > >http://groups.msn.com/BuckminsterFuller/shoebox.msnw?Page=7 --SIGHnS: The Edison Way in Menlo Park; Homestead censors get orders from As*croft? http://quincy4board.homestead.com/DeepPool.html www.watergate.com/stories/watergate.asp _________________________________________________________________ Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 7 Oct 2002 20:03:33 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: failure strain Comments: cc: synergeo@yahooGroups.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed probably some thing like the opposite is the case for rock, which has greater compressive strength than its tensile one. (that is crucial, to comprehend the tectonics .-) >Something to consider. I wonder if this is true for most >materials, like wood, metal. From: > >http://pygarg.ps.umist.ac.uk/ianson/paper_physics/Bending_Stiffness.html > >"Interesting point: did you know that, when you bend a >sheet of board until it becomes permanently damaged with a >crease, it always fails on the inside of the curve? This is >because the outside is being stretched but the inside is >being >compressed and the failure strain under compression is >lower than that for extension." --A HYDROGEN (sic; cracked methane) ECONOMY?... The Three Phases of Exploitation of the Protocols of the Elders of Kyoto: (FOSSILISATION [McCainanites?] (TM/sic))/ BORE/GUSH/NADIR "@" http://www.tarpley.net/aobook.htm. Http://www.tarpley.net/bushb.htm (partial contents, below): 17 -- THE ATTEMPTED COUP D'ETAT, 3/30/81 (87K) 18 -- IRAN-CONTRA (140K) 19 -- THE LEVERAGED BUYOUT MOB (67K) 20 -- THE PHONY WAR ON DRUGS (26K) 21 -- OMAHA (25K) 22 -- GEORGE "#9" TAKES THE PRESIDENCY (112K) 23 -- THE END OF HISTORY (168K) 24 -- THE NEW WORLD ORDER (255K) 25 -- THYROID STORM (139K) _________________________________________________________________ Join the world’s largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. http://www.hotmail.com ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 7 Oct 2002 20:06:12 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: quiet NG... Comments: To: synergeo@yahoogroups.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed let me restate the second paragraph, below. thus saith: > the only polyhedra that are made of all >of the same polygon, are known >as the Catalan solids. they are the duals >to the Archimedean ones, which unsurpizingly consist >of all identical vertices. > there are about a 100 of each. (regularity >of the facets or vertices makes for a subset >taht belongs to both categories, >a.k.a. the Platonic solids.) > >thus quoth: > > > Is there a geometric shape that is similar to a truncated icosahedron > >that > > > only uses ONE size of polyhedron (one geometric shape) ? > > > > > > Or do I *always* need at least two shapes? (pentagon and hexagon) >Which > >in > > > turn can be made up of triangles. > > > -- > > > somewherein@Africa > > > > > > > >--SIGHnS: The Edison Way in Menlo Park; >Homestead censors get orders from As*croft? >http://quincy4board.homestead.com/DeepPool.html > www.watergate.com/stories/watergate.asp-- > > >--A HYDROGEN (sic; cracked methane) ECONOMY?... >The Three Phases of Exploitation of the Protocols >of the Elders of Kyoto: >(FOSSILISATION [McCainanites?] (TM/sic))/ >BORE/GUSH/NADIR "@" http://www.tarpley.net/aobook.htm. >Http://www.tarpley.net/bushb.htm (partial contents, below): > 17 -- THE ATTEMPTED COUP D'ETAT, 3/30/81 (87K) > 18 -- IRAN-CONTRA (140K) > 19 -- THE LEVERAGED BUYOUT MOB (67K) > 20 -- THE PHONY WAR ON DRUGS (26K) > 21 -- OMAHA (25K) > 22 -- GEORGE "#9" TAKES THE PRESIDENCY (112K) > 23 -- THE END OF HISTORY (168K) > 24 -- THE NEW WORLD ORDER (255K) > 25 -- THYROID STORM (139K) > > >_________________________________________________________________ >MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: >http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx > > > >________________________________________________________________________ >________________________________________________________________________ > > > >Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ --SIGHnS: The Edison Way in Menlo Park; Homestead censors get orders from As*croft? http://quincy4board.homestead.com/DeepPool.html www.watergate.com/stories/watergate.asp-- --A HYDROGEN (sic; cracked methane) ECONOMY?... The Three Phases of Exploitation of the Protocols of the Elders of Kyoto: (FOSSILISATION [McCainanites?] (TM/sic))/ BORE/GUSH/NADIR "@" http://www.tarpley.net/aobook.htm. Http://www.tarpley.net/bushb.htm (partial contents, below): 17 -- THE ATTEMPTED COUP D'ETAT, 3/30/81 (87K) 18 -- IRAN-CONTRA (140K) 19 -- THE LEVERAGED BUYOUT MOB (67K) 20 -- THE PHONY WAR ON DRUGS (26K) 21 -- OMAHA (25K) 22 -- GEORGE "#9" TAKES THE PRESIDENCY (112K) 23 -- THE END OF HISTORY (168K) 24 -- THE NEW WORLD ORDER (255K) 25 -- THYROID STORM (139K) _________________________________________________________________ MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 7 Oct 2002 20:21:23 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: quiet NG... Comments: To: synergeo@yahooGroups.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed let me restate the second paragraph, below. regularity of facets AND vertices, makes the regular ("Platonic") shapes; only requiring regular facets OF ANY SORT, is the definition of the archmideans, which each consist of but one sort of vertex, which may not be regular (equi-angular [equigonal]), HENCE we can use the vertices to label the shapes, by the number of these N-way vertices (--asteron is my usage, as "icosa-gamma-asteron," gamma meaning "3-way"); the dual situation covers the catalans, each of which consists of one type of N-sided facet (--hedron, as "icosa-delta-hedron" -- these examples are duals. thus saith: > the only polyhedra that are made of all >of the same polygon, are known >as the Catalan solids. they are the duals >to the Archimedean ones, which unsurpizingly consist >of all identical vertices. > there are about a 100 of each. (regularity >of the facets or vertices makes for a subset >taht belongs to both categories, >a.k.a. the Platonic solids.) >--SIGHnS: The Edison Way in Menlo Park; >Homestead censors get orders from As*croft? >http://quincy4board.homestead.com/DeepPool.html > www.watergate.com/stories/watergate.asp-- _________________________________________________________________ Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 7 Oct 2002 21:02:32 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: failure strain Comments: To: synergeo@yahooGroups.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed the implied construction of "good" VEs (cuboctohedra or, in my terminology, dodeca-chi-astera) is just the same, as taking the outermost layers of a "watermanhedron," connecting the dots of the centers. can you do it by conjoining the square facets of the VEs, since these are flexible (like, to see if the whole thing will flex, a la Hoberman spheres) ?? the stuff about "we see that an hollow icosa (regular) can be packed onto, retaining its five-foldness for a certain (unspecified, as yet) number of layers, after which hexagonal (6-a-1) surface packings begin to appear and we find we should (if not "must") kowtow to Euler" is either nonsense, or kowowing too much to Euler! thus quoth: The question then arises, were one to 'force' a one-VE-thick IVM (a vast "plane" of IVM, VEs fused to VEs only in a planar manner) to 'wrap' itself as a closed sphere, how large in comparison to its construction "bricks" (spheres; unit-length --if stressed-- intervals) would that planar-sphere-wrapped have to be, to achieve at least a relatively stable latticelike regularity? --SIGHnS: The Edison Way in Menlo Park; Homestead censors get orders from As*croft? http://quincy4board.homestead.com/DeepPool.html www.watergate.com/stories/watergate.asp-- _________________________________________________________________ Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 8 Oct 2002 03:19:49 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: quiet NG... Comments: cc: synergeo@yahooGroups.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed From: QncyMI@netscape.net (Brian Quincy Hutchings) Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic Subject: Re: quiet NG... References: NNTP-Posting-Host: 199.172.105.79 I posted a reply, and it's not here, 3 or 4 hours, later; normal?... again: let me restate the second paragraph, below. regularity of facets AND vertices, makes the regular ("Platonic") shapes; only requiring regular facets OF ANY SORT, is the definition of the archmideans, which each consist of but one sort of vertex, which may not be regular (equi-angular [equigonal]), HENCE we can use the vertices to label the shapes, by the number of these N-way vertices (--asteron is my usage, as "icosa-gamma-asteron," gamma meaning "3-way"); the dual situation covers the catalans, each of which consists of one type of N-sided facet (--hedron, as "icosa-delta-hedron" -- these examples are duals. --SIGHnS: Edison Way, Menlo Park, 800/797-2958; Homestead censors get orders from As*croft? http://quincy4board.homestead.com/DeepPool.html www.watergate.com/stories/watergate.asp _________________________________________________________________ Join the world’s largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. http://www.hotmail.com ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 8 Oct 2002 17:51:31 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: quiet NG... Comments: cc: synergeo@yahooGroups.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed regarding http://groups.msn.com/BuckminsterFuller/shoebox.msnw?Page=7, can you just answer simple questions?... anyone can look at your God-am fool constructions, to see that you have not closed the putative spheres, since several of them are the same object, only one of which shows its incompleteness; and, if you tried, you'd see that it ain't easy -- firstly in terms of "how will **** shingle." the whole idea of taking monsieur Petit's silly idea of faux-conformality -- you could ASK HIM, as to his misapplication of his expertise in fluiddynamics -- and trying to prove it, USING UNE METHODE CRAFTIQUE DU PAPIER MACHE, is nuts, because papier mache is about as close to rubber-sheets (not neccesarily "geometry of") as you can get, til it dries. your bizarre ideal of n-vertons should really be beneath our contempt, but it's terribly understandable, given an "education via Rugrat Buckafka Fullofit," not like his own, at all (except for the part about being trapped in the Marina, til you learn how to navigate [*]). * try my One-day GPS Workshop: 100 Folk in White Sheets & Hoods Can Make a Simple Crapcircle! go hump a consenting dome, because *I* have dyscussed it; you've just said, Duh! thus quoth: Brian- You and I have discussed this structure for over a year now. There is no way you should be saying that this construction is in some way not fully understood by you. There is nothing to it. thus saith: >sorry, but I was confuzed by your statement, >"uses only one size element, but >every edge is a different length," >that ameliorates your 'methode craftique' and, >since you left no notes on your methode, >any one who stumbles into your site will >be at least as confuzed as I was. >(but, you don't have to trim the excess off >o'the struts, unless you want >to, say, apply glazing!) > your models clearly do not close-up, because >you didn't bother to do that, because to try >to do so "without any maths" is to fail, >insofar as you have ignored every thing >that's been said in critique of them. on the other hand, >that is the best way to knowledge! > unless your joints are flexible, >you won't be able to cram the model to closure, >except by occaisional luck -- >all-praise the goddess, Fortuna! http://groups.msn.com/BuckminsterFuller/shoebox.msnw?Page=7 --SIGHnS: Edison Way, Menlo Park, 800/797-2958; Homestead censors get orders from As*croft? http://quincy4board.homestead.com/DeepPool.html www.watergate.com/stories/watergate.asp _________________________________________________________________ MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 8 Oct 2002 11:01:13 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Leifur Thor Subject: why is no one talking about Bush's attempt to gain power? In-Reply-To: Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit I think Bucky would be saying, and doing quite a bit about it. I can't help thinking about the world game and world resources, and international respect of law. Leifur ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 8 Oct 2002 13:19:21 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Tony Kalenak Subject: Re: why is no one talking about Bush's attempt to gain power? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" IMHO: Bush is the photogenic (albeit inarticulate) figurehead of the military/industrial complex, that Eisenhower warned us about. Chaney ties to Halliburton/Brown & Root (the sole provided of support services to the military belie this connection. Their motto could well be "War is good for business, so let's get on with it and re-build our economy " Oh and along the way it gives them the excuse to undermine the UN. -----Original Message----- From: Leifur Thor [mailto:lthor@EARTHLINK.NET] Sent: Tuesday, October 08, 2002 12:01 PM To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU Subject: why is no one talking about Bush's attempt to gain power? I think Bucky would be saying, and doing quite a bit about it. I can't help thinking about the world game and world resources, and international respect of law. Leifur ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 8 Oct 2002 12:15:44 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Leifur Thor Subject: Re: why is no one talking about Bush's attempt to gain power? In-Reply-To: <2F175DC588EFD211B37C0060088FAC39313835@pscserver3> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Thanks Tony for some facts to bring cause for consern. Leifur > From: Tony Kalenak > Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works > > Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic > Date: Tue, 8 Oct 2002 13:19:21 -0500 > To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > Subject: Re: why is no one talking about Bush's attempt to gain power? > > IMHO: > Bush is the photogenic (albeit inarticulate) figurehead of the > military/industrial complex, that Eisenhower warned us about. > Chaney ties to Halliburton/Brown & Root (the sole provided of support > services to the military belie this connection. > Their motto could well be "War is good for business, so let's get on with it > and re-build our economy " > > Oh and along the way it gives them the excuse to undermine the UN. > > -----Original Message----- > From: Leifur Thor [mailto:lthor@EARTHLINK.NET] > Sent: Tuesday, October 08, 2002 12:01 PM > To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > Subject: why is no one talking about Bush's attempt to gain power? > > I think Bucky would be saying, and doing quite a bit about it. > > I can't help thinking about the world game and world resources, and > international respect of law. > > Leifur ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 8 Oct 2002 14:34:24 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Tony Kalenak Subject: Re: why is no one talking about Bush's attempt to gain power? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" An interesting related article on The Cheney - Military/industrial connection >From Texas Monthly.... http://www.texasmonthly.com/mag/issues/2002-10-01/feature3.php -----Original Message----- From: Leifur Thor [mailto:lthor@EARTHLINK.NET] Sent: Tuesday, October 08, 2002 1:16 PM To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU Subject: Re: why is no one talking about Bush's attempt to gain power? Thanks Tony for some facts to bring cause for consern. Leifur > From: Tony Kalenak > Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works > > Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic > Date: Tue, 8 Oct 2002 13:19:21 -0500 > To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > Subject: Re: why is no one talking about Bush's attempt to gain power? > > IMHO: > Bush is the photogenic (albeit inarticulate) figurehead of the > military/industrial complex, that Eisenhower warned us about. > Chaney ties to Halliburton/Brown & Root (the sole provided of support > services to the military belie this connection. > Their motto could well be "War is good for business, so let's get on with it > and re-build our economy " > > Oh and along the way it gives them the excuse to undermine the UN. > > -----Original Message----- > From: Leifur Thor [mailto:lthor@EARTHLINK.NET] > Sent: Tuesday, October 08, 2002 12:01 PM > To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > Subject: why is no one talking about Bush's attempt to gain power? > > I think Bucky would be saying, and doing quite a bit about it. > > I can't help thinking about the world game and world resources, and > international respect of law. > > Leifur ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 8 Oct 2002 14:08:47 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Leifur Thor Subject: Re: why is no one talking about Bush's attempt to gain power? In-Reply-To: <2F175DC588EFD211B37C0060088FAC39313838@pscserver3> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Seems to paint him as victim. Leifur > From: Tony Kalenak > Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works > > Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic > Date: Tue, 8 Oct 2002 14:34:24 -0500 > To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > Subject: Re: why is no one talking about Bush's attempt to gain power? > > An interesting related article on The Cheney - Military/industrial > connection > From Texas Monthly.... > http://www.texasmonthly.com/mag/issues/2002-10-01/feature3.php > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Leifur Thor [mailto:lthor@EARTHLINK.NET] > Sent: Tuesday, October 08, 2002 1:16 PM > To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > Subject: Re: why is no one talking about Bush's attempt to gain > power? > > Thanks Tony for some facts to bring cause for consern. > > Leifur > >> From: Tony Kalenak >> Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works >> >> Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic >> Date: Tue, 8 Oct 2002 13:19:21 -0500 >> To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU >> Subject: Re: why is no one talking about Bush's attempt to gain power? >> >> IMHO: >> Bush is the photogenic (albeit inarticulate) figurehead of the >> military/industrial complex, that Eisenhower warned us about. >> Chaney ties to Halliburton/Brown & Root (the sole provided of support >> services to the military belie this connection. >> Their motto could well be "War is good for business, so let's get on with > it >> and re-build our economy " >> >> Oh and along the way it gives them the excuse to undermine the UN. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Leifur Thor [mailto:lthor@EARTHLINK.NET] >> Sent: Tuesday, October 08, 2002 12:01 PM >> To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU >> Subject: why is no one talking about Bush's attempt to gain power? >> >> I think Bucky would be saying, and doing quite a bit about it. >> >> I can't help thinking about the world game and world resources, and >> international respect of law. >> >> Leifur ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 8 Oct 2002 16:50:18 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Tony Kalenak Subject: Re: why is no one talking about Bush's attempt to gain power? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" True, It is not a damning indictment of Cheney. And it does portray him as a (very rich) victim of circumstance and a mediocre corporate performer. But, I would say that as one of a group prone to secretive governmental meetings and having had a history with the industry/ government connection, It is not a great leap to assume/imagine slippery/slimy tentacles throughout the white house. A little more evidence of a connection: http://www.corpwatch.org/issues/PID.jsp?articleid=2469 -----Original Message----- From: Leifur Thor [mailto:lthor@EARTHLINK.NET] Sent: Tuesday, October 08, 2002 3:09 PM To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU Subject: Re: why is no one talking about Bush's attempt to gain power? Seems to paint him as victim. Leifur > From: Tony Kalenak > Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works > > Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic > Date: Tue, 8 Oct 2002 14:34:24 -0500 > To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > Subject: Re: why is no one talking about Bush's attempt to gain power? > > An interesting related article on The Cheney - Military/industrial > connection > From Texas Monthly.... > http://www.texasmonthly.com/mag/issues/2002-10-01/feature3.php > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Leifur Thor [mailto:lthor@EARTHLINK.NET] > Sent: Tuesday, October 08, 2002 1:16 PM > To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > Subject: Re: why is no one talking about Bush's attempt to gain > power? > > Thanks Tony for some facts to bring cause for consern. > > Leifur > >> From: Tony Kalenak >> Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works >> >> Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic >> Date: Tue, 8 Oct 2002 13:19:21 -0500 >> To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU >> Subject: Re: why is no one talking about Bush's attempt to gain power? >> >> IMHO: >> Bush is the photogenic (albeit inarticulate) figurehead of the >> military/industrial complex, that Eisenhower warned us about. >> Chaney ties to Halliburton/Brown & Root (the sole provided of support >> services to the military belie this connection. >> Their motto could well be "War is good for business, so let's get on with > it >> and re-build our economy " >> >> Oh and along the way it gives them the excuse to undermine the UN. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Leifur Thor [mailto:lthor@EARTHLINK.NET] >> Sent: Tuesday, October 08, 2002 12:01 PM >> To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU >> Subject: why is no one talking about Bush's attempt to gain power? >> >> I think Bucky would be saying, and doing quite a bit about it. >> >> I can't help thinking about the world game and world resources, and >> international respect of law. >> >> Leifur ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 8 Oct 2002 16:58:22 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Tony Kalenak Subject: Re: why is no one talking about Bush's attempt to gain power? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" http://www.corpwatch.org/issues/PID.jsp?articleid=2471 Here is a more concise analysis . -----Original Message----- From: Leifur Thor [mailto:lthor@EARTHLINK.NET] Sent: Tuesday, October 08, 2002 3:09 PM To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU Subject: Re: why is no one talking about Bush's attempt to gain power? Seems to paint him as victim. Leifur > From: Tony Kalenak > Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works > > Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic > Date: Tue, 8 Oct 2002 14:34:24 -0500 > To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > Subject: Re: why is no one talking about Bush's attempt to gain power? > > An interesting related article on The Cheney - Military/industrial > connection > From Texas Monthly.... > http://www.texasmonthly.com/mag/issues/2002-10-01/feature3.php > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Leifur Thor [mailto:lthor@EARTHLINK.NET] > Sent: Tuesday, October 08, 2002 1:16 PM > To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > Subject: Re: why is no one talking about Bush's attempt to gain > power? > > Thanks Tony for some facts to bring cause for consern. > > Leifur > >> From: Tony Kalenak >> Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works >> >> Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic >> Date: Tue, 8 Oct 2002 13:19:21 -0500 >> To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU >> Subject: Re: why is no one talking about Bush's attempt to gain power? >> >> IMHO: >> Bush is the photogenic (albeit inarticulate) figurehead of the >> military/industrial complex, that Eisenhower warned us about. >> Chaney ties to Halliburton/Brown & Root (the sole provided of support >> services to the military belie this connection. >> Their motto could well be "War is good for business, so let's get on with > it >> and re-build our economy " >> >> Oh and along the way it gives them the excuse to undermine the UN. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Leifur Thor [mailto:lthor@EARTHLINK.NET] >> Sent: Tuesday, October 08, 2002 12:01 PM >> To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU >> Subject: why is no one talking about Bush's attempt to gain power? >> >> I think Bucky would be saying, and doing quite a bit about it. >> >> I can't help thinking about the world game and world resources, and >> international respect of law. >> >> Leifur ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 8 Oct 2002 16:34:12 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Leifur Thor Subject: Re: why is no one talking about Bush's attempt to gain power? In-Reply-To: <2F175DC588EFD211B37C0060088FAC3931383D@pscserver3> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit thanks for the info Tony Leifur > From: Tony Kalenak > Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works > > Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic > Date: Tue, 8 Oct 2002 16:58:22 -0500 > To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > Subject: Re: why is no one talking about Bush's attempt to gain power? > > http://www.corpwatch.org/issues/PID.jsp?articleid=2471 > > Here is a more concise analysis . > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Leifur Thor [mailto:lthor@EARTHLINK.NET] > Sent: Tuesday, October 08, 2002 3:09 PM > To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > Subject: Re: why is no one talking about Bush's attempt to gain > power? > > Seems to paint him as victim. > > Leifur > >> From: Tony Kalenak >> Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works >> >> Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic >> Date: Tue, 8 Oct 2002 14:34:24 -0500 >> To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU >> Subject: Re: why is no one talking about Bush's attempt to gain power? >> >> An interesting related article on The Cheney - Military/industrial >> connection >> From Texas Monthly.... >> http://www.texasmonthly.com/mag/issues/2002-10-01/feature3.php >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Leifur Thor [mailto:lthor@EARTHLINK.NET] >> Sent: Tuesday, October 08, 2002 1:16 PM >> To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU >> Subject: Re: why is no one talking about Bush's attempt to gain >> power? >> >> Thanks Tony for some facts to bring cause for consern. >> >> Leifur >> >>> From: Tony Kalenak >>> Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works >>> >>> Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic >>> Date: Tue, 8 Oct 2002 13:19:21 -0500 >>> To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU >>> Subject: Re: why is no one talking about Bush's attempt to gain power? >>> >>> IMHO: >>> Bush is the photogenic (albeit inarticulate) figurehead of the >>> military/industrial complex, that Eisenhower warned us about. >>> Chaney ties to Halliburton/Brown & Root (the sole provided of support >>> services to the military belie this connection. >>> Their motto could well be "War is good for business, so let's get on with >> it >>> and re-build our economy " >>> >>> Oh and along the way it gives them the excuse to undermine the UN. >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: Leifur Thor [mailto:lthor@EARTHLINK.NET] >>> Sent: Tuesday, October 08, 2002 12:01 PM >>> To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU >>> Subject: why is no one talking about Bush's attempt to gain power? >>> >>> I think Bucky would be saying, and doing quite a bit about it. >>> >>> I can't help thinking about the world game and world resources, and >>> international respect of law. >>> >>> Leifur ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 9 Oct 2002 10:49:14 -0400 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Steve Miller Subject: [Fwd: I found the peom] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit This poem is composed entirely of actual quotes from George W. Bush. The quotes have been arranged for aesthetic presentation by Washington Post writer Richard Thompson. Hope you enjoy it, great to talk with both of you yesterday. MAKE THE PIE HIGHER by George W. Bush I think we all agree, the past is over. This is still a dangerous world. It's a world of madmen and uncertainty and potential mental losses. Rarely is the question asked Is our children learning? Will the highways of the Internet become more few? How many hands have I shaked? They misunderestimate me. I am a pitbull on the pantleg of opportunity. I know that the human being and the fish can coexist. Families is where our nation finds hope, where our wings take dream. Put food on your family! Knock down the tollbooth! Vulcanize society! Make the pie higher! Make the pie higher! -- Formactive: http://www.sover.net/~triorbtl/ ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 9 Oct 2002 09:40:07 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Leifur Thor Subject: Re: [Fwd: I found the peom] In-Reply-To: <3DA441EA.7060803@sover.net> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit that's great! Leifur > From: Steve Miller > Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works > > Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic > Date: Wed, 9 Oct 2002 10:49:14 -0400 > To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > Subject: [Fwd: I found the peom] > > This poem is composed entirely of actual quotes from George W. Bush. The > quotes have been arranged for aesthetic presentation by Washington Post > writer Richard Thompson. Hope you enjoy it, great to talk with both of you > yesterday. > > > > MAKE THE PIE HIGHER > by George W. Bush > > I think we all agree, the past is over. > This is still a dangerous world. > It's a world of madmen and uncertainty > and potential mental losses. > > Rarely is the question asked > > Is our children learning? > Will the highways of the Internet become more few? > > How many hands have I shaked? > > They misunderestimate me. > I am a pitbull on the pantleg of opportunity. > I know that the human being and the fish can coexist. > Families is where our nation finds hope, where > our wings take dream. > > Put food on your family! > > Knock down the tollbooth! > Vulcanize society! > Make the pie higher! Make the pie higher! > > > -- > Formactive: > http://www.sover.net/~triorbtl/ ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 9 Oct 2002 20:37:29 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Organization: (Retired) Subject: Re: Question about a Buckminster Fuller Master Index entry Comments: To: Jonathan Massey MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Dear Mr Massey, I included the book because it was in a list of books in Fuller's library (if I remember right). I can see that I need to flesh out that entry. From Amazon.com I found a pic of the cover and the following info: Title: The Beautiful Necessity: Seven Essays on Theosophy and Architecture Author: Claude Bragdon Publisher: Kessinger Publishing Co City? Country? Year: 1997 The Amazon page has a brief description of the book and a Table of Contents. Do you happen to know what city Mr Bragdon lived in and what country? Thanks for bringing that entry to my attention. I will update it probably in January. ============================== Joe S Moore joe_s_moore@hotmail.com http://buckminster.info <== NEW Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute ============================= ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jonathan Massey" To: Sent: Wednesday, October 09, 2002 8:07 AM Subject: Question about a Buckminster Fuller Master Index entry > Joe-- > Congratulations on all the work that must have goine into building the > B. F. Virtual Institute! > Could you help me make sense of an entry in the Master Index? There's an > entry under "Bragdon" at http://www.buckminster.info//Index/Bo-Brah.htm > for Claude Bragdon's book "The Beautiful Necessity." What does the entry > mean? I know Bragdon's book (and could supply information on it for the > index if it would help you), but I'm not sure what the index entry > refers to. Fuller's library? Something else? Any information > appreciated. > Thanks, > --Jonathan Massey > > -- > Jonathan Massey > Syracuse University School of Architecture > email: jmassey@syr.edu > mail: 103 Slocum Hall, Syracuse, NY 13244-1250 > telephone: (315) 443-5094 > fax: (315) 443-5082 > ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 10 Oct 2002 23:11:12 -0400 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Chris Fearnley Organization: Center for Syntropic Operations Subject: Papers presented to a Synergetics Powwow near Washington DC Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=unknown-8bit Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Greetings, I presented two short papers at a Synergetics powwow in the Washinton DC area on October 6: The Search for an Algebra or Calculus for Synergetics Synergetics and Linux I would especially like feedback about these papers as I hope to improve them moving forward. -- The lesson of history is that our firmest convictions are not to be asserted dogmatically; in fact they should be most suspect; they mark not our conquests but our limitations and our bounds. -- Morris Kline Christopher J. Fearnley | Linux/Internet/Web Consulting Chris@CJFearnley.com | Design Science Revolutionary http://www.CJFearnley.com | Explorer in Universe "Dare to be Naïve" -- Bucky Fuller ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 11 Oct 2002 03:37:12 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: quiet NG... Comments: cc: synergeo@yahooGroups.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Ah, so; what is the sound of one hand cramping? My only advice to you at this time, thou excellent devotee of Rajneesh (Asshopper), is to FOCUS UPON THE NAVEL-POINT, but without bending over too far (especially if caught in any sort of monastery (Tibetan Godking Worhsip e.g.)) and without looking "down." Keepest thine eyes upon the horizon. tank you berry much! Wait. *Fait le pauvre Petit un faveur, et* ask him to justify his bogus, Cone-headed endeavor; they said that they were from France, as well! A Wanabi Wolframite said this; no kidding: http://mathworld.wolfram.com/ConformalProjection.html "A map projection which is a conformal mapping, i.e., one for which local (infinitesimal) angles on a sphere are mapped to the same angles in the projection. On maps of an entire sphere, however, there are usually singular points at which local angles are distorted." I don't think the apperence of a navel point or dimple or singularity excludes this construction from being conformal. --SIGHnS: Edison Way, Menlo Park, 800/797-2958; Homestead censors get orders from As*croft? http://quincy4board.homestead.com/DeepPool.html www.watergate.com/stories/watergate.asp _________________________________________________________________ MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 11 Oct 2002 03:38:06 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: Notes in passing, 1 Comments: cc: synergeo@yahooGroups.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Congratulation -- I want to shake your virtual hand. No; there's no virtual buzzer in mine, on second thought, but I have to wonder about the efficacy of your rpior experiments with marbles; a-hem! Seriously, what is the "always-and-only twelveness of the proton," according to John? http://tetrahedraverse.com/temp/stelicosa32a.jpg It's this kind of multiple potential "regularities" that have been intriguing me since early on, but I've not tried to follow the chain of layers outward before. --A HYDROGEN (sic; cracked methane) ECONOMY?... The Three Phases of Exploitation of the Protocols of the Elders of Kyoto: (FOSSILISATION [McCainanites?] (TM/sic))/ BORE/GUSH/NADIR "@" http://www.tarpley.net/aobook.htm. Http://www.tarpley.net/bushb.htm (partial contents, below): 17 -- THE ATTEMPTED COUP D'ETAT, 3/30/81 (87K) 18 -- IRAN-CONTRA (140K) 19 -- THE LEVERAGED BUYOUT MOB (67K) 20 -- THE PHONY WAR ON DRUGS (26K) 21 -- OMAHA (25K) 22 -- GEORGE "#9" TAKES THE PRESIDENCY (112K) 23 -- THE END OF HISTORY (168K) 24 -- THE NEW WORLD ORDER (255K) 25 -- THYROID STORM (139K) _________________________________________________________________ Join the world’s largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. http://www.hotmail.com ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 11 Oct 2002 03:50:17 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: Tverse as a Waterman Comments: To: synergeo@yahoogroups.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Mr. Ace headed in the proper direction. You have to use elementary combinatorics, which involves a factorial or two (not powering). God, thank Pascal and his Wager! Thus quoth: >( http://tetrahedraverse.com/temp/stelicosa32.gif >for reference; sorry: 107kb 640x480x256) > >Next is where it gets interesting, if my math is OK (please check me for >stupidity bugs?): > >This 32-sphere, nucleated-faces pentagonal dodecahedron has twelve >pentagonal depressions consisting of five three-sphere pockets each. >(See above URL) >None of these can hold more than one sphere (tight), thus, there are five >possible pockets for a sphere per each face. >Now, if one penta-pocket has a sphere in, say, triangle "1", and so do all >the others, that's one configuration for 44 Tverse-packed spheres. >If we move _one_ sphere (into, say, triangle "2"), that's a second >configuration for the 44. --SIGHnS: Edison Way, Menlo Park, 800/797-2958; Homestead censors get orders from As*croft? http://quincy4board.homestead.com/DeepPool.html www.watergate.com/stories/watergate.asp _________________________________________________________________ MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 11 Oct 2002 03:57:58 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: quiet NG... Comments: cc: synergeo@yahooGroups.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Actually, if you tried your hare-brained scheme out with actual, thin rubber sheets, you'd immediately see what cannot be with the "conformality" of papier-mache' -- ole'! Thus saith: firstly in terms of "how will **** shingle." the whole idea of taking monsieur Petit's silly idea of faux-conformality -- you could ASK HIM, as to his misapplication of his expertise in fluiddynamics -- and trying to prove it, USING UNE METHODE CRAFTIQUE DU PAPIER MACHE, is nuts, because papier mache is about as close to rubber-sheets (not neccesarily "geometry of") as you can get, til it dries. your bizarre ideal of n-vertons should really be regarding http://groups.msn.com/BuckminsterFuller/shoebox.msnw?Page=7, --A HYDROGEN (sic; cracked methane) ECONOMY?... The Three Phases of Exploitation of the Protocols of the Elders of Kyoto: (FOSSILISATION [McCainanites?] (TM/sic))/ BORE/GUSH/NADIR "@" http://www.tarpley.net/aobook.htm. Http://www.tarpley.net/bushb.htm (partial contents, below): 17 -- THE ATTEMPTED COUP D'ETAT, 3/30/81 (87K) 18 -- IRAN-CONTRA (140K) 19 -- THE LEVERAGED BUYOUT MOB (67K) 20 -- THE PHONY WAR ON DRUGS (26K) 21 -- OMAHA (25K) 22 -- GEORGE "#9" TAKES THE PRESIDENCY (112K) 23 -- THE END OF HISTORY (168K) 24 -- THE NEW WORLD ORDER (255K) 25 -- THYROID STORM (139K) _________________________________________________________________ Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 10 Oct 2002 21:16:41 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Leifur Thor Subject: Re: Papers presented to a Synergetics Powwow near Washington DC In-Reply-To: <20021011031111.GA16771@linux00.LinuxForce.net> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Thanks for the info Chris, I and others I'm sure look forward to reading it= . Leifur > From: Chris Fearnley > Organization: Center for Syntropic Operations > Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works > > Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic > Date: Thu, 10 Oct 2002 23:11:12 -0400 > To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > Subject: Papers presented to a Synergetics Powwow near Washington DC >=20 > Greetings, >=20 > I presented two short papers at a Synergetics powwow in the Washinton > DC area on October 6: >=20 > The Search > for an Algebra or Calculus for Synergetics > Synergetics > and Linux >=20 > I would especially like feedback about these papers as I hope to improve > them moving forward. >=20 > -- > The lesson of history is that our firmest convictions are not to be > asserted dogmatically; in fact they should be most suspect; they mark > not our conquests but our limitations and our bounds. -- Morris Kline >=20 > Christopher J. Fearnley | Linux/Internet/Web Consulting > Chris@CJFearnley.com | Design Science Revolutionary > http://www.CJFearnley.com | Explorer in Universe > "Dare to be Na=EFve" -- Bucky Fuller ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 11 Oct 2002 15:18:40 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Organization: (Retired) Subject: Re: Reference for "Bees can't fly." Comments: To: nick pine MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Nick! I saw your post a few days ago & tried to find what you are looking for = but to no avail (damn). My RBF Master Index is a compilation of all the = published indexes in the back of various Bucky-books plus items I've = added manually. Unfortunately, there are still a lot of Bucky-books = with no indexes, and none of the articles by or about him have been = indexed either. So it makes answering questions like yours very = difficult. Unless someone just happens to remember, it's almost = impossible to find. I vaguely remember what you are referring to, but = who knows where! Have you searched the online Bucky texts at BFI? You might just get = lucky; see: Inventory of World Resources = http://209.196.135.250/worlddesign/index.htm Education Automation http://209.196.135.250/education_automation.htm Grunch of Giants http://209.196.135.250/education_automation.htm Synergetics http://www.rwgrayprojects.com/synergetics/synergetics.html Everything I Know http://209.196.135.250/everything_i_know.htm 5 articles by RBF http://209.196.135.250/option.htm (scroll to "Articles = by RBF" (BFI's search engine doesn't work properly. It returns hits for "being" = or "beer" when a search for "bee" is done.) =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D Joe S Moore joe_s_moore@hotmail.com http://buckminster.info <=3D=3D NEW Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D ----- Original Message -----=20 From: nick pine=20 To: joe_s_moore@hotmail.com=20 Sent: Friday, October 11, 2002 9:44 AM Subject: Reference for "Bees can't fly." Greetings Joe, I'm writing an article and looking for a specific reference... Would you know where and when and how (an exact quote) Bucky wrote that he learned in school that bees can't fly? Thanks, Nick Pine ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 11 Oct 2002 23:25:44 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: why is no one talking about Bush's attempt to gain power? Comments: cc: synergeo@yahooGroups.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed see my new sigfile, below, on D*ck (Homestead's relented, til the end of October). because I'm such a good larouchiac, I know what the media hide, when they talk about H*l*b*rt*n's role in the asbestos fakes, and they never mention Dresser Industries' role inthe making of Sir George, TOG (the Original George). >But, I would say that as one of a group prone to secretive governmental >meetings and having had a history with the industry/ government connection, >http://www.corpwatch.org/issues/PID.jsp?articleid=2469 > > http://www.texasmonthly.com/mag/issues/2002-10-01/feature3.php --SIGHnS: D*ck Ch*n*y's 2 focusgroups planned for this "clash o'civs," before 911! http://quincy4board.homestead.com/DeepPool.html www.larouchepub.com _________________________________________________________________ MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 11 Oct 2002 23:30:57 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: why is no one talking about Bush's attempt to gain power? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed when Eisenhower made the famous statement --though it should be quoted at more length-- the 'WAND' Corp. was already doing it, as a de-facto (and probably the largest) division of Rockefeller's PI network (he had ditched his controlling interest in McDonnell). see the "American Almanac" articles fo'mo'. >An interesting related article on The Cheney - Military/industrial >connection >From Texas Monthly.... >http://www.texasmonthly.com/mag/issues/2002-10-01/feature3.php --A HYDROGEN (sic; cracked methane) ECONOMY?... The Three Phases of Exploitation of the Protocols of the Elders of Kyoto: (FOSSILISATION [McCainanites?] (TM/sic))/ BORE/GUSH/NADIR "@" http://www.tarpley.net/aobook.htm. Http://www.tarpley.net/bushb.htm (partial contents, below): 17 -- THE ATTEMPTED COUP D'ETAT, 3/30/81 (87K) 18 -- IRAN-CONTRA (140K) 19 -- THE LEVERAGED BUYOUT MOB (67K) 20 -- THE PHONY WAR ON DRUGS (26K) 21 -- OMAHA (25K) 22 -- GEORGE "#9" TAKES THE PRESIDENCY (112K) 23 -- THE END OF HISTORY (168K) 24 -- THE NEW WORLD ORDER (255K) 25 -- THYROID STORM (139K) _________________________________________________________________ Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 11 Oct 2002 23:49:31 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: Papers presented to a Synergetics Powwow near Washington DC Comments: cc: synergeo@yahooGroups.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed why do folks take Bucky's assertions on such faith?... oh, I know; he had a "no-switchboards only-direct Interface with G*d" (sik; there are no vowels in old-time Hebrew .-) so, have you digested any of my paper, "Cosmometrical Constance?" more to the point, were you able to "access" it, or not?... anyway, his whole spiel on pi or even irrationals --which he used in abundance without note-- is silly, primarily because they *are* rations. we're already onto 4D and beyond in strings (although the mindless application of Time to graph-paper is a bother, engineers just call it, phase-space), so try to deal with that. yes, try to deal with a 4D space (sans time, that is to say, freeze-frame), but try *not* to take a detour through Flatland, while you're at it! now, as for Linux, FSF seems to have gone-along with the project of making a giant kludge of a kernel, in place of the original GNU HURD spec; alas!... perhaps, only a kludge is possible in 3 dimensions (ha-ha). >The Search > for an Algebra or Calculus for Synergetics >Synergetics > and Linux --SIGHnS: D*ck Ch*n*y's 2 focusgroups planned for this "clash o'civs," before 911! http://quincy4board.homestead.com/DeepPool.html www.larouchepub.com _________________________________________________________________ MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 11 Oct 2002 23:51:16 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: Papers presented to a Synergetics Powwow near Washington DC Comments: cc: synergeo@yahooGroups.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed oops; you missed a couple of his absolute best. back to The Book, _S_, boys & girls! why do folks take Bucky's assertions on such faith?... oh, I know; he had a "no-switchboards only-direct Interface with G*d" (sik; there are no vowels in old-time Hebrew .-) so, have you digested any of my paper, "Cosmometrical Constance?" more to the point, were you able to "access" it, or not?... anyway, his whole spiel on pi or even irrationals --which he used in abundance without note-- is silly, primarily because they *are* rations. we're already onto 4D and beyond in strings (although the mindless application of Time to graph-paper is a bother, engineers just call it, phase-space), so try to deal with that. yes, try to deal with a 4D space (sans time, that is to say, freeze-frame), but try *not* to take a detour through Flatland, while you're at it! now, as for Linux, FSF seems to have gone-along with the project of making a giant kludge of a kernel, in place of the original GNU HURD spec; alas!... perhaps, only a kludge is possible in 3 dimensions (ha-ha). >The Search > for an Algebra or Calculus for Synergetics >Synergetics > and Linux --SIGHnS: D*ck Ch*n*y's 2 focusgroups planned for this "clash o'civs," before 911! http://quincy4board.homestead.com/DeepPool.html www.larouchepub.com _________________________________________________________________ Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 11 Oct 2002 20:21:25 -0400 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: David Watkins Subject: Re: Reference for "Bees can't fly." MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT I don't know of any Bucky reference to "Bees can't fly" , but have heard the story elsewhere. As I heard the story, some engineers had done an analysis and were able to prove that bees could not fly. One of the assumptions in their argument was that the motion of the bees wings were controlled by ongoing signals from the bee's brain. Someone later determined that this is not the case. The circuitry to maintain wing motion is localized in the wing area. Localized circuitry allows for more rapid wing motion as the control signals have less distance to travel. Replace this one faulty assumption and the calculation supports what we know to be the case, bees can fly. I can imagine that this story would have amused Bucky and that if he heard it he would have said something about it at one time or another. Take care, Dave Watkins http://mywebpages.comcast.net/daviwat/ ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 12 Oct 2002 13:27:23 -0400 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Chris Fearnley Organization: Center for Syntropic Operations Subject: Re: Papers presented to a Synergetics Powwow near Washington DC In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=unknown-8bit Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit On Fri, Oct 11, 2002 at 11:49:31PM +0000, Quincy Quincy Quincy wrote: > why do folks take Bucky's assertions on such faith?... oh, I don't. I'm looking for the truth about how Universe works. I am trying to find a way to reconcile the fact that human mind has access to principles that are lucidly clear (e.g., the jitterbug transformation) yet when we try to analyze (or model with the computer) such clear, lucid phenomena, Synergeticists resort to traditional, mathematical methodologies (e.g., http://www.rwgrayprojects.com/rbfnotes/polyhed/jitterbug/jbCurve.html). This is a philosophical question: how does Nature coordinate? How can we represent Nature's coordination mathematically (but in a more "synergetic" way than the approach of traditional mathematical analysis)? -- The lesson of history is that our firmest convictions are not to be asserted dogmatically; in fact they should be most suspect; they mark not our conquests but our limitations and our bounds. -- Morris Kline Christopher J. Fearnley | Linux/Internet/Web Consulting Chris@CJFearnley.com | Design Science Revolutionary http://www.CJFearnley.com | Explorer in Universe "Dare to be Naïve" -- Bucky Fuller ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 12 Oct 2002 20:45:50 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: Reference for "Bees can't fly." Comments: cc: synergeo@yahooGroups.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed that's nothing compared to *Nude Scientist*. therein, they recently had reviewed a notion, totally uncritically as to hypotheses, that Bernoulli's principle couldn't work, as applied to aerodynamics; one has to reformulate in terms of ballistics of particles of air!... of course, one *can* do so, but to always have to kow-tow to the Newtonian Qabbalists, or their latter-day counterpart, the Wolframites, is strictly a British programme. >and were able to prove that bees could not fly. One of the assumptions in >their argument was that the motion of the bees wings were controlled by >ongoing signals from the bee's brain. Someone later determined that >http://mywebpages.comcast.net/daviwat/ --SIGHnS: D*ck Ch*n*y's 2 focusgroups planned for this "clash o'civs," in '90! http://quincy4board.homestead.com/DeepPool.html www.larouchepub.com _________________________________________________________________ MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 12 Oct 2002 20:56:06 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: Papers presented to a Synergetics Powwow near Washington DC Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed that's not the reason that I see. Bucky's stuff is always- and-only a pure subset of synthetic "euclidean" geometry, with a lot of 4D rhetoric thrown into the smoothee, some of which may certainly pan-out (is there gold flakes in them-thar smoothies ?-) >I don't. I'm looking for the truth about how Universe works. > >I am trying to find a way to reconcile the fact that human >mind has access to principles that are lucidly clear (e.g., the >jitterbug transformation) yet when we try to analyze (or model >with the computer) such clear, lucid phenomena, Synergeticists >resort to traditional, mathematical methodologies (e.g., >http://www.rwgrayprojects.com/rbfnotes/polyhed/jitterbug/jbCurve.html). > >This is a philosophical question: how does Nature coordinate? How can we >represent Nature's coordination mathematically (but in a more "synergetic" >way than the approach of traditional mathematical analysis)? >http://www.CJFearnley.com | Explorer in Universe --A HYDROGEN (sic; cracked methane) ECONOMY?... The Three Phases of Exploitation of the Protocols of the Elders of Kyoto: (FOSSILISATION [McCainanites?] (TM/sic))/ BORE/GUSH/NADIR "@" http://www.tarpley.net/aobook.htm. Http://www.tarpley.net/bushb.htm (partial contents, below): 17 -- THE ATTEMPTED COUP D'ETAT, 3/30/81 (87K) 18 -- IRAN-CONTRA (140K) 19 -- THE LEVERAGED BUYOUT MOB (67K) 20 -- THE PHONY WAR ON DRUGS (26K) 21 -- OMAHA (25K) 22 -- GEORGE "#9" TAKES THE PRESIDENCY (112K) 23 -- THE END OF HISTORY (168K) 24 -- THE NEW WORLD ORDER (255K) 25 -- THYROID STORM (139K) _________________________________________________________________ MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 12 Oct 2002 21:17:10 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: Tverse as a Waterman Comments: To: synergeo@yahoogroups.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed it's very simple to do the combinatorics, to see how the factorials are formulated: in your first 5-pocket socket, you have 1 choice, in the next 2 choices ... no, wait; I may have to look it up. I did it, before, to find the "sevenness" of the icosahedral group. thus quoth: > > http://mathworld.wolfram.com/IcosahedralGroup.html > >(ouch. That stuff's beyond me.... I'll have to study it to figger out >what >you mean. >I see "SO(3)" there on that page, and recall having a horrible time trying >to understand what SU(3) (Special Unitary group 3) was, in relation to >particle symmetries in the "standard model." I hope just figgerin' out how >many identical patterns under rotations there are in this 44-sphere object >isn't going to be *that* hard.) --SIGHnS: D*ck Ch*n*y's 2 focusgroups planned for this "clash o'civs," before 911! http://quincy4board.homestead.com/DeepPool.html www.larouchepub.com _________________________________________________________________ Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 13 Oct 2002 16:19:00 +0100 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Paul Taylor Subject: scientific In-Reply-To: <20021012172723.GA22386@linux00.LinuxForce.net> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit on 12/10/02 18:27, Chris Fearnley at Chris@CJFEARNLEY.COM wrote: > This is a philosophical question: how does Nature coordinate? How can we > represent Nature's coordination mathematically (but in a more "synergetic" > way than the approach of traditional mathematical analysis)? I know this may sound pedantic, but the question of how Nature coordinates is presumably a scientific question, like the question of how genomes are constructed. Paul Taylor ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 13 Oct 2002 19:27:40 -0400 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Bob Burkhardt Subject: Re: Reference for "Bees can't fly." MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I've always heard the story in relation to bumblebees, but never associated it with Bucky. I think I always heard it presented as an aerodynamics problem and haven't heard the angle you present of brain signals vs. localized control. Bob David Watkins wrote: >I don't know of any Bucky reference to "Bees can't fly" , but have heard the >story elsewhere. As I heard the story, some engineers had done an analysis >and were able to prove that bees could not fly. One of the assumptions in >their argument was that the motion of the bees wings were controlled by >ongoing signals from the bee's brain. Someone later determined that this is >not the case. The circuitry to maintain wing motion is localized in the wing >area. Localized circuitry allows for more rapid wing motion as the control >signals have less distance to travel. Replace this one faulty assumption and >the calculation supports what we know to be the case, bees can fly. I can >imagine that this story would have amused Bucky and that if he heard it he >would have said something about it at one time or another. > >Take care, > >Dave Watkins > >http://mywebpages.comcast.net/daviwat/ > > ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 13 Oct 2002 22:37:40 -0400 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Lee Bonnifield Subject: Re: Reference for "Bees can't fly." Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit I also heard it about bumblebees, and not from Bucky. What I heard was that someone (wrongly) applied an aerodynamics formula regarding wingspan and weight for fixed wing aircraft, and calculated that the bumblebee's wings were too short to lift its weight. The intent of the anecdote was to poke fun at engineers, but it's very unlikely any engineer ever thought the formula would apply with flapping wings. ---------- >From: Bob Burkhardt >To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU >Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic >Subject: Re: Reference for "Bees can't fly." >Date: Sun, Oct 13, 2002, 7:27 PM > > I've always heard the story in relation to bumblebees, but never associated > it with Bucky. I think I always heard it presented as an aerodynamics > problem > and haven't heard the angle you present of brain signals vs. localized > control. > > Bob > > David Watkins wrote: > >>I don't know of any Bucky reference to "Bees can't fly" , but have heard the >>story elsewhere. As I heard the story, some engineers had done an analysis >>and were able to prove that bees could not fly. One of the assumptions in >>their argument was that the motion of the bees wings were controlled by >>ongoing signals from the bee's brain. Someone later determined that this is >>not the case. The circuitry to maintain wing motion is localized in the wing >>area. Localized circuitry allows for more rapid wing motion as the control >>signals have less distance to travel. Replace this one faulty assumption and >>the calculation supports what we know to be the case, bees can fly. I can >>imagine that this story would have amused Bucky and that if he heard it he >>would have said something about it at one time or another. >> >>Take care, >> >>Dave Watkins >> >>http://mywebpages.comcast.net/daviwat/ >> >> ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 13 Oct 2002 23:39:43 -0400 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: David Watkins Subject: Re: Reference for "Bees can't fly." MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT I did a search on Google "bumblebees can't fly" and found a lot of interesting links, including several that supported what you heard. Someone has even written a book with that title. Dave Watkins > I also heard it about bumblebees, and not from Bucky. What I heard was > that someone (wrongly) applied an aerodynamics formula regarding > wingspan and weight for fixed wing aircraft, and calculated that the > bumblebee's wings were too short to lift its weight. The intent of the > anecdote was to poke fun at engineers, but it's very unlikely any > engineer ever thought the formula would apply with flapping wings. > ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 13 Oct 2002 23:37:26 -0400 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: David Watkins Subject: Re: Reference for "Bees can't fly." Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT I did a search on Google "bumblebees can't fly" and found a lot of interesting links, including several that supported what you heard. Someone has even written a book with that title. Dave Watkins "Lee Bonnifield" wrote in message news:200210140236.g9E2aG517113@ns1.planetc.com... > I also heard it about bumblebees, and not from Bucky. What I heard was > that someone (wrongly) applied an aerodynamics formula regarding > wingspan and weight for fixed wing aircraft, and calculated that the > bumblebee's wings were too short to lift its weight. The intent of the > anecdote was to poke fun at engineers, but it's very unlikely any > engineer ever thought the formula would apply with flapping wings. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 14 Oct 2002 19:14:49 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: scientific Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed it's a philological, promethean and Scientological question! (sorry .-) thus quoth: >I know this may sound pedantic, but the question of how Nature coordinates >is presumably a scientific question, like the question of how genomes are >constructed. --SIGHnS: D*ck Ch*n*y's 2 focusgroups planned for this "clash o'civs," before 911! http://quincy4board.homestead.com/DeepPool.html www.larouchepub.com _________________________________________________________________ Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 14 Oct 2002 19:10:13 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Gerardo Garcia Subject: Killingry->livingry / and a bet Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed according to Fuller that everyone should be granted a life grant on simple thinking, is it a solution to grant everybody related to violence a grant with a very high standard of living? Recently George Soros mentioned that 400 billions is less than 5% of the US' GNP. I would like to stablish a cipher (no matter if it only was reduction to absurd) of how much would it cost to grant everybody related to weaponry (defense, providers, weapons factories, etc. maybe organized crime as well) a satisfactory standard of living in order to avoid them to produce the risk of violence. Wouldn't it be necessry to begin granting the related to violence people first? It seems that the opposite has driven us to evergrowing violence risks. my bet is that Quincy does not have the cipher. Thanks in advance Gerardo García Tampico, México _________________________________________________________________ Join the world’s largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. http://www.hotmail.com ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 14 Oct 2002 19:30:31 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: Reference for "Bees can't fly." Comments: cc: synergeo@yahooGroups.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed ah, now I do so (all-so) recall; of course, bucky'd never have cited a source, alas! er, Bob! >I've always heard the story in relation to bumblebees, but never associated >it with Bucky. I think I always heard it presented as an aerodynamics >problem >and haven't heard the angle you present of brain signals vs. localized >control. --A HYDROGEN (sic; cracked methane) ECONOMY?... The Three Phases of Exploitation of the Protocols of the Elders of Kyoto: (FOSSILISATION [McCainanites?] (TM/sic))/ BORE/GUSH/NADIR "@" http://www.tarpley.net/aobook.htm. Http://www.tarpley.net/bushb.htm (partial contents, below): 17 -- THE ATTEMPTED COUP D'ETAT, 3/30/81 (87K) 18 -- IRAN-CONTRA (140K) 19 -- THE LEVERAGED BUYOUT MOB (67K) 20 -- THE PHONY WAR ON DRUGS (26K) 21 -- OMAHA (25K) 22 -- GEORGE "#9" TAKES THE PRESIDENCY (112K) 23 -- THE END OF HISTORY (168K) 24 -- THE NEW WORLD ORDER (255K) 25 -- THYROID STORM (139K) _________________________________________________________________ Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 14 Oct 2002 19:47:09 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: Tverse as a Waterman Comments: To: synergeo@yahooGroups.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Excellent question, John, which I was going to try to grapple, but you found the standard answer, it seems, about EM. It might be better to say, "EM always-and-only needs positive & negative stuff to propogate." [On the other hand, What Lee saith, below.] As for antimatter, it is merely an assumption that all of the Stuff, Out There, is like ours, when it is generally accepted that there are no "anti-photons" (perhaps, because there are no photons, two .-) Thus quoth: It's a peculiar problem, in that we can't find antimatter in reality, Thus quoth: "An ionized hydrogen atom cannot absorb or reradiate energy in the form of discrete lines until it captures another electron." (As y'all might know, an ion is an atom missing one or more electrons. In the case of hydrogen, it's a single proton.) Further scanning Google's results pages. Ater thirty more URLs, no more such info. Continuing search.... From: http://www-personal.umich.edu/~changm/qfund.html (This is quantum physics a la' Feynman, hence is based on a Feynman diagram. Good site for "visual quantum electrodynamics," by the way.) : " Here is an example of charges attracting-- a proton and electron exchange photons. (Note that the proton, like the electron, is mediated by the photon in electromagnetic interactions.) " Thus quoth: Assume it's talking about the discrete (typically visible) lines of emission when an electron falls from one energy to a lower energy. If there is no electron obviously the atom (ion, proton) can't emit any of those lines. It could absorb/emit other lines not associated with electrons, like in MRI. --SIGHnS: D*ck Ch*n*y's 2 focusgroups planned for this "clash o'civs," before 911! http://quincy4board.homestead.com/DeepPool.html www.larouchepub.com _________________________________________________________________ Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 14 Oct 2002 19:58:10 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: Tverse as a Waterman Comments: To: synergeo@yahoogroups.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed it is certainly counter-intuitive, that trying to close-pack (which is just a sort of "local, midphaze" ideal) around an icosah. would ever pan-out. for instance, do you assume that the the next ball, after putting one in the 5-pocket, does not touch the ball of the icosah.? http://tetrahedraverse.com/temp/stelicosa32a.jpg --A HYDROGEN (sic; cracked methane) ECONOMY?... The Three Phases of Exploitation of the Protocols of the Elders of Kyoto: (FOSSILISATION [McCainanites?] (TM/sic))/ BORE/GUSH/NADIR "@" http://www.tarpley.net/aobook.htm. Http://www.tarpley.net/bushb.htm (partial contents, below): 17 -- THE ATTEMPTED COUP D'ETAT, 3/30/81 (87K) 18 -- IRAN-CONTRA (140K) 19 -- THE LEVERAGED BUYOUT MOB (67K) 20 -- THE PHONY WAR ON DRUGS (26K) 21 -- OMAHA (25K) 22 -- GEORGE "#9" TAKES THE PRESIDENCY (112K) 23 -- THE END OF HISTORY (168K) 24 -- THE NEW WORLD ORDER (255K) 25 -- THYROID STORM (139K) _________________________________________________________________ Join the world’s largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. http://www.hotmail.com ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 14 Oct 2002 17:47:47 -0400 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: John Belt Subject: Re: Reference for "Bees can't fly." In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII The 'Synergetics Dictionary-The Mind of Buckminster Fuller' by E.J. Applewhite does not have a record of "bees" or "flying" that to me at least appear to be related to this thread. I will try to look further when time permits. john belt On Mon, 14 Oct 2002, Quincy Quincy Quincy wrote: > ah, now I do so (all-so) recall; of course, > bucky'd never have cited a source, alas! > er, Bob! > > >I've always heard the story in relation to bumblebees, but never associated > >it with Bucky. I think I always heard it presented as an aerodynamics ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 14 Oct 2002 18:12:04 -0400 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: David Watkins Subject: Re: Killingry->livingry / and a bet MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT Gerardo, You may be interested in the following site. It shows what portion of the world's annual military expenditure it would take to provide for the needs of the people of the world. I think this would be a good starting point for making the world a safer place to live. My opinion is that this diversion of expenditures from the military to meeting the needs of the world's people should be applied to the areas of greatest need first, rather than focusing on the violent people. If we are assuming some link of violence to need, this approach would get to these people without rewarding violence that might occur for a variety of other reasons. http://www.osearth.com/resources/wwwproject/index.shtml Hope this relates to your question. Take care, Dave Watkins http://mywebpages.comcast.net/daviwat/ > according to Fuller that everyone should be granted a life grant on > simple thinking, is it a solution to grant everybody related to violence a > grant with a very high standard of living? > > Recently George Soros mentioned that 400 billions is less than 5% of the > US' GNP. I would like to stablish a cipher (no matter if it only was > reduction to absurd) of how much would it cost to grant everybody related > to weaponry (defense, providers, weapons factories, etc. maybe organized > crime as well) a satisfactory standard of living in order to avoid them to > produce the risk of violence. > > Wouldn't it be necessry to begin granting the related to violence people > first? It seems that the opposite has driven us to evergrowing violence > risks. > > my bet is that Quincy does not have the cipher. > > Thanks in advance > > Gerardo García > Tampico, México > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > Join the world's largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. > http://www.hotmail.com ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2002 03:10:49 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: Killingry->livingry / and a bet Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed you win, Buckaroo! >my bet is that Quincy does not have the cipher. --SIGHnS: D*ck Ch*n*y's 2 focusgroups planned for this "clash o'civs," before 911! http://quincy4board.homestead.com/DeepPool.html www.larouchepub.com _________________________________________________________________ MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2002 03:11:32 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: Killingry->livingry / and a bet Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed you win, Buckaroo! or, did you mean, "I've got plenty o'nothin'" ?? >my bet is that Quincy does not have the cipher. --SIGHnS: D*ck Ch*n*y's 2 focusgroups planned for this "clash o'civs," before 911! http://quincy4board.homestead.com/DeepPool.html www.larouchepub.com _________________________________________________________________ MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2002 03:51:27 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: Tverse as a Waterman Comments: To: synergeo@yahooGroups.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed in particular, it is impossible to place the 3rd layer (and beyond) into any sort of symmetry (that I'm aware of; at least, not icosahedral, and central-symmetry may be all that you can achieve, if that). OK; now find a better topic (think on it, overnight, please), if only because I hate giving so-much credit to a Subject!... you might also grab the rudiments of combinatorics in the next few minutes, before retiring to your coffin. thus quoth: spherically-symmetrically --each of the 12 dodeca pentapockets gets treated pretty much the same, albeit when other layers have been added, interesting possibilities may emerge therein. --A HYDROGEN (sic; cracked methane) ECONOMY?... The Three Phases of Exploitation of the Protocols of the Elders of Kyoto: (FOSSILISATION [McCainanites?] (TM/sic))/ BORE/GUSH/NADIR "@" http://www.tarpley.net/aobook.htm. Http://www.tarpley.net/bushb.htm (partial contents, below): 17 -- THE ATTEMPTED COUP D'ETAT, 3/30/81 (87K) 18 -- IRAN-CONTRA (140K) 19 -- THE LEVERAGED BUYOUT MOB (67K) 20 -- THE PHONY WAR ON DRUGS (26K) 21 -- OMAHA (25K) 22 -- GEORGE "#9" TAKES THE PRESIDENCY (112K) 23 -- THE END OF HISTORY (168K) 24 -- THE NEW WORLD ORDER (255K) 25 -- THYROID STORM (139K) _________________________________________________________________ MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2002 03:58:21 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: ionized hydrogen & electromagnetism (not the stupid, Economy) Comments: To: synergeo@yahooGroups.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed the fact is that a) the "electrrons" are still around in the plasma -- the space is not charged too much in a given volume -- and b) most of the hydrogen was recently preceived to be molecular (dihydrogen). moo-ha-ha. --A HYDROGEN (sic; cracked methane) ECONOMY?... The Three Phases of Exploitation of the Protocols of the Elders of Kyoto: (FOSSILISATION [McCainanites?] (TM/sic))/ BORE/GUSH/NADIR "@" http://www.tarpley.net/aobook.htm. Http://www.tarpley.net/bushb.htm (partial contents, below): 17 -- THE ATTEMPTED COUP D'ETAT, 3/30/81 (87K) 18 -- IRAN-CONTRA (140K) 19 -- THE LEVERAGED BUYOUT MOB (67K) 20 -- THE PHONY WAR ON DRUGS (26K) 21 -- OMAHA (25K) 22 -- GEORGE "#9" TAKES THE PRESIDENCY (112K) 23 -- THE END OF HISTORY (168K) 24 -- THE NEW WORLD ORDER (255K) 25 -- THYROID STORM (139K) _________________________________________________________________ Join the world’s largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. http://www.hotmail.com ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 14 Oct 2002 21:38:08 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Organization: (Retired) Subject: Re: Schwedler dome Comments: To: Blair Wolfram MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Blair, The way I understand it, geodesic domes have either 3, 4, 5, or 6 struts coming together at a vertex at the most. All other types of domes have more coming together at the top vertex; eg, Lamella 10, Lattice 15, and Schwedler 15. The main Schwedler struts radiate out like spokes of a wheel in contrast to a Lattice dome. See Don Richter's excellent article in the back of volume 4 of _The Artifacts of R Buckminster Fuller_, pages 381-94. . ============================== Joe S Moore joe_s_moore@hotmail.com http://buckminster.info <== NEW Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute ============================= ----- Original Message ----- From: "Blair Wolfram" To: Sent: Monday, October 14, 2002 8:36 PM Subject: Schwedler dome > Hello Joe; > > Can you tell me how to identify a Schwedler dome? > > Blair > ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2002 16:08:45 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Gerardo Garcia Subject: Re: Killingry->livingry / and a bet Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Thanks David, I visited the link below. There it is stated that 700 billions are the world's military expenditures in a year. Those billions are less than 10% of the US GNP. I do not believe in rewarding violence, I was just trying to think something different. At the same time (of winning my Buckaroo bet, thanks Brian) I kind of felt sad of thinking how well the military from diverse countries get along and how difficult is to good will people to coalesce. I wonder why there is not a single dome science? I wonder how it is that Rigoberta Menchú and Jennifer Harbury don´t mix too much, being that they speak of the same things? I wonder why the larouchepub doesn´t mix too much with John Forbes Nash if they are trying do solve the same things about gravity? All those people seem to be good will people but always have a hard time aiming at the same target. Is it exactly what Fuller was talking about the specialists, do they (or we all) feel like specialists claiming for a lesser moral kind of people to coordinate them/us? That is what I feel with the visual display of the site David gave us: how is it that they are not in the same ship as the BFI's spaceshipearth project? Could we at least agree (I mean Brian Quincy Hutchings and I) that maybe Foghouse with their theater play is the leader in advancing Fuller ideas? or on this summary of a General Dynamics retired engineer (about his work experience in the California missile place): black engineers were the strongest (could stay standing for 48 hours), white engineers were the joyful (he said childish), jewish engineers were the geniuses and latino engineers were the guys that made a work meeting function. Just for one second, could it be that what is lacking is many of the Linux (collective pretended individual achievement) developing experiences? Could it be that Fuller's patent claiming is working against the advancing of his own ideas? Gerardo García Tampico, México for my second Buckaroo ticket PS. Brian, thanks for the Tarpley /Bush book link. I couldn't finish it. Please tell me what is the end of that story. >Gerardo, > >You may be interested in the following site. It shows what portion of the >world's annual military expenditure it would take to provide for the needs >of the people of the world. I think this would be a good starting point for >making the world a safer place to live. My opinion is that this diversion >of >expenditures from the military to meeting the needs of the world's people >should be applied to the areas of greatest need first, rather than focusing >on the violent people. If we are assuming some link of violence to need, >this approach would get to these people without rewarding violence that >might occur for a variety of other reasons. > >http://www.osearth.com/resources/wwwproject/index.shtml > >Hope this relates to your question. > >Take care, > >Dave Watkins > >http://mywebpages.comcast.net/daviwat/ > _________________________________________________________________ MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2002 09:51:21 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Leifur Thor Subject: Re: Killingry->livingry / and a bet In-Reply-To: Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Great idea Gerardo! You are thinking is whole systems. I can't help but wonder if- What if we could convince the weapons makers, that shifting to livingry at an aerospace level, would "increase" their businesses revenue above buildin= g weapons. Currently they "believe" it's weapons or nothing. So the goal should be bringing that vision to all of how these companies which are viewed by the public as evil, as excellent sources for livingry manufacturers when it comes about. Summerized-Not this or that, but this to that. And the Bucky show hooked me into Bucky. I've met others who wouldn't know squat about Bucky if it weren't for the play, and I can't begin to thank enough the creators of it, and what a gem they've created. And Bucky would have approved I'm sure. Leifur > From: Gerardo Garcia > Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works > > Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic > Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2002 16:08:45 +0000 > To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU > Subject: Re: Killingry->livingry / and a bet >=20 > Thanks David, >=20 > I visited the link below. There it is stated that 700 billions are the > world's military expenditures in a year. Those billions are less than 10= % > of the US GNP. I do not believe in rewarding violence, I was just trying= to > think something different. >=20 > At the same time (of winning my Buckaroo bet, thanks Brian) I kind of fel= t > sad of thinking how well the military from diverse countries get along an= d > how difficult is to good will people to coalesce. I wonder why there is = not > a single dome science? I wonder how it is that Rigoberta Mench=FA and Jenni= fer > Harbury don=B4t mix too much, being that they speak of the same things? I > wonder why the larouchepub doesn=B4t mix too much with John Forbes Nash if > they are trying do solve the same things about gravity? All those people > seem to be good will people but always have a hard time aiming at the sam= e > target. Is it exactly what Fuller was talking about the specialists, do > they (or we all) feel like specialists claiming for a lesser moral kind o= f > people to coordinate them/us? >=20 > That is what I feel with the visual display of the site David gave us: h= ow > is it that they are not in the same ship as the BFI's spaceshipearth > project? >=20 > Could we at least agree (I mean Brian Quincy Hutchings and I) that maybe > Foghouse with their theater play is the leader in advancing Fuller ideas? >=20 > or on this summary of a General Dynamics retired engineer (about his work > experience in the California missile place): >=20 > black engineers were the strongest (could stay standing for 48 hours), wh= ite > engineers were the joyful (he said childish), jewish engineers were the > geniuses and latino engineers were the guys that made a work meeting > function. >=20 > Just for one second, could it be that what is lacking is many of the Linu= x > (collective pretended individual achievement) developing experiences? Co= uld > it be that Fuller's patent claiming is working against the advancing of h= is > own ideas? >=20 > Gerardo Garc=EDa > Tampico, M=E9xico >=20 > for my second Buckaroo ticket >=20 > PS. Brian, thanks for the Tarpley /Bush book link. I couldn't finish it= . > Please tell me what is the end of that story. >=20 >> Gerardo, >>=20 >> You may be interested in the following site. It shows what portion of th= e >> world's annual military expenditure it would take to provide for the nee= ds >> of the people of the world. I think this would be a good starting point = for >> making the world a safer place to live. My opinion is that this diversio= n >> of >> expenditures from the military to meeting the needs of the world's peopl= e >> should be applied to the areas of greatest need first, rather than focus= ing >> on the violent people. If we are assuming some link of violence to need, >> this approach would get to these people without rewarding violence that >> might occur for a variety of other reasons. >>=20 >> http://www.osearth.com/resources/wwwproject/index.shtml >>=20 >> Hope this relates to your question. >>=20 >> Take care, >>=20 >> Dave Watkins >>=20 >> http://mywebpages.comcast.net/daviwat/ >>=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 > _________________________________________________________________ > MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: > http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2002 16:41:36 -0400 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: David Watkins Subject: Re: Killingry->livingry / and a bet MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Geraldo, "The What the World Wants Project is by Medard Gabel and the research staff of the World Game Institute." It was previously on The World Game Institute site if memory serves me right: http://www.worldgame.org/ There is a link on the BFI site to The World Game Institute. Bucky did a lot with what he called the "World Game", but I am not sure of exactly how the World Game Institute relates to Bucky's work. They certainly use a lot of Bucky's ideas. One more point, I was not trying to imply that you advocated rewarding terrorism. I do think that sometimes it is a problem when terrorists have legitimate complaints; many are then reluctant to look at those issues for fear they would be yielding to terrorists. Take care, Dave Watkins > > That is what I feel with the visual display of the site David gave us: how > is it that they are not in the same ship as the BFI's spaceshipearth > project? ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 16 Oct 2002 03:14:30 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: Killingry->livingry / and a bet Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed especially, they use that God-am silly map! >http://www.worldgame.org/ > >There is a link on the BFI site to The World Game Institute. Bucky did a >lot >with what he called the "World Game", but I am not sure of exactly how the >World Game Institute relates to Bucky's work. They certainly use a lot of >Bucky's ideas. --A HYDROGEN (sic; cracked methane) ECONOMY?... The Three Phases of Exploitation of the Protocols of the Elders of Kyoto: (FOSSILISATION [McCainanites?] (TM/sic))/ BORE/GUSH/NADIR "@" http://www.tarpley.net/aobook.htm. Http://www.tarpley.net/bushb.htm (partial contents, below): 17 -- THE ATTEMPTED COUP D'ETAT, 3/30/81 (87K) 18 -- IRAN-CONTRA (140K) 19 -- THE LEVERAGED BUYOUT MOB (67K) 20 -- THE PHONY WAR ON DRUGS (26K) 21 -- OMAHA (25K) 22 -- GEORGE "#9" TAKES THE PRESIDENCY (112K) 23 -- THE END OF HISTORY (168K) 24 -- THE NEW WORLD ORDER (255K) 25 -- THYROID STORM (139K) _________________________________________________________________ Protect your PC - get McAfee.com VirusScan Online http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963 ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 16 Oct 2002 03:31:37 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: Killingry->livingry / and a bet Comments: cc: synergeo@yahooGroups.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed NB: Hotmail's put my sig on top; sorry! --A HYDROGEN (sic; cracked methane) ECONOMY?... The Three Phases of Exploitation of the Protocols of the Elders of Kyoto: (FOSSILISATION [McCainanites?] (TM/sic))/ BORE/GUSH/NADIR "@" http://www.tarpley.net/aobook.htm. Http://www.tarpley.net/bushb.htm (partial contents, below): 17 -- THE ATTEMPTED COUP D'ETAT, 3/30/81 (87K) 18 -- IRAN-CONTRA (140K) 19 -- THE LEVERAGED BUYOUT MOB (67K) 20 -- THE PHONY WAR ON DRUGS (26K) 21 -- OMAHA (25K) 22 -- GEORGE "#9" TAKES THE PRESIDENCY (112K) 23 -- THE END OF HISTORY (168K) 24 -- THE NEW WORLD ORDER (255K) 25 -- THYROID STORM (139K) a-hem. Rigaberto Menchu is a UN-awarded terrorist (revisionist stuff, hereinat; see larouchepub.com (New Federalist button; search). I didn't see the movie on Nash, so that I don't know what you mean. the fact is that it's a propoganda-peice for the Kyoto Protocol; gravity?... doh!... also, having not seen the play by Foghouse, I can't comment & would be suprized if I agreed with much of it, since I don't with Bukafka, either. the silly idea of Earth as a spaceship ... well, maybe we can throw her into warp factor 9, and really scoot. anyway, he didn't patent that one; is that why there's been no development of the Earthdrive -- no venture capital to toss at it? I'm rather sure, at this point, that Linux is an oligarchical project, as well; it seems as if the Wholly Brutish Umpire has us, surrounded! thus quoth: >a single dome science? I wonder how it is that Rigoberta Menchú and >Jennifer >Harbury don´t mix too much, being that they speak of the same things? I >wonder why the larouchepub doesn´t mix too much with John Forbes Nash if >they are trying do solve the same things about gravity? All those people >seem to be good will people but always have a hard time aiming at the same >target. Is it exactly what Fuller was talking about the specialists, do >they (or we all) feel like specialists claiming for a lesser moral kind of >people to coordinate them/us? > >That is what I feel with the visual display of the site David gave us: how >is it that they are not in the same ship as the BFI's spaceshipearth >project? > >Could we at least agree (I mean Brian Quincy Hutchings and I) that maybe >Foghouse with their theater play is the leader in advancing Fuller ideas? > >or on this summary of a General Dynamics retired engineer (about his work >experience in the California missile place): > >black engineers were the strongest (could stay standing for 48 hours), >white >engineers were the joyful (he said childish), jewish engineers were the >geniuses and latino engineers were the guys that made a work meeting >function. > >Just for one second, could it be that what is lacking is many of the Linux >(collective pretended individual achievement) developing experiences? >Could >it be that Fuller's patent claiming is working against the advancing of his >own ideas? _________________________________________________________________ Surf the Web without missing calls! Get MSN Broadband. http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/freeactivation.asp ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2002 22:15:55 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Organization: (Retired) Subject: Re: news sites about RBF Comments: To: "j.o.hill" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit "Thinking Out Loud" is still available at WNET's website: http://www.thirteen.org/cgi-bin/bucky-bin/bucky.cgi . It's just that the PBS website no longer links to it. ============================== Joe S Moore joe_s_moore@hotmail.com http://buckminster.info <== NEW Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute ============================= ----- Original Message ----- From: "j.o.hill" Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic,alt.bucky-fuller Sent: Saturday, June 29, 2002 7:49 AM Subject: Re: news sites about RBF > You may still not find what you want but if you type "Bucky news" in as > an Advanced Search in the box labeled "with the exact phrase". That cuts > your sites down to 100. > > j.o.hill > > Michael Stutz wrote: > > > Doug Milliken wrote in message news:... > > > >>I just went to Google and typed in > >> Bucky news > >>While this turned up 40000(!) sites, the top ones were not bad > >>matches for your request. > >> > > > > Very few of these matches unfortunately were for actual news sites or > > services, or had anything to do with RBF at all -- most were just > > pages containing both words. The top hit [1] was the best match and > > many of the lesser hits in fact made the match because they were pages > > that linked to it. It's a site that gives links to new papers and > > research in the fullerenes ... but unfortunately has been discontinued > > since 1994. > > > > There is actually very little on the web which tracks news related to > > RBF or the areas of his work -- as an experiment I ran a weblog > > several years ago that attempted in part to track findings in this > > area but it was not my calling. The BFI news page no longer contains > > any but they still publish Trimtab, and it finds its way onto the web > > [2]. Even that celebrated WNET "Thinking Out Loud" site has been > > withdrawn by PBS, so all that info is now gone. > > > > You can use alltheweb.com to search for keywords in news articles and > > periodicals, and I've got a search that looks for Bucky news [3]. Only > > very rarely does anything turn up -- most recently being how his > > Carbondale home is in disrepair, SIU is not interested in helping and > > the guy who is trying to restore it, a former student of Bucky's, had > > only gotten $100 of the needed $100k. Was hoping that these newsgroups > > would have more info on this but they too have been slow in recent > > years. > > > > > > > > 1. http://www.physik.uni-oldenburg.de/bucky/htmls/bucky.html > > 2. http://www.bfi.org/Trimtab/index.htm > > 3. http://www.alltheweb.com/search?cat=news&lang=any&query=buckminster+fuller&p hrase=on > > > ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 16 Oct 2002 15:48:38 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Gerardo Garcia Subject: Re: Killingry->livingry / and a bet Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Bukafka? :) >From: Quincy Quincy Quincy >Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works > >To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU >Subject: Re: Killingry->livingry / and a bet >Date: Wed, 16 Oct 2002 03:31:37 +0000 > > c'mon Quincy, what have you been doing in Tijuana? Rigoberta: a she, not a he. A Guatemalan mayan Nobel Prize winner (peace prize). it is not the same thing Taco Bell and Taca Bell >a-hem. Rigaberto Menchu is a UN-awarded terrorist (revisionist stuff, as they say: "if my grandmother had wheels she would be a bycicle" >hereinat; see larouchepub.com (New Federalist button; search). > I didn't see the movie on Nash, so that I don't know what you mean. I read the Larouche magazine 21st science (something like that). It feels more about nuclear energy as a mean to solve energy problems than a faith on science (gravitation included). You can go to Nash's www site: http://www.math.princeton.edu/jfnj/ >the fact is that it's a propoganda-peice for the Kyoto Protocol; >gravity?... doh!... also, >having not seen the play by Foghouse, I have not seen the play either, but it is clear that they devoted to one idea of Bukafkartaud: "the updating of the display of his ideas" (better diction, speed of discourse, graphics, etc.) >I can't comment & would be suprized if I agreed >with much of it, since I don't with Bukafka, either. > the silly idea of Earth as a spaceship ... well, >maybe we can throw her into warp factor 9, and >really scoot. anyway, >he didn't patent that one; is that why >there's been no development of the Earthdrive -- >no venture capital to toss at it? crystal clear, any options? > I'm rather sure, at this point, that >Linux is an oligarchical project, as well; oh yeah, damn right: the opression of the intel processors family >it seems as if the Wholly Brutish Umpire has us, >surrounded! yes, but that was the only way to know that the children choir of King's College sings better than Elton John Anyway Quincy, Mr. Larouche seems a good will man but doesn't mix well with other good will people. _________________________________________________________________ Surf the Web without missing calls! Get MSN Broadband. http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/freeactivation.asp ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 16 Oct 2002 22:24:12 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: QM propogation Comments: cc: synergeo@yahooGroups.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Much of latter-day cosmology is predicated upon actually ignoring every thing but gravity, per "gtr;" yes, incl. "black holes!" Get the book by Eric Lerner, _The Big Bang Never Happened_, for a precis of Alfven's decades of work. When you combine that, as lionized by Star Trek et al ad vomitorium, with the Copenhagen school stuff, as below, it’s no wonder that Einstein got a head-ache! Your stuff about QM "versus" Classical M is quaint, although close to the commonplace Fuzzee Logeek paradigm. The site about this that was quoted had one good thing: it showed how the prototypical pairing of location & momentum, vis-a-vu H’s Uncertainty, can be done as “time & energy,” although I didn’t try to read it. There are all sorts of such pairs, Both in science & “every-day life” (well, mine, any way). Thus quoth: "Classical" physics is still rather Newtonian; "particles" that travel through something that isn't the same as the particle. Quantum mechanics goes far in reducing that view's effect on people's thinking about particles, by including the particles' surrounds in the conceptualization of the particle (the experimental setup is inextricably intertwined with the objects under experimental investigation) NB: Hotmail's put my sig on top; sorry! --SIGHnS: D*ck Ch*n*y's 2 focusgroups planned for this "clash o'civs," before 911! http://quincy4board.homestead.com/DeepPool.html www.larouchepub.com _________________________________________________________________ Choose an Internet access plan right for you -- try MSN! http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/default.asp ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 16 Oct 2002 22:24:33 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: Tverse as a Waterman Comments: cc: synergeo@yahooGroups.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Much of latter-day cosmology is predicated upon actually ignoring every thing but gravity, per "gtr;" yes, incl. "black holes!" Get the book by Eric Lerner, _The Big Bang Never Happened_, for a precis of Alfven's decades of work. When you combine that, as lionized by Star Trek et al ad vomitorium, with the Copenhagen school stuff, as below, it’s no wonder that Einstein got a head-ache! Your stuff about QM "versus" Classical M is quaint, although close to the commonplace Fuzzee Logeek paradigm. The site about this that was quoted had one good thing: it showed how the prototypical pairing of location & momentum, vis-a-vu H’s Uncertainty, can be done as “time & energy,” although I didn’t try to read it. There are all sorts of such pairs, Both in science & “every-day life” (well, mine, any way). Thus quoth: "Classical" physics is still rather Newtonian; "particles" that travel through something that isn't the same as the particle. Quantum mechanics goes far in reducing that view's effect on people's thinking about particles, by including the particles' surrounds in the conceptualization of the particle (the experimental setup is inextricably intertwined with the objects under experimental investigation) NB: Hotmail's put my sig on top; sorry! --SIGHnS: D*ck Ch*n*y's 2 focusgroups planned for this "clash o'civs," before 911! http://quincy4board.homestead.com/DeepPool.html www.larouchepub.com _________________________________________________________________ Surf the Web without missing calls! Get MSN Broadband. http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/freeactivation.asp ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 16 Oct 2002 22:28:24 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: Killingry->livingry / and a bet Comments: cc: synergeo@yahooGroups.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed thanks for the tip, Garcia; this is write-up my alley (esp. see the paper on the Goldbach conjecture !-) http://www.math.princeton.edu/jfnj/texts_and_graphics/IDEAL/Beijing/idemo.finer.c.html NB: Hotmail's put my sig on top; sorry! --SIGHnS: D*ck Ch*n*y's 2 focusgroups planned for this "clash o'civs," before 911! http://quincy4board.homestead.com/DeepPool.html www.larouchepub.com --A HYDROGEN (sic; cracked methane) ECONOMY?... The Three Phases of Exploitation of the Protocols of the Elders of Kyoto: (FOSSILISATION [McCainanites?] (TM/sic))/ BORE/GUSH/NADIR "@" http://www.tarpley.net/aobook.htm. Http://www.tarpley.net/bushb.htm (partial contents, below): 17 -- THE ATTEMPTED COUP D'ETAT, 3/30/81 (87K) 18 -- IRAN-CONTRA (140K) 19 -- THE LEVERAGED BUYOUT MOB (67K) 20 -- THE PHONY WAR ON DRUGS (26K) 21 -- OMAHA (25K) 22 -- GEORGE "#9" TAKES THE PRESIDENCY (112K) 23 -- THE END OF HISTORY (168K) 24 -- THE NEW WORLD ORDER (255K) 25 -- THYROID STORM (139K) _________________________________________________________________ Internet access plans that fit your lifestyle -- join MSN. http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/default.asp ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 16 Oct 2002 22:48:22 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Fuzzee Logeek and "FNT" Comments: cc: synergeo@yahooGroups.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Dear Ed.; Wading through pop-sci writing can get you all-wet, and Amir Aczel belly-flops on *The Last Theorem* (FLT), presuming that Fermat's *oeuvre* was contained solely in marginal notes to Bachet's big book of "diophantine" equations. The *raison d'etre* of his success was his huge corresponence with the scientists of the Continent. More, aprés *Entanglement*. It may seem as if the "Copenhagen School of interpreting the results of QM" is hegemonic in academia, but one only has to glance at *Discover*'s interview with David D., to see the most lucid thing, the title. The crux is, Mr. D has no hypothesis about what he's *doing* in (this/his; your/mine/our/their) Universe, wearing a Solipsist's blinders that apply, not just to each sentient observer, but to all "quantum events." What an event is, isn't found in D's rambling, nor in that of any of the School's spokesfolk, apparently including Bishop Everett’s. There *is* a Hell-bent search for usable quantum-computational events … it’s rather uncertain. A problem seems to be the "reification" of the math of probabilities, which was mostly worked-out by Pascal -- in correspondence with Fermat! (A gross, new-agey word, but why should the probability of an event be more *re-* than the event, itself ? Is it in flipping a coin, winning the lottery, or getting a date, tonight?) So, where's a hypothesis as to *how* an initializing correlation -- the "entanglement" that's made in their emmission -- of event-pairs should just go-away, like the polarization ("spin") of the would-be photons or gamma rays? Or of how, such a correlation is maintained, contarily? Aczel’s just-as-mainstream splash on FLT may also be outswum: Fermat retracted his big, oft-cited error (in a letter to Bernard Frénicle de Bessy [just read of it in *17 Essays on Fermat Numbers* from CMS (la Société Mathématique de Canada)]), before that, supposing he’d a proof of the infinitude of the "Fermat primes" (either way, still undone!) If so few of his plethora of results were explicitly proven by him, can one ask, Had Fermat *une methode*, that gave him an especial insight into *numbertheorie*, such that he is universally known as its greatest founder? I mean, in My local universe, it took a century to prove most of them, without one -- and Andy Wiles didn't really find it in his closet-search, either, for all that I know! --Brian "Quincy" Hutchings – I have no phone! P.O.Box 701, Santa Monica, CA 90406-0701 http://quincy4board.homestead.com --SIGHnS: D*ck Ch*n*y's 2 focusgroups planned for this "clash o'civs," before 911! http://quincy4board.homestead.com/DeepPool.html www.larouchepub.com _________________________________________________________________ Unlimited Internet access -- and 2 months free! Try MSN. http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/2monthsfree.asp ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 17 Oct 2002 00:47:27 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Gerardo Garcia Subject: Re: Killingry->livingry / and a bet Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Leifur, the 9th Fuller's video session http://omnifelicity.com/bucky/eik_session_09alt.html speaks about patience among other things. Maybe we shouldn't try to rush to implement Fuller's ideas (or ours), maybe it is only necessary that politicians and power people acknowledge that Nehru (and his daghter and later also prime minister of India) had heard about Fuller's housing ideas and didn't do anything about housing in seismic areas and later we had the earthquake (one year or two ago) that killed 100,000 people. Maybe that is what it is needed that they feel responsible for not doing anything to avoid those tragedies. In the session above mentioned, Fuller speaks twice of telepathy. Please see my then six years old son drawing of the next pages http://www.iconodo.addr.com/ or http://www.geocities.com/iconodo/ it was made back in the 2000 when I was thinking (to myself) to construct a page about "collective ivention". It must be something of what Brian says about the observer affecting the experiment, or a "jitterbug perception of other's longing and fears". Brian recommends something like "the big bang never happened". I recommend the loving environment that surrounds the man they say "heard" the big bang (in Dennis Ritchie -co creator of the Unix OS- www page) http://cm.bell-labs.com/cm/cs/who/dmr/labscam.html Another question: has anybody stablish a relation beteen the vector equilibrium (cuboctahedron) and the restablishmente of the 12th apostle (apostle book of facts? in Spanish "Hechos de los apóstoles") just for the sake of the number 12? Or, the David's star that forms with the opposite triangles of the cuboctahedron? regards Gerardo García Tampico, México >From: Leifur Thor >Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works > >To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU >Subject: Re: Killingry->livingry / and a bet >Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2002 09:51:21 -0700 > >Great idea Gerardo! You are thinking is whole systems. I can't help but >wonder if- > >What if we could convince the weapons makers, that shifting to livingry at >an aerospace level, would "increase" their businesses revenue above >building >weapons. Currently they "believe" it's weapons or nothing. So the goal >should be bringing that vision to all of how these companies which are >viewed by the public as evil, as excellent sources for livingry >manufacturers when it comes about. > >Summerized-Not this or that, but this to that. > >And the Bucky show hooked me into Bucky. I've met others who wouldn't know >squat about Bucky if it weren't for the play, and I can't begin to thank >enough the creators of it, and what a gem they've created. And Bucky would >have approved I'm sure. > >Leifur > _________________________________________________________________ Internet access plans that fit your lifestyle -- join MSN. http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/default.asp ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 17 Oct 2002 19:56:20 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: Killingry->livingry / and a bet Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed I'll check that reference, later. NB: Hotmail's put my sig on top; sorry! --SIGHnS: D*ck Ch*n*y's 2 focusgroups planned for this "clash o'civs," before 911! http://quincy4board.homestead.com/DeepPool.html www.larouchepub.com >It must be something of what Brian says about the observer affecting the >experiment, or a "jitterbug perception of other's longing and fears". > >Brian recommends something like "the big bang never happened". I recommend >the loving environment that surrounds the man they say "heard" the big >bang >(in Dennis Ritchie -co creator of the Unix OS- www page) > >http://cm.bell-labs.com/cm/cs/who/dmr/labscam.html _________________________________________________________________ Protect your PC - get McAfee.com VirusScan Online http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963 ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 17 Oct 2002 20:17:15 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: Proton EM Comments: cc: synergeo@yahooGroups.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed It gots t’be said, Newton’s algebraizations (if were his) of gravity was preceded by Kepler’s revolutionary constraints (or “laws”) of orbiting, and followed by a thorough, Continental reproof of his "corpuscles" (by Huyghens et al). Of course, if you read the _Encyc.Brit._, it may seem quite different. That is, the "classical" view is that of dyscerning an aether, through which waves o'light propogate. (And that's what the Michelson-Morley-Miller experiments deal with, *pace* Albert's brain .-) Thus quoth: through something that isn't the same as the particle. Quantum mechanics goes far in reducing that view's effect on people's thinking about particles, by including the particles' surrounds in the conceptualization of the particle (the experimental setup is inextricably --SIGHnS: D*ck Ch*n*y's 2 focusgroups planned for this "clash o'civs," before 911! http://quincy4board.homestead.com/DeepPool.html www.larouchepub.com _________________________________________________________________ Surf the Web without missing calls! Get MSN Broadband. http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/freeactivation.asp ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 17 Oct 2002 20:25:11 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: Tverse is what? Comments: To: sesynergeo@yahooGroups.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed there seems to be a loose allocation of the term, "12-order vertex" to ball-packing, even when they don't quite touch. and, there's no way that "layers" of balls will ever form such a pervasive "network," except the CCP/IVM one, which is just a reference (or "co-ordination"), around 12 balls in a dodeca-asteral formation. "because," there is no periodical structure to go with that, the layers will always be a bit "off." the proof (or what ever) is in your court. thus quoth: The only way for a layer 4 ball to touch the icosa would be if layer 2 (dodec) were distorted slightly, opening up one or more of the pentapockets enough for that layer 4 ball to settle down in further. Symmetrically built (no such distortion), layer 4 balls don't touch layer 1 (icosa) balls. "Proof" is for logic, math, and religion (where "proof" is "faith"). I can --SIGHnS: D*ck Ch*n*y's 2 focusgroups planned for this "clash o'civs," before 911! http://quincy4board.homestead.com/DeepPool.html www.larouchepub.com --A HYDROGEN (sic; cracked methane) ECONOMY?... The Three Phases of Exploitation of the Protocols of the Elders of Kyoto: (FOSSILISATION [McCainanites?] (TM/sic))/ BORE/GUSH/NADIR "@" http://www.tarpley.net/aobook.htm. Http://www.tarpley.net/bushb.htm (partial contents, below): 17 -- THE ATTEMPTED COUP D'ETAT, 3/30/81 (87K) 18 -- IRAN-CONTRA (140K) 19 -- THE LEVERAGED BUYOUT MOB (67K) 20 -- THE PHONY WAR ON DRUGS (26K) 21 -- OMAHA (25K) 22 -- GEORGE "#9" TAKES THE PRESIDENCY (112K) 23 -- THE END OF HISTORY (168K) 24 -- THE NEW WORLD ORDER (255K) 25 -- THYROID STORM (139K) _________________________________________________________________ Get faster connections -- switch to MSN Internet Access! http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/default.asp ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 17 Oct 2002 20:28:24 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: QM propogation Comments: To: synergeo@yahooGroups.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed It gots t’be said, Newton’s algebraizations (if were his) of gravity was preceded by Kepler’s revolutionary constraints (or “laws”) of orbiting, and followed by a thorough, Continental reproof of his "corpuscles" (by Huyghens et al). Of course, if you read the _Encyc.Brit._, it may seem quite different. That is, the "classical" view is that of dyscerning an aether, through which waves o'light propogate. (And that's what the Michelson-Morley-Miller experiments deal with, *pace* Albert's brain .-) Thus quoth: through something that isn't the same as the particle. Quantum mechanics goes far in reducing that view's effect on people's thinking about particles, by including the particles' surrounds in the conceptualization of the particle (the experimental setup is inextricably --A HYDROGEN (sic; cracked methane) ECONOMY?... The Three Phases of Exploitation of the Protocols of the Elders of Kyoto: (FOSSILISATION [McCainanites?] (TM/sic))/ BORE/GUSH/NADIR "@" http://www.tarpley.net/aobook.htm. Http://www.tarpley.net/bushb.htm (partial contents, below): 17 -- THE ATTEMPTED COUP D'ETAT, 3/30/81 (87K) 18 -- IRAN-CONTRA (140K) 19 -- THE LEVERAGED BUYOUT MOB (67K) 20 -- THE PHONY WAR ON DRUGS (26K) 21 -- OMAHA (25K) 22 -- GEORGE "#9" TAKES THE PRESIDENCY (112K) 23 -- THE END OF HISTORY (168K) 24 -- THE NEW WORLD ORDER (255K) 25 -- THYROID STORM (139K) _________________________________________________________________ Get faster connections -- switch to MSN Internet Access! http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/default.asp ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 18 Oct 2002 00:40:12 -0400 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: FA Subject: Re: Killingry->livingry / and a bet In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I think the map is one of RBF's greatest ideas. Foerd Ames Ocean Wave Energy Company 20 Burnside Street Bristol, RI 02809 USA email: foerd@owec.com web site: www.owec.com voice and fax: 401-253-4488 -----Original Message----- From: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works [mailto:GEODESIC@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU]On Behalf Of Quincy Quincy Quincy Sent: Tuesday, October 15, 2002 11:15 PM To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU Subject: Re: Killingry->livingry / and a bet especially, they use that God-am silly map! >http://www.worldgame.org/ > >There is a link on the BFI site to The World Game Institute. Bucky did a >lot >with what he called the "World Game", but I am not sure of exactly how the >World Game Institute relates to Bucky's work. They certainly use a lot of >Bucky's ideas. --A HYDROGEN (sic; cracked methane) ECONOMY?... The Three Phases of Exploitation of the Protocols of the Elders of Kyoto: (FOSSILISATION [McCainanites?] (TM/sic))/ BORE/GUSH/NADIR "@" http://www.tarpley.net/aobook.htm. Http://www.tarpley.net/bushb.htm (partial contents, below): 17 -- THE ATTEMPTED COUP D'ETAT, 3/30/81 (87K) 18 -- IRAN-CONTRA (140K) 19 -- THE LEVERAGED BUYOUT MOB (67K) 20 -- THE PHONY WAR ON DRUGS (26K) 21 -- OMAHA (25K) 22 -- GEORGE "#9" TAKES THE PRESIDENCY (112K) 23 -- THE END OF HISTORY (168K) 24 -- THE NEW WORLD ORDER (255K) 25 -- THYROID STORM (139K) _________________________________________________________________ Protect your PC - get McAfee.com VirusScan Online http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963 ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 18 Oct 2002 06:58:34 -0400 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: David Watkins Subject: Re: Killingry->livingry / and a bet MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT > I think the map is one of RBF's greatest ideas. > > Foerd Ames Me too. And I like the variations Bucky used to map various issues. But, it does confront our sense of the rectangular, just as the dome does. Peace, Dave Watkins http://mywebpages.comcast.net/daviwat/ ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 18 Oct 2002 16:53:37 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Gerardo Garcia Subject: Re: Killingry->livingry / and a bet Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Could anybody tell me if there is a great circle connecting the Argentinian city of Paraná (Entre Ríos), Tampico (Tamaulipas, México) and Vancouver (British Columbia, Canada); the regions seem to be connected as far as I can see from the BFI.org www page. If it is so, I can tell a story about affections and great circles. Gerardo >From: David Watkins >Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works > >To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU >Subject: Re: Killingry->livingry / and a bet >Date: Fri, 18 Oct 2002 06:58:34 -0400 > > > I think the map is one of RBF's greatest ideas. > > > > Foerd Ames > >Me too. And I like the variations Bucky used to map various issues. > >But, it does confront our sense of the rectangular, just as the dome does. > >Peace, > >Dave Watkins > >http://mywebpages.comcast.net/daviwat/ _________________________________________________________________ Protect your PC - get McAfee.com VirusScan Online http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963 ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 18 Oct 2002 21:07:51 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: Killingry->livingry / and a bet Comments: cc: synergeo@yahooGroups.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed ahem. the icosahedral gnomonicprojection is just a map. hemp is just a plant. Synergetics is just a subset of synthetic geometry. flouridation won't really kill you, much! NB: Hotmail's put my sig on top; sorry! --SIGHnS: Harry-the-Potter's "Public School," MacJihad versus McCrusade; Dame Jo din't write a Scholast's script; and "Let's you & Saddam dance" warn't Tony Blair's idea, either! >I think the map is one of RBF's greatest ideas. _________________________________________________________________ Surf the Web without missing calls! Get MSN Broadband. http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/freeactivation.asp ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 18 Oct 2002 21:13:19 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: Killingry->livingry / and a bet Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed actually, hte Buckymap is *more* perpendicular than the (say) Mercator one; that's why Bucky liked it! NB: Hotmail's put my sig on top; sorry! --SIGHnS: D*ck Ch*n*y's 2 focusgroups planned for this "clash o'civs," before 911! http://quincy4board.homestead.com/DeepPool.html www.larouchepub.com >Me too. And I like the variations Bucky used to map various issues. > >But, it does confront our sense of the rectangular, just as the dome does. _________________________________________________________________ Get a speedy connection with MSN Broadband. Join now! http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/freeactivation.asp ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 18 Oct 2002 21:22:27 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: Killingry->livingry / and a bet Comments: cc: synergeo@yahooGroups.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed are youincluding the whole, official areas of the cities, and if so, so, What, and Who cares? seriosuly, this is a great time tolearn the elements of navigation, startingwith "polar trigons & Napier's Law" (just my suggestion .-) NB: Hotmail's put my sig on top; sorry! --A HYDROGEN (sic; cracked methane) ECONOMY?... The Three Phases of Exploitation of the Protocols of the Elders of Kyoto: (FOSSILISATION [McCainanites?] (TM/sic))/ BORE/GUSH/NADIR "@" http://www.tarpley.net/aobook.htm. Http://www.tarpley.net/bushb.htm (partial contents, below): 17 -- THE ATTEMPTED COUP D'ETAT, 3/30/81 (87K) 18 -- IRAN-CONTRA (140K) 19 -- THE LEVERAGED BUYOUT MOB (67K) 20 -- THE PHONY WAR ON DRUGS (26K) 21 -- OMAHA (25K) 22 -- GEORGE "#9" TAKES THE PRESIDENCY (112K) 23 -- THE END OF HISTORY (168K) 24 -- THE NEW WORLD ORDER (255K) 25 -- THYROID STORM (139K) >Could anybody tell me if there is a great circle connecting the Argentinian >city of Paraná (Entre Ríos), Tampico (Tamaulipas, México) and Vancouver >(British Columbia, Canada); the regions seem to be connected as far as I >can >see from the BFI.org www page. If it is so, I can tell a story about >affections and great circles. _________________________________________________________________ Get a speedy connection with MSN Broadband. Join now! http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/freeactivation.asp ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 18 Oct 2002 21:58:57 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Gerardo Garcia Subject: Re: Killingry->livingry / and a bet Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed >From: Quincy Quincy Quincy >Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works > >To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU >Subject: Re: Killingry->livingry / and a bet >Date: Fri, 18 Oct 2002 21:22:27 +0000 > >are youincluding the whole, official areas >of the cities, and if so, >so, What, and Who cares? > seriosuly, this is a great time >tolearn the elements of navigation, >startingwith "polar trigons & Napier's Law" >(just my suggestion .-) > I am interested in the elements of navigation. Are there any links? dummy links, of course. And, what would be the navigation device? provided that John F. Nash and the LarouchePub don't give us soon something that doesn't wear the soil out. How wide are the widest great circles? I need at least a map that allows me to see the three cities and see if a ruler passes by the three points. Who cares? The only person that talked something pertinent about great circles of the earth and cultural facts (in this list) was Kiyoshi Kuromiya, but now he is deceased. The people involved in the story I can tell, do not care. Anyway I would try. Gerardo PS. about Mercator and desires to navigate, there is a gossip at http://www.geocities.com/cristofor_colom/ > >>Could anybody tell me if there is a great circle connecting the >>Argentinian >>city of Paraná (Entre Ríos), Tampico (Tamaulipas, México) and Vancouver >>(British Columbia, Canada); the regions seem to be connected as far as I >>can >>see from the BFI.org www page. If it is so, I can tell a story about >>affections and great circles. > > >_________________________________________________________________ >Get a speedy connection with MSN Broadband. Join now! >http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/freeactivation.asp _________________________________________________________________ Surf the Web without missing calls! Get MSN Broadband. http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/freeactivation.asp ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 7 Feb 2040 13:37:25 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Steve Miller Subject: Re: Killingry->livingry / and a bet MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Fluoridation! What is the fluoride a byproduct of, now? Quincy Quincy Quincy wrote: > ahem. the icosahedral gnomonicprojection is just a map. > hemp is just a plant. > Synergetics is just a subset of synthetic geometry. > flouridation won't really kill you, much! > > NB: Hotmail's put my sig on top; sorry! > > --SIGHnS: Harry-the-Potter's "Public School," > MacJihad versus McCrusade; > Dame Jo din't write a Scholast's script; > and "Let's you & Saddam dance" > warn't Tony Blair's idea, either! > >> I think the map is one of RBF's greatest ideas. > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > Surf the Web without missing calls! Get MSN Broadband. > http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/freeactivation.asp > -- Formactive: http://www.sover.net/~triorbtl/ ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 19 Oct 2002 12:29:54 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Organization: (Retired) Subject: Re: a manufacturer in holland Comments: To: team cqa MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Mr Spencer, If you use the search function at the bottom of my web site home page, you will get about 90 hits. I haven't checked them all, but the following Master Index page has my collection of octet truss info: http://www.buckminster.info//Index/Oct-Omnh.htm (scroll to "Octet"). I do know that the Mero Systems company in Germany makes octet truss structures. See http://www.mero.de/HOMEPAGE/index.html (click on "Construction Systems" and then on "Space Frame Structures") Some dome manufacturers also produce octet trusses. See: http://www.starnetint.com/cover.html (check out their hub designs) There is quite a few articles and books that have info about octet trusses; for example see http://www.buckminster.info//Ideas/05-OctetTrusIntro1.htm See also: http://www.buckminster.info//Ideas/05-Octet.htm I'm attempting to compile a list of significant geodesic domes for the whole world. So far I know of 6 domes in Spain at the following locations: Figueres (Dali Museum) Grand Canary Island (Pico de las Nieves Radome) Manzanares (Radome) Playa de Pals (Radome) Rota (Radome) Zaragoza (Private Residence) Can you add to this list? ============================== Joe S Moore joe_s_moore@hotmail.com http://buckminster.info <== NEW Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute ============================= ----- Original Message ----- From: "team cqa" To: Sent: Monday, August 27, 1956 2:43 AM Subject: a manufacturer in holland > hello mr moore, > > i live in a 40 foot geodesic dome here in zaragoza spain. i'd like to build > a mezzanine type loft, using an octet truss for the support structure > instead f standard 2x6 framing. > > would you please tell me where i can buy this octet trusss? it would be > nice if we could buy the hubs and use wooden struts purchased locally, but > for now any lead you could give me would be appreciated. someone in spain > told me there's a manufacturer in holland. > > thanks, mr moore > > frank spencer > ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 19 Oct 2002 21:40:38 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: Killingry->livingry / and a bet Comments: cc: synergeo@yahooGroups.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed is a catalan, a Basque?... who is John Cabot catalan?... alas, the rest is in spanish! there's only one "width" of great circle, known as "the circumference of Earth," and you just can't tell by a straight-edge using any known map. on the other hand, Mercator's has the special property ... eluding me, at this moment-being. NB: Hotmail's put my sig on top; sorry! --SIGHnS: Harry-the-Potter's "Public School," MacJihad versus McCrusade; Dame Jo din't write a Scholast's script; and "Let's you & Saddam dance" warn't Tony Blair's idea, either! thus qtuoh: >How wide are the widest great circles? I need at least a map that allows me >to see the three cities and see if a ruler passes by the three points. > >Who cares? The only person that talked something pertinent about great >circles of the earth and cultural facts (in this list) was Kiyoshi >PS. about Mercator and desires to navigate, there is a gossip at >http://www.geocities.com/cristofor_colom/ _________________________________________________________________ Get faster connections -- switch to MSN Internet Access! http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/default.asp ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 19 Oct 2002 21:43:07 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: Killingry->livingry / and a bet Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed mining, in general, and also that of the soil-critters (hence, the natural release of it into streams .-) NB: Hotmail's put my sig on top; sorry! --SIGHnS: D*ck Ch*n*y's 2 focusgroups planned for this "clash o'civs," before 911! http://quincy4board.homestead.com/DeepPool.html www.larouchepub.com >Fluoridation! What is the fluoride a byproduct of, now? >>ahem. the icosahedral gnomonicprojection is just a map. >>hemp is just a plant. >>Synergetics is just a subset of synthetic geometry. >>flouridation won't really kill you, much! _________________________________________________________________ Broadband? Dial-up? Get reliable MSN Internet Access. http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/default.asp ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 19 Oct 2002 18:06:11 -0400 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Steve Miller Subject: Re: Killingry->livingry / and a bet MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit On a radio show last year I heard that the fluoride used in public systems used to be a byproduct of aluminum production, but is now a byproduct of fertilizer. It is a toxic waste, used to poison rats in moderate doses. If you look on the tube of your toothpaste you will see a warning: POISON: DO NOT SWALLOW. Unless you have rare, nonfluoridated toothpaste. Fluoride is a rapid combiner- it is always found with a bunch of junk sticking to it. The vast majority of the 'fluoride' put in water is other, mostly unidentified, substances surrounding a tiny amount of fluoride. You have to admire the resourcefulness of the manufacturers to turn their toxic waste into valuable diluted poison for all. Think about it when you get a fluoide treatment-notice how careful the dentist or hygienist is to keep you from swallowing it. How much do you pay for this? I was being charged about $30.00 per dose. Now I know why I always felt sick. Quincy Quincy Quincy wrote: > mining, in general, and also that > of the soil-critters (hence, > the natural release of it into streams .-) > > NB: Hotmail's put my sig on top; sorry! > --SIGHnS: D*ck Ch*n*y's 2 focusgroups planned > for this "clash o'civs," before 911! > http://quincy4board.homestead.com/DeepPool.html > www.larouchepub.com > >> Fluoridation! What is the fluoride a byproduct of, now? > > >>> ahem. the icosahedral gnomonicprojection is just a map. >>> hemp is just a plant. >>> Synergetics is just a subset of synthetic geometry. >>> flouridation won't really kill you, much! >> > > > _________________________________________________________________ > Broadband? Dial-up? Get reliable MSN Internet Access. > http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/default.asp > -- Formactive: http://www.sover.net/~triorbtl/ ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 19 Oct 2002 21:29:44 -0400 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Lee Bonnifield Subject: Re: Killingry->livingry / and a bet Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable > is it a solution to grant everybody related to violence a grant with a ve= ry > high standard of living? ... Wouldn't it be necessry to begin granting th= e > related to violence people first? I see at least two problems with that solution. 1) It assumes that a very high standard of living is a motivating force for the people most likely to engage in violence. What if they already have a very high standard of living? I'm afraid there are other motivators for 18 year old men raised to admire superheroes and the warriors whose statues are on the courthouse lawn. Their motivations could be more hormonal than monetary. It could include the need for excitement, the need to excel at something that gets broad public respect, the need to control, threaten, or hurt others; the need to be told which ones are the evildoers so that you get praise when you threaten them; to be part of a cohesive group, to be told clearly what to do, etc. 2) Some WOULD be more motivated by money, so a grant might work in persuading them to stay home and think rather than becoming a globetrotting threat. But can you outbid the politicians who would also like to hire that 18 year old, as a threat to other politicians? The citizenry may be glad to get those kids out of the neighborhood, where they'd just be racing their cars, joining the police force or other gangs, smacking people around. Better to get them stationed overseas until they mellow. > Could anybody tell me if there is a great circle connecting the Argentini= an > city of Paran=E1 (Entre R=EDos), Tampico (Tamaulipas, M=E9xico) and Vancouver > (British Columbia, Canada); the regions seem to be connected as far as I = can > see from the BFI.org www page. If it is so, I can tell a story about > affections and great circles. > How wide are the widest great circles? I need at least a map that allows = me > to see the three cities and see if a ruler passes by the three points. A flat map would have to be custom-designed for those particular 3 cities for a ruler to work, most great circles on any flat map will trace as curves, not straight lines. A Bucky map projection would be one of the easiest ways to design a flat map that kept one particular great circle in a straight line -- maybe you picked those 3 cities because they did line up on a Bucky map? Or maybe a Parana to Vancouver jet dropped something in your yard? :-) If accuracy within 100 miles is close enough, use a spherical map (a globe) and a string stretched between Parana and Vancouver. I tried that, the string had too much friction with the globe for me to be sure it was pulled exactly along a great circle, but it could have been -- it could go directly over Tampico, with my sloppy effort. If you need more accuracy, somebody else could calculate it from these approximate longitudes & latitudes: Parana 60 W 32 S Tampico 98 W 22 N Vancouver 123 W 44 N but those exact points could be miles away from an exact great circle, you'd have to supply L & L more precisely. And then remember that the Earth is not a perfect sphere, so there are NO great circles on Earth if you're being very precise; there are geodesics near the rough surface, or great circles above the Earth, like airplanes fly. ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 20 Oct 2002 08:08:44 -0400 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Steve Miller Subject: Re: Killingry->livingry / and a bet MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Just stretch a string across a globe. >=20 >>Could anybody tell me if there is a great circle connecting the Argenti= nian >>city of Paran=E1 (Entre R=EDos), Tampico (Tamaulipas, M=E9xico) and Van= couver >>(British Columbia, Canada); the regions seem to be connected as far as = I can >>see from the BFI.org www page. If it is so, I can tell a story about >>affections and great circles. >> >=20 >=20 >>How wide are the widest great circles? I need at least a map that allow= s me >>to see the three cities and see if a ruler passes by the three points. >> >=20 > A flat map would have to be custom-designed for those particular 3 > cities for a ruler to work, most great circles on any flat map will > trace as curves, not straight lines. A Bucky map projection would be > one of the easiest ways to design a flat map that kept one particular > great circle in a straight line -- maybe you picked those 3 cities > because they did line up on a Bucky map? Or maybe a Parana to > Vancouver jet dropped something in your yard? :-) >=20 > If accuracy within 100 miles is close enough, use a spherical map (a > globe) and a string stretched between Parana and Vancouver. I tried > that, the string had too much friction with the globe for me to be > sure it was pulled exactly along a great circle, but it could have > been -- it could go directly over Tampico, with my sloppy effort. >=20 > If you need more accuracy, somebody else could calculate it from these > approximate longitudes & latitudes: >=20 > Parana 60 W 32 S >=20 > Tampico 98 W 22 N >=20 > Vancouver 123 W 44 N >=20 > but those exact points could be miles away from an exact great circle, > you'd have to supply L & L more precisely. And then remember that the > Earth is not a perfect sphere, so there are NO great circles on Earth > if you're being very precise; there are geodesics near the rough > surface, or great circles above the Earth, like airplanes fly. >=20 >=20 --=20 Formactive: http://www.sover.net/~triorbtl/ ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 20 Oct 2002 17:39:16 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Gerardo Garcia Subject: Re: Killingry->livingry / and a bet Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed >From: Quincy Quincy Quincy >Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works > >To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU >Subject: Re: Killingry->livingry / and a bet >Date: Sat, 19 Oct 2002 21:40:38 +0000 > >is a catalan, a Basque?... who is John Cabot catalan?... >alas, the rest is in spanish! catalan is the language (idiom) or a national (person) from Catalunya (Catalonia, Cataluña). The geocities page says that John Cabot was from Catalunya (a catalán, catalan. With or without graphic accent) The main page is in Spanish, but some links are multilingual. > there's only one "width" of great circle, >known as "the circumference of Earth," and >you just can't tell by a straight-edge >using any known map. on the other hand, >Mercator's has the special property ... eluding me, >at this moment-being. _________________________________________________________________ Broadband? Dial-up? Get reliable MSN Internet Access. http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/default.asp ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 20 Oct 2002 18:20:22 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Gerardo Garcia Subject: Re: Killingry->livingry / and a bet Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed >From: Lee Bonnifield >Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works > >To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU >Subject: Re: Killingry->livingry / and a bet >Date: Sat, 19 Oct 2002 21:29:44 -0400 > > > is it a solution to grant everybody related to violence a grant with a >very > > high standard of living? ... Wouldn't it be necessry to begin granting >the > > related to violence people first? > >I see at least two problems with that solution. > >1) It assumes that a very high standard of living is a motivating >force for the people most likely to engage in violence. What if they >already have a very high standard of living? I'm afraid there are >other motivators for 18 year old men raised to admire superheroes and >the warriors whose statues are on the courthouse lawn. Their >motivations could be more hormonal than monetary. It could include >the need for excitement, the need to excel at something that gets >broad public respect, the need to control, threaten, or hurt others; >the need to be told which ones are the evildoers so that you get >praise when you threaten them; to be part of a cohesive group, to be >told clearly what to do, etc. > >2) Some WOULD be more motivated by money, so a grant might work in >persuading them to stay home and think rather than becoming a >globetrotting threat. But can you outbid the politicians who would >also like to hire that 18 year old, as a threat to other politicians? >The citizenry may be glad to get those kids out of the neighborhood, >where they'd just be racing their cars, joining the police force or >other gangs, smacking people around. Better to get them stationed >overseas until they mellow. > The attorney general (Procurador General de la República) during the previuos mexican president Ernesto Zedillo, Raúl Lozano, dismissed 700 "judicial" policemen when he got in charge. After that, the assaults, kidnapping, car robberies, etc. skyrocketed in México City to the actual levels. (something anybody would like to mellow in the moon). Those guys do not know doing anything else. They might be recognized at least for their love for their offspring. In 1997, in Austin, TX (César Chavez ST, after the grapes picker, not the boxer) there was a "bear soup" place where everybody (criminal, illegal immigrant, or the contrary) could have a very decent meal for free. maybe the keyword is "mellow": a comprehensive mellowing sense of carefulness for everybody? > > > Could anybody tell me if there is a great circle connecting the >Argentinian > > city of Paraná (Entre Ríos), Tampico (Tamaulipas, México) and Vancouver > > (British Columbia, Canada); the regions seem to be connected as far as I >can > > see from the BFI.org www page. If it is so, I can tell a story about > > affections and great circles. > > > > How wide are the widest great circles? I need at least a map that allows >me > > to see the three cities and see if a ruler passes by the three points. > >A flat map would have to be custom-designed for those particular 3 >cities for a ruler to work, most great circles on any flat map will >trace as curves, not straight lines. A Bucky map projection would be >one of the easiest ways to design a flat map that kept one particular >great circle in a straight line -- maybe you picked those 3 cities >because they did line up on a Bucky map? Or maybe a Parana to >Vancouver jet dropped something in your yard? :-) > The mellowing was running between Paraná and Tampico, and later on a nephew of mine was casually vaulted to Vancouver. Later, he crossed the river between Canada and the States. They say that he "walked over the water" but the truth is that the river was not deep at all :) I will try to "complete" the story while maybe someone can tell me if there is a great circle connecting the three cities. >If accuracy within 100 miles is close enough, use a spherical map (a >globe) and a string stretched between Parana and Vancouver. I tried >that, the string had too much friction with the globe for me to be >sure it was pulled exactly along a great circle, but it could have >been -- it could go directly over Tampico, with my sloppy effort. > >If you need more accuracy, somebody else could calculate it from these >approximate longitudes & latitudes: > >Parana 60 W 32 S > >Tampico 98 W 22 N > >Vancouver 123 W 44 N > >but those exact points could be miles away from an exact great circle, >you'd have to supply L & L more precisely. And then remember that the >Earth is not a perfect sphere, so there are NO great circles on Earth >if you're being very precise; there are geodesics near the rough >surface, or great circles above the Earth, like airplanes fly. In a map (a Godell (?) or something like that, projection) the three cities are in a straight line. The dymaxion map at BFI' has no political divisions. Thanks for your answer. _________________________________________________________________ Unlimited Internet access for only $21.95/month. Try MSN! http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/2monthsfree.asp ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 20 Oct 2002 23:32:02 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: Killingry->livingry / and a bet Comments: cc: synergeo@yahooGroups.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed no dice. only works on a Buckymap, if all three cities lie on the same centers of symmetry for each trigon they're on (like the center); the map is *20 different projections*. that said, it's rpbably easy to determine that *on* a Bucky map, just by eying the string between the furtherest two cities, vis-a-vu the trigona that it crosses ... and the trigona have to be "tabbed" such that they are contiguous under the string, etc. NB: Hotmail's put my sig on top; sorry! --SIGHnS: Harry-the-Potter's "Public School," MacJihad versus McCrusade; Dame Jo din't write a Scholast's script; and "Let's you & Saddam dance" warn't Tony Blair's idea, either! thus quoth: >>A flat map would have to be custom-designed for those particular 3 >>cities for a ruler to work, most great circles on any flat map will >>trace as curves, not straight lines. A Bucky map projection would be >>one of the easiest ways to design a flat map that kept one particular >>great circle in a straight line -- maybe you picked those 3 cities >>because they did line up on a Bucky map? Or maybe a Parana to >>Vancouver jet dropped something in your yard? :-) >> >>If accuracy within 100 miles is close enough, use a spherical map (a >>globe) and a string stretched between Parana and Vancouver. I tried >>that, the string had too much friction with the globe for me to be >>sure it was pulled exactly along a great circle, but it could have >>been -- it could go directly over Tampico, with my sloppy effort. _________________________________________________________________ Unlimited Internet access -- and 2 months free! Try MSN. http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/2monthsfree.asp ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 20 Oct 2002 23:33:28 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: Killingry->livingry / and a bet Comments: cc: synergeo@yahooGroups.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed oops; the width is the diameter of Earth, of the circumference, of course. NB: Hotmail's put my sig on top; sorry! --SIGHnS: D*ck Ch*n*y's 2 focusgroups planned for this "clash o'civs," before 911! http://quincy4board.homestead.com/DeepPool.html www.larouchepub.com thus saith: >> there's only one "width" of great circle, >>known as "the circumference of Earth," and >>you just can't tell by a straight-edge >>using any known map. on the other hand, >>Mercator's has the special property ... eluding me, >>at this moment-being. _________________________________________________________________ Surf the Web without missing calls! Get MSN Broadband. http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/freeactivation.asp ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 1 Jan 1904 01:12:13 +0100 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: frank Subject: Re: a manufacturer in holland In-Reply-To: Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable hi mr moore thank you very much for your quick response. yes i can add to the list, i know oof two more domes not yet on your list. when i get exact locations i'll email you again. anything more i can help you with? thaks again. will be in touch frank spencer el 19/10/02 08:29 pm, Joe S Moore en joe_s_moore@HOTMAIL.COM escribi=F3: > Mr Spencer, >=20 > If you use the search function at the bottom of my web site home page, yo= u > will get about 90 hits. I haven't checked them all, but the following > Master Index page has my collection of octet truss info: > http://www.buckminster.info//Index/Oct-Omnh.htm (scroll to "Octet"). >=20 > I do know that the Mero Systems company in Germany makes octet truss > structures. > See http://www.mero.de/HOMEPAGE/index.html (click on "Construction System= s" > and then on "Space Frame Structures") >=20 > Some dome manufacturers also produce octet trusses. > See: http://www.starnetint.com/cover.html (check out their hub designs) >=20 > There is quite a few articles and books that have info about octet trusse= s; > for example see http://www.buckminster.info//Ideas/05-OctetTrusIntro1.htm >=20 > See also: http://www.buckminster.info//Ideas/05-Octet.htm >=20 > I'm attempting to compile a list of significant geodesic domes for the wh= ole > world. So far I know of 6 domes in Spain at the following locations: >=20 > Figueres (Dali Museum) > Grand Canary Island (Pico de las Nieves Radome) > Manzanares (Radome) > Playa de Pals (Radome) > Rota (Radome) > Zaragoza (Private Residence) >=20 > Can you add to this list? >=20 > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > Joe S Moore > joe_s_moore@hotmail.com > http://buckminster.info <=3D=3D NEW > Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >=20 > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "team cqa" > To: > Sent: Monday, August 27, 1956 2:43 AM > Subject: a manufacturer in holland >=20 >=20 >> hello mr moore, >>=20 >> i live in a 40 foot geodesic dome here in zaragoza spain. i'd like to > build >> a mezzanine type loft, using an octet truss for the support structure >> instead f standard 2x6 framing. >>=20 >> would you please tell me where i can buy this octet trusss? it would be >> nice if we could buy the hubs and use wooden struts purchased locally, > but >> for now any lead you could give me would be appreciated. someone in spa= in >> told me there's a manufacturer in holland. >>=20 >> thanks, mr moore >>=20 >> frank spencer >>=20 ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 22 Oct 2002 19:48:02 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: Tverse is what? Comments: cc: synergeo@yahooGroups.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed There’s no reason for anyone to confuse "12-around-none" with 12-around-one; you're walking on Newtonian water, here, or probably just dog-paddling too strenuously. The fact that you could easily find another 12A0, after trying to systematically pack balls *around* a 12A0, or "randomly with greasy balls in a big, tensile balloon," is neither here, nor any there. (That is, given suitable thought as to *how* to find them, say using conduction, "non-invasively.") Close is a cigar, as far as such imperfect spheres as ball-bearings go. The fact remains, the symmetry does not allow it. It's fine to say "Quite!" as a rejoinder to an assumption about chirality, but can you actually configure it, as I think that I can?… I'm only holding to adding them to the pockets in the 44-ball assembly, though, for now. There are so many "elementary" tools to apply to this stuff, but you seem to be stuck with your simulacrum. (It now seems that Kirby didn't really find ant more 12A0s, but how'd you have proved that he had, anyway?… There's a field of geometry-provers in computer science, but that is all geared toward arbitrary-precision arithmetic, not floating-point ops (flops), which is where the Mandelbrot-set hangs-up.) Here's my real criticism, which I just recalled, looking at your "rambling." If "12-order-vertex" is a term from graphtheory, then it's not applicable as such, whenever balls don't touch; "neighborliness" is not accepted as a criterion in it. (Vertexial) graphs are dualized to voronoi cells, all of which naturally touch (by construction). You can use any terms that you like, but you'll get the graphtheorists pissed-off – especially the conjecturally undead ones (Erdos e.g. !-) Anyway, it seems that the only symmetries that you can achieve are the (trivial) central-s., and probably those few chiral ones, related to the dodeca-asteron (sik .-) Thus quoth: You miss the fact that Tverse's claim is for a "space" that's mostly 12-around-1 (vertex order 12), with all the flexibility and hard-to-model confusion arising from perhaps randomly-placed "readjustment" zones (as noted above), NOT that the whole space is populated with Tverse's (formerly) "protons" --12-around-NONE highly regular icosahedra, which (a) *can* be packed layer-wise onto for at least three layers and (b) when acting as the center object in any other packing pattern the system is capable of, produces a *trend* toward symmetry (spherical variety) throughout the space in which it sits. NB: Hotmail's put my sig on top; sorry! --SIGHnS: Harry-the-Potter's "Public School," MacJihad versus McCrusade; Dame Jo din't write a Scholast's script; and "Let's you & Saddam dance" warn't Tony Blair's idea, either! _________________________________________________________________ Protect your PC - get McAfee.com VirusScan Online http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963 ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 22 Oct 2002 21:00:16 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: Working on your pages from a Library.... (KMM3257117V17024L0KM) Comments: To: hspersonalsupport@homesteadsupport.com, synergeo@yahooGroups.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed unfortunately, I've just seen taht, not only does SB not load the whole page, but that index page, itself, loads the same from the web. womehow, bug chunks of it are missing! I havn't worked on it for weeks, til after we got it going again from a similar problem. please; did you forward my request to Griffin? I realize taht this support cuts into your time, but it's all happenned since the upgrade; where's the list of enhancements that this provided, please? NB: Hotmail's put my sig on top; sorry! --SIGHnS: D*ck Ch*n*y's 2 focusgroups planned for this "clash o'civs," before 911! http://quincy4board.homestead.com/DeepPool.html www.larouchepub.com >Rest assured that your page opens in the online SiteBuilder, I've confirmed >this in multiple tests. > >If the library computer you are working restricts access you may or may not >be able to clear cache or access other settings. Also, even if you are able >to clear cache this may not clear your problems in the long-term. Please >keep in mind that the library most likely uses a "firewall" to protect >their network - this can cause loading problems with the SiteBuilder such >as the ones you have encountered. _________________________________________________________________ Get faster connections -- switch to MSN Internet Access! http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/default.asp ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 23 Oct 2002 22:26:39 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: Tverse is what? Comments: cc: synergeo@yahooGroups.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Is this Mr. Taylor?… You are using your *argumentarium ad hominem*, again; have you seen nothing of mine that is relevant (since I generally respond to "threads" on geometry, my One, True Avocation) ??… It's easy to explain, why I crospost between geodesic-l & synergeo, since "Dick" was doing the same, and there's a lot of overlap; I'mw sorry, if you subscribe to both lists, but it's quite manual from my end, even though the choices are not always so great. Groovy data, below, although I'm not sure, whose, Kirby. Thus quoth: In the case of "Quincy", I don't know what the solution is, given that he hasn't got the intelligence neither to refrain from cross-posting (that means deliberately copying or Cc'ing, Brian) messages for Synergeo to Geodesic or vice versa, nor to stop arbitrarily furthering his own completely obscure, personal and inconsequential agendas on either list. Perhaps unmoderated lists are just not feasible for these (Fullerian) topics? I happen to think that Fuller's ideas are worthy of more considerate treatment. The issue of so-called "rights" is not the same as that of simple relevance. Thus quoth: Close. Here are the stats (these are touching neighbor stats, reading directly from the applet's raw data): >>>packing.init("packing.txt") >>>packing.stats() Neighbors: 0 Balls with: 0 Neighbors: 1 Balls with: 0 Neighbors: 2 Balls with: 0 Neighbors: 3 Balls with: 135 Neighbors: 4 Balls with: 84 Neighbors: 5 Balls with: 92 Neighbors: 6 Balls with: 174 Neighbors: 7 Balls with: 287 Neighbors: 8 Balls with: 182 Neighbors: 9 Balls with: 32 Neighbors: 10 Balls with: 7 Neighbors: 11 Balls with: 4 Neighbors: 12 Balls with: 3 Total examined: 1000 Average number of neighbors: 6.148 Two other 12-around-1s. [?] [from another posting:] Here's a lingering web page on the topic: http://www.inetarena.com/~pdx4d/ocn/sphpacking.html NB: Hotmail's put my sig on top; sorry! --SIGHnS: D*ck Ch*n*y's 2 focusgroups planned for this "clash o'civs," before 911! http://quincy4board.homestead.com/DeepPool.html www.larouchepub.com _________________________________________________________________ Get faster connections -- switch to MSN Internet Access! http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/default.asp ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 23 Oct 2002 22:29:38 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: CCP; icosa; VE Comments: To: synergeo@yahooGroups.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed What a weird, apples-and-elephants thing! Are you talking about the centers of the spheres, as with the making of the watermanhedra (where's the better terminology for that, as well?) ?? Thus quoth: http://www.grunch.net/synergetics/volumes2.html The nuked icosa is scaled up by 1/0.951057 or 1.05146, and volume will be up as a 3rd power of this scale factor, i.e. about 1.16246. So the final volumes table is: Volume Radii Non-nuked icosa: 18.51 0.951 Regular cubocta: 20.00 1.0 Nuked icosa: 21.52 1.0 Not surprisingly, the nuked icosa comes closer to filling the volume of the sphere it inscribes than the VE of same radius, as the regular icosa is "more spherical". NB: Hotmail's put my sig on top; sorry! --SIGHnS: Harry-the-Potter's "Public School," MacJihad versus McCrusade; Dame Jo din't write a Scholast's script; and "Let's you & Saddam dance" warn't Tony Blair's idea, either! _________________________________________________________________ Surf the Web without missing calls! Get MSN Broadband. http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/freeactivation.asp ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2002 11:29:45 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Organization: (Retired) Subject: Re: Back in business Comments: To: johill Comments: cc: "List, The DomeHome" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Jeff, I am very glad to hear that you are back in business! So many dome = manufs have come & gone over the years--it gets kind of depressing. I = will include your new info in my annual January update. Your new = website looks good: http://www.domeplans.com =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D Joe S Moore joe_s_moore@hotmail.com http://buckminster.info <=3D=3D NEW Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D ----- Original Message -----=20 From: johill=20 To: joe_s_moore@hotmail.com=20 Sent: Wednesday, October 23, 2002 6:46 AM Subject: Back in business Hi Joe, I was catching up on the backlog from the DomeHome list and saw your = reference to your manufactures list in your response to William. In = checking out my own listing at = http://www.buckminster.info//Index/DomeManuf-P.htm for Precision = Structures, I noticed that you show me as OUT OF BUSINESS. That was = true in Oct. of 2000 but now I'm back with a web site, Professional Dome = Plans. I wouldn't mention it except that I see you've done fairly = recent updates so I thought you might want to add it to your future = update list. Nice to have the DomeHome list back isn't it. I didn't realize how = much I missed it. Thanks, Jeff Hill ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2002 11:58:20 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Organization: (Retired) Subject: Re: buckminster fuller Comments: To: Greg MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Greg, This is the info that I have: According to a letter to the editor that appeared in the Summer '89 issue of DOME magazine (page 4), Bucky contributed an short poem entitled "How Little I Know" for the following book: _Extra-Terrestrials Among Us_ by George C. Andrews Llewellyn Publications (1987) St. Paul, MN, USA It would appear that you have an original draft. You might want to compare your copy to the words as quoted in the above article in DOME mag and/or in the book. ============================== Joe S Moore joe_s_moore@hotmail.com http://buckminster.info <== NEW Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute ============================= ----- Original Message ----- From: "Greg" To: Sent: Wednesday, October 23, 2002 9:20 AM Subject: buckminster fuller > Dear Joe, > I came across your great Buckminster Fuller site, and thought you might be a > good person to ask about a Fuller pamphlet I happen to have entitled "How > Little I Know." It appears to have been typed or printed on double 11" x > 17" paper, then folded over to make an 8" x 11" sized pamphlet stapled > through the middle. The curious thing, however, is that on virtually every > page there are squares of paper pasted over the original text with corrected > text typed over it, making it seem more like an original manuscript of some > kind than printed matter that was widely distributed. Have you run across > something like this before? I can't remember how I got piece, but think > I've had it since about 1969, which would put me in a situation where my > father was working in a project where there were many cutting-edge > scientists, thinkers and grad students passing through. Thanks and all > best, Greg Aunapu > ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2002 12:58:43 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Organization: (Retired) Subject: Re: buckminster fuller Comments: To: Round12345@aol.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Michael, In my previous reply re Fuller's poem "How Little I Know" I forgot to mention that it also appeared in a Saturday Review magazine series called "What I Have Learned" in the Nov 12, 1966, issue on pages 70-77. Spencer Hunter graciously placed the list of articles that you refer to on his website long ago before I had my own web site. ============================== Joe S Moore joe_s_moore@hotmail.com http://buckminster.info <== NEW Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute ============================= ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Thursday, October 24, 2002 12:23 PM Subject: Re: buckminster fuller > I was going to send you the following link about the Fuller poem > > http://www.u.arizona.edu/~shunter/rbf.txt > > but then saw who reformatted the listing! You're everywhere!! > > Keep up the great work! > > Michael Round > Overland Park, KS > ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2002 20:08:44 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Gerardo Garcia Subject: Re: buckminster fuller Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Hello, maybe in this context, a comment on something like the "supposedly" piracy of the term "tensegrity" by Carlos Castaneda, wouldn´t be out of place. I knew first of Buckminster Fuller, because I was browsing some www Carlos Castaneda sites. I do not think that the Castaneda's "endorsement" of the term "tensegrity" was casual. Even less in an internet (altavista, google, yahoo, etc) age. I do even state that pointing to somebody (in the utopies field) in this times (as what I believe the Castaneda's adoption of the term above was: a precessional strategic pointing) is a question of integrity. Nobody answered me exactly whether the three cities (Paraná, TAmpico and Vancouver) could be considered in a great circle; I hope that this assumption of mine will be approprietly responded (together to my other assumption that Foghouse is the leader in the advancement of Fuller's ideas and ideals). With Teilhard de Chardin as a witness, I am expecting some kind of metaphysical intercourse (with due respect) :) As Lee said: something to fall in my yard. Gerardo >From: Joe S Moore >Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works > >To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU >Subject: Re: buckminster fuller >Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2002 11:58:20 -0700 > >Greg, > >This is the info that I have: > >According to a letter to the editor that appeared in the Summer '89 issue >of >DOME magazine (page 4), Bucky contributed an short poem entitled "How >Little >I Know" for the following book: > >_Extra-Terrestrials Among Us_ >by George C. Andrews >Llewellyn Publications (1987) >St. Paul, MN, USA > >It would appear that you have an original draft. You might want to compare >your copy to the words as quoted in the above article in DOME mag and/or in >the book. > >============================== >Joe S Moore >joe_s_moore@hotmail.com >http://buckminster.info <== NEW >Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute >============================= > >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Greg" >To: >Sent: Wednesday, October 23, 2002 9:20 AM >Subject: buckminster fuller > > > > Dear Joe, > > I came across your great Buckminster Fuller site, and thought you might >be >a > > good person to ask about a Fuller pamphlet I happen to have entitled >"How > > Little I Know." It appears to have been typed or printed on double 11" >x > > 17" paper, then folded over to make an 8" x 11" sized pamphlet stapled > > through the middle. The curious thing, however, is that on virtually >every > > page there are squares of paper pasted over the original text with >corrected > > text typed over it, making it seem more like an original manuscript of >some > > kind than printed matter that was widely distributed. Have you run >across > > something like this before? I can't remember how I got piece, but think > > I've had it since about 1969, which would put me in a situation where my > > father was working in a project where there were many cutting-edge > > scientists, thinkers and grad students passing through. Thanks and >all > > best, Greg Aunapu > > _________________________________________________________________ Broadband? Dial-up? Get reliable MSN Internet Access. http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/default.asp ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2002 21:14:37 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: buckminster fuller Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Casteneda gave his last workshop on it in the SMC gym, and I almost went to the introductory event (he lived around here, as well). recently, I saw a group of about 15-20 people doing it at a local yoga/dance/etc. place; it was a lot like free-form, hyperkinetic tai-chi (falun gong, what ever). I still don't care, if any 3 cities are "on" a GC; so, What? as a large part of Bucky's ouevre is supposed to be axiomatically "apolitical," it's horseshit (intertransformabilities .-) NB: Hotmail's put my sig on top; sorry! --SIGHnS: Harry-the-Potter's "Public School," MacJihad versus McCrusade; Dame Jo din't write a Scholast's script; and "Let's you & Saddam dance" warn't Tony Blair's idea, either! thus quoth: >I do even state that pointing to somebody (in the utopies field) in this >times (as what I believe the Castaneda's adoption of the term above was: a >precessional strategic pointing) is a question of integrity. > >Nobody answered me exactly whether the three cities (Paraná, TAmpico and >Vancouver) could be considered in a great circle; I hope that this >assumption of mine will be approprietly responded (together to my other >assumption that Foghouse is the leader in the advancement of Fuller's ideas _________________________________________________________________ Choose an Internet access plan right for you -- try MSN! http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/default.asp ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2002 21:44:14 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: peristalsis occureth (was: Tverse is what?) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Two things, firstly. When I say "elementary," it could as well mean "time-consuming," if that means that one has to "work backwards through Eucild til dawn suffices" … backwards metaphor, but go with the paradox (meaning, don't beat your head against the wall for the rest of your life, like Lord Berty) … because to try to prove "modern, pure, solid geometry" with ham-handed virtual tools, is "no there, where, Man!" So, by this token, it's just as futile to rely upon a compasses-construction of a theorem *as* the development of a *demonstrando esta quad* (or a proof), although it should be a simple matter to construct the proof by appealing to the diagram, or to disprove itself. But don't appease your shakey e-pencil with the tautology. One dose not have a) to do all of the constructions that one proves, as one reads the manual, so long as that one has done all of the elementary operations (dropping perpendiculars, bisecting angles, proportioning segments etc.) in concert in several proofs (as in Euclid); nor b) to make complete diagrams of the (say) dodeca-asteron or assemblage of spheres or what-hath-one – why I suggest the quoted book, hereinafter _The Tetrahedron and How to Use It!_. The whole matter of so-called initial conditions is just where the "universality" of the M-set implodes. In the field, which I visited on my one day at UCSC (Heinz Otto-Peitgen was on his European part of the year, summer; no matter), it is known by the metaphor of "magnification." It really is a sort of couch-potato thing, although the problem with the specification isn't just limited to that, because I'm quite sure that there's (usually) no direct "mapping" between the FLOPs and the resolution; eh? "Trivial" is almost always meant (in science) in both ways, Duh! and Doh? ... even if it ain't truly obvious, theretofore. The main problem may be, you really haven't defined your neologistic use of "12-order vertex." NB: I wasn't sure that last night's message had made it, because of a curious error that hit, just as I hit the SEND button. anyway, as i recall, Jim was also at M-boy's general talk: it was quite a bore, and I was the only one who asked a technical question. thus saith: Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2002 03:49:59 -0000 From: "Brian Hutchings" Subject: Re: Tverse is what? thou don'tst believeth me; well, pray for enlightenment! you missed the whole ideal, that the FLOPS do not even allow you to prove this stuff, because they are inherently chaotic. I uncovered this, myself, before I found a reference, with the obvious absurdity of the "universality of the M-set." yes, I even asked monsieur M. at Royce Hall, UCLA; you can ask DAvid Koski or Russell Chu, what they thought he said. I thought, it was quite a funny way to beg the question! yes, "trivial" has both concurrent meanings, as used by geometers; yeeha! NB: Hotmail's put my sig on top; sorry! --SIGHnS: D*ck Ch*n*y's 2 focusgroups planned for this "clash o'civs," before 911! http://quincy4board.homestead.com/DeepPool.html www.larouchepub.com _________________________________________________________________ Unlimited Internet access -- and 2 months free! Try MSN. http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/2monthsfree.asp ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 25 Oct 2002 01:42:40 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Gerardo Garcia Subject: Re: buckminster fuller Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed >From: Quincy Quincy Quincy >Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works > >To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU >Subject: Re: buckminster fuller >Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2002 21:14:37 +0000 > >Casteneda gave his last workshop on it >in the SMC gym, and I almost went >to the introductory event (he lived around here, >as well). recently, I do not think that you missed anything. I insist: the most important thing Castaneda did in his final days was to point towards Fuller. But I insist, maybe the dome builders (Mr. Fuller himself in his time) design the security superbly well and there are no bad accidents, but it is necessary to have the money first to design the life grants for the displaced by any new technologies (domes included). Maybe it is very natural to pursue a "beatle" kind of hit, like the hypercar, as a middle step. In the mean time, the main battle seems to be for the modeling (who makes the invisible visible in the best fashion): I insist again: foghouse seems to be leading. Even Mr. Fuller's grandson seems to agree: http://www.bfi.org/buckyUpClose.html Well, Castaneda also claimed to have the best recipe for watching the invisible with your own eyes; no drugs involved. Just try the recapitulation of plain literary practice. The fight for the best way to make the invisible visible. Maybe this links say something about it: (to see who Castaneda denied a business movie deal) http://www.brightlightsfilm.com/26/fellini3.html (to see who was Fellini) http://hotwired.lycos.com/books/96/10/fellini.html (one of his films) http://www.cinemaitalia.com/fellini/nave_comm.html (more about Castaneda and Fellini) http://www.sustainedaction.org/Explorations/castaneda_meets_jodorowsky.htm If it is true that nowadays the battle is not between ideologies but betweeen utopic visions, some credit has to be given to Castaneda for pointing towards Fuller. It is not possible to publish one internet site with the word "tensegrity" and that such word does not take you to the Fuller www sites. Gerardo García >I saw a group of about 15-20 people doing it >at a local yoga/dance/etc. place; >it was a lot like free-form, >hyperkinetic tai-chi (falun gong, >what ever). > I still don't care, if >any 3 cities are "on" a GC; so, What? > as a large part of Bucky's ouevre is supposed >to be axiomatically "apolitical," it's horseshit >(intertransformabilities .-) > >NB: Hotmail's put my sig on top; sorry! >--SIGHnS: Harry-the-Potter's "Public School," >MacJihad versus McCrusade; >Dame Jo din't write a Scholast's script; >and "Let's you & Saddam dance" >warn't Tony Blair's idea, either! > >thus quoth: >>I do even state that pointing to somebody (in the utopies field) in this >>times (as what I believe the Castaneda's adoption of the term above was: a >>precessional strategic pointing) is a question of integrity. >> >>Nobody answered me exactly whether the three cities (Paraná, TAmpico and >>Vancouver) could be considered in a great circle; I hope that this >>assumption of mine will be approprietly responded (together to my other >>assumption that Foghouse is the leader in the advancement of Fuller's >>ideas > > >_________________________________________________________________ >Choose an Internet access plan right for you -- try MSN! >http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/default.asp _________________________________________________________________ Surf the Web without missing calls! Get MSN Broadband. http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/freeactivation.asp ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2002 23:28:46 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Organization: (Retired) Subject: Re: a manufacturer in holland MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Frank, I know of 1 radome in Gibraltar but none in Portugal, except there's one radome on Terceira Island in the Azores. Should I send you my list of domes for France? ============================== Joe S Moore joe_s_moore@hotmail.com http://buckminster.info <== NEW Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute ============================= ----- Original Message ----- From: "frank" Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic To: Sent: Thursday, December 31, 1903 5:12 PM Subject: Re: a manufacturer in holland hi mr moore thank you very much for your quick response. yes i can add to the list, i know oof two more domes not yet on your list. when i get exact locations i'll email you again. anything more i can help you with? thaks again. will be in touch frank spencer (snip) ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 25 Oct 2002 11:25:39 -0400 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Lee Bonnifield Subject: Re: buckminster fuller Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable > Nobody answered me exactly whether the three cities (Paran=E1, TAmpico and > Vancouver) could be considered in a great circle; I did; if you want more precision than I got with a string on a globe, you must be more precise about the widths of the cities and their precise locations. If you are thinking of a cylinder with the diameter of the Earth and an axial length of 100 miles, yes, they're on a great cylinder. Maybe I made up the term great cylinder. A great circle has zero width (the dimension I call axial length on a cylinder.) The width of the cylinder gives you some margin for error; if a great circle passes one inch to the left of the Tampico point you're interested in, that point is not on a great circle, but it would be on a great cylinder a foot long with the great circle at its center. Or, here's another answer: Yes, I GUARANTEE that the precise geometrical centers of those cities are on a great circle. EVERY triplet of cities is on a great circle. Any 3 nonlinear points are on some circle; every circle is a circumference of some sphere. The trick is that the sphere containing that great circle is probably in space, not coinciding with the surface of the Earth. The sphere might be a different size, and centered in a different place than the center of the Earth. That probably isn't the answer you want. If you insist that the great circle must be centered on the Earth's center, that the GC must be on the surface of Earth, you must be more specific about how close to a great circle you'll accept. The cities are close to being on a great circle, but Earth is not a perfect sphere so there are no perfect great circles. Is it OK if your hypothetical GC passes thru the eastern edge of Tampico and the western edge of Vancouver, etc? Is it OK if the circle passes thru Vancouver at ground level but is 437 feet above the ground at Tampico? You seem to insisting on a very precise answer to a vague question. ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 25 Oct 2002 09:17:06 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Re: Simplicity domes MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Hi Dan I'd like to contribute to the section on simplicity. The randome design is brand new and is undergoing prototyping. Some info is available on the web and I am happy to offer any more I have. The design is almost math free. There are no chord factors to mess with. All hub elements are identical. Struts automatically adjust in length. Anyone can build one with a few simple directions. There is a picture at: http://www.washedashore.com/randome/ More info is at: http://groups.msn.com/BuckminsterFuller/shoebox.msnw?Page=7 Everyone is welcome to use the design for personal or humanitarian needs. Anyone interested in manufacturing randomes should contact me. Dick Fischbeck > >--- J & D Goldman wrote: > > > >> One idea for a chapter is Simplicity Domes. The main > >> objective would > >> be to compile materials, designs, methods of > >> construction, etc., > >> that reduce the "reasons not to" when one considers a > >> dome as an > >> alternative to the routine rectilinear structure. If > >> nothing else, > >> its a leader to help people break the ice and try a > dome > >> for the first > >> time. This might be easiest to apply to small > structures > >> like sheds, > >> garages, place-in-the-woods, etc., but need not be > >> limited to that. __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Y! Web Hosting - Let the expert host your web site http://webhosting.yahoo.com/ ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 25 Oct 2002 19:56:33 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Gerardo Garcia Subject: Synergy hazards Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed The mexican architect Alfonso Ramírez Ponce, reports on the leaned brick technique in: http://www.arponce.itgo.com/index.html In the next link, he mentions that the technique is located in time and geography 3000 years ago in Luxor, Egypt and today in central México. http://www.arponce.itgo.com/custom.html Although Alfonso Ramírez remarks that both places (in Egypt and México) are located on the same latitude, I won't mention anything about great circles because Lee puts me against the wall :) Next link is something in English about leaned brick construction http://www.networkearth.org/naturalbuilding/curves.html Architect Ramírez knows B. Fuller, Italian semiotician Umberto Eco knows about Fuller since 1962 (1968, U. Mursia.-Milano, Italia "La definizione dell'Arte") ...."the architects of the yuxtaposed spheres". But, they find it very difficult to converge in one people oriented science. Regarding the leaned brick techniques, it seems to be much less expensive than the actual dome building. Thus, the first law of Gerardo says that "it will be easier that Quincy and I agree on some subject than the dome builders hyperdome the hypercar project". I even coined a neologism. Gerardo PS. Thanks Lee. I will assume that the aforemailmentioned three cities are in a same not so wide cyllinder great circle. I am collecting the Vancouver traveler (by plane) experiences. _________________________________________________________________ Choose an Internet access plan right for you -- try MSN! http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/default.asp ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 25 Oct 2002 22:26:57 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: ESRI (was: buckminster fuller) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed thelink to the theatre-thing(reCasteneda) got me tothis one about ESRI, which reminded me, did you see in the paper about the Xian Science globe? if so, you'd knowabout it'sspecial feature, going on the "tour" of the inside; did Bucky suggest the same thing for the "geoscope?" NB: Hotmail's put my sig on top; sorry! --SIGHnS: Harry-the-Potter's "Public School," MacJihad versus McCrusade; Dame Jo din't write a Scholast's script; and "Let's you & Saddam dance" warn't Tony Blair's idea, either! thus quoth: >Well, Castaneda also claimed to have the best recipe for watching the >invisible with your own eyes; no drugs involved. Just try the >recapitulation of plain literary practice. _________________________________________________________________ Get a speedy connection with MSN Broadband. Join now! http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/freeactivation.asp ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 25 Oct 2002 22:59:19 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: Gaps Comments: cc: synergeo@yahooGroups.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Dam-rightit’swrong; You assumed that it was a linear (constant) function Of the number of vertices – shades of “Dick Fischstichk” – when their placement is areal; eh? As for the Piggybacking syndrome, Newton admitted to it & it was commemoratedin '99 by a 2-pund coin – with a big joke on the edge!… While it'strue that there'snottoo much that is new in _S_ -- beyond the artifacts-induced know-howof _I_ (_Inventions_) – he also made several great observations, that may have even been original (see "tensegrity;" a-hem !-) What he had, that you don't seemto, is those "tools" that are soelementary, a good grounding in constructive geometry (since he was into navigation, he had to *really* learn it, in spite of any difficulties he may'vehad at Milton Academy). Thus quoth: That is, no matter how one places the spheres in this, the gaps between the outer-12 spheres must total to the same number, whether the sphere-pack is in VE form, regicosa form, or "Our Lady" form, or anything in between. Thus quoth: >I have the egotistical temerity to believe Fuller's stuff should be >piggybacking on MINE, not the other way around. NB: Hotmail's put my sig on top; sorry! --SIGHnS: Harry-the-Potter's "Public School," MacJihad versus McCrusade; Dame Jo din't write a Scholast's script; and "Let's you & Saddam dance" warn't Tony Blair's idea, either! --SIGHnS: D*ck Ch*n*y's 2 focusgroups planned for this "clash o'civs," before 911! http://quincy4board.homestead.com/DeepPool.html www.larouchepub.com --A HYDROGEN (sic; cracked methane) ECONOMY?... The Three Phases of Exploitation of the Protocols of the Elders of Kyoto: (FOSSILISATION [McCainanites?] (TM/sic))/ BORE/GUSH/NADIR "@" http://www.tarpley.net/aobook.htm. Http://www.tarpley.net/bushb.htm (partial contents, below): 17 -- THE ATTEMPTED COUP D'ETAT, 3/30/81 (87K) 18 -- IRAN-CONTRA (140K) 19 -- THE LEVERAGED BUYOUT MOB (67K) 20 -- THE PHONY WAR ON DRUGS (26K) 21 -- OMAHA (25K) 22 -- GEORGE "#9" TAKES THE PRESIDENCY (112K) 23 -- THE END OF HISTORY (168K) 24 -- THE NEW WORLD ORDER (255K) 25 -- THYROID STORM (139K) _________________________________________________________________ Broadband? Dial-up? Get reliable MSN Internet Access. http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/default.asp ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 26 Oct 2002 17:43:49 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Gerardo Garcia Subject: Re: ESRI (was: buckminster fuller) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed >From: Quincy Quincy Quincy >Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works > >To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU >Subject: ESRI (was: buckminster fuller) >Date: Fri, 25 Oct 2002 22:26:57 +0000 > This is equilibrium in three paragraphs! and a fresh air! (no links) but I do not know anything about ESRI or Xian Science globe. I guess I can yahoogle it. >thelink to the theatre-thing(reCasteneda) got me >tothis one about ESRI, which reminded me, >did you see in the paper about the Xian Science globe? > if so, you'd knowabout it'sspecial feature, >going on the "tour" of the inside; >did Bucky suggest the same thing >for the "geoscope?" > And it was Fuller who said (did he forget to say something?) that language was the first and most complex technology. Has anybody ever recognized Quincy's efforts to retool it? It might be the first thing to do towards ______________________ (fill it in full joy) >NB: Hotmail's put my sig on top; sorry! >--SIGHnS: Harry-the-Potter's "Public School," >MacJihad versus McCrusade; >Dame Jo din't write a Scholast's script; >and "Let's you & Saddam dance" >warn't Tony Blair's idea, either! > >thus quoth: >>Well, Castaneda also claimed to have the best recipe for watching the >>invisible with your own eyes; no drugs involved. Just try the >>recapitulation of plain literary practice. > better, form a dome cartel and cherish Mr. Lula da Silva and his pillow Brazilian former theologian heretic Leonardo Boff in his quest for a utopy. > >_________________________________________________________________ >Get a speedy connection with MSN Broadband. Join now! >http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/freeactivation.asp _________________________________________________________________ Unlimited Internet access for only $21.95/month. Try MSN! http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/2monthsfree.asp ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 26 Oct 2002 13:04:42 -0400 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Lee Bonnifield Subject: Re: Killingry->livingry / and a bet Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable > The attorney general (Procurador General de la Rep=FAblica) during the > previuos mexican president Ernesto Zedillo, Ra=FAl Lozano, dismissed 700 > "judicial" policemen when he got in charge. After that, the assaults, > kidnapping, car robberies, etc. skyrocketed in M=E9xico City to the actual > levels. Do you mean that prior to the dismissal most assaults etc were not reported, and after the dismissal the number of reports rose to match the actual number of assaults? Or that the number of assaults etc rose because the 700 police were no longer there to stop them? Or (more in keeping with the premise of the thread) the 700 ex-police committed new assaults etc because they were no longer getting paid? ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 26 Oct 2002 18:50:00 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Gerardo Garcia Subject: Re: Killingry->livingry / and a bet Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Hi Lee, the dismissed became (enough of them) the "appropriatly trained" capos of many gangs. The thing is, how do you dismiss just like that somebody that does not know anything else but "working" with weapons? Worse, what their feelings would be seeing that the rest of the corrupt appartus prevail? Several of the cruelest kidnappers are ex-policemen. >From: Lee Bonnifield >Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works > >To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU >Subject: Re: Killingry->livingry / and a bet >Date: Sat, 26 Oct 2002 13:04:42 -0400 > > > The attorney general (Procurador General de la República) during the > > previuos mexican president Ernesto Zedillo, Raúl Lozano, dismissed 700 > > "judicial" policemen when he got in charge. After that, the assaults, > > kidnapping, car robberies, etc. skyrocketed in México City to the actual > > levels. > >Do you mean that prior to the dismissal most assaults etc were not >reported, and after the dismissal the number of reports rose to match >the actual number of assaults? > >Or that the number of assaults etc rose because the 700 police were no >longer there to stop them? > >Or (more in keeping with the premise of the thread) the 700 ex-police >committed new assaults etc because they were no longer getting paid? _________________________________________________________________ Broadband? Dial-up? Get reliable MSN Internet Access. http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/default.asp ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 26 Oct 2002 15:02:54 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Re: the hubs for the octet truss? Comments: To: frank In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Hi Frank I can tell you an easy way to build an octet truss if you like. Take a look at the cupdome pictured at: http://groups.msn.com/BuckminsterFuller/shoebox.msnw?Page=6 All you have to do is to make lots of identical triangular box, both ends open, and fasten them together into a truss. That's it. The points where you fasten the truss to the sides of the dome are anywhere they touch. The truss is hung on the dome at any level. Does that make sense? The boxes could be made of sheet metal, for example. Light weight. Any thickness truss. What is the span going to be? Dick --- frank wrote: > hi mr fischbeck > > i live in a 40 foot dome in spain. > > i'd like to put a loft above the maain floor and would > like to use an octet > truss strusture to spupport the loft floor. do you know > where i can buy the > hubs for the truss? > > please contact me. > > thank you > > frank spencer > __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Y! Web Hosting - Let the expert host your web site http://webhosting.yahoo.com/ ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 26 Oct 2002 20:31:06 -0400 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Steve Miller Subject: Re: the hubs for the octet truss? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit How rigid is it? Dick Fischbeck wrote: > Hi Frank > > I can tell you an easy way to build an octet truss if you > like. > > Take a look at the cupdome pictured at: > > http://groups.msn.com/BuckminsterFuller/shoebox.msnw?Page=6 > > All you have to do is to make lots of identical triangular > box, both ends open, and fasten them together into a truss. > That's it. > > The points where you fasten the truss to the sides of the > dome are anywhere they touch. The truss is hung on the dome > at any level. > > Does that make sense? The boxes could be made of sheet > metal, for example. Light weight. Any thickness truss. What > is the span going to be? > > Dick > > --- frank wrote: > >>hi mr fischbeck >> >>i live in a 40 foot dome in spain. >> >>i'd like to put a loft above the maain floor and would >>like to use an octet >>truss strusture to spupport the loft floor. do you know >>where i can buy the >>hubs for the truss? >> >>please contact me. >> >>thank you >> >>frank spencer >> >> > > > __________________________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > Y! Web Hosting - Let the expert host your web site > http://webhosting.yahoo.com/ > > -- Formactive: http://www.sover.net/~triorbtl/ ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 26 Oct 2002 18:07:48 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Organization: (Retired) Subject: Re: Pacific Domes Booklets located. Comments: To: Mitch Case Comments: cc: "List, The DomeHome" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Mitch, OK, now I remember. Amazon.com notified me that the order was not = completed because of inventory problems. I'm not interested in buying = the Pacific Domes Floor Plans Booklets however, I'm sending a copy of = this email to two electronic newsletters ("lists") that have subscribers = that may be interested. See: "Cc" =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D Joe S Moore joe_s_moore@hotmail.com http://buckminster.info <=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D N E W Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Mitch Case=20 To: Joe S Moore=20 Sent: Saturday, October 26, 2002 11:50 AM Subject: Re: Pacific Domes Booklets located. Yes, one of thes orders was me, from Amazon-King ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Joe S Moore=20 To: Mitch Case=20 Sent: Saturday, October 26, 2002 1:33 PM Subject: Re: Pacific Domes Booklets located. Mitch, I'm a little confused. I don't remember trying to buy some old (I = presume) Pacific Domes Booklets. I recently ordered several used books = thru Amazon.com, two of which orders fell thru for various reasons. Was = one of those you? = =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D Joe S Moore joe_s_moore@hotmail.com http://buckminster.info <=3D=3D NEW Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute = =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Mitch Case=20 To: joe_s_moore@hotmail.com=20 Sent: Saturday, October 26, 2002 11:11 AM Subject: Pacific Domes Booklets located. Condition: Collectible - Very Good=20 Seller's comments: The floor plans to five pacific dome homes (not = 0840340096) in color, 20', 24', 30', 36' and 44' w/plastic covers.=20 I will ship this now for $9.00 even no extra shipping; call = 972-675-1207 for Visa/Master or Discover processing. Ask for Mitch www.PacificDomes.com ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 27 Oct 2002 12:53:10 +0100 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: frank Subject: Re: a manufacturer in holland In-Reply-To: Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable el 25/10/02 08:28 am, Joe S Moore en joe_s_moore@HOTMAIL.COM escribi=F3: > Frank, >=20 > I know of 1 radome in Gibraltar but none in Portugal, except there's one > radome on Terceira Island in the Azores. >=20 > Should I send you my list of domes for France? >=20 > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > Joe S Moore > joe_s_moore@hotmail.com > http://buckminster.info <=3D=3D NEW > Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >=20 > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "frank" > Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic > To: > Sent: Thursday, December 31, 1903 5:12 PM > Subject: Re: a manufacturer in holland >=20 yes please send me your list of domes in france. i live 2 hours south of the french border. frank > hi mr moore >=20 > thank you very much for your quick response. >=20 > yes i can add to the list, i know oof two more domes not yet on your lis= t. > when i get exact locations i'll email you again. anything more i can hel= p > you with? >=20 > thaks again. will be in touch >=20 > frank spencer >=20 > (snip) ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 27 Oct 2002 10:55:46 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Re: the hubs for the octet truss? In-Reply-To: <3DBB33CA.2080108@sover.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Get snow yet, Steve? The truss described below is a redundant octet system. It is as rigid as the material and construction method used permit. In the octet truss, each vertex has 7 axis connecting to neigboring vertexes. See: http://www.rwgrayprojects.com/synergetics/s04/figs/f2001.html In the triangular-box, redundant octet truss, each vertex has 10 axes connecting neighboring vertexes. That is, if my counting is correct. Its advantage is in its simplicity of construction. The boxes can be either face/double bonded, or vertex/single bonded, where half as many boxes are employed. --- Steve Miller wrote: > How rigid is it? >Dick Fischbeck wrote: > > > Hi Frank > > > > I can tell you an easy way to build an octet truss if > you > > like. > > > > Take a look at the cupdome pictured at: > > > > > http://groups.msn.com/BuckminsterFuller/shoebox.msnw?Page=6 > > > > All you have to do is to make lots of identical > triangular > > box, both ends open, and fasten them together into a > truss. > > That's it. > > > > The points where you fasten the truss to the sides of > the > > dome are anywhere they touch. The truss is hung on the > dome > > at any level. > > > > Does that make sense? The boxes could be made of sheet > > metal, for example. Light weight. Any thickness truss. > What > > is the span going to be? > > > > Dick > > > > --- frank wrote: > > > >>hi mr fischbeck > >> > >>i live in a 40 foot dome in spain. > >> > >>i'd like to put a loft above the maain floor and would > >>like to use an octet > >>truss strusture to spupport the loft floor. do you > know > >>where i can buy the > >>hubs for the truss? > >> > >>please contact me. > >> > >>thank you > >> > >>frank spencer > >> __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Y! Web Hosting - Let the expert host your web site http://webhosting.yahoo.com/ ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 27 Oct 2002 15:26:07 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Organization: (Retired) Subject: Re: dome mfrs Comments: To: DomeHome-H@h19.hoflin.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Rhonda, You have touched on a difficult problem. I used to have links if available, but the task of keeping them up-to-date became a huge problem. At one time I had several thousand links which required too much time to maintain. So reluctantly I dropped most of the links in my web site. Now, one must use other methods of tracking down a company, such as a search engine. I kept the country and city where a manufacturer is located; so that helps a little. If you have a specific company that you are interested in let me know and I'll look it up in my paper backup files (binders). ============================== Joe S Moore joe_s_moore@hotmail.com http://buckminster.info <== NEW Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute ============================= ----- Original Message ----- From: "The DomeHome List" To: Sent: Friday, January 01, 1904 2:25 PM Subject: re: dome mfrs > From: Rhonda Holland > Date: Wed, 23 Oct 2002 21:02:23 -0400 > > At 10:09 PM 10/22/02 -0500, you wrote: > >From: "Joe S Moore" > >Date: Wed, 25 Sep 2002 20:49:55 -0700 > >To: "Newhouse, William L." > >Cc: "List, The Geodesic" > > > >William, > > > >Please go to this page > >http://www.buckminster.info//Index/Dome-Dt.htm and > >scroll below to "Manufacturers". > > > >============================== > >Joe S Moore > >joe_s_moore@hotmail.com > >http://buckminster.info <== NEW > >Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute > > Joe, > > I clicked on a few of the links. How does one get the contact > information for the manufacturing companies listed at the site??? > > Thanks in advance, > > Rhonda M. Holland > Publisher, Money Finder > mailto:moneyfinder-subscribe@topica.com > http://moneyfinder.bizhosting.com > > .:'':. > .::::::::. The DomeHome Email List . http://www.domegroup.org > > ** subscribe/unsubscribe to this list (under DOG LISTS) at > http://www.hoflin.com > ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 27 Oct 2002 17:30:45 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Steve Miller Subject: Re: the hubs for the octet truss? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit We got an inch of wet snow. But our greens are still growing under the hoops. Dick Fischbeck wrote: > Get snow yet, Steve? > > The truss described below is a redundant octet system. It > is as rigid as the material and construction method used > permit. > > In the octet truss, each vertex has 7 axis connecting to > neigboring vertexes. See: > > http://www.rwgrayprojects.com/synergetics/s04/figs/f2001.html > > In the triangular-box, redundant octet truss, each vertex > has 10 axes connecting neighboring vertexes. That is, if my > counting is correct. Its advantage is in its simplicity of > construction. > > The boxes can be either face/double bonded, or > vertex/single bonded, where half as many boxes are > employed. > > --- Steve Miller wrote: > >>How rigid is it? >> > >>Dick Fischbeck wrote: >> >> >>>Hi Frank >>> >>>I can tell you an easy way to build an octet truss if >>> >>you >> >>>like. >>> >>>Take a look at the cupdome pictured at: >>> >>> >>> > http://groups.msn.com/BuckminsterFuller/shoebox.msnw?Page=6 > >>>All you have to do is to make lots of identical >>> >>triangular >> >>>box, both ends open, and fasten them together into a >>> >>truss. >> >>>That's it. >>> >>>The points where you fasten the truss to the sides of >>> >>the >> >>>dome are anywhere they touch. The truss is hung on the >>> >>dome >> >>>at any level. >>> >>>Does that make sense? The boxes could be made of sheet >>>metal, for example. Light weight. Any thickness truss. >>> >>What >> >>>is the span going to be? >>> >>>Dick >>> >>>--- frank wrote: >>> >>> >>>>hi mr fischbeck >>>> >>>>i live in a 40 foot dome in spain. >>>> >>>>i'd like to put a loft above the maain floor and would >>>>like to use an octet >>>>truss strusture to spupport the loft floor. do you >>>> >>know >> >>>>where i can buy the >>>>hubs for the truss? >>>> >>>>please contact me. >>>> >>>>thank you >>>> >>>>frank spencer >>>> >>>> > > __________________________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > Y! Web Hosting - Let the expert host your web site > http://webhosting.yahoo.com/ > > -- Formactive: http://www.sover.net/~triorbtl/ ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 27 Oct 2002 15:39:32 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Organization: (Retired) Subject: Re: a manufacturer in holland Comments: cc: "List, The DomeHome" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Frank, Here's what I have for France: Marne-la-Vallee (Space Mountain at Euro Disney) Paris (La Geode Theater at Cite des Sciences et de L'Industrie) Paris (Palais de Sports) city? (Petrochemical? Tank Cover by Vacono Company) ============================== Joe S Moore joe_s_moore@hotmail.com http://buckminster.info <== NEW Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute ============================= ----- Original Message ----- From: "frank" Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic To: Sent: Sunday, October 27, 2002 4:53 AM Subject: Re: a manufacturer in holland el 25/10/02 08:28 am, Joe S Moore en joe_s_moore@HOTMAIL.COM escribió: > Frank, > > I know of 1 radome in Gibraltar but none in Portugal, except there's one > radome on Terceira Island in the Azores. > > Should I send you my list of domes for France? > > ============================== > Joe S Moore > joe_s_moore@hotmail.com > http://buckminster.info <== NEW > Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute > ============================= > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "frank" > Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic > To: > Sent: Thursday, December 31, 1903 5:12 PM > Subject: Re: a manufacturer in holland > yes please send me your list of domes in france. i live 2 hours south of the french border. frank > hi mr moore > > thank you very much for your quick response. > > yes i can add to the list, i know oof two more domes not yet on your list. > when i get exact locations i'll email you again. anything more i can help > you with? > > thaks again. will be in touch > > frank spencer > > (snip) ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 27 Oct 2002 23:19:20 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: dome mfrs Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed I reacll reading of a utility that checks for dead links & updates them, if possible. NB: Hotmail's put my sig on top; sorry! --SIGHnS: Harry-the-Potter's "Public School," MacJihad versus McCrusade; Dame Jo din't write a Scholast's script; and "Let's you & Saddam dance" warn't Tony Blair's idea, either! thus quoth: > > I clicked on a few of the links. How does one get the contact > > information for the manufacturing companies listed at the site??? _________________________________________________________________ Protect your PC - get McAfee.com VirusScan Online http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963 ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 27 Oct 2002 23:37:34 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: Tverse is what? Comments: To: synergeo@yahoogroups.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed this is what I meant. you can say that "vertex-order" is a topological thing, but it's also one of the few elementary entities of graphtheory. the fact taht your usage pre graphtheory is improper should be a signpost as to mading your method work, if that is possible. as a parting (I hope) example, note that the 4-color problem is often dualized to its "vertex-order" dual, \ as in the alleged proof of it with computer-accounting. NB: Hotmail's put my sig on top; sorry! --SIGHnS: Harry-the-Potter's "Public School," MacJihad versus McCrusade; Dame Jo din't write a Scholast's script; and "Let's you & Saddam dance" warn't Tony Blair's idea, either! thus qutoh: >"Network" : a set of points (called "vertices," hence one of them is a >"vertex") with line-segments between them and attached to them(*), either >on >a plane or in Euclidean 3D. A hair-net is a network. A graphical >representation of internet connectivities on a map, is a network. A >totally >triangulated plane, or a totally tetragonated volume, is a network. >((*) Topological language, we say the line-segments "terminate in" the >vertices. >A sphere packed tight with many small unit-radius spheres will be, I have >assumed and mostly found, *primarily* "vertex order twelve," meaning that >for the majority of this "network" each point ("vertex"; 'node'; point; >sphere-center) has twelve line-segment ends attached to it. _________________________________________________________________ Broadband? Dial-up? Get reliable MSN Internet Access. http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/default.asp ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 27 Oct 2002 23:42:43 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: the hubs for the octet truss? Comments: cc: synergeo@yahooGroups.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed never give "up," never say "die," never prove taht "randome" has any intrinsic meaning, what so ever. what a BSer this "Dick" be! of course, an octet truss has 12 radial spokes (or (6 "axes" in general) from each hub, or 9 if it's on the surface, or less (if it's only one octah.thick, then it'll have at most nine on each hub). one cannot face-bond either tetrah. or octah., although one can do that with both. NB: Hotmail's put my sig on top; sorry! --SIGHnS: D*ck Ch*n*y's 2 focusgroups planned for this "clash o'civs," before 911! http://quincy4board.homestead.com/DeepPool.html www.larouchepub.com thus quoth: >The truss described below is a redundant octet system. It >is as rigid as the material and construction method used >permit. > >In the octet truss, each vertex has 7 axis connecting to >neigboring vertexes. See: > >http://www.rwgrayprojects.com/synergetics/s04/figs/f2001.html > >In the triangular-box, redundant octet truss, each vertex >has 10 axes connecting neighboring vertexes. That is, if my >counting is correct. Its advantage is in its simplicity of >construction. > >The boxes can be either face/double bonded, or >vertex/single bonded, where half as many boxes are >employed. _________________________________________________________________ Choose an Internet access plan right for you -- try MSN! http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/default.asp ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 27 Oct 2002 23:57:15 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: Points repelling each other on a sphere Comments: cc: synergeo@yahooGroups.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed this guy has no clue as to the elementary geometry that easily dysproves his "n-verton/reandome" crappola. and, he admits it, repeatedly. will he admit it, again, when queried? thus quoth: http://www.wmeadow.demon.co.uk/poly/ I am not into computer programing but I am very interested in ultra- low-cost shelter. I found an simple method to construct geodesic shells with some number n vertexes. Each vertex is an identical concave element with an angular deficit equal to 720/n degrees. The elements are arranged at some approximate distance apart such that the area of each triangular facet is the same, or close to the same. See paper model at: http://groups.msn.com/BuckminsterFuller/shoebox.msnw?Page=7 NB: Hotmail's put my sig on top; sorry! --A HYDROGEN (sic; cracked methane) ECONOMY?... The Three Phases of Exploitation of the Protocols of the Elders of Kyoto: (FOSSILISATION [McCainanites?] (TM/sic))/ BORE/GUSH/NADIR "@" http://www.tarpley.net/aobook.htm. Http://www.tarpley.net/bushb.htm (partial contents, below): 17 -- THE ATTEMPTED COUP D'ETAT, 3/30/81 (87K) _________________________________________________________________ Surf the Web without missing calls! Get MSN Broadband. http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/freeactivation.asp ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 27 Oct 2002 23:59:34 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: a little dark lie (was: Simplicity domes) Comments: cc: synergeo@yahooGroups.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed geodesic darer-t-be-not-just-naeive-but-simpletonic! NB: Hotmail's put my sig on top; sorry! --SIGHnS: Harry-the-Potter's "Public School," MacJihad versus McCrusade; Dame Jo din't write a Scholast's script; and "Let's you & Saddam dance" warn't Tony Blair's idea, either! thus quoth: >I'd like to contribute to the section on simplicity. The >randome design is brand new and is undergoing >prototyping. >Some info is available on the web and I am happy to >offer >any more I have. > >The design is almost math free. There are no chord >factors >to mess with. All hub elements are identical. Struts >automatically adjust in length. Anyone can build one >with a >few simple directions. > >There is a picture at: > >http://www.washedashore.com/randome/ > >More info is at: > >http://groups.msn.com/BuckminsterFuller/shoebox.msnw?Page=7 _________________________________________________________________ Get faster connections -- switch to MSN Internet Access! http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/default.asp ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 28 Oct 2002 00:02:02 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: buckminster fuller Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed not quite; only if tow of them are on a diameter (that is, polar). NB: Hotmail's put my sig on top; sorry! --SIGHnS: D*ck Ch*n*y's 2 focusgroups planned for this "clash o'civs," before 911! http://quincy4board.homestead.com/DeepPool.html www.larouchepub.com thus quoth: >Or, here's another answer: Yes, I GUARANTEE that the precise >geometrical centers of those cities are on a great circle. EVERY >triplet of cities is on a great circle. Any 3 nonlinear points are on >some circle; every circle is a circumference of some sphere. The >trick is that the sphere containing that great circle is probably in >space, not coinciding with the surface of the Earth. The sphere might >be a different size, and centered in a different place than the center >of the Earth. _________________________________________________________________ Unlimited Internet access -- and 2 months free! Try MSN. http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/2monthsfree.asp ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 28 Oct 2002 00:24:10 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Lee Bonnifield Subject: Re: buckminster fuller Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit QQQ: > not quite; only if tow of them are on a diameter > (that is, polar). Nope, you missed the point. Any 3 non-polar cities (as long as they are not in a 3D straight line) ARE on a great circle. The point you missed is >>trick is that the sphere containing that great circle is probably in >>space, not coinciding with the surface of the Earth. The sphere might >>be a different size, and centered in a different place than the center >>of the Earth. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 28 Oct 2002 08:02:40 +0100 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: frank Subject: Re: a manufacturer in holland In-Reply-To: Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable hi joe,=20 there's an architect who, get this, designed all the jigs for his hubs ab= d struts then built a 6 frequency dome, he's near agen in southern france. the dome appeared in a book entitled the natural house book. i'll diug out his cointact info today or tomorrow and send it to you. in spain, in the town of JACA a hydro- electrical company covered their generating apparatus with a metal domme, pretty big. i have pictures wiol= l scan and send them to you. there's also an old radome, still inn operatio= n just south of here, used by the spanish air force. i've been trying to ge= t to know someopone in their military who can get me a visit but their pretty old fashioned here. it is on the mountaintop outside of the town of el frasno, about 60 kms south of zaragoza. also now in madrid, suburb of barajas near the airport is a metal dome used as the protection for a science musuem run by a bank callled LA CAI. will keep my eyes and ears oipen and be intouch with you. any further info on the hub structure for an octet truss for me' frank=20 el 27/10/02 11:39 pm, Joe S Moore en joe_s_moore@HOTMAIL.COM escribi=F3: > Frank, >=20 > Here's what I have for France: >=20 > Marne-la-Vallee (Space Mountain at Euro Disney) > Paris (La Geode Theater at Cite des Sciences et de L'Industrie) > Paris (Palais de Sports) > city? (Petrochemical? Tank Cover by Vacono Company) >=20 > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > Joe S Moore > joe_s_moore@hotmail.com > http://buckminster.info <=3D=3D NEW > Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >=20 > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "frank" > Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic > To: > Sent: Sunday, October 27, 2002 4:53 AM > Subject: Re: a manufacturer in holland >=20 >=20 > el 25/10/02 08:28 am, Joe S Moore en joe_s_moore@HOTMAIL.COM escribi=F3: >=20 >> Frank, >>=20 >> I know of 1 radome in Gibraltar but none in Portugal, except there's one >> radome on Terceira Island in the Azores. >>=20 >> Should I send you my list of domes for France? >>=20 >> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >> Joe S Moore >> joe_s_moore@hotmail.com >> http://buckminster.info <=3D=3D NEW >> Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute >> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >>=20 >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "frank" >> Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic >> To: >> Sent: Thursday, December 31, 1903 5:12 PM >> Subject: Re: a manufacturer in holland >>=20 > yes please send me your list of domes in france. i live 2 hours south of > the french border. >=20 > frank >> hi mr moore >>=20 >> thank you very much for your quick response. >>=20 >> yes i can add to the list, i know oof two more domes not yet on your > list. >> when i get exact locations i'll email you again. anything more i can he= lp >> you with? >>=20 >> thaks again. will be in touch >>=20 >> frank spencer >>=20 >> (snip) ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 28 Oct 2002 06:50:22 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Re: Points repelling each other on a sphere In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Does the elementary geometry also dysprove that the randome in my yard is rigid and standing? Go kiss LLR's behind, Dr. Geometry. --- Quincy Quincy Quincy wrote: > this guy has no clue as to the elementary geometry > that easily dysproves his "n-verton/reandome" crappola. > and, he admits it, repeatedly. > will he admit it, again, > when queried? __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Y! Web Hosting - Let the expert host your web site http://webhosting.yahoo.com/ ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 28 Oct 2002 07:12:17 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Re: the hubs for the octet truss? In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Yes, 6, not 7 axes. The triangular boxes I refer to are prisms, not tets. They can be arranged face to face or edge to edge. It is strictly not an octet truss, but the octet truss is in there anyway. --- Quincy Quincy Quincy wrote: > never give "up," never say "die," > never prove taht "randome" has any intrinsic meaning, > what so ever. what a BSer this "Dick" be! > of course, an octet truss has 12 radial spokes (or > (6 "axes" in general) from each hub, or > 9 if it's on the surface, or less (if > it's only one octah.thick, then > it'll have at most nine on each hub). > one cannot face-bond either tetrah. > or octah., although one can do that with both. > > NB: Hotmail's put my sig on top; sorry! > --SIGHnS: D*ck Ch*n*y's 2 focusgroups planned > for this "clash o'civs," before 911! > http://quincy4board.homestead.com/DeepPool.html > www.larouchepub.com > > thus quoth: > >The truss described below is a redundant octet system. > It > >is as rigid as the material and construction method used > >permit. > > > >In the octet truss, each vertex has 7 axis connecting to > >neigboring vertexes. See: > > > >http://www.rwgrayprojects.com/synergetics/s04/figs/f2001.html > > > >In the triangular-box, redundant octet truss, each > vertex > >has 10 axes connecting neighboring vertexes. That is, if > my > >counting is correct. Its advantage is in its simplicity > of > >construction. > > > >The boxes can be either face/double bonded, or > >vertex/single bonded, where half as many boxes are > >employed. __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Y! Web Hosting - Let the expert host your web site http://webhosting.yahoo.com/ ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 28 Oct 2002 17:17:44 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Gerardo Garcia Subject: Re: buckminster fuller Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed It's only a joke, but I think that I somehow began this: Could it be that we are already in an eccentric (regarding the earth's centre) point of reference, that is, that we are already migrating from the earth before the Perotian "cleaning of the house"? I suppose that Mr. Larouche would be delighted. By the way, if we have to accept the tensegrity theory (feminine gives form while masculine deforms) shouldn´t we be writing all kind of prose to avoid Lee migrate from this list? otherwise, is there a sexless tensegrity theory? Of course, my understanding of names in English is limited, but then Lee might have some scientific girl friends to give form to this forum. It is only a humble suggestion Gerardo >From: Lee Bonnifield >Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works > >To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU >Subject: Re: buckminster fuller >Date: Mon, 28 Oct 2002 00:24:10 -0500 > >QQQ: > > not quite; only if tow of them are on a diameter > > (that is, polar). > >Nope, you missed the point. Any 3 non-polar cities (as long as they >are not in a 3D straight line) ARE on a great circle. The point you >missed is > > >>trick is that the sphere containing that great circle is probably in > >>space, not coinciding with the surface of the Earth. The sphere might > >>be a different size, and centered in a different place than the center > >>of the Earth. _________________________________________________________________ Get a speedy connection with MSN Broadband. Join now! http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/freeactivation.asp ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 28 Oct 2002 17:31:30 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Gerardo Garcia Subject: Re: Points repelling each other on a sphere Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Here we need the feminine saying: "boys dont fight, please there be peace. This is a forum not a battlefield (the Inglewood forum?)" please take my advice, contact Lula da Silva, propose him the best scientifically affordable dome for Brazil "landless" and, GET A TICKET FOR THE CARNIVAL with due respect and great "Ezechiel book" doubts Gerardo Tampico, México (not Illinois) >From: Dick Fischbeck >Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works > >To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU >Subject: Re: Points repelling each other on a sphere >Date: Mon, 28 Oct 2002 06:50:22 -0800 > >Does the elementary geometry also dysprove that the randome >in my yard is rigid and standing? > >Go kiss LLR's behind, Dr. Geometry. > >--- Quincy Quincy Quincy wrote: > > this guy has no clue as to the elementary geometry > > that easily dysproves his "n-verton/reandome" crappola. > > and, he admits it, repeatedly. > > will he admit it, again, > > when queried? > > >__________________________________________________ >Do you Yahoo!? >Y! Web Hosting - Let the expert host your web site >http://webhosting.yahoo.com/ _________________________________________________________________ Unlimited Internet access for only $21.95/month. Try MSN! http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/2monthsfree.asp ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 28 Oct 2002 20:06:44 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: Points repelling each other on a sphere Comments: cc: synergeo@yahooGroups.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed it proves that you don't have a clue, as to how to make a complete spheric, without ripping the rubber sheets! NB: Hotmail's put my sig on top; sorry! --SIGHnS: Harry-the-Potter's "Public School," MacJihad versus McCrusade; Dame Jo din't write a Scholast's script; and "Let's you & Saddam dance" warn't Tony Blair's idea, either! thus quoth: >Does the elementary geometry also dysprove that the randome >in my yard is rigid and standing? > >Go kiss LLR's behind, Dr. Geometry. > >--- Quincy Quincy Quincy wrote: > > this guy has no clue as to the elementary geometry > > that easily dysproves his "n-verton/reandome" crappola. > > and, he admits it, repeatedly. _________________________________________________________________ Get faster connections -- switch to MSN Internet Access! http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/default.asp ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 28 Oct 2002 20:13:30 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: buckminster fuller Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed now *that* is the kind of example that is used to illustrate the meaning of "trivial purfuit." in other words, it's a GC of an "orthogonal sphere" that is smaller than Earth, if not co-inky-dink. NB: Hotmail's put my sig on top; sorry! --SIGHnS: D*ck Ch*n*y's 2 focusgroups planned for this "clash o'civs," before 911! http://quincy4board.homestead.com/DeepPool.html www.larouchepub.com thus quoth: > >>trick is that the sphere containing that great circle is probably in > >>space, not coinciding with the surface of the Earth. The sphere _________________________________________________________________ Get a speedy connection with MSN Broadband. Join now! http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/freeactivation.asp ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 28 Oct 2002 20:34:02 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: Points repelling each other on a sphere Comments: To: synergeo@yahoogroups.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Lee, it's nice to get a direct question, every once & a while, and rare on this list (or geodesic-l or syn-hell (sic .-)) we'll just take the cases of 2, 3 and 4 vertices (apices or -astera or "vertexions (tm)" or "vertons"); now, see if *you* all can do it. "Dick" uses a sophistry of papier mache and incomplete "shperical" structures, to give the impression that he found some thing, that cannot exist in this space (Universe). (re below, please, do find a really elementary proof.) one (not-so-elementary) way to prove it, is to show that, although a sphere can be conformally mapped to a cone (or a plane or a cylinder, as with the vast bulk of all usefull projections), it can NOT be so-mapped to more than one. that is to say, there will always be (analytical) dyscontinuities between the conical (planar etc.) elements, which are cognate with the unfolding of gores from a real sphere. the Dymaxion map has these problems e.g., and the "craft" technique o'Dick covers them up (aside from the doltish lack of finishing any sphere .-) NB: Hotmail's put my sig on top; sorry! --A HYDROGEN (sic; cracked methane) ECONOMY?... The Three Phases of Exploitation of the Protocols of the Elders of Kyoto: (FOSSILISATION [McCainanites?] (TM/sic))/ BORE/GUSH/NADIR "@" http://www.tarpley.net/aobook.htm. Http://www.tarpley.net/bushb.htm (partial contents, below): 17 -- THE ATTEMPTED COUP D'ETAT, 3/30/81 (87K) 18 -- IRAN-CONTRA (140K) 19 -- THE LEVERAGED BUYOUT MOB (67K) 20 -- THE PHONY WAR ON DRUGS (26K) 21 -- OMAHA (25K) 22 -- GEORGE "#9" TAKES THE PRESIDENCY (112K) 23 -- THE END OF HISTORY (168K) 24 -- THE NEW WORLD ORDER (255K) 25 -- THYROID STORM (139K) thus quoth: >Also, I have never understood what it is QQQ thinks Dick should prove. >QQQ, can you state the theorem you think he should prove, or its >negation, and prove it? As far as I can tell Dick has no theorem, but >he does have a functioning (trial-and-error) mechanical technique for >overlapping n cones >to cover a sphere. If you think that is impossible I'd think you could >come up with a counterexample construction. I guess that would be an > >> http://www.wmeadow.demon.co.uk/poly/ _________________________________________________________________ Internet access plans that fit your lifestyle -- join MSN. http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/default.asp ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 28 Oct 2002 15:11:33 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Lee Bonnifield Subject: Re: buckminster fuller Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit > Of course, my understanding of names in English is limited, but then Lee > might have some scientific girl friends to give form to this forum. I wish. This Lee is male. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 28 Oct 2002 20:54:36 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: Gaps Comments: To: synergeo@yahoogroups.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed a.k.a. "the altitude of an equigonal trigon, relative to its edge-length." (I prefer to use the from, second-root of three-quarters, for reasons of comprehension over "rationalization".) Thus quoth: >Rephrasing: >If a 30-60-90 triangle's hypotenuse (opposite the 90 angle) is "1.0", >then its short side (opposite the 30 angle) is "0.5" (half as long as the >hyp.), and the long edge (opposite the 60 angle) is the square root of 3 >divided by 2? Correct. http://mathworld.wolfram.com/30-60-90Triangle.html http://www.themathpage.com/aTrig/30-60-90-triangle.htm (edges x 2) http://www.math.okstate.edu/~rpsc/dict/30-60-90.html NB: Hotmail's put my sig on top; sorry! --A HYDROGEN (sic; cracked methane) ECONOMY?... The Three Phases of Exploitation of the Protocols of the Elders of Kyoto: (FOSSILISATION [McCainanites?] (TM/sic))/ BORE/GUSH/NADIR "@" http://www.tarpley.net/aobook.htm. Http://www.tarpley.net/bushb.htm (partial contents, below): 17 -- THE ATTEMPTED COUP D'ETAT, 3/30/81 (87K) _________________________________________________________________ Get faster connections -- switch to MSN Internet Access! http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/default.asp ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 28 Oct 2002 20:56:10 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: EM frequencys Comments: cc: synergeo@yahooGroups.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed >http://www.innerx.net/personal/tsmith/Schumann.html#brain seems to indicate a knowledge of the speed of light (in vacuo or what ever) – is lacking! Thus quoth: The 1 Hz frequency of the Delta waves is 7.5 times lower than the 7.5 Hz natural frequency at the surface of the Earth. Since the radius of the Earth is about 6,400 km, the radius for a 1 Hz natural frequency is about 7.5 x 6,400 = 48,000 km. Here are some natural frequencies that seem to correspond to the Delta and Theta waves of the Human Brain. Plasma Sheet (opposite Sun), inner radius = 60,000 km 0.8 Hz NB: Hotmail's put my sig on top; sorry! --SIGHnS: Harry-the-Potter's "Public School," MacJihad versus McCrusade; Dame Jo din't write a Scholast's script; and "Let's you & Saddam dance" warn't Tony Blair's idea, either! _________________________________________________________________ Protect your PC - get McAfee.com VirusScan Online http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963 ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 29 Oct 2002 06:53:40 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Re: Points repelling each other on a sphere In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Gerardo Do you know anyone who would be able to actually contact Lula? Maybe in the ministry of housing or the department of welfare or something? See: http://www.abc.net.au/worldtoday/s712903.htm --- Gerardo Garcia wrote: > Here we need the feminine saying: "boys dont fight, > please there be peace. > This is a forum not a battlefield (the Inglewood forum?)" > > please take my advice, contact Lula da Silva, propose him > the best > scientifically affordable dome for Brazil "landless" and, > GET A TICKET FOR > THE CARNIVAL __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? HotJobs - Search new jobs daily now http://hotjobs.yahoo.com/ ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 29 Oct 2002 06:59:00 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Re: Points repelling each other on a sphere In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii No rips, tears, folds or wrinkles. Every overlapping cone lies completely flat and it closes. I've shown you closed models but they did not satisfy you. What are you talking about for the thousandth time? Make a model. --- Quincy Quincy Quincy wrote: > it proves that you don't have a clue, > as to how to make a complete spheric, > without ripping the rubber sheets! __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? HotJobs - Search new jobs daily now http://hotjobs.yahoo.com/ ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 29 Oct 2002 08:37:02 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Organization: (Retired) Subject: Re: Dymaxion Flying Fish Logo Comments: To: Mark Sherwood MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Mark, Go to the bottom of my home page and search for the word logo; 5 of the = 6 hits are probably relevant to what you are looking for. This probably = won't help you, but the BFI used to (1983?) sell a t-shirt with the = flying fish logo on the front. After looking things over, I think your = best bet is _Bucky Works_, page 91. I'm sorry, but I don't know of a = digital version of that Dymaxion logo. =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D Joe S Moore joe_s_moore@hotmail.com http://buckminster.info <=3D=3D NEW Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Mark Sherwood=20 To: joe_s_moore@hotmail.com=20 Sent: Monday, October 28, 2002 8:06 PM Subject: Dymaxion Flying Fish Logo Joe, I hope you can help me. Recently I found a picture on the Internet of = a fellow who worked on the Dymaxion car and he was wearing a white smock = with the word "DYMAXION" and a flying fish logo on the back. I will = attach the photo so you can see what I mean. I am trying to find a = clearer image of this logo if possible, and it seems that, like me, you = are fascinated by Mr. Fuller's inventions. Any help you can offer would = be much appreciated. =20 Thanks, =20 =20 Mark Sherwood ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 29 Oct 2002 10:35:42 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Organization: (Retired) Subject: Re: a manufacturer in holland MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Frank, Thanks for adding to the list of world domes! Octet trusses are really very simple. They're made up of just regular tetrahedra & octahedra. All the sides are the same length. See http://www.buckminster.info//Ideas/05-OctetTrusIntro1.htm and http://www.buckminster.info//Ideas/05-OctetTrusIntro2.htm . Try making some models out of straws and masking tape. The hardest part is the connectors. (See http://www.buckminster.info//Index/Domes-C.htm scroll down) Once you get a feel for octet trusses, scale up your models to a larger size. You might be able to design your own connector. The ones that are commercially available are expensive. Please note: Cutting an octahedron in half will substantially reduce the strength of the structure. This is the error in most octet truss applications that exist right now. ============================== Joe S Moore joe_s_moore@hotmail.com http://buckminster.info <============ NEW Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute ============================= ----- Original Message ----- From: "frank" Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic To: Sent: Monday, October 28, 2002 12:02 AM Subject: Re: a manufacturer in holland hi joe, there's an architect who, get this, designed all the jigs for his hubs abd struts then built a 6 frequency dome, he's near agen in southern france. the dome appeared in a book entitled the natural house book. i'll diug out his cointact info today or tomorrow and send it to you. in spain, in the town of JACA a hydro- electrical company covered their generating apparatus with a metal domme, pretty big. i have pictures wioll scan and send them to you. there's also an old radome, still inn operation just south of here, used by the spanish air force. i've been trying to get to know someopone in their military who can get me a visit but their pretty old fashioned here. it is on the mountaintop outside of the town of el frasno, about 60 kms south of zaragoza. also now in madrid, suburb of barajas near the airport is a metal dome used as the protection for a science musuem run by a bank callled LA CAI. will keep my eyes and ears oipen and be intouch with you. any further info on the hub structure for an octet truss for me' frank el 27/10/02 11:39 pm, Joe S Moore en joe_s_moore@HOTMAIL.COM escribió: > Frank, > > Here's what I have for France: > > Marne-la-Vallee (Space Mountain at Euro Disney) > Paris (La Geode Theater at Cite des Sciences et de L'Industrie) > Paris (Palais de Sports) > city? (Petrochemical? Tank Cover by Vacono Company) > > ============================== > Joe S Moore > joe_s_moore@hotmail.com > http://buckminster.info <== NEW > Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute > ============================= > (snip) ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 29 Oct 2002 20:28:45 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: Points repelling each other on a sphere Comments: cc: synergeo@yahooGroups.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed you only lie to yourself, Fischstichk; you've certainly never posted a complete sphere on the page you've referenced, and anyone who's tried to do such things knows, that even getting them to shingle is a problem. since you provide no notes as to difficulties in your model-making, one has to ask, What the ****? NB: Hotmail's put my sig on top; sorry! --SIGHnS: MacJihad versus McCrusade, George goes to Harry-the-Potter's "Public School;" if Dame Jo din't write a Scholast's script, "Let's you & Saddam dance" is Tony Blair's reading, not ideal! http://quincy4board.homestead.com/3rd.html thus quoth: >No rips, tears, folds or wrinkles. Every overlapping cone >lies completely flat and it closes. I've shown you closed >models but they did not satisfy you. What are you talking >about for the thousandth time? > >Make a model. _________________________________________________________________ Choose an Internet access plan right for you -- try MSN! http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/default.asp ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 29 Oct 2002 20:40:07 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Gerardo Garcia Subject: Re: Points repelling each other on a sphere Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Which is the sphere? which are the points? Cause if we are the points, Vernadsky's pal T. de Chardin, foretold that the more we were trying to repell each others, the more we were going to coalesce. >From: Quincy Quincy Quincy >Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works > >To: GEODESIC@LISTSERV.BUFFALO.EDU >Subject: Re: Points repelling each other on a sphere >Date: Tue, 29 Oct 2002 20:28:45 +0000 > >you only lie to yourself, Fischstichk; >you've certainly never posted a complete sphere >on the page you've referenced, and >anyone who's tried to do such things knows, >that even getting them to shingle is a problem. > since you provide no notes as to difficulties >in your model-making, one has to ask, What the ****? > > >NB: Hotmail's put my sig on top; sorry! >--SIGHnS: MacJihad versus McCrusade, George goes >to Harry-the-Potter's "Public School;" if >Dame Jo din't write a Scholast's script, >"Let's you & Saddam dance" is Tony Blair's >reading, not ideal! >http://quincy4board.homestead.com/3rd.html > >thus quoth: >>No rips, tears, folds or wrinkles. Every overlapping cone >>lies completely flat and it closes. I've shown you closed >>models but they did not satisfy you. What are you talking >>about for the thousandth time? >> >>Make a model. > > >_________________________________________________________________ >Choose an Internet access plan right for you -- try MSN! >http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/default.asp _________________________________________________________________ Get a speedy connection with MSN Broadband. Join now! http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/freeactivation.asp ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 29 Oct 2002 21:01:25 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: Points repelling each other on a sphere Comments: cc: synergeo@yahooGroups.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed I have to take it back about "confomrality," since it doesn't even apply to gonomic projections (from the center of the sphere-to-be-mapped, like the Dymaxion (tm)), although "stereographic" ones have it (I think, "stereo" comes from the ability to project alternately from both poles to both sides of an equatorial disk, both hemispheres). the "EZ" way to dysprove this crap about "vertons," is to just try it for the biverton, or, if you prefer for the sake of a nondegenerate case, the 4-verton. Dick's entire sophistry is predicated upon having enough "paper-plate elements," such that these problems are hidden in the curvature (a-hem) of the plates, themselves -- and he still mhasn't gotten a spherical model to close, as far as I know! thus quoth: we'll just take the cases of 2, 3 and 4 vertices (apices or -astera or "vertexions (tm)" or "vertons"); now, see if *you* all can do it. "Dick" uses a sophistry of papier mache and incomplete "shperical" structures, to give the impression that he found some thing, that cannot exist in this space (Universe). (re below, please, do find a really elementary proof.) one (not-so-elementary) way to prove it, the following was really nice, JBw: http://www.channel1.com/users/bobwb/prospect/prospect.htm#Oct2v NB: Hotmail's put my sig on top; sorry! --SIGHnS: MacJihad versus McCrusade, George goes to Harry-the-Potter's "Public School;" if Dame Jo din't write a Scholast's script, "Let's you & Saddam dance" is Tony Blair's reading, not ideal! http://quincy4board.homestead.com/3rd.html _________________________________________________________________ Choose an Internet access plan right for you -- try MSN! http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/default.asp ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 00:03:22 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: Points repelling each other on a sphere Comments: cc: synergeo@yahooGroups.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Deforming paper-plates should be left to picnicers, although all of it is covered in the study of "quadric surfaces," Of which cones & cylinders are simple examples. (A question remains in my mind, about cones that do not have a circular cross-section.) Brawley's continues use of the notion of uncertainty is absurd, when all of it is related to the particular implimentation of the floating-point standard in hardware and software – very diversly. Well, that's *my* hypothesis, not unlike the following pop-sci crappola! Today’s (NY) “Science Times” is cool, except for the hype on multiverses. The usual list of suspects includes the Astronomer Royal, to add to quacks like Newton. Rees has a flakey thing about "frames" like a motion-picture, wherein you're like a character in flipbook (or in several multiflipbooks, I suppose; I haven't read it, yet, and don't expect it To me much of interest). Thus quoth: Define "confirm" and I'd be better able to answer it. NB: Hotmail's put my sig on top; sorry! --SIGHnS: MacJihad versus McCrusade, George goes to Harry-the-Potter's "Public School;" if Dame Jo din't write a Scholast's script, "Let's you & Saddam dance" is Tony Blair's reading, not ideal! http://quincy4board.homestead.com/3rd.html http://quincy4board.homestead.com/files/curriculum/Cosmo.PCX --A HYDROGEN (sic; cracked methane) ECONOMY?... The Three Phases of Exploitation of the Protocols of the Elders of Kyoto: (FOSSILISATION [McCainanites?] (TM/sic))/ BORE/GUSH/NADIR "@" http://www.tarpley.net/aobook.htm. Http://www.tarpley.net/bushb.htm (partial contents, below): 17 -- THE ATTEMPTED COUP D'ETAT, 3/30/81 (87K)http://quincy4board.homestead.com/files/curriculum/Cosmo.PCX _________________________________________________________________ Get faster connections -- switch to MSN Internet Access! http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/default.asp ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 08:05:48 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: FA Subject: Re: Points repelling each other on a sphere In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit --A HYDROGEN (sic; cracked methane) ECONOMY?... Hydrogen production from methane, I suppose, is better than from hydrocarbons (ridiculous) but I still say we've got oceans of recyclable fuel just sitting out there. Clean it up (desalinate), electrolyze it using indigenous elelctrical generating sources, et voila. Foerd Ames Ocean Wave Energy Company 20 Burnside Street Bristol, RI 02809 USA email: foerd@owec.com web site: www.owec.com voice and fax: 401-253-4488 ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 29 Oct 2002 21:10:02 -0600 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Blair Wolfram Subject: Re: Points repelling each other on a sphere MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit "Fischstichk...lies...What the ****?." What is this? Blair Quincy Quincy Quincy wrote: > you only lie to yourself, Fischstichk; > you've certainly never posted a complete sphere > on the page you've referenced, and > anyone who's tried to do such things knows, > that even getting them to shingle is a problem. > since you provide no notes as to difficulties > in your model-making, one has to ask, What the ****? > > NB: Hotmail's put my sig on top; sorry! > --SIGHnS: MacJihad versus McCrusade, George goes > to Harry-the-Potter's "Public School;" if > Dame Jo din't write a Scholast's script, > "Let's you & Saddam dance" is Tony Blair's > reading, not ideal! > http://quincy4board.homestead.com/3rd.html > > thus quoth: > >No rips, tears, folds or wrinkles. Every overlapping cone > >lies completely flat and it closes. I've shown you closed > >models but they did not satisfy you. What are you talking > >about for the thousandth time? > > > >Make a model. > > _________________________________________________________________ > Choose an Internet access plan right for you -- try MSN! > http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/default.asp ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 07:37:00 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Re: geodesic shell MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Take a tet, doesn't have to be regular. Divide each edge in half. Cut off the 4 vertexes along planes defined by those 6 midpoints. We have 8 pieces, 4 bottomless tets and 4 triangles. The 4 little tets can easily be bent into cones. The sum of the angular deficits of the cones equals 720 degrees. Nothing very new mathematically. Except the construction method of building a geodesic shell out of n identical vertex elements. __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? HotJobs - Search new jobs daily now http://hotjobs.yahoo.com/ ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 07:57:10 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: trademark MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Quin, this trademark is taken! Page 1. ENGINEERING PLASTICS Verton ® Structural Composites Page 2. Santa Ana, CA Columbus, IN Thornaby-on-Tees UK Seremban, Malaysia ... __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? HotJobs - Search new jobs daily now http://hotjobs.yahoo.com/ ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 30 Oct 2002 14:32:50 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Bob Burkhardt Subject: tensegrity dome model MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I'm cleaning house, and I decided to disassemble an old tensegrity dome model. I took a picture of it since I hadn't before. It's at http://www.channel1.com/users/bobwb/synergetics/photos/v4octadome.html Bob ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2002 00:50:33 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Gerardo Garcia Subject: Frank Buck? Wright Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Hello, the next link speaks about Frank Lloyd Wright pushing for housing with very warm people oriented arguments http://www.counterpunch.org/stclair0813.html somehow it looks very alike to Mr. Fuller's own troubles with his own proposals. _________________________________________________________________ Broadband? Dial-up? Get reliable MSN Internet Access. http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/default.asp ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2002 01:28:34 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: geodesic Comments: cc: synergeo@yahooGroups.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed congratulation! you just found (probably) the only case where this can work, because any pyramid can be considered to be a "general" cone. that is, any polyhedron can be considered to be an assemblage of such cones, plus those flat "cones" that you noted. however, just *saying* that they can then be bent into curvey forms that will smoothly join, is totally no where, 'sVille-man! (in general, this is false.) NB: Hotmail's put my sig on top; sorry! --SIGHnS: MacJihad versus McCrusade, George goes to Harry-the-Potter's "Public School;" if Dame Jo din't write a Scholast's script, "Let's you & Saddam dance" is Tony Blair's reading, not ideal! http://quincy4board.homestead.com/3rd.html http://quincy4board.homestead.com/files/curriculum/Cosmo.PCX thus quoth: >Take a tet, doesn't have to be regular. Divide each edge in >half. Cut off the 4 vertexes along planes defined by those >6 midpoints. We have 8 pieces, 4 bottomless tets and 4 >triangles. The 4 little tets can easily be bent into cones. >The sum of the angular deficits of the cones equals 720 >degrees. Nothing very new mathematically. Except the >construction method of building a geodesic shell out of n >identical vertex elements. _________________________________________________________________ Get faster connections -- switch to MSN Internet Access! http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/default.asp ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2002 01:34:02 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: hydrogen econ.? (was: Points repelling each other on a sphere) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed that wasn't my point. is there any reason to rip the H2 off of the CH4, when the main difference may be the fuel-air ratio? I suppose you could mix them together, two. NB: Hotmail's put my sig on top; sorry! --A HYDROGEN (sic; cracked methane) ECONOMY?... The Three Phases of Exploitation of the Protocols of the Elders of Kyoto: (FOSSILISATION [McCainanites?] (TM/sic))/ BORE/GUSH/NADIR "@" http://www.tarpley.net/aobook.htm. Http://www.tarpley.net/bushb.htm (partial contents, below): 17 -- THE ATTEMPTED COUP D'ETAT, 3/30/81 (87K) 18 -- IRAN-CONTRA (140K) 19 -- THE LEVERAGED BUYOUT MOB (67K) 20 -- THE PHONY WAR ON DRUGS (26K) 21 -- OMAHA (25K) 22 -- GEORGE "#9" TAKES THE PRESIDENCY (112K) 23 -- THE END OF HISTORY (168K) 24 -- THE NEW WORLD ORDER (255K) 25 -- THYROID STORM (139K) http://quincy4board.homestead.com/files/curriculum/Cosmo.PCX >Hydrogen production from methane, I suppose, is better than from >hydrocarbons (ridiculous) but I still say we've got oceans of recyclable >fuel just sitting out there. Clean it up (desalinate), electrolyze it using >indigenous elelctrical generating sources, et voila. _________________________________________________________________ Internet access plans that fit your lifestyle -- join MSN. http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/default.asp ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2002 02:54:23 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Comments: To: hspersonalsupport@homesteadsupport.com Comments: cc: support@homesteadsupport.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed True, Bob Griffin did extend my year by two months, all told, except for the many delays in notification, when I was "up Schitz Creek without a paddle." Now, the original complaint was two, approximately 3-week times, when I couldn't edit my page; that is, I'd asked for a "2x" extension for pain, suffering & foolishness, which'd take me through November. Now, termination is set for Hallowe'en, inconveniently in the last days of my campaign. Of course, the Standard Agreement Boilerplate is supposed to cover any-and-all possibilities, but that don't stand in court (sure, it'd be near Menlo Park, and I've always wanted to visit Edison's lab !-) The last 3-week outage was due solely to an "upgrade" that made everything more difficult, as far as using the ONLINE SiteBuilder, and the sneaky hiding of the button that launches it. So, as a thwarted, possibly helpful beta-tester, even such a simple thing as putting that button on the screen that's after the login, is moot (even if it was really small, to promote the OFFline job, or even invisible). Mr. Griffin hasn't even answered what seems to be a simple query: How do new, would-be users try HS out, if the ONline SB is such a mess, and virtually impossible to "launch," til you know the secret? (It used to be that you could do almost everything dealing with your pages, from a single screen, such as transferring files. It's really annoying, how often one has to change screens after the simplest of operations, that should have brought you back to the screen that you were using!) The latest fiasco is that my index.html had elements removed from it, and it wouldn't load. Nothing was done to back it up – and I hadn't changed a thing on it for weeks of arguing – after asking (just like with the launch button, HS could have said, "Sorry, it's at the very bottom of the (new) 'Page Manager,' not that graphical element that you used to use, at the top;" I only learned from someone on the boards, after 3 weeks!) [Now, I can load the index, but I have no idea how many things were deleted, below the top of the scroll; does HS have back-ups, or not?] So, please contact Bob Griffin of Homestead Technologies, Inc., in Menlo Park, if you agree with me; thank you. --Brian Hutchings PS: this is all without considering what crackers may've done to my site; indeed, I have no idea whether using my URLs will actually get my pages, in general, nor what security us used by Homestead, for Homestead. NB: Hotmail's put my sig on top; sorry! --SIGHnS: MacJihad versus McCrusade, George goes to Harry-the-Potter's "Public School;" if Dame Jo din't write a Scholast's script, "Let's you & Saddam dance" is Tony Blair's reading, not ideal! http://quincy4board.homestead.com/3rd.html http://quincy4board.homestead.com/files/curriculum/Cosmo.PCX _________________________________________________________________ Get a speedy connection with MSN Broadband. Join now! http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/freeactivation.asp ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2002 05:46:46 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Re: geodesic In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii No. It works with any omnitriangulated polyhedron. If you would make an icosa, for example, out of 12 cones, each with a 60 degree angular deficit, you might stop thinking this is a hoax, if that's what you think. Show why this is false, if you can. --- Quincy Quincy Quincy wrote: > congratulation! > you just found (probably) the only case > where this can work, because > any pyramid can be considered to be a "general" cone. > that is, any polyhedron can be considered > to be an assemblage of such cones, > plus those flat "cones" that you noted. > however, > just *saying* that they can then be bent > into curvey forms that will smoothly join, > is totally no where, 'sVille-man! > (in general, this is false.) > thus quoth: > >Take a tet, doesn't have to be regular. Divide each edge > in > >half. Cut off the 4 vertexes along planes defined by > those > >6 midpoints. We have 8 pieces, 4 bottomless tets and 4 > >triangles. The 4 little tets can easily be bent into > cones. > >The sum of the angular deficits of the cones equals 720 > >degrees. Nothing very new mathematically. Except the > >construction method of building a geodesic shell out of > n > >identical vertex elements. __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? HotJobs - Search new jobs daily now http://hotjobs.yahoo.com/ ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 1 Nov 2002 00:17:42 -0500 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: FA Subject: Levi Strauss Globe In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Does anyone (attention Joe!) have an idea where I can pick up a base for the Levi Strauss edition of the Dymaxion Globe? I believe it must have comprised a caster with ball bearings between two metal disks. It would have mounting holes about the periphery. Thanks for any leads. Foerd Ames Ocean Wave Energy Company 20 Burnside Street Bristol, RI 02809 USA email: foerd@owec.com web site: www.owec.com voice and fax: 401-253-4488 ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2002 10:28:49 -0700 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Joe S Moore Organization: (Retired) Subject: Re: Levi Strauss Globe MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Foerd, See http://buckminster.info/Index/Gl-Gram.htm (scroll to "Globe"). I don't know where you could get a base, but this is where you could go to see one (I presume). Also, since the globe was commissioned by BFI, you might try contacting them: http://209.196.135.250/ ============================== Joe S Moore joe_s_moore@hotmail.com http://buckminster.info <========== N E W Buckminster Fuller Virtual Institute ============================= ----- Original Message ----- From: "FA" Newsgroups: bit.listserv.geodesic To: Sent: Thursday, October 31, 2002 10:17 PM Subject: Levi Strauss Globe > Does anyone (attention Joe!) have an idea where I can pick up a base for the > Levi Strauss edition of the Dymaxion Globe? I believe it must have comprised > a caster with ball bearings between two metal disks. It would have mounting > holes about the periphery. Thanks for any leads. > > Foerd Ames > > Ocean Wave Energy Company > 20 Burnside Street > Bristol, RI 02809 USA > > email: foerd@owec.com > web site: www.owec.com > voice and fax: 401-253-4488 > ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2002 21:15:07 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: geodesic Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed don't be such a jerk; it's your smart-ass proposition, and all that you have to do is show it for a "4-verton," but you can't. (I asked you to do this, quite a long time ago; eh?) perhaps the phrase, "painfully obvious," should apply to this diatribe, but one does have to know **** from Shinola (tm), although the former can be used in an emergency! I mean, haven't you noticed that *no* one has come to the defense of Vertons (tm), except momentarily? NB: Hotmail's put my sig on top; sorry! --SIGHnS: MacJihad versus McCrusade, George goes to Harry-the-Potter's "Public School;" if Dame Jo din't write a Scholast's script, "Let's you & Saddam dance" is Tony Blair's reading, not ideal! http://quincy4board.homestead.com/3rd.html http://quincy4board.homestead.com/files/curriculum/Cosmo.PCX thus quoth: >No. It works with any omnitriangulated polyhedron. > >If you would make an icosa, for example, out of 12 cones, >each with a 60 degree angular deficit, you might stop >thinking this is a hoax, if that's what you think. > >Show why this is false, if you can. > >--- Quincy Quincy Quincy wrote: > > congratulation! > > you just found (probably) the only case > > where this can work, because > > any pyramid can be considered to be a "general" cone. > > that is, any polyhedron can be considered > > to be an assemblage of such cones, > > plus those flat "cones" that you noted. > > however, > > just *saying* that they can then be bent > > into curvey forms that will smoothly join, > > is totally no where, 'sVille-man! > > (in general, this is false.) _________________________________________________________________ Get faster connections -- switch to MSN Internet Access! http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/default.asp ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2002 21:43:25 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: Urner on Particle Physics (and Rybonics) Comments: cc: synergeo@yahooGroups.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed There’s a phrase for folks like Rybo: Bucky Withces (and "Dick" is another one .-) Against all odds & Bucky's own misdirection (that is, you have to read the guy to whom _S_ is dedicated, or virtually any thing else on the bookshelf, adjacent), these guys have not studied elementary "constructive" geometry, unless you can get that from these simulacra (which, it seems, remains very doubtful at this time !-) We all know that Kirby is perfectly well-addressed in this elementary geometry, which is the whole of _S_, for the greater part. Go fish, Rybo! Thus quoth: >Which is it: the tetrahedron/octahedron/icosahedron >OR the cuboctahedron? All three combining relate to derive all other polyhedra/vertexia via axis spinnings on/of opposite vertexes, edges and openings. You know the rap. You want me to speak Buckanese for you at this time. Well you have gotten pieces here and there and plenty over the years from me. Im to tired to concentrate on it at moment. SOmetimes it comes easier than others. Kirby, you now how it is. You speak Buckanese as well if not better than me most of the time. NB: Hotmail's put my sig on top; sorry! --SIGHnS: D*ck Ch*n*y's 2 focusgroups planned for this "clash o'civs," before 911! http://quincy4board.homestead.com/DeepPool.html http://quincy4board.homestead.com/files/curriculum/Cosmo.PCX www.larouchepub.com _________________________________________________________________ Get a speedy connection with MSN Broadband. Join now! http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/freeactivation.asp ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2002 21:54:43 +0000 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Quincy Quincy Quincy Subject: Re: Urner on Particle Physics (and Rybonics) Comments: cc: synergeo@yahooGroups.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed this seems like gobble-de-gook. that is, there is no way for me to dystinguish it from crap, mere mathematico-physical verbiage strung on a rope, or any other sort of "Horseshit -- a perfect example of intertransfromabilites!" thus quoth: NB: Hotmail's put my sig on top; sorry! --A HYDROGEN (sic; cracked methane) ECONOMY?... The Three Phases of Exploitation of the Protocols of the Elders of Kyoto: (FOSSILISATION [McCainanites?] (TM/sic))/ BORE/GUSH/NADIR "@" http://www.tarpley.net/aobook.htm. Http://www.tarpley.net/bushb.htm (partial contents, below): 17 -- THE ATTEMPTED COUP D'ETAT, 3/30/81 (87K) _________________________________________________________________ Broadband? Dial-up? Get reliable MSN Internet Access. http://resourcecenter.msn.com/access/plans/default.asp ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2002 14:48:37 -0800 Reply-To: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works Sender: List for the discussion of Buckminster Fuller's works From: Dick Fischbeck Subject: Re: geodesic In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Several people have no problem with the randome construction. They probably don't care if you have a problem with it. What do you mean, "show it for a 4 vertexion"? I've shown this picture before. http://groups.msn.com/BuckminsterFuller/shoebox.msnw?action=ShowPhoto&PhotoID=109 Care to comment? --- Quincy Quincy Quincy wrote: > don't be such a jerk; > it's your smart-ass proposition, and > all that you have to do is show it > for a "4-verton," but you can't. > (I asked you to do this, > quite a long time ago; eh?) > > perhaps the phrase, "painfully obvious," > should apply to this diatribe, but > one does have to know **** from Shinola (tm), > although the former can be used in an emergency! > I mean, > haven't you noticed that *no* one has come > to the defense of Vertons (tm), > except momentarily? __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? HotJobs - Search new jobs daily now http://hotjobs.yahoo.com/